Yeah marks progress you through the rep, but to get the items from the rep itself you have to have the items you get from advanced and elite ques. If you can't get those how will you advance? Other than randomly hopefully getting one in the supply drop which is not a guarantee and at best you get 4 shots a day? Yeah that's not a good plan.
The thing is the devs have made a decision and those who want a steep difficulty curve for advanced lost. So enjoy dealing with a faster que and a quicker completion. THE HORROR!
3 cannot be stressed enough. Gear doesn't make the build. (Damn 15k, I envy you, I can't get my sci to do that -with- fleet gear. Just shows how much the captaining matters. )
Yes, but if you're simply working on a build, it doesn't matter how strong or weak enemies are. You can work out a decent build in Normal. The only reason Advanced needs to be stronger is so people who aren't good enough for Elite can still feel that they have an e-peen by doing Advanced, which is kind of like bragging that you graduated elementary school and that it was hard. No one cares how hard or easy Adavanced is, except when it prevents them from getting gear in a reasonable time frame and prevents them from entering Elite in a reasonable time frame.
People have been clamouring for Cryptic to put BNPs in normals for ages now, and it's obvious that Cryptic never will. With the amount of time gating it takes to get dilithium a upgrade gear... telling people they need to time gate even more to work with Fleet Gear as they then time gate to work on Rep and R&D gear is a bit much don't you think.
I get it, you think you're elite and want to join the cool kids in elite, but you're just not good enough. But stop trying to take out your own frustrations that you'll never be one of the cool kids on everyone else who simply wants to get the Rep gear and move on.
1. Not being able to finish "Advanced" level queues does not keep anyone from buying fleet gear.
And, you don't even need to be in a high level fleet, as there are channels where you can ask for access to top-tier resources.
2. Doing the reputation projects normally will occasionally get you the drops to which you're referring.
Can it be maddeningly slow? Yes. Although, I got enough from drops (only doing the new STFs on Normal) to purchase Delta rep gear within the first 3 days.
3. One does not require a ton of rep and/or fleet gear to be useful in an Advanced queue.
My science captain, in a science ship, with MKXI free gear from episodes, does around 15k DPS. And I'm nowhere near the greatest sci captain, trust me.
3:This is very true anyone can go out and build a 10k dps ship no matter their spec for less then 1 million ec.
2:yes if the rng gods are on your side i am nearly at iter 3 delta and have yet to get a drop from the boxes.
1:Fleet gear is expansive when used as a stepping stone for rep gear.
Really this is not that hard just add the special items like bnp's to normal mode and leave advanced where it is.
Or just get rid of normal because the new advanced is pretty much the same now.
People here just seem to refuse to step down to normal.
Even though everyone in the game has spent the last 2 weeks in Normal, but whatever you say.
These people used to steam roll elite and now can't steamroll advanced and are butthurt about it?
Wrong again, but no surprise since you clearly don't understand the problem. I can 'steam roll' either version, but I'm only 1/5. The problem is the time investment/reward rate and the excessively high failure rate due to under geared players that need to play that mode to get their gear.
Players can progress through normal. Please stop spreading all this misinformation. Normal stfs award Marks.
Marks progress you through the rep. So to say it has no function is just a lie.
Well, if you consider getting to Tier 5 Rep the only thing that signifies progression, then sure. Everyone else progresses to attain gear offered by the reward system. Gear that cannot be obtained by doing Normal Mode STF's due to lack of Neural Processors and the like. Sure, there is a chance you can get these through daily/hourly rep.. so I guess you could play the RND game for a couple years till you get enough resources. Yeah, that's an awesome solution!
The queues are not empty because of the difficulty, they're empty because of the rewards nerf so everyone went to battlezones or wherever else they thought was a better return on time.
Yeah, that explains the massive spike in Normal Mode que population huh? Some of the players that used to run Advanced dropped to Normal just for Marks and small amount of Dil, some went to Battlezones, and others who needed gear just stopped playing.
The tons of threads, que numbers and reaction by Cryptic tell you everything you need to know. You're staring at a blue sky, insisting it's yellow and then trying to insult the intelligence of everyone telling you it's blue.
If all the rewards from advanced were moved to normal, then I'm pretty sure advanced queues would be even more dead than they are now. I'd wager most people, even those that "have no business being there," (at least according to some people), are only there because they can't get the rewards they want, (R&D stuff, BNPS, etc...), elsewhere.
