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xanathaar
Member Posts: 10 Arc User
KDF'ers, Today is a Good Day to....help a noob.
Dear all reading this.
I have been a STO player since beta, but VERY much on/off, emphasis on off for long periods of time.
I consider myself a decent player, though not an expert by any means.
Unfortunately im also somewhat of a min/maxer or elitist at times, when it comes to my own performance if not others.
My "problem" with STO is that it's very intricate and complex and while I generally love that, I don't honestly have the time or truly the inclination to really put myself into the details.
Therefore im hoping you will all be willing to spend a few minutes to do the following.
EDIT: This is purely PVE related to STF's, no PVP intended at all, ever, in this lifetime
Also it's PUG STF's, not team since I don't have people to team up with regulary.
1: Look at my build for my dear Fleet Mogh: http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=azracsmogh_0
2: Give my hints, suggestions or outright orders on how I can improve my DPS with this ship.
3: Explain if you can in sentences even a Gorn can understand, why your suggestions are an improvement and why what I have is wrong/sub-optimal, so I wont keep making the mistake and don't need to come here begging again in a few weeks/month's when a new ship catch my fancy.
I know this is a lot to ask, so I can only hope some of you have too much time on your hands, but well.......there must be some fellow nerds out there
Please note the following about the build.
Frontal cannon is the "Heavy Crescent Wave Cannon" that sets with the BioNeural Infusion Circuits console
Tactical Consoles are the fleet "Tactical Vulnerability Exploiters" that adds:
31.9% Disruptor Damage, 8% Critical Severity, To Target: -0 to 15 Damage Resistance Rating based on the target's current health.
I could not find these things in Stoacademy, most likely because after years of working in IT im developing willfull blindness or something
In advance, thank you all for reading this wall of text (which you hopefully will have if you read this) and even more so for anyone taking the time to help me out.
P.S
While DPS is my goal, I would of course like to survive long enough to DO dps, so some survivability is unfortunately a must.
Dear all reading this.
I have been a STO player since beta, but VERY much on/off, emphasis on off for long periods of time.
I consider myself a decent player, though not an expert by any means.
Unfortunately im also somewhat of a min/maxer or elitist at times, when it comes to my own performance if not others.
My "problem" with STO is that it's very intricate and complex and while I generally love that, I don't honestly have the time or truly the inclination to really put myself into the details.
Therefore im hoping you will all be willing to spend a few minutes to do the following.
EDIT: This is purely PVE related to STF's, no PVP intended at all, ever, in this lifetime
Also it's PUG STF's, not team since I don't have people to team up with regulary.
1: Look at my build for my dear Fleet Mogh: http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=azracsmogh_0
2: Give my hints, suggestions or outright orders on how I can improve my DPS with this ship.
3: Explain if you can in sentences even a Gorn can understand, why your suggestions are an improvement and why what I have is wrong/sub-optimal, so I wont keep making the mistake and don't need to come here begging again in a few weeks/month's when a new ship catch my fancy.
I know this is a lot to ask, so I can only hope some of you have too much time on your hands, but well.......there must be some fellow nerds out there
Please note the following about the build.
Frontal cannon is the "Heavy Crescent Wave Cannon" that sets with the BioNeural Infusion Circuits console
Tactical Consoles are the fleet "Tactical Vulnerability Exploiters" that adds:
31.9% Disruptor Damage, 8% Critical Severity, To Target: -0 to 15 Damage Resistance Rating based on the target's current health.
I could not find these things in Stoacademy, most likely because after years of working in IT im developing willfull blindness or something
In advance, thank you all for reading this wall of text (which you hopefully will have if you read this) and even more so for anyone taking the time to help me out.
P.S
While DPS is my goal, I would of course like to survive long enough to DO dps, so some survivability is unfortunately a must.
Post edited by xanathaar on
0
Comments
http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=terrortarg_0
IMO, not worth running a single heavy cannon and one BO slot for it. Some might even say drop the torp and run all beams but I like a torp in STFs. But definitely ApB is needed here. The Elite Fleet Disruptors are great vs. other ships but against borg installations etc. their proc isn't as useful so Antiproton is King for STFs.
Almost forgot to mention. The Marion Doff that gives energy drain reduction while running DEM is needed for extra powah! And use the energy drain reducing cruiser command too. For moar powah!!
And your build needs quite a few of them I'm sorry to say...
Your biggest issue is the lack of duplicate boff abilities in a non aux2bat build. With that in mind...
Do you want an aux2bat build or a non aux2bat build.
Since it appears your missing a HUGE mechanic I would prefer not to explain both builds.
