I don't zerg, but doing so would put me at an advantage- why should those who zerg be rewarded?
Also, anything that adds a penalty for death is.... a death penalty. That's what i mean when I say death penalty, i'm not suggesting huge XP debt or permadeath or something...
Finally, you're assuming most people wouldn't want a death penalty- the lack of one penalises someone who plays correctly by making them advance slowly in comparison to others who just zerg.
Answer my question now, what combat game has no death penalty?
I'm going to bed now, so if i don't respond I don't mean to be impolite.
Also, thanks for the dictionary response, now you know that the removal of a bonus would be a penalty. Please don't be condescending, i've avoided doing so up to now.
Ok there is no reasoning with you, the game has no death penalty period.
I agree to pay you $100 to do a job but give you $110 because you did the job fast or better then expected thats called a bonus, I took nothing away from you.
If I agree to pay you $100 but you do a bad job and I take you to court and the court tells me I do not have to pay, then you lost the agreed amount.
Feel free to call it a penalty all you want, you must lead a depressing life if EVERYTHING in life is a penalty for you and a bonus is just a penalty, I can't help you there, but for the rest of us.
I am not assuming ANY numbers, all I am saying is if there is no death penalty you can CHOOSE to impose one, or not, if there is a death penalty you CANNOT CHOOSE to ignore it. There are people who CHOOSE to not play a game on ONLY the death penalty, I am one thats why I do not play Aion (I wanted to but heard about the death penalty and since I can't CHOOSE to not have the death penalty then I CHOOSE not to play).
My goal in this game is not to die, I CHOOSE to consider my efforts a failure if I die in game. I also CHOOSE not to let exploiters bother me, and if grouped I will kick or leave that group and ignore them because I CHOOSE too.
It DOESN'T Matter if someone is zerging to anyone but the Devs, do you understand that? you cannot prove that zerging even exsists (Now I am sure it does, but I have NEVER seen it and I don't do it) if you team with a zerger, drop the team or kick them and put them on ignore, pay attention to your OWN game play, I don't NEED your sense of justice based on rumor that something exsists. There are ways to limit exploits without penalties to ALL, can you at least acknowledge that?
I am not assuming ANY numbers, all I am saying is if there is no death penalty you can CHOOSE to impose one, or not, if there is a death penalty you CANNOT CHOOSE to ignore it.
So, in other words, you can choose that the mugger who is about to assault you will stop or you can choose that he strike you. And by doing so, he can then choose to let you report him or not to report him. Hence, he can hit you and you will simply take it - and like it - because he, no longer bound by any laws but his own, doesn't have to give a flying .... if you live or die.
Somewhere out there, you just made a Vulcan cry with your unique logic on how the world and it's inhabitants work.
It's not about you, it's about all of us. Get off your single minded horse and think about the whole.
So, in other words, you can choose that the mugger who is about to assault you will stop or you can choose that he strike you. And by doing so, he can then choose to let you report him or not to report him. Hence, he can hit you and you will simply take it - and like it - because he, no longer bound by any laws but his own, doesn't have to give a flying .... if you live or die.
Somewhere out there, you just made a Vulcan cry with your unique logic on how the world and it's inhabitants work.
It's not about you, it's about all of us. Get off your single minded horse and think about the whole.
Oh will you stop we are talking about a game, a time sink waste of time teaching you nothing penalty in a game, that is not where close to what we are talking about, we are talking about penalties not crimes.
Can you try and be logical, your example besides being insulting doesn't even make sense.
This is done there is no death penalty, period if you don't like it leave the game. I am fed up with juvenile and depressing back talk and side reasonning, No one in the world considers bonuses penalties and the fact that the find me a zerger challenge is almost impossible to win is just showing how stupid this debate is.
Oh will you stop we are talking about a game, a time sink waste of time teaching you nothing penalty in a game, that is not where close to what we are talking about, we are talking about penalties not crimes.
Can you try and be logical, your example besides being insulting doesn't even make sense.
hahaha...that's funny! I just love the new ability that people have to dis-associate themselves from anything that seems remotely challenging. My Alt-Space is broke...what do I do... The horror!
hahaha...that's funny! I just love the new ability that people have to dis-associate themselves from anything that seems remotely challenging. My Alt-Space is broke...what do I do... The horror!
And I love seeing how people are arguning about better content which I agree to improving, then just imposing penalties.
