If we go by canon, Feds get fancy new ships and variety because canon says they embrace and advance their vessels and technology. KDF canon says they reuse the same ship designs over and over and only give them under-the-hood upgades based on what they've reverse-engineered, and only use newer ships if certain tech won't work with what they have, or if it's the standard ships of a race they've conquered.
Releasing upper Tier reskins and loadouts won't work; KDF players will complain about Cryptic being lazy. Releasing original designs will have KDF players complain about "MUH canon designs". Doesn't help either that KDF has technically long been the written bad guys from the start, and has less race variety (never with the option to play as some member of a formerly enslaved or "inferior" KDF-controlled or captured race working up the KDF ladder the hard way), and there hasn't been much in the way of any new warrior/slaver/underworld race being taken over by the Klingons to help add new ship variety.
Klingons have basically been written into a dead end. They will probably at some point become part of a larger Imperial Federation Republic (possibly an oxymoron), though it will probably not change what starting faction a player could choose from; it would just mean that at some late season and future Tier; KDF players will finally have access to Fed ships and equipment, and Feds would have access to KDF ships and equipment. Let's say a theoretical universal Tier 8 or 9 where all ships in-game can be accessed and used by both sides; including some upgraded refitted retrofit copies of older tier ships just for the purists to use.
Replacing KDF with the Romulan Star Empire will just result in a faction even worse than the KDF; since from the outset they're just as much of the bad guy the Klingons used to be, but with even fewer ship choices. And would require way too much time and effort to create a faction who's missions are tied exclusively to doing the opposite of all the other factions, which would ultimately make them a pure PvP faction, but without access to STFs or certain PvE areas due to storyline differences.
I started back in beta, KDF was awful, today its a hell of a lot better. Legacy of Romulus added a great set of missions at the start that I think was better written, and more fun than the Romulan and Federation starter experience.
The hard truth is that most people aren't into playing KDF.
Cryptic can't force people to play a faction, and if the lights are to stay on, they need to sell to the masses.
It's not malice, some conspiracy or vindictive. These are human beings working at jobs, and anyone who reads these accusations will let irritation slip into interviews, and these accusations have been around since day one.
What should happen is simple, easing blocks to cross faction grouping so FRIENDS can play with friends removes faction issues. I love my kdf characters, but my friends all went fed. They don't want to reroll, STO is very effective at getting you attached to a character and crew.
When people can group with friends regardless of faction or even join fleets, then there is less worry about not getting to play what you want with who you want. The last few years of exclusivity in factions has hurt the kdf , its time to try something new.
obscure trek canon puts the klingons in bed with the federation not far into the future as one big federation, so with d'tan's romulans and remans looking to unite with the vulcans, its not out of the possibility the republic would join the federation as well.
thats all i got.
Not sure about 'obscure' and might already be mentioned...
Isn't the Klingon Empire becoming part of the Federation referenced in the Enterprise episode 'Azanti Prime', during Archer's first encounter with the Temporal Agent Daniels, where he shows Archer the Enterprise J?
Cryptic can't force people to play a faction, and if the lights are to stay on, they need to sell to the masses.
It's a no win situation with the KDF though I fear. One the one hand, Cryptic don't want to invest in the KDF because there aren't enough people playing KDF, but then a lot of people likely don't play KDF because Cryptic wont invest in it. Someone has to make the first move, and as a business, I'd say it's down to Cryptic to try and help their case.
A merging with the Republic is not the answer. If anything, the Republic has only further alienated the KDF. I bet (by comparison) that a fair number of people who created a Romulan character chose FED as their allegiance.
Apart from the limitations that the KDF have (costumes and hair options, as insignificant as that may seem) the one thing that truly irritates me is all the shared missions. You've got KDF players doing FED themed missions. Everything (of scale) is created for the FED, and then edited for the KDF. New Romulus was done this way, Nimbus III was done this way, the whole Dyson Sphere (and missions within) was done this way, and I haven't played them yet, but I'd expect that the whole Delta Quadrant setup is also done this way.
