No one in my Guild launched STO through Steam - Hell most (myself included) don't use PWE's ARC system to launch ity either; so anyone using info from Steam or ARC still is missing a sizable chunk of the actual STO playerbase numbers.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
He has some valid points about a few things but I got the distinct impression he’s not played the game for years and is basing his assessment on what he’s read elsewhere or what he recalls from the initial release.
I mean the game has issues, but it is vastly different from that thing that crawled onto our PC’s back in 2010!
Yeah I got the impression from the video that he probably played in the early days, quit some time between LoR and DR, and has been waiting patiently for it to go under ever since so that he could make this video but finally got impatient and jumped the gun without doing enough additional research. That's just my guess though, he clearly did some research because he had clips of current ships in the game, but he also didn't mention any of the new systems that have been added over the years. Most of his videos have been we done and thoroughly researched so idk what was up with this one
3. Now that we know how many PC players there are, we can compare them to the Steam numbers to determine what percentage of PC players are Steam users.
Not possible. Steam Charts only shows how many people are playing a specific game at a specific point in time. So it might show 2,000 players playing on Steam at a specific time, but 20,000 players might have played on Steam for that day. We can only know how many PC users there are not how many PC players are Steam users.
Steam Charts is only good for showing trends such as what times are the most active or how successful an event is.
3. Now that we know how many PC players there are, we can compare them to the Steam numbers to determine what percentage of PC players are Steam users.
Not possible. Steam Charts only shows how many people are playing a specific game at a specific point in time. So it might show 2,000 players playing on Steam at a specific time, but 20,000 players might have played on Steam for that day. We can only know how many PC users there are not how many PC players are Steam users.
Steam Charts is only good for showing trends such as what times are the most active or how successful an event is.
All true. But we can do some reasonable estimates with the numbers available. Here is how...
1) according to this poll posted yesterday on reddit approximately 40% of people play on Steam:
3) Combing the information from #1 and #2 above, 2,8030 is 40% of 7,075.
But wait. We're only talking about concurrent players. Even if we say 7,075 concurrent players were on, as you said that is only at the same time. That doesn't tell us how many people played in total. That brings us to number 4...
4) if we say that the average person's play session is 1 hour (just as an example) and the average person is only able to play 1 time each day (again, just an example) that would mean 24 x 7,075 = 169,800.
5) based on the above, we could guesstimate that somewhere in the ballpark of 170,000 people may have played STO in one 24 hour period.
Obviously these are not concrete figures, but they are reasonable estimates using the figures and percentages available.
and therefore any such numbers cannot be even slightly accurate.
Correction: it is not that the numbers "cannot be even slightly accurate", it is that we don't know how accurate they are. Those 2 statements are not the same thing. That reddit poll may in fact accurately represent the percentage of people that play on steam, or may not. We just don't know. But not knowing is not the same thing as saying it "can't" be right.
and therefore any such numbers cannot be even slightly accurate.
Correction: it is not that the numbers "cannot be even slightly accurate", it is that we don't know how accurate they are. Those 2 statements are not the same thing. That reddit poll may in fact accurately represent the percentage of people that play on steam, or may not. We just don't know. But not knowing is not the same thing as saying it "can't" be right.
Technically correction, the best kind of correction
Since the input is unreliable (a self-selected sample in a web poll) the results are more likely to be garbage than not.
The numbers might be right. But so might the numbers from rolling dice.
and therefore any such numbers cannot be even slightly accurate.
Correction: it is not that the numbers "cannot be even slightly accurate", it is that we don't know how accurate they are. Those 2 statements are not the same thing. That reddit poll may in fact accurately represent the percentage of people that play on steam, or may not. We just don't know. But not knowing is not the same thing as saying it "can't" be right.
Technically correction, the best kind of correction
Since the input is unreliable (a self-selected sample in a web poll) the results are more likely to be garbage than not.
The numbers might be right. But so might the numbers from rolling dice.
