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A thread abou JJ trek
floppytechie
Member Posts: 136 Arc User
So,one of my friends finally got me to watch Star Trek:Into Darkness (id been holding off as i had read the negative comments about it 
) and i must say,its pretty good!
Just about the only thing that bothered me was that the Enterprise was defeated by a ship only 3 years more advanced.And seeing the Vengeance in action makes me want to buy the avenger.Overall:not bad.
thoughts?Rage posts?:rolleyes:
) and i must say,its pretty good!Just about the only thing that bothered me was that the Enterprise was defeated by a ship only 3 years more advanced.And seeing the Vengeance in action makes me want to buy the avenger.Overall:not bad.
thoughts?Rage posts?:rolleyes:
Proud owner of every ship with hangers ingame
Flagship - N.C.C.-99635-A U.S.S. Asterion
I support playable Typhoon class!!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Flagship - N.C.C.-99635-A U.S.S. Asterion
I support playable Typhoon class!!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by floppytechie on
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If you're going to make a target out of yourself, OP, somebody ought to stand with you. Reckon I'll do until a real Star Trek fan happens along.
I volunteer as Tribute. Even though my last name isn't Everdeen .
Well well well, what do we got here? A couple of JJ fans looking to rumble...
You must be either really brave or really stupid to come onto Nicholas Meyer's fan turf shoutin' that nonsense...
*snaps fingers to summon the rest of the trolls*
I just hope the third film (2016?) focuses (at least toward the end) on retelling the story of the Undiscovered Country. I want the film to start like Star Wars Ep 2; I want to see a couple of planets in the background, and then I want to zoom in on one of them and see a huge conflict between Federation and Klingon ships (a conflict of which includes another Constitution Class).
I know it wont happen, but I'd love to see the JJ style Klingons in STO, and I'd like to see their new Klingon Warbird more too. Lovely design.
liked it aswell, watched it 2-3 times but don't really have a desire to buy it or whatever.
also, this is better suited for the "ten forward" section of this forum.
Just wanted to check if the JJ hate was still there:D
anyway,it was not bad:P
To the incoming trolls and rage-ers :
"Good,good,let the b**t-hurt flow through you." -Darth Sidius :cool:
Flagship - N.C.C.-99635-A U.S.S. Asterion
I support playable Typhoon class!!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I enjoyed the new films. I didn't find them to be all that good, but I did find them to be enjoyable, and that's the yardstick by which I measure films.
*In the best Paul Hogan as a Klingon impression I can do.*
"Wot? You lot call that a knoife? That's nawt a knoife."
*pulls bat'leth from over right shoulder*
Naow this, this is a knoife."
^ This.
And my main issue is that the Enterprise is armed with cannons! I mean, who uses single cannons !??!
That's right. I said it. Bring it on.
I did have problems with it, though, and they're nothing to do with it being different from Original Trek... more to do with the plot doesn't work. Seriously. Explain to me what Khan's plan is, or what Marcus's plan is... and then explain how the things they do help them achieve their goals. Their actions just don't make any kind of sense... and I'm afraid I'm not the kind of viewer who checks his brain at the door when watching movies. Just don't seem to be able to ease it out of my skull, I'm afraid.
Now, you could say the same thing about a lot of "original" Trek stuff - that the plots don't work - and, in fact, I do. And some of them are a lot more obviously absurd than Into Darkness, too. But, overall, my opinion remains: it was a fun action movie, but it had a lot wrong with it.
Or better yet, an entirely original plot unrelated to anything Star Trek had already done. :P
I agree, and i'd like to add my two cents on the subject; As films in their own right, not bad.
Into Darkness was uninspired though. I had hoped for Abrams second film to have been a little more than what amounts to a semi-rehash of Star Trek II. And i'd have dumped that god-awful ruination that was Zach Quinto having to emulate William Shatner.
It was such a good scene and then they ruined it! All for fanservice! GAAAH.
This. The first JJTrek wasn't bad, but Into Darkness felt like it was done by a half-dozen John Woo wannabes each loaded on enough cocaine to put their heart rates at Warp 17. And that's just taking it "as a movie," before the rot that was "Mirror Universe Wrath of Khan" made it even worse. While the word makes me want to heave anyway, Into Darkness really showed just how horribly wrong "reimagined" can go.
Maybe they could produce a fitting follow-up to Into Darkness with "Spock's Brain: The Reimagined Motion Picture." :P
Throwing my lot in with you folks, preferred the JJ films to the original or next gen films. They breathed new life into what otherwise to most of the world was a rotting cadaver.
As to Trek having some sort of mysterious "this is Trek" thing going, EVERY series was different, heck go back to TOS and pretty near every EPISODE was different. It's just a certain core of fans who seem to think Trek was one thing and one thing alone.
As to not following old Trek Lore, news flash, it's an alternate universe, it doesn't have to follow the same lore. JJ Trek doesn't follow TOS even, it comes BEFORE TOS but down a different leg of the trousers of time. At most it would have to follow on from Enterprise, but then lots of the "Trek core" don't consider Enterprise Trek either. :P
I'm over 6 feet tall and kind of big. Bring it. :P Shish, this is getting more West Side Story than Star Trek. Let me say now, I am NOT doing a song and dance number...