And you know, maybe that would be fine; people complaining about the challenge would have a middle of the road difficulty, that they'd have to private queue for, but you pretty much had to do that pre-nerf anyway.
Don't know, seems kind of a waste. If I was a dev, I wouldn't want to see more than one difficulty that was out of reach for most of my player base. Like many have pointed out, gear doesn't necessarily make you a better player, and I doubt many casuals, who only play a few hours a week, will ever reach a level of competence to play at that level.
Supporting multiple levels of content that are ignored by a large portion of the player base doesn't make sense. One seems like enough.
3:This is very true anyone can go out and build a 10k dps ship no matter their spec for less then 1 million ec.
2:yes if the rng gods are on your side i am nearly at iter 3 delta and have yet to get a drop from the boxes.
1:Fleet gear is expansive when used as a stepping stone for rep gear.
Really this is not that hard just add the special items like bnp's to normal mode and leave advanced where it is.
Or just get rid of normal because the new advanced is pretty much the same now.
Why would one use Fleet gear as just a "stepping stone?" It's mostly better, at a better price, IMO. And How much rep gear does someone need to be useful in an advanced queue? With the upgrade system, does one really need BNP or fleet gear that bad just to be useful on a STF now?
So....why does anyone "need" those BNPs so quickly, and so badly?
The whole thing is that people have something against playing on Normal, and refuse to do it, because [insert nonsensical reason here]. I get the rewards changes, because that is silly.
Anyone claiming they need BNP, or to get rep gear, in order to do ISA (and not be completely useless) is plainly wrong.
Why would one use Fleet gear as just a "stepping stone?" It's mostly better, at a better price, IMO. And How much rep gear does someone need to be useful in an advanced queue? With the upgrade system, does one really need BNP or fleet gear that bad just to be useful on a STF now?
So....why does anyone "need" those BNPs so quickly, and so badly?
The whole thing is that people have something against playing on Normal, and refuse to do it, because [insert nonsensical reason here]. I get the rewards changes, because that is silly.
Anyone claiming they need BNP, or to get rep gear, in order to do ISA (and not be completely useless) is plainly wrong.
Let me put it this way... I'll use small words.
I can do elite. I've done elite, always with a pre-made and always within my fleet, but I've done it, succeeded at it, and done it well.
I can't PUG advanced. So here's the thing. I have good enough gear to actually do elite and do it well and succeed at it, but it's not good enough to just PUG an Advanced.
So why the hell though should I have to do normals when I'm trying to upgrade my gear... or else go through the hell of always trying to get a proper pre-made together when I'm just trying to get BNPs and better my gear?
I do pre-mades... but I also PUG, but I shouldn't have to go all the way to normal when I PUG when I can clean up on Elite with my gear. I'm good, my gear is good, but I can't carry an Advanced as it stands now.
So if we're going to compare e-peens, mine is probably bigger then yours, and I'm even saying they should leave Advanced as it is right now.
Because they don't agree with you, it doesn't mean someone can't understand what is being said. Condescension doesn't make your argument more or less valid.
I can't PUG advanced. So here's the thing. I have good enough gear to actually do elite and do it well and succeed at it, but it's not good enough to just PUG an Advanced.
You can't PUG Advanced, because people whom are barely (or not) good enough for Normal are jumping to Advanced.
So why the hell though should I have to do normals when I'm trying to upgrade my gear... or else go through the hell of always trying to get a proper pre-made together when I'm just trying to get BNPs and better my gear?
Is it hard to spend the <5 minutes on the 10k DPS channel to get a team for this?
I do pre-mades... but I also PUG, but I shouldn't have to go all the way to normal when I PUG when I can clean up on Elite with my gear. I'm good, my gear is good, but I can't carry an Advanced as it stands now.
I believe you. I also agree that this is a problem.
So if we're going to compare e-peens, mine is probably bigger then yours, and I'm even saying they should leave Advanced as it is right now.
I'm not sure why you are being so condescending, especially since we agree on most of your points. I just don't understand why you aren't able to do what everyone else in your position is doing to solve your problem. It literally takes the same amount of time or less to find a team.
I'm not sure why you are being so condescending, especially since we agree on most of your points. I just don't understand why you aren't able to do what everyone else in your position is doing to solve your problem. It literally takes the same amount of time or less to find a team.
Because why should I have to? Same time. It takes me one click on the PUG screen to get into a mission. Depending on whose in what channel and what type of pre-made you're looking for it can take upwards of 5 minutes, as even you admitted. All to get a single BNP in a level of difficulty that shouldn't be that hard in the first place to do.
