OP I understand where you are coming from. As I personally have my own setups, I personally dislike picking stuff up, I would wish I could just select pass for life and be done with it.
This thread kinda reminds me of the TNG episode called The Neutral Zone (1988) where Picard visits the cryogenic survivors they found, Offenhouse demands a face-to-face talk with the Picard, demanding "the need" to contact with his attorney, and Picard tells him that money has become obsolete in the current century and his attorney has been dead for four hundred years.
Offenhouse is flabbergasted, stating that Humanity must still be as it once was: power-hungry and controlling. Picard retorts that Humans no longer seek such material things; they have grown out of their infancy:
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: A lot has changed in the past three hundred years. People are no longer obsessed with the accumulation of things. We've eliminated hunger, want, the need for possessions. We've grown out of our infancy. (Greed?)
Ralph Offenhouse: You've got it all wrong. It has never been about possessions. It's about power. ("Need"?)
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: Power to do what?
Ralph Offenhouse: To control your life, your destiny.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: That kind of control is an illusion.
Ralph Offenhouse: Really? I'm here, aren't I? I should be dead. But I'm not.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: This is the 24th century. Material needs no longer exist.
Ralph Offenhouse: Then what's the challenge?
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: The challenge, Mr. Offenhouse, is to improve yourself. To enrich yourself. Enjoy it.
(Did he mean to include enriching and improve others as well?)
Ralph Offenhouse: Captain, I didn't mean to come on so strong. It's just that I've built my whole life on knowing what's going on, and for the first time I feel... completely out of touch. It's, er, making me crazy. You can understand that? (Need vs Greed?)
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: That's the first thing you've said I do understand. And please, stay off the com panels.
Edit: Every MMO that I've ever played I have never liked the whole Need vs Greed roll system. It's superfluous.
If they really want to keep the Need/Greed/Pass system, here's how it could be done while minimizing abuse:...
That's a lot of mental calculation for someone in the middle of a queue to do on the fly. It'd just come down to needing on purples, passing on everything else to be able to need on purples.
This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
Everyone else gets common, uncommon, and rare junk to sell for EC.
Granted, what I forgot to add was that Greed should get a 1% chance to literally steal the item out from under the victor of a Need roll, at the cost of not being able to directly participate in the roll period (as they currently do now), which raises up to 2.5% max every Greed roll until you successfully steal the item, then it resets from 1% chance.
There doesn't need to be a victory. Getting drops shouldn't be a competition with other players. Each player should earn their own drops which should go directly into their inventory.
Some people love drama.
It's the entire point of other MMOs.
This is my Risian Corvette. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
First, sorry if this was ever discussed here. I contacted support with feedback, they said to come post my comment here,
I've been playing STO for a few months now, I'm really into it. One thing that bugs me though is that in PVE, practically all players choose NEED when an item is up for grabs, forcing those would would like to click GREED to instead click NEED so that everyone's chances are equal.
I was thinking that a new rule could be implemented. Maybe a player can only click NEED once per PVE mission but I'm curious as to you all think about this.
Thanks, have a good day :-)
I'm pretyt oldschool when it comes to this... if an item drops that I would like, I select GREED. If an item drops that I need, I select NEED.
That rule goes for fleet runs and in pretyt much most games, but no here, not when pugging. You have to ignore the GREED button. I don't even know why it's there, ot be honest. It shouldn't give you the option in PvEs - just auto-roll for drops of green n better. Save people from having to click a button at all.
If you don't want the item that dropped, sell it. Easy peasy.
just make everyones loot "personal" to that player like the system in diablo so you don't know what is dropping for the other players they could be getting legendarys and purples dropping left and right but you will never know.
Also you will never get rid of players that want the maximum level of achievement with the least amount of effort. At least give me the option to friendly fire them if they don't click respawn then they wont get in.
just make everyones loot "personal" to that player like the system in diablo so you don't know what is dropping for the other players they could be getting legendarys and purples dropping left and right but you will never know.
Also you will never get rid of players that want the maximum level of achievement with the least amount of effort. At least give me the option to friendly fire them if they don't click respawn then they wont get in.
Or of they don't actively respawn/move from the spawn point in 30 seconds, autoboot
There doesn't need to be a victory. Getting drops shouldn't be a competition with other players. Each player should earn their own drops which should go directly into their inventory.
Some players still like the option the be able to not get the loot. That is why I like Round-Robin. The loot that drops will only be available to the one that sees the option to collect loot. Then, if you don't want to, you don't need to.
