This isn't a cheap shot at the devs, nor a complaint, simply an observation designed to encourage healthy discussion.
It's kind of inevitable that a game that's been running this long would become this 'heavy' for want of a better term. I just feel like all the item choice is almost crazy. From different weapons to shields, not to mention all the grinding involved with getting decent gear now.
As a long time player (since launch) I'm of the view that the game needs an overhaul and some simplification, especially for those of us who are fans but don't have the time to get so involved due to career/commitments etc. But this is just my opinion and I'm curious to know what the rest of the player base thinks.
No. This game is insanely easy to play.....
"I think the game has gotten too complicated" doesn't necessarily mean "gotten too hard". You can have a game that's relatively easy, but still has way too many overlapping & interlocking systems, busy UI, dozens/hundreds of required items, etc.
And yeah, MMOs tend to pile up system upon system as the get older & have expansions. Gotta add Something New every big expansion, and eventually those Something News turn into a giant pile of confusion for some/many. It varies, of course, depending on the systems and how much they inter-relate. /shrug
...actually, it's not just MMOs, but any "live" game - Path of Exile (a Diablo-like) adds some big new system with every Season, and it just turns into a big mess at endgame with all sorts of stuff to keep track of and/or get ambushed by as you grind levels.
This here probably illustrates my original point better than what I did, too many different systems, too many different types of gear, too many different paths required to get half decent gear etc. That is if you want to be doing good dps.
And for those of us who don't chase DPS, we do just fine.
There's not really too much going on, IMO. If you don't want to do Reps, don't do them. If you don't want to craft, don't craft. If you don't want to do Admiralty, don't. One can get through this game just fine on what many of the missions drop and with the free ships one gets at leveling (before the leveling T6 ships). I've done just fine with a T5-U ship and whatever I had on hand already to scrounge from my other ships.
Now a LTS and loving it.
Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.
I have come to the conclusion that I have a memory like Etch-A-Sketch. I shake my head and forget everything.
there has been way to much content removed from the game cause it was challenging as it is . although the game has many things to do , it is all entirely optional .
what i do with reps is only do tfo for marks when my pile of marks goes under 100 . that way i am only doing marks for any faction approx once every three days . that way i don't get burned out grinding and to me i have all the time in the world to finish them
you don't need every ship in your roster to have gold gear, mk 12 stuff is perfectly fine to have fun on.
the game is not complicated at all . nothing better tutorials and a better ui would not fix .
if anything my biggest complaint is there not enough dynamic content in the game . endeavors have touched on bringing in changing content but we need more
This isn't a cheap shot at the devs, nor a complaint, simply an observation designed to encourage healthy discussion.
It's kind of inevitable that a game that's been running this long would become this 'heavy' for want of a better term. I just feel like all the item choice is almost crazy. From different weapons to shields, not to mention all the grinding involved with getting decent gear now.
As a long time player (since launch) I'm of the view that the game needs an overhaul and some simplification, especially for those of us who are fans but don't have the time to get so involved due to career/commitments etc. But this is just my opinion and I'm curious to know what the rest of the player base thinks.
No. This game is insanely easy to play.....and I'm not joking. 9 years ago, it was harder; when Delta Rising it got harder still......then it got nerfed because some people couldn't handle the NPC's........now, again, the game is insanely easy.
I agree. it started with removing some of the harder missions. I remember a mission, I forget which arc, or evn planet, but you had to scan/ collect some items and one was on top of a stone arch, and it was a royal pain in the tail to get up there. wasn't even easy to figure out it WAS up there. there are other missions that use to be very difficult but have really been streamlined down
That isn't a mission as such, it is a patrol (I forget which planet, but it is in Beta quadrant somewhere) and at least as of a few months ago it was still there, not removed.
The combat mechanics of the game are very simple compared to most games.
The 'filler' content such as doffing ect is more convoluted and not something I bother with.
I tend to only log in when a new episode is released or for certain events, I bypass most of the boring stuff (albiet, I'm sure many people don't find it boring).
The combat mechanics of the game are very simple compared to most games.
