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What would you like to see with a Kdf Overhaul?

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  • where2r1where2r1 Member Posts: 5,900 Arc User
    There are a lot of great ideas in this thread, too many to list. I'll mention one, though. I love the idea of emphasizing the Houses. A character could choose a House, perhaps by doing a KDF only mission, or queue of some sort. The reward could be a uniform and a dagger specific to that House (bound to character, or course). This goes back to my old and often repeated request for the game to include daggers, and not just Klingon ones.

    Isn't your fleet named for a house?

    "Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK

    “Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
  • patrickngopatrickngo Member Posts: 9,794 Arc User
    This thread is motivating me to roll another KDF character, specifically, a Klingon. As for why a Klingon would allow a non-Klingon to serve on his ship, I offer you the answer any of my KDF characters would give you...

    "THEY FIGHT!!!! If you want to challenge him or her in single combat for his or her station, go ahead. But when he or she wins, he or she may claim command of your ship as a prize. Anyone who serves on my ship must first pass the rite of ascension and earn their place as Klingon warrior."

    As for Klingon scientists, they are honored by Klingon culture, and this is canon. Beverly Crusher once met a Klingon scientist who was honored as one of the best. (She also shoved Crusher to the floor when she thought her honor was being challenged.) Any decent KDF strategist knows that science is a necessary part of space travel and space combat. Science was used to great effect by one of their strongest opponents, the Federation (and possibly others). Science is also needed in fighting new enemies, like the Borg and the Undine. I will concede that warriors may receive more honor, but science and scientists have their place in the KDF.

    There are a lot of great ideas in this thread, too many to list. I'll mention one, though. I love the idea of emphasizing the Houses. A character could choose a House, perhaps by doing a KDF only mission, or queue of some sort. The reward could be a uniform and a dagger specific to that House (bound to character, or course). This goes back to my old and often repeated request for the game to include daggers, and not just Klingon ones.

    I also want to say that the KDF being part of the alliance is fine, but remember what it was like when the Klingons were "at peace" with the Federation in canon. Even in the best of times, they were on the verge of war, and some of the houses wanted to instigate it. Oh, and I like the title of General better than Dahar Master, but that's just me.

    my mechanism is probably more 'gamer' than anything else. I'd arrange to have six different 'house' contacts-representatives of the most powerful (or ambitious) political bodies in the Empire, roughly arranged along an axis. On one axis, are the factions that currently favour peace with the Federation, or will favour it. basically the 'internationalist' faction, and on the other, are the 'Nationalists' and outsiders.

    the second axis runs from 'liberal' to 'conservative' in Klingon terms. Hardcore traditionalists in the Worf mold on the internationalist side, and hardcore traditionalists that view the Federation with actual suspicion on the 'nationalist' side, and of course, the 'seventh' point, J'mPok, who's basically representative of 'official Empire Policy' and acts as the 'neutral' pole.

    On the "liberal'' side, are the real 'freaks'-the Klingon equivalent to communists on the internationalist side, and the Klingon equivalent of 'red staters' on the Nationalist side.

    Player gets to choose who he or she aligns with, and gets 'special' mission content, along with specific Pvp missions. The PvP missions being set up there to act as a sort of 'ongoing tournament', only this one is more like a civil war or riot.

    Results to be tallied weekly, and the outcomes applied to a calculator that either renders bonuses to the non-KDF factions, or bonuses to the players aligned with the 'nationalist' factions. basically creating a situation where KvK matches have a wider spread impact on rewards throughout the game for everyone, and those KvK matches would be fought in specific, faction-only, no-Romulans queues that have 'random' teaming by alignment on the 'x axis'. When the nationalists win one more PvP match on those queues than the Internationalists, then 'nationalist' Klingons and unaligned Klingons gain a bonus (n%) to Skillpoint and Dilithium earnings playing other things, and Starfleet, Romulan, AoY, and Dominion takes a (nx2)% hit for the next week. When it's the other way, Klingons take the hit, and everyone else gets the bonus.

