I'm fine with the game, its a free to play and you get to play it for free, Im very competitive with this game, in fact I prefer this game to have somekind of real money exchange where we can sell our stuff for real money.
Then you guys can see how competitive I will become
Some of you never tried playing a very hard mmo like Planet Calypso. a true uber micro transaction where most casual players can't even survive without spending real money.
This STO is a baby game compare to Planet Calypso.
I laugh how easy to make ec/ore/zen on this game. not to mention this game is constantly being exploited by the elite players, due to the fact that sometimes the foundry is broken. LOL
I like their F2P better than SWTOR where you have to pay $20 to see the new season content. No pay? No content for you.
With STO I might want some shiny new ship but I don't need to buy it just to be allowed to play the content. It's up to me to decide when I want to spend more money.
The second quote would be my answer to the first.
I spent many years endgame raiding in EQ2, and still pop in now and then after it went F2P. EQ2's store is just as full of big-ticket items that you don't really need. The problem with EQ2's model is that even after going F2P they are still charging the full price of a AAA game for every new expansion pack.
I see nothing wrong with Cryptic charging $20-30 for premium items that you don't really need, if that's what they need to do in order to keep regularly releasing free new episode content without a subscription fee. I might be annoyed by it, but that annoyance comes from wanting something for which I am unwilling to justify the expense, not because they're in the wrong.
Fleet Admiral L'Yern - Screenshot and doffing addict
Eclipse Class Intel Cruiser U.S.S. Dioscuria NX-91121-A - Interactive Crew Roster
i'm not missing your point. i dont' see your point as being valid. how much time someone grinds in sto is up to them. if you have no problem dropping 15-20 bucks a month on sto, just as you did when it was subscription, then you have no need to grind. they're not adding 5 new ships every month that you have to buy. as is usually the case this is people who can't separate wanting something from needing something, and then blaming everyone else because they can't get everything they want instantly for free.
No you are completely missing my point. You're talking about warp drive, I'm talking about phasers.
I don't disagree with what you're saying at all, the problem is I'm not arguing against that and you think I am.
I`d like to ask you all what are your thoughts about the way PW and Cryptic deal with their zen in this game ?
I feel Star Trek is genuinely good and with alot of potention that its yet to be used, but I feel quite annoyed that pretty much any action in this game is halted by either Zen or its counterpart masked as ''dilithium'' wich hinders your progress even more and works as a way for players to feel the need to buy more zen only to sell it and earn more of that thing so they can progress faster in the game.
Not only that but one of the most reconigsable feuture of StarTrek, its ships, are mostly locked behind subscriptions and 20 dollars worth of zen EACH.
I can`t belive that this is ok with this community and even if it is, can anyone honestly say that the way they are doing this isn`t at the very least agressive consumer wise ?
If I had to make a example of sucessfull free to play with a good buisness model it would be Warframe, that game can be grinding most of the time and not always can be as acessible as the people who buy they coins (platinum) with real life money, but it gives the player the option to trade gear and modules for the platinum he needs to progress better in it.
I hope at least some of you share in the same concern.
Are there people annoyed, yes, but there always are. The monetization could be much worse.
New home of the Romulan Republic.
I have an idea for what Season 11 should be; Season 11: The Big Bug Fix.
I have not been able to read my bug tickets in over a year, not even the tickets about not being able to see my tickets.
I find the drama of your signature proof of your immaturity, this means you, DR whiners.
Not at all, in fact I wasn't aware there were any microtransactions. Not really.
Nothing in the C-Store I'd say was truly 'micro' priced. And even though purchases can be quite steep sometimes in my opinion, they are available account wide for all time.
If they began charging a few hundred Zen here to 'rent' C-Store ships, or started to flood the store with costume or decoration options for 50 Zen a piece, then it'll be microtransaction heavy.
