better not to argue with a white knight that says "I'd be perfectly fine if I took 12 months to hit level 60"
I said 3 or 4 weeks. 12 months was on a different game.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Wait until they start reviewing the metrics. This game should be BOOMING two weeks after DR launch and there are dead queues everywhere. It will put the fear of God into them, the only thing that does - numbers.
They will eventally bring Advanced back to the old Elite when they see low numbers for what should be such a busy time period. The question will be, how long? Players are leaving in droves and once gone you can't be sure you'll get them back.
I think damage is already starting to be done to the game. I was hoping last Thursday's change would fix it but it clearly was not enough. Each week with the dead queues hurts the game. Not sure how much time they have to get it right but I think they're pushing it.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
While everyone has the right to complain, this guy got it right.
Back before all the DPS power creep, using GW for CC in ISE and getting all the generators to 10% before blowing them up was standard practice. People got accostumed to pew pew and thats it since the Omega rep came out.
You are right but things are different still!
You may grav well all you want on the flock of spheres to gain time to blow the gen but if ur team doesnt generate an average of 10kDPS/player the formal optional timer not the criteria will get you in the end.
You may have that, I may have that but not 90% of the players in game.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I think damage is already starting to be done to the game. I was hoping last Thursday's change would fix it but it clearly was not enough. Each week with the dead queues hurts the game. Not sure how much time they have to get it right but I think they're pushing it.
I'm expecting interesting patch changes today/tomorrow for the tribble server.
When I fly my high dps boats I would LOVE for someone to throw well timed grav wells and tbrs. Most of the time no one does. If someone is flying a 5-10k dedicated sci boat with cc that should never be considered detrimental. Ignorance really.
The problem is that now the only incentive is more dps. Even if you bring the dps though some troll will pop a generator early for no reason. So it's very pointless to pug ISA.I tried to do vicious cycle it never popped. The other queues seem to be the same. Dead.
Removing the current lead designers won't change a thing. Pwe's direction has been more monetization. Squeeze the player base for all they got. I had enough, my wallet is closed.
We're not at endgame anymore. People have at least 10 levels to move up to get there again (more if you count specialization points), and I am not sure that the queued content is the fastest way to earn skill points. It was certainly never designed around that goal. The endgame rewards of interest are marks and dilithium, not skill points.
I've only managed to bring one character to Level 60 so far. And I have plenty more to level (I'll not do them all immediately, and always focus on a few main characters ,but you get the idea.)
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
We're not at endgame anymore. People have at least 10 levels to move up to get there again (more if you count specialization points), and I am not sure that the queued content is the fastest way to earn skill points. It was certainly never designed around that goal. The endgame rewards of interest are marks and dilithium, not skill points.
I've only managed to bring one character to Level 60 so far.
I'm lvl 60
I have a fair amount of spec points
I have 13 mk 14 items on my ship
I have 7 mk 13 items on my ship
I have T5-u FACR
I have endgame boffs and doffs and traits
My cruiser does 25k+ dps
I am at endgame now, and I can tell you it's FAR from enough. The damage my ship does is well above the average player, by several factors infact. I can tell you the average group (pug) will NEVER reach a level that makes most advanced stf's doable. Let alone elites.
I can't stand the rhetoric of "wait until you reach level 60 or upgrade your equipment" it's simply not true as guilli88 I too am level 60 24k dps JHDC and I can't save pugs. Upgrading and specialization a brought me a whole 10% more dps, how on earth is that enough for your average 5-7k boat? Why would anyone ever dump the resources anyway?
If you are happy to put around normal there's no reason to upgrade. If upgrading won't allow you to complete advanced/elite anyways, why join the rat race? There's no incentive to play.