And for those that don't like having to click on the tab to collect loot, just macro it to your space bar, or whatever you use to fire. Then you auto loot everything you can get.
But the Need/Greed system was useless in STO since before I started playing in 2013.
Leader of Elite Guardian Academy.Would you like to learn how to run a fleet? Would you like to know how to do ship builds (true budget as well as high end)?The join the Academy today!
Or of they don't actively respawn/move from the spawn point in 30 seconds, autoboot
I would prefer that if someone didn't respawn, or is leeching, the other players will have the option to select Need/Greed/Pass on the leeched's C-Store/Lobi/Lockbox ships. Then, they will need to repurchase them.
And if they were upgraded, the winner of the roll will get the upgrade, and all gear with that ship.
See if that gets them to play, or stay out of queues. Lol.
Leader of Elite Guardian Academy.Would you like to learn how to run a fleet? Would you like to know how to do ship builds (true budget as well as high end)?The join the Academy today!
One game had the option, if agreed upon beforehand I guess, to convert the item into money and divide it evenly among the players. Whether that was base value or market value I don't know.
That would have serious potential for abuse among afkers, so make the option specifically for fleets to use I suppose?
Everyone needs everything. No difference between need and greed in the mmo.
Not sure why you are quoting me...
But the whole point of me mentioning that scenario is to show that his suggestion was slightly flawed. He had suggested that everyone only gets one need roll, and after everyone uses their one need roll then the highest they can roll is greed. When all people in the group are only able to roll greed (or pass) then how is that different from everybody being able to roll need? except in the second case people can also roll greed and pass. Actually i dont know if i would call his original suggestion flawed. Its actually the first step in making STO a two roll system. Might as well just get rid of all that "can only roll need once" stuff that the OP talked about and just make STO a two roll game...need and pass (which i also mentioned a few posts later) for the reasons that everyone in this thread have already said. Which is why i didnt bother mentioning all those reasons because everyone is already saying them.
For a level 60 even purple items are mostly worthless with a few small exceptions. Sure if a purple crtdx3 beam array drops you can sell that for something but not really anything else.
You can craft better than any drop, you can get fleet gear, you can get rep gear and you can get mission rewards that are all better.
The loot dropping might as well be converted to EC since that is what almost everyone does with every piece of it at max level. If they just converted all drops to EC and then split the EC with the team that would simplify things a lot.
For a star trek game there is really no reason that blowing up ships should result in loot, especially not after the warp core explosion.
This game has loot because MMOs have loot even though they have changed the game so much here that the loot is worthless.
EQ2 has an auto need greed system. If an item drops that the system sees as an upgrade for you it can auto need and otherwise greed. Most people I have run into just turn that system on and leave it alone. It does a pretty good job.
If we did that and by some miracle that mk xii green shield was an upgrade for you then you can have it and otherwise it converts to EC. If that is an upgrade for you I am sure your team will be happy for you to have it.
I was thinking that a new rule could be implemented. Maybe a player can only click NEED once per PVE mission but I'm curious as to you all think about this.
Only two kinds of drops exist in STO; need drops and pass drops.
Need drops include any tech upgrades, and vendor trash. Pass drops include all rolled-for consumables (ie canonical food personal devices).
There is literally no need for a greed option. Nothing drops which would necessitate it. If it drops, and its an upgrade, you can find it on the exchange for an affordable price. In sextuplet, to outfit you and your entire away team.
Having a constant pop up to accept/refuse a drop is more annoying (to me) than having loot drop directly into inventory and taking the 10 seconds it takes to recycle the vendor trash at the end of a mission.
But I don't expect people to share my pet peeves.
Why not have it both ways?
I don't know if they have the option in the game still, but I know at one point that they had an auto loot option in the game. It never auto looted though. Why not make it actually auto loot for those that select it, and not do it for those that don't have it selected?
Also, I have been playing Defiance. One of the things I like about that game is that they have a setting where you can pick a quality that anything that quality, or lower, will be turned into in-game currency as it is picked up.
That would also be nice to have. You can set it to have any common weapons or gear to auto sell for EC as you pick it up, and that will save a lot more space in player's inventory, and let players play longer before needing to stop.
All they need to do is make it where things that are not weapons or gear will go into the inventory. This will keep you from auto selling commodities, components, heals, and things like that.
