If you can press W and aim your mouse, you're already PvE capable. How this even became a point of discussion is still baffling.
WK and MI are both viable for PvE. There aren't many builds in the game that aren't PvE viable. Then again, it's one thing to be capable and another thing to actually be good at it. MI's damage is simply higher than WK. The reason for this is because MI isn't throwing butter knives halfway across the dungeon because they're A) Too busy watching stealth meter to time dodges, Not restricted from melee and C) Actually pull off the perma-stealth role.
Have you noticed how much damage DF puts out on dungeon mobs? It puts out a lot more when it crits. You know how you reap the full benefit of crit DF? Not dodging in the middle of it because lol I'm about to run out of stealth. I'd even dare to say DS might be able to close the gap on this but you'd be too busy fishing for crits while the MI is already on his third DF and wondering why you're not doing any damage.
If we wanted add management, we'd get a CW. Unfortunately we wanted a boss killer and mistakingly invited a WK.
Don't get me wrong. I played WK since it came out. I love the idea of the spec. However, it's just not practical. Throwing kitchen knives isn't very intimidating or threatening. Unless they're mobs. Then again, you have to be mentally incapacitated to suck at dodging mobs.
Im WK, and I use DF...
I stealth for damage bonus>DHx1>DF>DF>refresh DHx1>DF>DF and so on... this way I get damage bonuses and DH ticking away for 30k damage WHILE I'm stacking DF damage.
The only thing that sucks, is no ITC standing in red.... I hope devs make it a class ability instead of paragon.
I stealth for damage bonus>DHx1>DF>DF>refresh DHx1>DF>DF and so on... this way I get damage bonuses and DH ticking away for 30k damage WHILE I'm stacking DF damage.
What is DH? Do you mean Disheartening Strike (DS)?
I soloed my Halfling MI through "Lair of the Mad Dragon" last night (I'm working up the list of sub-60 dungeons as I have a lot of them in my Quest Diary, and I need the practice).
I know it's only a level 34 dungeon, but I had a much easier time then when I was with a party at level 37 with my DCs. Some bits were a bit hairy, but generally it was a doddle.
Duelist's Flurry and Gloaming Cut worked just fine. Nothing really ran out of the way, although they seemed to know where the daggers were coming from with Cloud of Steel. Really nice to see my Stealth increase when I killed something with GC, even without the Sneaky Stabber Feat (although, it should be called Sneaky Slasher, really).
I switched back and forth between Cloud of Steel with either Duelists's Flurry or Gloaming Cut.
There are definite advantages to the MI Paragon in PvE, as it seems to have more inherent Stealth replenishment, as well as Invisible Infiltrator completely refilling the Stealth meter after a Daily. It is such a shame that the same build and Feats just do not work in PvP, as enemy players are (usually) not thick enough to just stand there and take it. Although, I also like my WK as she can stay at range and so out of danger a lot of the time.
I used Bait and Swtich and Shadow Strike, alternating several other Encounters such as Path of the Blade, Dazing Strike, Lashing Blade etc. For Dailies I used Shocking Execution against bosses, or Whirlwind of Blades against crowds. Worked well in conjunction with Path of Blades as well, as it did not matter that PoB broke Stealth, as I followed up with WoB and refilled my Stealth!
Most mobs I could one-shot with Gloaming Cut, so I know it's not a true test.
I wonder if I can solo Dread Vault? Looking forward to finding out!
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beckylunaticMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 14,231Arc User
edited October 2014
I do not understand why some people are suggesting that WKs don't use DF or can't use it successfully like an MI build...?
I use DF and DiS on my hybrid WK executioner. He has to mind dodges due to no ITC, not due to running out of stealth. Perma isn't particularly necessary in PvE. Much of the time is just slows you down.
I do not understand why some people are suggesting that WKs don't use DF or can't use it successfully like an MI build...?
I use DF and DiS on my hybrid WK executioner.
I think it just seems counter-intuitive to a lot of people to choose a Paragon path and then not use the Paragon Powers and Feats for it. The idea of using CoS and DiS is so the WK is a ranged combatant, and using Saboteur Feats increases the Stealth up time without having to have very high INT.