Here's my point. I don't care how easy Advanced is. It being easy doesn't mean jack to me. I can do elite, so why the heck do I care about advanced at all. It being easy means nothing to me. I get nothing out of Advanced being so difficult I can't PUG it because your average player isn't good enough to simply walk in and do it.
That's the issue. I have no e-peen, I couldn't care less. I generally don't brag about the fact that I can do elite because the accomplishment means nothing to me. But your average player should be able to do advanced in a pug. Not complete the optional, but complete it successfully the majority of the time.
That's not happening and that's what needs to change. The fact that your BNPs are behind a gate that your average player can't complete, regardless of its necessity is the issue.
I and the game get nothing out of advanced being difficult. Want to get your build up to being able to do advanced? Go to your fleet or a dps channel and see if you can get into a elite whose sole purpose is to discover your weakness. You don't need advanced to learn your build, any reasonable fleet and most reasonable players will assist people in getting their builds up to snuff... when they have time.
But the idea that advanced needs to be difficult for difficult sake is bogus. That's elite's job.
No you can get green mk 11 beam arrays as low as 10000 ec per (as long as you don't care about energy type) After that mk 11 or mk 12 blues beam arrays can be had for under 100k each so at current prices for 8 beams its 80,000 to 800,000 ec for 8 green/blue weapons. The weapon energy type/mods might be bad but considering they make such a small differnce in dps and for a low price its hard to complain.
The price has gone up quite a bit about a month ago i got 5xgreen mk11's for under 5k each and 3x blue mk11's for under 40k each.
There's the problem; I'm not looking for beams; I'm looking for Dual Heavy Cannons & Turrets.
I have enough beams; the game practically throws them all at you.
"Join Date: Jun 2012" Says Cryptic's "new" forum system. I've been here since a week before launch, but SOME stuff just didn't carry over through multiple system changes/updates. :rolleyes:
Because why should I have to? Same time. It takes me one click on the PUG screen to get into a mission. Depending on whose in what channel and what type of pre-made you're looking for it can take upwards of 5 minutes, as even you admitted. All to get a single BNP in a level of difficulty that shouldn't be that hard in the first place to do.
Here's my point. I don't care how easy Advanced is. It being easy doesn't mean jack to me. I can do elite, so why the heck do I care about advanced at all. It being easy means nothing to me. I get nothing out of Advanced being so difficult I can't PUG it because your average player isn't good enough to simply walk in and do it.
That's the issue. I have no e-peen, I couldn't care less. I generally don't brag about the fact that I can do elite because the accomplishment means nothing to me. But your average player should be able to do advanced in a pug. Not complete the optional, but complete it successfully the majority of the time.
That's not happening and that's what needs to change. The fact that your BNPs are behind a gate that your average player can't complete, regardless of its necessity is the issue.
I and the game get nothing out of advanced being difficult. Want to get your build up to being able to do advanced? Go to your fleet or a dps channel and see if you can get into a elite whose sole purpose is to discover your weakness. You don't need advanced to learn your build, any reasonable fleet and most reasonable players will assist people in getting their builds up to snuff... when they have time.
But the idea that advanced needs to be difficult for difficult sake is bogus. That's elite's job.
It can take 5 minutes for a random queue, as well.
Advanced is, by definition, not for everyone. I think everyone got spoiled by being able to ROFLstomp the old Elite. So, Easy, Still Easy, and...Ridiculous? That makes no sense to me.
I'm sorry you would rather wait in a queue, with what could be someone who wants to troll the team, than watch 10k DPS channel looking for a "lf2m ISA" message, or start one.
I'm not sure what the whole "e-peen" thing is about, since I consistently use myself as an example for "Not high DPS."
Your average player should be able to do average content. I believe a group of average people can complete Advanced. I also believe that people who can't handle normal are joining advanced queues- trying to leech off everyone else, people are trolling teams so they fail, and others believe themselves to be better than they actually are.
So, if I want a challenge that isn't ridiculously easy or ridiculously hard, I'm SOL...because you like clicking one button, instead of typing "lf4m ISA"? Nah, that don't taste right, Chef.
As long as Ancient Power Cells, Borg Neural Processors, Voth Cybernetic Implants, and Isomorphic Injectors are awarded only from Advanced and above, people who don't care how much DPS they do, and play the game because it's fun to them will queue for Advanced STFs. Simple as that.
