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the pathfinder is just not very good.
cavewark
Member Posts: 131 Arc User
OK just levelled the pathfinder to 5 to get the buff and that's it never using the ship again there are so much better "science" vessels out there.
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Did you just buy the pathfinder for 3000 zen or are you one of the unlucky ones who bought the intrepid, a fleet ship module and then the T5-U upgrade, only to find out 2 weeks later that you might as well have flung your cash down the sewer because they just came up with a new Intrepid for no reason?
Free Tibet!
It makes it depressing to me that despite the massive array of Equipment, Abilities, Weaponry, etc... really the choices you end up making are 100% motivated by the Min-Max Build ideology rather than a Role / Purpose ideology. They could easily change the game with focus in that direction, where combat is about exploiting your enemies weaknesses rather than punching them as hard in the face as possible.
Until then the idea of "Science" vessels actually being useful outside of those more designed like Destroyers is a mere pipedream. On the flipside, I like the Pathfinder (Intrepid NX) Skin based on the original Voyager concept; and the Voyager Internals are faithful enough and proportioned in a way that doesn't make you feel like the ship is a Tardis ^_^
sorry to be blunt but you are using it wrong or your set up isn't very good, I'm using this on my Fed Tac and it ROCKS! its a tank with mod DPS that holds it own.
its one of the best ships ive used thus far.
If you really think that Science Vessels cannot perform outside of the "Destroyer" fashioned versions, you also have no idea what you were doing with Science abilities.
You're a cruel, cruel person.
Keep it up
I'm using it with my Fed-Sci right now, and had come to it from a Vesta.... I agree with you.... it's nice.... I like mine. Tanks well, moderate DPS..... I quite like it.
The secondary deflector and the shield heal trait gives the Pathfinder resilience and pure hitting power. The Isokinetic cannon i use on it is merely icing on the cake.
I think the issue is some people don't know how to sci and blame the ship.
^ this...
Probably another person who just sticks 6 beams on it and says it sucks because it can't do great dps with its 2 tac consoles...just flies it like a another escort/cruiser.
Correct. Making Science abilities worthwhile is merely the mirror of what people have to do to make the tactical aspects of a ship good. You have different skillboxes you need to reinforce, different gear you need to make it work. Crit Hit / Severity has much less appeal but some of the bonus stats of that gear may be nice, i.e. Graviton Gen on Assimilated Console, Particle Generator bonus on Nukara Rep's Universal Console.
It's enough that many out there have trouble making their Cruisers, Escorts hit consistently hard enough with energy weapons, torps, etc. You have guys failing to make even Scimitars hit hard and last long enough. Now throw Science into it on a Science Vessel that only has 6 weapon slots?
agreed i usually love sci ships on my teams cause they really help make things easy: yes your weapons do not put out uber DPS but that really is not what they are there for because a sci ship really does not need weapons to win their powers alone make them awesome and if done right very DPS heavy and quite literally turn a fleet into a pile of scrap in mere seconds.
ask around STO op you might learn a thing about how some good pathfinders are set up then if ya like those methods keep em if not move on and if yo still do not like the pathfinder move onto another ship.
This is probably the best post out there.
The Pathfinder is one of the best Science ships out there, with only the Scryer possibly beating it, or at least it's equal.
The issue I find with Science ship drivers a goodly percentage of the time is like another poster said, they fly them like destroyers or cruisers, then complain when they don't work as well.
There are a ton of posts in the Academy and in the Federation Shipyards that spell out exactly what you need to do to use a Science Ship properly, and people still ignore them. All they do is fly them like their cruiser or escort, then complain when they suck, blaming the ship, when it's their own incompetant ignorance that's the problem.
How are you using the ship?
Uh Huh... I think one person said it best a few posts up, that Science ships are often appreciated in his Groups; that simply is the point, the game doesn't NEED CC/Support ships; it isn't design around them and as time goes on the Science abilities have slowly turned the Science Ship from being a Bard / Healer into a Warlock.
Anyone who flies a Science ship doesn't do it because they're the absolute beast at anything, they do it because they enjoy actually having something to keep them engaged while drudging through the same damn DPS focused content day-in and day-out.
If you think they're the best at anything you are fooling yourself, telling people that "The Ship is Great you just need to go to the Forum to get expert help to fit" which every viable build relies entirely around Reputation Gear and highly customised Bridge Officers; where-as Escorts and Cruisers are viable without a deep understanding of the game mechanics.
And the game does NOTHING to help this; with the obvious role you would THINK the Science Ship should (and at one point did, but oh gone are those days) has being absolutely wrong.
Don't get me wrong I'm not going to fly anything other than my Intrepid / Pathfinder, because I have loved the ship (and the look) for years ... but I'm not going to delude myself into thinking that it is a good or solid ship without serious damn investment that is well beyond the means of most average players.
