I can only suggest that you read some threads about how much Dilithium people are making in this game in a very short time - such as people doing ESTFs in minutes and doing several of them in an hour or two. There is a reason why this forum has had so many "raise the Dilithium cap" threads in it.
8000 Dilithium a day is exceptionally easy to do, if you've got two times 5-10 minutes a day on your schedule. There is a fortune to be made on the KDF side by having your Duty Officers waylay the transports and installations of your Omega Force, Nukara Strike Force, Dyson Joint Command allies, and putting the prisoners to work. More so if you're willing to hang on to your Gamma quadrant prisoners, as they work just as hard, but apparently they don't die good, so you get them back to try and work them to death again tomorrow.
The problem is that at end-game virtually everything you can do gives you Dilithium. Spend 10 minutes doing an ESTF and boom! A thousand Dilithum - and more if you want to convert your items for more Dilithium. If you actually spend an hour or two a day just playing the normal end-game things you are easily making the Dilithium you need. Now you might not be saving it for Zen, but making it is not the issue as Cryptic throws it at you - and even throws things like Mining Claims or Bonus events into the game to make it even easier to make more.
Indeed, did a single CSE run shortly before heading to work that netting me nearly 3000 dil ore in nano processors, marks and dil ore drop combined. A couple of CSE and ISE runs typically add more ore that I can refine that day.
And I repeat: these are not AVERAGE. They are EXCEPTIONAL. Average players play 1-2 hours a night. They don't spend that time farming Dil. They make likely 1-2k per night MAX. On a weekend, likely 3-5 hours.
Let's stop calling people who can finish an STF in 10 minutes 'average', shall we?
Please reconsider ARC. Please make it optional, at the least. PLEASE.
It seems the vast majority of your most active players (forum regulars) hate the idea... and while that's a small subset of the playerbase, I think it's an important constituency.
THE PLAYERS DO NOT WANT THIS.
And I repeat: these are not AVERAGE. They are EXCEPTIONAL. Average players play 1-2 hours a night. They don't spend that time farming Dil. They make likely 1-2k per night MAX. On a weekend, likely 3-5 hours.
Let's stop calling people who can finish an STF in 10 minutes 'average', shall we?
Dude, just doing 20 Doff missions will net you 1,000+ per day at level 50; and that just from a few minutes of clicking missions - and assuming you're not doing big payoff missions or have great quality Doffs either. And if you are a Klingon, as was said above, you can make several times that.
Even if it takes you 20 minutes to complete an ESTF like CES, as tekehd stated, you can make around 3,000 there. So in roughly 30 minutes - and far less if you're a slightly above average player - you have made 4,000 Dilithium from 1 STF and some Doffing.
And there is no way anyone at end-game is only making 1,000 - 2,000 per night. Heck, simply doing a B'tran Daily will make you almost 1,500, and that only takes 15-20 minutes.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Do you know what percentage of players understand and use the DOFF system, much less run 20 per night?
Do you know what percentage of players log in every night?
Do you know what percentage of players KNOW what a "B'Tran Daily" is??
Do you know what percentage of players KNOW that there is an STOwiki?
Do you know what percentage of players come to the forums???
Have you pugged any regular STFs lately?
The average player is vastly different from the average elite player.
I think you and I have a very different understanding of 'Average'.
Please reconsider ARC. Please make it optional, at the least. PLEASE.
It seems the vast majority of your most active players (forum regulars) hate the idea... and while that's a small subset of the playerbase, I think it's an important constituency.
THE PLAYERS DO NOT WANT THIS.
Do you know what percentage of players understand and use the DOFF system, much less run 20 per night?
Do you know what percentage of players log in every night?
Do you know what percentage of players KNOW what a "B'Tran Daily" is??
Do you know what percentage of players KNOW that there is an STOwiki?
Do you know what percentage of players come to the forums???
Have you pugged any regular STFs lately?
The average player is vastly different from the average elite player.
I think you and I have a very different understanding of 'Average'.
Ah, I see. When proven wrong you jump to extraneous statements. Ok...
Since players learn about the Strange New World mission at Level 5, I am going to assume that they know what an Exploration Daily is - whether is is Delta Volcanis at Level 5 or B'tran at Level 45+.
