I appreciate your point of view; however if you are going to quote from my posts please don't cherry-pick portions out of context. The quote you pasted was actually an answer which challenges your own argument. The quote in proper context is as follows:
For games based on an intellectual property, keeping true to the setting and appealing to its fans is the way to go. If Cryptic keeps the game fun for fans of the franchise, they'll always have those fans showing up either as new players or as continuing subscribers. Making a game appeal to hardcore players only lasts until another game markets itself as "more hardcore than that game you WERE playing." Once the hardcore folks move on, what is left?
I wasn't trying to belittle your post in any way. I've just been hearing how it's the fans of the show that will keep this game going and that they are such a numerous bunch that this game can survive on them alone. My only cross point to this was the answer to your last question. When the hardcores leave who is left? The fans your are right. The number of which however can't even sustain a television program any longer, sad as that is. Therefor my point in that was when the hardcore players leave what will be left is a number of fans that can't sustain a tv show. So how are they going to be able to sustain a game that will be almost wholly dependent on them.
Absulutely right, a game without death penalty is MEGA BORING. Those amoung u who wanna play realxed game Cryptic could offer a special mode. Since most content is instance based make it hard mode and noral mode. One with death penalty one wihtout. But ofc with death penalty it should also give better loot.
Why better loot? Would the content not being "boring" be reward enough?
I wasn't trying to belittle your post in any way. I've just been hearing how it's the fans of the show that will keep this game going and that they are such a numerous bunch that this game can survive on them alone. My only cross point to this was the answer to your last question. When the hardcores leave who is left? The fans your are right. The number of which however can't even sustain a television program any longer, sad as that is. Therefor my point in that was when the hardcore players leave what will be left is a number of fans that can't sustain a tv show. So how are they going to be able to sustain a game that will be almost wholly dependent on them.
The "hardcores" does not represent the majority of players.
Just so I understand you:
You punish your dog for doing something wrong.
You punish your child for doing something wrong.
You DON'T punish your player for doing something wrong?
So why do I have to take damage? They're all going to die anyways, and me taking damage just adds needless time I could be using to do other things. Can't we just take weapons away from NPC's? If I ever blow up (I hope I will sometime before Admiral) I don't want to have to waste time trying to find where I was in the last part of the mission so to me I don't really want to blow up anymore. Can't we just take that out too?
IT"S A GAME..you actually are advocating "punishment" for players. That concept has to be the most ridiculous I have ever seen...punish your players...LOL
If you die and respawn then the NPC should also respawn so everything is reset as new... This doesn't ruin the flow of the game forcing you to go to another station to get crew (which is also currently pointless, well done Cryptic) and promotes you to stay alive if your down to on or two ships as you dont want to restart on them again, the respawn will be based on the respwn points you unlock as you go along... It also means you get as many trys as you like before you decide you need help or move on to missions until you level up enough to do it...
If in a group situation then you would be dead until either your friends die an you all respawn or they prevail and then you respawn and continue with them...
I agree with this implementation, though i would word the last sentence as "you do not respawn until your team is no longer in combat". This would make the encounters modular and render zerging almost useless while not actually enforcing a penalty on the player.
IT"S A GAME..you actually are advocating "punishment" for players. That concept has to be the most ridiculous I have ever seen...punish your players...LOL
Name me one game that doesn't have some kind of penalty system. Oh and please note I used your argument I didn't come up with that example on my own, you did.
The "hardcores" does not represent the majority of players.
Did reading comprehension fail you. I said the majority of subs for this game are going to come from fans of the IP. The number of which was unable to sustain any series in the last decade. If those same (and might I add supremely divided) fans can't even keep a series going how pray tell are they going to sustain this MMO?
Name me one game that doesn't have some kind of penalty system. Oh and please note I used your argument I didn't come up with that example on my own, you did.
Did reading comprehension fail you. I said the majority of subs for this game are going to come from fans of the IP. The number of which was unable to sustain any series in the last decade. If those same (and might I add supremely divided) fans can't even keep a series going how pray tell are they going to sustain this MMO?