Don't bleme those people. They would never be in those queues if it wasn't more or less required for them to get their rep gear made. If the rewards were put in normal, even if limited to say, 3 per day, you would never see their faces in Advanced.
So, Cryptic can either make the queues doable by those people, give the rewards in normal, or lose those people. Guess which choice they'll take? (Hint: it's not losing those people) Just because you can do 10K, 20K, or even 50K DPS doesn't mean your money is any shinier to Cryptic than anyone else's.
I don't really see any difference? I still so far have had no luck with any of the pug groups that I have been grouped with. So someone who has upgraded quite a bit of his gear and used to run the old elite without issue which supposedly the advanced are supposed to be like... Where does that leave the game for me? Right now stuck running normals. It sucks. I should be able to do what I was doing before *especially* with the upgrades I've done so far. Maybe I'll try to get a group of fleet mates together before I pass complete judgement.
It can take 5 minutes for a random queue, as well.
Advanced is, by definition, not for everyone. I think everyone got spoiled by being able to ROFLstomp the old Elite. So, Easy, Still Easy, and...Ridiculous? That makes no sense to me.
I'm sorry you would rather wait in a queue, with what could be someone who wants to troll the team, than watch 10k DPS channel looking for a "lf2m ISA" message, or start one.
I'm not sure what the whole "e-peen" thing is about, since I consistently use myself as an example for "Not high DPS."
Your average player should be able to do average content. I believe a group of average people can complete Advanced. I also believe that people who can't handle normal are joining advanced queues- trying to leech off everyone else, people are trolling teams so they fail, and others believe themselves to be better than they actually are.
So, if I want a challenge that isn't ridiculously easy or ridiculously hard, I'm SOL...because you like clicking one button, instead of typing "lf4m ISA"? Nah, that don't taste right, Chef.
STFU with this advanced is for advanced players already. We were told by the DEVs that the new Advanced would be exactly the same as the "old "elite but with added mandatory objectives. All of you guys wanting pre 11/6 patch difficulty back are now crying over spilled milk. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few...does this make any sense to you all????
The community joined together and voiced loudly their opposition to this HP saturated advanced que situation and are finally being listened to, something we all thought had disappeared. Your arguments are no longer valid at this point because obviously you are the minority and are now just speaking up in order to troll the threads. All you are doing from this point forward is arguing just to argue and to get in the last word because you have just found out that most of the player base does not agree with you.
Someone posted earlier that each captain spec should be doing *blank* job and man alive I hope thats not the direction they go with the game. I liked in pre Delta that it didn't matter I was an engy, I wasn't locked into tanking or debuffing or whtaever. STO was unique in that it didn't have some holy trinity of healer/tank/dps for group play and I thought that was a feature not a bug.
I hope you're not referring to me.
I never said that nor implied it.
I only used those examples as a BASIC suggestion of proper teamwork.
Tac still get damage bonuses for using Escorts, Scis still get shield bonuses when using Sci ships, and Engs still get defensive bonuses for using cruisers.
Those mechanics were put into place shortly after the 3 difficulties were functioning as intended, hence the skill tree revamp they did to reflect those, and the forced respec that followed.
Anyway, I never said "each captain spec should be doing *blank* job";
What I said was that if different players WOULD do different jobs instead of everyone just focusing on DPS like it's the holy grail...the teams would succeed far ore often, and be much more efficient.
Basically, more players need to actually THINK about their builds & playstyles, and adjust them accordingly instead of just doing whatever they want to do & then getting upset that their team is failing and/or blaming a difficult that they're obviously not committed enough to succeed at.
I have been on plenty of STFs-failing teams in my 4+ years...sometimes it was my fault, and sometimes it wasn't.
The point is: I evaluated my own factors & adjusted them accordingly and/or attempted to help someone else do so.
Play together, play as a team instead of a group, and learn from & help each other.
That's all I was attempting to say.
just ran my first bug hunt on normal, it went so throughly bad im not considering a second attempt at it. all mark 12 kit across the board and a mk 14 dyson gun, none of it is the slightest bit effective against those ravagers. they were op before the nerf, they are still op.
so licking my wounds as typical as a cat. im considering just leaving to the space aspect from this point.
I have all Mx 10-11 gear...nothing higher than blue, if that.
Ravagers have never been more of a problem for me than the flying Bluegills.
I have yet to see Bug Hunt on Normal go "so throughly bad".
Either you're doing something wrong or you are extremely unlucky with PUGs?
I'd love to queue it up with you sometime, and see if we can figure out what's happening here because I seriously cannot currently understand how Bug Hunt could ever be that problematic.