I love how people say content is super easy and you can't die, so we need a penalty so we don't die
And I love how people are so depressing they view the entire world as nothing but a bleak penalty and we all should suffer with them.
Why have a death penalty that elapses before it is physically possible to have any effect?
You can be defeated in STO, but there's no real "penalty," unless your patience level is dialed so low that a few seconds before respawning is intolerable. It's a minor slap on the wrist, but not to the point of being frustrating. It's a good balance for this type of game I think. It just depends on what you're looking for and in the mood for. Sometimes you want Eve.
No, EVERYONE is playing games for emotional rewards, because emotions are the only thing the motivate us.
Emotional reward from winning, however, is proportional to the effort needed to win and the obstacles that have been overcome.
In this game, there is too little of both. Only obstacle I encountered so far is permanent crashes in ground missons.
Oh, and people who don't understand what the second "M" in "MMORPG" means.
Really and how can you be the judge of what "everyones" emotions are? If you want that I would suggest go to eve and loose a 215 billion cred ship and see what emotions fly outta you.
1) damage to modules require repair or replacement requiring energy would be a nice touch
2) DP's add an extra sence of loss to games if they are too high then they can be bad, and players loose interest. if there is no sence of loss people will loose interest too
Would you please point out where I "very clearly" said:
"there's a sizeable demographic who will play Star Trek Online, and have never enjoyed another combat-based computer game"
So if people don't agree with you, they should just stop playing and leave. Thanks for the constructive argument. :rolleyes:
Poeple can agree or disagree but when hardcore players start beating down on everyone else about the ratification of why DP should be in that goes to far, they should find something else that suits them.
My point was mainly about aesthetics, in that the highest level enemies are often visually identical to the lowest, giving the impression that, at the beginning of the game, you are easily destroying everything availiable.
Except in almost all games, if you come across a challenge that is literally beyond your level, you either have to come back later, get better at the game, or (if possible) get help. In STO, simply fighting the mob over and over will eventually lead you to be the victor.
This is simply false. If you can't win you can't win. If you can win, with some lucky bounces your way, then maybe you do win in STO.
Just so I understand you:
You punish your dog for doing something wrong.
You punish your child for doing something wrong.
You DON'T punish your player for doing something wrong?
A player, a customer, is not a dog nor a child. Why you would equate a player to either is baffling.
Just so I understand you:
You punish your dog for doing something wrong.
You punish your child for doing something wrong.
You DON'T punish your player for doing something wrong?
So why do I have to take damage? They're all going to die anyways, and me taking damage just adds needless time I could be using to do other things. Can't we just take weapons away from NPC's? If I ever blow up (I hope I will sometime before Admiral) I don't want to have to waste time trying to find where I was in the last part of the mission so to me I don't really want to blow up anymore. Can't we just take that out too?
Apples and oranges first off and I am not going to beat them for a mistake.
TLDR version: Current death procedure is user-friendly and will net more subscribers.
_____________________________________
I can understand the desire of some for a more "hardcore" experience; however it ultimately harms a game more than it helps. Here's my theory based on my own experiences:
All players want to overcome challenging content and feel a sense of accomplishment. Some of those players want that challenge to be daunting, others want to just fight and not have to worry too much. Cryptic appears to be leaning towards a fun, cinematic style that provides action and challenge but lets the player get right back into the action if they make a mistake or are overwhelmed. This choice was very much about either allowing STO to become a niche game for hardcores or making it casual-friendly.
I played "EVE: The Second Genesis" (AKA EVE Online) from closed beta in '03 until March '09. In that game, if you got clobbered whether by a player or NPCs you lost your ship. Aside from the starter ship, which was replaced for free all other ships had to be replaced at the player's expense. This cost was typically millions or, more often billions of interstellar credits with the cost only slightly mitigated by insuring the ship. The replacement process normally involved traveling between several systems, often through "indian country" to replace the modules and pick up the new ship. This assumes that you had cloned your character properly. In the case of PVP, if you had not and the other player "podded" you (shot your escape pod) as most do, you lost skill points and could possibly face real-time days, weeks or months of re-training in order to get back into the class of ship you were flying or the weapon systems you were using when you died.