I'm lvl 60
I have a fair amount of spec points
I have 13 mk 14 items on my ship
I have 7 mk 13 items on my ship
I have T5-u FACR
I have endgame boffs and doffs and traits
My cruiser does 25k+ dps
I am at endgame now, and I can tell you it's FAR from enough. The damage my ship does is well above the average player, by several factors infact. I can tell you the average group (pug) will NEVER reach a level that makes most advanced stf's doable. Let alone elites.
You are right.
I have 2 toons on 60, rest stuck at 54-55 due to lack of play. Upgrades are petty much done. I can provide 20k-25k builds on some of em. Other toons have other priorities.
One thing is save to say:
Neither the levelling nor the ship upgrades have anyway near an influence on the enhanced hull hit points or the fail criteria the community faces in current highest difficulty compared to what they faced 2 weeks ago.
It seems that either Cryptic deliberately wants to slow down the player from any form of progression by cutting back any in game rewards or they dont have the slightest understanding about general pve balance in thier own game.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I'm lvl 60
I have a fair amount of spec points
I have 13 mk 14 items on my ship
I have 7 mk 13 items on my ship
I have T5-u FACR
I have endgame boffs and doffs and traits
My cruiser does 25k+ dps
I am at endgame now, and I can tell you it's FAR from enough. The damage my ship does is well above the average player, by several factors infact. I can tell you the average group (pug) will NEVER reach a level that makes most advanced stf's doable. Let alone elites.
Now that is a better data point. I think slow queues however are not a sign on their own after a major content release and level cap increase. People are simply busy with other content.
In the end, as always, actions will speak louder than words - if players really stop playing queued content because it isn't rewarding or fun, then the numbers will show, and Cryptic will have to react. (Not promise or evade - react).
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
How to fix a dead queue with minimal work in 2 steps:
1) Buff dil/mark reward
2) Buff XP reward
Instead Cryptic ignore 2) and do the opposite of 1). :rolleyes:
You got that right!
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> <
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Looking for a new fleet? Drop by the in-game chat channel, "tenforwardforum", and say hi to the members of A Fleet Called Ten Forward (Fed) and The Orion Pirates (KDF). If you already have a fleet you are happy with, please feel free to drop by our chat channel if you are looking for a friendly bunch of helpful people to socialize with.
I have a serious problem with the "New! Improved!" STFs. Namely, the rewards no longer are worth the effort required. I have begun leveling up and running DR missions with two toons. The story content mission rewards also do not match the effort required.
I tried the replacement for ISE on the day DR was released. Fleet Mogai with all Rommie Rep or Purple gear and SRO Boffs. Not a DPS Monster but a respectable output anyway. On Wednesday, I could hold my own in ISE and contribute towards the success of a PUG team. Heck, I could carry a bad team at least to completion in about ten minutes. I've never been one who got excited over the Optional. If I made it, great! If not well I can try again in an hour or so. On Friday, with the same ship, it felt like I was doing nothing at all. I can live with this part. New or more enemies with new techniques require me to learn and adapt to them. Takes time but I will get there.
What I refuse to accept is the now pitiful level of rewards for all of the queues. Since pwe/cryptic has decided to go this route I cannot stop them. What I can do is refuse to play in the queues. I'm not going to make any grand sweeping gestures on these forums by posting an I quit thread. What I can do without all the fanfare is reduce the time I spend playing STO. The less time I spend playing the game, the more likely it is I will not spend money on it. Which really ought to get their attention nicely.
I suspect some people who do not come to these forums feel the same way I do. Further, since they do not come here, they never saw the EP's explanation. All they saw was they leveled really fast according to something the game allowed. Then suddenly with no warning they got ganked. Without coming here, they wouldn't know what they did was "wrong". So they pressed <DEL> on STO and talked to their friends about it. Of course the friends talked as well. Of course the friends' version of the story was probably a little looser with the facts. And suddenly, STO has a bad reputation. Which the Dev Team did not have to grind for.
With people they will now never have a chance to earn any revenue from.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
Angry customers are like roaches, if you find one lurking around there's bound to be more hiding in the walls you can't see. Since dr launched cryptic has an infestation of angry customers.