    Scoring total will be by 50% plus one, and the queue would be structured specifically to prevent 'othersiding' matches to cheat the outcome.

    (because we all KNOW who the majority in the game is.)

    Further, more 'scoring weight' would be applied to Low Tier matches (from level 5 to level 49) than to level 60 or 'endgame' matches because so many cheeses aren't available at the lower tiers, making for a much more focused fighting.

    n=a percentage calculated based on 'tier' level play.

    Tier 1 (level 5-10): 40% of the total
    Tier 2 (level 11-20): 20% of the total
    Tier 3 (Levels 21-30): 15% of the total
    Tier 4 (Levels 31-40): 9% of the total
    Tier 5 (levels 41-50): 5% of the total
    Endgame Tier (51-65): 1% of the total.

    n=(number of matches per tier times their percentage) divided by 10 to set the percentage bonus or penalty amount.

    This basically structures the 'relevance calculation' such that 'endgame' players with their stacks of lobi and grind-for-it skills have the smallest impact on how much the bonus or penalty is, while 'newbie' (or new toons) have the largest impact, thus avoiding the corrosive impact of the current pay-to-win structure by making it unlikely in the extreme that the same guys hanging around Ker'rat with chained immunities and rules-hole-exploit gear dominate the outcome on the 'record' matches, since a 'newbie' match in T2 ships has more impact than twenty fights of a level 65 team running the latest in untested exploit gear does.

    Match types would include raid/raid defense, seize territory, and house battles (Arena).

    The Queue would accept only 'premades' of 2 or fewer, the rest of the actual 'match team' would be puggies, because we want this to be more than a one-sided slaughter.

    There would be rewards for sticking to your 'political guns' in the form of faction/house specific offerings and 'tier' rewards only available if you actually fight in a given tier or weight-class, and these would be cosmetic items unavailable in any form, with minor game impacts. Things like having an 'animal handler' Bridge officer for ground PvE missions (choose: gorn, or Klingon, and those-lizard-things, Targs, or Jackal Mastiff), specific melee weapons (not Batts. I'm thinking of Klingon Daggers that work, a Mek'leth type, etc.) and for grinding through as a PvP'er, the coveted 'Dahar Master Greatcoat' (with your faction's symbol proudly displayed-not available to people grinding endless PvE).

    and maybe some special titles as well.

    Things like what we used to have, when Honorguard Armor required running through ALL the GROUND stf's instead of doing ISA on endless repeat.

    what it would do, is give the Empire a 'story of its own' that impacts the general environment of STO, it would make PvP relevant, and it would give relevance and leverage to the Klingon side of things by giving people a reason to use them for more than Kontraband farms.

    (Hence, why the other factions and fractions would be blocked from controlling the ongoing event).

    The 'infighting' angle works with Klingons, because Klingons are conflict-driven people, they thrive on it. The most dishonorable thing you can do, is surrender without a fight-they won't respect you if you do (consistent, it's even something the morons doing Discovery managed to understand...for one episode.)

    The ongoing debate, then, would be along the lines of 'how much do we pay for this 'alliance' with the Federation?' the Internationalists and the 'government' (J'mpok) are currently on the "everything including our souls" bandwagon, this doesn't seem like something Klingons would take for long, if at all, and Klingons especially tend to express their political opposition using fists, blades, and disruptors.

    The results would reflect either 'improved output to the alliance' (if the Internationalists win), or 'production delays/shipment delays' if the internationalists win, every week.

    Benefits:

    1. it gives the faction an ongoing 'relevance' to the game, thus boosting population.
    2. it helps balance the Dilithium economy and works as a sink.
    3. it addresses the 'leveling too fast' problem better than timegating other content.
    4. provides additional materials for the game's storyline to work off of.
    5. provides relevance for PvP-but not so much that it overwhelms the rest of the game.
    6. provides 'story hooks' for the other factions, esp. the majority faction.
    7. it combines two long-ignored and neglected elements (KDF and PvP) to consolidate those communities into something a bit more...active and open to newbies and casual players, since to get the 'tier rewards' your casual has to take a break from the breakneck railroading of advancement, to fight a few matches at each level block.