Since players learn about Doffs at Level 10, I am going to assume that they know what Doff mission are from Level 10 onward.
Since the game sends you to DS9 to learn about STFS at Level 40, I am going to assume that they know what an STF is.
And so on, and so on, and so on.
The point is that earning Dilithium is not difficult. You learn to do it at Level 5 in the game.
If you want something from the C-Store, but do not wish to buy it with your own money, then Cryptic gives you a very nice little system of earning it. Whether it takes you 1 month, 2 months, or 10 months, if you want that 10,000 Zen 9-Pack you can get it.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
If you buy 1 ship, and want the 3 ship-pack, buying them separately won't make a difference, true. You've spent 7,500 zen either way. Cryptic's never given anyone a retroactive discount, nor should they.
Of course, if you buy one ship, then want the 9 ship-pack, it's trickier. What would've cost you 12,500 Zen (the initial ship plus pack) now becomes a minimum (assuming you only bought the one ship) of 17,500 zen (the original plus two more separate ships, and two 3-packs)... You're always going to be at least 5,000 zen down the hole this way.
Not that I care especially. It's a Frankenship, so, not interested. But I see the concern. Somewhat.
Also, regarding the KDF doff missions... that's 5 or 10 minutes for one character. With the rate of return on these assignments in prisoners that trade in at 500 dil per 4, or 350 dil per 3 (if they don't crit and triple) and absurd quantities of contraband, even doing this just once a day is an easy 5,000 dilithium daily, doing nothing but circling the 3-sector point between Eta Eridani, Pi Canis Major and Regulus. (And a stop by the Fleet base to drop off the contraband. Which you can also bridge-account-bank to your other characters.)
It's like no one understands that 80+% of players never make it to the forums.
It's like assuming because someone was introduced to a concept one time, they automatically know all the ins and outs.
It's like thinking that people who only have 1 hour a night to play a video game choose to spend it running from sector to sector setting up duty officer missions, which they are unlikely to know how to maximize the potential of...
because they only have one hour a night to play.
Cry you a river indeed. Try to understand from the point of view of someone who does not play 30+ hours a week.
(And I actually DO play many hours a week - but I don't have kids, and am lucky to have free time. I do understand that coming home after a 12 hour day sitting in front of a PC makes it less likely to do so at the end of my day, so I am an outlier. Like 85% of the people on the forums.)
Please reconsider ARC. Please make it optional, at the least. PLEASE.
It seems the vast majority of your most active players (forum regulars) hate the idea... and while that's a small subset of the playerbase, I think it's an important constituency.
THE PLAYERS DO NOT WANT THIS.
And Galadiman: Those slippers ain't red, and those bricks ain't yellow. We're dealing with reality here, not wishes. One of the selling points of Zen is that it can be exchanged for dilithium, saving you time if you don't have any, or just don't think it's worth it. If people who have little time to play get an easy pass to everything the game has to offer, what's the other part of the playerbase going to do with those other 29 hours?
THE difference is, in a supermarket, it costs them money ("marginal cost of sale") to stock, heat/cool, move, etc. one more soda. It costs NOTHING to sell one more ship (no marginal cost of sale). Once the initial cost of production is covered, there is no cost to cover... subscription charges cover any marginal costs of memory, etc.
Actually, not true. Additional sales simply spread the cost of "production" out across more units, incrementally increasing the profit margin on each unit.
Also, many people seem to believe that data (which is what these ships are at a basic level, a group of 1's and 0's in a database) is free once it is created. In fact, there are ongoing costs associated with that data. All the cost of running and maintaining the datacenter. Those costs get spread out across the products being sold, whether they're toothbrushes or access codes.
Finally, the intellectual property has a worth of its own. Any transaction involving that IP then necessarily deals with some increment of the cost to create that IP.
Any business that creates IP, whether it be music, data, designs for buildings, anything that is at its core an idea rather than a tangible product, must still get compensated for that idea. Because in the end, that is all they have that is worth anything, and if they give it away, they cease to exist.
As an Architect, I deal with these issues daily, so I apologize for getting a bit pedantic about it.
It's like no one understands that 80+% of players never make it to the forums.
Which is irrelevant to the discussion as Dilithium, Dailies, Doffs, and STFs are all explained to you in-game. Plus there are many, many, many Chat Channels people can join to get even more information on those subjects - as well as just asking in Zone Chat. You never need to come to the forum to learn these things.