Did reading comprehension fail you. I said the majority of subs for this game are going to come from fans of the IP.
Help me out with my "reading comprehension" and show me where you actually said that.
"I wasn't trying to belittle your post in any way. I've just been hearing how it's the fans of the show that will keep this game going and that they are such a numerous bunch that this game can survive on them alone. My only cross point to this was the answer to your last question. When the hardcores leave who is left? The fans your are right. The number of which however can't even sustain a television program any longer, sad as that is. Therefor my point in that was when the hardcore players leave what will be left is a number of fans that can't sustain a tv show. So how are they going to be able to sustain a game that will be almost wholly dependent on them."
Your implication is that hardcores are such a large segment of the population, of the game, that the game fails without them.
The number of which was unable to sustain any series in the last decade. If those same (and might I add supremely divided) fans can't even keep a series going how pray tell are they going to sustain this MMO?
The last season of Enterprise had 2.81 million viewersURL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek_Enterprise#Reception"]1[/URL, the lowest of the four year run. 2.81 viewers couldn't keep the show on the air. 2.81 million subscribers to this game would make it one of the must succesful MMOs in the market.
Your premise fails. STO could only hope to have a fan base like the one Enterprise had. If STO could capture just half the audience that Enterpirse did it'd be a run-away succcess as an MMO.
Do you keep those "play well" bonuses after you die? Are they with you forever from the time you get them? I'm pretty sure you lose those when you die. Wouldn't that be considered a penalty system?
Do you keep those "play well" bonuses after you die? Are they with you forever from the time you get them? I'm pretty sure you lose those when you die. Wouldn't that be considered a penalty system?
I have to wait 15 seconds to re-spawn in STO, I am losing time. Wouldn't that be considered a penalty system?
Do you keep those "play well" bonuses after you die? Are they with you forever from the time you get them? I'm pretty sure you lose those when you die. Wouldn't that be considered a penalty system?
You lose 1 of 5 stars each time you die (so 5 deaths to lose the bonus). You gain back stars as you fight.
So, though good play you can be "more" than you are.. But no matter what you can never be "less" than you are.
Considering that you get a "bonus" for having stars I would not call that a "penalty".... Let alone that the words "bonus" and "penalty" mean the opposite thing.
Help me out with my "reading comprehension" and show me where you actually said that
Your implication is that hardcores are such a large segment of the population, of the game, that the game fails without them.
The last season of Enterprise had 2.81 million viewersURL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek_Enterprise#Reception"]1[/URL, the lowest of the four year run. 2.81 viewers couldn't keep the show on the air. 2.81 million subscribers to this game would make it one of the must succesful MMOs in the market.
Your premise fails. STO could only hope to have a fan bas like the one Enterprise had. If STO could capture just half the audience that Enterpirse did it'd be a run-away succcess as an MMO.
And do you honestly think it will be able to capture even a fraction of that audience? I know several trekkers/trekkies that will never touch this game. What fraction of those that do will stick around past 1 year? What fraction of those will stay even longer? Cryptic's past record does not seem to support the idea that they're even going to be committing any kind of meaningful resources at STO, with CO still being built and another as yet unnamed MMO already in the works.
Do you honestly see this game making it past the 1 year mark based on Cryptic's past performance? Watching a show is a lot easier than sitting in front of a monitor for hours on a time sync like any MMO. Why couldn't they keep Enterprise running? If there were so many fans watching it I would have thought whatever company running it would have wanted to maintain that income. And what is to come of this IP after they've given up on it? They can't sell it like they did with CoH/V, they don't own it.
I truly don't want to see this game remembered like every other Star Trek game, as a p.o.s. But if it can't keep enough people entertained for any amount of time it's going to die. Look at the Matrix, they had a huge fan base, but shoddy/lack of game design killed it quicker than I think any other MMO around. I don't want this to happen to STO but if even the slowest leveler is admiral in 6 months and they continue the content record they have with CO I don't see many resubbing.
I have to wait 15 seconds to re-spawn in STO, I am losing time. Wouldn't that be considered a penalty system?