If you don't know what aux2bat is, no worries, I'm sure I can find a post of mine or other explaining the benefits and penalties of it.
Cheers
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=azracsothermogh_0
Unless you want an Aux to Bat build, of which there are about a bazillion threads on the subject.
You need optimally 3 Damage control engineers to keep the EPTx abilities up and cycling and a Warp Core engineer is nice as well for an overall boost. Your call really. And the Doff for Aux to ID.
Cheers.
This is why I dislike Mogh boff layout. Unless you go aux2bat you badly miss that 2nd lt tac boff. So you end up with 3 ensign tac boffs like the defiant. Torpedo spread or high yield.
- Judge Aaron Satie
From left to right, what are the second engineering consoles and the third Tactical consoles? They are unfamiliar to me.
I like the build though Boffwise.
R.I.P
Now to try and do you all justice with a response.....
Before I start, I forgot to add an important thing to the original post, that I was running 2 Beam DOFF's and 3 Tac Team boffs, all purple as part of my setup.
@panserbjorne39
As far as I can tell, your primary change was to the Bridge Officer layout, removing the Beam Overload and Beam Target Shields for Torp Spread and APB, as well as removing the 2-sets Cannon/Console.
I was recommended that setup due to the % buff, but I honestly don't have the math to figure out if it was worth it.
I'll look into trying the build, but first i'll try to go through the many other suggestions, so thank you for the effort so far
@dahminus
This is what I was worried about, missing some major mechanic, because while optimizing the build, swapping beam for cannon or something for torpedo or mine or whatever is good, I never felt this would do anything "tremendous", my boat started out with Cannon's and torp's and while my DPS change depending on what I do, it's never anything major and very very situation-dependant, as in "can I stand still and just fire, great for my cannons, do I need to move, not so great".
I have tried looking up this Aux2Bat and found several posts, but honestly nothing that explained it in a manner my simple mind could understand, so I would appriciate any info you could give.
@thissler
Your build is pretty much what I had, weapons-wise, before I went back to beam's, except for the fact I didnt use mines at all since they are very situational and placement dependant and don't seem that reliable (to me)
What "worries" me the most about the build you have shown is that you have removed all special consoles, including Plasmonic Leech and several others I have seen recommended often, to put in a TON of movement-consoles.
Now I understand that movement and cannon's go hand-in-hand, but can 4 cannons really outweigh the dps-loss of removing all those consoles ?
And why 1 auto-targeting, removing 2 of the tac consoles pretty much removes 2 x 32% damage increase, aint that a huge loss ?
@macronius & bitemepwe
Im sorry Macronius, but since I don't know Aux2Bat and im not really an expert on the boff abilities and why some work and not, I have no real idea what you are saying, but from what I see, his build includes 2 Tac Teams and I thought the need from that was removed by having 2 purple Team Doffs ?
Bitemepw, from the GamePedia.
Sci-Console:
The Emitter Array is a Ship Science Console that improves shield repair and healing abilities such as Rotate Shield Frequency.
Tac Console:
It's the Auto-Targeting module you get from the new faction/reputation thing, a mix of damage + accuracy, from Gamepedia.
increase your accuracy with all starship weapons as well as offering a modest boost to proton damage.
So, to sum it all up.
Thank you for some good advice, it has confirmed my suspicions that a "good build" is a much a matter of taste as skill in general, but als far more importantly that I clearly AM missing something, both in regards to lack of knowledge, like Aux2Bat, but also in regards especially, to Bridge Officer's and what abilities to have there.
I'll continue to strongly appriciate any more information, advice and suggestions and i'll be happy to try and implement any changes and give it a try.
One thing I may be missing here is gameplay knowledge, as im assuming some builds require a specific playstyle or knowledge to be effecient.
Afterall, having the skills aint enough if you don't use them at the right time and place.
So, thanks to everyone so far
.....They do open up a whole new world of possibilities tho. So if you go that way, ignore the builds I've posted.
In any build:
.....In ESTF's you'll only need a few healing powers. TSS, HE, & Aux2SI for healing should be enough.
.....Use all Nausican BOFF's for added 1.?% crit chance.
.....Since you're pug'ing the ESTF's, consider using Antiproton weapons instead of disruptors. Pugs aren't known for teamwork and most teams split up in Kithomer Vortex & Cure Found. So while you'll be taking advantage of the disruptor proc, your team probably won't be.
.....NOTE: Voth antiproton weapons DO NOT have the crit damage bonus that the original AP weapons carry. So your better off with disruptors if you can't find the regular AP weapons.
