^To say Voyager is weaker than a Constitution class is ridiculous, but as the Video was trying to emphasize Voyager is weaker than a Galaxy class. The D7 in Voyager was obviously modified as it had been in the Delta Quadrant for a while, also Voyager does NOT have as many firing arrays as it is a Science exploration ship, which did not really become tactical until they added the ablative armor and Borg torpedoes. Then the Slipstream drive was added and that made it even more capable. If 7 OF 9 had never been on Voyager than it probably wouldn't have made it out of the Delta Quadrant.
Obviously.
The Klingon ship pulled into the established Klingon Starbase and got some upgrades in the Delta Quadrant :cool:
It is indeed an awkwardly cute, tiny little ship, that's for sure.
JamJamz!!!
Make me a KDF ship that looks/draws inspiration from a submarine with an added Klingon touch and not only will I buy it, but I'll send you a crate of the best beer we've got here!
^To say Voyager is weaker than a Constitution class is ridiculous, but as the Video was trying to emphasize Voyager is weaker than a Galaxy class. The D7 in Voyager was obviously modified as it had been in the Delta Quadrant for a while, also Voyager does NOT have as many firing arrays as it is a Science exploration ship, which did not really become tactical until they added the ablative armor and Borg torpedoes. Then the Slipstream drive was added and that made it even more capable. If 7 OF 9 had never been on Voyager than it probably wouldn't have made it out of the Delta Quadrant.
Also that video wasn't honestly put together. many scenes of the episodes used were cut out or important facts in the episodes were ignored that would disprove the posters video rant.
Yeah I gave that video of his a watch a while back. It's nice. Really, it is. Good comedy, nice mockery of blatant TNG fanboyism and manipulative dishonest editing, and total ignorance of the fact that offensive and defensive capabilities have always been in an arms race, and always will be.
tactical abiliities that in onscreen canon where inferior to a constitution.
lmao. yea, this is true.
lol, this guy is a nut.. he has a video on youtube depicting what he thinks is voyager being weaker than a connie.. and anyone who argues a good point as to why its not a valid argument, he just ignores, or keeps throwing fluff around..
dude, that old klink cruiser, was more than likely very upgraded as well.. what do you think a ship full of Klingons are going to do for as long as they were out there.. lol...
by your logic, the connie is tuffer than the galaxy as well. since the ent. d was taken out by a Klingon vessel that could fire through its shields, and the ent. a, survived such an attack...
please keep your garbage off these forums..
now that being said lol... in voyager, belana torres commented that the dauntless was a lean vessel, meaning it didn't really have armaments, or defences, but was built to go fast in lew of said missing systems.. those are pretty much her exact words as well...
so if the dauntless was done right, it would be more of a show piece, rather than a viable endgame ship.. but it will probably be the cats meow and the most powerfull thing in the quadrant (knowing cryptic).
^To say Voyager is weaker than a Constitution class is ridiculous, but as the Video was trying to emphasize Voyager is weaker than a Galaxy class. The D7 in Voyager was obviously modified as it had been in the Delta Quadrant for a while, also Voyager does NOT have as many firing arrays as it is a Science exploration ship, which did not really become tactical until they added the ablative armor and Borg torpedoes. Then the Slipstream drive was added and that made it even more capable. If 7 OF 9 had never been on Voyager than it probably wouldn't have made it out of the Delta Quadrant.
except voyager did pretty well for herself before 7 of nine.. voyager was not a science vessel.. I have watched every episode looking and listening (since this has been argued before here) for evidence of such.. everytime the crew refers to what the ship was designed for, it is usually tactical based. harry kim makes several statements, janeway does, and tom paris..
in other episodes, 7 of 9 (while building the stellar cartography lab that also doubled as an astrometrics lab) said that since she added the lab, voyager would be able to carry out far more scientific and exploratory missions.