The 'filler' content such as doffing ect is more convoluted and not something I bother with.
I tend to only log in when a new episode is released or for certain events, I bypass most of the boring stuff (albiet, I'm sure many people don't find it boring).
alot games use pointless key presses to do the same thing as auto fire in this game does and they try claim its fast paced action lol (swtor jumps into mind)
doffing needs revamped its out of date and the rewards are unimpressive . alot of people used to doff when mk 12 consoles where rarely produced from doff missions , my tuffli at one time was my busiest ship as i jamp from sector to sector getting the best missions . now i rarely bother doffing , why would i for 5 dilithium a time.
And for those of us who don't chase DPS, we do just fine.
There's not really too much going on, IMO. If you don't want to do Reps, don't do them. If you don't want to craft, don't craft. If you don't want to do Admiralty, don't. One can get through this game just fine on what many of the missions drop and with the free ships one gets at leveling (before the leveling T6 ships). I've done just fine with a T5-U ship and whatever I had on hand already to scrounge from my other ships.
indeed, I personally don't do the doff stuff (except when I see a bonus to something).
In fact, i find this game childish. A 10 years kid could play at sto without problems, and like for each decision, you are warned 1 time, impossible to make a mistake.
When I look at my 3 filled power bars plus the bridge officer power, I kinda have the feeling it is a bit too complicated. It seems it could be far more streamlined and still not lack complexity. But overhauling something like that is a daunting task that is not guaranteed to succeed well.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
And for those of us who don't chase DPS, we do just fine.
There's not really too much going on, IMO. If you don't want to do Reps, don't do them. If you don't want to craft, don't craft. If you don't want to do Admiralty, don't. One can get through this game just fine on what many of the missions drop and with the free ships one gets at leveling (before the leveling T6 ships). I've done just fine with a T5-U ship and whatever I had on hand already to scrounge from my other ships.
Yep. both my mains usually fly T-5U carriers, a Jemnaught and a Recluse.
It is a very casual Game. Events are either time gated (because there easy with dps builds) or simplified versions to a degree of doing it afk or where level 10 characters can run it.
Cryptic has broken his own house rules lately by retconning (mostly box ships, those few zen ships are just for show )Ships and powers, adding miracle to older ships or giving them more buffs.
You can play the entire game outside the intro mission(s) with 1 t6 ship. Skip all missions and arcs your bored of or don't want to play (again). Any new player just could search this forum for some people with knowledge about dps, go to their side and use their tips for builds, traits and doffs. Rush to lvlcap (which u can boost) or just simply do in a few days of just playing.
Search a good fleet or get help from NoP channel to buy fleet stuff, and go to some channel to play the TFO's.
If you go sign up solo, you learn which will start within 5 minutes and which takes days to start, very quickly and then you go raid all you like.
If you don't want to spend any real life money, STO is very forgiving. You can spend hours and create several free alts, get around the 8k dil refine cap per char each day, Get free ships from events or grind your EC and get your ship from the Auction.
The most people who wait for turning zen to dil or dil to phoenix boxes they can do the Admiralty System or get their daily 8k per alt by some daily bonuses in BattleZones or some questing, until they can turn it over and improve their stuff to deal more diplomatic immunity damage in the universe of star trek (since we become buddies with Jemm hadar and kdf and Romulans and fly all there ships in the future).
Star Trek Online is very simple and very easy to play. Also very friendly in giving stuff each year (the anniversary give away, free ships with multiple events, you can play events or buyout the tokens, you can play most TFO's with a t5u ship still, or with very good gear ship without any really skills (remember facetumbling over your keyboard isn't really skills)
R&D is optional and just a daily clicky, same for doffing. Reps is a daily task you also do if u want them maxed out, or you fill the one u need and just play. Most people are giving tips to prevent players to avoid the developers way of shipbuilding. You don't have to play all missions to get access to the game anymore, you can almost start each arc of quests after the tutorials.
People who are bored can take a break from STO and return after weeks/months/years and you can pick up your old character where you stopped.