.....Also consider mk XI or XII [crth]x3 vs fleet weapons. You don't need the added acc in ESTF's and the frequency of your crits will more than compensate for the lost base dmg. And they are much cheaper compared to the XII Elite fleet versions.
NOTE: Atm, crit is broken when using FAW. But I guess they'll fix that at some point.
.....Use the Assimilated Borg set. If you don't have mk XI's already, save up for the mk XII's. If you feel that the Borg shield isn't strong enough use the Borg Def, Eng, plus the honor guard shield. I use the full mk XI borg set with no problems.
.....If you decide to go with a kinetic build, change back to the Honor Guard set for the torp bonus.
1a) My first suggestion.
http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=moghsuggestone_4737
Some Simple changes to the existing build. All aimed at max dps output.
...Drop the single cannon and go all beams.
...Change tac officer to TT I, FAW II & III.
...Change engineer to EP2 weapons in the first two slots, Aceton beam on the third.
...Change Lt uni to science with Trac beams and tractor replusor for target control.
...Have two tac teams & the Aux2SI running continuous.
1b) My first suggestion with a twist.
...Do everything noted above but put a DBB up front instead of a 5th beam.
Swap in Beam overload for FAW II (or one of the TT's)
Use the BO with the DBB.
2) Second suggestion.
Take maximum advantage of the 5 forward weapon slots and put 5 DHC [crth]x3 up front and matching turrets in the rear.
...Change the tac to TTI. CSV I, CSV II
...You can use CRF, but I prefer CSV for quick destruction of sphere clusters. (esp when someones providing GW)
...I can attest to the efficacy of using [crth]x3 with DHC's.
...I had mk XII [dmg]x3 DC's. I switched to mk XI DHC's [crth]x3. (The mk XI's were so much cheaper.) The mk XI DHC's do way more damage than the mk XII DC's ever did.
...You'll hammer through ESTF's so fast you'll wonder why it took so long to finish them before.
Final thought: If you have any difficulty keeping it alive you can always switch the Aceton beam back to RSP. Still having a problem? Swap the 2nd EP2W back to EP2S.
...I fly a tactical bort with all DHC's and only the healing powers noted at the top. I only die when I get lazy. I'm almost always stationary so I don't get the defense bonus that you'll probably have since you can move about more freely.
My Bort build, for reference.
http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=tggrtactbort_4737
Thanks for the suggestions, i'll certainly try them out though i'd like to try the Aux2Batt, I don't really mind costs that much though of course at some point it becomes too expensive.
A few questions.
Why not Fleet DHC's with Crit x 3 ?, as I said before, the price aint really my biggest concern, though Fleet credits can be annoying at times depending on research up.
Why the Assimilated set, any particular reason or just ?
Also I noticed nobody commented about Captain skill setup, but I guess nobody checked it since I didnt mention it
.....I'd like to do it as well, but I've been grinding for a new ship so I'll let the A2B doffs wait.
.....I've only got access to Advanced fleet weapons and none of them offer [crth]x3. If I remember correctly they only offer two options with a crit bonus. [dmg]x3 [crtH] or [dmg]x3 [crtD]. I don't know what the Elite's offer.
.....The mark XI [crth]x3 costs more than 1 million EC less than the mk XII [crth]x3 on the exchange. For that huge pile of cash you get about 20 base damage over the mk XI set.
.....If $$ is no object I'd go for the XII's, but I'm saving for another ship, so the added damage wasn't worth it to me.
.....You don't need to max the build out for ESTF's. You'll stroll through them with a set of mk XI weapons.
.....The Borg set is much tankier than the honor guard set. The Borg set procs pretty regular and the mk XII set is noticeably better than the mk XI even though the stats don't seem to reflect it.
.....The honor guard set's procs are pretty useless on your build. The kinetic dmg boost is only for torpedos, not even mines. So it's wasted on anything but a kinetic build. And the crew recovery proc doesn't really affect your survivability at all.
.....The honor guard shield has a healthy base of shield points but the Borg shield's regen rate makes up for what it lacks in initial hardness.
.....I like the three set bonus's healing powers.
.....There's a hidden bonus in the borg tractor beam. If you use it on a target that has just been hit with the kinetic cutting beam, it does bonus kinetic damage. Something like up to 7k every second over 10 seconds.
.....That would take longer, I'm getting a little bleary eyed atm.
.....I respeced my KDF in the last year or so. I tried to max out my energy damage, shield strength, hull strength, accuracy, and defense. I'm pretty sure this is my skill tree as it is now.
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=tggrbopwmines_4737
You can use or stack:
...Damage control engineers to reduce any Emerg Power cd.
...Warp Core engineers to add power to all subsystems on use of any Emerg Power.