I have already addressed that in another post. It is a penalty that is nothing more than a time sync, and as others in this thread have said I don't want unnecessary time syncs. It teaches me nothing, helps with nothing and delays nothing, so just take it out.
In fact, since we can only seem to see black and white here, take all weapons away from NPC's. I have better things to do than watch the explosion animation for 15 seconds before finishing off whatever was left in that group that I didn't kill the first round. So NO to Death, NO to Penalties, NO to NPC damage, NO to a 15 second respawn that does not effect the game in anyway, NO to anything that detracts from my space bar mashing. If we're going to K.I.S.S. then lets not half TRIBBLE it and just go all the way huh?
You lose 1 of 5 stars each time you die (so 5 deaths to lose the bonus). You gain back stars as you fight.
So, though good play you can be "more" than you are.. But no matter what you can never be "less" than you are.
Considering that you get a "bonus" for having stars I would not call that a "penalty".... Let alone that the words "bonus" and "penalty" mean the opposite thing.
I do believe this is simple perception. You believe you are nothing less than what you are because you perceive those stars as bonuses to what you are. The penalty is the loss of the star. If there were no penalty you would never lose any stars right? I'm sure there are those that perceive themselves as less than they should be without those stars. There are probably those that perceive who they are as their character with only 5 stars, as anything less is well just that: less.
I do believe this is simple perception. You believe you are nothing less than what you are because you perceive those stars as bonuses to what you are. The penalty is the loss of the star. If there were no penalty you would never lose any stars right? I'm sure there are those that perceive themselves as less than they should be without those stars. There are probably those that perceive who they are as their character with only 5 stars, as anything less is well just that: less.
I think it is because you want to perceive it that way.
When you make your new character you do not have the bonus (IIRC). You are at "normal" at this point. When you defeat bad guys you earn the stars.. Making you greater than "normal". When you are defeated you lose the stars bringing you back to "normal".
Nothing takes you below "normal" but your actions can make you greater than "normal".
Some people see the glass as half full and others half empty.
I think it is because you want to perceive it that way.
When you make your new character you do not have the bonus (IIRC). You are at "normal" at this point. When you defeat bad guys you earn the stars.. Making you greater than "normal". When you are defeated you lose the stars bringing you back to "normal".
Nothing takes you below "normal" but your actions can make you greater than "normal".
Some people see the glass as half full and others half empty.
Penalty: disadvantage, loss, or hardship due to some action (from merriam-webster.com)
So you start normal, then you kill something and get a star. Then you die and loose said star. I do believe that fits the above definition. It puts you at a disadvantage to where you were. It could be considered a 'loss'. It makes the game ever so slightly harder (hardship). All due to some action.
This is all a matter of perception. You don't want to perceive your getting anything negative so you see it as a lessening of the positive. I don't want to perceive that what I do makes no difference. And as I have repeatedly stated if they're going to go this route then they shouldn't half TRIBBLE it. Take away anything remotely negative. I don't want to die. I don't want to blow up. I don't want to take damage. I don't want to spend 15 minute waiting to finish off a group. Just let me play and don't get in my way. NO to Death, NO to damage and NO to NPC weapons.
Also, death penalty is not needed. Respawning may make you reappear at full health a little faster, but when you consider the travel time it takes to get back to the enemy group it's less appealing and more work.
A ship will typically heal to full or close to it by the time you get back to it from respawning anyway unless you died right beside the respawn point because you're just that bad.
Zerging isn't really a problem, this game was made to be mind numbingly easy anyway, but if zerging ever did become an issue, the solution isn't a death penalty but simply make yourself unable to respawn when any team mates are in combat. So in fleet actions and such, you cant just keep dying and running back, yo have to go in as a fleet and die or retreat as a fleet. No zerg trickle rushing in from respawn constantly.
Anything outside of fleet actions really doesn't matter.
As for PVP, make your score and experience drop every death and that solves it there.