Each month is an event, so u get free items and dailly choice of any mark, a big box of any mark you want / need. And you play a TFO that fills up quickly.
You don't need the perfect builds, the perfect weapons or the perfect carreer character. The game is very easy and forgiving. Some people like the Auction game, other want endgame the lobistore. Others just fun with or without friends.
STO is very simple for players.
The monopoly board game has more complexity than this game has. If you doubt this than I recommend doing 10 TFO's of Infected ground, miner instabilities, and gateway to grethor. Tell me how much hair you have left after trying to get people to press F or go a certain direction out of only 2 directions to choose from to get the job done.
As far as visible or accessible they freaking color code, make giant arrows, make npcs come from directions you need to go during the course of a TFO, etc. I mean what else can you do to make things visible and accessible to everyone. The only thing Cryptic hasn't done is play the game for you that is where people like me come in where I have to carry people. However I do need cryptic to make me some ultimate training manuals that unlock all the boff skills for the billion boffs that I have that made me quit after DR was released. I even spent an entire day just setting up 3 alts with that mess they created for me. If there is any complex problems that is a complex problem dealing with DR aftermath. I mean the changes were great for the game but they literally mothballed my whole fleet of characters then on top of that the starship traits makes me struggle to try to play this game again.
No this game is not too complicated at all!
Go try Neverwinter Nights & see if you still feel this way.
It looks like to me that you are still learning everything there is to this game. Take it one step at a time. Ask for advice in zone chat too. Usually there are helpful players online to answer your questions.
It might seem complicated but it's not. Currently STO is a very simple game. Do the endeavors then logout.
(Ok you can donate to your fleet and do the currently running event. But that's all.)
I think it pretty much boils down to what goals a player sets up for himself in this game.
The game is so forgiving that if they are easy enough you can run and play through it just fine. The available online time can easily be balanced against the deck of characters one likes to maintain and can vary from super grindy to super boring by doing so.
If for some reason the goals of a player are set high, yep one looks at a very complex game with substantial options. Tendency rising! I doubt there is anybody around who knows everything or who did everything STO offers anymore. The game is just too vast by now.
I think that’s the reason why I always react a bit allergic when somebody suggests copying builds form somewhere is bad or that key-binds (as in smash space bar) are a cheap way to run things. Thanks to the community help is omnipresent for everybody who does not want to reduce his goals to minimum. With such aid one can cope with STO just fine even if the individual goals happen to be above it. Players who refuse such help or advocate refusing it on purpose have a habit if quickly losing any relevance for me; let it be in discussions in forums or in my in game teamed PvE experience.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Maybe complicated was the wrong choice of words, but the grind required to get any decent gear is ridiculous IMO
With the introduction of the endeavor system, the first account wide system, cryptic made it rather clear that they want us to have a progression curve that lasts for about two years until it is done. All other character based systems are shorter than that reaching from a 14 days event over a 3 moth reputation to like 1,2 years of complete crafting school development.
If you look at that timeframe here and balance your average online time against the number of chars you like to maintain your STO experience is not necessarily a grindy one.
Doing admiralty, doffing, endeavors, crafting, a single PvE every 3rd day or so for marks to fill reputations I think you can develop a single toon within 2 years to top by playing only 15 minutes per day. Every toon more needs like 10 minutes added.
I do this routine for over 7 years now and 10 minutes per day is indeed the time I spend on a toon on average, and all my toons are pretty much complete in everything.
Sure there are days where I feel cursed having too many alts, on others I’m bored and could use some more but in the end it’s to find the right balancing factor here against the concept of “grind”.
If the game feels grindy to you, you either have less than 15 minutes to play per day or simply have too many characters. Simple as that and no need to place blame on the game.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
> @uiab said:
> It might seem complicated but it's not. Currently STO is a very simple game. Do the endeavors then logout.
> (Ok you can donate to your fleet and do the currently running event. But that's all.)
Do not follow this "advice" under any circumstances.
Why not? That's all I do when log on whilst on my lunchbreak from work (it's all I have time to do at lunchtime!)