I just use Conn Officers to reduce the CD on my evasive maneuvers.
...You can stack three purple ones for a 15 second cd reduction.
...I use EM a lot, so it's useful to me.
ATM I have two Hazard system doff's.
...They give me dmg resistance when I use brace for impact.
But most of my doff's are blue or green, I only have one purple. And I do fine.
But preferbly, I would like to see what an "optimal" build would look like, costs not taken into account, only availability.
Take a look at the Elite fleets, I don't know what they offer in the way of [crth].
I know it's easier to find the real antiprotons in a fleet store. The exchange is swamped with Voth AP's but they don't have the innate crtD bonus that the original AP's do.
If you really want to max out the build, you'll want to look into the Aux2batt build or the Aux2Inertial dampers version. But that's significantly different from what I sent you. You'll want to look at some A2B builds specifically for your bird.
.....My skill layout is pretty straight forward. I focused on dmg output and survival. My skill set is still somewhat generic though.
Examples:
...It leans towards an all energy build but I did spend some points on kinetic dmg.
...Also, I did not put anything into graviton or particle generators, but I do use tractor beams and GW in ESTF's to good effect.
.....I use this skill set for all of my KDF ships; BOP, Battle cruiser, raptor, carrier, etc. I fly each one a bit differently. I fly the BOP with mines, variations of the battle cruiser with beams and cannons, I tried a full kinetic raptor, and most of my builds incorporate some form of tractor beam, repulsor, or GW.
.....If I really wanted to max out each ship build to the tiniest detail, I would build a new char for each play style or weapon set. One for maximum kinetic, one for maximum energy, and another for special attacks like GW and tractor beams.
Example:
...For the BOP with mines I'd sacrifice somewhere and max out kinetic dmg and/or stealth, but I'd keep my energy weapon buffs.
...If I was building a kinetic B'rel, I'd drop everything related to energy weapons & shields and put everything into kinetic, stealth, and other items.
...If I was creating a carrier, I'd go engineer and build a healer or possibly a science based drain boat.
...For a Bort I'd drop everything kinetic, and put more into power levels or things that affect mobility. If I had anything left I'd put it in Graviton or particle gens or resistance to same.
And that's just PvE. PvP would mean a whole other set of considerations that would affect your skill set, depending on the ship and the play style.
.....But this is my only KDF toon, and I have no intention of building a toon for each ship or style of play that I employ. Skilling out your capt in too restrictive a manner may max out their effectiveness in one area, but it will make them less effective when/if you decide to try an alternate build.
.....Hopefully my skill set is at least a good starting point from which to work.
The core ability of aux2bat builds is auxiliary to battery.
Auxiliary to battery takes a chunk of your auxiliary power and converts it into equal amounts of weapons, shields and engine. Which is kinda decent...but not amazing to say the least.
The supplemental doffs are where you get the zomg AMAZING power from. These doffs are Technicians. These reduce the cool downs of your bridge officer abilities by 10% per very rare doff on activation of auxiliary to battery. You may stack 3 doffs for a total of 30% reduction, but you can get by fine with just 2.
The deal with cool downs is that there are two of them, let's call them hard and soft. Your soft cool down appears when you activate an ability, a thin white line starts spinning in a clockwise fashion until it makes a lap and you can use the ability again.
The hard (global) cool down is when you have a duplicate ability. Another thin white line will appear. But it will be horizontal and slowly drop to the bottom of the ability before you can use it.
Let's take cannon scatter volley as an example...when you first use it, a 30 second cool down will begin, this is the soft clock. You duplicate/second copy of cannon scatter volley will also begin counting down from its hard/global horizontal line cool down...but it is only 15 seconds.
What auxiliary to battery does is chips away at the soft cool down of boff abilities until it reaches the global cool down. Thus turning the clock into the horizontal line or soft to hard or regular cool down to global cool down.
Things to note is that auxiliary to battery only takes the current time left on a boff ability into consideration. If the cool down has 100 seconds left will take 10/20/30 seconds off depending on how many very rare doffs you have. If the same ability is at 10 seconds, au2bat will only take 1/2/3 seconds off depending on how many very rare doffs you have.
Another thing to note is that the difference between the global cool down and the normal cooldown is the amount of time you can strip off. Using cannon scatter volley again, the regular cool down is 30 secs, while the global cool down is 15. The difference of 15 seconds is the amount of time you can take off.
You can never reduce the global cool down.
The global cool down begin counting down upon activation of an ability...this means you will always wait the global before activating the cool down.
Aux2bat murders your auxiliary. So sci skills will be less effective. A aux battery can counter this somewhat.