Now after playing both games, I can say without hesitation that if Cryptic keeps things casual-friendly they will see high subscriber numbers. When players feel free to explore and have fun without having to worry too much about making a mistake or losing a fight, they will think of STO as a fun leisure activity. The often-maligned Blizzard figured that out and now look at the subscriber numbers for WoW. Both games can provide more difficult challenges through raid-style content. I believe Cryptic understands that placing STO on a more "hardcore" trajectory will ultimately ostracize casual players, including the Star Trek fans who might otherwise have never tried an MMOG.
For games based on an intellectual property, keeping true to the setting and appealing to its fans is the way to go. If Cryptic keeps the game fun for fans of the franchise, they'll always have those fans showing up either as new players or as continuing subscribers. Making a game appeal to hardcore players only lasts until another game markets itself as "more hardcore than that game you WERE playing." Once the hardcore folks move on, what is left?
Apples and oranges first off and I am not going to beat them for a mistake.
Nobody is saying to beat them or anyone except those arguing in black and white terms (absolute or nothing). I also noticed you ignored the second half of the post.
Once the hardcore folks move on, what is left?
Not enough to keep some form of the show running unfortunately.
Because the poster on your side of the argument did, examine the post I quoted.
Nobody is saying to beat them or anyone except those arguing in black and white terms (absolute or nothing). I also noticed you ignored the second half of the post.
Ok there is no reasoning with you, the game has no death penalty period.
I agree to pay you $100 to do a job but give you $110 because you did the job fast or better then expected thats called a bonus, I took nothing away from you.
If I agree to pay you $100 but you do a bad job and I take you to court and the court tells me I do not have to pay, then you lost the agreed amount.
Feel free to call it a penalty all you want, you must lead a depressing life if EVERYTHING in life is a penalty for you and a bonus is just a penalty, I can't help you there, but for the rest of us.
I am not assuming ANY numbers, all I am saying is if there is no death penalty you can CHOOSE to impose one, or not, if there is a death penalty you CANNOT CHOOSE to ignore it. There are people who CHOOSE to not play a game on ONLY the death penalty, I am one thats why I do not play Aion (I wanted to but heard about the death penalty and since I can't CHOOSE to not have the death penalty then I CHOOSE not to play).
My goal in this game is not to die, I CHOOSE to consider my efforts a failure if I die in game. I also CHOOSE not to let exploiters bother me, and if grouped I will kick or leave that group and ignore them because I CHOOSE too.
It DOESN'T Matter if someone is zerging to anyone but the Devs, do you understand that? you cannot prove that zerging even exsists (Now I am sure it does, but I have NEVER seen it and I don't do it) if you team with a zerger, drop the team or kick them and put them on ignore, pay attention to your OWN game play, I don't NEED your sense of justice based on rumor that something exsists. There are ways to limit exploits without penalties to ALL, can you at least acknowledge that?
Let be help you.
Let's say that your company gives a rate of pay, with bonus of $110. Now, because you did not work efficiently, you are only given $100. This means that you are payed $10 less than your collegues. This is a penalty. A penalty is by definition the removal of a right or benefit.
The removal of a positive is a negative.
Another way? Under law, freedom is a basic right. When someone commits an unwanted act, that freedom is removed. Therefore, a privilege is removed, a penalty.
If the bonus is the normal state of events (most people will manage not to die for a small amount of time won't they?) then the lack of the bonus would be the abnormal situation. It would be a penalty.
Now, if you want to choose to play a game filled with exploits, that's great, but most people tend to choose a game that... works.
The best way to avoid an exploit is to report it. Not to play pretending that it doesn't exist, that gives the exploiters a comparative advantage.
And please, as you were so adamant I answer your questiion, consider mine which you've now ignored three times: what is this mythical game you play that involves combat and has no death penalty at all? I've yet to encounter it.
Not enough to keep some form of the show running unfortunately.
Zexks,
I appreciate your point of view; however if you are going to quote from my posts please don't cherry-pick portions out of context. The quote you pasted was actually an answer which challenges your own argument. The quote in proper context is as follows:
For games based on an intellectual property, keeping true to the setting and appealing to its fans is the way to go. If Cryptic keeps the game fun for fans of the franchise, they'll always have those fans showing up either as new players or as continuing subscribers. Making a game appeal to hardcore players only lasts until another game markets itself as "more hardcore than that game you WERE playing." Once the hardcore folks move on, what is left?
Let be help you.
Let's say that your company gives a rate of pay, with bonus of $110. Now, because you did not work efficiently, you are only given $100. This means that you are payed $10 less than your collegues. This is a penalty. A penalty is by definition the removal of a right or benefit.