    Drawbacks:

    1. you can hear the screaming from the DPS league, can't you?
    2. someone will claim they're being 'forced' to PvP. this is not the case, but certainly someone will make that argument, esp. if they want the goodies without doing the activity.
    3. because it's structured in such a way that you can't really 'buy a win' using your lockboxes, a lot of 'professional builders' out there will have deep and angry things to say about how the calculations are weighted against the normal 'pay to win' options-this, in spite of there being some nifty gadgets and consoles available in the C-store on lower tier ships, and the low-tier ships that are qualitatively better than their free counterparts until you hit the rather excellent Hegh'ta.
    4. it combines two minorities that most of the developer and player populations don't like, and gives them a measure of in-game 'power'. This will make some vocal types exceedingly put-out.
    5. not everyone will get the purple ribbon, there will be losers and those that miss out, this too will create criticism.

    over-all;

    it provides a format that makes the advertising true, it gives KDF players a reason to stick around, and it gives other players a tangible reason to want at least a hand in whatever's going on, it's likely to be cheaper than some of the other options, and it's likely to have a lasting impact to the positive, since unlike PvE's done in the current style, you can't easily predict the outcome or watch netflix with a stopwatch and keybinds to do it.

    further, it gives the chance to incorporate 'political stories' into a faction that fit the faction and it can be made 'bottomless' in the sense that it can go on indefinitely without needing a handwavium excuse to end it. It's 'jockeying for power and influence' on longer term than a single mission, and once the maps are made and given a basic vetting, it's durable without much if any ongoing development needed (Unless the storyline demands it).

    Now, my nominations:

    Internationalist faction:

    House of Duras
    House of K'Lek
    House of Martok

    Neutral:
    J'mPok

    Nationalists:

    House Kriton
    House Woldan
    House (someone).

    Liberals:

    Duras
    Woldan

    Moderates:

    Kriton
    Martok

    Conservatives:

    K'Lek
    (someone)

    why is Duras more Liberal in my model than Martok? think about what Ja'rod (Head of the House of Duras) has gone through in the last ten years, how many times he's been saved by Federation forces, or needed them, or worked with them? Martok's been imprisoned, his wife's been running the show, and her most recent experiences have been someone bringing outside aliens to kill her and finish off her House. These baqtags were stopped by KDF troops sent by J'mpok. she's going to be more politically 'in tune' with the Chancellor when it comes to the 'traditional vs. liberal" axis, while her returned husband is firmly in the internationalist camp, which means she's going to be there too...but not as...eagerly as her Par'mach.

    so, "Moderate" and Internationalist (in favour of the Alliance) she would be, just as Ja'rod, with his experiences, would be more likely inclined to seeing more social changes within the Empire, as well as deeper connections to the Federation.

    Woldan is kind of a stab in the dark, but that runs for most of the 'nationalists' Liberal nationalists would be in favour of more development at home, possibly an isolationist stance with regards to the Federation, and repairing the Empire's infrastructure, even if this means doing things like promoting low-borns and such to positions of authority.

    Conservative Nationalists would be more hostile in general to everybody who isn't part of the Empire. They would share with Conservative internationalists a dim view of 'low born trash' and a desire to reinforce the existing power structure at home. They'll also be more "Warriors are better" in their rhetoric, Conservatives in general are more 'warlike', their focus is different. The internationalists want to intervene in foreign conflicts, taking a role as the 'hammer' of the Alliance, while conservative Nationalists want to bunker up the Empire and expand-through-conquest.