You didn't have to do the upgrades. You can still play pretty much everything except maybe the elite queues with the top end gear from pre-DR. Also, as previously mentioned dilithium converts to zen, meaning even if you decided you want to upgrade your ship, you can do it without spending any of your own money. Every game constantly adds new and better gear. You either pay money or have to grind to get it. This game gives you the choice to do either one, so don't complain if you don't like your own choice.
If the game is so fair why limit progress with dilithium then ? Why limit its refining ammount at all ? Why we have to rely in a third coin to pay for our progress ? Why not use the credits instead so if dilithium is so important, to be used in fleet upgrades only and leave the fleet marks/credits for the actual ships and only spend zen in cosmetic ones ??
Also id be realy happy if the lockbox bull**** could be erased as well its not worthy and a jackpot machine masked as a pretty box.
Im not being unfair or nuts about it, im mearly asking for PW review their approach and make a more friendly consumer offer.
I haven't said anything positive about sto in a while but their f2p/microtransaction model is among the best, and the ability to obtain their premium currency without spending a penny is a plus i wish i could grind for golden eagles in warthunder
OP, if you hate the micro transactions here, don't ever play SWTOR. They make this game look like overflowing cups of generosity.
And the couple Aeria-run games I've tried in the past, make SWTOR look generous & friendly.
(But yeah - the OP should also avoid SWTOR because he doesn't like lockboxes. That game's got bucket's of 'em. Hundreds & hundreds of items from boxes, complete with a "Collection" window for you to keep track of how many of them you've gotten... and how many you're missing.)
And the couple Aeria-run games I've tried in the past, make SWTOR look generous & friendly.
(But yeah - the OP should also avoid SWTOR because he doesn't like lockboxes. That game's got bucket's of 'em. Hundreds & hundreds of items from boxes, complete with a "Collection" window for you to keep track of how many of them you've gotten... and how many you're missing.)
but at least you can unlock something from their lockboxes and make it account wide if you want to. in sto if you want a second ship you either head over to the exchange or keep on opening lockboxes and hope you hit that 1% again.
If the game is so fair why limit progress with dilithium then ? Why limit its refining ammount at all ? Why we have to rely in a third coin to pay for our progress ? Why not use the credits instead so if dilithium is so important, to be used in fleet upgrades only and leave the fleet marks/credits for the actual ships and only spend zen in cosmetic ones ??
Also id be realy happy if the lockbox bull**** could be erased as well its not worthy and a jackpot machine masked as a pretty box.
Im not being unfair or nuts about it, im mearly asking for PW review their approach and make a more friendly consumer offer.
Because servers, programmers, artists, and cast member voice acting all cost money. Someone has to pay for it all.
But, thanks to the whales it doesn't have to be you! YAY!
Why can't you have lockbox ships for free? You can, by grinding.
Why can't you get free T6 ships? You can, grinding.
but at least you can unlock something from their lockboxes and make it account wide if you want to. in sto if you want a second ship you either head over to the exchange or keep on opening lockboxes and hope you hit that 1% again.
Yeah, that's one of their features that I do like, and wish other people would copy. Shame about some of the other stuff they do. :P
If the game is so fair why limit progress with dilithium then ? Why limit its refining ammount at all ?
This question has been asked and answered exhaustively on these forums.
Short version: because the timegated daily refinement limit is the only thing that keeps inflation in check and makes it possible for F2P players to turn their in-game currency into premium items.
The refining limit is the very thing that makes it practical for the average player to earn Zen by farming dil without spending 12 hours a day doing so.
Fleet Admiral L'Yern - Screenshot and doffing addict
Eclipse Class Intel Cruiser U.S.S. Dioscuria NX-91121-A - Interactive Crew Roster
I`d like to ask you all what are your thoughts about the way PW and Cryptic deal with their zen in this game ?
I feel Star Trek is genuinely good and with alot of potention that its yet to be used, but I feel quite annoyed that pretty much any action in this game is halted by either Zen or its counterpart masked as ''dilithium'' wich hinders your progress even more and works as a way for players to feel the need to buy more zen only to sell it and earn more of that thing so they can progress faster in the game.
