Reward is scaled on the time taken to complete a mission. It's just a case that some missions are "broken" in that sense. Just because ISE can be run in 4-7 minutes by an average group, doesn't mean that ISE is not meant to be near a 15 minute run.
Notice how much of the new content is futureproofed, while things like ISE are not. Futureproofed? Yes, they have periods of time built in to them to enforce a certain amount of time or they have a certain amount of travel built in to them to try to enforce a certain amount of time.
They need to do a remaster of ISE and other such things so that they are brought in line with the other content - that the time taken for it and other such things is in line with other content - so that the rewards from it and other such things is brought in line with other content.
It's not a case that other content needs to reward more - it's that ISE needs to take longer for the rewards it offers.
Not only is ISE itself easier than in years past, but with all the powercreep it is even easier - thus faster - thus it rewards on a broken time scale.
I am surprised we haven't seen a remaster of them already - perhaps X2 or S10, eh?
But there should be increased reward for accomplishing the objective sooner. Cryptic broke the old STFs with constant powercreep, the players just optimized it (as they should). Making the players stand there and spin the wheels is a way of punishing them for Cryptics errors. Recipe for making the players go do something else.
But there should be increased reward for accomplishing the objective sooner. Cryptic broke the old STFs with constant powercreep, the players just optimized it (as they should). Making the players stand there and spin the wheels is a way of punishing them for Cryptics errors. Recipe for making the players go do something else.
Which is where you include optionals that provide increased rewards...you can still have something that takes ~15 minutes that will provide varying rewards depending on how well the group performs during that ~15 minutes.
It doesn't have to be a case of spinning wheels - it's something they corrected during the Mirror Event. There was the issue of folks obliterating everything and twiddling their thumbs - they fixed it to there were more waves.
Take ISE for example and how it starts. You blast the Cube and two Spheres - wham, bam, obliteration. Imagine if that initial encounter lasted a set period of time and waves continued to come out of the gate during that period of time (akin to fighting the Voth in the Undine SBZ). You provide an optional reward that scales with the number of waves defeated during that time period. You reward the better players for their better performance...they can get increased rewards - without turning it into the 2-5 minute fiasco that it is currently and sets it so far apart from the rest of the content.
There are many ways one could go about rewarding performance - while still maintaining the ~15 minute base.
edit: And it doesn't actually have to be 15 minutes - it just has to be balanced around some set point. A 30 minute mission that's twice as easy to do as a 15 minute mission would be an example. Something that can be done in 7.5 minutes but that is twice as hard as a 15 minute mission would be another example. It's just a case of trying to balance the content in some fashion, so that folks have a choice rather than a false choice.
The name of the server we play on is Holodeck.
Almost everything can be replayed...like a Holodeck program.
It's pretty much the foundation of the game...it's a pseudo futuristic themepark.
There are better MMOs with way less instancing. The instancing implementation (time gates) is also lame. This is a quasi-MMO, single-player experience, 75% of the time.
There's just not a better Star Trek MMO than this one. I enjoy my ships. :cool:
There are better MMOs with way less instancing. The instancing implementation (time gates) is also lame. This is a quasi-MMO, single-player experience, 75% of the time.
There's just not a better Star Trek MMO than this one. I enjoy my ships. :cool:
No doubt folks will have different preferences, was just a case of saying that it's so part of the foundation of what STO is - that it would require a STO2 for it to be any different.
I just wanted to pipe and mention something else that I didn't see brought up:
TL; DR - I normally play single player stuff, and don't feel confident to start joining the PvE content. Others also may be of a similar mindset, which may also be affecting the numbers.
As a lone-wolf type player, I have avoided the PvE multiplayer stuff for well over 3 years now. This possibly makes me a big wimp, but I don't like the idea of playing a map where I have NO IDEA what to expect (telling me to read a wiki is like telling someone to learn guitar by only watching youtube clips and never ever practising - I can get an idea, but it's too much info to hold in my head all at once, because I learn better by doing.)
On top of this, there is also the crippling guilt (see above: 'big wimp') that comes with knowing that any mistake (my favourite way of learning) that I make is suffered by OTHERS - e.g. failing Optionals, not knowing about the 10% rule on certain STFs, etc.).