Just to make sure we are on the same page here, I understand and agree that generally speaking the forums/reddit may not accurately represent the desires of the overall playerbase.
For example, people tend to be more vocal on issues when they are upset. So hypothetically speaking, just because 90% of people on the forums might be complaining about something doesn't mean 90% of the playerbase is upset. It just means the ones that were upset decided to come to the forums and complain about it. And all the ones who aren't upset are happily in game playing. So yeah, I get all that.
Now, having said that, there are some issues that have nothing to do with "more vocal when upset". Regarding the specific poll in question, I have no reason to believe the people on the forums/reddit would be vastly different than the people who don't post on the forums/reddit when it comes to whether they use Arc, the launcher, or steam, because that issue has nothing to do with whether anyone is happy or mad; it's just a technical question.
So on this specific issue, I have no reason to believe the 500+ people who voted in that reddit poll are "exceptions to the rule".
He missed out the fact you could get free T6 ships three times a year, so his research is not good regarding that.
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
He missed out the fact you could get free T6 ships three times a year, so his research is not good regarding that.
Yeah, 90% of that video sounded like stuff/issues from YEARS ago. It's worth a watch for those that don't know the early history of the game, but once he gets past the actual history/facts it's not a very informed opinion (in MY opinion).
He missed out the fact you could get free T6 ships three times a year, so his research is not good regarding that.
Yeah, 90% of that video sounded like stuff/issues from YEARS ago. It's worth a watch for those that don't know the early history of the game, but once he gets past the actual history/facts it's not a very informed opinion (in MY opinion).
It's vastly improved since season 7 when I started
"The meaning of victory is not to merely defeat your enemy but to destroy him, to completely eradicate him from living memory, to leave no remnant of his endeavours, to crush utterly his achievement and remove from all record his every trace of existence. From that defeat no enemy can ever recover. That is the meaning of victory."
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
I'll admit, I haven't seen the video yet (it's 2 a.m. here, I might watch it later).
There are some YouTube-users with great analyses (I saw one on Les Moonves and his firing and what it might mean for Trek a while ago) but in the end, an analysis is just that. A personal view which may be more or less based on facts.
His video isn't more valuable than any comment here, in fact, comments made on this forum may be even more valuable because one can be pretty sure that forum users actually still play the game.
Instead of focussing on such an approximation of facts however, let's look at the most basic fact instead: the game is still alive (hence why people are even able to play it - duh). Judging by the amount of more recent game handles (with the random numbers), the ongoing release of new content including voice acting, it is also doing well.
No amount of followers on YouTube, reputation over there or proclaimed expertise in judging games, is going to change that.
Formerly known as Risian4. Risian6 is my new PS4-account. Fleetcaptain5 is my main PC account. I hope to actively play again on PC in a few months.
Now that that's made clear... on to the next issue: when are playable Voth coming, and where's are my T7 Vesta and C-store purchasable real life shuttle?
I will also add that while I *don't* agree the game is dying (see my last post), calling someone a "random youtuber" does not invalidate their point. Youtube is one of the biggest website on the internet, and the person who made this video is a known commentator with a following. We may not like/agree with some of the things he said, but calling him a "random youtuber" isn't a counter-argument. Again, see my last post for why *I* dont' believe the game is dying.
I expected better from you. strawman arguements never solves anything.
Point 1: people don't actually post about things they dont care about. If someone clicks reply, they care to some degree. But you cant have your cake and eat it too.
Point 2: uninformed opinions are basically worthless. The guy who made this video sounds like he doesnt actually play, which would make his uninformed opinion worthless. At the same time we also have some people in this thread discussing the merrits of a video they havent watched, which makes their opinions equally uninformed.
this has to be the lowest flamebait i've seen in some time, but you know that after writing such nonsense. Plenty assumptions with no facts in hand pretending to be reasonable while at the same time coming off as insulting. You call others out for uninformed comments when you are making uninformed comments yourself.
3. Now that we know how many PC players there are, we can compare them to the Steam numbers to determine what percentage of PC players are Steam users.
