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Are STO Players too lazy for their own good? Are Cryptic equally to blame?
dderidexwarbird
Member Posts: 35 Arc User
Been playing this game since release and the one thing that has frustrated me more then Cryptic is the laziness of the playerbase itself.
New Queue System - The playerbase complains because they can't double click and spam the same queues over and over and over again.
This is exactly what happens when you spoil children Cryptic, they become lazy cretins.
Half of the balance issues in the game are the playerbase using items and abilities in ways they were NOT supposed to be used or designed that way. So its the playerbases fault for ruining the game and causing it to be in such a boring and unrewarding state, not Cryptics.
Cryptic does have a part in some of the blame since they release essentially the same content with different races/planets/environments etc but its essentially the same thing over and over again.
- Do a mission in which you beam down to a planet, kill some things, listen to dialogue and then beam up to space and do the same thing. Sure, the stories are interesting and kudos to Cryptic for writing but the game design and interactivity really lets this game done. I am not part of the story, I am just riding the railroad, I don't get any interactivity or make any decisions in the game that will affect the story.
- Then after that, you just grind the same 2 or 3 queues for reputation over and over and over again. The reason the grind is so long, is to make sure that Cryptic only has to release the bare minimum of content so they can focus on their primary objective, making money from lockboxes and ships.
But what is the point of ships if you have nothing dynamic to do with them? Its just rinse and repeat and there is nothing pushing the boat out in way of content.
New Queue System - The playerbase complains because they can't double click and spam the same queues over and over and over again.
This is exactly what happens when you spoil children Cryptic, they become lazy cretins.
Half of the balance issues in the game are the playerbase using items and abilities in ways they were NOT supposed to be used or designed that way. So its the playerbases fault for ruining the game and causing it to be in such a boring and unrewarding state, not Cryptics.
Cryptic does have a part in some of the blame since they release essentially the same content with different races/planets/environments etc but its essentially the same thing over and over again.
- Do a mission in which you beam down to a planet, kill some things, listen to dialogue and then beam up to space and do the same thing. Sure, the stories are interesting and kudos to Cryptic for writing but the game design and interactivity really lets this game done. I am not part of the story, I am just riding the railroad, I don't get any interactivity or make any decisions in the game that will affect the story.
- Then after that, you just grind the same 2 or 3 queues for reputation over and over and over again. The reason the grind is so long, is to make sure that Cryptic only has to release the bare minimum of content so they can focus on their primary objective, making money from lockboxes and ships.
But what is the point of ships if you have nothing dynamic to do with them? Its just rinse and repeat and there is nothing pushing the boat out in way of content.
Original Author of the "What's the Beef with the Galaxy, Cryptic?" Forum Post
Change can happen - Tier 6 Galaxy... Believe in yourself...
https://taskforcerepublic.tumblr.com/ - Task Force: Republic, Second Life Roleplay Community
Change can happen - Tier 6 Galaxy... Believe in yourself...
https://taskforcerepublic.tumblr.com/ - Task Force: Republic, Second Life Roleplay Community
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Thats not what I mean, I mean the general mindset of players, if they arn't doing a 5 minute queue for 1000 marks, they arn't happy and its this culture of laziness that is going to be the death-knell of the game.
Change can happen - Tier 6 Galaxy... Believe in yourself...
https://taskforcerepublic.tumblr.com/ - Task Force: Republic, Second Life Roleplay Community
badly designed queue is badly designed, the only laziness is on the part of the devs for not even having a remote understanding of WHY it's badly designed. btw, don't exaggerate, no one has said anything about "1000" marks, it doesn't make your attempt at a point any more valid, only weakens it and makes you look foolish...but then again most of your post does that as well. even adding further filters to the OLD queue UI would have been an improvement without the need for the clunker currently in place now. and why even remove filtering fro ground and space? where was the logic in that?
why, there wasn't any. it's more like "hey look at this shiny new thing we never really thought about but it LOOKS cool".
Donate Brains, zombies in Washington DC are starving.
What, NO! I have never complained about builds. I just have to ask the question, every few months its the same thing from Cryptic and its starting to get a little tedious. I am GLAD some things finally got nerfed.
Change can happen - Tier 6 Galaxy... Believe in yourself...
https://taskforcerepublic.tumblr.com/ - Task Force: Republic, Second Life Roleplay Community
So what exactly do you mean when you say "its the playerbases fault for ruining the game" ?
I mean that people are always looking for easy ways to break the game, so they don't use things in the correct way. I am pretty sure that Cryptic never really thought Aux2Batt would become like it did. That was the players, manipulating the game for a lazy advantage.
Change can happen - Tier 6 Galaxy... Believe in yourself...
https://taskforcerepublic.tumblr.com/ - Task Force: Republic, Second Life Roleplay Community
Please show me where players have asked for 1000 marks for a 5 min queue ?