not too many science vessels are built with 13 phaser arrays, 4 torpedo tubes and a wide array of torpedos like she had.. she also had been built to menuever like no other ship her size (which is useless in scientific and exploratory missions) and in several episodes, they had to create labs and facilities to carry out a scientific mission or need. not to mention, more than half her crew were engineers and operations personel.. there wasn't a whole lot of blue shirts on board.. there are actual counts of what was seen on screne, as compared with the crew size. Christ, most of there blue shirts came from either chokatays crew, or the crew of the equinox.
while I wont say she wasn't capable of being an explorer/science ship, its also a far stretch to say she was a science vessel.. she was more than likely designed as a patrol vessel (policing systems from piracy, and watching the boarders, but also being equipped to explore anything they came across).
like I said, for a science vessel, she was woefully under equipped.. as a patrol vessel, she did her job pretty good, since she didn't lose too many fights..
except voyager did pretty well for herself before 7 of nine.. voyager was not a science vessel.. I have watched every episode looking and listening (since this has been argued before here) for evidence of such.. everytime the crew refers to what the ship was designed for, it is usually tactical based. harry kim makes several statements, janeway does, and tom paris..
in other episodes, 7 of 9 (while building the stellar cartography lab that also doubled as an astrometrics lab) said that since she added the lab, voyager would be able to carry out far more scientific and exploratory missions.
not too many science vessels are built with 13 phaser arrays, 4 torpedo tubes and a wide array of torpedos like she had.. she also had been built to menuever like no other ship her size (which is useless in scientific and exploratory missions) and in several episodes, they had to create labs and facilities to carry out a scientific mission or need. not to mention, more than half her crew were engineers and operations personel.. there wasn't a whole lot of blue shirts on board.. there are actual counts of what was seen on screne, as compared with the crew size. Christ, most of there blue shirts came from either chokatays crew, or the crew of the equinox.
while I wont say she wasn't capable of being an explorer/science ship, its also a far stretch to say she was a science vessel.. she was more than likely designed as a patrol vessel (policing systems from piracy, and watching the boarders, but also being equipped to explore anything they came across).
like I said, for a science vessel, she was woefully under equipped.. as a patrol vessel, she did her job pretty good, since she didn't lose too many fights..
Yes to all of this. Also worth noting her first mission was essentially to patrol the Badlands.
Well, true, it's not a "done deal"... but, thanks to Priority One offering the audio from BOTH the panel and the "info dump" Q&A, I was just reading between the lines. Here's my line of thinking:
1. Clearly, X2 has strong ties to Voyager and the Delta Quadrant.
2. In the panel, someone asked about science ships. Geko and the panel responded with the crafting system allowing you to upgrade your ship without a fleet. There is also new ships coming out, especially this new tactical science vessel (similar to the Tactical Vesta). Geko also said that there is a very special T6 ship coming that we have seen from the Delta Quadrant. It also seems to be a science vessel.
Could be anything, of course... but it sure didn't sound like it would be an obscure alien ship. It sounded like it would be a FED ship, but we've seen it before... what Starfleet ships did we see in Voyager? The Prometheus (check), the Equinox & Rhode Island (check check), the other obvious canon ships (obvious check)... then, there's the Dauntless, the Starfleet ship that wasn't a Starfleet ship.
A stretch? Maybe, but like I said, it sure seems like there's room for it.
My hope is that we get a new more tactically focused intrepid similar to what the Regent did with the Soverign.
We saw that in the Delta quadrant, and it's a science vessel as far as STO is concerned.
Yeah I don't really take that as hard canon though. That means the Millenium Falcon is canon to Star Trek too.
While the logic is sound, however the Millennium Falcon cameo is so far away that someone could easily create a new ship or shuttle that looks similar from long range that could easily negate what you said. However, the Dauntless was easily identified at the Battle of Procyon V.
With Trek canon, like others suggested over the years, that Starfleet Adapted the design. But with STO, Starfleet could've recreated the Dauntless and used it for understanding Slipstream technology. Or now that we are returning to the Delta Quadrant, maybe we find the original Dauntless. Maybe Arturis really didn't get assimilated like we thought at the end of VOY: Hope and Fear, and forgave Starfleet after he learned Janeway was the one responsible for defeating the Borg and thus saving his people. So he gave the Dauntless to Starfleet in repentance. And with the original Dauntless, Starfleet could now master Slipstream Technology with new generation ships that allow longer-range Slipstream travel and deeper Galactic exploration.