I am serious. @Xavier_Q
Please, queue it with me sometime?
"Join Date: Jun 2012" Says Cryptic's "new" forum system. I've been here since a week before launch, but SOME stuff just didn't carry over through multiple system changes/updates. :rolleyes:
I don't really see any difference? I still so far have had no luck with any of the pug groups that I have been grouped with. So someone who has upgraded quite a bit of his gear and used to run the old elite without issue which supposedly the advanced are supposed to be like... Where does that leave the game for me? Right now stuck running normals. It sucks. I should be able to do what I was doing before *especially* with the upgrades I've done so far. Maybe I'll try to get a group of fleet mates together before I pass complete judgement.
I do agree with this. Normal should be "Easy," the old Elite should be "Normal," then there should be Advanced and Elite, with better rewards. I really don't think they should have forced people out of old content and make them participate in the expansion.
Honestly, the old Elite was so silly easy it was just not fun to me, and I always wondered why it was called "Elite." But some people saw it as a means to an end, and just wanted it over with.
With the power creep that comes with DR, though, everyone gets better just by leveling. It's obvious they would see the need to upgrade the STFs to compensate. What they don't realize, is that some people just don't care what their skill level is, they'll just go wherever the rewards are, and assume they are entitled to them for little to no effort.
I also think it's wrong that people can't do the same content with the same ships and gear they already had. Assuming one upgraded or got a T6 ship, yeah, everything needs to be changed. But a lot of people HATE the new ships, or the new content, and want nothing to do with it.
But others who want the new difficulty (that is in place) shouldn't be penalized for wanting to play it. Just as those who want the old content shouldn't be penalized for not wanting any part of it. Problem is, people know they can't do the new STFs, and join them anyway.
STFU with this advanced is for advanced players already. We were told by the DEVs that the new Advanced would be exactly the same as the "old "elite but with added mandatory objectives. All of you guys wanting pre 11/6 patch difficulty back are now crying over spilled milk. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few...does this make any sense to you all????
The community joined together and voiced loudly their opposition to this HP saturated advanced que situation and are finally being listened to, something we all thought had disappeared. Your arguments are no longer valid at this point because obviously you are the minority and are now just speaking up in order to troll the threads. All you are doing from this point forward is arguing just to argue and to get in the last word because you have just found out that most of the player base does not agree with you.
Shut up and let this thread die.
Please do not assume to know my motives, nor assume you have any authority to begin to give me orders. It demeans us both. Thank you.
I have all Mx 10-11 gear...nothing higher than blue, if that.
Ravagers have never been more of a problem for me than the flying Bluegills.
I have yet to see Bug Hunt on Normal go "so throughly bad".
Either you're doing something wrong or you are extremely unlucky with PUGs?
I'd love to queue it up with you sometime, and see if we can figure out what's happening here because I seriously cannot currently understand how Bug Hunt could ever be that problematic.
I am serious. @Xavier_Q
Please, queue it with me sometime?
doing nothing that i havent done before, the first encounter with the bugs in that cave on that mission dragons deceit, those ravagers were always the problem, they usually take me out the fight faster then i join in. using dyson tech and perhaps useless? i can exchange it for a maco kit i got on my boffs. i dont understand what the issue is either.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
doing nothing that i havent done before, the first encounter with the bugs in that cave on that mission dragons deceit, those ravagers were always the problem, they usually take me out the fight faster then i join in. using dyson tech and perhaps useless? i can exchange it for a maco kit i got on my boffs. i dont understand what the issue is either.
Just out of curiosity do you go right in and get jumped on and smothered? Perhaps take a more ranged and move in tactic. For instance start shooting as you enter and clear the room. I do this as my medic and I can stay alive and keep others healed.
Edit: I'm thinking maybe you're getting flanked to death.
Anyone agree with this? I'm not talking about rewards of course, but the HP levels of the critters. I ran a pug last night in ISE in my Mirror T'Varo with primarily Mk XII gear a couple pieces of MK XIII and only died once. Had to really stay on top of my BO powers and even had to disengage at a couple points to recoup.
I enjoyed the challenge and not steam rolling through it in five minutes. I know not everyone may agree but anyone else that does?
No, I don't agree.
There has to be some sort of balance between "challenge" and "accessibility". The developers failed at that with the new advanced mode.