The removal of a positive is a negative.
Another way? Under law, freedom is a basic right. When someone commits an unwanted act, that freedom is removed. Therefore, a privilege is removed, a penalty.
If the bonus is the normal state of events (most people will manage not to die for a small amount of time won't they?) then the lack of the bonus would be the abnormal situation. It would be a penalty.
Now, if you want to choose to play a game filled with exploits, that's great, but most people tend to choose a game that... works.
The best way to avoid an exploit is to report it. Not to play pretending that it doesn't exist, that gives the exploiters a comparative advantage.
And please, as you were so adamant I answer your questiion, consider mine which you've now ignored three times: what is this mythical game you play that involves combat and has no death penalty at all? I've yet to encounter it.
Ok trouble is you base rate of pay does not include bonues, if your paid $100 an hour that is your base rate, bonues are not computed till AFTER base pay is paid out, many companies paying bonues monthly in fact and is computed AFTER base pay, there are plenty of accounting books to help you with this concept..
In you crime example, constitutional rights are your basic rights, when you commit a crime your BASIC rights are removed a bonus in this case would be some right or protection not given to everyone without something in exchange, I mean really this is not a very good example for you to use.
Your main issue is your saying that a bonus is a guarantee and thats not how any bonuses work. So again a bonus is that which is granted for exceptional performance above any normal level of reward or compensation, YOU are choosing to equate it to a guarantee.
Champions online has no death penalty except for respawning and returning like STO and made by the same company.
Absulutely right, a game without death penalty is MEGA BORING. Those amoung u who wanna play realxed game Cryptic could offer a special mode. Since most content is instance based make it hard mode and noral mode. One with death penalty one wihtout. But ofc with death penalty it should also give better loot.
Ok trouble is you base rate of pay does not include bonues, if your paid $100 an hour that is your base rate, bonues are not computed till AFTER base pay is paid out, many companies paying bonues monthly in fact and is computed AFTER base pay, there are plenty of accounting books to help you with this concept..
In you crime example, constitutional rights are your basic rights, when you commit a crime your BASIC rights are removed a bonus in this case would be some right or protection not given to everyone without something in exchange, I mean really this is not a very good example for you to use.
Your main issue is your saying that a bonus is a guarantee and thats not how any bonuses work. So again a bonus is that which is granted for exceptional performance above any normal level of reward or compensation, YOU are choosing to equate it to a guarantee.
Champions online has no death penalty except for respawning and returning like STO and made by the same company.
Well, if the bonus is based on not dieing, then every person who does not die would have the bonus- correct? So only those who die would have the bonus...
If a bonus is more common than a lack of one, it is essentially a norm, yes.
In champions online you lose a static bonus upon death, that's a penalty.
Absulutely right, a game without death penalty is MEGA BORING. Those amoung u who wanna play realxed game Cryptic could offer a special mode. Since most content is instance based make it hard mode and noral mode. One with death penalty one wihtout. But ofc with death penalty it should also give better loot.
Now wait, why should picking the option for a death penalty give better loot?
Here is what I'd like to see:
A check box that if selected gives a death penalty (Doesn't matter what it is really just a death penalty of some sort)
No changes in loot or rewards, give in game notices or force the pop up to pick when you log in. Run this one month data mining who uses it and who doesn't. Post the results.
If the pro DP people are right we should have better then 50% checking it on.
Now before you say this is unfair, all of you have stated the game to be boring without one,so no extra reward is needed.
That a death penalty is needed for the game to succeed.
That a death penalty is more popular then none.
That a lack of a death penalty is making the game too easy.
That a death penalty give immersion.
That a death penalty teaches you how to play the game.
That a death penalty is needed to make the game fresh.
That a death penalty is needed to make the game challenging.
Well, if the bonus is based on not dieing, then every person who does not die would have the bonus- correct? So only those who die would have the bonus...
If a bonus is more common than a lack of one, it is essentially a norm, yes.
In champions online you lose a static bonus upon death, that's a penalty.
Champions online has no penalty, if I die 10,000 times I don't lose anything (well maybe my mind for dying so much, hehe)
You know what here is what your saying.
You do a mission the mission giver says you get 100 skill points for completing it, you finish it and get your reward but if it was not enough to level you its a penalty, cause everything is a penalty to you. You get a salary well thats a penalty cause you have to work for it. You eat and thats a penalty cause you have to TRIBBLE later, my god what is wrong with you?