I'm not saying that anything should be changed. I'm explaining why I don't do them. I now have some experience in it thanks to joining a fleet, but I'm still only interested in missions that I already know. So...Conduit, basically. So far, at least. (Anyone else who is like me in this regard, I highly suggest you find a friendly fleet if you can.)
Again - not saying anything should be changed.
Keeping in mind that I'm just some random dude on the internet: What I would like to see added is a single player training option for a lot of the PvE stuff. I would be playing most of the shared PvE content (instead of making new characters) if I was confident in being able to enjoy them and not ruin it for others.
The training content could reward, say, 5 Rep Marks and 360 dil, and would also be time gated. As a player, I think it would be fair to make it so that training content didn't trigger the Rep daily mark reward.
It would also double as an excellent PvE warmup first thing of a gaming session, and could also bring new achievements/accolades/trophies.
I think that this would bring in many players like me (assuming they exist) - I did hammer the living daylights out of the MU event when it was on, figuring that other players like me would also be coming out of the woodwork for it. If it was still up, I would totally still be playing, 100% guarantee, no question - because I have confidence that I can play it and have fun without making a fool/nuisance out of myself.
Just my 2 cents worth, have a good day/night/whatever.
It's one of those things where the single-player content for certain reps is not on par with the single-player content for other reps as well, eh?
For example: I've got a guy that I dread taking into ISE - but the Defera stuff is nowhere near as rewarding as hitting up the Voth, Undine, New Rom stuff. It's not that single-player stuff should be anywhere near as rewarding as the team stuff; but the single-player stuff is so out of whack...meh.
One, I'm primarily a solo player, though I don't mind teaming up with one or two other people. As a casual player with irregular availability to play, this suits me best.
But the queues are all 5-man. That's cool, too, if the PvE queue I want to play just then is available.
Like a lot of people have said, there are some queues that just don't have players in them. There are a lot of reasons for that, but the bottom line is that you can't jump into a specific queue whenever you feel like it -- and there aren't a lot of alternatives when you need specific rewards and none of those queues are active.
Omega is one good example. I don't want to run Elite. I've never run Elite. The Normal queues aren't always active when I want to play. And Defera is the only resort for a solo player like me.
There are specific PvE scenarios that I simply do not enjoy and would rather not play at all. But what alternatives are there?
I for one would like to see more solo-player PvE options whereby I can get the marks I need playing a scenario I enjoy without necessarily queuing up for a PUG.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Which is where you include optionals that provide increased rewards...you can still have something that takes ~15 minutes that will provide varying rewards depending on how well the group performs during that ~15 minutes.
It doesn't have to be a case of spinning wheels - it's something they corrected during the Mirror Event. There was the issue of folks obliterating everything and twiddling their thumbs - they fixed it to there were more waves.
And created a new issue to where the game would continue to spawn infinite enemies to the point where no amount of firepower available from any given pug would ever be able to get the max reward (you can't close a rift or pop a satellite when people are shooting at you). Hence all the teams composed of people who decided, "TRIBBLE this, I'm just going to sit here at the spawn point and wait for Obisek to get rid of them himself because I just want Mirror Hakeev. I could give a **** about the per-instance reward, and there's no actual failure condition for this mission so going afk doesn't matter."
The correct fix would have been to make that an ascended glitch and just end the damn timer with a bonus reward after closing a certain number of rifts. Timegating things like that just makes the queues annoying and drives people away if there isn't a specific thing they want out of it. To continue the example, MIE participation dropped precipitously after people started getting Hakeev because the queue was a pain in the TRIBBLE.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Personally I think they should remove the queues entirely, make each place into it's own world and make people go to it to do the content, and while they're at it they could expand that world to include other missions and stuff as well.
The Voth Battlezone is a good start to this, but needs to be a mix between that and a place like New Romulus. We need areas that aren't necessarily able to be captured and has a dynamic combat system that constantly changes and evolves so we have to be strategic and plan properly.
Wishful thinking though probably.
Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head. - Euripides
I no longer do any Bug Hunting work for Cryptic. I may resume if a serious attempt to fix the game is made.
The game doesn't suffer from a lack of PVE content.
The game suffers from a lack of viable PVE content, due to game design.
STO heavily pushes the player population into certain directions. This is due to whatever shiny or reputation that is rolled out. There's also the fact certain queued "STFs" reward very poorly for the time you put in.
In short, the game heavily promotes Locust player movement. There's a lot of stuff on the queues but 75% of it is of no use to established players. Once players leave certain areas that require a number of players to even successfully do, following players are kind of SOL.
Example: When everyone was working Rom Rep, it was all about Epohh raising and Mine Trap. You can still do Epohhs but is very time consuming to get the factory line going. Mine Trap was rewarding and quick since the queues popped a lot on this. But now that everyone has moved to Voth, then Undine Reps & Instances, Mine Trap almost never pops anymore.
Personally I think they should remove the queues entirely, make each place into it's own world and make people go to it to do the content, and while they're at it they could expand that world to include other missions and stuff as well.
The Voth Battlezone is a good start to this, but needs to be a mix between that and a place like New Romulus. We need areas that aren't necessarily able to be captured and has a dynamic combat system that constantly changes and evolves so we have to be strategic and plan properly.
Wishful thinking though probably.
Well, considering that many of them were like that in the past.... I'm going with no. besides, it made things a lot harder to get started.
Personally I think they should remove the queues entirely, make each place into it's own world and make people go to it to do the content, and while they're at it they could expand that world to include other missions and stuff as well.
I understand what you're saying and I kind of agree with you, but so far that has only worked with the open adventure zones that you can run around in and engage whatever targets you want. Stuff like ISE is heavily scripted and doesnt work in that can kind of scenario. Even Ker'rat is scripted to a degree ("read 8 codes, destroy 4 hulks"). More adventure zones would be good, and I would love to see some truly open hunting zones where you can just fly around shooting stuff without any kind of linked objective. What I would really *love* are warzones between the different faction spaces, things like ~Borg controlled areas where you can try to push them back, or ~Tholian Assembly sector space and if you enter a system you get ganked.
I primarily focus on the following PvE STFs for the dilithium reward:
- Crystalline Catastrophe Elite
- Infected: The Condiut Elite
- Khitomer Vortex Elite
- The Cure Found Elite (but not as often as the other Borg STF)
- Starbase 24 (once in a while since it's only 480 dil)
- Gorn Minefield (once in a while since it's only 480 dil)
- The Big Dig (if it queues up, most times it does not)
For rep system I do the following:
- The above mentioned Borg STFs
- Storming the Spire Elite
- Azure Nebula Rescue
Just for fun I do the following since I do not care about the reward:
- Colony Invasion
- The Vault: Ensnared
I would like to play the following STFs, but apparently they are more or less defunct since queue them up for hours at a time is simply a waste:
- Minetrap
- Breaking the Planet
- The Breach Elite (I don't do anymore 'cuz I get tired of seeing myself get blown up in after season 8.5)
****************************************
There was a prior post about eliminating non-elite STFs. I disagree. Before playing elite STFs I play the normal STFs so that I get an understanding of what to do. I prefer to totally F-Up while learning what to in normal STFs and fail the mission than to do the learning process in the elite STFs... unless of course players do not mind high failure rates.
Additionally, elite STFs are not for everyone especially those who are simply looking for a causal challenge yet still be able to earn marks for the rep system. On top of that it is not like developers need to split there time developing normal / Elite STFs. Both are basically the same mission with the elites have something extra.
I don't think this is a question of having too much of a focus on PVE content. For anyone whose branched out of the PC and the MMO you might have found your way to a little title called Halo. Back in the day, monumental population, all going at their variety of PVP content, but every now and then there was a significant issue with how may "playlists" (ie. PVE queues) the devs were funneling their population through. Even though multiplayer was the most successful part of the game, and even though Halo was one of the most successful multiplayer games out there (at least back in 2008 which is primarily when I'm referring to), they needed to scale back the number of "playlists" to correspond to the number of people entering the system. We have a similar situation now. PVE is probably one of the most popular and by far the healthiest parts of STO but we simply have too many individual queues for people to meander about in. Some things (like your STF's and the other more easily grindable missions) may none the less still see a sufficient number of people to be reliably playable but others like the Mine Trap just have too many other alternatives for consistent queues to develop.