Minor tweaks would have been fine. But for the most part, they should have left the old elite alone when it became "advanced". Monster hit point hikes on the enemy NPCs, combined with little to no change on the timer, and the optional now being mandatory, was the wrong mix. Average players who are looking to work toward updated gear, are cut off from said gear because of the items needed for projects are locked behind the higher modes. All because DPS monster boats are virtually a requirement to beat the clock. Something the average player/newly minted 50 hasn't achieved yet. They are usually running stock gear or reward gear, on average.
Advanced should be for these folks. Not for the bored/lazy min-max-er to get quick marks or project items. If you want to play a mode with concrete punching bags, with no optionals and unforgiving timer clock, that's what the new elite difficulty is for.
Comments
The thing is the devs have made a decision and those who want a steep difficulty curve for advanced lost. So enjoy dealing with a faster que and a quicker completion. THE HORROR!
Yes, but if you're simply working on a build, it doesn't matter how strong or weak enemies are. You can work out a decent build in Normal. The only reason Advanced needs to be stronger is so people who aren't good enough for Elite can still feel that they have an e-peen by doing Advanced, which is kind of like bragging that you graduated elementary school and that it was hard. No one cares how hard or easy Adavanced is, except when it prevents them from getting gear in a reasonable time frame and prevents them from entering Elite in a reasonable time frame.
People have been clamouring for Cryptic to put BNPs in normals for ages now, and it's obvious that Cryptic never will. With the amount of time gating it takes to get dilithium a upgrade gear... telling people they need to time gate even more to work with Fleet Gear as they then time gate to work on Rep and R&D gear is a bit much don't you think.
I get it, you think you're elite and want to join the cool kids in elite, but you're just not good enough. But stop trying to take out your own frustrations that you'll never be one of the cool kids on everyone else who simply wants to get the Rep gear and move on.
3:This is very true anyone can go out and build a 10k dps ship no matter their spec for less then 1 million ec.
2:yes if the rng gods are on your side i am nearly at iter 3 delta and have yet to get a drop from the boxes.
1:Fleet gear is expansive when used as a stepping stone for rep gear.
Really this is not that hard just add the special items like bnp's to normal mode and leave advanced where it is.
Or just get rid of normal because the new advanced is pretty much the same now.
Even though everyone in the game has spent the last 2 weeks in Normal, but whatever you say.
Wrong again, but no surprise since you clearly don't understand the problem. I can 'steam roll' either version, but I'm only 1/5. The problem is the time investment/reward rate and the excessively high failure rate due to under geared players that need to play that mode to get their gear.
Well, if you consider getting to Tier 5 Rep the only thing that signifies progression, then sure. Everyone else progresses to attain gear offered by the reward system. Gear that cannot be obtained by doing Normal Mode STF's due to lack of Neural Processors and the like. Sure, there is a chance you can get these through daily/hourly rep.. so I guess you could play the RND game for a couple years till you get enough resources. Yeah, that's an awesome solution!
Yeah, that explains the massive spike in Normal Mode que population huh? Some of the players that used to run Advanced dropped to Normal just for Marks and small amount of Dil, some went to Battlezones, and others who needed gear just stopped playing.
The tons of threads, que numbers and reaction by Cryptic tell you everything you need to know. You're staring at a blue sky, insisting it's yellow and then trying to insult the intelligence of everyone telling you it's blue.
And you know, maybe that would be fine; people complaining about the challenge would have a middle of the road difficulty, that they'd have to private queue for, but you pretty much had to do that pre-nerf anyway.
Don't know, seems kind of a waste. If I was a dev, I wouldn't want to see more than one difficulty that was out of reach for most of my player base. Like many have pointed out, gear doesn't necessarily make you a better player, and I doubt many casuals, who only play a few hours a week, will ever reach a level of competence to play at that level.
Supporting multiple levels of content that are ignored by a large portion of the player base doesn't make sense. One seems like enough.
Why would one use Fleet gear as just a "stepping stone?" It's mostly better, at a better price, IMO. And How much rep gear does someone need to be useful in an advanced queue? With the upgrade system, does one really need BNP or fleet gear that bad just to be useful on a STF now?
So....why does anyone "need" those BNPs so quickly, and so badly?
The whole thing is that people have something against playing on Normal, and refuse to do it, because [insert nonsensical reason here]. I get the rewards changes, because that is silly.
Anyone claiming they need BNP, or to get rep gear, in order to do ISA (and not be completely useless) is plainly wrong.
Let me put it this way... I'll use small words.
I can do elite. I've done elite, always with a pre-made and always within my fleet, but I've done it, succeeded at it, and done it well.