    Moderates on both camps want a more 'balanced' approach-necessary foreign adventures, but also deep investment at home, in general they're the sort that don't want massive social realignment, but are fine with some reforms to improve the efficiency of the empire-whether in its own affairs, or as part of an international alliance.

    Jimmy just wants to keep the Empire going, whether it's as a sub-portion of a galactic alliance, or as a fully independent state, he's fixated on national survival, especially after the Iconians killed off most of the last High Council and nearly did him in personally.

    all the fighting between these groups is about influencing the Chancellor, who's got most of the 'official' power. He's put in this spot by his office-he has to balance violently opposed interest groups while keeping the country afloat.

    and everyone still reports to him, regardless of who else they're reporting to.





    whatever.

  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 8,188 Arc User
    strathkin wrote: »
    Something I suggested to our Community Manager was hopefully they will FIX Gorn Very Rare Bridge Officer's.

    For the longest time Gorn's (Very Rare) Bridge Officers start out as a Purple, even though they only list but a single Superior Trait identical to Rare Bridge Officers, while a Very Rare is supposed to have two.

    Once added to your crew they again show as only a Blue Bridge Officer quality, likely because they only have but a single Superior Trait.

    Yet if you have a Federation Captain who earned Level 4 in Diplomacy: Today there the only ones who can have a Gorn Bridge Officer (Very Rare) that has two Superior Trait's and shows properly as Purple.

    So hopefully they finally get that FIXED for Victory is Life.
    It's not possible for standard gorn to have two superior traits, because they have 3 fixed race traits and only one random.
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 8,188 Arc User
    where2r1 wrote: »
    You want a one stop shop for the KDF side without all the wandering...go use Ganalda Station, right next to the KDF Starbase.

    Between the Ganalda Station and KDF Starbase, you have everything right there, if your fleet unlocked it.
    How can you claim 4 loading screens, flying through sector space and however much walking is needed to reach all the contacts on two respective station maps to count as "without wandering?"
  • nimbullnimbull Member Posts: 1,470 Arc User
    edited May 2018
    patrickngo wrote: »
    where2r1 wrote: »
    nimbull wrote: »
    Gorn on pogo sticks.

    LOL! Very funny. :)

    But I think I know what the boys really want to see instead.

    yeah, a 3 meter tall, terrifying Gorn Female, with wings and a prehensile tail, and long slavering fangs.

    maybe blowing fire as she dominates the gorn males around her.

    All while wearing a hot pink bikini on Risa doing a tonic dance as the males bounce on pogo sticks.

    ... and then it gets weird.
    Green people don't have to be.... little.
  • where2r1where2r1 Member Posts: 5,900 Arc User
    warpangel wrote: »
    How can you claim 4 loading screens, flying through sector space and however much walking is needed to reach all the contacts on two respective station maps to count as "without wandering?"

    LOL! What??? LOL! So, trying to crack me up on a Sunday???

    Stopping by the Fleet holdings isn't part of the daily routine for you? It should be. The Fleet Dilithium Mine assignment for extra refinement of 500 Dilithium is one that is actually worth doing.

    Why do you want to do everything by standing in one spot?
    Sounds like a rather odd goal in a video game. LOL!

    There you have it...GO Admiralty! No more jump screens.
    You might have to lift a finger to click your mouse, though.

    The Devs created that for you.

    +++++++++

    Lets see here.... You don't have to go to the shipyard every day. And you don't have to do recruitment every day....matter of fact, there is a nice long cool down on that.

    SooooOOoooo..... What are you kids up to? I wonder??

    Choosing to to pick up some 400 Dilithium at the Loresinger and 2000 from the Security guy? OMG...you.... you are complaining about walking from Security guy to the Transporter to the Loresinger to the console inside and back everyday? LOL!

    OMG... please tell me I am kidding myself???

    Why not just ask the devs to move Loresiinger Ch'toh inside? Or switch places of the interact points between Commander B'Tama and Loresinger Ch'toh???