It's like thinking that people who only have 1 hour a night to play a video game choose to spend it running from sector to sector setting up duty officer missions, which they are unlikely to know how to maximize the potential of...
Your argument was the "Average players play 1-2 hours a night" but "make likely 1-2k per night MAX."
Now your example is down to 1 hour of play time. You can keep changing your data all you want to try and justify your stance but it will not change what I told you above.
The average player can run a single Exploration Daily and make 1,480 Dilithium in 15-20 minutes. That blows your 1-2K theory out the door. The average player can pick 20 Doff missions in any Sector and have a great Dilithum return of 1,000+ - they don't need to go chasing around the Sectors.
because they only have one hour a night to play.
I can only assume in your next post that you will tell me people are only playing 30 minutes a day. Of course I will tell you that they can do an ESTF and some Doffs and make 4,000+ in that 30 minutes.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
I don't get the big deal, if you don't like it, don't support it.
Does anyone need these ships? They aren't that good, they are a toy you'll put away and play with real ships again in no time. If you don't like the direction the devs are heading then don't support them.
People needing everything they seen kinda gets old fast
This.
Vote with your money, and learn to resist that urge to buy every little ship that slightly interests you.
ok let me ask this question to all of you sitting on the fence or saying the ship is not worth it AND PAY ATTENTION TO THE RESPONSES DEVS.........if the consles were able to be used on any ship would this make you more agreeable to a purchase so that means you buy the pack and you can use the consoles and get all the bonuses on ANY ship you stick them on....we can already do this with the lame hirogen escort console to a degree as that console works on any escort ....why not just any freaking ship smh .......anyway what say you fellow players?
Vote with your money, and learn to resist that urge to buy every little ship that slightly interests you.
While I have no plans on buying the ships myself - they just do not interest me - I have no problem with people wanting to buy them, or being willing to buy them. The more money people spend the more content the rest of us get.
Plus it is not as though spending a lot of money on a game you like is an uncommon occurrence. Heck, go to Ebay and look up Loot Cards for World Of War.craft. I think the Spectral Tigers are going for around $500.00.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
Dilithium is not something you just use to transform into Zen, not anymore because we have Reputation gear, we have Fleet Gear and the whole thing is now a ingame currency.
Right now 10000 Zen is 1,330,000 Dilithium ... sure you can "get it" as long you "earn it" ... but I would never dump 1.3 million Dilithium on those ships.
I do not like the ships, myself, but I have no problem on people buying them if they do like them.
And there are many players in the game who have maxed-out their Reps (like me) or just are not that interested in doing all the Reps. To those people Dilithium is basically just a "buy-stuff-for-free" commodity. It does not take much looking on the Dilithium Exchange to see how much Zen gets purchased there per month.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
ok let me ask this question to all of you sitting on the fence or saying the ship is not worth it AND PAY ATTENTION TO THE RESPONSES DEVS.........if the consles were able to be used on any ship would this make you more agreeable to a purchase so that means you buy the pack and you can use the consoles and get all the bonuses on ANY ship you stick them on....we can already do this with the lame hirogen escort console to a degree as that console works on any escort ....why not just any freaking ship smh .......anyway what say you fellow players?
Fair question.
Answer is no.
Wouldn't make me at all more likely to buy the ships.
One way that STO doesn't go all-in on p2w is by restricting tier 5 ship consoles to specific ships.
That becomes a free for all, we're a significent step closer towards pure p2w.
Not a good idea, in my view.
If Cryptic started moving in that direction, I'd be considering playing and paying a whole lot less.
Its there to keep people from basically over paying, and then whining about refunds. If you buy say 1 KDF SD, then later on decide you want the other 2 most would send a ticket (Or 20) saying "well I already bought 1 can i get a discount on the other 2" It's a huge headache for dev's ...All this does is keep players from having to pay twice for the same thing.
But like what others have said, I honestly can't believe they pumped out 9 versions of the same...dang...ship -.- good gawd
ok let me ask this question to all of you sitting on the fence or saying the ship is not worth it AND PAY ATTENTION TO THE RESPONSES DEVS.........if the consles were able to be used on any ship would this make you more agreeable to a purchase so that means you buy the pack and you can use the consoles and get all the bonuses on ANY ship you stick them on....we can already do this with the lame hirogen escort console to a degree as that console works on any escort ....why not just any freaking ship smh .......anyway what say you fellow players?