The forums may not be a true representation of the state of the game, but it does give a good indication of how things are going. The people that come to the forums care enough to post, spend time and money in the game. Casuals may be enjoying the story content, but I don't think they will pay the bills.
Empty queues mean casuals have nothing to do. Whales can't show off all the gear they bought. The game dies because there's nothing to hold anyone's interest.
If the first go around in fixing the advanced queues is any indication, things are not going great. Numbers can't be that great, so let's see if they make a second pass. If not I will enjoy some sunshine.
so... how long till cryptic admits the vast majority of the playerbase is outright ignoring/refusing to play STFs, fleet actions/etc? and decides to... you know, tune them?
There is pride here, I wouldn't expect them to admit to anything.
They might tune them, but I have a feeling they're taking this as a wait and see approach, which, I think is fair it's still fairly new.
If anything, there isn't enough of a population to support the now way too many queues. Heck, there were too many queues well prior to DR, many of them were dead then. PUG-ing is all but gone.
Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
I was really hoping the dilithium/lobi event would have helped filled up the queues, especially the Fleet Alerts. I don't even think it brought any extra traffic. Since DR my small fleet is in shambles. We had been making really good progress working our way to T4 but now, I'm the only one logging in. The other 10 guys haven't bothered since the first week of DR and I'm pretty sure 4 of them have no intention of coming back. I used to be able to get a project a day done by myself, but now forget it. Mission friggin impossible. I cringe when a low level ship is in the group (PUGging) now, it's 50/50 on whether you can complete the mission. Before DR you could carry 2 maybe even 3 low level ships and it was fun to boot.
I also see the specter of racism or nationalism in this complaints about "Chinese company." Who cares where the company is located? Is it a cue that you are meant to hate it because its from China?
China is a single-party communist country. Every chinese business is either majority-owned by the government or operates at their pleasure (bribes). They will be using your money to fund militarized expansion across the Asia-Pacific region. So yeah it matters.
Angry customers are like roaches, if you find one lurking around there's bound to be more hiding in the walls you can't see. Since dr launched cryptic has an infestation of angry customers.
The forums may not be a true representation of the state of the game, but it does give a good indication of how things are going. The people that come to the forums care enough to post, spend time and money in the game. Casuals may be enjoying the story content, but I don't think they will pay the bills.
Empty queues mean casuals have nothing to do. Whales can't show off all the gear they bought. The game dies because there's nothing to hold anyone's interest.
If the first go around in fixing the advanced queues is any indication, things are not going great. Numbers can't be that great, so let's see if they make a second pass. If not I will enjoy some sunshine.
that's not necessarily true, there has been research that showed casuals/average players in general account for half of a f2p game profits, while whales account for the other half, while i'll admit that due to star trek "unique" fanbase, the whales might account for more than half of the profits on STO case, losing casuals will hurt cryptic's(and PWE) bottom line anyway.
You are correct, if I may to add to my thought I meant that a casual that is only interested in the story content will probably not need to upgrade gear to level 14 epic, or buy loads of ships. In that sense my thought was that they wouldn't contribute to the bottom line.
I would play standard mode if the reward included the module needed for buying the rep gear; without that, there is no reason to play standard since I have been playing the missions long enough to know how they work, but am not interested in the new advanced queue menagerie.
A better idea for Advanced queues is a staged level of success.
1. Old elite without optional is the basic reward with module
2. Old elite with optional is the bonus reward with module
3. Final stage is new Advance requirement (reduced time for completion and new options) with a double bonus reward and two modules
This way a player and team that achieve final stage will know they are ready for Elite mode.
I'de prefer the advanced missions be exactly like the old elites, with 2 changes : 35-50% more HP on the enemy and the optional made mandatory.
That leaves plenty of room to carry an occasional noob or a few lowbie cruisers. Let the l33ts have their nightmare mode, leave the advanced queues for the transitional players and casuals.