> @reyan01 said:
> (Quote)
>
> Why not? That's all I do when log on whilst on my lunchbreak from work (it's all I have time to do at lunchtime!)
If people aren't going to actually play the game why log in at all? I wouldn't.
Daily log in numbers seem to be the second to most important metric for cryptic after in game sales.
Otherwise we would not have so many systems encouraging us to do so. If I’d balance my free RL time against the time/effort for in game character progression tending to all those systems quickly and call it STO day is the most economical way.
Granted, the more one restricts oneself to that the more one loses any reason to tend to STO at all but it is surely a highly encouraged way offered to us by the game.
I mean why play ISA or CCA for 25 seconds if an admiralty assignment only takes 2 seconds of attention.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Comments
This here probably illustrates my original point better than what I did, too many different systems, too many different types of gear, too many different paths required to get half decent gear etc. That is if you want to be doing good dps.
There's not really too much going on, IMO. If you don't want to do Reps, don't do them. If you don't want to craft, don't craft. If you don't want to do Admiralty, don't. One can get through this game just fine on what many of the missions drop and with the free ships one gets at leveling (before the leveling T6 ships). I've done just fine with a T5-U ship and whatever I had on hand already to scrounge from my other ships.
what i do with reps is only do tfo for marks when my pile of marks goes under 100 . that way i am only doing marks for any faction approx once every three days . that way i don't get burned out grinding and to me i have all the time in the world to finish them
you don't need every ship in your roster to have gold gear, mk 12 stuff is perfectly fine to have fun on.
the game is not complicated at all . nothing better tutorials and a better ui would not fix .
if anything my biggest complaint is there not enough dynamic content in the game . endeavors have touched on bringing in changing content but we need more
That isn't a mission as such, it is a patrol (I forget which planet, but it is in Beta quadrant somewhere) and at least as of a few months ago it was still there, not removed.
The 'filler' content such as doffing ect is more convoluted and not something I bother with.
I tend to only log in when a new episode is released or for certain events, I bypass most of the boring stuff (albiet, I'm sure many people don't find it boring).
alot games use pointless key presses to do the same thing as auto fire in this game does and they try claim its fast paced action lol (swtor jumps into mind)
doffing needs revamped its out of date and the rewards are unimpressive . alot of people used to doff when mk 12 consoles where rarely produced from doff missions , my tuffli at one time was my busiest ship as i jamp from sector to sector getting the best missions . now i rarely bother doffing , why would i for 5 dilithium a time.
indeed, I personally don't do the doff stuff (except when I see a bonus to something).
In fact, i find this game childish. A 10 years kid could play at sto without problems, and like for each decision, you are warned 1 time, impossible to make a mistake.
Cryptic has broken his own house rules lately by retconning (mostly box ships, those few zen ships are just for show
You can play the entire game outside the intro mission(s) with 1 t6 ship. Skip all missions and arcs your bored of or don't want to play (again). Any new player just could search this forum for some people with knowledge about dps, go to their side and use their tips for builds, traits and doffs. Rush to lvlcap (which u can boost) or just simply do in a few days of just playing.
Search a good fleet or get help from NoP channel to buy fleet stuff, and go to some channel to play the TFO's.
If you go sign up solo, you learn which will start within 5 minutes and which takes days to start, very quickly and then you go raid all you like.
If you don't want to spend any real life money, STO is very forgiving. You can spend hours and create several free alts, get around the 8k dil refine cap per char each day, Get free ships from events or grind your EC and get your ship from the Auction.
The most people who wait for turning zen to dil or dil to phoenix boxes they can do the Admiralty System or get their daily 8k per alt by some daily bonuses in BattleZones or some questing, until they can turn it over and improve their stuff to deal more diplomatic immunity damage in the universe of star trek (since we become buddies with Jemm hadar and kdf and Romulans and fly all there ships in the future).