There's no individual feel for each faction. The missions, quests and surroundings should be extremely catered for the faction from which we are playing, and they're not. It wouldn't surprise me if this further adds to the fact that most people play FED, cause aside from the KDF specific story missions, the whole reputation system is exactly the same, regardless of which faction you're playing.
Hey, hate to say it , but nothing there is so 'tribal' that it isn't supported with objective evidence. with 18% of the game's population according to Cryptic's own numbers, better than a third of the lockbox ships, and Jem'Hadar ships from doffing, sport "IKS" headers. a visit to areas with a LOT of KDF and you'll see a lot of "Warrior's Decorated Skirt", Tholian scarves, crystalline swords, Nausicaan swords, etc. etc. on the ground, there's an entire FLEET dedicated to Ferasans (You can't gen a Ferasan without buying it in the C-store first), Guramba destroyers over Ker'rat, lots of players KDF side lean on the Leech (only available through zen purchase on the KDF side), there are a selection of KDF fleets at Tier 5, including some small ones, Proportionally, we grind, and spend more than players whose focus is Federation.
I believe the item highlighted is available through the exchange too?
Hey, hate to say it , but nothing there is so 'tribal' that it isn't supported with objective evidence. with 18% of the game's population according to Cryptic's own numbers, better than a third of the lockbox ships, and Jem'Hadar ships from doffing, sport "IKS" headers. a visit to areas with a LOT of KDF and you'll see a lot of "Warrior's Decorated Skirt", Tholian scarves, crystalline swords, Nausicaan swords, etc. etc. on the ground, there's an entire FLEET dedicated to Ferasans (You can't gen a Ferasan without buying it in the C-store first), Guramba destroyers over Ker'rat, lots of players KDF side lean on the Leech (only available through zen purchase on the KDF side), there are a selection of KDF fleets at Tier 5, including some small ones, Proportionally, we grind, and spend more than players whose focus is Federation.
Cryptic decided we weren't profitable after the fiasco with the Bortasque-a ship that is gimped hard, even compared to Federation standard Cruisers.
but in general, taken proportionally, KDF spends a LOT more money than Fed does.
with a far, far, more limited collection of things to buy, and the lingering and intensifying impacts of constant neglect from the development end dating back to release.
If you go back through the years since game release, you'll find that KDF players have good reasons to be suspicious of Cryptic's motives, and to feel singled out for unearned hostility, which in turn, feeds this 'tribalism' you're pooh-poohing.
when you add in comments by staff members including Rivera, to the effect that "..KDF was a mistake..." and "...could disappear without any effect..." and maybe there's something to it beyond just reviewing their handling. Kind of edges things away from "Incompetence" back toward "Malice."
You used the term "objective evidence" and then laid out a bunch of anecdotal observations that you puff up into seeming like broad trends and blanket assertions.
He left, shortly thereafter, Geko took the stats for the KDF battlecruiser that was being worked on, slapped a half-assed "Just almost a violation of copyright" copy of the Vengeance from the second JJ Abrams movie on it, announced that the KDF ship that was being waited for was 'rainchecked' and released the Avenger class-unasked for by the Fed community.
The Avenger is nowhere near the Vengeance in terms of design and appearance, other than the classic Constitution design principles behind them.
This is nothing more than a baseless accusation bandied about by some on the forums, dating back to the Avenger's release.
However, you are correct about the Mogh being delayed and the circumstances around it.
The devs do not seem to understand that they cannot simply stop supporting a second faction in an MMO. They will not just lose the KDF players, they will lose many FED players because the game will have less depth for everyone. KDF has been completely abandoned and so only a few still play KDF.
I can give them an easy fix. Simply merge KDF and Romulan Star Empire. There are far more romulans than Klinks, so this would create a robust second faction.
This is a bad idea. Mostly because it makes no sense from a story and in-game perspective.