But, even if the auto sell option is not done, still making the auto loot option actually auto loot for those that select it would be an awesome idea. It will give players like yourself the option to not have to worry about selecting whether or not you want it. While at the same time, it can be turned off so that players that prefer to choose whether or not they want something have that option.
Leader of Elite Guardian Academy.Would you like to learn how to run a fleet? Would you like to know how to do ship builds (true budget as well as high end)?The join the Academy today!
First, sorry if this was ever discussed here. I contacted support with feedback, they said to come post my comment here,
I've been playing STO for a few months now, I'm really into it. One thing that bugs me though is that in PVE, practically all players choose NEED when an item is up for grabs, forcing those would would like to click GREED to instead click NEED so that everyone's chances are equal.
I was thinking that a new rule could be implemented. Maybe a player can only click NEED once per PVE mission but I'm curious as to you all think about this.
Thanks, have a good day :-)
if someone "needs" some crappy drop, then they shouldn't be on my team.
drops are nothing but vendor trash, and even then since the same items drop time after time its not even worth putting them on the exchange.
Really the actual issue are the people who have to click on the trash in the first place making me have to click something to get it off my screen or look at the TRIBBLE while the timer counts down.
The Need/Greed system works well when you have a loot system that is 'class trinity' specific (WOW) where player A of X class can only select greed because the loot is of Y class. If the loot was also of X class then player A could choose Need.
In STO their is not true trinity class divide and the loot is not 'trinity' class specific, so need/greed is more of an etiquette luxury.
I see a possible answer as increasing the meaningful loot drops (green to Ultra rare), upgrade-able, un-craftable mods or combination modifier types) so that upgrading puts the loot/gear on par with currently crafted gear potentials, but not at a rate that exceeds the time sink they put on crafting for the same gear.
Comments
Offenhouse is flabbergasted, stating that Humanity must still be as it once was: power-hungry and controlling. Picard retorts that Humans no longer seek such material things; they have grown out of their infancy:
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: A lot has changed in the past three hundred years. People are no longer obsessed with the accumulation of things. We've eliminated hunger, want, the need for possessions. We've grown out of our infancy. (Greed?)
Ralph Offenhouse: You've got it all wrong. It has never been about possessions. It's about power. ("Need"?)
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: Power to do what?
Ralph Offenhouse: To control your life, your destiny.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: That kind of control is an illusion.
Ralph Offenhouse: Really? I'm here, aren't I? I should be dead. But I'm not.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: This is the 24th century. Material needs no longer exist.
Ralph Offenhouse: Then what's the challenge?
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: The challenge, Mr. Offenhouse, is to improve yourself. To enrich yourself. Enjoy it.
(Did he mean to include enriching and improve others as well?)
Ralph Offenhouse: Captain, I didn't mean to come on so strong. It's just that I've built my whole life on knowing what's going on, and for the first time I feel... completely out of touch. It's, er, making me crazy. You can understand that? (Need vs Greed?)
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: That's the first thing you've said I do understand. And please, stay off the com panels.
Edit: Every MMO that I've ever played I have never liked the whole Need vs Greed roll system. It's superfluous.
That's a lot of mental calculation for someone in the middle of a queue to do on the fly. It'd just come down to needing on purples, passing on everything else to be able to need on purples.
Wouldn't everyone* just hit need on the purples?
*Standard internet disclaimers
Everyone else gets common, uncommon, and rare junk to sell for EC.
Granted, what I forgot to add was that Greed should get a 1% chance to literally steal the item out from under the victor of a Need roll, at the cost of not being able to directly participate in the roll period (as they currently do now), which raises up to 2.5% max every Greed roll until you successfully steal the item, then it resets from 1% chance.
I never understood the need/greed thing anyways.
Some people love drama.
It's the entire point of other MMOs.
Well, I got THAT much :rolleyes:
I'm pretyt oldschool when it comes to this... if an item drops that I would like, I select GREED. If an item drops that I need, I select NEED.
That rule goes for fleet runs and in pretyt much most games, but no here, not when pugging. You have to ignore the GREED button. I don't even know why it's there, ot be honest. It shouldn't give you the option in PvEs - just auto-roll for drops of green n better. Save people from having to click a button at all.
If you don't want the item that dropped, sell it. Easy peasy.
Also you will never get rid of players that want the maximum level of achievement with the least amount of effort. At least give me the option to friendly fire them if they don't click respawn then they wont get in.