The consoles being unique to the ship doesnt bother me. Its the grind necessary to get a complete C-store ship...that and the 9 seperate ships...really? Just doesnt show a proper respect for either my time or my money.
That said, I think these ships show a lot of promise, especially the way I've been fitting my destroyers and escorts lately. Its a shame they've chosen to roll them out in this way otherwise..i'd have bought them in a heartbeat.
Made the C-store ships complete without the aniversary ship and I bet many would reconsider their stance. To late to deal with the grind issue for the aniversary ship.
I can see the reason for not offering them as a bundle after purchasing one since there would be no point. When you buy the bundle you get one ship for free, if you buy one separately why would you buy the bundle since you would be paying the same amount purchasing the remaining ships seperately, unless your complaint is that you expect some sort of discount for having already purchased a ship, if only things worked that way, but that's not to be.
When they said they were coming out with a 3 pack for each ship I was expecting a bit of variety, different appearances, different boom/nacelle configurations but they are just the same bloody ships with just very slight differences.
Coming out with these things right after making us grind for the same damn ship was a boner move, so what if it comes with a whole extra console slot and a special console with some near useless proc with a ridiculous cooldown, big frappin deal.
If this appeals to some people they are welcome to it and if they are satisfied with that, I am happy for them, but I'm gonna pass. I already did my thing chasing after Q, that's enough of that.
If something is not broken, don't fix it, if it is broken, don't leave it broken.
I can see the reason for not offering them as a bundle after purchasing one since there would be no point. When you buy the bundle you get one ship for free, if you buy one separately why would you buy the bundle since you would be paying the same amount purchasing the remaining ships seperately, unless your complaint is that you expect some sort of discount for having already purchased a ship, if only things worked that way, but that's not to be.
When they said they were coming out with a 3 pack for each ship I was expecting a bit of variety, different appearances, different boom/nacelle configurations but they are just the same bloody ships with just very slight differences.
Coming out with these things right after making us grind for the same damn ship was a boner move, so what if it comes with a whole extra console slot and a special console with some near useless proc with a ridiculous cooldown, big frappin deal.
If this appeals to some people they are welcome to it and if they are satisfied with that, I am happy for them, but I'm gonna pass. I already did my thing chasing after Q, that's enough of that.
It's more complicated than that, as there are two levels here, each 3-pay has a 3 for price of 2 deal on the pack (as usual), and there is a whole set set of packs which is also ANOTHER 3 for price of 2 on that. (or in context effectively 9 for the price of 4)
So you have the first of each set where buying the first for 2500 means you have to pay 2500 for each of the other two in that set for 2500 (total 7500 for that set) and then also having to buy the other two sets for 5000 each (10000) once that is done for a total cost of 17500.
I don't really agree with the complaints though, bulk deals is what they do. Save up for the bulk (it'll save you 12500 zen doing so) ~56% off.
Honestly don't care for the ships so cryptic can do what ever they like for the bundle and put what ever silly price tag on it or special purchasing requirements, cause this guy...
this guy right here...
aint getting them
why you ask.. well sit down and Ill tell you why. Cause honestly I think there ugly looken, not being rude here just stating my opinion.. think there very ugly ships. Rom one isn't too too bad but yeah.. UGLY
Thank everyone who said "suck it up" about the whole anniversary grind thing- this is just the next step in that unified plan, hope they like it as well. All hail our Chinese overlords!
Indeed .
At this point I'm just waiting for the :
"what's 100$ for 3 ships ? that's nothing ... " ,
along with the
" ...and remember , the Devs have to get payed somehow ... or they won't be able to make more 100$ ships for us and sell us more tech instead of content ..." crowds to become the dominant in these forums .
... 'cause as you know ... some ppl make their money by posting on forums ...
I thought I was going to be getting these when I figured the cost would be 5,000 Zen for the lot. I guess because the Fed, KDF, and Rom versions are almost carbon copies of each other (unlike, say, Oddy, Bortas, and Scimi) that I could get them all for that price. 10,000 Zen though...there's just no way. Yes, I made a reasonable amount of dilithium during the bonus weekend and yes, I have shelled out a lot of money for other items in the game before, but this 10K Zen price tag on top of the anniversary grind is too much.