Geko took the stats for the KDF battlecruiser that was being worked on, slapped a half-assed "Just almost a violation of copyright" copy of the Vengeance from the second JJ Abrams movie on it,
Take another look at the Vengeance... The Scyer, with it's negative-space saucer, has as much in common with the Vengeance as the Avenger does...
If you have access to the Fleet Assault Cruiser, mess around enough in Ship Customisation and you can actually kit-bash a ship that looks pretty close to the Vengeance, from components that predate the Vengeance... Perhaps JJ ripped off STO?
You're clutching at straws a little there I think...
I thought that STO's idea of the romulans becoming allies of either the federation or the klingons was already a strech, but to join one or the other is just ridiculous.
Well, the unfortunate truth is... multi factions only matter in PvP. When was the last time PvP mattered in STO?
I have to partly agree with this, since PvP is such a tiny little aspect of this game and since PvP can be FvF...PvP means little to this game.
They only care about their cash cow and that will never change it's obvious.
Romulans are the new KDF...they made the Bortasqu' suck and then said Klingon ships don't sell so they don't make new original ships...now they did it with Romulans and the Ar'Kif.
The KDF hasn't gotten anything original in years, and now the RR hasn't gotten anything in over a year, which is sad since the Republic isn't even two years old.
They made the Romulans powerful to sell and now that they sold they are discarded like the KDF.....
Simple fact nothing is going to happen...KDF or RR isn't going to improve and that's the end of the story.
OP, your 'easy fix' is short sighted and incorrect. I play KDF. I prefer playing KDF. I've no interest in being part of D'Tan's Republic. Nor, I strongly suspect, do the majority of the players who play Fed-aligned Rommies want to suddenly find themselves arbitrarily part of the Empire. Merging factions is a really dumb idea. Might be the dumbest I've read this week.
A six year old boy and his starship. Living the dream.
The Avenger is nowhere near the Vengeance in terms of design and appearance, other than the classic Constitution design principles behind them.
While I agree that the looks of the Avenger and Vengeance are quite different, I'd still debate about Cryptic's intent behind the ship.
First of all, it was made out of thin air without any indication that such ship would be made and while everyone expected the new Klingon battlecruiser announced by dStahl in June 2013, following a series of threads by people literally crying for the Vengeance. I say "crying" because they were told on multiple ocassions that liscencing issues prevent it and they still wouln't stop. And boom, out of nowhere, the most powerfull Fed cruiser yet, the first battlecruiser actually pops up.
Secondly, why would this ship of all Fed ships be given a black hull? Why the black hull if this ship isn't suposed to remind someone of something? Federation ships don't have black hulls, no Federation ship in STO before the Avenger had access to a stock black hull material.
But to me, the name was a dead giveaway for the intent behind the ship. Under normal circumistances maybe not as much, but they actually went on and renamed an existing ship so they can give the name "Avenger" to this one. Again, if the ship is not suposed to represent something to someone, why was naming it "Avenger" so important that they had to rename a Star Cruiser in order for this one to claim the name? Why just don't call it something, anything else?
The situation with the Avenger is much like the Tal'Shiar ships. They're not the Narada, but one look at them and it's obvious what they're suposed to represent and who they need to shut up and milk. And again, a dead giveaway in the form of a "shrapnel torpedo".
The intent is pretty obvious in my book even though the looks is not as much of a "copy-paste" job and even though I agree with the player that said the Scryer fits the visual description much better.
I believe the item highlighted is available through the exchange too?
If you mean the Plasmonic Leach? (Sorry my old tired eyes couldnt pick out the textl) you are most correct, but that version is only available to Federation aligned characters. KDF can only aquire it via the Zen Store.
Then again, a KDF toon could farm the dilithium to convert to Zen to buy the ship.. So it is all much of a sameness really.
*Edit
Which im guessing was probably your original point also, as it is 1 of the best, if not THE best, universal console in game, KDF have it better. Once the Zen ship is purchased (800zen currently) it is an unlimited supply of the console for any KDF toon rolled on that account. That makes that particular point redundant for the other chaps argument!