But a WK Executioner is an interesting idea. I like ideas that break the mould, especially when they work. But you have to choose a rubbish Feat just to get a Tier III feat. I suppose you could take Determined Pursuit, so you can use VP in PvE. Thrill of the Kill might be OK if you did not have to actually kill something to get the measley 1% Action Point gain.
I re-speced both my WK and MI, and they both have the same stats and I have all the Power and Features I want. So I can re-spec Feats and Boons for <80k AD, or just wait until the overhaul is released and see what happens. At the moment, they both have 17, 17, 20, 19, 14, 20.
I made the WK a Scoundrel/Saboteur and the MI an Executioner/Saboteur, so I can use Gloaming Cut in PvE and DuF in PvP with the MI.
When I managed to get DuF to connect, it worked a treat. I killed a GWF, another TR and an SW when I was sure I was dead, but they seemed to under-estimate the bleed damage, coupled with refilling my Stealth with ShS and then again with Bloodbath or ShEx.
The WK is not doing quite so well atm, but we were up against some 17k enemies and she has no Weapon or armour enchant. But she's doing OK.
I must say, at about 11k GS, I am getting a little sick of being Perma-Stunned/Frozen/Dazed with a single hit and have all my hp disappear in 2 seconds when I get caught out of Stealth by a CW with an 8k GS. And Warlocks seem to be able to target me when I am invisible. :mad:
Perma WK can kill HRs & CWs in Open world PvP rather easily from a distance since they can't do s*** in a large area like that, whereas MI has practically no chance because landing DF on them = suicide.
In domination, MI can hold a node much better than WK, both can't kill geared HR & GF but if WK get caught once = dead, not so useful.
I do not understand why some people are suggesting that WKs don't use DF or can't use it successfully like an MI build...?
I use DF and DiS on my hybrid WK executioner. He has to mind dodges due to no ITC, not due to running out of stealth. Perma isn't particularly necessary in PvE. Much of the time is just slows you down.
For PvE, DF for sure.
For PvP, using DF without ITC = suicide.
For PvE, DF for sure.
For PvP, using DF without ITC = suicide.
That actually makes sense, thanks.
Although there are people posting about a WK not being able to use DF in dungeons, and you so can, but this is why I've been saying you really have to mind those dodges, is all. But like I also said, you can use your knives when you're avoiding red. WK is a fantastic dragon-puncher.
Although there are people posting about a WK not being able to use DF in dungeons, and you so can, but this is why I've been saying you really have to mind those dodges, is all. But like I also said, you can use your knives when you're avoiding red. WK is a fantastic dragon-puncher.
PVE - There are no problems being a WK in PVE at all. And as DF is any TRs highest DPS at will, it's silly (other than role playing playstyle issues) not to use it. It's very easy to make up for the loss of ITC by speccing for an extra dodge roll. Having DiS allows you to keep constant DOT on multiple targets when you enter battle and when you dodge away. You will not, however, out DPS a good MI Executioner but you will do just fine.
PVP - Spec for dodge rolls and use artifacts that give you extra stamina. Run with as high a deflect as you can manage. You will do fine there as well. Yes, it can suck and be frustrating to get caught out be a CW and get melted. 2 CW's is a nightmare. But overall, you can shine as long as you are not hung up on beating everyone 1v1 ... WK plays much more of a support role and can do so quite well.
Comments
Im WK, and I use DF...
I stealth for damage bonus>DHx1>DF>DF>refresh DHx1>DF>DF and so on... this way I get damage bonuses and DH ticking away for 30k damage WHILE I'm stacking DF damage.
The only thing that sucks, is no ITC standing in red.... I hope devs make it a class ability instead of paragon.
What is DH? Do you mean Disheartening Strike (DS)?
I soloed my Halfling MI through "Lair of the Mad Dragon" last night (I'm working up the list of sub-60 dungeons as I have a lot of them in my Quest Diary, and I need the practice).
I know it's only a level 34 dungeon, but I had a much easier time then when I was with a party at level 37 with my DCs. Some bits were a bit hairy, but generally it was a doddle.
Duelist's Flurry and Gloaming Cut worked just fine. Nothing really ran out of the way, although they seemed to know where the daggers were coming from with Cloud of Steel. Really nice to see my Stealth increase when I killed something with GC, even without the Sneaky Stabber Feat (although, it should be called Sneaky Slasher, really).
