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Hirogen Heavy Hunter ship size vs crew
phostrela
Member Posts: 26 Arc User
I picked up one of these and personally I think its beautiful; it's detail is pretty great. Over all, very happy with the little rust bucket.
But I cannot wrap my head around the idea 200 people are in that ship doing things. This ship is actually about the same size as my B'rel.
Is this a glitch? It appears it was either just rendered too small or the crew size is possibly off by a zero. I could see 20-40 crew members maybe being able to live on this ship as it is now. Not 200 unless they are oompa loompas. Oompa Loompas with no personal bubble.
But I cannot wrap my head around the idea 200 people are in that ship doing things. This ship is actually about the same size as my B'rel.
Is this a glitch? It appears it was either just rendered too small or the crew size is possibly off by a zero. I could see 20-40 crew members maybe being able to live on this ship as it is now. Not 200 unless they are oompa loompas. Oompa Loompas with no personal bubble.
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As you can see here, the ship is quite small in canon as compared to Voyager. And yes these were typically only crewed by 2 Hirogen.
33.33% of the STO Ship Art team.
100% of the new guys on the STO Ship Art team.
If your hirogen ship had a crew of 2 then it would be a disadvantage to you the player and make things like the doff system odd, if you have 400 doffs and a crew of 2.
It's one of those game mechanics you have to overlook.
Is there any chance an older released ship could be corrected to its proper size? Yes, I'm talking about the Scimitar, Tulwar and Falchion. They're about 30% oversized. (Btw, I'll get the 3-pack if they're resized.)
And nice signature you got there.:P
Actually a smaller crew number is an advantage (albeit minimal). You basically always loose all able crew in a couple seconds of combat and they 'heal' by numbers, not by percentage. So a small ship with little crew has them all able very fast, unlike an Odyssey, Vo'quv or D'Deridex.
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Thanks for the warm welcome!
Resizing finished ships takes a ton of consideration. We do have a huge list of fixes and changes we would love to implement, if time permits. Bringing ships more in line of canon is very much what we want as a ship team. Sometimes however, because of the scale of the game, there is no real way to have all ships be 100% of their canon size. It comes down to a ship by ship basis. Our number one goal is always to be 100% accurate to canon, but that isn't always possible.
33.33% of the STO Ship Art team.
100% of the new guys on the STO Ship Art team.
the scimitar comes to mind. the model is great and all, its just SO much bigger then it should be. sure, being that big is 'cool' i guess, but its not right.
this got posted a wile back by taco i think, thats the old model
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7456/9345158350_370bc50b15_o.jpg
and i took a similar picture a wile back, its even bigger
http://cloud-2.steampowered.com/ugc/613898718240097817/DB4977CBE26E1E76201F71743AABC37CD6EBEBDA/
when its suposed to be this size, MUCH smaller
http://images.wikia.com/memoryalpha/en/images/8/8f/Nemesis_comparison.jpg
just compare how wide the sovereign saucer is with the center nose section of the scimitar, in game they are about as wide. id say its at least 30% larger then it should be. size like that is nothing but a disadvantage in practice, no one will miss how massively over sized it is.
did you do those defiant variant overhauls? well the half that made it in are a great improvement! i hope to see more like that. a total redo of the sovereign would be great as well, and the front of the galaxy's neck not being so upright.
Jamjamz was the one to do the Defiant overhauls, and he did a great job on them. His redo does serve as a great example of what can be done to bring older models into line of canon.
33.33% of the STO Ship Art team.
100% of the new guys on the STO Ship Art team.
Welcome to the forums Crypticquack,
It's understandable that u guys have consider the stats, abilities and balancing of each ship u guys make when considering the mechanics of the game.
I have to ask if u guys have plans on updating older Tier 5 ships in the future such as the Defiant, Galaxy and Intrepid classes? not in terms of ship stats but in terms of Boff Sations like replacing one of the 3rd Tac, Eng or Sci station into a Univerisal Boff Station so they be almost as much adaptable as the newer Tier 5 C-Store or Lock Box ships in terms of survivability or have a sight better offensive then they currently have. the big problem is that having a 3rd Tac, Eng or Sci boff stations is alot of those abilities tend to shared CD with each other, such as EPtS with EPtE, BO with FaW, etc.
Only reason i ask because alot of those older pre-lock box ships lacks the ability to compete with the newer generation of ships due to the fact they can't really adapt especially in PvP, in STO today any ship that has a universal boff station even a ensign one would make a ship much more effective and more adaptable to certain circumstances.
Any answer u can give would be fine.
Note: i don't usually play Feds since most of all my main toons are KDF, only reason i ask because i wanna fight more of these ships in battle in PvP ^_^
I can't answer specifics on what our plans are for the future unfortunately. But I can tell we are always looking at feedback and that does affect those plans. So any suggestions are welcome, we are always reading.
33.33% of the STO Ship Art team.
100% of the new guys on the STO Ship Art team.
Sure you can!
Course, that would make you the 100% of the recently no longer with the STO Ship Art team. :P
Meh, but I guess that means you can't confirm (you can definitely deny) the super secret plans and agreement that came about from a CBS-Disney meeting that never took place to approve this T5 Connie: https://s3.teefury.com/products_large_images/1285020425_bottom_milleniumenterprise.jpg
Btw...heh, welcome!