Secondly, why would this ship of all Fed ships be given a black hull? Why the black hull if this ship isn't suposed to remind someone of something? Federation ships don't have black hulls, no Federation ship in STO before the Avenger had access to a stock black hull material.
There's 'black' material for most other Federation ships, perhaps not as black as the Avenger, however the Avenger's colour scheme is very reminiscent of most of the CStore Refits, including the Galaxy and Assault Cruiser...
To me it appeared to be a natural extension of these colour schemes...
Not sure about 'obscure' and might already be mentioned...
Isn't the Klingon Empire becoming part of the Federation referenced in the Enterprise episode 'Azanti Prime', during Archer's first encounter with the Temporal Agent Daniels, where he shows Archer the Enterprise J?
its one minor reference to it and not very well known it seems, that makes it obscure.
its Azati btw and it is from that episode. i couldnt really find a direct reference to it from mem alpha other then this:
There's 'black' material for most other Federation ships, perhaps not as black as the Avenger, however the Avenger's colour scheme is very reminiscent of most of the CStore Refits, including the Galaxy and Assault Cruiser...
To me it appeared to be a natural extension of these colour schemes...
Uhm....nope, there wasn't a black material before the Avenger. I suspect you refer to the Type 4, which is the NX-Class metal-like grey, darker but not black. When you put the Type 4 on the NX-Class it's very obvious that it's the hull material derived from ENT.
And you're wrong about the refits as well. The refits have access to Cryptic's 25-century era Type 6 hull material. That is quite different and has nothing to do with the Avenger's unique complete black with blue windows. In fact, the Avenger has access to the Type 6 as any other 25-century C-Store ship, but aditionally has access to the unique Avenger black hull.
Not sure about 'obscure' and might already be mentioned...
Isn't the Klingon Empire becoming part of the Federation referenced in the Enterprise episode 'Azanti Prime', during Archer's first encounter with the Temporal Agent Daniels, where he shows Archer the Enterprise J?
Well putting aside the fact that it's Enterprise for a moment...
Yes, Daniels does say that. In at least one possible future where the Sphere Builders weren't stopped and had taken over a good portion of the galaxy, the Klingons had joined the Federation...by the 26th century that is.
Key word: 26th century.
We're still in the early 25th century. So EVEN if the Klingons do join the Federation by that point, it does NOT EQUAL to them joining the Federation while STO is still around.
Besides, it won't happen for one other reason: That would require putting WORK into the KDF, and they won't do that.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Well putting aside the fact that it's Enterprise for a moment...
Yes, Daniels does say that. In at least one possible future where the Sphere Builders weren't stopped and had taken over a good portion of the galaxy, the Klingons had joined the Federation...by the 26th century that is.
Key word: 26th century.
We're still in the early 25th century. So EVEN if the Klingons do join the Federation by that point, it does NOT EQUAL to them joining the Federation while STO is still around.
Besides, it won't happen for one other reason: That would require putting WORK into the KDF, and they won't do that.
that doesnt demolish the idea of a solid alliance at some point in sto canon so it ultimately aims towards a future for the klingons and the federation that would involves "being god damn heroes!".
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Isn't the Klingon Empire becoming part of the Federation referenced in the Enterprise episode 'Azanti Prime', during Archer's first encounter with the Temporal Agent Daniels, where he shows Archer the Enterprise J?
We've just entered the 25th Century. For all we know, the Klingon Empire (likely minus the Orion Syndicate) don't join the Federation until the late 26th Century; that's some 190(ish) years away yet, long after the current story and our existing heroes are long dead.
On the plus, if the Klingons join the Federation in the 26th Century, then our lovely little alliance is going to succeed in their war against the Iconians - how do we know? - cause we're still around in the 26th Century. :P
that doesnt demolish the idea of a solid alliance at some point in sto canon so it ultimately aims towards a future for the klingons and the federation that would involves "being god damn heroes!".