    She is only useful during the Jr. Officer Events, it won't matter if she is standing out next to a rock the rest of the time. Though, you would have to run inside to interact with the console to pick up your Bekk and turn in the chits for the DOFFs for the event.

    They MIGHT actually do THAT.
    "Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK

    “Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
  • smooshy#7462 smooshy Member Posts: 227 Arc User
    As for Klingon scientists, they are honored by Klingon culture, and this is canon. Beverly Crusher once met a Klingon scientist who was honored as one of the best. (She also shoved Crusher to the floor when she thought her honor was being challenged.) Any decent KDF strategist knows that science is a necessary part of space travel and space combat. Science was used to great effect by one of their strongest opponents, the Federation (and possibly others). Science is also needed in fighting new enemies, like the Borg and the Undine. I will concede that warriors may receive more honor, but science and scientists have their place in the KDF.

    Here is a direct quote from that episode, "Suspicions": Dr. Crusher [in voiceover]: "Kurak was a warp field specialist on the Klingon homeworld. I don't think Klingons regard scientists very highly. She always seemed a little defensive."
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 8,188 Arc User
    where2r1 wrote: »
    warpangel wrote: »
    How can you claim 4 loading screens, flying through sector space and however much walking is needed to reach all the contacts on two respective station maps to count as "without wandering?"

    LOL! What??? LOL! So, trying to crack me up on a Sunday???

    Stopping by the Fleet holdings isn't part of the daily routine for you? It should be. The Fleet Dilithium Mine assignment for extra refinement of 500 Dilithium is one that is actually worth doing.

    Why do you want to do everything by standing in one spot?
    Sounds like a rather odd goal in a video game. LOL!

    There you have it...GO Admiralty! No more jump screens.
    You might have to lift a finger to click your mouse, though.

    The Devs created that for you.

    +++++++++

    Lets see here.... You don't have to go to the shipyard every day. And you don't have to do recruitment every day....matter of fact, there is a nice long cool down on that.

    SooooOOoooo..... What are you kids up to? I wonder??

    Choosing to to pick up some 400 Dilithium at the Loresinger and 2000 from the Security guy? OMG...you.... you are complaining about walking from Security guy to the Transporter to the Loresinger to the console inside and back everyday? LOL!

    OMG... please tell me I am kidding myself???

    Why not just ask the devs to move Loresiinger Ch'toh inside? Or switch places of the interact points between Commander B'Tama and Loresinger Ch'toh???

    She is only useful during the Jr. Officer Events, it won't matter if she is standing out next to a rock the rest of the time. Though, you would have to run inside to interact with the console to pick up your Bekk and turn in the chits for the DOFFs for the event.

    They MIGHT actually do THAT.
    :confused: You're the one who talked about doing things "one stop," even if your suggestion wasn't actually one stop at all. There's a point at which laughing at yourself gets weird and it was passed sometime before that line of plus signs.
  • korithian1korithian1 Member Posts: 76 Arc User
    I guess in short make it less Klingon.

    I get that it is the Klingon defense force, but it is made up of Gorns, Orions, Nausicaans, Aliens, Ferasan, Leathans, liberated borg, Trill and soon Cardassians. So having them all act as Klingons obsessed with honor and want to die in battle can seem odd and a little wrong.

    The same goes with any story arc that is about Klingon beliefs that others may not hold, or where there is the right way to do something and the wrong way to do it and the Klingon way which is to do it wrong but with more shouting involved, its always done the Klingon way. As it seems as soon as you become part of the KDF you have your personality replaced with a Klingon.

    So it would be nice if they different species had more personality and there was a little less klingon forced on players.
  • kronin#4685 kronin Member Posts: 266 Arc User
    As for Klingon scientists, they are honored by Klingon culture, and this is canon. Beverly Crusher once met a Klingon scientist who was honored as one of the best. (She also shoved Crusher to the floor when she thought her honor was being challenged.) Any decent KDF strategist knows that science is a necessary part of space travel and space combat. Science was used to great effect by one of their strongest opponents, the Federation (and possibly others). Science is also needed in fighting new enemies, like the Borg and the Undine. I will concede that warriors may receive more honor, but science and scientists have their place in the KDF.