Most I've ever gotten was doing UAA on bonus mark weekend (and that falls far short of 1000).
If there's something I don't know about please share.
It's not just video games. That type of attitude can be seen in RL everyday.
I can't blame people for following the path of least resistance. Like a river flowing through terrain of least resistance, Humans are after all about 70% water weight. It's only natural they take on some of its properties.
But to live day by day by that mindset is where it becomes unhealthy.
Hard work is good for the soul, from time to time.
"Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless — like water. Put water in a cup, it becomes the cup; Put water into a bottle it becomes the bottle; Put water it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend."
-Bruce Lee-
Your criticizing the very beauty of sto. The immensely diverse options to combine various gears traits skills doffs etc... is what makes sto interesting and fun. Would you prefer sto be simplified for you into one single macro build with all available items dictated to the player? Or perhaps you'd prefer that players should refrain from using some gear/skill combinations because it may or may not be intended to work that way?
Ironically you cite the aux2bat macro as example but it was the extensive variety of other options in sto to reduce boff skill cooldowns (and boost power levels) which rendered aux2bat semi-obsolete (more or less, but still useful in some builds).
You claim the game is ruined by redundant content and lazy players; but the new competitive wargames queues are completely different from any previous content. Also the tzenkethi pve queues are very original and entertaining with interesting mechanics and challenging objectives.
I have seen many games ruined by this sort of cynical "blame the players" perspective, thankfully STO is not one of them.
Thats pretty rare, I don't think you get any rewards if you don't put in enough combat time.
Great quote there and one I use in Ju-jitsu! lol.
OP is correct and it's an opinion I have had for a few years now. Alot of players have a spoilt 'gimme now' mentality. Let's look at common complaints you find in the forums.
'It's a grind'. All games are a grind. Simple games that sell well such as CoD, FIFA, WWE et all. All short and limited in content, but players don't think they are grinding!? The amount of things you can do in STO means you can vary 'the grind' greatly.
'There's a shortage of content'. Look at the same examples. $80 games than can be completed in 6 hours or so. STO has over 100 hours of Episodic content across the faction and is free. Hardly a lack of content and great value!
'The rewards are too small/Missions should be rewarding MK XIV'. A very 'entitled' view. High grade items should never be easy to obtain, the should be very rare (think back to pre-rep Omega queues when you prayed to RNGesus that you'd get 'salvage'), yet Cryptic has made them easier and easier to obtain to ease complains (and people still complain).
'Queues/Missions are too hard'. No. They are too easy due to power creep. CCA used to be a challenge to beat due to the Entity's Regen, something I loved, but nerf happened and now it's done in 30 seconds! Then look at the fact 1 ship can massacre an Armada as easy as you can take candy from a baby! This is wrong, just plain wrong. A battle like that should take time and planning, not 'Spacebar Spam' easy and vape.
'Missions are too long'. Again no. They are too short. For me a mission should be lasting at least 30 minutes, mainly so you feel like you've actually done 'a mission'!
'Sector Space speed is too slow'. I bang my head so many times this comes out and demonstrates some player's impatience perfectly. Take your warp core out and travel through Beta Quadrant and you're still travelling faster than in the TV series!
'Bugs are easy to fix'. My God! Sorry but so many people just refuse to understand what a pain in the proverbal backside it is to fix bugs in a game with 145k files and millions of lines of code! Yes, some have taken their time to resolve (Seperation Bug), but if it's not breaking the game the game itself is still playable.
'Levelling takes too long'. Quite the opposite. I can level a toon to 60 within 2 weeks. It should take months, and I am serious on that! Look at the Final Fantasy games where it will take a long, long time to it that max level. This is what STO's levelling should be like!
Another bug-bear I have about some players is that they'll appear in Zone chat asking 'what's the giveaway today/what's changed' and other similar questions. It takes longer to type the question and wait for a player to respond and type the answer than it does to find out themselves!
And there are the people who berate the Dev's and the game yet they are still playing! If the game was truly that bad, you wouldn't play.
Lastly, the game operates on players paying 'micro-transactions', so Cryptic does need to keep it's playerbase happy. Thankfully the game is Free-To-Play for all, with money only buying 'cosmetics' for the most part. Unlike alot of MMO's where 'Money Equals Power', STO isn't. It's not even 'Freemium' as someone keeps claiming. If I'm buying something, by doing so, I am rewarding the company for their work. I don't need to buy it, but I want to as I believe they are, for the most part, doing a good job. However, I want a challenging game, not a walk-over, and certainly not STO's version of Farmville Rewards. I enjoy most of the content, and I really did like Delta Rising in it's original iteration.