The problem is, the Klingon Empire is seemingly unpredictable. How many times before have we had an alliance (solid or otherwise) that has fallen apart? For all we know, the Klingons leave the Federation in the 27th Century. :P
doubtful of leaving especially if the klingons value a honorable sacrifice for a good reason and if it shocks them enough it would be enough to change their minds altogether. it just requires that one big thing that would be enough to make em realize that having a solid friend is better then fighting an unwinnable fight that could end them for good, as kahless once said "Destroying an empire to win a war is no victory and ending a battle to save an empire is no defeat.".
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
what, you... okay now, who detected the Undine threat, and did something about it?
The Klingons.
who sent forces to help the Deferi even though they themselves weren't under direct threat and had not yet been attacked by the borg-in the middle of a war with someone bigger-because the Deferi were allied once to the Empire, a long time ago, even though they've been neutrals/noncontributors since?
The Klingons.
Who got betrayed by their principal and largest "Ally", yet lets the Fed PC's go time and again because...HONOR! ?
The Klingons.
who did not fall for an Undine trick and commit a war crime by attacking a medical research site unprovoked?
The Klingons.
Who sent their best, most elite, forces to fight in alliance with the people they were nominally at war with, time and again, when it would've been easier to stand back and finish them off after the Borg and other forces had reduced their strength?
The Klingons.
Who stripped their defensive forces to help Earth when the Undine attacked ESD, leaving their homeworld nearly defenseless (check hte mission, kids-guess who was FIRST to step up?)
The Kllingons.
The Klingon Defense Force are the big-damn-heroes in STO. Heroes are pro-Active. Heroes challenge the odds, Heroes step up even when they have less tech, less bodies, less gear, when the odds are bad.
Big Damn Heroes do what must be done even when their so-called 'friends' refuse to see it.
The Federation broke the Khitomer Accords. Twice.
correct.
that had nothing to do with the federation. invalid point and thrown out.
what?
alright time for you to find some links, its getting more confusing as you go along.
your forgetting romulans and the klingons were as much a part of the quadrants affairs as the federation.
depends on your perspective, if your a fed you get fed help and the useless captain koren as well. and dont forget it was the federation who saved your qo'nos from those same monsters.
the klingons are just one power, its not by any means the biggest or best.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Comments
Still waiting to be able to use forum titles
Or, post-50 everyone is in the Delta Faction. Making 1-50 basically a tutorial.
Releasing upper Tier reskins and loadouts won't work; KDF players will complain about Cryptic being lazy. Releasing original designs will have KDF players complain about "MUH canon designs". Doesn't help either that KDF has technically long been the written bad guys from the start, and has less race variety (never with the option to play as some member of a formerly enslaved or "inferior" KDF-controlled or captured race working up the KDF ladder the hard way), and there hasn't been much in the way of any new warrior/slaver/underworld race being taken over by the Klingons to help add new ship variety.
Klingons have basically been written into a dead end. They will probably at some point become part of a larger Imperial Federation Republic (possibly an oxymoron), though it will probably not change what starting faction a player could choose from; it would just mean that at some late season and future Tier; KDF players will finally have access to Fed ships and equipment, and Feds would have access to KDF ships and equipment. Let's say a theoretical universal Tier 8 or 9 where all ships in-game can be accessed and used by both sides; including some upgraded refitted retrofit copies of older tier ships just for the purists to use.
Replacing KDF with the Romulan Star Empire will just result in a faction even worse than the KDF; since from the outset they're just as much of the bad guy the Klingons used to be, but with even fewer ship choices. And would require way too much time and effort to create a faction who's missions are tied exclusively to doing the opposite of all the other factions, which would ultimately make them a pure PvP faction, but without access to STFs or certain PvE areas due to storyline differences.
The hard truth is that most people aren't into playing KDF.
Cryptic can't force people to play a faction, and if the lights are to stay on, they need to sell to the masses.
