What if they were to give it a hangar and convert the Star Cruiser to a Flight-Deck Cruiser?
Yeah, it's a case that I'm looking at the Marauder and still hoping for a Fleet Version. So then it would be a case of comparing that Fleet Marauder to the Fleet Star Cruiser.
Fleet Star Cruiser vs. "Fleet Marauder"
+Strategic Maneuvering
+Weapon System Efficiency
-15 Inertia
-Hangar
Course, folks /facepalm my wanting a Fleet Marauder..so folks will probably /facepalm the suggestion for the Star Cruiser in the same manner (and for other reasons as well)...
Actually I love my maraurder on my Orion kdf. My original idea was to turn the star cruiser into a flight deck cruiser.
However, since they gave the galaxy X a hanger I'm a little weary of adding a hanger to the star cruiser. I mean yeah it would beef it up but I would rather it have a unique advantage.
Besides I like the fact kdf have unique classes of ships
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
Actually I love my maraurder on my Orion kdf. My original idea was to turn the star cruiser into a flight deck cruiser.
However, since they gave the galaxy X a hanger I'm a little weary of adding a hanger to the star cruiser. I mean yeah it would beef it up but I would rather it have a unique advantage.
Besides I like the fact kdf have unique classes of ships
But Flight-Deck Cruisers aren't KDF-unique. Just like Battle Cruisers haven't been KDF-unique forever.
Voth Bastion Flight-Deck Cruiser...arguably better than either the Marauder or Corsair.
But speaking of the Gal-X Dreadnought Cruiser...still bugs me that the Bortasqu' is a Dreadnought but it is not a Dreadnought Cruiser, it's a Battle Cruiser instead. But I'm complaining about that in another thread.
Folks hate the Star Cruiser and Marauder because it is not some cookie cutter ship that they can use to do X or Y as well as some other ship. Not everybody's playing to min/max...but even though I have no Fed toons, I look at the Star Cruiser and can't help but wonder when it's going to take some vitamins.
The good old SR 71 in spaaaaace...
In my opinion what the ship needs (and so does the Gal R, Intrepid R and any other ship with only a LT tac station)is an overhaul of some old gameplay systems. In particular the shield balancing system. This system is terribly outdated and immersion breaking. When was the last time you saw a starfleet captain mashing the shield balance button all the time in a ST episode or film?
If they converted it to a toggle button system, like the cruiser commands or carrier hangar orders, overhauled a little to make the shield regeneration and the shield power relevant to shield balance we could get rid of the crutch that is the shield balance portion of Tac Team, cutting down the "must have" tactical powers from 3 to 2.
I just read the title and felt like I needed to post something, provided that the fleet star cruiser has been my flagship in my tac fed for at least 1 year and 6 months.
I used to fly it in a very tanky way until very recently, because it's one of the best tank ships in game, only beaten by the bulwark (the bastion is debatable) and the tal shiar adapted battlecruiser if built properly, which aren't the majority of the cases. The fleet ambassador and the fleet galaxy could seem better in tanking at first sight, but if you analyze everything you will find that the star cruiser overwhelms them in defensive skills very clearly.
Now I fly in an A2B build with 3 purple techicians, and realised that i can tank even better using boff abilities at the right time and order, with also a vast amount of DPS which made me capable of making 1st places in cristallines and other events several times (I never fall behind the 3rd place). Some people will consider a bit suicide, but also i usually fly with the draw fire command with excellent results even in the elite undine space invasions holding many ships at the same time (0 deaths at the moment).
The fact is that to properly fly in this ship you MUST have a good duty officer setup to reduce tac team CD as if you had 2 of them, and depending if you want an A2B build or not, there are many possibilities for the duty layouts, but is a complete need to fulfil them properly.
So, in conclusion, here's my build: Fleet Star Cruiser
Since the beginning I was with the plasma energy. I've made recent changes to the boff settings including the eng teams and the sci team when I put the A2B also, and in equipment I replaced first from maco to solanae, and now to the nukara set, which has proved very efficient in giving both offensive and defensive capabilities.