Not only that but one of the most reconigsable feuture of StarTrek, its ships, are mostly locked behind subscriptions and 20 dollars worth of zen EACH.
I can`t belive that this is ok with this community and even if it is, can anyone honestly say that the way they are doing this isn`t at the very least agressive consumer wise ?
If I had to make a example of sucessfull free to play with a good buisness model it would be Warframe, that game can be grinding most of the time and not always can be as acessible as the people who buy they coins (platinum) with real life money, but it gives the player the option to trade gear and modules for the platinum he needs to progress better in it.
I hope at least some of you share in the same concern.
I'm okay with the way this game's MTX is handled because I've played plenty of other F2P games. In the other games, your growth is quite literally stunted unless you start buying things. Lots of things. My first PWE game was Forsaken World, and as good as i was at playing my character and even though I was max level, whales (big spenders) could utterly obliterate me in a single hit after standing there for awhile, laughing off my insignificant hits. Even grinding to the point of insanity can't compete with people who are willing to drop $10k or more into their characters. It sucked.
In this game, spending is a lot more reasonable. And even better, cryptic gives away current-tier ships through events from time to time. They're not as good as the paid ships, but they're still competitive enough.
As for Dilithium, think of it as a currency which indicates that you're actually playing the game. Most games (including monthly-sub WoW) have currencies like this. With enough of it, you can turn around and convert it into Zen to buy your own top-tier ship. And it's really not that hard to get--hell, in a lot of other games, there is no conversion mechanic, or if there is, it's severely limited.
So yeah, that's why I'm okay with STO's system. It seems to work, and it's actually not discouraging to free players like myself. Just understand that you have to at least play the game a bit to get the good stuff, but that's true of any game worth it's weight in targ ****.
I`d like to ask you all what are your thoughts about the way PW and Cryptic deal with their zen in this game ?
I feel Star Trek is genuinely good and with alot of potention that its yet to be used, but I feel quite annoyed that pretty much any action in this game is halted by either Zen or its counterpart masked as ''dilithium'' wich hinders your progress even more and works as a way for players to feel the need to buy more zen only to sell it and earn more of that thing so they can progress faster in the game.
Not only that but one of the most reconigsable feuture of StarTrek, its ships, are mostly locked behind subscriptions and 20 dollars worth of zen EACH.
I can`t belive that this is ok with this community and even if it is, can anyone honestly say that the way they are doing this isn`t at the very least agressive consumer wise ?
If I had to make a example of sucessfull free to play with a good buisness model it would be Warframe, that game can be grinding most of the time and not always can be as acessible as the people who buy they coins (platinum) with real life money, but it gives the player the option to trade gear and modules for the platinum he needs to progress better in it.
I hope at least some of you share in the same concern.
I absolutely agree with you all these people who keep using the logical fallacy arguments that you can grind to get what you want for free are still missing the point.
I think STO has one of the best implementations of free-to-play I've ever seen. Specifically because of the Dilithium Exchange.
Which has exactly zero mention in any Cryptic created tutorials .
(just leveled a Delta Recruit , so my memory is fairly fresh on what is and isn't covered by tutorials)
And since several players have already mentioned it , I'll just add that on the surface , 30+$ ships do cost a lot of money ... -- no two ways about it -- and there is nothing "Micro" about that transaction .
... but then again , as a wise man once said ... , "free to play games are VERY EXPENSIVE" ...
Which has exactly zero mention in any Cryptic created tutorials .
(just leveled a Delta Recruit , so my memory is fairly fresh on what is and isn't covered by tutorials)
And since several players have already mentioned it , I'll just add that on the surface , 30+$ ships do cost a lot of money ... -- no two ways about it -- and there is nothing "Micro" about that transaction .
