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Best Weapon energy type
jenkal
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
What is the best weapon type for a full cannon avenger build (with plasmonic leech, if it's useful to you)?
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or romulan plasma with embassey sci consoles
but in all honesty, the proc of your weapon type isn't that relevant anyway. More important is the possibility to buff the weapontype.
So even phasers, while they have the most useless proc of all, can be buffed for 7,6% bonus dmg with the 2piece set from the undine rep. It is basically as if you had another phaser console.
same goes for disruptors which have a better proc.
antiproton have that too and since they have bonus crtD instead of a proc outclass the other weapon types. Only problem is, the don't come in great variaty and basically the only option of obtaining them is the fleet store.
The only exception to that is antiproton which has a flat bonus to critD and therefore will boost your damage when you crit. The rate at which you crit can be changed though by slotting anything that boosts critH so this gives it an advantage over all the other procs that you can't change.
Hence why antiproton is considered the top energy type for raw damage output.
But if you're picking an energy type consider what boosts you can get for the actual weapon damage. Tac consoles, space sets, deflectors etc will all have the ability to boost the base damage of different energy types, even if they don't affect the proc itself.
The buff sets mentioned will be from slotting more than one part of a space set, several of these will give boosts to certain damage types:
Counter command weapon set 2pc gives phaser bonus damage and photon torp damage.
Dyson weapon set 2pc boosts photon torps and proton damage.
Obelisk space set 2pc gives antiproton bonus damage.
Anything that says it gives bonus damage applies the boost after everything else affecting the weapon so although the % might look lower than a tac console it will often give higher numbers in practice.
Make sure you're not using multiple energy types or you'll be getting a reduced boost to each type when you could just concentrate on one type only and get better results.
Apart from that, just pick the type you like the colour or sound of, or if you think it fits with your ship/captain background.
The new undine counter command ordnance set buffs phasers and disruptors if you equip 2 pieces.
There is also one for anitprotons that is free. The ancient obelisk technologies set.
At the bottom of the page is a list of all the other sets.
Sorry, but there is not a "better" energy type weapon. Any energy type is good (with the exception of tetryon and phasers, more the first one) as long as you have the right build.
Some energy types are harder to master, because you dont have effective sets or other things to boost em, but they are as good as any other type. The problem is, in Star trek online, if a energy type is provide with a great set to boost it, that energy type becomes "better" than any other. Actually this is not true, the only difference is that you have the right items placed on your ship...
Just use what you want, the rest is just numbers.
What's wrong with phasers and tetryon? They both seem to do well for me.
KDF Tac: Bortasqu' Tactical
Fed Tac: Fleet Gal-X
Keep those big guns a-thunderin'
Tetryon proc doesn't really help you once the enemy's shields are down, or against unshielded targets.
Phaser proc doesn't last all that long, can be easily cleared in PvP, and in PvE the AI isn't really smart enough for it to matter if they lose power momentarily in a subsystem that may not even be the subsystem you want disabled.
But frankly it doesn't matter if you're losing out on a small potential proc bonus due to power creep.
Joined January 2009
sorry, but there are better energy types when it comes to max dps. It may not be gamebreaking much, but it is more than you can get with other types.
An inherent 20% crtD more is not alot if you have only 10% crtH, which was pretty much standard 2 years ago...but crtH has more than doubled since then which made antiprotons better for max dmg than basically all other types. And as long as there is a crtH and ACC increase every now and then, antiproton will get better.
Then there is the factor of consoles and sets that boost specific types, which gives certain energy types an edge over others.
plasma weapons and embassey sci consoles for instance. where 3 of those add up as if you had an additional tac console.
on the downside, antiproton don't come in great varieties. basically only the fleet ones.
would i suggest to use AP on a guramba or another ship that features some gimmick that is tied to a specific weapon, NO...but to say all energy types are equal i simply wrong. Each proc has advantages and disadvantages...even phasers. Sometimes those advantages however become irrelevant. And in PVE most procs won't have any impact. A dot on a target that lives for 3 seconds isn't doing anything, but it is very powerfull on a boss ship. A shield strip proc on an unshielded target is worthless, but it can be nasty against heavily shielded ships.
the only 2 that seem to be "using" their specific function in each and every fight are disruptors, antiprotons and to a certain degree polaron.
disruptors also come in a huge variety which also gives them an edge, since they can immitate other weapons.
best variety and multiproc are disruptors
best overall dps, antiproton
but is there a gamebreaking difference in performance compared to the other types...NO, but it is still enough to give the OP a clear answer to his question.
Time will only tell!
If you dont have the antiproton set, using antirptoton is just a question of taste. Dont forget this. You will not get more performance in your cannons using AP than using plasma, disruptor or almost any other energy type.
And again, no there is no a better energy type. Because the damage IS THE SAME on all weapons, it doesnt matter the proc. The proc is not what is doing the damage. Some people forget this. Unless again, you talking about tetryons or phasers, that for an unkown reason they have really caped the output damage, almost any energy type is good.
In fact i get more performance using disruptor cannons than antiproton cannons. I had a build on my Kumari of antiproton cannons + turrets and i switched it to a disruptor build cuz i had more performance with it lol.
Yes AP can be great, but then, so can Disruptor, or Plasma, or Polaron, or even the humble Phaser, if you build for it ...
I just hope new players don't read the AP phanbois posts and think it's gospel, it would be a shame for them to be so misguided.
What difference does it make? I guess if you are into PvP and the energy damage or the procs are maybe more important to you as you are going against other players, it may be a question that you can look at.
If you are like most players, and do mostly PvE with an occasional foray into PvP, any energy type will work. We can argue over this proc or that proc..plasma with Romulan consoles, vs Antiproton and the CritH values, but, let's be honest, in a PvE does it matter? STFs, Breach, Vault ensnared, Crystalline..any of them? If you get three of the five ships to focus their energy on a single target, it doesn't take long. About the only one that I see people have problems with is Khitomer when the call in the cube, and they can't handle it by themselves. Well, recognize that you can't, and team up with the other mate on your side of the map.
I use tetryon beams on my Recluse and Orb Weaver. Polaron on my Jem Hadar. Antiproton cannons on the Bug Ship. Antiproton beams on the Odyssey. Tetryon Cannons on the MVAE. Romulan Plasma beams on the Dreadnought. Nanite disruptors I have in reserve for when I feel like switching them over. My point is..use what you want to use. In my case, I just like using the proper energy type (mostly) for the ship type. Just makes it different when I fly a different ship.
Well there other weapons besides just the Anti-proton (this is just one part of puzzle) to use to take out those shields you mention. Weapons and traits, skill and bridge crew skills, devices, universal consoles whatever you need to get the job done.
A few hours ago at the Undine Space Battlezone the Planet Killer I was the only ship fighting that. I was hit hard by the PK beams. I kept the shields at 100% with full power to weapons. But in all I get to see how the new hull and shields are withstand that PK hits with primary tools before drain sets in. Thus the need o kick in secondary tools have to be use.
I am sure you have some tricks up your way also.. In all the prizes awards will be your proof to show off if you care too. To me it's just another daily battle to deal with.
Time will only tell!
But remember its a game n have fun
the fantasy you talk about is called math and combatlog parsing...but as arthur c. CLarke wrote: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"
it may be magic to you, but to the rest it simply is higher understanding.
I AM into PvP, that's why I'm asking, otherwise I wouldn't even need a dps build in the first place! I mean with my (non fleet) assault cruiser I could easily take out any other ship in my class. I could tank pretty well (being an engineer), but couldn't stand a chance in pvp. Why? Because my turni rate and dps output were simply crippling, and even if I could take 1vs1 a pvp built ship and tank it (without dealing much damage) I wasn't able to resist with more than 1 ship. That is because since I had an assault cruiser everyone saw me as dinner. So now that I have an Avenger (a ship made for DPS), I am asking this question.
Check what gear you have, what works for other avenger capts, consider the grinding effort you want to make and how you fly your ship and what any teams you play with want. Also check out existing avenger builds in the fed shipyard section and the pvp forum.
Thanks, this is the best build I have been presented with so far, and I have looked at quite a few (this build does not include items you can only get out of lockboxes or with gems, since that's what I requested):
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=abitdifferent_0
The only difference I have made to it is add a plasmonic leech instead of the Avenger Armament system console. Of course I am considering changing weapon type to tetryon, but I'd like to know if that's a bad choice and comments about it.
Whether EPTE is worthwhile might be a suck it and see, it fits the overall concept but I'd experiment with EPTS and a second EPTW.
Definitely experiment with the CSV - try cannon rapid fire or attack patterns. CSV is great for area damage in PVE, whereas mostly PVP is trying to take down a particular target.
So wrong. having more critical change doesnt mean you will do more damage. In fact, you can be fighitn for 30 minutes and the proc will almost never activate. So, in that case that weapon will be same as any other. Even worst if you are using it to have more critical chances. And that tiny window of chance is, honestly ridiculous. As i said, i had more performance and i dealt more damage with other energy types like disruptor, than using AP. Even if i had a little tiny more critical chance. Thats the reason you cant base your weapon performance on the proc.
Tetryon is the WORST energy type, at least, tested by thousands of users, because not only the damage is caped (even if the weapon should deal the same damage base as any other weapon, in the practice its not) but the proc is completely useless. Phasers are even far better than tetryon, a thousand times. Except tetryon and phasers in a little measure, any energy weapon type can deal the same damage as AP. And even more. Depending on your ship build. Still i laugh when i read that people uses AP because they "think" its the best weapon energy type and it deals more damage than the others.. cuh cuh cuh ^^
Damn, have you even ever seen an Antiproton weapon in your life? And you are telling me I'm wrong?! First of all there is no proc on Antiproton weapons, it's a straight up Critical Severity +_% So that means EVERY SINGLE TIME YOU CRITICAL, the damage is higher than normal. And the Critical Chance probability depends on your build... It's possible to reach a near 20% critical chance probability, you know what that means? 1 every 5 shots you get a critical (with dual cannons that means about 2 criticals every volley on an avenger). So you are "So wrong".
You don't seem to understand how antiproton weapons work.
Your basic antiproton weapon has a built in 20% boost to critical damage. All other energy types have a proc effect that has a 2.5% chance to occur.
Thing is that you can very much alter your critical chance in this game. You cannot do anything to change the proc rate for any other energy types.
The chance you get to have a critical attack happen is dependent on what you have slotted to affect it. Therefore antiproton weapons are the only energy type where you can increase both the base damage (via tac consoles, weapon sets etc.) and also the "proc" on the weapon (by boosting your critH).
This is why people who have BIG CritH numbers see antiproton as possibly the best type. If you boost your critH to over 20% (easily possible as a Romulan) then you're can get very large numbers of criticals and also very big criticals.
Compared to the proc of most other weapons though, phasers are rather weak. They have a random chance is disabling a sub-system. However, the only disabled sub-system that is visibly seen by the player is the shields. During the short period of time When shields are down all weapon damages are applied to the hull.
Disabling weapons is good too since that means your enemy cannot fire back at you. However, for me it is hard to know if the weapons have actually been disabled or if the enemy ship is simply waiting for weapon power levels to recharge.
Disabling auxiliary systems is rather meh... Yeah, I suppose during that time enemy ship cannot do a science attack on you, but it's rather useless.
Disabling engines is not much of a big deal. I am too business to know if a ship has temporarily stopped moving. In combat it make very little difference. The exception would be if you are trying to escape combat, and only if you are very near the 10km limit.
Phaser Engine proc is making enemy to stop = 0% defense (with skills maybe 5-6% max), which means nearly 80-100% chance to hit this specific target on top of your accuracy.
So its not meeh at all
Can't find the reference for it but ship speed of zero does not mean 0% defense. There is a defense penalty though. Anywaste... not impressive. That said, I use phasers on my Sovereign.
For a change of pace, I have purchased a mirror Sovereign and I am installing fluidic anti-protons weapons on that ship.
Ok, lets stop for the moment, because you dont make any common sense here.
This is not me trying to explain something to you, this is for everybody that is saying the same thing like you.
Ok, you say: best is antiproton because 20% crtd (by that you are saying that 20%crtD is better than any proc you can get - i will neither agree or disagree)
Second thing you and everybody else is saying that second best thing is romulan plasma (people where saying this mostly before counter-command rep and even now).
So my question: if 20%crtd is better than any proc, how can 2proc weapon be better than every other 1proc weapon out there??
If i want disruptor part of rom-plasma, i can take normal disruptors, have that proc and put plus one crtd mod?
If i want plasma part of rom-plasma, i can take normal plasma, have that proc and put plus one crtd mod and put those fleet science consoles to boost your plasma dps?
So, there is no common sense in saying that rom plasma is better then normal plasma, if the antiproton crtd build-in proc/mod is the best thing in game, is there?
Ok, now my personal choice is (considering of the consoles and set bonuses that can boost your dps):
1. disruptors (very good proc, better for team play, various different variants of disruptors that can stack, you can use your own warp/sing core - read this as AMP- and still get to set bonus for dps - 7.5% post-weapon power,, there are 4 good items you can equip the get 2set bon. and every build will find at least 2 of them useful)
2. antiproton (20%crtd - best but selfish proc/mod, 10%post weapon 2-piece bonus is better than disruptor 2piece but restricts you to use moderate quality warp core not useful to every build, 360 beam array - not useful to every build, escort cannot use sv/rf, beam boats will still prefer beam array for broadside, also romulans cannot use warp core.)
3. phasers - yes, PHASERS, 2piece form counter-command push them here despite not so useful proc, and remember there are still elite phasers you can grab
4. plasma....
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and i am tired of writing....
Lets just say that it is more suited for enemys with little shield but a lot of hull points.
now AP, as i said, is only going to be a good weapon choice if you get above 20% crtH. The additional crtD in combination with high crtH makes this weapon type very bursty and most importantly proc independent.
so to answer the question: It is only better when you got high enough crtH, which these days shouldn't be a problem.
The one proc from rom plasma is buffing the other proc...but that is not the only reason why plasma is so great, the reason are embassey sci consoles with +% plasma dmg. If you are not going to use embassey sci consoles and other set boni to buff plasma, don't go for rom plasma.
a crtD mod isn't really good unless you have "enough" (you can never have enough) crtH...the rom plasma double proc has a synergy in itself, well worth a weapon mod. Other weapon types i'm not convinced the proc can compete with a weapon mod.
so why is antiproton better anyway: you allways go for max crtH anyway regardless of your weapon type.
you may use up your consoles space for other consoles, so you couldn't use embassey sci consoles anyway.
A proc will allways be random. may come in the right moment, but also can be a complete waste (1 sec before the target explodes), 20% crtD on AP is steady and gets ever more powerfull with each crtH and even ACC added, since the "proc" depends on crtH.
years ago when 10% crtH was already a lot and antiproton only existed as MK X weapons with [BORG] mod, they were balanced with other weapon types, but that is no longer the case.
there is a list of buffs and sets and tems, to buff each weapon type...depends on how long the list is and how much you can incorporate into your build.
Rom plasma has one of the longest lists, so does disruptors...antiproton does not have a very long list, but the fact that crtH (and to a certain degree ACC overflow) directly buffs the weapons "speciality" sets it appart from all the other weapon types. period.