No, it really isn't. It may seem like that on the surface, but let's look at it objectively.
FT5U Defiant vs. FT5U Somraw... everything else is fairly equal (slightly different hull and turn rate, but in the same ballpark, and the ens boff is tac on Defiant and eng on Somraw, in this configuration the eng is definitely more useful), exact same console layout... but the Somraw has its cloak built in. So the "power creep" that you're quoting... would in fact only bring the Defiant up to (almost) the same capabilities that the Somraw already has. (Actually, it'd still be slightly less due to occupying a device slot, and the mentioned BOFF difference, but...) Whereas right now the Somraw enjoys a distinct advantage... exactly the advantage that you're implying is "power creep".
Essentially, when you compare it to the Somraw, the Defiant is currently handicapped and this change would simply remove the largest fraction of that handicap.
And it could still be limited to the same particular ships that can use it now, which avoids the "power creep" issues that might be raised by giving the cloak ability to ships that don't currently have it.
Out of curiosity, why the Somraw instead of the Qin? The Qin is the raptor with the same Boff seating as the Defiant doesn't it?
Your brought up some of the differences, but glossed over others:
Slightly better hull on the KDF vs. slightly better shield on the Fed. (shield is often seen as better)
Slightly better turn on the Fed. (Meh for PvE, but huge for PvP)
Slightly better crew rating on the Fed. (Though not as bad a split as some of the bigger ships)
And the often brought up in this kind of comparison, the wonky pivot point on the raptors. (supposedly not better or worse, just "different" but some people really don't like it)
Personally I am for cloak as a device rather then a console, but I feel that your slightly missrepresting things.
Another reason you can't implement this idea is that it creates a gap between the Free players and the hardcore players.
This is not [meant to be] a Pay2Win game.......... :rolleyes: apparently...
But those who do not purchase the cloaking ships therefore would not have access to a cloak, and this creates a sense of inequality among the playerbase, so you risk alienating the F2P players (haha, 'alienating' in a sci-fi game, see what I did there?!)
All joking aside, a cloaking device is, in fact, very useful indeed. Any console can be useful in game depending on your play-style. As a Fed (and I fly the Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit) I use the cloak a lot, for various reasons (and it's not just "running and hiding").
The KDF and the RRF have had enough taken away from them already; battle-cruisers and carriers to name but two examples. In a game that is increasing towards having three identical factions (with the 3-packs being released lately), let the two most unloved faction keep something that makes them unique.
Fleet Admiral Robert Leece
USS Silverburn NX-150996-B
Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit [T5-U]
No, it really isn't. It may seem like that on the surface, but let's look at it objectively.
FT5U Defiant vs. FT5U Somraw... everything else is fairly equal (slightly different hull and turn rate, but in the same ballpark, and the ens boff is tac on Defiant and eng on Somraw, in this configuration the eng is definitely more useful), exact same console layout... but the Somraw has its cloak built in. So the "power creep" that you're quoting... would in fact only bring the Defiant up to (almost) the same capabilities that the Somraw already has. (Actually, it'd still be slightly less due to occupying a device slot, and the mentioned BOFF difference, but...) Whereas right now the Somraw enjoys a distinct advantage... exactly the advantage that you're implying is "power creep".
Essentially, when you compare it to the Somraw, the Defiant is currently handicapped and this change would simply remove the largest fraction of that handicap.
And it could still be limited to the same particular ships that can use it now, which avoids the "power creep" issues that might be raised by giving the cloak ability to ships that don't currently have it.
The general feeling is that a T6 Defiant will be coming. Cryptic has been putting in periodic Canon ships to be ported over to T6, as you know. That means a Set Bonus implemented with it. Every single one of the lower tiered ships ported over to T6 had a special set made for it at T6 provided they had the pieces before. Galaxy, Intrepid got a set with set bonus made for them when they transitioned to T6. The JHSS & D'D set got expanded also. Only the KDF Negh'Var didn't because, well, Cryptic forgot to make more T5 KDF ships for it to even have a set to begin with. Hell, they never made a T5 C-Store Negh'Var.
There already is a possible set to be made with the Galaxy-X. There already are multiple components for Defiant items, enough to make a set.
Anyways, a theoretical Cloaking Device going in a Device Slot would mean a Freed Up Console Slot to still count towards Set Bonus. That *is* Power Creep.
No it doesn't. Not everyone who plays has the Cloaking Device Universal Console, and most people likely aren't going to buy a Federation Dreadnought Cruiser or a Tactical Escort Retrofit just to get the console, because in reality, as others have stated, it's not all that much of an advantage to have. And as I already stated, that console is already most effective on the ships that it is already usable on (Especially on the Dreadnought Cruiser). Using it on a Heavy Cruiser would be less effective than using it on my Dreadnought Cruiser, so why shouldn't I be able to use it on the Heavy Cruiser?