And yet, as people have said, they give away similar level ships 2-3 times a year at least (summer event, winter event, anniversary). Yeah, it's not instant (similar to how going through the Dil exchange isn't instant), unlike just spending $ would be. But it's still a lot "friendlier" than most other f2p MMOs out there.
The mention of Forsaken World makes me remember Perfect World (another PWE game)..... at the time I tried that game, mounts - as in just faster/safer movement - cost $25-40 base, with another ~30 of upgrades to get them to full power. Yeah, those were nice & cheap. :rolleyes:
(Thinking about bad cash shops I've experienced..... one that I really hate is temporary items. Like, say, 30-day rentals of more inventory & bank space. Those are terrible. Another fun one is failable upgrading..... as much as people dislike the current upgrade system in STO, how would you like it if you spent that Dil for an upgrade chance.... but it could fail, either reducing the item's quality or destroying it? And the only way to decrease that chance was with cash-shop-only consumables? "Gee, the only way to upgrade my +9 Phaser to +10 without a chance of breaking it is $15 worth of Q's Blessings from the shop!" Whee!)
I absolutely agree with you all these people who keep using the logical fallacy arguments that you can grind to get what you want for free are still missing the point.
( InigoMontoya.jpg )
What is the fallacy in pointing out that this game is F2P and never forces you in particular to spend real-world currency as long as you are willing to spend time playing instead, assuming the whales never swim away?
Comments
Then you guys can see how competitive I will become
Some of you never tried playing a very hard mmo like Planet Calypso. a true uber micro transaction where most casual players can't even survive without spending real money.
This STO is a baby game compare to Planet Calypso.
I laugh how easy to make ec/ore/zen on this game. not to mention this game is constantly being exploited by the elite players, due to the fact that sometimes the foundry is broken. LOL
I spent many years endgame raiding in EQ2, and still pop in now and then after it went F2P. EQ2's store is just as full of big-ticket items that you don't really need. The problem with EQ2's model is that even after going F2P they are still charging the full price of a AAA game for every new expansion pack.
I see nothing wrong with Cryptic charging $20-30 for premium items that you don't really need, if that's what they need to do in order to keep regularly releasing free new episode content without a subscription fee. I might be annoyed by it, but that annoyance comes from wanting something for which I am unwilling to justify the expense, not because they're in the wrong.
Eclipse Class Intel Cruiser U.S.S. Dioscuria NX-91121-A - Interactive Crew Roster
Sorry, did feel like reading the OP. Just read the title.
No you are completely missing my point. You're talking about warp drive, I'm talking about phasers.
I don't disagree with what you're saying at all, the problem is I'm not arguing against that and you think I am.
I wont look the gift horse in the mouth, though, as the whales have bought me everything in game since Season 5!
/10char
Are there people annoyed, yes, but there always are. The monetization could be much worse.
I have an idea for what Season 11 should be; Season 11: The Big Bug Fix.
I have not been able to read my bug tickets in over a year, not even the tickets about not being able to see my tickets.
I find the drama of your signature proof of your immaturity, this means you, DR whiners.
Nothing in the C-Store I'd say was truly 'micro' priced. And even though purchases can be quite steep sometimes in my opinion, they are available account wide for all time.
If they began charging a few hundred Zen here to 'rent' C-Store ships, or started to flood the store with costume or decoration options for 50 Zen a piece, then it'll be microtransaction heavy.
Too many players want something for nothing.
If more players contributed to these games, we'd see more content and fewer bugs.
Free loaders should be thanking Whales for paying to keep the lights on and the new content coming.
If the game is so fair why limit progress with dilithium then ? Why limit its refining ammount at all ? Why we have to rely in a third coin to pay for our progress ? Why not use the credits instead so if dilithium is so important, to be used in fleet upgrades only and leave the fleet marks/credits for the actual ships and only spend zen in cosmetic ones ??
Also id be realy happy if the lockbox bull**** could be erased as well its not worthy and a jackpot machine masked as a pretty box.