Having Starfleet recreate a ship that an alien created to look similar to Starfleet's ships makes far more sense than a Starfleet ship from another timeline (Galaxy-X).
:rolleyes:
It does huh? So Starfleet stealing some design a alien made to trick Starfleet officers into using makes more sense than a ship which there is no evidence you can possibly provide that wouldn't be designed in the Prime timeline huh?
32 years later and they haven't made the faux Federation ship, but things in this alternate timeline have come to pass, the Federation was at war with the Klingons which only just ended, Worf went to the Empire, The Romulan Empire was decimated...not in the same way but still.
Then I suppose it should upset you that the Olympic class is in game right? Same with Transphasic Torpedoes and the Ablative Generator right? Because there is no way they could have been designed in a timeline alternate from that Admiral Janeway's?
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
And I think it's there for the same reason you see Mirandas and Excelsiors in the battles against the Dominion and Borg... re-using an existing model to save on production costs.
Well.. Are you going to pretend said Mirandas and Excelsiors weren't used in the Dominion wars?
Don't look silly... Don't call it the "Z-Store/Zen Store"...
I want a 22nd century Steamrunner and a T-5 Millennium Falcon...
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Considering we have the MF, Lightsabers, Yoda payed the game a visit and R2D2 was in a parallel universe, I don't think thats an unreasonable pretense.
Don't look silly... Don't call it the "Z-Store/Zen Store"...
And I think it's there for the same reason you see Mirandas and Excelsiors in the battles against the Dominion and Borg... re-using an existing model to save on production costs.
So what if they are reused models?
It's not like we saw a Miranda or Excelsior still being used in the 26th Century. :rolleyes:
It's not like we saw a Miranda or Excelsior still being used in the 26th Century. :rolleyes:
Yes, because with how fickle the Starfleet core of engineers are and how we know they love building bigger and better things will not only be using a alien designed ship a 150 years later they will also be using the Prometheus and Nova.
Not to mention I guess the Sphere Builders just happen to make identical designs to Delta Quadrant races from a 150 years ago :rolleyes:
Was nothing but reuse of old models...
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
Yes, because with how fickle the Starfleet core of engineers are and how we know they love building bigger and better things will not only be using a alien designed ship a 150 years later they will also be using the Prometheus and Nova.
Not to mention I guess the Sphere Builders just happen to make identical designs to Delta Quadrant races from a 150 years ago :rolleyes:
Was nothing but reuse of old models...
Yes, your logic holds.........when we are flying around in NX recreations, ships that were decommissioned over a 100 years ago, and captaining alien ships we "found". :rolleyes:
And I see no ill logic about them reusing the Prometheus and Nova, when the Galaxy-class was listed at having a 200 year life span in the tech manuals.
But if you don't like Star Trek reusing models, then I suggest you march over to CBS's HQ and demand they stop doing that! And Cryptic, you heard this guy! Better not reuse those same models or else he's going to stomp his feet!
Yes, your logic holds.........when we are flying around in NX recreations, ships that were decommissioned over a 100 years ago, and captaining alien ships we "found". :rolleyes:
And I see no ill logic about them reusing the Prometheus and Nova, when the Galaxy-class was listed at having a 200 year life span in the tech manuals.
But if you don't like Star Trek reusing models, then I suggest you march over to CBS's HQ and demand they stop doing that! And Cryptic, you heard this guy! Better not reuse those same models or else he's going to stomp his feet!
Funny? I thought STO isn't canon?
A recreation that is inferior in every way to a real ship, would be like me recreating the Wright brother plain, sure it can fly but it's there for nothing more but nostalgia or admiring our past, but that Wright brothers plain sure as heck isn't going to get me into the future.
Funny you say 200 years but all I've ever seen over the forums and other places is over 100...just like the Nova and the Prometheus I've seen is less than 100.