It's a question of diverting the flow of people in too many ways for the given population, NOT that PVE as a concept is overplayed.
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
make the rewards the same for all pve content and let the content speak for itself
As well as making all pve content choice of marks
uniform Dilithium reward and choice of marks will allow fleets to do content together and will show cryptic what content needs improving instead of blackmasiling us to do crappy content because its the only place to get the marks
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
make the rewards the same for all pve content and let the content speak for itself
So then why play a SB fleet defense when a shorter run through a Fleet alert would net just as much? The former may offer more interesting gameplay but becaues the latter is a much more efficient use of grinding time it's going to be a much less appealing choice however the content compares.
Rewards should scale according to time and effort, there's really no question about this. Letting the missions "speak for themselves" may be a grand ideal to shoot for but it can't be relied upon to maintain queue populations (as without that base of people just doing it for the marks those that want to play the content for the simple fun of it are going to have a MUCH more difficult time finding games in high-effort missions.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
So then why play a SB fleet defense when a shorter run through a Fleet alert would net just as much? The former may offer more interesting gameplay but becaues the latter is a much more efficient use of grinding time it's going to be a much less appealing choice however the content compares.
Rewards should scale according to time and effort, there's really no question about this. Letting the missions "speak for themselves" may be a grand ideal to shoot for but it can't be relied upon to maintain queue populations (as without that base of people just doing it for the marks those that want to play the content for the simple fun of it are going to have a MUCH more difficult time finding games in high-effort missions.)
You tke wy from long missions.....Add to short missions
Find the balence
Or if it isnt too hard scale to Ave projected time...With romulans and crazy DPS time gate them so all are the same length
If you finish too fast everyone has a few minutes to chat and sociaalize :P
Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
In a perfect world, missions would pay out based on a fixed scale factoring in performance, time spend in mission, and a fixed payout schedule...
For example, if the determination is we should "earn" 2880 Dil and 100 marks/hour, then a 5 minute ISE (from queueing till drop-out) with optional pays out 1/12th of this amount (240/9), and a 1/2 hour KASE with a 15 minute blasting of a cloak-heavy Donatra pays 1400/50...
Fail the optional, reward dropped 25%. Multi-optional missions have their reductions based on a percentage value (2 optionals means a 12.5% reduction per failure).
Of course, this is calculated dynamically based on the actual mission results - a true noob ISE that takes 15 minutes and squeaks by with the optional would give the 15 minute payout (720/25)
This way, it's less of a case where "we all need to pile on fleet alert / ISE / poking in Undine BZ for quickie rewards" and more a case where people can play "what they want" and all earn the appropriate baseline payouts...
Then we can begin to let the missions "stand on their own merit" - because at this point the mission choice is less about the final reward and time/effort calculation, and more about playing the content that people want to play... Obviously missions that are still ignored after this point can be dropped because they are determined to be something that nobody wants to play...
Detecting big-time "anti-old-school" bias here. NX? Lobi. TOS/TMP Connie? Super-promotion-box. (aka the two hardest ways to get ships) Excelsior & all 3 TNG "big hero" ships? C-Store. Please Equalize...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
If we have too much PvE content I wonder what expansion 2 is... a redux of more old leveling content? lol
Another thing is no interviews since then so ppl are kinda dropping off the grid with no idea what they are up to or any plans other than seeing posts by devs saying oh we are fixing things but no eta or info can be given on whats being done lol.
Undine was alright for awhile collected my undine rep collectors items now... be back when expansion 2 is out
IN an interview with priority one Al Captain Geko Rivera says that we have too much in the way of PvE ques. Whats more is he went on to say that in the future many of the pve ques are going to be removed or only available for featured events.
Dunno bout the rest of you but this is extremely upsetting to me. I personally feel that STO is extremely lacking in the way of PvE ques. And that what we need are more PvE ques, specifically organized fleet ques. Something that could be like raiding in other MMOs. we need more not less.