I can't PUG advanced. So here's the thing. I have good enough gear to actually do elite and do it well and succeed at it, but it's not good enough to just PUG an Advanced.
So why the hell though should I have to do normals when I'm trying to upgrade my gear... or else go through the hell of always trying to get a proper pre-made together when I'm just trying to get BNPs and better my gear?
I do pre-mades... but I also PUG, but I shouldn't have to go all the way to normal when I PUG when I can clean up on Elite with my gear. I'm good, my gear is good, but I can't carry an Advanced as it stands now.
So if we're going to compare e-peens, mine is probably bigger then yours, and I'm even saying they should leave Advanced as it is right now.
Because they don't agree with you, it doesn't mean someone can't understand what is being said. Condescension doesn't make your argument more or less valid.
Congratulations.
You can't PUG Advanced, because people whom are barely (or not) good enough for Normal are jumping to Advanced.
Is it hard to spend the <5 minutes on the 10k DPS channel to get a team for this?
I believe you. I also agree that this is a problem.
I'm not sure why you are being so condescending, especially since we agree on most of your points. I just don't understand why you aren't able to do what everyone else in your position is doing to solve your problem. It literally takes the same amount of time or less to find a team.
Because why should I have to? Same time. It takes me one click on the PUG screen to get into a mission. Depending on whose in what channel and what type of pre-made you're looking for it can take upwards of 5 minutes, as even you admitted. All to get a single BNP in a level of difficulty that shouldn't be that hard in the first place to do.
Here's my point. I don't care how easy Advanced is. It being easy doesn't mean jack to me. I can do elite, so why the heck do I care about advanced at all. It being easy means nothing to me. I get nothing out of Advanced being so difficult I can't PUG it because your average player isn't good enough to simply walk in and do it.
That's the issue. I have no e-peen, I couldn't care less. I generally don't brag about the fact that I can do elite because the accomplishment means nothing to me. But your average player should be able to do advanced in a pug. Not complete the optional, but complete it successfully the majority of the time.
That's not happening and that's what needs to change. The fact that your BNPs are behind a gate that your average player can't complete, regardless of its necessity is the issue.
I and the game get nothing out of advanced being difficult. Want to get your build up to being able to do advanced? Go to your fleet or a dps channel and see if you can get into a elite whose sole purpose is to discover your weakness. You don't need advanced to learn your build, any reasonable fleet and most reasonable players will assist people in getting their builds up to snuff... when they have time.
But the idea that advanced needs to be difficult for difficult sake is bogus. That's elite's job.
There's the problem; I'm not looking for beams; I'm looking for Dual Heavy Cannons & Turrets.
I have enough beams; the game practically throws them all at you.
It can take 5 minutes for a random queue, as well.
Advanced is, by definition, not for everyone. I think everyone got spoiled by being able to ROFLstomp the old Elite. So, Easy, Still Easy, and...Ridiculous? That makes no sense to me.
I'm sorry you would rather wait in a queue, with what could be someone who wants to troll the team, than watch 10k DPS channel looking for a "lf2m ISA" message, or start one.
I'm not sure what the whole "e-peen" thing is about, since I consistently use myself as an example for "Not high DPS."
Your average player should be able to do average content. I believe a group of average people can complete Advanced. I also believe that people who can't handle normal are joining advanced queues- trying to leech off everyone else, people are trolling teams so they fail, and others believe themselves to be better than they actually are.
So, if I want a challenge that isn't ridiculously easy or ridiculously hard, I'm SOL...because you like clicking one button, instead of typing "lf4m ISA"? Nah, that don't taste right, Chef.
Don't bleme those people. They would never be in those queues if it wasn't more or less required for them to get their rep gear made. If the rewards were put in normal, even if limited to say, 3 per day, you would never see their faces in Advanced.
So, Cryptic can either make the queues doable by those people, give the rewards in normal, or lose those people. Guess which choice they'll take? (Hint: it's not losing those people) Just because you can do 10K, 20K, or even 50K DPS doesn't mean your money is any shinier to Cryptic than anyone else's.
STFU with this advanced is for advanced players already. We were told by the DEVs that the new Advanced would be exactly the same as the "old "elite but with added mandatory objectives. All of you guys wanting pre 11/6 patch difficulty back are now crying over spilled milk. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few...does this make any sense to you all????
