...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
No worries. Words like "interim" and "stop gap" really do have meaning for people familiar with working under deadlines or with limited resources.
To be clear, I am one of those people. I will miss a deadline before I'll release broken bits of code. Never trade speed for accuracy. NEVER.
Sure, you can easily miss deadlines in your job whenever you feel like it and never have to accept a suboptimal solution.
And you also never discover that there are bugs you didn't see before the software was delivered.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
I will miss a deadline before I'll release broken bits of code. Never trade speed for accuracy. NEVER.
Are you very familiar with the concept of having a job, with a boss, that can fire you?
Indeed. It's rarely a popular stance to take, but I refuse to sign my name to something that hasn't tested 100% functional. Of course, faulty code in my line of work can cost clients thousands, rather than just annoying subscribers to an MMO. It is admittedly not my charming demeanor that keeps me employed.
I have a suggestion. There are two ways to jam yourself up in a stellar body, I think. One is logging off or zoning for a queue, which you can't control as far as location. The other is zoning into a mission. That point is usually tied to a planet, right? Can you move the planets farther away from the suns? Does the move back into sector space follow closely enough to where you were when you left that this would help? Just a thought.
_______________ CommanderDonatra@Capt.Sisko: ahhh is it supposed to do that? Norvo Tigan@dontdrunkimshoot: hell ya, maybe
Firstly, let me welcome Tacofangs taking the initiative on this issue - its very reassuring to see a dev visibly taking this issue seriously, and involving players in identifying the bug, and suggesting possible resolutions.
However, whilst I very much welcome the initiative, I think in this case the suggested interim hotfix is inadvisable- it may be a case of 'the cure being worse than the disease'. Getting stuck in geometry is annoying, but can easily be fixed by transwarping, switching instance, or by relogging/accepting a map invite (this last one doesn't always work).
That said, getting stuck is a comparatively minor headache, and whilst 'immersion breaking' most players understand this is a game and can comprehend what just happened to them. However, a player that exits a mission, only to find themselves suddenly being transwarped halfway across the quadrant without any warning, will likely make most players go "WTF just happened to me?!?!?!". Most players don't read the forums, and even fewer will have seen this thread, so its unlikely that they will know WHY it happened to them. Whilst many can warp back to where they were without issue, it will also impact lower level players - who now find themselves having to crawl back home at Warp 5 for several minutes. This may put new players off the game.
In my view, the optimum solution from a player perspective, would be to eliminate collisions entirely for stars/similar objects in sector space - that way people will never end up getting stuck in the first place.
Of course, the level of work involved might make this suggestion impractical, take ages to implement, or there may be other reasons why its a bad idea. However, I don't think that the proposed hotfix is a good idea, even as an interim solution - I would suggest leaving things be until a more enduring solution is possible.
In my view, its likely to blow up a comparatively minor bug that few notice, into a major source of inconvenience, griping and forum whining.
That said, getting stuck is a comparatively minor headache, and whilst 'immersion breaking' most players understand this is a game and can comprehend what just happened to them. However, a player that exits a mission, only to find themselves suddenly being transwarped halfway across the quadrant without any warning, will likely make most players go "WTF just happened to me?!?!?!". Most players don't read the forums, and even fewer will have seen this thread, so its unlikely that they will know WHY it happened to them. Whilst many can warp back to where they were without issue, it will also impact lower level players - who now find themselves having to crawl back home at Warp 5 for several minutes. This may put new players off the game.
Most players would not care. Certainly less than being stuck, given that yes, most players don't read the forums and thus don't know you can get out by transwarping or switching instance.
Firstly, let me welcome Tacofangs taking the initiative on this issue - its very reassuring to see a dev visibly taking this issue seriously, and involving players in identifying the bug, and suggesting possible resolutions.
However, whilst I very much welcome the initiative, I think in this case the suggested interim hotfix is inadvisable- it may be a case of 'the cure being worse than the disease'. Getting stuck in geometry is annoying, but can easily be fixed by transwarping, switching instance, or by relogging/accepting a map invite (this last one doesn't always work).
That said, getting stuck is a comparatively minor headache, and whilst 'immersion breaking' most players understand this is a game and can comprehend what just happened to them. However, a player that exits a mission, only to find themselves suddenly being transwarped halfway across the quadrant without any warning, will likely make most players go "WTF just happened to me?!?!?!". Most players don't read the forums, and even fewer will have seen this thread, so its unlikely that they will know WHY it happened to them. Whilst many can warp back to where they were without issue, it will also impact lower level players - who now find themselves having to crawl back home at Warp 5 for several minutes. This may put new players off the game.
In my view, the optimum solution from a player perspective, would be to eliminate collisions entirely for stars/similar objects in sector space - that way people will never end up getting stuck in the first place.
Of course, the level of work involved might make this suggestion impractical, take ages to implement, or there may be other reasons why its a bad idea. However, I don't think that the proposed hotfix is a good idea, even as an interim solution - I would suggest leaving things be until a more enduring solution is possible.