China is a single-party communist country. Every chinese business is either majority-owned by the government or operates at their pleasure (bribes). They will be using your money to fund militarized expansion across the Asia-Pacific region. So yeah it matters.
I think other countries have waged aggressive warfare without cause in a similar manner as China with Tibet - hmm what was that country who did so recently?? I can't quite remember.
Captain Jean-Luc Picard: "We think we've come so far. Torture of heretics, burning of witches, it's all ancient history. Then - before you can blink an eye - suddenly it threatens to start all over again."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
I quit using the ques, because either people didn't understand the mechanics, or thought it was funny to sabo the run. After 4-5 times in a row with zero reward, and longer fights, and downtime in between I decided nevermore.
So I am using private ques only now to do stfs, or pves whatever.
I guess they wanted people to fail more often , so it'd be harder to get dil and they'd buy Zen instead.
I do notice the public ques are about dead. Sad story, broken hearts, poor ending, no happy ever after.
Comments
I said 3 or 4 weeks. 12 months was on a different game.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
I think damage is already starting to be done to the game. I was hoping last Thursday's change would fix it but it clearly was not enough. Each week with the dead queues hurts the game. Not sure how much time they have to get it right but I think they're pushing it.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Yes, I am not surprised you have no interest in reality and I would sugest not accusing people of racism in public.
No, never heard about Star Trek, what is it?
You are right but things are different still!
You may grav well all you want on the flock of spheres to gain time to blow the gen but if ur team doesnt generate an average of 10kDPS/player the formal optional timer not the criteria will get you in the end.
You may have that, I may have that but not 90% of the players in game.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I'm expecting interesting patch changes today/tomorrow for the tribble server.
sig
http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/5451/om71.jpg
It is a peculiar phenomenon that we can imagine events that defy the laws of the universe.
The problem is that now the only incentive is more dps. Even if you bring the dps though some troll will pop a generator early for no reason. So it's very pointless to pug ISA.I tried to do vicious cycle it never popped. The other queues seem to be the same. Dead.
Removing the current lead designers won't change a thing. Pwe's direction has been more monetization. Squeeze the player base for all they got. I had enough, my wallet is closed.
I've only managed to bring one character to Level 60 so far. And I have plenty more to level (I'll not do them all immediately, and always focus on a few main characters ,but you get the idea.)
You are an optimist, I expect they tighten the screws.
I'm lvl 60
I have a fair amount of spec points
I have 13 mk 14 items on my ship
I have 7 mk 13 items on my ship
I have T5-u FACR
I have endgame boffs and doffs and traits
My cruiser does 25k+ dps
I am at endgame now, and I can tell you it's FAR from enough. The damage my ship does is well above the average player, by several factors infact. I can tell you the average group (pug) will NEVER reach a level that makes most advanced stf's doable. Let alone elites.
sig
http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/5451/om71.jpg
It is a peculiar phenomenon that we can imagine events that defy the laws of the universe.
If you are happy to put around normal there's no reason to upgrade. If upgrading won't allow you to complete advanced/elite anyways, why join the rat race? There's no incentive to play.
You are right.
I have 2 toons on 60, rest stuck at 54-55 due to lack of play. Upgrades are petty much done. I can provide 20k-25k builds on some of em. Other toons have other priorities.
One thing is save to say:
Neither the levelling nor the ship upgrades have anyway near an influence on the enhanced hull hit points or the fail criteria the community faces in current highest difficulty compared to what they faced 2 weeks ago.
It seems that either Cryptic deliberately wants to slow down the player from any form of progression by cutting back any in game rewards or they dont have the slightest understanding about general pve balance in thier own game.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
They'll just keep on going as if nothing happened, yelling "This is biggest success ever!" louder than before.