Not possible. Steam Charts only shows how many people are playing a specific game at a specific point in time. So it might show 2,000 players playing on Steam at a specific time, but 20,000 players might have played on Steam for that day. We can only know how many PC users there are not how many PC players are Steam users.
Steam Charts is only good for showing trends such as what times are the most active or how successful an event is.
All true. But we can do some reasonable estimates with the numbers available. Here is how...
1) according to this poll posted yesterday on reddit approximately 40% of people play on Steam:
3) Combing the information from #1 and #2 above, 2,8030 is 40% of 7,075.
But wait. We're only talking about concurrent players. Even if we say 7,075 concurrent players were on, as you said that is only at the same time. That doesn't tell us how many people played in total. That brings us to number 4...
4) if we say that the average person's play session is 1 hour (just as an example) and the average person is only able to play 1 time each day (again, just an example) that would mean 24 x 7,075 = 169,800.
5) based on the above, we could guesstimate that somewhere in the ballpark of 170,000 people may have played STO in one 24 hour period.
Obviously these are not concrete figures, but they are reasonable estimates using the figures and percentages available.
and therefore any such numbers cannot be even slightly accurate.
Correction: it is not that the numbers "cannot be even slightly accurate", it is that we don't know how accurate they are. Those 2 statements are not the same thing. That reddit poll may in fact accurately represent the percentage of people that play on steam, or may not. We just don't know. But not knowing is not the same thing as saying it "can't" be right.
Technically correction, the best kind of correction
Since the input is unreliable (a self-selected sample in a web poll) the results are more likely to be garbage than not.
The numbers might be right. But so might the numbers from rolling dice.
Just to make sure we are on the same page here, I understand and agree that generally speaking the forums/reddit may not accurately represent the desires of the overall playerbase.
For example, people tend to be more vocal on issues when they are upset. So hypothetically speaking, just because 90% of people on the forums might be complaining about something doesn't mean 90% of the playerbase is upset. It just means the ones that were upset decided to come to the forums and complain about it. And all the ones who aren't upset are happily in game playing. So yeah, I get all that.
Now, having said that, there are some issues that have nothing to do with "more vocal when upset". Regarding the specific poll in question, I have no reason to believe the people on the forums/reddit would be vastly different than the people who don't post on the forums/reddit when it comes to whether they use Arc, the launcher, or steam, because that issue has nothing to do with whether anyone is happy or mad; it's just a technical question.
So on this specific issue, I have no reason to believe the 500+ people who voted in that reddit poll are "exceptions to the rule".
Like saying 500 people are the majority instead of the minority. You've going to have to explain that one. Also out of how many voted are fake accounts looking to pump up a score? So all you got is conjecture and are trying to make a point out of it. Debating about nothing is still nothing.
He missed out the fact you could get free T6 ships three times a year, so his research is not good regarding that.
Yeah, 90% of that video sounded like stuff/issues from YEARS ago. It's worth a watch for those that don't know the early history of the game, but once he gets past the actual history/facts it's not a very informed opinion (in MY opinion).
I completely disagree because i just don't care what this person is posting, tosh or not (of course you made the assumption for me by speaking on my behalf saying i didn't see it and come across as uniformed, so i will let you wonder), it is only just one opinion which isn't any more or less important than yours, mine, theraven or anyone elses and i will not put it on a pedestal so far out of reach thinking its a holy grail in terms of comments simply because someone put it out on youtube.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
So on this specific issue, I have no reason to believe the 500+ people who voted in that reddit poll are "exceptions to the rule".