I can constantly fly with A2B without any problem just with some breaks of about a second sometimes to activate the few auxiliary-dependant abilities, but is not a need. I want hazard emitters for the cleanse effect and polarize hull for the immobilizing immunity, not for the heals or resistances.
Obviously it's not a pvp ship, but i'm not interested in pvp on this game. If I want pvp, i go to other games which names I won't mention here.
Even though, someday I will test it to see how it handles in queued pvp, as in kerra't I don't have survivability problems the few times i go there.
Add Sensor Analysis and a large boost to shield multiplier, x1.2 for non-fleet and x1.32 for fleet, while lowering the hull hitpoints to balance out the extra shield power. For the console
* An SIF generator similar to scattering field that buffs damage resistance temporarily for teammates in close range.
* Or one that dramatically increases shield regeneration and/or hull regeneration temporarily for teammates in close range.
could do the opposite of the regent, there isn't a ship with that station setup yet.
COM eng LTC sci LT eng LT tac ENS sci
That would do it IMO.
Additionally Cryptics devs could release a nice new ship model in a similar style as the new Tempest (more round shapes, no nonsense greebles or edges, you know what i mean).
I think the devs don't really know what to do with the (old) star Cruiser ships, giving them a much more Science emphasis would make them unique and would open up a much different playstyle, without having to rely on non Starfleet ships.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
I think the devs don't really know what to do with the (old) star Cruiser ships, giving them a much more Science emphasis would make them unique and would open up a much different playstyle, without having to rely on non Starfleet ships.
They don't know what to do with the older ships in the KDF & Fed lineups, period. Most of them became completely obsolete the moment Hybrid ships started coming around. LtCdr and such in skill areas outside the ship specialization. The Akira was the first to break the old rules by having LtCdr ENG on an Escort, and the game slid that way ever since with Hybrid BOFF setups, some even having very potent Lt, LtCdr, and even 2 with Cmdr Universal stations.
I love that suggested build for a star cruiser refit. Ship could use the update after all these years. A lot of the old ships fleet versions could use a once over to make them more cstore worthy. Im all for seeing new cstore versions of old mainstream ships that didnt have one, like the FPER. So long as they dont invalidate 95% of all the ships in that class like the FPER did....
Basically it was a matter of maximising shield regen and hull healing, this required high level EPtS so I thought "why not run a matching EPtW?", having taken away TT I had the ability to run APB and FAW together, coupled with high level EPtW I was able to just maintain overcapped weapon power, the same concept could be used on the Galaxy (the ship I orginally designed the build for as a 'fix') and the Oddy bringing the Star cruiser and the Galaxy up to par with the Sovi's more restrained builds.
Basically it was a matter of maximising shield regen and hull healing, this required high level EPtS so I thought "why not run a matching EPtW?", having taken away TT I had the ability to run APB and FAW together, coupled with high level EPtW I was able to just maintain overcapped weapon power, the same concept could be used on the Galaxy (the ship I orginally designed the build for as a 'fix') and the Oddy bringing the Star cruiser and the Galaxy up to par with the Sovi's more restrained builds.
Obviously you can A2B it but... yeah.
Interesting...
...does the [Elite Fleet Regenerative Shield Array Mk XII [Cap]x2 [ResB] [Adapt]] make a noticeable difference compared to a comparable resilient shield?
EDIT:
Why Tractor Beam?
If i where you, i would put TSS I to the ensign station and use Feedback pulse I or Tractor Beam repulsors instead. (just an idea)
I know you are reluctant to use A2B, but since the colldowns of powers like RSP are quiet long, is it still possible to tank long enough?
When using this build with a Galaxy, what power do you put at the 3. engineering ensign station?
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
...does the [Elite Fleet Regenerative Shield Array Mk XII [Cap]x2 [ResB] [Adapt]] make a noticeable difference compared to a comparable resilient shield?