Im not being unfair or nuts about it, im mearly asking for PW review their approach and make a more friendly consumer offer.
So this ^^^ tried it liked it then realised ifyou want anything half decent you have pay
And the couple Aeria-run games I've tried in the past, make SWTOR look generous & friendly.
(But yeah - the OP should also avoid SWTOR because he doesn't like lockboxes. That game's got bucket's of 'em. Hundreds & hundreds of items from boxes, complete with a "Collection" window for you to keep track of how many of them you've gotten... and how many you're missing.)
Because servers, programmers, artists, and cast member voice acting all cost money. Someone has to pay for it all.
But, thanks to the whales it doesn't have to be you! YAY!
Why can't you have lockbox ships for free? You can, by grinding.
Why can't you get free T6 ships? You can, grinding.
Fleet ship modules? Grinding.
Continuity errors? "A wizard did it."
Yeah, that's one of their features that I do like, and wish other people would copy. Shame about some of the other stuff they do. :P
"Oh you won't buy a terrible ships well no ship for you!"
Short version: because the timegated daily refinement limit is the only thing that keeps inflation in check and makes it possible for F2P players to turn their in-game currency into premium items.
The refining limit is the very thing that makes it practical for the average player to earn Zen by farming dil without spending 12 hours a day doing so.
Eclipse Class Intel Cruiser U.S.S. Dioscuria NX-91121-A - Interactive Crew Roster
In this game, spending is a lot more reasonable. And even better, cryptic gives away current-tier ships through events from time to time. They're not as good as the paid ships, but they're still competitive enough.
As for Dilithium, think of it as a currency which indicates that you're actually playing the game. Most games (including monthly-sub WoW) have currencies like this. With enough of it, you can turn around and convert it into Zen to buy your own top-tier ship. And it's really not that hard to get--hell, in a lot of other games, there is no conversion mechanic, or if there is, it's severely limited.
So yeah, that's why I'm okay with STO's system. It seems to work, and it's actually not discouraging to free players like myself. Just understand that you have to at least play the game a bit to get the good stuff, but that's true of any game worth it's weight in targ ****.
I absolutely agree with you all these people who keep using the logical fallacy arguments that you can grind to get what you want for free are still missing the point.
Which has exactly zero mention in any Cryptic created tutorials .
(just leveled a Delta Recruit , so my memory is fairly fresh on what is and isn't covered by tutorials)
And since several players have already mentioned it , I'll just add that on the surface , 30+$ ships do cost a lot of money ... -- no two ways about it -- and there is nothing "Micro" about that transaction .
... but then again , as a wise man once said ... , "free to play games are VERY EXPENSIVE" ...
And yet, as people have said, they give away similar level ships 2-3 times a year at least (summer event, winter event, anniversary). Yeah, it's not instant (similar to how going through the Dil exchange isn't instant), unlike just spending $ would be. But it's still a lot "friendlier" than most other f2p MMOs out there.
The mention of Forsaken World makes me remember Perfect World (another PWE game)..... at the time I tried that game, mounts - as in just faster/safer movement - cost $25-40 base, with another ~30 of upgrades to get them to full power. Yeah, those were nice & cheap. :rolleyes:
(Thinking about bad cash shops I've experienced..... one that I really hate is temporary items. Like, say, 30-day rentals of more inventory & bank space. Those are terrible. Another fun one is failable upgrading..... as much as people dislike the current upgrade system in STO, how would you like it if you spent that Dil for an upgrade chance.... but it could fail, either reducing the item's quality or destroying it? And the only way to decrease that chance was with cash-shop-only consumables? "Gee, the only way to upgrade my +9 Phaser to +10 without a chance of breaking it is $15 worth of Q's Blessings from the shop!" Whee!)
( InigoMontoya.jpg )
What is the fallacy in pointing out that this game is F2P and never forces you in particular to spend real-world currency as long as you are willing to spend time playing instead, assuming the whales never swim away?