By too much he means that with so many options the population has become diluted and many events won't pop because there aren't enough people queueing for them.
By having less available at a given time there are less choices, and less dilution of the population, making the queues pop faster. By putting them in a rotation where only certain queues are available at certain times, it give an opportunity for lesser played content to have a better shot of getting played.
Also, you title is massively out of context and very inflammatory, and isn't really accurate.
We need less gated TRIBBLE and more good challenging content that players can beat at a speed that scales with how powerful they are. Basically stfs and nws. More of that type.
I've seen a lot of posts and chat talking about how the longer queues and especially the gated ones aren't worth peoples time. For instance the mission Storming the Spire, what a joke, bad marks and it takes a gated amount of time. Azure Nebula rescue is something similar to it as well.
The waiting period at the beginning of queues is just lol as well, no one cares about what cutscenes or briefings have to say they just wanna get in kill all the stuff get the marks and loot and gtfo. The purpose it slows is to slow players progression down and to bolster ingame queue numbers.
like we need more stf's in my opinion they aren't worth playing any more since all the space weapons was removed
Scaling, changing the rewards, restoring sanity to the difficulty, creating a proactive AI - all are great topics of discussion.
The reason why there are too many queues? Cryptic tried to revamp them, adding more than a dozen new versions. And they made them difficult, while cutting dilithium.
Players who have enjoyed them, found what they had (in terms of gear) was no longer elite. The fun was sucked out of the game for them. Myself I have 1 toon now capable of being competitive, but the cost was insane. All the work put into my other toons seems pointless.
Now add insult to injury. More video's of people with the new leet gear doing 100K dps. Not earned gear, but purchased and upgraded with cash.
So the players have left. They can't compete - and why bother?
Now the queues are empty.
A good chunk of our fleet is playing RIFT tonight.
Cryptic has a long way to go to get our interest as a group back.
I wanna see single player queues. I don't like other players. I don't wanna play with them, I don't wanna talk to them, I don't want their help. If I can't complete a simple stf on my own, the. What's the point of playing? And what's the point of getting any kills in an stf if all the loot that your kills drop is up for grabs to anyone else? So, more queues are required, but single player ones, and just nix the PvP queues and leave it to kerrat.
What if They just made it so that at certain times of the day each individual STF offered 25% to 35% more of the reward it contained?
They would have to add decent rewards to a few of the older ones, but essentially what this would do is create a wandering minstrel type of following.
It would be similar to the old hourly process, but instead of a particular STF being available only occasionally, it would always be around but it's Reward would be increased by whatever percentage say, three times every 24 hours, thus making it's queue more likely to be filled.
:cool:
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I wanna see single player queues. I don't like other players. I don't wanna play with them, I don't wanna talk to them, I don't want their help. If I can't complete a simple stf on my own, the. What's the point of playing? And what's the point of getting any kills in an stf if all the loot that your kills drop is up for grabs to anyone else? So, more queues are required, but single player ones, and just nix the PvP queues and leave it to kerrat.
That kinda-sorta completely defeats/negates the meaning of MMO.
:cool:
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
It truly is amazing for them to say there is too much content spreading players out, and then here they go and add a THIRD queue skill variable when only two as always would have suited just fine. But no, gotta split the players even more because of a smaller fraction of players who have broken the DPS meters all the while creating even more new queues. There should only be advanced (a more sane advanced than we have now) and elite queues for STF's, and for others, only normal and elite. No more!
Comments
But there should be increased reward for accomplishing the objective sooner. Cryptic broke the old STFs with constant powercreep, the players just optimized it (as they should). Making the players stand there and spin the wheels is a way of punishing them for Cryptics errors. Recipe for making the players go do something else.
Which is where you include optionals that provide increased rewards...you can still have something that takes ~15 minutes that will provide varying rewards depending on how well the group performs during that ~15 minutes.
It doesn't have to be a case of spinning wheels - it's something they corrected during the Mirror Event. There was the issue of folks obliterating everything and twiddling their thumbs - they fixed it to there were more waves.