I guess we will just have to see whether enough people fork out the Zen to offset those who decided to fork out nothing at all.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
"what's 100$ for 3 ships ? that's nothing ... " ,
along with the
" ...and remember , the Devs have to get payed somehow ... or they won't be able to make more 100$ ships for us and sell us more tech instead of content ..." crowds to become the dominant in these forums .
... 'cause as you know ... some ppl make their money by posting on forums ...
$100 for 3 ships? Even if you bought three of them invidually that's 7500 for three (or about $75).... $100 would get you all 9.
I do believe there are valid arguments on both sides of the debate and I suspect a compromise would be the best solution. On the one hand Cryptic needs to stop people from returning single ships so that packs can be bought. Besides, it can become quite an administrative nightmare trying to compensate for every possible scenario. I mean what happens if someone already owns 4 ships and wants to buy the 9 pack?
On the other hand, barring players from all future pack sales because they bought a single ship when they could afford it is also not the solution. People have different amounts of money at different times and punishing someone today will cost you money tomorrow.
So I propose that Cryptic implements a trade in system on existing ships for the purpose of buying packs. Give players the option to trade in their single ships at say 50% of what they paid and let them then be able to buy the pack of their choice. Trade ins could be done for straight up Zen or could count as a discount on packs. This way everyone knows what they're getting and everyone is happy.
"what's 100$ for 3 ships ? that's nothing ... " ,
along with the
" ...and remember , the Devs have to get payed somehow ... or they won't be able to make more 100$ ships for us and sell us more tech instead of content ..." crowds to become the dominant in these forums .
... 'cause as you know ... some ppl make their money by posting on forums ...
I'm expecting a "If you don't like, don't buy it !". Which is as stupid.
Comments
8000 Dilithium a day is exceptionally easy to do, if you've got two times 5-10 minutes a day on your schedule. There is a fortune to be made on the KDF side by having your Duty Officers waylay the transports and installations of your Omega Force, Nukara Strike Force, Dyson Joint Command allies, and putting the prisoners to work. More so if you're willing to hang on to your Gamma quadrant prisoners, as they work just as hard, but apparently they don't die good, so you get them back to try and work them to death again tomorrow.
It's the only reason I have 4 KDF alts.
Too easy.
Indeed, did a single CSE run shortly before heading to work that netting me nearly 3000 dil ore in nano processors, marks and dil ore drop combined. A couple of CSE and ISE runs typically add more ore that I can refine that day.
Let's stop calling people who can finish an STF in 10 minutes 'average', shall we?
It seems the vast majority of your most active players (forum regulars) hate the idea... and while that's a small subset of the playerbase, I think it's an important constituency.
THE PLAYERS DO NOT WANT THIS.
Even if it takes you 20 minutes to complete an ESTF like CES, as tekehd stated, you can make around 3,000 there. So in roughly 30 minutes - and far less if you're a slightly above average player - you have made 4,000 Dilithium from 1 STF and some Doffing.
And there is no way anyone at end-game is only making 1,000 - 2,000 per night. Heck, simply doing a B'tran Daily will make you almost 1,500, and that only takes 15-20 minutes.
Do you know what percentage of players log in every night?
Do you know what percentage of players KNOW what a "B'Tran Daily" is??
Do you know what percentage of players KNOW that there is an STOwiki?
Do you know what percentage of players come to the forums???
Have you pugged any regular STFs lately?
The average player is vastly different from the average elite player.
I think you and I have a very different understanding of 'Average'.
It seems the vast majority of your most active players (forum regulars) hate the idea... and while that's a small subset of the playerbase, I think it's an important constituency.
THE PLAYERS DO NOT WANT THIS.
if you buy A ship it costs 2500 Zen
if you were to then buy the 2 pack ship that is another 5000 Zen, the EXACT SAME COST as just buying the other two seperate anyway
The same applies for the set of 9
Since players learn about the Strange New World mission at Level 5, I am going to assume that they know what an Exploration Daily is - whether is is Delta Volcanis at Level 5 or B'tran at Level 45+.