The bonuses it provides are negligible when you really think about it. It gives +50% Defense while cloaked (which isn't really very helpful when you consider your shields are disabled), and +15% Damage Bonus for 5 seconds after decloaking. The only way that +15% becomes powerful is if you are one of those power-gamer PvPers who already does absurd amounts of DPS. In over a year of using it, I have yet to notice a significant increase in my weapon strength while under the effect of that "damage bonus".
Again, I fail to see how me being able to use the Cloaking Device Universal Console, which is of limited availability due to requiring the purchase of a Ship from the C-Store, which is most effective on the ships it's already usable on, on any Federation ship would change the balance of power in any way.
I mean for real, I can use it on the Federation Dreadnought Cruiser, which has the Spinal Phaser Lance, a hangar that deploys 4-6 hangar pets, which can use the Saucer Separation Console which gives me another hangar pet that also has the Spinal Phaser Lance, and can also use the Anti-matter Spread Console. It is quite literally less effective to use the Cloaking Device Universal Console on any other federation ship, so again, I fail to see how using it on another ship I own changes anything.
Despite your argument, you haven't even given a good reason, as to why they should either!
If as you say, the other ships are inferior to the dread, than why the desire for a cloak for them?
You must have a reason but, that reason isn't sufficient enough for them to change it!
Look. The Treaty of Algeron is obviously dead in the water. And I'm not asking for everyone to have the ability to cloak their fed ships. I paid for that console with cash when I bought the Galaxy Bundle. It's not like one can buy it with in game currency from a vendor (unless you count spending a ton of Dilithium on Zen to buy a ship that comes equipped with it), or even from the rep system. I don't see why something I paid cash for should be limited to a handful of ships when in reality, the console is most effective on the ships it is already usable on. IMHO, it's MOST effective on the Federation Dreadnought Cruiser, so why shouldn't I be able to use it on a Heavy Cruiser, or some other Federation Ship?
I would say it's obvious they don't want cloak on every ship or they would have put cloak on the Command Cruisers or very least the Pilot ships...
They put cloak on the Intel ships because it fits...what good is gathering Intel if you're seen and known? Each faction good a umph from the norm...Feds don't use cloak and they got standard cloak, Klingons use standard and they got battle cloak, Romulans use battle cloak and they got enhanced battle cloak.
It was a design decision not a "Hey open the cloak floodgates" decision.
The Federation president chose to honor the treaty even after the collapse of the RSE as we know it...just because the Federation is allied with the Romulans and the Romulans may have agreed it was alright for them to use cloak on the Intel ships doesn't mean they can just throw it on any ship.
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
I'm making the argument based on the simple fact that as it stands today, with the various T5 variants, the Defiant is handicapped compared to its closest Romulan and Klingon analogs. (I.E. you could port over the same exact built to a Qin and you already *have* that extra console slot you're saying is such a bad thing.) It still would be after this change, but it fits better with the lore and reduces the severity of the handicap.
I don't agree on that. As someone that has played all 3 factions extensively in PVP and PVE, I will take the Defiant any day, 'errday against any T5 Raptor. The Defiant isn't handicapped against their KDF contemporaries at T5. T5 Fed Escorts wipe the floor with T5 KDF Escorts.
And Warbirds are just overpowered (I can make a long thread in that, but it's not just the ships themselves that have absolutely zero design compromise of note).
You don't want to bring up canon into this For the KDF not to pay for their cloaks while the Feds would have to is inline with Star Trek. The Klingons have a long history, a tradition of cloaking technology in the IP, while the Federation does not. Pretty much every Klingon Warship shown since Star Trek III has been cloak capable. It's natural for the cloaks to be built in, just as they are with the Romulan ships.
But again, mostly I agree with you, I fly the Patrol Escort (It use to be the Somraw equivalent) when I feel Tac-ish Fed side.
What can go in the 3rd TAC BOFF slot?
Ensuring you have 2 copies of TT.
or
Stuffing an extra Tactical attack ability. Something like this:
TT1, HYT2, CRF2, APO3
TT1, CRF1, APB2
BO1
or
Your stated example of Kemocite Laced Weaponry. This is why Ver I & II of this ability is way more expensive than Ver III. Putting these in at a very low rank TAC slot while the higher rank slots are used for other TAC abilities. But you'd still have the usefulness of KLW to buff your attacks.
Another reason you can't implement this idea is that it creates a gap between the Free players and the hardcore players.
This is not [meant to be] a Pay2Win game.......... :rolleyes: apparently...
But those who do not purchase the cloaking ships therefore would not have access to a cloak, and this creates a sense of inequality among the playerbase, so you risk alienating the F2P players (haha, 'alienating' in a sci-fi game, see what I did there?!)
All joking aside, a cloaking device is, in fact, very useful indeed. Any console can be useful in game depending on your play-style. As a Fed (and I fly the Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit) I use the cloak a lot, for various reasons (and it's not just "running and hiding").