Ya...that's about it for the breakdown of aux2bat. best thing to do is to try it. It can be a game changer for people unaware of how the cool downs work in game.
If you would like an aux2bat build, I'll throw one up for ya.
I think I should save that ayx2bat guide.. I'll probably need it again
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skillplanner/?build=tggrbopwmines_4737
.....There is still some room to play around with it. I have some points in Power insulators and inertial dampers which could be shuffled around.
Just an FYI, when looking at the skill planner, you can hover your cursor over the icons to get a popup of what they are.
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=ayx2batmigh_0
2 technicians. Marion Frances Dulmer, borg warfare doff and a reverse shield polarity doff.
Pure dps build on a non aux2bat set up
http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=dpsnonaux2bat_0
Borg warfare doff, quatermaster battery doff, 3 maintenance battery doffs, marion
Cheers
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
To those questioning the Eng Consoles. Again I just went for pretty. You really don't need any turn consoles at all on a Mogh. I just don't recognize the new consoles that well. When I use fleet I tend to use the ones that boost all res and then plus something else. Like hull healing, power transfer, or yes, even a turning one. So again really, just some proper consoles.
Leech is good, but my Doff scheme is a power scheme anyways. Combine that with leech and woot. So sure if you already have it, use it.
Turrets ad so very little that I use mines. For when I need some big booms fast.
Someone mentioned AP. I actually use AP on my Mogh. I use the two piece AP set. I use the borg set with the cutting beam. I also run the Borg deflector, etc.
Or I run the KHG set to get more out of my torpedoes. It depends on the day.
http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=naussymogh_0
Is what I'm running right now. I guess I was feeling all supportive. All in all the idea of the build is that the ship is absolutely geared towards forward dps, cannons and torps marry well for that sort of thing, so essentially think escort without Omega 3 and call it a good job.
Sadly I am on a smart phone as my internet is down and the function does not work, but thanks for the reminder.
R.I.P
Now that I know what an Aux2Bat setup is, im still left with a few questions I would like to get consolidated.
1: Considering eSTF's and a Aux2Bat build, what is in your experience best, continue with Beam Banks or go front-heavy with cannons ?
2: Is it worth the change from Elite Beam to non-fleet Beam's to get the 3x CritH (Beam has Dam3 Crit1 only.
3: I keep reading about some setup's doing 30k damage (over short periods of time granted) but I have never EVER seen anything like this in any of my STF's, at most we are talking 10k over 10 minutes or 14-15k over 5.
Do anyone know of such a setup and what makes this possible ??
Thanks all again
I tried to read the "Noobs guide to Power" in the sticky above, but that thing is outdated by about 11 million patches.
Im currently trying to figure out good power-levels, I mean I know that high power = good (duh), but with my consoles, having Weapons set to 100 power means im pretty much at 125 all the time anyway, thanks to leech, etc, etc.
What I don't understand is, is there any reason to set my weapons-power higher than that, do I gain any benefit if I have "bonus" power above 125 or do I just gain the benefit of not being "drained" below 125 when I fire ?.
All in all, power seems to be a strange one to deal with a lot of the time.....:(
If you want to go full-forward and wants a DBB for overload, why not go full DBB insted of DHC/DBB ??
Because frankly, DHCs deal more damage than DBBs, and CRF is devastating. Sure, you can run all DBBs, but the moment you turn on FaW and there's more than 1 target in front of you, your single-target DPS will suffer. Whenever I use forward-damage centric ships I build 'em to deal massive single-target damage, and FaW doesn't let me do that as efficiently as CRF. A CRF/BO combo is devastating, especially if you let CRF bring shields down and nail a BO straight to the hull. It's also mostly a stylistic choice: I have Elachi DHCs and they look pretty great, coupled with 2 beams continuously firing from the weapon pods makes for a kickass-looking ship.
There's also the matter of weapon power drain being less with DHCs than with DBBs. My weapon drain isn't much because I also run mines aft, and a torpedo fore, so that's 2 weapons not draining power.
So you build for spike damage...i doubt that you would be able to do over 5k with a build like that...if you talking pvp, I understand. but the OP is wanting a pve build.
The builds I linked can do over 30k dps when flown properly. Unbeknown to most of the community, positioning plays a giant role in the super high dps ranges.
Beams are always going to out dps cannons.
A swap of the single heavy crescent cannon to another beam
My PvE/PvP hybrid skill tree
I can easily do 8-10k before myself, but thats not really what im after, im after the very best build I can get and advice on how to do better, positioning, playing, etc. etc.
If your suggestions are just "just do meh cause it's fun and thats what I do", I already did that before