You also have no way of validating that they are representative. It's an unfalsifiable hypothesis. Ie. pseudoscience.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
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why dont we fight back i started maybe 3 months ago this game is far from dead that guy is loser go to nerdSlayer channel and tell him he a little bish every time i go to a station to pick up or finish a quest thers so many ships of online players flooding the area nah to the people who complain because they cant figure out how to read and get ahead of this game fck that TRIBBLE
i went on youtube and rip him a new one if you play this game you should to rip him a new one regardless of your sto differences i see you every day online even tho you moan and whine about something yet your still here go to his you tube and rip him a new one i dont think the forum devs will edit this cause i like to think they still play the game
Calm down buddy. There are a lot of important things in life that are worth getting upset about, but a video game isn't one of them. We want you to be around to enjoy the game with the rest of us, so don't let yourself get so worked up. It's not good for you.
are you kidding me go there watch the video and get hit with a commercial that support that guys lame ghetto you tube if your here you should support sto regardless of pity differences im only like maybe 3 months in its a good game its fun and the devs make it not boring every week there has been something new except this week for some reason also compare his subscribers count to others like overwatch even if its a mmo vs first person shooter he obviously only played a week and put this out
ps if you have a google acount e-mail like most of us do you can rip him a new one
You would be wise to be careful what you say. People are getting into a lot of trouble in this "day and age" for comments that can be perceived threatening online.
ps why are you even here do you even like the game? and all the hard work the devs the players feed back and the forum admins do for us you sound like a sto hater
im just saying im new to this game it rocks honestly only thing id change is more advertisement on Facebook etc i didnt know how awesome it was until i click on a face book link and said wtf try it only thing id change is the one week zone chat for help that was annoying if your a new player you know what im talking about after that lifted sto people were the most insightful most friendliness caring sharing hook you up mmo players i ever come across
and for that youtuber guy he obviously didn't give this game a chance he went with almost doa either a game exists or doesn't like lets say law breakers google that they died because they didn't listen about a game dxdiag.exe issue where players had posted that there driver was misleading some kinda English barrier the game could of over taken over watch from blizzard entertainment but they sucked didn't listen and i dont see law breakers no more
@mybm , you seriously need to calm down. Despite the fact that you are "supporting" STO, what you are doing to advocating and promoting uncivil discourse. That's not tolerated here. Be like Elsa. Let it go.
As for everyone else, it's unnecessary to attack one another over some, "random YouTuber" I believe he was called?, and his ill informed opinion of our beloved game. Carry on.
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Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
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'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Comments
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
Yeah I got the impression from the video that he probably played in the early days, quit some time between LoR and DR, and has been waiting patiently for it to go under ever since so that he could make this video but finally got impatient and jumped the gun without doing enough additional research. That's just my guess though, he clearly did some research because he had clips of current ships in the game, but he also didn't mention any of the new systems that have been added over the years. Most of his videos have been we done and thoroughly researched so idk what was up with this one
Not possible. Steam Charts only shows how many people are playing a specific game at a specific point in time. So it might show 2,000 players playing on Steam at a specific time, but 20,000 players might have played on Steam for that day. We can only know how many PC users there are not how many PC players are Steam users.
Steam Charts is only good for showing trends such as what times are the most active or how successful an event is.
All true. But we can do some reasonable estimates with the numbers available. Here is how...
1) according to this poll posted yesterday on reddit approximately 40% of people play on Steam:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sto/comments/axzjfk/do_you_play_through_arc_old_launcher_or_steam/
2) according to steamcharts, there was was a max of 2,830 concurrent players in the last 30 days.
https://steamcharts.com/app/9900
3) Combing the information from #1 and #2 above, 2,8030 is 40% of 7,075.
But wait. We're only talking about concurrent players. Even if we say 7,075 concurrent players were on, as you said that is only at the same time. That doesn't tell us how many people played in total. That brings us to number 4...
4) if we say that the average person's play session is 1 hour (just as an example) and the average person is only able to play 1 time each day (again, just an example) that would mean 24 x 7,075 = 169,800.
5) based on the above, we could guesstimate that somewhere in the ballpark of 170,000 people may have played STO in one 24 hour period.