Since players learn about Doffs at Level 10, I am going to assume that they know what Doff mission are from Level 10 onward.
Since the game sends you to DS9 to learn about STFS at Level 40, I am going to assume that they know what an STF is.
And so on, and so on, and so on.
The point is that earning Dilithium is not difficult. You learn to do it at Level 5 in the game.
If you want something from the C-Store, but do not wish to buy it with your own money, then Cryptic gives you a very nice little system of earning it. Whether it takes you 1 month, 2 months, or 10 months, if you want that 10,000 Zen 9-Pack you can get it.
Of course, if you buy one ship, then want the 9 ship-pack, it's trickier. What would've cost you 12,500 Zen (the initial ship plus pack) now becomes a minimum (assuming you only bought the one ship) of 17,500 zen (the original plus two more separate ships, and two 3-packs)... You're always going to be at least 5,000 zen down the hole this way.
Not that I care especially. It's a Frankenship, so, not interested. But I see the concern. Somewhat.
Also, regarding the KDF doff missions... that's 5 or 10 minutes for one character. With the rate of return on these assignments in prisoners that trade in at 500 dil per 4, or 350 dil per 3 (if they don't crit and triple) and absurd quantities of contraband, even doing this just once a day is an easy 5,000 dilithium daily, doing nothing but circling the 3-sector point between Eta Eridani, Pi Canis Major and Regulus. (And a stop by the Fleet base to drop off the contraband. Which you can also bridge-account-bank to your other characters.)
So really... cry me a river.
It's like assuming because someone was introduced to a concept one time, they automatically know all the ins and outs.
It's like thinking that people who only have 1 hour a night to play a video game choose to spend it running from sector to sector setting up duty officer missions, which they are unlikely to know how to maximize the potential of...
because they only have one hour a night to play.
Cry you a river indeed. Try to understand from the point of view of someone who does not play 30+ hours a week.
(And I actually DO play many hours a week - but I don't have kids, and am lucky to have free time. I do understand that coming home after a 12 hour day sitting in front of a PC makes it less likely to do so at the end of my day, so I am an outlier. Like 85% of the people on the forums.)
It seems the vast majority of your most active players (forum regulars) hate the idea... and while that's a small subset of the playerbase, I think it's an important constituency.
THE PLAYERS DO NOT WANT THIS.
The Ferengi FCA would be proud.
Officially Nerfed In Early 2410
Why do you want to pay for the same thing twice?
Cause it's cheaper if you didn't plan ahead.
And Galadiman: Those slippers ain't red, and those bricks ain't yellow. We're dealing with reality here, not wishes. One of the selling points of Zen is that it can be exchanged for dilithium, saving you time if you don't have any, or just don't think it's worth it. If people who have little time to play get an easy pass to everything the game has to offer, what's the other part of the playerbase going to do with those other 29 hours?
PvP? (Ha!)
Also, many people seem to believe that data (which is what these ships are at a basic level, a group of 1's and 0's in a database) is free once it is created. In fact, there are ongoing costs associated with that data. All the cost of running and maintaining the datacenter. Those costs get spread out across the products being sold, whether they're toothbrushes or access codes.
Finally, the intellectual property has a worth of its own. Any transaction involving that IP then necessarily deals with some increment of the cost to create that IP.
Any business that creates IP, whether it be music, data, designs for buildings, anything that is at its core an idea rather than a tangible product, must still get compensated for that idea. Because in the end, that is all they have that is worth anything, and if they give it away, they cease to exist.
As an Architect, I deal with these issues daily, so I apologize for getting a bit pedantic about it.
I could certainly make an argument for that.
--Red Annorax
Your argument was the "Average players play 1-2 hours a night" but "make likely 1-2k per night MAX."
Now your example is down to 1 hour of play time. You can keep changing your data all you want to try and justify your stance but it will not change what I told you above.
The average player can run a single Exploration Daily and make 1,480 Dilithium in 15-20 minutes. That blows your 1-2K theory out the door. The average player can pick 20 Doff missions in any Sector and have a great Dilithum return of 1,000+ - they don't need to go chasing around the Sectors.
I can only assume in your next post that you will tell me people are only playing 30 minutes a day. Of course I will tell you that they can do an ESTF and some Doffs and make 4,000+ in that 30 minutes.