The community joined together and voiced loudly their opposition to this HP saturated advanced que situation and are finally being listened to, something we all thought had disappeared. Your arguments are no longer valid at this point because obviously you are the minority and are now just speaking up in order to troll the threads. All you are doing from this point forward is arguing just to argue and to get in the last word because you have just found out that most of the player base does not agree with you.
Shut up and let this thread die.
I hope you're not referring to me.
I never said that nor implied it.
I only used those examples as a BASIC suggestion of proper teamwork.
Tac still get damage bonuses for using Escorts, Scis still get shield bonuses when using Sci ships, and Engs still get defensive bonuses for using cruisers.
Those mechanics were put into place shortly after the 3 difficulties were functioning as intended, hence the skill tree revamp they did to reflect those, and the forced respec that followed.
Anyway, I never said "each captain spec should be doing *blank* job";
What I said was that if different players WOULD do different jobs instead of everyone just focusing on DPS like it's the holy grail...the teams would succeed far ore often, and be much more efficient.
Basically, more players need to actually THINK about their builds & playstyles, and adjust them accordingly instead of just doing whatever they want to do & then getting upset that their team is failing and/or blaming a difficult that they're obviously not committed enough to succeed at.
I have been on plenty of STFs-failing teams in my 4+ years...sometimes it was my fault, and sometimes it wasn't.
The point is: I evaluated my own factors & adjusted them accordingly and/or attempted to help someone else do so.
Play together, play as a team instead of a group, and learn from & help each other.
That's all I was attempting to say.
I have all Mx 10-11 gear...nothing higher than blue, if that.
Ravagers have never been more of a problem for me than the flying Bluegills.
I have yet to see Bug Hunt on Normal go "so throughly bad".
Either you're doing something wrong or you are extremely unlucky with PUGs?
I'd love to queue it up with you sometime, and see if we can figure out what's happening here because I seriously cannot currently understand how Bug Hunt could ever be that problematic.
I am serious.
@Xavier_Q
Please, queue it with me sometime?
I do agree with this. Normal should be "Easy," the old Elite should be "Normal," then there should be Advanced and Elite, with better rewards. I really don't think they should have forced people out of old content and make them participate in the expansion.
Honestly, the old Elite was so silly easy it was just not fun to me, and I always wondered why it was called "Elite." But some people saw it as a means to an end, and just wanted it over with.
With the power creep that comes with DR, though, everyone gets better just by leveling. It's obvious they would see the need to upgrade the STFs to compensate. What they don't realize, is that some people just don't care what their skill level is, they'll just go wherever the rewards are, and assume they are entitled to them for little to no effort.
I also think it's wrong that people can't do the same content with the same ships and gear they already had. Assuming one upgraded or got a T6 ship, yeah, everything needs to be changed. But a lot of people HATE the new ships, or the new content, and want nothing to do with it.
But others who want the new difficulty (that is in place) shouldn't be penalized for wanting to play it. Just as those who want the old content shouldn't be penalized for not wanting any part of it. Problem is, people know they can't do the new STFs, and join them anyway.
Please do not assume to know my motives, nor assume you have any authority to begin to give me orders. It demeans us both. Thank you.
doing nothing that i havent done before, the first encounter with the bugs in that cave on that mission dragons deceit, those ravagers were always the problem, they usually take me out the fight faster then i join in. using dyson tech and perhaps useless? i can exchange it for a maco kit i got on my boffs. i dont understand what the issue is either.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Just out of curiosity do you go right in and get jumped on and smothered? Perhaps take a more ranged and move in tactic. For instance start shooting as you enter and clear the room. I do this as my medic and I can stay alive and keep others healed.
Edit: I'm thinking maybe you're getting flanked to death.
Lion Heart of Hammer Squadron
No, I don't agree.
There has to be some sort of balance between "challenge" and "accessibility". The developers failed at that with the new advanced mode.
Minor tweaks would have been fine. But for the most part, they should have left the old elite alone when it became "advanced". Monster hit point hikes on the enemy NPCs, combined with little to no change on the timer, and the optional now being mandatory, was the wrong mix. Average players who are looking to work toward updated gear, are cut off from said gear because of the items needed for projects are locked behind the higher modes. All because DPS monster boats are virtually a requirement to beat the clock. Something the average player/newly minted 50 hasn't achieved yet. They are usually running stock gear or reward gear, on average.
Advanced should be for these folks. Not for the bored/lazy min-max-er to get quick marks or project items. If you want to play a mode with concrete punching bags, with no optionals and unforgiving timer clock, that's what the new elite difficulty is for.
What was and still is needed is to make the optionals optional again on advanced.