Yes it does as the whole point of the build is to maximise the regeneration potential of the ship to make up for the lack of TT and compensate for the slow manual distro. as such it has to be a regen shield of some sort (for concept testing I used the Omega force shields which work just as well)
EDIT:
Why Tractor Beam?
If i where you, i would put TSS I to the ensign station and use Feedback pulse I or Tractor Beam repulsors instead. (just an idea)
I know you are reluctant to use A2B, but since the colldowns of powers like RSP are quiet long, is it still possible to tank long enough?
With regard to TB vs TSS I found the one TSS used as needed to be enough and TB reduces target defence giving you the ability to score more crits and the same for your team mates.
On A2B, I haven't done any A2B testing with the build... I suppose if you dropped EPtW to level 1 and raised RSP to level 2 you might be able to pull it off... you'd need another form of resist though, maybe PH? Again, I haven't done any A2B testing so I can't say for certain but I suppose it might be possible with an eng or a sci toon.
When using this build with a Galaxy, what power do you put at the 3. engineering ensign station?
http://www.kaysvaultofstuff.com/tt-less-galaxy.html
I left it empty as I used the EPtX powers at level 3 leaving the ensign equally useless, I suppose you could rejig the powers a bit... perhaps taking a second DEM to make up for EPtW1 rather than 3...
I'd invite you to play with it, I'd love to see the results, maybe I can use them to refine the concept and make alternative versions of it
That's remotely similiar to my tt-less Galaxy build I use since forever. I however don't see a reason to leave anything "empty" - you can slot EPtX abilities in the ensign slots for situational use. I have a EPtA and a EPtE I ready most of the time and especially the EPtE is extremely valuable. Build on STOacademy.
It's 7-10k-ish dps, although I don't care about it. It's fun and survives pretty much everything, rescuing all ships on the breach solo in separation mode (this is where the EPtE for example shines). The TSS with tractor beam DOFF removes Borg boarding parties as well.
Right now I'm experimenting with APD I, trying to sacrifice my own damage for team beneficial tanking.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
With regard to TB vs TSS I found the one TSS used as needed to be enough and TB reduces target defence giving you the ability to score more crits and the same for your team mates.
On A2B, I haven't done any A2B testing with the build... I suppose if you dropped EPtW to level 1 and raised RSP to level 2 you might be able to pull it off... you'd need another form of resist though, maybe PH? Again, I haven't done any A2B testing so I can't say for certain but I suppose it might be possible with an eng or a sci toon.
I used to use A2B on most of my cruiser ships for a long time, but they become insanely squishy compared to a A2S Build IMO.
That's why i'm looking for a more sturdy but still offensive alternative myself.
I'd invite you to play with it, I'd love to see the results, maybe I can use them to refine the concept and make alternative versions of it
I'm already testing something similar with my Engineers Fleet Heavy Cruiser Retrofit.
It includes the Full Borg set, the nukara particle converter and the Romulan Hyper-Plasma torpedo Launcher (which is a beautiful fire-and-forget weapon IMO).
I'll post the full build later, after a bit more testing.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Here's a early WIP. LINK
I tried a similar build with my Science Character flying a Mirror Star Cruiser, but strangely it doesn't really work. I think the Star Cruisers turn rate is killing it for me, too slow and always a bit too late to line up torpedoes and the ship gets blown up it's not even funny, lol.
I'll do a bit more testing for a few days with this build. If it works, i'm going to replace the Antiproton Arrays with Fleet antiprotons and get some better Engineering armor consoles (+turn).
DOFFs:
2x Energy Weapons Officer (50% beam recharge)
3x Damage Control (EmptX recharge)
Maybe i should use another Deflector/Impulse/Shield Set?
OT: when using my build at a Star Cruiser i'd just remove the Torpedo Spread and add a Science team to the ensign Science Station.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
I wouldn't have used the borg shields myself, As I said, I used Omega force ones for my testing and maintaining 125/130 shield power and spamming distribute shields is crucial to the build's success. I can't say I see too much wrong with the build itself though, dropping the torps and taking a second FAW would boost your dps while allowing you to spare the two doff slots for something else.