Take ISE for example and how it starts. You blast the Cube and two Spheres - wham, bam, obliteration. Imagine if that initial encounter lasted a set period of time and waves continued to come out of the gate during that period of time (akin to fighting the Voth in the Undine SBZ). You provide an optional reward that scales with the number of waves defeated during that time period. You reward the better players for their better performance...they can get increased rewards - without turning it into the 2-5 minute fiasco that it is currently and sets it so far apart from the rest of the content.
There are many ways one could go about rewarding performance - while still maintaining the ~15 minute base.
edit: And it doesn't actually have to be 15 minutes - it just has to be balanced around some set point. A 30 minute mission that's twice as easy to do as a 15 minute mission would be an example. Something that can be done in 7.5 minutes but that is twice as hard as a 15 minute mission would be another example. It's just a case of trying to balance the content in some fashion, so that folks have a choice rather than a false choice.
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
The name of the server we play on is Holodeck.
Almost everything can be replayed...like a Holodeck program.
It's pretty much the foundation of the game...it's a pseudo futuristic themepark.
There are better MMOs with way less instancing. The instancing implementation (time gates) is also lame. This is a quasi-MMO, single-player experience, 75% of the time.
There's just not a better Star Trek MMO than this one. I enjoy my ships. :cool:
IKS Korrasami (Fleet B'rel Bird of Prey Retrofit T5-U)
No doubt folks will have different preferences, was just a case of saying that it's so part of the foundation of what STO is - that it would require a STO2 for it to be any different.
TL; DR - I normally play single player stuff, and don't feel confident to start joining the PvE content. Others also may be of a similar mindset, which may also be affecting the numbers.
As a lone-wolf type player, I have avoided the PvE multiplayer stuff for well over 3 years now. This possibly makes me a big wimp, but I don't like the idea of playing a map where I have NO IDEA what to expect (telling me to read a wiki is like telling someone to learn guitar by only watching youtube clips and never ever practising - I can get an idea, but it's too much info to hold in my head all at once, because I learn better by doing.)
On top of this, there is also the crippling guilt (see above: 'big wimp') that comes with knowing that any mistake (my favourite way of learning) that I make is suffered by OTHERS - e.g. failing Optionals, not knowing about the 10% rule on certain STFs, etc.).
I'm not saying that anything should be changed. I'm explaining why I don't do them. I now have some experience in it thanks to joining a fleet, but I'm still only interested in missions that I already know. So...Conduit, basically. So far, at least. (Anyone else who is like me in this regard, I highly suggest you find a friendly fleet if you can.)
Again - not saying anything should be changed.
Keeping in mind that I'm just some random dude on the internet: What I would like to see added is a single player training option for a lot of the PvE stuff. I would be playing most of the shared PvE content (instead of making new characters) if I was confident in being able to enjoy them and not ruin it for others.
The training content could reward, say, 5 Rep Marks and 360 dil, and would also be time gated. As a player, I think it would be fair to make it so that training content didn't trigger the Rep daily mark reward.
It would also double as an excellent PvE warmup first thing of a gaming session, and could also bring new achievements/accolades/trophies.
I think that this would bring in many players like me (assuming they exist) - I did hammer the living daylights out of the MU event when it was on, figuring that other players like me would also be coming out of the woodwork for it. If it was still up, I would totally still be playing, 100% guarantee, no question - because I have confidence that I can play it and have fun without making a fool/nuisance out of myself.
Just my 2 cents worth, have a good day/night/whatever.
For example: I've got a guy that I dread taking into ISE - but the Defera stuff is nowhere near as rewarding as hitting up the Voth, Undine, New Rom stuff. It's not that single-player stuff should be anywhere near as rewarding as the team stuff; but the single-player stuff is so out of whack...meh.
One, I'm primarily a solo player, though I don't mind teaming up with one or two other people. As a casual player with irregular availability to play, this suits me best.
But the queues are all 5-man. That's cool, too, if the PvE queue I want to play just then is available.
Like a lot of people have said, there are some queues that just don't have players in them. There are a lot of reasons for that, but the bottom line is that you can't jump into a specific queue whenever you feel like it -- and there aren't a lot of alternatives when you need specific rewards and none of those queues are active.