Champions online has no penalty, if I die 10,000 times I don't lose anything (well maybe my mind for dying so much, hehe)
You know what here is what your saying.
You do a mission the mission giver says you get 100 skill points for completing it, you finish it and get your reward but if it was not enough to level you its a penalty, cause everything is a penalty to you. You get a salary well thats a penalty cause you have to work for it. You eat and thats a penalty cause you have to TRIBBLE later, my god what is wrong with you?
Now you're being childish and obtuse.
If something is recieved as a bonus by everyone, then technically it isn't a bonus, it's the norm. Thats why paying everyone a bonus except one person, for no justifiable reason, would be seen as discrimination in an employment tribunal.
Or to put it into your words "TRIBBLE, lol"
Anyway, this isn't going anywhere, someone should probably mention the TRIBBLE now.
If something is recieved as a bonus by everyone, then technically it isn't a bonus, it's the norm. Thats why paying everyone a bonus except one person, for no justifiable reason, would be seen as discrimination in an employment tribunal.
Or to put it into your words "TRIBBLE, lol"
Anyway, this isn't going anywhere, someone should probably mention the TRIBBLE now.
Your wrong if EVERYONE recieved the bonus then its an EASY bonus to get, but in Champions not EVERYONE gets the bonus stars so its not all that easy.
I mean you can be one shotted right out of the air flying peacefully, and there goes your bonus, super speed through town and BAM! there is a legendary monster oops no more bonus, this all assumes you have EARNED the bonus to lose it, you are not given it automatically. If you really have a hard time playing, you may NEVER get the bonus.
So Champions does not meet you EVERYONE gets a bonus, so the bonus stays a bonus and not the norm.
There are FAR more important things they should concentrate on than something like death penalties that are going away in most modern MMOs.
good point, now that developers are getting away from the artifical feeling of need or the laziness of having a DP, content and environment should see an upswing.
Comments
Ok there is no reasoning with you, the game has no death penalty period.
I agree to pay you $100 to do a job but give you $110 because you did the job fast or better then expected thats called a bonus, I took nothing away from you.
If I agree to pay you $100 but you do a bad job and I take you to court and the court tells me I do not have to pay, then you lost the agreed amount.
Feel free to call it a penalty all you want, you must lead a depressing life if EVERYTHING in life is a penalty for you and a bonus is just a penalty, I can't help you there, but for the rest of us.
I am not assuming ANY numbers, all I am saying is if there is no death penalty you can CHOOSE to impose one, or not, if there is a death penalty you CANNOT CHOOSE to ignore it. There are people who CHOOSE to not play a game on ONLY the death penalty, I am one thats why I do not play Aion (I wanted to but heard about the death penalty and since I can't CHOOSE to not have the death penalty then I CHOOSE not to play).
My goal in this game is not to die, I CHOOSE to consider my efforts a failure if I die in game. I also CHOOSE not to let exploiters bother me, and if grouped I will kick or leave that group and ignore them because I CHOOSE too.
It DOESN'T Matter if someone is zerging to anyone but the Devs, do you understand that? you cannot prove that zerging even exsists (Now I am sure it does, but I have NEVER seen it and I don't do it) if you team with a zerger, drop the team or kick them and put them on ignore, pay attention to your OWN game play, I don't NEED your sense of justice based on rumor that something exsists. There are ways to limit exploits without penalties to ALL, can you at least acknowledge that?
So, in other words, you can choose that the mugger who is about to assault you will stop or you can choose that he strike you. And by doing so, he can then choose to let you report him or not to report him. Hence, he can hit you and you will simply take it - and like it - because he, no longer bound by any laws but his own, doesn't have to give a flying .... if you live or die.
Somewhere out there, you just made a Vulcan cry with your unique logic on how the world and it's inhabitants work.
It's not about you, it's about all of us. Get off your single minded horse and think about the whole.
Oh will you stop we are talking about a game, a time sink waste of time teaching you nothing penalty in a game, that is not where close to what we are talking about, we are talking about penalties not crimes.
Can you try and be logical, your example besides being insulting doesn't even make sense.
This is done there is no death penalty, period if you don't like it leave the game. I am fed up with juvenile and depressing back talk and side reasonning, No one in the world considers bonuses penalties and the fact that the find me a zerger challenge is almost impossible to win is just showing how stupid this debate is.
hahaha...that's funny! I just love the new ability that people have to dis-associate themselves from anything that seems remotely challenging. My Alt-Space is broke...what do I do... The horror!