As a science captain I would grab the sensor scan doff as this allows you to use the ability defensively in the same way as RSF, you should also remember that sci fleet is a massive shield resist power. I can't comment on the skill table or traits etc as you haven't filled those fields in.
I'm sorry i forgot to fill out the Skill and Trait stuff. HERE is an updated build. I just noticed that i haven't changed the Skills for more than two years, lol.
I don't know what i was thinking .
Regarding traits, i'm a bit confused by the sheer amount of range. I don't really have a clue which ones do create synergies with the BOFF powers i use.
Because of recent events, i am thinking about changing to my good old Galaxy -R.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
Because of recent events, i am thinking about changing to my good old Galaxy -R.
Well, the Gal-R does have a slightly better boff layout in the science ensign.
In terms of skill tree, there is nothing wrong with yours really though you could refine it a bit I would put that in the realm of optionals.
Your space traits look to be very offensive, I would make them more defensive while practising with the build and slowing make them more offensive again once you are happy with it, I would also trade your monotaniums for neutroniums, you could put universal consoles in your sci slots... I can't think right now of what you might do with that though... I'm too tired to build ships right now
Comments
COM eng
LTC sci
LT eng
LT tac
ENS sci
Yeah, it's a case that I'm looking at the Marauder and still hoping for a Fleet Version. So then it would be a case of comparing that Fleet Marauder to the Fleet Star Cruiser.
Fleet Star Cruiser vs. "Fleet Marauder"
+Strategic Maneuvering
+Weapon System Efficiency
-15 Inertia
-Hangar
Course, folks /facepalm my wanting a Fleet Marauder..so folks will probably /facepalm the suggestion for the Star Cruiser in the same manner (and for other reasons as well)...
However, since they gave the galaxy X a hanger I'm a little weary of adding a hanger to the star cruiser. I mean yeah it would beef it up but I would rather it have a unique advantage.
Besides I like the fact kdf have unique classes of ships
That is basically the BOFF layout I proposed for my Star Cruiser refit idea, with the Lt Eng becoming universal on the fleet level.
But Flight-Deck Cruisers aren't KDF-unique. Just like Battle Cruisers haven't been KDF-unique forever.
Voth Bastion Flight-Deck Cruiser...arguably better than either the Marauder or Corsair.
But speaking of the Gal-X Dreadnought Cruiser...still bugs me that the Bortasqu' is a Dreadnought but it is not a Dreadnought Cruiser, it's a Battle Cruiser instead. But I'm complaining about that in another thread.
Folks hate the Star Cruiser and Marauder because it is not some cookie cutter ship that they can use to do X or Y as well as some other ship. Not everybody's playing to min/max...but even though I have no Fed toons, I look at the Star Cruiser and can't help but wonder when it's going to take some vitamins.
I'm sorry to people who I, in the past, insulted, annoyed, etc.
In my opinion what the ship needs (and so does the Gal R, Intrepid R and any other ship with only a LT tac station)is an overhaul of some old gameplay systems. In particular the shield balancing system. This system is terribly outdated and immersion breaking. When was the last time you saw a starfleet captain mashing the shield balance button all the time in a ST episode or film?
If they converted it to a toggle button system, like the cruiser commands or carrier hangar orders, overhauled a little to make the shield regeneration and the shield power relevant to shield balance we could get rid of the crutch that is the shield balance portion of Tac Team, cutting down the "must have" tactical powers from 3 to 2.
If the Regent is any indication, the fleet version would get the Lt Tac made universal... :P
I used to fly it in a very tanky way until very recently, because it's one of the best tank ships in game, only beaten by the bulwark (the bastion is debatable) and the tal shiar adapted battlecruiser if built properly, which aren't the majority of the cases. The fleet ambassador and the fleet galaxy could seem better in tanking at first sight, but if you analyze everything you will find that the star cruiser overwhelms them in defensive skills very clearly.