Or of they don't actively respawn/move from the spawn point in 30 seconds, autoboot
Some players still like the option the be able to not get the loot. That is why I like Round-Robin. The loot that drops will only be available to the one that sees the option to collect loot. Then, if you don't want to, you don't need to.
And for those that don't like having to click on the tab to collect loot, just macro it to your space bar, or whatever you use to fire. Then you auto loot everything you can get.
But the Need/Greed system was useless in STO since before I started playing in 2013.
I would prefer that if someone didn't respawn, or is leeching, the other players will have the option to select Need/Greed/Pass on the leeched's C-Store/Lobi/Lockbox ships. Then, they will need to repurchase them.
And if they were upgraded, the winner of the roll will get the upgrade, and all gear with that ship.
See if that gets them to play, or stay out of queues. Lol.
That would have serious potential for abuse among afkers, so make the option specifically for fleets to use I suppose?
Not sure why you are quoting me...
But the whole point of me mentioning that scenario is to show that his suggestion was slightly flawed. He had suggested that everyone only gets one need roll, and after everyone uses their one need roll then the highest they can roll is greed. When all people in the group are only able to roll greed (or pass) then how is that different from everybody being able to roll need? except in the second case people can also roll greed and pass. Actually i dont know if i would call his original suggestion flawed. Its actually the first step in making STO a two roll system. Might as well just get rid of all that "can only roll need once" stuff that the OP talked about and just make STO a two roll game...need and pass (which i also mentioned a few posts later) for the reasons that everyone in this thread have already said. Which is why i didnt bother mentioning all those reasons because everyone is already saying them.
You can craft better than any drop, you can get fleet gear, you can get rep gear and you can get mission rewards that are all better.
The loot dropping might as well be converted to EC since that is what almost everyone does with every piece of it at max level. If they just converted all drops to EC and then split the EC with the team that would simplify things a lot.
For a star trek game there is really no reason that blowing up ships should result in loot, especially not after the warp core explosion.
This game has loot because MMOs have loot even though they have changed the game so much here that the loot is worthless.
EQ2 has an auto need greed system. If an item drops that the system sees as an upgrade for you it can auto need and otherwise greed. Most people I have run into just turn that system on and leave it alone. It does a pretty good job.
If we did that and by some miracle that mk xii green shield was an upgrade for you then you can have it and otherwise it converts to EC. If that is an upgrade for you I am sure your team will be happy for you to have it.
Need drops include any tech upgrades, and vendor trash. Pass drops include all rolled-for consumables (ie canonical food personal devices).
There is literally no need for a greed option. Nothing drops which would necessitate it. If it drops, and its an upgrade, you can find it on the exchange for an affordable price. In sextuplet, to outfit you and your entire away team.
Class-oriented but not class-specific gear drops from boss mobs require a greed roll. There's no such gear here, however.
Why not have it both ways?
I don't know if they have the option in the game still, but I know at one point that they had an auto loot option in the game. It never auto looted though. Why not make it actually auto loot for those that select it, and not do it for those that don't have it selected?
Also, I have been playing Defiance. One of the things I like about that game is that they have a setting where you can pick a quality that anything that quality, or lower, will be turned into in-game currency as it is picked up.
That would also be nice to have. You can set it to have any common weapons or gear to auto sell for EC as you pick it up, and that will save a lot more space in player's inventory, and let players play longer before needing to stop.
All they need to do is make it where things that are not weapons or gear will go into the inventory. This will keep you from auto selling commodities, components, heals, and things like that.
But, even if the auto sell option is not done, still making the auto loot option actually auto loot for those that select it would be an awesome idea. It will give players like yourself the option to not have to worry about selecting whether or not you want it. While at the same time, it can be turned off so that players that prefer to choose whether or not they want something have that option.
if someone "needs" some crappy drop, then they shouldn't be on my team.
drops are nothing but vendor trash, and even then since the same items drop time after time its not even worth putting them on the exchange.
Really the actual issue are the people who have to click on the trash in the first place making me have to click something to get it off my screen or look at the TRIBBLE while the timer counts down.
This is the most fair solution.
To everyone.
Hell, the DEVS should make RR/Common the standard form for loot.
In STO their is not true trinity class divide and the loot is not 'trinity' class specific, so need/greed is more of an etiquette luxury.
I see a possible answer as increasing the meaningful loot drops (green to Ultra rare), upgrade-able, un-craftable mods or combination modifier types) so that upgrading puts the loot/gear on par with currently crafted gear potentials, but not at a rate that exceeds the time sink they put on crafting for the same gear.