Penalty: disadvantage, loss, or hardship due to some action (from merriam-webster.com)
So you start normal, then you kill something and get a star. Then you die and loose said star. I do believe that fits the above definition. It puts you at a disadvantage to where you were. It could be considered a 'loss'. It makes the game ever so slightly harder (hardship). All due to some action.
This is all a matter of perception. You don't want to perceive your getting anything negative so you see it as a lessening of the positive. I don't want to perceive that what I do makes no difference. And as I have repeatedly stated if they're going to go this route then they shouldn't half TRIBBLE it. Take away anything remotely negative. I don't want to die. I don't want to blow up. I don't want to take damage. I don't want to spend 15 minute waiting to finish off a group. Just let me play and don't get in my way. NO to Death, NO to damage and NO to NPC weapons.
Think however you want. I won't try to stop you.
Seeing that the game uses the word "bonus" and not "penalty" I feel all-right about my own thought processes.
By the way... Are you either of the girls in your avatar photo? Do you think it is funny to call people names who have genetic and medical differences?
I don't.. But I guess that is why we perceive things differently.
By the way... Are you either of the girls in your avatar photo? Do you think it is funny to call people names who have genetic and medical differences?
I don't.. But I guess that is why we perceive things differently.
No I'm not, it came from an email I got a long time ago. Every time I read the caption it makes me laugh though. Nice attempt at a cheap shot though. I'd hope with a response like that, you would avoid any funny video show as they tend to show those with some kind of diability (young, old, overweight, whatever) and that should be a massive affront to your personal sensibilities.
Bob Saget and Tom Bergereau (don't know how to spell his name) should probably burn in the pit for what they do then shouldn't they? Making fun of those less fortunate and all, and on national TV. How dare they.
I fear the average gamer won't be so easily placated, and what that will mean for the long term survival of STO.
No I'm not, it came from an email I got a long time ago. Every time I read the caption it makes me laugh though. Nice attempt at a cheap shot though. I'd hope with a response like that, you would avoid any funny video show as they tend to show those with some kind of diability (young, old, overweight, whatever) and that should be a massive affront to your personal sensibilities.
Bob Saget and Tom Bergereau (don't know how to spell his name) should probably burn in the pit for what they do then shouldn't they? Making fun of those less fortunate and all, and on national TV. How dare they.
I guess I do not feel the need to point and laugh at people with serious medical conditions or genetic conditions. I also never see a reason to call people names.. Especially anonymous ones with severe conditions.
Seeing that you find such activities enjoyable enough to advertise it to everyone else says a lot to me.
Do you keep those "play well" bonuses after you die? Are they with you forever from the time you get them? I'm pretty sure you lose those when you die. Wouldn't that be considered a penalty system?
No, most logical people don't see bonuses as penalties, unless your trying to prove that a death penalty is needed.
On Earth in the game Champions online it is a bonus.
Only on an internet forum would people consider a bonus as a penalty
And do you honestly think it will be able to capture even a fraction of that audience? I know several trekkers/trekkies that will never touch this game. What fraction of those that do will stick around past 1 year? What fraction of those will stay even longer? Cryptic's past record does not seem to support the idea that they're even going to be committing any kind of meaningful resources at STO, with CO still being built and another as yet unnamed MMO already in the works.
Do you honestly see this game making it past the 1 year mark based on Cryptic's past performance? Watching a show is a lot easier than sitting in front of a monitor for hours on a time sync like any MMO. Why couldn't they keep Enterprise running? If there were so many fans watching it I would have thought whatever company running it would have wanted to maintain that income. And what is to come of this IP after they've given up on it? They can't sell it like they did with CoH/V, they don't own it.
I truly don't want to see this game remembered like every other Star Trek game, as a p.o.s. But if it can't keep enough people entertained for any amount of time it's going to die. Look at the Matrix, they had a huge fan base, but shoddy/lack of game design killed it quicker than I think any other MMO around. I don't want this to happen to STO but if even the slowest leveler is admiral in 6 months and they continue the content record they have with CO I don't see many resubbing.
SWOOOOSHHHHH!!!
Hear that? It's the sound of you moving goal-posts.