Omega is one good example. I don't want to run Elite. I've never run Elite. The Normal queues aren't always active when I want to play. And Defera is the only resort for a solo player like me.
There are specific PvE scenarios that I simply do not enjoy and would rather not play at all. But what alternatives are there?
I for one would like to see more solo-player PvE options whereby I can get the marks I need playing a scenario I enjoy without necessarily queuing up for a PUG.
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The correct fix would have been to make that an ascended glitch and just end the damn timer with a bonus reward after closing a certain number of rifts. Timegating things like that just makes the queues annoying and drives people away if there isn't a specific thing they want out of it. To continue the example, MIE participation dropped precipitously after people started getting Hakeev because the queue was a pain in the TRIBBLE.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
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The Voth Battlezone is a good start to this, but needs to be a mix between that and a place like New Romulus. We need areas that aren't necessarily able to be captured and has a dynamic combat system that constantly changes and evolves so we have to be strategic and plan properly.
Wishful thinking though probably.
The game suffers from a lack of viable PVE content, due to game design.
STO heavily pushes the player population into certain directions. This is due to whatever shiny or reputation that is rolled out. There's also the fact certain queued "STFs" reward very poorly for the time you put in.
In short, the game heavily promotes Locust player movement. There's a lot of stuff on the queues but 75% of it is of no use to established players. Once players leave certain areas that require a number of players to even successfully do, following players are kind of SOL.
Example: When everyone was working Rom Rep, it was all about Epohh raising and Mine Trap. You can still do Epohhs but is very time consuming to get the factory line going. Mine Trap was rewarding and quick since the queues popped a lot on this. But now that everyone has moved to Voth, then Undine Reps & Instances, Mine Trap almost never pops anymore.
My character Tsin'xing
- Crystalline Catastrophe Elite
- Infected: The Condiut Elite
- Khitomer Vortex Elite
- The Cure Found Elite (but not as often as the other Borg STF)
- Starbase 24 (once in a while since it's only 480 dil)
- Gorn Minefield (once in a while since it's only 480 dil)
- The Big Dig (if it queues up, most times it does not)
For rep system I do the following:
- The above mentioned Borg STFs
- Storming the Spire Elite
- Azure Nebula Rescue
Just for fun I do the following since I do not care about the reward:
- Colony Invasion
- The Vault: Ensnared
I would like to play the following STFs, but apparently they are more or less defunct since queue them up for hours at a time is simply a waste:
- Minetrap
- Breaking the Planet
- The Breach Elite (I don't do anymore 'cuz I get tired of seeing myself get blown up in after season 8.5)
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There was a prior post about eliminating non-elite STFs. I disagree. Before playing elite STFs I play the normal STFs so that I get an understanding of what to do. I prefer to totally F-Up while learning what to in normal STFs and fail the mission than to do the learning process in the elite STFs... unless of course players do not mind high failure rates.
Additionally, elite STFs are not for everyone especially those who are simply looking for a causal challenge yet still be able to earn marks for the rep system. On top of that it is not like developers need to split there time developing normal / Elite STFs. Both are basically the same mission with the elites have something extra.
I don't think this is a question of having too much of a focus on PVE content. For anyone whose branched out of the PC and the MMO you might have found your way to a little title called Halo. Back in the day, monumental population, all going at their variety of PVP content, but every now and then there was a significant issue with how may "playlists" (ie. PVE queues) the devs were funneling their population through. Even though multiplayer was the most successful part of the game, and even though Halo was one of the most successful multiplayer games out there (at least back in 2008 which is primarily when I'm referring to), they needed to scale back the number of "playlists" to correspond to the number of people entering the system. We have a similar situation now. PVE is probably one of the most popular and by far the healthiest parts of STO but we simply have too many individual queues for people to meander about in. Some things (like your STF's and the other more easily grindable missions) may none the less still see a sufficient number of people to be reliably playable but others like the Mine Trap just have too many other alternatives for consistent queues to develop.