And I love seeing how people are arguning about better content which I agree to improving, then just imposing penalties.
I love how people say content is super easy and you can't die, so we need a penalty so we don't die
And I love how people are so depressing they view the entire world as nothing but a bleak penalty and we all should suffer with them.
You can be defeated in STO, but there's no real "penalty," unless your patience level is dialed so low that a few seconds before respawning is intolerable. It's a minor slap on the wrist, but not to the point of being frustrating. It's a good balance for this type of game I think. It just depends on what you're looking for and in the mood for. Sometimes you want Eve.
Really and how can you be the judge of what "everyones" emotions are? If you want that I would suggest go to eve and loose a 215 billion cred ship and see what emotions fly outta you.
Would you please point out where I "very clearly" said:
"there's a sizeable demographic who will play Star Trek Online, and have never enjoyed another combat-based computer game"
Poeple can agree or disagree but when hardcore players start beating down on everyone else about the ratification of why DP should be in that goes to far, they should find something else that suits them.
Gotcha. I see what you're saying now.
This is simply false. If you can't win you can't win. If you can win, with some lucky bounces your way, then maybe you do win in STO.
A player, a customer, is not a dog nor a child. Why you would equate a player to either is baffling.
Apples and oranges first off and I am not going to beat them for a mistake.
Opinions are like a-holes. Everyone has one. And they are usually full of TRIBBLE.
I now return you to your regularly scheduled thread.
_____________________________________
I can understand the desire of some for a more "hardcore" experience; however it ultimately harms a game more than it helps. Here's my theory based on my own experiences:
All players want to overcome challenging content and feel a sense of accomplishment. Some of those players want that challenge to be daunting, others want to just fight and not have to worry too much. Cryptic appears to be leaning towards a fun, cinematic style that provides action and challenge but lets the player get right back into the action if they make a mistake or are overwhelmed. This choice was very much about either allowing STO to become a niche game for hardcores or making it casual-friendly.
I played "EVE: The Second Genesis" (AKA EVE Online) from closed beta in '03 until March '09. In that game, if you got clobbered whether by a player or NPCs you lost your ship. Aside from the starter ship, which was replaced for free all other ships had to be replaced at the player's expense. This cost was typically millions or, more often billions of interstellar credits with the cost only slightly mitigated by insuring the ship. The replacement process normally involved traveling between several systems, often through "indian country" to replace the modules and pick up the new ship. This assumes that you had cloned your character properly. In the case of PVP, if you had not and the other player "podded" you (shot your escape pod) as most do, you lost skill points and could possibly face real-time days, weeks or months of re-training in order to get back into the class of ship you were flying or the weapon systems you were using when you died.
Now after playing both games, I can say without hesitation that if Cryptic keeps things casual-friendly they will see high subscriber numbers. When players feel free to explore and have fun without having to worry too much about making a mistake or losing a fight, they will think of STO as a fun leisure activity. The often-maligned Blizzard figured that out and now look at the subscriber numbers for WoW. Both games can provide more difficult challenges through raid-style content. I believe Cryptic understands that placing STO on a more "hardcore" trajectory will ultimately ostracize casual players, including the Star Trek fans who might otherwise have never tried an MMOG.
For games based on an intellectual property, keeping true to the setting and appealing to its fans is the way to go. If Cryptic keeps the game fun for fans of the franchise, they'll always have those fans showing up either as new players or as continuing subscribers. Making a game appeal to hardcore players only lasts until another game markets itself as "more hardcore than that game you WERE playing." Once the hardcore folks move on, what is left?
Because the poster on your side of the argument did, examine the post I quoted.
Nobody is saying to beat them or anyone except those arguing in black and white terms (absolute or nothing). I also noticed you ignored the second half of the post.
Not enough to keep some form of the show running unfortunately.
Yes, I did ignore the second part.
Let be help you.
Let's say that your company gives a rate of pay, with bonus of $110. Now, because you did not work efficiently, you are only given $100. This means that you are payed $10 less than your collegues. This is a penalty. A penalty is by definition the removal of a right or benefit.
The removal of a positive is a negative.
Another way? Under law, freedom is a basic right. When someone commits an unwanted act, that freedom is removed. Therefore, a privilege is removed, a penalty.