Can't have a honest conversation because of a white knight with power
It does huh? So Starfleet stealing some design a alien made to trick Starfleet officers into using makes more sense than a ship which there is no evidence you can possibly provide that wouldn't be designed in the Prime timeline huh?
It is the phaser lance and the cloaking device that are the problem. I have no problem with a Starfleet ship that looks the same as a ship from another timeline. However, having two pieces of technology that are not used on other Starfleet ships is the problem. Starfleet ships should never have cloaking devices due to legality issues. The Defiant was authorized to use its cloaking device by the Romulans and the Galaxy-X came from a reality where the Romulan Star Empire was no more, but no other Defiant class ships were allowed to use a cloaking device and the Federation President has renewed the Federation's commitment to the Treaty of Algeron. No other Starfleet vessel uses the Phaser LanceTherefore, the Galaxy-X uses a piece of technology that is rarely used by the STO timeline except for on three ships and a piece of technology that is not used by any other ship. Therefore, there is no way for the Galaxy-X to be designed in the Prime timeline since the Phaser Lance would have been implemented on more ships.
Comments
Obviously.
The Klingon ship pulled into the established Klingon Starbase and got some upgrades in the Delta Quadrant :cool:
JamJamz!!!
Make me a KDF ship that looks/draws inspiration from a submarine with an added Klingon touch and not only will I buy it, but I'll send you a crate of the best beer we've got here!
Also that video wasn't honestly put together. many scenes of the episodes used were cut out or important facts in the episodes were ignored that would disprove the posters video rant.
[/SIGPIC]
lol, this guy is a nut.. he has a video on youtube depicting what he thinks is voyager being weaker than a connie.. and anyone who argues a good point as to why its not a valid argument, he just ignores, or keeps throwing fluff around..
dude, that old klink cruiser, was more than likely very upgraded as well.. what do you think a ship full of Klingons are going to do for as long as they were out there.. lol...
by your logic, the connie is tuffer than the galaxy as well. since the ent. d was taken out by a Klingon vessel that could fire through its shields, and the ent. a, survived such an attack...
please keep your garbage off these forums..
now that being said lol... in voyager, belana torres commented that the dauntless was a lean vessel, meaning it didn't really have armaments, or defences, but was built to go fast in lew of said missing systems.. those are pretty much her exact words as well...
so if the dauntless was done right, it would be more of a show piece, rather than a viable endgame ship.. but it will probably be the cats meow and the most powerfull thing in the quadrant (knowing cryptic).
except voyager did pretty well for herself before 7 of nine.. voyager was not a science vessel.. I have watched every episode looking and listening (since this has been argued before here) for evidence of such.. everytime the crew refers to what the ship was designed for, it is usually tactical based. harry kim makes several statements, janeway does, and tom paris..
in other episodes, 7 of 9 (while building the stellar cartography lab that also doubled as an astrometrics lab) said that since she added the lab, voyager would be able to carry out far more scientific and exploratory missions.
not too many science vessels are built with 13 phaser arrays, 4 torpedo tubes and a wide array of torpedos like she had.. she also had been built to menuever like no other ship her size (which is useless in scientific and exploratory missions) and in several episodes, they had to create labs and facilities to carry out a scientific mission or need. not to mention, more than half her crew were engineers and operations personel.. there wasn't a whole lot of blue shirts on board.. there are actual counts of what was seen on screne, as compared with the crew size. Christ, most of there blue shirts came from either chokatays crew, or the crew of the equinox.
while I wont say she wasn't capable of being an explorer/science ship, its also a far stretch to say she was a science vessel.. she was more than likely designed as a patrol vessel (policing systems from piracy, and watching the boarders, but also being equipped to explore anything they came across).
like I said, for a science vessel, she was woefully under equipped.. as a patrol vessel, she did her job pretty good, since she didn't lose too many fights..
Yes to all of this. Also worth noting her first mission was essentially to patrol the Badlands.
We saw that in the Delta quadrant, and it's a science vessel as far as STO is concerned.
While the logic is sound, however the Millennium Falcon cameo is so far away that someone could easily create a new ship or shuttle that looks similar from long range that could easily negate what you said. However, the Dauntless was easily identified at the Battle of Procyon V.