I didn't say STO would get the same audience as the tv show Enterprise, I was highlighting your silly notion that the folks who watched that show couldn't even keep it in on the air they couldn't keep the game alive. But if STO did have the same, or similar audience, it would be a smash hit.
But you didn't even know the ratings for the show and were trying to take digs at those who watch the series.
You insisted that the numbers that failed to keep the tv show on the air wouldn't keep STO going without "hardcore" player. It's simply false. If the game had a large portion of the tv shows audience you and the other "hardcore" players leaving wouldn't even be noticed.
You don't comprehend the difference in needs for a tv show and an MMO. I don't understand why you can't but you clearly don't. An audience a network would shrug off is an audience almost all MMO would kill to have.
Just admit your mistake, attempt to explain your position in a better way and move on. The fan base that watched the tv show, if they came to the game, would make it a run-away hit. Your premise is wrong.
Note that I never say I think they will come over in comparable numbers simply that if they did, those numbers could not save the tv show but they would certainly save this game.
I have already addressed that in another post. It is a penalty that is nothing more than a time sync, and as others in this thread have said I don't want unnecessary time syncs. It teaches me nothing, helps with nothing and delays nothing, so just take it out.
In fact, since we can only seem to see black and white here, take all weapons away from NPC's. I have better things to do than watch the explosion animation for 15 seconds before finishing off whatever was left in that group that I didn't kill the first round. So NO to Death, NO to Penalties, NO to NPC damage, NO to a 15 second respawn that does not effect the game in anyway, NO to anything that detracts from my space bar mashing. If we're going to K.I.S.S. then lets not half TRIBBLE it and just go all the way huh?
Most MMO "death penalties" are time sinks.
STO has a time sink. It has a death penalty.
PS: Keep being absurd if that's the only responses you have left.
A death penalty shouldn't be implemented. And here's why.
I hate to say it but death penalties suck in all mmos. In eve you lose your ship(meaning you spend most of your play time recovering your lost ships' values), in wow u waste time and all your gear gets damaged, in FF11 you lose EXP and even level DOWN.
That being said PvE in STO already has an excellent death penalty.
When you die in a PvE mission you respawn. you lose a bit of crew, big whoop, they recharge quickly. However, what is really frustrating (or at least it was in OB not sure now as im not far in the game) All those enemies you were fighting....they heal completely by the time u get back. If you just spent 2 minutes dueling a battlecruiser in your Miranda, and TRIBBLE up and die, You just lost all that progress. Which to me is annoying as he**.
Now if you look at the PvP system, a death penalty would be a disaster. Again there is already a penalty for dieing.....the other team gets a point, duh. Being as the goal in pvp at least for the team as a whole, is to outscore your opponents, how would damaging your equiptment help that? By the end of the match you would all be limping around in half dead ships.
Also, when you die in pvp you lose out on precious damage dealt which means less reward.
I quit EVE because I literally dont have the time to constantly have to work to replace ships as opposed to getting better ones. And dont tell me I needed to L2P, if u play eve, you lose ships. Simple as that.
I enjoy that I can log on to STO and play a few quick PvP matches in between work/school. A death penalty would ruin that, and most likely, this game.
I would however, like to note that the skill cap sucks, and combat is still a bit too easy :P
wow, and I thought world of warcraft had reached that perfect spot of relaxing and non-punishing gameplay,
I call myself a casual player, and I play quite casually, but people here in this thread are quite right to be worried about the outcome of STO when the gameplay mechanics are so out of order as they are.
My other half and I are new to MMO's. Never played one before, but decided to pick up STO.
So far so good, but just wanted to add my fellings about a DP.
Was on one of the early missions, and getting my butt kicked - shields gone, hull depleting, I tried to run and was on the edge of my seat, unsure what would happen when my character got splattered. Then it happened - boooooom, dead!
So I sit there, thinking "Oh no, what happens now that I died?".
Respawn.
What? Is that it? Haven't even lost progress on the number of Borg ships destroyed? WTF?
It's taken a bit of the tension (read fun) out of the combat already for me. What's the point if I can just keep brute forcing it rather than making me think how to approach the situation differently?
I would welcome some kind of penalty. Nothing too major, but something! Otherwise, where's the challenge?
I still might have fun with it. I have only just started, but this point really does give me pause when considering whether I will play past my first free month.
Comments
just not true...
I wasn't trying to belittle your post in any way. I've just been hearing how it's the fans of the show that will keep this game going and that they are such a numerous bunch that this game can survive on them alone. My only cross point to this was the answer to your last question. When the hardcores leave who is left? The fans your are right. The number of which however can't even sustain a television program any longer, sad as that is. Therefor my point in that was when the hardcore players leave what will be left is a number of fans that can't sustain a tv show. So how are they going to be able to sustain a game that will be almost wholly dependent on them.
Why better loot? Would the content not being "boring" be reward enough?
The "hardcores" does not represent the majority of players.
you have to wait to respan, that's death penalty enough
it's a game, games are supposed to be fun
and cryptic has stated that there are enough games with death penalty, the game-community is ready to move on to something new
and no they didn't use those exact words, but that was the point
IT"S A GAME..you actually are advocating "punishment" for players. That concept has to be the most ridiculous I have ever seen...punish your players...LOL
Name me one game that doesn't have some kind of penalty system. Oh and please note I used your argument I didn't come up with that example on my own, you did.
Did reading comprehension fail you. I said the majority of subs for this game are going to come from fans of the IP. The number of which was unable to sustain any series in the last decade. If those same (and might I add supremely divided) fans can't even keep a series going how pray tell are they going to sustain this MMO?
Champions Online
Help me out with my "reading comprehension" and show me where you actually said that.
"I wasn't trying to belittle your post in any way. I've just been hearing how it's the fans of the show that will keep this game going and that they are such a numerous bunch that this game can survive on them alone. My only cross point to this was the answer to your last question. When the hardcores leave who is left? The fans your are right. The number of which however can't even sustain a television program any longer, sad as that is. Therefor my point in that was when the hardcore players leave what will be left is a number of fans that can't sustain a tv show. So how are they going to be able to sustain a game that will be almost wholly dependent on them."
Your implication is that hardcores are such a large segment of the population, of the game, that the game fails without them.
The last season of Enterprise had 2.81 million viewersURL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Trek_Enterprise#Reception"]1[/URL, the lowest of the four year run. 2.81 viewers couldn't keep the show on the air. 2.81 million subscribers to this game would make it one of the must succesful MMOs in the market.
Your premise fails. STO could only hope to have a fan base like the one Enterprise had. If STO could capture just half the audience that Enterpirse did it'd be a run-away succcess as an MMO.
Do you keep those "play well" bonuses after you die? Are they with you forever from the time you get them? I'm pretty sure you lose those when you die. Wouldn't that be considered a penalty system?
I have to wait 15 seconds to re-spawn in STO, I am losing time. Wouldn't that be considered a penalty system?
You lose 1 of 5 stars each time you die (so 5 deaths to lose the bonus). You gain back stars as you fight.
So, though good play you can be "more" than you are.. But no matter what you can never be "less" than you are.
Considering that you get a "bonus" for having stars I would not call that a "penalty".... Let alone that the words "bonus" and "penalty" mean the opposite thing.
And do you honestly think it will be able to capture even a fraction of that audience? I know several trekkers/trekkies that will never touch this game. What fraction of those that do will stick around past 1 year? What fraction of those will stay even longer? Cryptic's past record does not seem to support the idea that they're even going to be committing any kind of meaningful resources at STO, with CO still being built and another as yet unnamed MMO already in the works.
Do you honestly see this game making it past the 1 year mark based on Cryptic's past performance? Watching a show is a lot easier than sitting in front of a monitor for hours on a time sync like any MMO. Why couldn't they keep Enterprise running? If there were so many fans watching it I would have thought whatever company running it would have wanted to maintain that income. And what is to come of this IP after they've given up on it? They can't sell it like they did with CoH/V, they don't own it.
I truly don't want to see this game remembered like every other Star Trek game, as a p.o.s. But if it can't keep enough people entertained for any amount of time it's going to die. Look at the Matrix, they had a huge fan base, but shoddy/lack of game design killed it quicker than I think any other MMO around. I don't want this to happen to STO but if even the slowest leveler is admiral in 6 months and they continue the content record they have with CO I don't see many resubbing.
I have already addressed that in another post. It is a penalty that is nothing more than a time sync, and as others in this thread have said I don't want unnecessary time syncs. It teaches me nothing, helps with nothing and delays nothing, so just take it out.
In fact, since we can only seem to see black and white here, take all weapons away from NPC's. I have better things to do than watch the explosion animation for 15 seconds before finishing off whatever was left in that group that I didn't kill the first round. So NO to Death, NO to Penalties, NO to NPC damage, NO to a 15 second respawn that does not effect the game in anyway, NO to anything that detracts from my space bar mashing. If we're going to K.I.S.S. then lets not half TRIBBLE it and just go all the way huh?
I do believe this is simple perception. You believe you are nothing less than what you are because you perceive those stars as bonuses to what you are. The penalty is the loss of the star. If there were no penalty you would never lose any stars right? I'm sure there are those that perceive themselves as less than they should be without those stars. There are probably those that perceive who they are as their character with only 5 stars, as anything less is well just that: less.
I think it is because you want to perceive it that way.
When you make your new character you do not have the bonus (IIRC). You are at "normal" at this point. When you defeat bad guys you earn the stars.. Making you greater than "normal". When you are defeated you lose the stars bringing you back to "normal".
Nothing takes you below "normal" but your actions can make you greater than "normal".
Some people see the glass as half full and others half empty.
Penalty: disadvantage, loss, or hardship due to some action (from merriam-webster.com)
So you start normal, then you kill something and get a star. Then you die and loose said star. I do believe that fits the above definition. It puts you at a disadvantage to where you were. It could be considered a 'loss'. It makes the game ever so slightly harder (hardship). All due to some action.
This is all a matter of perception. You don't want to perceive your getting anything negative so you see it as a lessening of the positive. I don't want to perceive that what I do makes no difference. And as I have repeatedly stated if they're going to go this route then they shouldn't half TRIBBLE it. Take away anything remotely negative. I don't want to die. I don't want to blow up. I don't want to take damage. I don't want to spend 15 minute waiting to finish off a group. Just let me play and don't get in my way. NO to Death, NO to damage and NO to NPC weapons.
...
...
You have a huge rack.
Also, death penalty is not needed. Respawning may make you reappear at full health a little faster, but when you consider the travel time it takes to get back to the enemy group it's less appealing and more work.
A ship will typically heal to full or close to it by the time you get back to it from respawning anyway unless you died right beside the respawn point because you're just that bad.
Zerging isn't really a problem, this game was made to be mind numbingly easy anyway, but if zerging ever did become an issue, the solution isn't a death penalty but simply make yourself unable to respawn when any team mates are in combat. So in fleet actions and such, you cant just keep dying and running back, yo have to go in as a fleet and die or retreat as a fleet. No zerg trickle rushing in from respawn constantly.
Anything outside of fleet actions really doesn't matter.
As for PVP, make your score and experience drop every death and that solves it there.
This isn't a big deal.
Think however you want. I won't try to stop you.
Seeing that the game uses the word "bonus" and not "penalty" I feel all-right about my own thought processes.
By the way... Are you either of the girls in your avatar photo? Do you think it is funny to call people names who have genetic and medical differences?
I don't.. But I guess that is why we perceive things differently.
I fear the average gamer won't be so easily placated, and what that will mean for the long term survival of STO.
No I'm not, it came from an email I got a long time ago. Every time I read the caption it makes me laugh though. Nice attempt at a cheap shot though. I'd hope with a response like that, you would avoid any funny video show as they tend to show those with some kind of diability (young, old, overweight, whatever) and that should be a massive affront to your personal sensibilities.
Bob Saget and Tom Bergereau (don't know how to spell his name) should probably burn in the pit for what they do then shouldn't they? Making fun of those less fortunate and all, and on national TV. How dare they.