Obviously these are not concrete figures, but they are reasonable estimates using the figures and percentages available.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Correction: it is not that the numbers "cannot be even slightly accurate", it is that we don't know how accurate they are. Those 2 statements are not the same thing. That reddit poll may in fact accurately represent the percentage of people that play on steam, or may not. We just don't know. But not knowing is not the same thing as saying it "can't" be right.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Technically correction, the best kind of correction
Since the input is unreliable (a self-selected sample in a web poll) the results are more likely to be garbage than not.
The numbers might be right. But so might the numbers from rolling dice.
Just to make sure we are on the same page here, I understand and agree that generally speaking the forums/reddit may not accurately represent the desires of the overall playerbase.
For example, people tend to be more vocal on issues when they are upset. So hypothetically speaking, just because 90% of people on the forums might be complaining about something doesn't mean 90% of the playerbase is upset. It just means the ones that were upset decided to come to the forums and complain about it. And all the ones who aren't upset are happily in game playing. So yeah, I get all that.
Now, having said that, there are some issues that have nothing to do with "more vocal when upset". Regarding the specific poll in question, I have no reason to believe the people on the forums/reddit would be vastly different than the people who don't post on the forums/reddit when it comes to whether they use Arc, the launcher, or steam, because that issue has nothing to do with whether anyone is happy or mad; it's just a technical question.
So on this specific issue, I have no reason to believe the 500+ people who voted in that reddit poll are "exceptions to the rule".
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Yeah, 90% of that video sounded like stuff/issues from YEARS ago. It's worth a watch for those that don't know the early history of the game, but once he gets past the actual history/facts it's not a very informed opinion (in MY opinion).
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
It's vastly improved since season 7 when I started
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
There are some YouTube-users with great analyses (I saw one on Les Moonves and his firing and what it might mean for Trek a while ago) but in the end, an analysis is just that. A personal view which may be more or less based on facts.
His video isn't more valuable than any comment here, in fact, comments made on this forum may be even more valuable because one can be pretty sure that forum users actually still play the game.
Instead of focussing on such an approximation of facts however, let's look at the most basic fact instead: the game is still alive (hence why people are even able to play it - duh). Judging by the amount of more recent game handles (with the random numbers), the ongoing release of new content including voice acting, it is also doing well.
No amount of followers on YouTube, reputation over there or proclaimed expertise in judging games, is going to change that.
Now that that's made clear... on to the next issue: when are playable Voth coming, and where's are my T7 Vesta and C-store purchasable real life shuttle?
I expected better from you. strawman arguements never solves anything.
this has to be the lowest flamebait i've seen in some time, but you know that after writing such nonsense. Plenty assumptions with no facts in hand pretending to be reasonable while at the same time coming off as insulting. You call others out for uninformed comments when you are making uninformed comments yourself.
Speculation and nothing more.
Like saying 500 people are the majority instead of the minority. You've going to have to explain that one. Also out of how many voted are fake accounts looking to pump up a score? So all you got is conjecture and are trying to make a point out of it. Debating about nothing is still nothing.
I completely disagree because i just don't care what this person is posting, tosh or not (of course you made the assumption for me by speaking on my behalf saying i didn't see it and come across as uniformed, so i will let you wonder), it is only just one opinion which isn't any more or less important than yours, mine, theraven or anyone elses and i will not put it on a pedestal so far out of reach thinking its a holy grail in terms of comments simply because someone put it out on youtube.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
You also have no way of validating that they are representative. It's an unfalsifiable hypothesis. Ie. pseudoscience.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Calm down buddy. There are a lot of important things in life that are worth getting upset about, but a video game isn't one of them. We want you to be around to enjoy the game with the rest of us, so don't let yourself get so worked up. It's not good for you.
That's true. But do you have any logical reason to think those 500 people would be exceptions to the norm on this specific issue?
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
You would be wise to be careful what you say. People are getting into a lot of trouble in this "day and age" for comments that can be perceived threatening online.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
As for everyone else, it's unnecessary to attack one another over some, "random YouTuber" I believe he was called?, and his ill informed opinion of our beloved game. Carry on.
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l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'