With Trek canon, like others suggested over the years, that Starfleet Adapted the design. But with STO, Starfleet could've recreated the Dauntless and used it for understanding Slipstream technology. Or now that we are returning to the Delta Quadrant, maybe we find the original Dauntless. Maybe Arturis really didn't get assimilated like we thought at the end of VOY: Hope and Fear, and forgave Starfleet after he learned Janeway was the one responsible for defeating the Borg and thus saving his people. So he gave the Dauntless to Starfleet in repentance. And with the original Dauntless, Starfleet could now master Slipstream Technology with new generation ships that allow longer-range Slipstream travel and deeper Galactic exploration.
:rolleyes:
It does huh? So Starfleet stealing some design a alien made to trick Starfleet officers into using makes more sense than a ship which there is no evidence you can possibly provide that wouldn't be designed in the Prime timeline huh?
32 years later and they haven't made the faux Federation ship, but things in this alternate timeline have come to pass, the Federation was at war with the Klingons which only just ended, Worf went to the Empire, The Romulan Empire was decimated...not in the same way but still.
Then I suppose it should upset you that the Olympic class is in game right? Same with Transphasic Torpedoes and the Ablative Generator right? Because there is no way they could have been designed in a timeline alternate from that Admiral Janeway's?
Why not both? Improved Intrepid AND the Dauntless?
Well.. Are you going to pretend said Mirandas and Excelsiors weren't used in the Dominion wars?
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
I think the Falcon is probably some sort of specialty ship... You know... NPC ship with special ability of sorts... Like the Planet Killer.
And yea... We should deffo have that steamrunner (though it might have had another classification back then).
Considering we have the MF, Lightsabers, Yoda payed the game a visit and R2D2 was in a parallel universe, I don't think thats an unreasonable pretense.
So what if they are reused models?
It's not like we saw a Miranda or Excelsior still being used in the 26th Century. :rolleyes:
Yes, because with how fickle the Starfleet core of engineers are and how we know they love building bigger and better things will not only be using a alien designed ship a 150 years later they will also be using the Prometheus and Nova.
Not to mention I guess the Sphere Builders just happen to make identical designs to Delta Quadrant races from a 150 years ago :rolleyes:
Was nothing but reuse of old models...
Yes, your logic holds.........when we are flying around in NX recreations, ships that were decommissioned over a 100 years ago, and captaining alien ships we "found". :rolleyes:
And I see no ill logic about them reusing the Prometheus and Nova, when the Galaxy-class was listed at having a 200 year life span in the tech manuals.
But if you don't like Star Trek reusing models, then I suggest you march over to CBS's HQ and demand they stop doing that! And Cryptic, you heard this guy! Better not reuse those same models or else he's going to stomp his feet!
Funny? I thought STO isn't canon?
A recreation that is inferior in every way to a real ship, would be like me recreating the Wright brother plain, sure it can fly but it's there for nothing more but nostalgia or admiring our past, but that Wright brothers plain sure as heck isn't going to get me into the future.
Funny you say 200 years but all I've ever seen over the forums and other places is over 100...just like the Nova and the Prometheus I've seen is less than 100.
It is the phaser lance and the cloaking device that are the problem. I have no problem with a Starfleet ship that looks the same as a ship from another timeline. However, having two pieces of technology that are not used on other Starfleet ships is the problem. Starfleet ships should never have cloaking devices due to legality issues. The Defiant was authorized to use its cloaking device by the Romulans and the Galaxy-X came from a reality where the Romulan Star Empire was no more, but no other Defiant class ships were allowed to use a cloaking device and the Federation President has renewed the Federation's commitment to the Treaty of Algeron. No other Starfleet vessel uses the Phaser LanceTherefore, the Galaxy-X uses a piece of technology that is rarely used by the STO timeline except for on three ships and a piece of technology that is not used by any other ship. Therefore, there is no way for the Galaxy-X to be designed in the Prime timeline since the Phaser Lance would have been implemented on more ships.