If the bonus is the normal state of events (most people will manage not to die for a small amount of time won't they?) then the lack of the bonus would be the abnormal situation. It would be a penalty.
Now, if you want to choose to play a game filled with exploits, that's great, but most people tend to choose a game that... works.
The best way to avoid an exploit is to report it. Not to play pretending that it doesn't exist, that gives the exploiters a comparative advantage.
And please, as you were so adamant I answer your questiion, consider mine which you've now ignored three times: what is this mythical game you play that involves combat and has no death penalty at all? I've yet to encounter it.
Zexks,
I appreciate your point of view; however if you are going to quote from my posts please don't cherry-pick portions out of context. The quote you pasted was actually an answer which challenges your own argument. The quote in proper context is as follows:
For games based on an intellectual property, keeping true to the setting and appealing to its fans is the way to go. If Cryptic keeps the game fun for fans of the franchise, they'll always have those fans showing up either as new players or as continuing subscribers. Making a game appeal to hardcore players only lasts until another game markets itself as "more hardcore than that game you WERE playing." Once the hardcore folks move on, what is left?
Ok trouble is you base rate of pay does not include bonues, if your paid $100 an hour that is your base rate, bonues are not computed till AFTER base pay is paid out, many companies paying bonues monthly in fact and is computed AFTER base pay, there are plenty of accounting books to help you with this concept..
In you crime example, constitutional rights are your basic rights, when you commit a crime your BASIC rights are removed a bonus in this case would be some right or protection not given to everyone without something in exchange, I mean really this is not a very good example for you to use.
Your main issue is your saying that a bonus is a guarantee and thats not how any bonuses work. So again a bonus is that which is granted for exceptional performance above any normal level of reward or compensation, YOU are choosing to equate it to a guarantee.
Champions online has no death penalty except for respawning and returning like STO and made by the same company.
Well, if the bonus is based on not dieing, then every person who does not die would have the bonus- correct? So only those who die would have the bonus...
If a bonus is more common than a lack of one, it is essentially a norm, yes.
In champions online you lose a static bonus upon death, that's a penalty.
Now wait, why should picking the option for a death penalty give better loot?
Here is what I'd like to see:
A check box that if selected gives a death penalty (Doesn't matter what it is really just a death penalty of some sort)
No changes in loot or rewards, give in game notices or force the pop up to pick when you log in. Run this one month data mining who uses it and who doesn't. Post the results.
If the pro DP people are right we should have better then 50% checking it on.
Now before you say this is unfair, all of you have stated the game to be boring without one,so no extra reward is needed.
That a death penalty is needed for the game to succeed.
That a death penalty is more popular then none.
That a lack of a death penalty is making the game too easy.
That a death penalty give immersion.
That a death penalty teaches you how to play the game.
That a death penalty is needed to make the game fresh.
That a death penalty is needed to make the game challenging.
Champions online has no penalty, if I die 10,000 times I don't lose anything (well maybe my mind for dying so much, hehe)
You know what here is what your saying.
You do a mission the mission giver says you get 100 skill points for completing it, you finish it and get your reward but if it was not enough to level you its a penalty, cause everything is a penalty to you. You get a salary well thats a penalty cause you have to work for it. You eat and thats a penalty cause you have to TRIBBLE later, my god what is wrong with you?
Now you're being childish and obtuse.
If something is recieved as a bonus by everyone, then technically it isn't a bonus, it's the norm. Thats why paying everyone a bonus except one person, for no justifiable reason, would be seen as discrimination in an employment tribunal.
Or to put it into your words "TRIBBLE, lol"
Anyway, this isn't going anywhere, someone should probably mention the TRIBBLE now.
Your wrong if EVERYONE recieved the bonus then its an EASY bonus to get, but in Champions not EVERYONE gets the bonus stars so its not all that easy.
I mean you can be one shotted right out of the air flying peacefully, and there goes your bonus, super speed through town and BAM! there is a legendary monster oops no more bonus, this all assumes you have EARNED the bonus to lose it, you are not given it automatically. If you really have a hard time playing, you may NEVER get the bonus.
So Champions does not meet you EVERYONE gets a bonus, so the bonus stays a bonus and not the norm.
And no comments on my Optional DP hehe
good point, now that developers are getting away from the artifical feeling of need or the laziness of having a DP, content and environment should see an upswing.