That makes it a BAD SHIP, especially when compared to the Scryer or Dyson that can easily be fit to out-perform it in every respect; as they are far more designed around being DPS (Destroyer) ships than the Intrepid that is far better suited to being a Healer with Crowd Control and De-Buff which is made difficult given the now almost total lack of De-Buff abilities... and many of the Buff abilities are shifted to the Reputation rewards, so hope any who want to invest in it love to grind away Rep and other ships (for Ship Traits most of which you have to pay for with lots of Dilithium / Real Money)
Totally agree, its a death dealer in terms of exotic damage builds. This should be your focus.
It doesn't make a good tac platform, you're wasting its potential....go ahead remove your tac consoles, in this ship you don't even need them.
Even on my Tac characters it holds it's own.
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
I ran mine with a maxed Particle Generator Build using GW3 and TBR 1 and 2 (Pull Doff) and it rocked for the most part
The Pathfinders T5 Trait is great and add to the mix with the Guardians T5 Trait and you find yourself very Tank like
I've since settled on flying the Scryer Intel Science Vessel largely because of its BOFF layout and integrated cloak; however, the Pathfinder is still a great Science vessel.
But on top of that, there's the matter of the Intel cruiser abilities themselves. They really don't do much, and what they do is severely lacking. Plus there's the Intel boff abilities. They're almost solely designed for escorts or high dps ships. And what sucks is that every single Intel boff, regardless of career, has the exact same ones. The only one I've found even remotely useful is the override subsystem safeties, and even that is extremely limited. Not only doesn't it restore disabled subsystems, it has a 100% phaser proc that affects you, the user.
All in all, these ships were extremely overemphasized by EVERYONE. My advice to anyone looking to get one, you probably shouldn't bother. Save your zen and dilithium and focus on your current ship and equipment.
I jumped into my pathfinder on a Tac Carrier Officer, just top level the Trait up, but its so much fun, so underated and does some seriously good dps. Im a little less robust than I'm used to, but my piloting skills for it are improving as is the fun.
Dont give up on this ship OP, just find a build that suits and get into it! It is all Gravy!!
If you don't intend to use the ship again, why did you even bother leveling it in the first place?
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Before you go buy the ship, do you not see the stats of it? If you look at the stats of a Science Vessel and hoping for a Tempest, then that's on you.
Or do you buy blindly? Then that's still on you.
If you see the stats of the ship, you should get a very rough idea what it's about.
If you know what you were buying, trying to get a proper build for it, but are coming short due to gear, game knowledge... then that's still the player.
The ship isn't bad. It's the player.
As for Science's role in STO? I do remember it's glory days. That were when the game was new. When all aspects of Science were viable modes of play in both PVP and PVE. Drains, CC, Disables, Sensor attacks, even Damage. A lot of those playstyles have been sadly nerfed, with CC, and damage being the last truly viable ones. Healboats don't matter in STO. They've been irrelevant for years now. Damage dealers have enough defense and self heals to take care of themselves, and Cross Healing further makes dedicated Healboats even more irrelevant. But CC and Damage are the last 2 things SCI does well. Wish there was more like the old days.
In addition, I don't think the Average STO player "is the best at everything." Quite the contrary. I think the Average STO player is the worst at everything from the stuff I've seen in the queues over time. Mind you, I don't count newbies in this equation, because we've all been newbies and we all had to learn the game. But then again, I see the OP's registration date, and one has to wonder.
Edit: Noticed you talked about the DSD being better because it's a "Destroyer." That makes me wonder wonder what you really know about Science to begin with.
I can't wait to bring my Sci up enough to be able to run the Path.
Once I build up my resources, I will be working on a gravity well build next, I think I can get a lot of damage out of that.
Experiment with your build, it's a fantastic ship, you just need to give it some love first.
STO Beta Test and Launch Veteran
Grav well 1 and Grav well 3 with a lt cmd/commander tac depending on which mode you fly it in, perfect for TS3 with the Neutronic torp
-Lord Commander Solar Macharius
Do you know the first thing about flying a science ship and making it well. You're obviously one of the people that fly any ship as an underpowered escort, call it a destroyer, then wonder why everyone else is out-everything... then come to the boards and cry how weak science is.
Yes science requires an investment of time, energy credits, and dilithium. It's not something the average player can slip into and run. But then the average person is all about point your ship in the general direction, put a book on the space bar and the numbers for FAW, then go get a soda.
But once you put the time and investment into a science ship, they can outperform almost... almost... every other ship and build out there... if you know what you're doing.
You want to explain me that one, please? 100% phaser proc? Is that a cute way of referring to the fact that one subsystem goes offline when the buff expires?
Yep and that's why Engineering Team is your friend, it laughs out Loud at OSS taking a system off line