In my view, its likely to blow up a comparatively minor bug that few notice, into a major source of inconvenience, griping and forum whining.
Agreed completely. People will never come to the forums to complain about being able to ghost through a star, 99% of players just won't care, but they will about being sent away far from where they exited from, and the low level players are an excellent example (I'd suggest also making everyone equal there, just make anyone able to go warp 10 from the start, what's the point in making people take so long to get around?)
This should be as simple as changing some flags in the different types of stars and the fix would be done, sounds quicker and easier than the other measure and no one will complain about it.
Frankly, I'd prefer the immersion-break of flying right through a star (or any other non-ship object in sector space). It would have the considerable side benefit of not blocking my path through sector space and getting hung up on space geometry.
I completely agree that throwing low-level players way off course from where they were supposed to be could have a considerable impact on their ability to get from mission A to mission B reasonably quickly. It's not a big deal for a character with access to plenty of transwarps and slipstream, but it's soul-crushing for the newbie who's got to fly around the hard, slow way. Sometimes it might be of benefit, but more often likely to be a huge annoyance.
Pity we can't resort to the use of the /stuck command while "stuck" inside Stars to get teleported 2 LY in the current direction past any obstructing geometry. Arrange things such that the command could only be used in space in places where Players are SUPPOSED TO NOT BE (like inside of stars, outside the "box" of sector space, etc.) and you'd have a solution.
For this has happened a lot in the Delta Quadrant. The patrol missions are the ones I had trouble with. I leave the game, and next time I login I get trapped inside the sun or just leave the patrol mission and are to travel to the next one. I always get trapped inside the suns.
It just happened in the Delta Quadrant, I finished the episode Midnight and when I appeared in sector space outside the Kyana System...I can't escape the star.
Pity we can't resort to the use of the /stuck command while "stuck" inside Stars to get teleported 2 LY in the current direction past any obstructing geometry. Arrange things such that the command could only be used in space in places where Players are SUPPOSED TO NOT BE (like inside of stars, outside the "box" of sector space, etc.) and you'd have a solution.
Comments
And you also never discover that there are bugs you didn't see before the software was delivered.
Indeed. It's rarely a popular stance to take, but I refuse to sign my name to something that hasn't tested 100% functional. Of course, faulty code in my line of work can cost clients thousands, rather than just annoying subscribers to an MMO. It is admittedly not my charming demeanor that keeps me employed.
CommanderDonatra@Capt.Sisko: ahhh is it supposed to do that?
Norvo Tigan@dontdrunkimshoot: hell ya, maybe
However, whilst I very much welcome the initiative, I think in this case the suggested interim hotfix is inadvisable- it may be a case of 'the cure being worse than the disease'. Getting stuck in geometry is annoying, but can easily be fixed by transwarping, switching instance, or by relogging/accepting a map invite (this last one doesn't always work).
That said, getting stuck is a comparatively minor headache, and whilst 'immersion breaking' most players understand this is a game and can comprehend what just happened to them. However, a player that exits a mission, only to find themselves suddenly being transwarped halfway across the quadrant without any warning, will likely make most players go "WTF just happened to me?!?!?!". Most players don't read the forums, and even fewer will have seen this thread, so its unlikely that they will know WHY it happened to them. Whilst many can warp back to where they were without issue, it will also impact lower level players - who now find themselves having to crawl back home at Warp 5 for several minutes. This may put new players off the game.
In my view, the optimum solution from a player perspective, would be to eliminate collisions entirely for stars/similar objects in sector space - that way people will never end up getting stuck in the first place.
Of course, the level of work involved might make this suggestion impractical, take ages to implement, or there may be other reasons why its a bad idea. However, I don't think that the proposed hotfix is a good idea, even as an interim solution - I would suggest leaving things be until a more enduring solution is possible.
In my view, its likely to blow up a comparatively minor bug that few notice, into a major source of inconvenience, griping and forum whining.
Agreed completely. People will never come to the forums to complain about being able to ghost through a star, 99% of players just won't care, but they will about being sent away far from where they exited from, and the low level players are an excellent example (I'd suggest also making everyone equal there, just make anyone able to go warp 10 from the start, what's the point in making people take so long to get around?)
This should be as simple as changing some flags in the different types of stars and the fix would be done, sounds quicker and easier than the other measure and no one will complain about it.
I completely agree that throwing low-level players way off course from where they were supposed to be could have a considerable impact on their ability to get from mission A to mission B reasonably quickly. It's not a big deal for a character with access to plenty of transwarps and slipstream, but it's soul-crushing for the newbie who's got to fly around the hard, slow way. Sometimes it might be of benefit, but more often likely to be a huge annoyance.
Protonic Kool-Aid Down The Drain Cruiser
Immortal BOff Skills combo for Ground