    Here is a direct quote from that episode, "Suspicions": Dr. Crusher [in voiceover]: "Kurak was a warp field specialist on the Klingon homeworld. I don't think Klingons regard scientists very highly. She always seemed a little defensive."
    The key word in Crusher's quote is the word "think". As clever and awesome as she is, she is still an outsider taking a guess about Klingon culture. Crusher is also from a culture that prizes science very highly. She is a Federation scientist. From her viewpoint, any culture that does not do the same thing would be seen as not regarding science very highly. Note that by the time the events of STO happen, the KDF has a battlecruiser named after this scientist. Again, Klingons do favor warriors more. They are a warrior race. But their scientists do have a place.
  • talonxvtalonxv Member Posts: 4,240 Arc User
    > @kronin#4685 said:
    > smooshy#7462 wrote: »
    >
    > kronin#4685 wrote: »
    >
    > As for Klingon scientists, they are honored by Klingon culture, and this is canon. Beverly Crusher once met a Klingon scientist who was honored as one of the best. (She also shoved Crusher to the floor when she thought her honor was being challenged.) Any decent KDF strategist knows that science is a necessary part of space travel and space combat. Science was used to great effect by one of their strongest opponents, the Federation (and possibly others). Science is also needed in fighting new enemies, like the Borg and the Undine. I will concede that warriors may receive more honor, but science and scientists have their place in the KDF.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Here is a direct quote from that episode, "Suspicions": Dr. Crusher [in voiceover]: "Kurak was a warp field specialist on the Klingon homeworld. I don't think Klingons regard scientists very highly. She always seemed a little defensive."
    >
    >
    >
    > The key word in Crusher's quote is the word "think". As clever and awesome as she is, she is still an outsider taking a guess about Klingon culture. Crusher is also from a culture that prizes science very highly. She is a Federation scientist. From her viewpoint, any culture that does not do the same thing would be seen as not regarding science very highly. Note that by the time the events of STO happen, the KDF has a battlecruiser named after this scientist. Again, Klingons do favor warriors more. They are a warrior race. But their scientists do have a place.

    Not just scientists. Doctors, lasers, cooks, the people that make the empire run are still needed.

    Is it best to be a warrior? Sure. But it's not everything. Cause even the Klingons realize, they need more than that. There is honor at being the very best at what you do.
    afMSv4g.jpg
    Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!

    http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1145998/star-trek-battles-channel-got-canon/p1
  • vetteguy904vetteguy904 Member Posts: 2,637 Arc User
    where2r1 wrote: »
    There are a lot of great ideas in this thread, too many to list. I'll mention one, though. I love the idea of emphasizing the Houses. A character could choose a House, perhaps by doing a KDF only mission, or queue of some sort. The reward could be a uniform and a dagger specific to that House (bound to character, or course). This goes back to my old and often repeated request for the game to include daggers, and not just Klingon ones.

    Isn't your fleet named for a house?

    not everyone is in a fleet
    2dm9h86.jpg

  • sirsitsalotsirsitsalot Member Posts: 1,606 Arc User
    To be totally honest, I don't want a KDF overhaul. I don't want a NRR overhaul. I don't want a UFP overhaul... I want an added layer to the game that lets us explore space. And not just to scan anomalies or run random madlib missions. But a meaningful system that adds a lasting and far-reaching purpose for every mechanic we have in the game, facilitated by situational scenarios that make sense based on where an event has been driven by player activity. This layer would provide a constant, meaningful flow of activity that anyone, regardless of faction or fleet affiliation can participate in during the stretch of time between episodic content.

    So before they go revamping factions, I think they should add something like this that would be something meaningful for everyone.
    I have no snarky remarks to make, at this time...
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