Now I fly in an A2B build with 3 purple techicians, and realised that i can tank even better using boff abilities at the right time and order, with also a vast amount of DPS which made me capable of making 1st places in cristallines and other events several times (I never fall behind the 3rd place). Some people will consider a bit suicide, but also i usually fly with the draw fire command with excellent results even in the elite undine space invasions holding many ships at the same time (0 deaths at the moment).
The fact is that to properly fly in this ship you MUST have a good duty officer setup to reduce tac team CD as if you had 2 of them, and depending if you want an A2B build or not, there are many possibilities for the duty layouts, but is a complete need to fulfil them properly.
So, in conclusion, here's my build:
Fleet Star Cruiser
Since the beginning I was with the plasma energy. I've made recent changes to the boff settings including the eng teams and the sci team when I put the A2B also, and in equipment I replaced first from maco to solanae, and now to the nukara set, which has proved very efficient in giving both offensive and defensive capabilities.
I can constantly fly with A2B without any problem just with some breaks of about a second sometimes to activate the few auxiliary-dependant abilities, but is not a need. I want hazard emitters for the cleanse effect and polarize hull for the immobilizing immunity, not for the heals or resistances.
Obviously it's not a pvp ship, but i'm not interested in pvp on this game. If I want pvp, i go to other games which names I won't mention here.
Even though, someday I will test it to see how it handles in queued pvp, as in kerra't I don't have survivability problems the few times i go there.
I hope this has been of some help to anyone ^^
Add Sensor Analysis and a large boost to shield multiplier, x1.2 for non-fleet and x1.32 for fleet, while lowering the hull hitpoints to balance out the extra shield power. For the console
* An SIF generator similar to scattering field that buffs damage resistance temporarily for teammates in close range.
* Or one that dramatically increases shield regeneration and/or hull regeneration temporarily for teammates in close range.
*Farts*
Console-Universal Tachyon Feedback Shell.
Think of a version of the Reactive Shield Amplifier except with more shield damage, but without the immune to all damage part.
I'm sorry to people who I, in the past, insulted, annoyed, etc.
That would do it IMO.
Additionally Cryptics devs could release a nice new ship model in a similar style as the new Tempest (more round shapes, no nonsense greebles or edges, you know what i mean).
I think the devs don't really know what to do with the (old) star Cruiser ships, giving them a much more Science emphasis would make them unique and would open up a much different playstyle, without having to rely on non Starfleet ships.
They don't know what to do with the older ships in the KDF & Fed lineups, period. Most of them became completely obsolete the moment Hybrid ships started coming around. LtCdr and such in skill areas outside the ship specialization. The Akira was the first to break the old rules by having LtCdr ENG on an Escort, and the game slid that way ever since with Hybrid BOFF setups, some even having very potent Lt, LtCdr, and even 2 with Cmdr Universal stations.
Sorry just had a cough never mind me!
I'm sorry to people who I, in the past, insulted, annoyed, etc.
LTC sci
LT eng
LT tac
ENS sci
I love that suggested build for a star cruiser refit. Ship could use the update after all these years. A lot of the old ships fleet versions could use a once over to make them more cstore worthy. Im all for seeing new cstore versions of old mainstream ships that didnt have one, like the FPER. So long as they dont invalidate 95% of all the ships in that class like the FPER did....
Build here
Basically it was a matter of maximising shield regen and hull healing, this required high level EPtS so I thought "why not run a matching EPtW?", having taken away TT I had the ability to run APB and FAW together, coupled with high level EPtW I was able to just maintain overcapped weapon power, the same concept could be used on the Galaxy (the ship I orginally designed the build for as a 'fix') and the Oddy bringing the Star cruiser and the Galaxy up to par with the Sovi's more restrained builds.
Obviously you can A2B it but... yeah.
Interesting...