It's not malice, some conspiracy or vindictive. These are human beings working at jobs, and anyone who reads these accusations will let irritation slip into interviews, and these accusations have been around since day one.
What should happen is simple, easing blocks to cross faction grouping so FRIENDS can play with friends removes faction issues. I love my kdf characters, but my friends all went fed. They don't want to reroll, STO is very effective at getting you attached to a character and crew.
When people can group with friends regardless of faction or even join fleets, then there is less worry about not getting to play what you want with who you want. The last few years of exclusivity in factions has hurt the kdf , its time to try something new.
Not sure about 'obscure' and might already be mentioned...
Isn't the Klingon Empire becoming part of the Federation referenced in the Enterprise episode 'Azanti Prime', during Archer's first encounter with the Temporal Agent Daniels, where he shows Archer the Enterprise J?
And there you have it ladies and gentlemen - confirmation from the OP himself that this is, in fact, a troll thread.
A merging with the Republic is not the answer. If anything, the Republic has only further alienated the KDF. I bet (by comparison) that a fair number of people who created a Romulan character chose FED as their allegiance.
Apart from the limitations that the KDF have (costumes and hair options, as insignificant as that may seem) the one thing that truly irritates me is all the shared missions. You've got KDF players doing FED themed missions. Everything (of scale) is created for the FED, and then edited for the KDF. New Romulus was done this way, Nimbus III was done this way, the whole Dyson Sphere (and missions within) was done this way, and I haven't played them yet, but I'd expect that the whole Delta Quadrant setup is also done this way.
There's no individual feel for each faction. The missions, quests and surroundings should be extremely catered for the faction from which we are playing, and they're not. It wouldn't surprise me if this further adds to the fact that most people play FED, cause aside from the KDF specific story missions, the whole reputation system is exactly the same, regardless of which faction you're playing.
I believe the item highlighted is available through the exchange too?
You used the term "objective evidence" and then laid out a bunch of anecdotal observations that you puff up into seeming like broad trends and blanket assertions.
The plural of anecdote is not data.
The Avenger is nowhere near the Vengeance in terms of design and appearance, other than the classic Constitution design principles behind them.
This is nothing more than a baseless accusation bandied about by some on the forums, dating back to the Avenger's release.
However, you are correct about the Mogh being delayed and the circumstances around it.
This is a bad idea. Mostly because it makes no sense from a story and in-game perspective.
Take another look at the Vengeance... The Scyer, with it's negative-space saucer, has as much in common with the Vengeance as the Avenger does...
If you have access to the Fleet Assault Cruiser, mess around enough in Ship Customisation and you can actually kit-bash a ship that looks pretty close to the Vengeance, from components that predate the Vengeance... Perhaps JJ ripped off STO?
You're clutching at straws a little there I think...
I have to partly agree with this, since PvP is such a tiny little aspect of this game and since PvP can be FvF...PvP means little to this game.
They only care about their cash cow and that will never change it's obvious.
Romulans are the new KDF...they made the Bortasqu' suck and then said Klingon ships don't sell so they don't make new original ships...now they did it with Romulans and the Ar'Kif.
The KDF hasn't gotten anything original in years, and now the RR hasn't gotten anything in over a year, which is sad since the Republic isn't even two years old.
They made the Romulans powerful to sell and now that they sold they are discarded like the KDF.....
Simple fact nothing is going to happen...KDF or RR isn't going to improve and that's the end of the story.
While I agree that the looks of the Avenger and Vengeance are quite different, I'd still debate about Cryptic's intent behind the ship.
First of all, it was made out of thin air without any indication that such ship would be made and while everyone expected the new Klingon battlecruiser announced by dStahl in June 2013, following a series of threads by people literally crying for the Vengeance. I say "crying" because they were told on multiple ocassions that liscencing issues prevent it and they still wouln't stop. And boom, out of nowhere, the most powerfull Fed cruiser yet, the first battlecruiser actually pops up.