It's a question of diverting the flow of people in too many ways for the given population, NOT that PVE as a concept is overplayed.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
As well as making all pve content choice of marks
uniform Dilithium reward and choice of marks will allow fleets to do content together and will show cryptic what content needs improving instead of blackmasiling us to do crappy content because its the only place to get the marks
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
So then why play a SB fleet defense when a shorter run through a Fleet alert would net just as much? The former may offer more interesting gameplay but becaues the latter is a much more efficient use of grinding time it's going to be a much less appealing choice however the content compares.
Rewards should scale according to time and effort, there's really no question about this. Letting the missions "speak for themselves" may be a grand ideal to shoot for but it can't be relied upon to maintain queue populations (as without that base of people just doing it for the marks those that want to play the content for the simple fun of it are going to have a MUCH more difficult time finding games in high-effort missions.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
You tke wy from long missions.....Add to short missions
Find the balence
Or if it isnt too hard scale to Ave projected time...With romulans and crazy DPS time gate them so all are the same length
If you finish too fast everyone has a few minutes to chat and sociaalize :P
Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng
JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
For example, if the determination is we should "earn" 2880 Dil and 100 marks/hour, then a 5 minute ISE (from queueing till drop-out) with optional pays out 1/12th of this amount (240/9), and a 1/2 hour KASE with a 15 minute blasting of a cloak-heavy Donatra pays 1400/50...
Fail the optional, reward dropped 25%. Multi-optional missions have their reductions based on a percentage value (2 optionals means a 12.5% reduction per failure).
Of course, this is calculated dynamically based on the actual mission results - a true noob ISE that takes 15 minutes and squeaks by with the optional would give the 15 minute payout (720/25)
This way, it's less of a case where "we all need to pile on fleet alert / ISE / poking in Undine BZ for quickie rewards" and more a case where people can play "what they want" and all earn the appropriate baseline payouts...
Then we can begin to let the missions "stand on their own merit" - because at this point the mission choice is less about the final reward and time/effort calculation, and more about playing the content that people want to play... Obviously missions that are still ignored after this point can be dropped because they are determined to be something that nobody wants to play...
To rob a line: [quote: Mariemaia Kushrenada] Forum Posting is much like an endless waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever. However, opinions will change upon the reading of my post.[/quote]
Another thing is no interviews since then so ppl are kinda dropping off the grid with no idea what they are up to or any plans other than seeing posts by devs saying oh we are fixing things but no eta or info can be given on whats being done lol.
Undine was alright for awhile collected my undine rep collectors items now... be back when expansion 2 is out
By too much he means that with so many options the population has become diluted and many events won't pop because there aren't enough people queueing for them.
By having less available at a given time there are less choices, and less dilution of the population, making the queues pop faster. By putting them in a rotation where only certain queues are available at certain times, it give an opportunity for lesser played content to have a better shot of getting played.
Also, you title is massively out of context and very inflammatory, and isn't really accurate.
like we need more stf's in my opinion they aren't worth playing any more since all the space weapons was removed
The reason why there are too many queues? Cryptic tried to revamp them, adding more than a dozen new versions. And they made them difficult, while cutting dilithium.
Players who have enjoyed them, found what they had (in terms of gear) was no longer elite. The fun was sucked out of the game for them. Myself I have 1 toon now capable of being competitive, but the cost was insane. All the work put into my other toons seems pointless.
Now add insult to injury. More video's of people with the new leet gear doing 100K dps. Not earned gear, but purchased and upgraded with cash.
So the players have left. They can't compete - and why bother?
Now the queues are empty.
A good chunk of our fleet is playing RIFT tonight.
Cryptic has a long way to go to get our interest as a group back.
None of this rep. When stfs were fun, and rewards were good.
I vote rollback to season 6, 2014!
^^
They would have to add decent rewards to a few of the older ones, but essentially what this would do is create a wandering minstrel type of following.
It would be similar to the old hourly process, but instead of a particular STF being available only occasionally, it would always be around but it's Reward would be increased by whatever percentage say, three times every 24 hours, thus making it's queue more likely to be filled.
:cool:
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
That kinda-sorta completely defeats/negates the meaning of MMO.
:cool:
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion