Sharing your Account

ryogahabiki · May 2022

First and foremost, this question does not pertain to me.
I have a friend who started playing STO shortly after it was released but since then has become burned out (Long story) and she is considering giving her account and all the characters/ships/etc she has earned/unlocked/etc to her son.
I always remember hearing you can't share your account with another person, including gifting the account to another person. But when I looked in the T&C I can't find where it says that. I don't know if I was looking in the wrong spot or if I am mistaken.
Does anyone know what the policy is, and can they point me to some official document/page that says it.

baddmoonrizin · May 2022

The Terms of Service related to accounts and specfically with regards to what you describe are as follows:

4. Account

4.1 You may be required to create an account (an “Account”) to access our Service and to use certain features and functions of our Service.

4.2 IN ORDER TO USE OUR SERVICES, YOU NEED TO MEET CERTAIN AGE REQUIREMENTS STIPULATED IN THE JURISDICTION OF YOUR RESIDENCE, AND YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE POWER TO ENTER A BINDING AGREEMENT WITH US UNDER ANY APPLICABLE LAWS. For example, if you reside in the United States, you must be 13 years of age or older to create an Account and you must be 18 years of age or older to enter into a contract independently. If you are 13 or over, but are under the legal age to enter into a contract in the jurisdiction you reside in (“Legal Age”) and/or under 18 years of age, we require that you review these Terms with your parents or legal guardian to ensure they read and agree to them. If you are the parent or legal guardian of a user of our Website, Games and/or Service and you have questions about the Terms, please contact us at tos@gearboxsf.com.

4.3 By creating an Account or otherwise using the Service, you represent that you are of Legal Age or at least age 18 and agree to these Terms, or that you are over 13 years old and your parents or legal guardian have read and agreed to these Terms, and you understand and agree that we are relying upon that representation in allowing you to use the Service.

4.5 When creating an Account and a user identity (“User ID”) you agree to (i) provide true, accurate, current and complete information as requested in the required fields (the “Account Information”) and (ii) promptly maintain and update such User ID and your Account Information to keep it true, accurate, current and complete.

4.7 Your Account may only to be used by yourself. We are not responsible for any misuse of your Account or your User ID, you agree to accept all risks of misuse of and unauthorized access to your Account and to hold us and our affiliates harmless from and against any misuse use of your Account or your User ID, including, but not limited to, improper or unauthorized use by someone to whom you revealed your password.

For further information, please refer to the Terms of Service page on the website:

https://account.arcgames.com/en/about/terms/

jonsills · May 2022

So, technically not against the rules providing that account info is updated to reflect the change and son is of age, but Cryptic is held harmless for anything that happens regarding the account from that point on - including if son unwisely shares any logon details and someone accesses the account and sells everything on the Exchange for 1 EC each.

baddmoonrizin · May 2022

I just checked for clarification as well, and the gifting, selling, or trading of accounts is prohibited.

Unknown · May 2022

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diesel · May 2022

you can do what ever you want with yr account.
you can't blame company for what you did to yr account and company will tell you TRIBBLE off if you do so.
as long as you keep quiet (not blabbing at forum or in game), company do not care what you do to yr account.

ryogahabiki · May 2022

baddmoonrizin wrote: »

The Terms of Service related to accounts and specfically with regards to what you describe are as follows:

4. Account

4.1 You may be required to create an account (an “Account”) to access our Service and to use certain features and functions of our Service.

4.2 IN ORDER TO USE OUR SERVICES, YOU NEED TO MEET CERTAIN AGE REQUIREMENTS STIPULATED IN THE JURISDICTION OF YOUR RESIDENCE, AND YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE POWER TO ENTER A BINDING AGREEMENT WITH US UNDER ANY APPLICABLE LAWS. For example, if you reside in the United States, you must be 13 years of age or older to create an Account and you must be 18 years of age or older to enter into a contract independently. If you are 13 or over, but are under the legal age to enter into a contract in the jurisdiction you reside in (“Legal Age”) and/or under 18 years of age, we require that you review these Terms with your parents or legal guardian to ensure they read and agree to them. If you are the parent or legal guardian of a user of our Website, Games and/or Service and you have questions about the Terms, please contact us at tos@gearboxsf.com.