The KDF and the RRF have had enough taken away from them already; battle-cruisers and carriers to name but two examples. In a game that is increasing towards having three identical factions (with the 3-packs being released lately), let the two most unloved faction keep something that makes them unique.
This is not true... A F2P player could still get the cloaking console without spending one cent... All they'd need to do is save Dilithium, and then buy Zen with it via the Dilithium Exchange, and then buy the ship from the C-Store.
Comments
Out of curiosity, why the Somraw instead of the Qin? The Qin is the raptor with the same Boff seating as the Defiant doesn't it?
Your brought up some of the differences, but glossed over others:
Slightly better hull on the KDF vs. slightly better shield on the Fed. (shield is often seen as better)
Slightly better turn on the Fed. (Meh for PvE, but huge for PvP)
Slightly better crew rating on the Fed. (Though not as bad a split as some of the bigger ships)
And the often brought up in this kind of comparison, the wonky pivot point on the raptors. (supposedly not better or worse, just "different" but some people really don't like it)
Personally I am for cloak as a device rather then a console, but I feel that your slightly missrepresting things.
This is not [meant to be] a Pay2Win game.......... :rolleyes: apparently...
But those who do not purchase the cloaking ships therefore would not have access to a cloak, and this creates a sense of inequality among the playerbase, so you risk alienating the F2P players (haha, 'alienating' in a sci-fi game, see what I did there?!)
All joking aside, a cloaking device is, in fact, very useful indeed. Any console can be useful in game depending on your play-style. As a Fed (and I fly the Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit) I use the cloak a lot, for various reasons (and it's not just "running and hiding").
The KDF and the RRF have had enough taken away from them already; battle-cruisers and carriers to name but two examples. In a game that is increasing towards having three identical factions (with the 3-packs being released lately), let the two most unloved faction keep something that makes them unique.
USS Silverburn NX-150996-B
Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit [T5-U]
The general feeling is that a T6 Defiant will be coming. Cryptic has been putting in periodic Canon ships to be ported over to T6, as you know. That means a Set Bonus implemented with it. Every single one of the lower tiered ships ported over to T6 had a special set made for it at T6 provided they had the pieces before. Galaxy, Intrepid got a set with set bonus made for them when they transitioned to T6. The JHSS & D'D set got expanded also. Only the KDF Negh'Var didn't because, well, Cryptic forgot to make more T5 KDF ships for it to even have a set to begin with. Hell, they never made a T5 C-Store Negh'Var.
There already is a possible set to be made with the Galaxy-X. There already are multiple components for Defiant items, enough to make a set.
Anyways, a theoretical Cloaking Device going in a Device Slot would mean a Freed Up Console Slot to still count towards Set Bonus. That *is* Power Creep.
So... No, still.
Despite your argument, you haven't even given a good reason, as to why they should either!
If as you say, the other ships are inferior to the dread, than why the desire for a cloak for them?
You must have a reason but, that reason isn't sufficient enough for them to change it!
Praetor of the -RTS- Romulan Tal Shiar fleet!
I would say it's obvious they don't want cloak on every ship or they would have put cloak on the Command Cruisers or very least the Pilot ships...
They put cloak on the Intel ships because it fits...what good is gathering Intel if you're seen and known? Each faction good a umph from the norm...Feds don't use cloak and they got standard cloak, Klingons use standard and they got battle cloak, Romulans use battle cloak and they got enhanced battle cloak.
It was a design decision not a "Hey open the cloak floodgates" decision.
The Federation president chose to honor the treaty even after the collapse of the RSE as we know it...just because the Federation is allied with the Romulans and the Romulans may have agreed it was alright for them to use cloak on the Intel ships doesn't mean they can just throw it on any ship.
Kemocite-Laced Weaponry, or so I am told.
But again, mostly I agree with you, I fly the Patrol Escort (It use to be the Somraw equivalent) when I feel Tac-ish Fed side.
I don't agree on that. As someone that has played all 3 factions extensively in PVP and PVE, I will take the Defiant any day, 'errday against any T5 Raptor. The Defiant isn't handicapped against their KDF contemporaries at T5. T5 Fed Escorts wipe the floor with T5 KDF Escorts.
And Warbirds are just overpowered (I can make a long thread in that, but it's not just the ships themselves that have absolutely zero design compromise of note).
You don't want to bring up canon into this
What can go in the 3rd TAC BOFF slot?
Ensuring you have 2 copies of TT.
or
Stuffing an extra Tactical attack ability. Something like this:
TT1, HYT2, CRF2, APO3
TT1, CRF1, APB2
BO1
or
Your stated example of Kemocite Laced Weaponry. This is why Ver I & II of this ability is way more expensive than Ver III. Putting these in at a very low rank TAC slot while the higher rank slots are used for other TAC abilities. But you'd still have the usefulness of KLW to buff your attacks.
This is not true... A F2P player could still get the cloaking console without spending one cent... All they'd need to do is save Dilithium, and then buy Zen with it via the Dilithium Exchange, and then buy the ship from the C-Store.