I switched back and forth between Cloud of Steel with either Duelists's Flurry or Gloaming Cut.
There are definite advantages to the MI Paragon in PvE, as it seems to have more inherent Stealth replenishment, as well as Invisible Infiltrator completely refilling the Stealth meter after a Daily. It is such a shame that the same build and Feats just do not work in PvP, as enemy players are (usually) not thick enough to just stand there and take it. Although, I also like my WK as she can stay at range and so out of danger a lot of the time.
I used Bait and Swtich and Shadow Strike, alternating several other Encounters such as Path of the Blade, Dazing Strike, Lashing Blade etc. For Dailies I used Shocking Execution against bosses, or Whirlwind of Blades against crowds. Worked well in conjunction with Path of Blades as well, as it did not matter that PoB broke Stealth, as I followed up with WoB and refilled my Stealth!
Most mobs I could one-shot with Gloaming Cut, so I know it's not a true test.
I wonder if I can solo Dread Vault? Looking forward to finding out!
I use DF and DiS on my hybrid WK executioner. He has to mind dodges due to no ITC, not due to running out of stealth. Perma isn't particularly necessary in PvE. Much of the time is just slows you down.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
I think it just seems counter-intuitive to a lot of people to choose a Paragon path and then not use the Paragon Powers and Feats for it. The idea of using CoS and DiS is so the WK is a ranged combatant, and using Saboteur Feats increases the Stealth up time without having to have very high INT.
But a WK Executioner is an interesting idea. I like ideas that break the mould, especially when they work. But you have to choose a rubbish Feat just to get a Tier III feat. I suppose you could take Determined Pursuit, so you can use VP in PvE. Thrill of the Kill might be OK if you did not have to actually kill something to get the measley 1% Action Point gain.
I re-speced both my WK and MI, and they both have the same stats and I have all the Power and Features I want. So I can re-spec Feats and Boons for <80k AD, or just wait until the overhaul is released and see what happens. At the moment, they both have 17, 17, 20, 19, 14, 20.
I made the WK a Scoundrel/Saboteur and the MI an Executioner/Saboteur, so I can use Gloaming Cut in PvE and DuF in PvP with the MI.
When I managed to get DuF to connect, it worked a treat. I killed a GWF, another TR and an SW when I was sure I was dead, but they seemed to under-estimate the bleed damage, coupled with refilling my Stealth with ShS and then again with Bloodbath or ShEx.
The WK is not doing quite so well atm, but we were up against some 17k enemies and she has no Weapon or armour enchant. But she's doing OK.
I must say, at about 11k GS, I am getting a little sick of being Perma-Stunned/Frozen/Dazed with a single hit and have all my hp disappear in 2 seconds when I get caught out of Stealth by a CW with an 8k GS. And Warlocks seem to be able to target me when I am invisible. :mad:
In domination, MI can hold a node much better than WK, both can't kill geared HR & GF but if WK get caught once = dead, not so useful.
Mod 12.5 PvP Power/Crit/Arp Optimization
Youtube channel (PvE/PvP)
For PvE, DF for sure.
For PvP, using DF without ITC = suicide.
Mod 12.5 PvP Power/Crit/Arp Optimization
Youtube channel (PvE/PvP)
That actually makes sense, thanks.
Although there are people posting about a WK not being able to use DF in dungeons, and you so can, but this is why I've been saying you really have to mind those dodges, is all. But like I also said, you can use your knives when you're avoiding red. WK is a fantastic dragon-puncher.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
PVE - There are no problems being a WK in PVE at all. And as DF is any TRs highest DPS at will, it's silly (other than role playing playstyle issues) not to use it. It's very easy to make up for the loss of ITC by speccing for an extra dodge roll. Having DiS allows you to keep constant DOT on multiple targets when you enter battle and when you dodge away. You will not, however, out DPS a good MI Executioner but you will do just fine.
PVP - Spec for dodge rolls and use artifacts that give you extra stamina. Run with as high a deflect as you can manage. You will do fine there as well. Yes, it can suck and be frustrating to get caught out be a CW and get melted. 2 CW's is a nightmare. But overall, you can shine as long as you are not hung up on beating everyone 1v1 ... WK plays much more of a support role and can do so quite well.