This.
Vote with your money, and learn to resist that urge to buy every little ship that slightly interests you.
Plus it is not as though spending a lot of money on a game you like is an uncommon occurrence. Heck, go to Ebay and look up Loot Cards for World Of War.craft. I think the Spectral Tigers are going for around $500.00.
And there are many players in the game who have maxed-out their Reps (like me) or just are not that interested in doing all the Reps. To those people Dilithium is basically just a "buy-stuff-for-free" commodity. It does not take much looking on the Dilithium Exchange to see how much Zen gets purchased there per month.
Fair question.
Answer is no.
Wouldn't make me at all more likely to buy the ships.
One way that STO doesn't go all-in on p2w is by restricting tier 5 ship consoles to specific ships.
That becomes a free for all, we're a significent step closer towards pure p2w.
Not a good idea, in my view.
If Cryptic started moving in that direction, I'd be considering playing and paying a whole lot less.
But like what others have said, I honestly can't believe they pumped out 9 versions of the same...dang...ship -.- good gawd
The consoles being unique to the ship doesnt bother me. Its the grind necessary to get a complete C-store ship...that and the 9 seperate ships...really? Just doesnt show a proper respect for either my time or my money.
That said, I think these ships show a lot of promise, especially the way I've been fitting my destroyers and escorts lately. Its a shame they've chosen to roll them out in this way otherwise..i'd have bought them in a heartbeat.
Made the C-store ships complete without the aniversary ship and I bet many would reconsider their stance. To late to deal with the grind issue for the aniversary ship.
My two cents.
When they said they were coming out with a 3 pack for each ship I was expecting a bit of variety, different appearances, different boom/nacelle configurations but they are just the same bloody ships with just very slight differences.
Coming out with these things right after making us grind for the same damn ship was a boner move, so what if it comes with a whole extra console slot and a special console with some near useless proc with a ridiculous cooldown, big frappin deal.
If this appeals to some people they are welcome to it and if they are satisfied with that, I am happy for them, but I'm gonna pass. I already did my thing chasing after Q, that's enough of that.
It's more complicated than that, as there are two levels here, each 3-pay has a 3 for price of 2 deal on the pack (as usual), and there is a whole set set of packs which is also ANOTHER 3 for price of 2 on that. (or in context effectively 9 for the price of 4)
So you have the first of each set where buying the first for 2500 means you have to pay 2500 for each of the other two in that set for 2500 (total 7500 for that set) and then also having to buy the other two sets for 5000 each (10000) once that is done for a total cost of 17500.
I don't really agree with the complaints though, bulk deals is what they do. Save up for the bulk (it'll save you 12500 zen doing so) ~56% off.
this guy right here...
aint getting them
why you ask.. well sit down and Ill tell you why. Cause honestly I think there ugly looken, not being rude here just stating my opinion.. think there very ugly ships. Rom one isn't too too bad but yeah.. UGLY
Indeed .
At this point I'm just waiting for the :
"what's 100$ for 3 ships ? that's nothing ... " ,
along with the
" ...and remember , the Devs have to get payed somehow ... or they won't be able to make more 100$ ships for us and sell us more tech instead of content ..." crowds to become the dominant in these forums .
... 'cause as you know ... some ppl make their money by posting on forums ...
I guess we will just have to see whether enough people fork out the Zen to offset those who decided to fork out nothing at all.
Former/Cryptic Name: Captain_Hans_Langsdorff
Founding member, Special Service Squadron
"Fear God and Dread Nought." First Sea Lord, Adm. Jacky Fisher
$100 for 3 ships? Even if you bought three of them invidually that's 7500 for three (or about $75).... $100 would get you all 9.
On the other hand, barring players from all future pack sales because they bought a single ship when they could afford it is also not the solution. People have different amounts of money at different times and punishing someone today will cost you money tomorrow.
So I propose that Cryptic implements a trade in system on existing ships for the purpose of buying packs. Give players the option to trade in their single ships at say 50% of what they paid and let them then be able to buy the pack of their choice. Trade ins could be done for straight up Zen or could count as a discount on packs. This way everyone knows what they're getting and everyone is happy.
Make it so.
Thank you Captain Obvious, you've saved us again !