...does the [Elite Fleet Regenerative Shield Array Mk XII [Cap]x2 [ResB] [Adapt]] make a noticeable difference compared to a comparable resilient shield?
EDIT:
Why Tractor Beam?
If i where you, i would put TSS I to the ensign station and use Feedback pulse I or Tractor Beam repulsors instead. (just an idea)
I know you are reluctant to use A2B, but since the colldowns of powers like RSP are quiet long, is it still possible to tank long enough?
When using this build with a Galaxy, what power do you put at the 3. engineering ensign station?
Yes it does as the whole point of the build is to maximise the regeneration potential of the ship to make up for the lack of TT and compensate for the slow manual distro. as such it has to be a regen shield of some sort (for concept testing I used the Omega force shields which work just as well)
With regard to TB vs TSS I found the one TSS used as needed to be enough and TB reduces target defence giving you the ability to score more crits and the same for your team mates.
On A2B, I haven't done any A2B testing with the build... I suppose if you dropped EPtW to level 1 and raised RSP to level 2 you might be able to pull it off... you'd need another form of resist though, maybe PH? Again, I haven't done any A2B testing so I can't say for certain but I suppose it might be possible with an eng or a sci toon.
http://www.kaysvaultofstuff.com/tt-less-galaxy.html
I left it empty as I used the EPtX powers at level 3 leaving the ensign equally useless, I suppose you could rejig the powers a bit... perhaps taking a second DEM to make up for EPtW1 rather than 3...
I'd invite you to play with it, I'd love to see the results, maybe I can use them to refine the concept and make alternative versions of it
It's 7-10k-ish dps, although I don't care about it. It's fun and survives pretty much everything, rescuing all ships on the breach solo in separation mode (this is where the EPtE for example shines). The TSS with tractor beam DOFF removes Borg boarding parties as well.
Right now I'm experimenting with APD I, trying to sacrifice my own damage for team beneficial tanking.
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That's why i'm looking for a more sturdy but still offensive alternative myself.
I'm already testing something similar with my Engineers Fleet Heavy Cruiser Retrofit.
It includes the Full Borg set, the nukara particle converter and the Romulan Hyper-Plasma torpedo Launcher (which is a beautiful fire-and-forget weapon IMO).
I'll post the full build later, after a bit more testing.
I tried a similar build with my Science Character flying a Mirror Star Cruiser, but strangely it doesn't really work. I think the Star Cruisers turn rate is killing it for me, too slow and always a bit too late to line up torpedoes and the ship gets blown up it's not even funny, lol.
I'll do a bit more testing for a few days with this build. If it works, i'm going to replace the Antiproton Arrays with Fleet antiprotons and get some better Engineering armor consoles (+turn).
DOFFs:
2x Energy Weapons Officer (50% beam recharge)
3x Damage Control (EmptX recharge)
Maybe i should use another Deflector/Impulse/Shield Set?
OT: when using my build at a Star Cruiser i'd just remove the Torpedo Spread and add a Science team to the ensign Science Station.
As a science captain I would grab the sensor scan doff as this allows you to use the ability defensively in the same way as RSF, you should also remember that sci fleet is a massive shield resist power. I can't comment on the skill table or traits etc as you haven't filled those fields in.
HERE is an updated build. I just noticed that i haven't changed the Skills for more than two years, lol.
I don't know what i was thinking
Regarding traits, i'm a bit confused by the sheer amount of range. I don't really have a clue which ones do create synergies with the BOFF powers i use.
Because of recent events, i am thinking about changing to my good old Galaxy -R.
Well, the Gal-R does have a slightly better boff layout in the science ensign.
In terms of skill tree, there is nothing wrong with yours really though you could refine it a bit I would put that in the realm of optionals.
Your space traits look to be very offensive, I would make them more defensive while practising with the build and slowing make them more offensive again once you are happy with it, I would also trade your monotaniums for neutroniums, you could put universal consoles in your sci slots... I can't think right now of what you might do with that though... I'm too tired to build ships right now