What in the Frankenstein is that!? It's magnificent!
33.33% of the STO Ship Art team.
100% of the new guys on the STO Ship Art team.
This quote is from and old thread regarding the Intrepid's saucer, but the images show what I'm referring to.
Once again sorry for derailing a tad and if it does get dev attention, thank you in advance.:)
Edit: Totally didn't notice crypticquack's introduction thread and this could have gone in there, now I just feel plain silly for asking this in here.:o
you have to introduce yourself! a crypticquack? wow, quack quack
This is why they don't come. Stop. Be constructive.
Welcome to the forums Quack! Always nice to have interaction from the guys behind the scenes. As far as art feedback goes, I'm really enjoying how detailed ship models are getting. Any lobbying I could do would be for the next space set you guys do to use graphics that turn my ship a healthy red color, maybe something around the shade of the republic cruiser or jedi starfighter from star wars. Not the best IP to bring up in a star trek MMO, I know, but that's just the only example of the shade I can think of. Anyway, I ask, because red is my favorite color, and with the customization options right now, It's really hard to give my ship a red racing stripe or anything like that, they all come out more brown or pinkish...
Also, to the OP, if you think 200 humans in there is a lot, imagine 200 hirogen...
What I want to know is why Cryptic took the only Hirogen ship in canon with a canon name (the Venatic Class) and decided to rename it the Apex Class?
According to Ex Astris Scientia's estimates it is about 600 metre long, the Vo'Quv is about 1,500 metres long, that's 900 metres difference.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
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Hahahhahahahaha "Hardpoints".
Thank you for such a quick response, Crypticquack. I appreciate what you and your team have done with this ship and others. It really is a beautiful ship, especially with my rep gear on it. It's quickly becoming my favorite ship, not just because of its looks; it is a very deadly and efficient ship.
Not to diminish STV at all, but flying this ship made me nostalgic for the show Firefly. Kind of reminds me of Serenity.
You sum up my thoughts on this ship nicely. I should probably just make a new thread in the game bugs section, if it hasn't been done already.
IMO the stat saying it has a crew of 200 must be a typo. It also has a low inertia rating of 60, making it comparable to larger escorts that would normally have a crew of 150-350(?). Like the Mobius Destroyer or the JHEC.
If it were me, I would lower this to a crew of 20-50 and raise it's inertia to 70 or 80 to be in line with other ships of its size. But the inertia doesn't really bother me. I love power sliding.
I wouldn't want to doubt Ex Astris Scientia, but according to this one shot, the Venatic could be 600 metres WIDE, meaning it's way longer than that.
Actually, not naming it Venatic might be a clever way of making sure there's nothing to argue about. The Apex might be a very similar design but of different size than the Venatic.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
To me the ship that is just completely out of whack is the Jem'hadar dreadnought. In the show they describe it as being twice as large as a galaxy class, and it was large enough for a defiant to fly between the command deck and the main body.
Too bad you can't "make it so".
A lot of players' heads would melt if they ever saw that flying around in game
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The Dread actually is about twice the size of a Galaxy in game. (I'm not entirely sure now but it's definitely in the range of 1300-1500 metres, similar to the D'Deridex. I'll have to check on my Rommie flying the Big D.) But that size wouldn't permit a Defiant class ship flying "between the command deck and the main body". It's a similar discrepancy as with the normal Negh'var and the Regent's one in the mirror universe. Typically it's explained as two different Jem'Hadar ships of the same shape, one having about 1.5km (or 1200 metres, depending on estimates; which would more or less fit STO's model) and another huge one being 4.5km in this chart I quickly found (but I believe I've seen estimates over 8k in lenght for the 'large version').
Note about the Scimitar: The strange thing is I've never noticed anything that would put its size over the 890 meters stated in production material (the movie quite perfectly fits that), unlike with those discrepancies about the Jem dread, or even the Defiant, or Galor.
EDIT: Maybe I'm mistaken about the size of the Jem dread that Valiant tried to destroy. It actually could also fit the smaller version of the Dread (as the one in STO), however fact is there were notably larger versions present elsewhere in DS9.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
As for the Scimitar, shrinking it a bit would be welcomed. Moving around sector space is a chore when flying her, as so many ships just bump her around. Even worse when you move to sector space above a busy planet, such as New Romulus. Forcing your way out of the wall of ships would make Jigsaw giggle with delight.
Member since early 2011
I know that I've gotten stuck in a parking lot with the Scimitar a time-or-two and after trying to fly out (with varying values of success) got a PM from one of the ships I bounced off filled with laughter. The wings make moving in sector space extremely unwieldy.
However, the bird is gigantic and it is a dreadnought so ... I suppose this is where we're at.
As for the Hirogen Hunter Heavy Escort, that thing looks so tiny -- but it also has a lot of serious firepower under the hood for such a small package.
I'd imagine that's because the old "let's stick the Civilian Battleship model in here and hope nobody notices" Hirogen battleship was called the Apex and they just didn't change it.