Star Trek Online is very simple and very easy to play. Also very friendly in giving stuff each year (the anniversary give away, free ships with multiple events, you can play events or buyout the tokens, you can play most TFO's with a t5u ship still, or with very good gear ship without any really skills (remember facetumbling over your keyboard isn't really skills)
R&D is optional and just a daily clicky, same for doffing. Reps is a daily task you also do if u want them maxed out, or you fill the one u need and just play. Most people are giving tips to prevent players to avoid the developers way of shipbuilding. You don't have to play all missions to get access to the game anymore, you can almost start each arc of quests after the tutorials.
People who are bored can take a break from STO and return after weeks/months/years and you can pick up your old character where you stopped.
Each month is an event, so u get free items and dailly choice of any mark, a big box of any mark you want / need. And you play a TFO that fills up quickly.
You don't need the perfect builds, the perfect weapons or the perfect carreer character. The game is very easy and forgiving. Some people like the Auction game, other want endgame the lobistore. Others just fun with or without friends.
STO is very simple for players.
As far as visible or accessible they freaking color code, make giant arrows, make npcs come from directions you need to go during the course of a TFO, etc. I mean what else can you do to make things visible and accessible to everyone. The only thing Cryptic hasn't done is play the game for you that is where people like me come in where I have to carry people. However I do need cryptic to make me some ultimate training manuals that unlock all the boff skills for the billion boffs that I have that made me quit after DR was released. I even spent an entire day just setting up 3 alts with that mess they created for me. If there is any complex problems that is a complex problem dealing with DR aftermath. I mean the changes were great for the game but they literally mothballed my whole fleet of characters then on top of that the starship traits makes me struggle to try to play this game again.
Go try Neverwinter Nights & see if you still feel this way.
It looks like to me that you are still learning everything there is to this game. Take it one step at a time. Ask for advice in zone chat too. Usually there are helpful players online to answer your questions.
(Ok you can donate to your fleet and do the currently running event. But that's all.)
The game is so forgiving that if they are easy enough you can run and play through it just fine. The available online time can easily be balanced against the deck of characters one likes to maintain and can vary from super grindy to super boring by doing so.
If for some reason the goals of a player are set high, yep one looks at a very complex game with substantial options. Tendency rising! I doubt there is anybody around who knows everything or who did everything STO offers anymore. The game is just too vast by now.
I think that’s the reason why I always react a bit allergic when somebody suggests copying builds form somewhere is bad or that key-binds (as in smash space bar) are a cheap way to run things. Thanks to the community help is omnipresent for everybody who does not want to reduce his goals to minimum. With such aid one can cope with STO just fine even if the individual goals happen to be above it. Players who refuse such help or advocate refusing it on purpose have a habit if quickly losing any relevance for me; let it be in discussions in forums or in my in game teamed PvE experience.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
With the introduction of the endeavor system, the first account wide system, cryptic made it rather clear that they want us to have a progression curve that lasts for about two years until it is done. All other character based systems are shorter than that reaching from a 14 days event over a 3 moth reputation to like 1,2 years of complete crafting school development.
If you look at that timeframe here and balance your average online time against the number of chars you like to maintain your STO experience is not necessarily a grindy one.
Doing admiralty, doffing, endeavors, crafting, a single PvE every 3rd day or so for marks to fill reputations I think you can develop a single toon within 2 years to top by playing only 15 minutes per day. Every toon more needs like 10 minutes added.
I do this routine for over 7 years now and 10 minutes per day is indeed the time I spend on a toon on average, and all my toons are pretty much complete in everything.
Sure there are days where I feel cursed having too many alts, on others I’m bored and could use some more but in the end it’s to find the right balancing factor here against the concept of “grind”.
If the game feels grindy to you, you either have less than 15 minutes to play per day or simply have too many characters. Simple as that and no need to place blame on the game.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
Daily log in numbers seem to be the second to most important metric for cryptic after in game sales.
Otherwise we would not have so many systems encouraging us to do so. If I’d balance my free RL time against the time/effort for in game character progression tending to all those systems quickly and call it STO day is the most economical way.
Granted, the more one restricts oneself to that the more one loses any reason to tend to STO at all but it is surely a highly encouraged way offered to us by the game.
I mean why play ISA or CCA for 25 seconds if an admiralty assignment only takes 2 seconds of attention.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.