In reference to the playerbase being to blame for the issues you state...that can't possibly be true...it's preposterous. If a player uses abilities/consoles/weapons/etc. that exist within the game...and the game allows them to use it the way that they do...then it's legitimate. If the designers truly never intended for the players to do what they're doing, then the designers have to do something in the game to no longer allow it to be utilized the way it's being utilized. Essentially, if what you're saying is in fact the case, then, without question, it's a design flaw and not a problem with the playerbase. Every player will always try to get the most out of their build/character...that's a normal player response. This is why there's a subculture within the game to have matches with ships that stay within certain design limits.
As far as the repetitive content goes, lather/rinse/repeat...you can also lay this at Cryptic's doorstep. With the release of this season, by their own admission, they're doing something new with the Challenge PvP Queues. It's new stuff. I think with this type of new content, they're trying to break out of the 'same old, same old'.
Players blow through the low levels like they are nothing more than a Command and Conquer tutorial, and get to max level with no real clue how to play the game. Thus the never-ending drone of, "It's too hard!" followed by cries of, "Why did you nerf?!"
If players had to work through the low levels, or even in the case of lesser skilled gamers, be forced to team up to complete missions, and if the game was designed so that players encountered NPC's who teach them how to use powers and abilities effectively, then by the time they get to level 60 they would be able to deal with level 60 content.
Can you imagine the whinging when players actually have to earn their levels? It would be revolutionary!
All beings we know allways use the path of least resistence for energy conservation reasons. If players use it then they are lazy cretins ... give me a break ... what the hell did you smoke ?
Any person with more then 2 neurons will allways try to optimise resources, and time is a resource.
While i understand your point, what you did there is extremly exagerated and with bad words. Lots of anger against everyone ...
Take a chill pill mate !
That actually sounds really nice. Mine goes more along the lines of:
Fly to System, Freeze-Task Manger-Quit-Restart, Kill some ships, Freeze-Task Manger-Quit-Restart, Beam down to a planet, kill some things, listen to some dialogue, Freeze-Task Manger-Quit-Restart, Beam up, Freeze-Task Manger-Quit-Restart, Kill some ships, Freeze-Task Manger-Quit-Restart, Leave system.
Let's see.....
Players in any game will always use the tools available to make themselves as strong as possible. Plus, there is no wrong way to play .... other than trolling .... play limits are set by the game developers and if it is possible to do it in the game and it's something you like (except trolling) then you are playing the game the right way.
Forcing players to team up to progress in the game is a sure way to lose a large percentage of the player base, which means a loss of income, which means a shut down of the game if revenues drop below expenses. One of STOs great features to a lot of players is the fact that every bit of main content can be played totally solo and you don't have to depend on other people for your story progression. The fact that some of the harder missions can be run as a team is a nice feature, although the team play ability of a lot of the mission is so ......flaky ..... that trying to run it as a team is a quite frustrating experience.
Lather, rinse, repeat...... the exact same as every MMO I have ever played. There is only so much "new" that can be done with any given game without turning it into a totally different game. Although at times the lead you by the nose nature of STOs missions are a bit disappointing (to me), it's better than the go here, kill x number of those then return that most MMOs use.
Anyone who makes it to max level knows how to play the game, they may not play it the same way as someone else, they may not play it the "correct" way in some peoples opinion, they might have NO clue how to run an STF because they prefer to run solo, but they obviously know how to play the game or they would never get enough XP to make max level. A slight disclaimer on that one, I have leveled more than a few toons to 60 without ever finishing the initial story arc. It isn't quick but once you hit level 12 and start doffing you can doff your way to level 60 with no problems. Thus you can hit max level without ever experiencing a lot of game stuff.
Unless they figure out some way to make all STFs take exactly the same amount of time, and give out exactly the same rewards, the STFs that give out the best reward for the time spent will always be the ones 90% plus of players are going to be playing. Some will play certain STFs just because they are actually fun to play, but only if/when they can actually find 4 other people willing to play that STF. And I can pretty much guarantee that if the Devs go in and add time gates to all the STFs to equalize time spent, all STFs will be dead. If they equalize only the rewards, players will still only play the ones with the highest reward per time spent.
The new UI works just fine, and is very much so preferred over the old style with a massive list of empty queues. That said, it does indeed need refinement, and some filters, other than that, it sure is refreshing and I like it.
nah what comes to mind is this
I don't disagree with you there, but there is a huge difference between a mindset of 'efficiency and clever play' and one of 'impatience and entitlement'. The latter being the mindset I understood was being talked about in the post you quoted.
No. Your fun makes everyone else's fun wrong by default.
Never had a Commodore. I hear they were nice.
Old isn't my problem. My system was fresh built at the end of 2015. I7 (4Ghz-4 Core), 32 Gigs of RAM, and an Nvidia 970 GTX. It is just ever since the 'Agents Of Yesterday' the game hasn't worked. As much as I would like to play... *shrug*