4.3 By creating an Account or otherwise using the Service, you represent that you are of Legal Age or at least age 18 and agree to these Terms, or that you are over 13 years old and your parents or legal guardian have read and agreed to these Terms, and you understand and agree that we are relying upon that representation in allowing you to use the Service.

4.5 When creating an Account and a user identity (“User ID”) you agree to (i) provide true, accurate, current and complete information as requested in the required fields (the “Account Information”) and (ii) promptly maintain and update such User ID and your Account Information to keep it true, accurate, current and complete.

4.7 Your Account may only to be used by yourself. We are not responsible for any misuse of your Account or your User ID, you agree to accept all risks of misuse of and unauthorized access to your Account and to hold us and our affiliates harmless from and against any misuse use of your Account or your User ID, including, but not limited to, improper or unauthorized use by someone to whom you revealed your password.

For further information, please refer to the Terms of Service page on the website:

https://account.arcgames.com/en/about/terms/

Thank You

baddmoonrizin · May 2022

keepcalmchiveon wrote: »

i like how at the age of 13, you need a parents approval...how is that going to be proven?

on the same hand...why cant people xfer an acct to a family member? how is that going to be proven as well?

in the terms outlined by you bad...it does not specify in no uncertain terms about xfer of an acct to a family member. it says "only by yourself," and really doesnt do well in defining ones self.

in 4.7 as you posted, they are not responsible for actions on the acct, should one desire to hand out the password. (revealed is the word used)...so in essence, the mother could share that password, and the son could sign in moving forward, and no one would know.

tricky points and its rather grey and undefined.

seems odd as well that 4.7 leaves cryptic blameless if an acct got TRIBBLE as well.

why doesnt cryptic install a 2 form auth factor like many games do now?

just my thoughts...not trying to provoke or poke the bear.

I pointed all of that out myself, but was told in no uncertain terms that it just isn't allowed. That being said, yeah, how is anyone to know unless an issue comes up with the account later and one reaches out to CS about it? Anyway...

diesel#3831 wrote: »

you can do what ever you want with yr account.
you can't blame company for what you did to yr account and company will tell you TRIBBLE off if you do so.
as long as you keep quiet (not blabbing at forum or in game), company do not care what you do to yr account.

Please, do not give people bad advice when they've been given a clarification of the Terms of Service, because as I've clearly pointed out, the company does care.

ryogahabiki wrote: »

Thank You

You're quite welcome.

angrytarg · May 2022

Nobody knows who actually plays the game. Just saying.

jonsills · May 2022

The bit about needing your parent's approval if you're under 18 absolves Cryptic of any responsibility if someone comes in and is shocked to find Timmy playing one of those eeeevil online games that teach you to curse your parents and worship Satan. Or, y'know, they just stub their eyes on a typical ESD chat. Complain to the company? Hey, we *told* the kid to get your permission - not our fault. We can shut that down right now, though...

rattler2 · May 2022

Another reason for the no sharing of accounts is information security. There could be things tied to it, like maybe credit card information if someone saved that somewhere.

Lets say someone was playing a subscription game and decided to quit, but they know a friend who would love to play. Well... what if the original owner also forgot that they had their credit card information saved for that account. Yea maybe they disabled a recurring sub, but if the card is still saved... guess who now has access to it.

It may not always be the case, but this is one major concern when it comes to ANY account attached to a game. It is a chance no company wishes to take. Therefor... account sharing is officially a no go.

captainbrian11 · May 2022

That said, I'm sure cryptic isn't going to shut down an account because Mom let's her kid play around on it.

Unknown · June 2022

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rattler2 · June 2022

Doesn't matter the age. It is a legal issue that no company wants to deal with at all.

wraithshadow13 · June 2022

Does that include letting your kid play on your account, even if you're still active on it? I.E. letting them have their own character?