In the end, as always, actions will speak louder than words - if players really stop playing queued content because it isn't rewarding or fun, then the numbers will show, and Cryptic will have to react. (Not promise or evade - react).
You got that right!
> <
> <
>
Cryptic live in a world where the sky is green the grass is blue & the moon is made of cheese.
More like this...
http://imgur.com/7beQS6a
I tried the replacement for ISE on the day DR was released. Fleet Mogai with all Rommie Rep or Purple gear and SRO Boffs. Not a DPS Monster but a respectable output anyway. On Wednesday, I could hold my own in ISE and contribute towards the success of a PUG team. Heck, I could carry a bad team at least to completion in about ten minutes. I've never been one who got excited over the Optional. If I made it, great! If not well I can try again in an hour or so. On Friday, with the same ship, it felt like I was doing nothing at all. I can live with this part. New or more enemies with new techniques require me to learn and adapt to them. Takes time but I will get there.
What I refuse to accept is the now pitiful level of rewards for all of the queues. Since pwe/cryptic has decided to go this route I cannot stop them. What I can do is refuse to play in the queues. I'm not going to make any grand sweeping gestures on these forums by posting an I quit thread. What I can do without all the fanfare is reduce the time I spend playing STO. The less time I spend playing the game, the more likely it is I will not spend money on it. Which really ought to get their attention nicely.
I suspect some people who do not come to these forums feel the same way I do. Further, since they do not come here, they never saw the EP's explanation. All they saw was they leveled really fast according to something the game allowed. Then suddenly with no warning they got ganked. Without coming here, they wouldn't know what they did was "wrong". So they pressed <DEL> on STO and talked to their friends about it. Of course the friends talked as well. Of course the friends' version of the story was probably a little looser with the facts. And suddenly, STO has a bad reputation. Which the Dev Team did not have to grind for.
With people they will now never have a chance to earn any revenue from.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGnH6JPsv7E
The forums may not be a true representation of the state of the game, but it does give a good indication of how things are going. The people that come to the forums care enough to post, spend time and money in the game. Casuals may be enjoying the story content, but I don't think they will pay the bills.
Empty queues mean casuals have nothing to do. Whales can't show off all the gear they bought. The game dies because there's nothing to hold anyone's interest.
If the first go around in fixing the advanced queues is any indication, things are not going great. Numbers can't be that great, so let's see if they make a second pass. If not I will enjoy some sunshine.
so downloading that now :P
system Lord Baal is dead
There is pride here, I wouldn't expect them to admit to anything.
They might tune them, but I have a feeling they're taking this as a wait and see approach, which, I think is fair it's still fairly new.
If anything, there isn't enough of a population to support the now way too many queues. Heck, there were too many queues well prior to DR, many of them were dead then. PUG-ing is all but gone.
China is a single-party communist country. Every chinese business is either majority-owned by the government or operates at their pleasure (bribes). They will be using your money to fund militarized expansion across the Asia-Pacific region. So yeah it matters.
that's not necessarily true, there has been research that showed casuals/average players in general account for half of a f2p game profits, while whales account for the other half, while i'll admit that due to star trek "unique" fanbase, the whales might account for more than half of the profits on STO case, losing casuals will hurt cryptic's(and PWE) bottom line anyway.
I'de prefer the advanced missions be exactly like the old elites, with 2 changes : 35-50% more HP on the enemy and the optional made mandatory.
That leaves plenty of room to carry an occasional noob or a few lowbie cruisers. Let the l33ts have their nightmare mode, leave the advanced queues for the transitional players and casuals.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
My character Tsin'xing
I think other countries have waged aggressive warfare without cause in a similar manner as China with Tibet - hmm what was that country who did so recently?? I can't quite remember.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
So I am using private ques only now to do stfs, or pves whatever.
I guess they wanted people to fail more often , so it'd be harder to get dil and they'd buy Zen instead.
I do notice the public ques are about dead. Sad story, broken hearts, poor ending, no happy ever after.