Secondly, why would this ship of all Fed ships be given a black hull? Why the black hull if this ship isn't suposed to remind someone of something? Federation ships don't have black hulls, no Federation ship in STO before the Avenger had access to a stock black hull material.
But to me, the name was a dead giveaway for the intent behind the ship. Under normal circumistances maybe not as much, but they actually went on and renamed an existing ship so they can give the name "Avenger" to this one. Again, if the ship is not suposed to represent something to someone, why was naming it "Avenger" so important that they had to rename a Star Cruiser in order for this one to claim the name? Why just don't call it something, anything else?
The situation with the Avenger is much like the Tal'Shiar ships. They're not the Narada, but one look at them and it's obvious what they're suposed to represent and who they need to shut up and milk. And again, a dead giveaway in the form of a "shrapnel torpedo".
The intent is pretty obvious in my book even though the looks is not as much of a "copy-paste" job and even though I agree with the player that said the Scryer fits the visual description much better.
If you mean the Plasmonic Leach? (Sorry my old tired eyes couldnt pick out the textl) you are most correct, but that version is only available to Federation aligned characters. KDF can only aquire it via the Zen Store.
Then again, a KDF toon could farm the dilithium to convert to Zen to buy the ship.. So it is all much of a sameness really.
*Edit
Which im guessing was probably your original point
There's 'black' material for most other Federation ships, perhaps not as black as the Avenger, however the Avenger's colour scheme is very reminiscent of most of the CStore Refits, including the Galaxy and Assault Cruiser...
To me it appeared to be a natural extension of these colour schemes...
its one minor reference to it and not very well known it seems, that makes it obscure.
its Azati btw and it is from that episode. i couldnt really find a direct reference to it from mem alpha other then this:
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/26th_century
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Uhm....nope, there wasn't a black material before the Avenger. I suspect you refer to the Type 4, which is the NX-Class metal-like grey, darker but not black. When you put the Type 4 on the NX-Class it's very obvious that it's the hull material derived from ENT.
And you're wrong about the refits as well. The refits have access to Cryptic's 25-century era Type 6 hull material. That is quite different and has nothing to do with the Avenger's unique complete black with blue windows. In fact, the Avenger has access to the Type 6 as any other 25-century C-Store ship, but aditionally has access to the unique Avenger black hull.
Well putting aside the fact that it's Enterprise for a moment...
Yes, Daniels does say that. In at least one possible future where the Sphere Builders weren't stopped and had taken over a good portion of the galaxy, the Klingons had joined the Federation...by the 26th century that is.
Key word: 26th century.
We're still in the early 25th century. So EVEN if the Klingons do join the Federation by that point, it does NOT EQUAL to them joining the Federation while STO is still around.
Besides, it won't happen for one other reason: That would require putting WORK into the KDF, and they won't do that.
that doesnt demolish the idea of a solid alliance at some point in sto canon so it ultimately aims towards a future for the klingons and the federation that would involves "being god damn heroes!".
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
On the plus, if the Klingons join the Federation in the 26th Century, then our lovely little alliance is going to succeed in their war against the Iconians - how do we know? - cause we're still around in the 26th Century. :P
And what was wrong with Enterprise? Loved the show. It was a better and more true example of humanity than anything we saw in any of the other shows.
I'd point you in the direction of the latest KDF clothing - some of which was given to us all free of charge. Just sayin'
It's minimal, but it's there.
The problem is, the Klingon Empire is seemingly unpredictable. How many times before have we had an alliance (solid or otherwise) that has fallen apart? For all we know, the Klingons leave the Federation in the 27th Century. :P
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
correct.
that had nothing to do with the federation. invalid point and thrown out.
what?
alright time for you to find some links, its getting more confusing as you go along.
your forgetting romulans and the klingons were as much a part of the quadrants affairs as the federation.
depends on your perspective, if your a fed you get fed help and the useless captain koren as well. and dont forget it was the federation who saved your qo'nos from those same monsters.
the klingons are just one power, its not by any means the biggest or best.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.