I don't have kids, but i can only imagine how many trek fans would do that so their kids can play, too.

angrytarg · June 2022

> @wraithshadow13 said:
> Does that include letting your kid play on your account, even if you're still active on it? I.E. letting them have their own character?
>
> I don't have kids, but i can only imagine how many trek fans would do that so their kids can play, too.

Again, nobody knows. For legal reasons, if you ask, the answer is always no. But there is no bio-scanner attached to the device someone plays on. So if someone would let others play on their account or give it away, if that is done quietly nothing happens, ever. If they make it public and ask, well that's a ban (worst case).

Unknown · June 2022

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baddmoonrizin · June 2022

keepcalmchiveon wrote: »

rattler2 wrote: »

Doesn't matter the age. It is a legal issue that no company wants to deal with at all.

but yet it seems to. the company mentions age, not us. and why 13? is there some magical acceptance at that age vs 12? or 10?

this is why this whole bit of "not allowed" is hogwash.

they certainly want players and the money, but heaven forbid a parent chooses to pass on the account to a child.

/rant.

It's to comply with the Federal Trade Commission's (FTC) enforcement of the Children's Online Privacy Protection Act (COPPA) of 1998. The U.S. Congress enacted this legislation to place parents in control of what information is collected from their young children online. The Rule was designed to protect children under age 13, while accounting for the dynamic nature of the internet.

The Rule applies to operators of commercial websites and online services (including mobile apps and IoT devices, such as smart toys) directed to children under 13 that collect, use, or disclose personal information from children, or on whose behalf such information is collected or maintained (such as when personal information is collected by an ad network to serve targeted advertising). The Rule also applies to operators of general audience websites or online services with actual knowledge that they are collecting, using, or disclosing personal information from children under 13, and to websites or online services that have actual knowledge that they are collecting personal information directly from users of another website or online service directed to children.

COPPA applies to personal information collected online by operators of both websites and online services. The term “online service” broadly covers any service available over the Internet, or that connects to the Internet or a wide-area network. Examples of online services include services that allow users to play network-connected games, engage in social networking activities, purchase goods or services online, receive online advertisements, or interact with other online content or services. Mobile applications that connect to the Internet, Internet-enabled gaming platforms, connected toys, smart speakers, voice assistants, voice-over-Internet protocol services, and Internet-enabled location-based services also are online services covered by COPPA.

In enacting the Children’s Online Privacy Protection Act, Congress determined to apply the statute’s protections only to children under 13, recognizing that younger children are particularly vulnerable to overreaching by marketers and may not understand the safety and privacy issues created by the online collection of personal information. Although COPPA does not apply to teenagers, the FTC is concerned about teen privacy and does believe that strong, more flexible, protections may be appropriate for that age group.

So, in other words, as a U.S.-based company, they are legally required to do this.

Unknown · June 2022

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Unknown · June 2022

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leemwatson · June 2022

keepcalmchiveon wrote: »

baddmoonrizin wrote: »

keepcalmchiveon wrote: »

rattler2 wrote: »

Doesn't matter the age. It is a legal issue that no company wants to deal with at all.

but yet it seems to. the company mentions age, not us. and why 13? is there some magical acceptance at that age vs 12? or 10?

this is why this whole bit of "not allowed" is hogwash.

they certainly want players and the money, but heaven forbid a parent chooses to pass on the account to a child.

/rant.

It's to comply with the Federal Trade Commission's (FTC) enforcement of the Children's Online Privacy Protection Act (COPPA) of 1998. The U.S. Congress enacted this legislation to place parents in control of what information is collected from their young children online. The Rule was designed to protect children under age 13, while accounting for the dynamic nature of the internet.

The Rule applies to operators of commercial websites and online services (including mobile apps and IoT devices, such as smart toys) directed to children under 13 that collect, use, or disclose personal information from children, or on whose behalf such information is collected or maintained (such as when personal information is collected by an ad network to serve targeted advertising). The Rule also applies to operators of general audience websites or online services with actual knowledge that they are collecting, using, or disclosing personal information from children under 13, and to websites or online services that have actual knowledge that they are collecting personal information directly from users of another website or online service directed to children.