I guess I do not feel the need to point and laugh at people with serious medical conditions or genetic conditions. I also never see a reason to call people names.. Especially anonymous ones with severe conditions.
Seeing that you find such activities enjoyable enough to advertise it to everyone else says a lot to me.
/wave
No, most logical people don't see bonuses as penalties, unless your trying to prove that a death penalty is needed.
On Earth in the game Champions online it is a bonus.
Only on an internet forum would people consider a bonus as a penalty
SWOOOOSHHHHH!!!
Hear that? It's the sound of you moving goal-posts.
I didn't say STO would get the same audience as the tv show Enterprise, I was highlighting your silly notion that the folks who watched that show couldn't even keep it in on the air they couldn't keep the game alive. But if STO did have the same, or similar audience, it would be a smash hit.
But you didn't even know the ratings for the show and were trying to take digs at those who watch the series.
You insisted that the numbers that failed to keep the tv show on the air wouldn't keep STO going without "hardcore" player. It's simply false. If the game had a large portion of the tv shows audience you and the other "hardcore" players leaving wouldn't even be noticed.
You don't comprehend the difference in needs for a tv show and an MMO. I don't understand why you can't but you clearly don't. An audience a network would shrug off is an audience almost all MMO would kill to have.
Just admit your mistake, attempt to explain your position in a better way and move on. The fan base that watched the tv show, if they came to the game, would make it a run-away hit. Your premise is wrong.
Note that I never say I think they will come over in comparable numbers simply that if they did, those numbers could not save the tv show but they would certainly save this game.
Most MMO "death penalties" are time sinks.
STO has a time sink. It has a death penalty.
PS: Keep being absurd if that's the only responses you have left.
I hate to say it but death penalties suck in all mmos. In eve you lose your ship(meaning you spend most of your play time recovering your lost ships' values), in wow u waste time and all your gear gets damaged, in FF11 you lose EXP and even level DOWN.
That being said PvE in STO already has an excellent death penalty.
When you die in a PvE mission you respawn. you lose a bit of crew, big whoop, they recharge quickly. However, what is really frustrating (or at least it was in OB not sure now as im not far in the game) All those enemies you were fighting....they heal completely by the time u get back. If you just spent 2 minutes dueling a battlecruiser in your Miranda, and TRIBBLE up and die, You just lost all that progress. Which to me is annoying as he**.
Now if you look at the PvP system, a death penalty would be a disaster. Again there is already a penalty for dieing.....the other team gets a point, duh. Being as the goal in pvp at least for the team as a whole, is to outscore your opponents, how would damaging your equiptment help that? By the end of the match you would all be limping around in half dead ships.
Also, when you die in pvp you lose out on precious damage dealt which means less reward.
I quit EVE because I literally dont have the time to constantly have to work to replace ships as opposed to getting better ones. And dont tell me I needed to L2P, if u play eve, you lose ships. Simple as that.
I enjoy that I can log on to STO and play a few quick PvP matches in between work/school. A death penalty would ruin that, and most likely, this game.
I would however, like to note that the skill cap sucks, and combat is still a bit too easy :P
I call myself a casual player, and I play quite casually, but people here in this thread are quite right to be worried about the outcome of STO when the gameplay mechanics are so out of order as they are.
So far so good, but just wanted to add my fellings about a DP.
Was on one of the early missions, and getting my butt kicked - shields gone, hull depleting, I tried to run and was on the edge of my seat, unsure what would happen when my character got splattered. Then it happened - boooooom, dead!
So I sit there, thinking "Oh no, what happens now that I died?".
Respawn.
What? Is that it? Haven't even lost progress on the number of Borg ships destroyed? WTF?
It's taken a bit of the tension (read fun) out of the combat already for me. What's the point if I can just keep brute forcing it rather than making me think how to approach the situation differently?
I would welcome some kind of penalty. Nothing too major, but something! Otherwise, where's the challenge?
I still might have fun with it. I have only just started, but this point really does give me pause when considering whether I will play past my first free month.