COPPA applies to personal information collected online by operators of both websites and online services. The term “online service” broadly covers any service available over the Internet, or that connects to the Internet or a wide-area network. Examples of online services include services that allow users to play network-connected games, engage in social networking activities, purchase goods or services online, receive online advertisements, or interact with other online content or services. Mobile applications that connect to the Internet, Internet-enabled gaming platforms, connected toys, smart speakers, voice assistants, voice-over-Internet protocol services, and Internet-enabled location-based services also are online services covered by COPPA.

In enacting the Children’s Online Privacy Protection Act, Congress determined to apply the statute’s protections only to children under 13, recognizing that younger children are particularly vulnerable to overreaching by marketers and may not understand the safety and privacy issues created by the online collection of personal information. Although COPPA does not apply to teenagers, the FTC is concerned about teen privacy and does believe that strong, more flexible, protections may be appropriate for that age group.

So, in other words, as a U.S.-based company, they are legally required to do this.

yall can post links or quote provisions in laws that relegate why...

i never said i was against it, nor said it wasnt a law. i said it was pathetic that a family member cant xfer an acct to another member. as in a fake rant knowing that any legal mumbo jumbo would in fact play a part of why.

that said...what does cryptic do (aside from the initial details about the acct setup) to prove that any and all accts are parent approved for those under 13? i certainly dont get off the wall emails asking to prove my age, nor any in game pop ups to validate it either.

this is fun when topics like this come up. it shows how little a company does to comply initially, with no follow up.

its akin to companies no drug policy, but then having no random drug tests.

Legally, all a games-company has to do is have you agree to the T&C's, in good faith on their part. An 'age-gate' doesn't really have any legal standing, simply because people lie. As the T&C's are publicly available, it protects the company from frivolous law-suits. Ignorance is not a defence, especially when the T&C's are shoved in your face from the get go. Checking your I.D. is a laborious process and generally only reserved for obvious reasons.

As a side note, a company's no drug policy is legally different in the fact it is only for their employees, not customers, and even without a random drug test, they can dismiss you with sufficient evidence (smelling of cannabis for example). This is primarily to cover a company's Health and Safety requirements, such as in the UK (Health and Safety Act 1974) and EU's equivalents for example. I'm not too hot on US legislation as there's so many variations. I see what you're trying to say, but it's a different kettle of fish.

lazarus51166 · June 2022

(I'm talking about COPPA, not COPA. Two different things. COPA, yes was struck down, but COPPA is very much active. Comments moderated out so as not to mislead/confuse other readers. - BMR)

Unknown · June 2022

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leemwatson · June 2022

lazarus51166 wrote: »

(Comments moderated out so as not to mislead/confuse other readers. - BMR)

You make some very interesting points, and it's good to see the US side of law as I'm in the UK so studied UK and EU Business Law (waaaaaaay back in the early 90's). As I understand it, from my perspective, Cryptic is entitled to limit or restrict transfer of accounts where there is a genuine concern that a fraud has or may be committed. It's insertion into the T&C's or by official word is a reasonable protection measure for them and the consumer. Whilst you may argue that they have no legal right to do so, their argument does have, again, reasonable legal standing as the T&C's constitute a legal contract and would certainly be enforced as such, hench why it must be a person (or parent) of 18 or over that accepts it. The key is what is 'reasonable' in law. The US is typically an outlier due to it's devolved law systems. What is 'illegal' in one county may not be legal in another, you know that. If Californian law permits Cryptic to restrict accounts, then they can do so.

Here is the kicker though. That account is Cryptic's, as it implicitly states within the T&C's (It's their data specificly), not the player's property. The player has no ownership and is only 'licensed' to USE the account (essentially renting it) within the T&C's limits. In equivalence, you rent a room to someone, that someone lets someone else rent in their place without your consent and you kick them out. Do you really think they should sue you when you gave no permission to transfer that tenancy??

baddmoonrizin · June 2022

Well, since the internet lawyers are coming out and offering bad advice, we're going to shut this down before someone goes and does something they shouldn't.

The long and short of it, folks, is: No, you cannot sell, trade, or gift your account to another person. This is per the company. Period. End of discussion. /thread