For me, the JJverse are good sci-fi action flicks and okay Star Trek films, but they lean a little too heavily on the action side to be really great ST films. In the past I've explained the difference between a Foundry farm mission with story justification and an actual story mission as, the one uses a story as an excuse for violence, while the other uses violence as a storytelling element. The difference between TV trek and the JJverse isn't that pronounced but it's the same basic idea. (Nemesis had that problem, too, incidentally.)
JJ also made one of the same mistakes the Enterprise writers did: Just like ENT tried too hard to convince us it was still Trek without the Federation, He tried too hard to convince us that it was still Trek even though it didn't follow the Prime Universe storylines to the letter, resulting in way too many contrived coincidences. And he's got even less of a sense of scale than Star Trek usually does.
I also don't agree with JJ's insistence that Starfleet isn't a military (my reasoning), but that's a debate that goes straight to the heart of the fanbase.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
On to new business...
I think sometimes every single one of us Star Trek fans want to be the sole and above all final arbiter of the final word on what is and isn't, ahem, 'Real' Star Trek. We then proceed to look down our hipster noses at someone whose viewpoint differs by a ridiculously tiny amount from ours.
We next proceed to overuse excess and hyperbole to ruthlessly slash each other to bits and to confirm to the audience we're all playing to how theologically Simon Pure our own viewpoint is. Think about how incredibly asanine the countless over-the-top statements which 'prove' we hates the JJTrek fo-evah that are posted all throughout these forums make all of us Star Trek fans look to people who do not like Star Trek at all.
Face it, whenever the topic of JJTrek comes up, either pro or con, our public little hipster b****slap lover's spats make an awful good show for the folks on the other side of of the glass don't they?
As someone who doesn't normally channel Gene, I cannot help but wonder if he isn't terribly ashamed and embarrassed by the whole lot of us.
*A Federation Cruiser warps into the system*
Comms Officer: Sir, we have an incoming hail. Priority One, across all channels. Playing it now.
Computer: Message One: *The sounds of bottles klinking together* JJ faaaaaaans, come out to plaaaay.....JJ Faaaaaaaaaaans, Come out to plaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay!
-Leonard Nimoy, RIP
I chalk this up to JJ deliberately pissing off the nerds. Just like how the writers in TNG made fun of their audience in little snide ways.
I liked the first film and the first 1/2 to 3/4 of the second film. They are what they are retro 60's nostalgia films like the scooby doo movie, the lost in space movie etc and for that they stack up a lot better. The characters are fun. I like the funny banter. They have the kind of fun dialog the old Star wars films had and the prequel films lack.
Parallels: my second mission for Fed aligned Romulans.
JJ Abrams: the new millenium's Victor Frankenstein. :P
Well that and the fact that the Enterprise is a cruiser or heavy cruiser and the Vengeance was a Dreadnought so it would kind of be like a destroyer vs a battleship which wouldn't go well for the destroyer.
But Star Trek doesn't need to follow the Prime Universe storylines to the letter to be Star Trek its just minutia. TOS got along fine without needing everything before already plotted out and did fine just making it up as it went along.
Heck it even contradicted itself more than once.
So your big problem is that in a movie based on a series where planets and their billions of inhabitants were destroyed frequently that they decided to do it to a planet people actually care about this time?
This. People seem to forget that Nemesis and Enterprise had pretty much killed the franchise. Star Trek, for all intents and purposes, was dead. These new movies have brought the franchise back and have brought in new fans to boot.
That said, I immensely enjoyed both films and I'm looking forward to the third one.
system Lord Baal is dead
I think you got a point here. As long as they don't continue it and produce a series, those two (three) movies will only delay Star Treks death.
Don't get me wrong i really liked the new movies in spite of all thier faults. (other Trek movies had their own faults too.)
JJ Abrams created some entertaining and fun to watch Star Trek movies, something i haven't seen since ST VI tbh.
They really should start making a series in that new reality, better sooner than later. Maybe telling new stories of another ship, if the Movie cast is too expensive.
But in no case they should miss that chance and let Trek die (again).
I think returning to the old (main) timeline would only create a lot of confusion amongst the common (non hardcore trek fan) audience.
TOS has the benefit that it was the FIRST Star Trek TV show, and I'm pretty damn sure that when it was being made, they did not foresee an IP that spans the decades after the original series has run its course. Hell, TV shows then and now are often wondering if they'll get a 2nd season.
OF COURSE IT MADE THINGS UP AS IT WENT ALONG.
American TV shows generally do not have a previously written storyline to run, from beginning to a defined ending. They make stuff up as they go along! They did so then, and they damn well do so now.
It did not have to fit into pre-existing storylines. It did not have to take into account canon, because it WAS making its own history.
Worrying about all that when you dive into any existing IP is part of it all. When you go completely against something that is previously established in a much loved IP, be ready for some flack.
In regards to the JJ Trek, I absolutely feel that if JJ Abrams did not use well known characters with ALOT of damn history, if he did not try to rehash previous movies with monkey miming, we wouldn't be having this debate about what's wrong with JJ Trek all over the place.
If he actually made his own and unique contribution to Star Trek, with original characters, original settings, etc., then he would have had a whole lot more leeway from the Star Trek fanbase. If he did not try to remake characters and their histories that have 4 years of TV seasons, 6 full-fledged movies, and much adored by the fanbase, we would not be having this discussion.
If JJ Abrams made his own unique contribution to Star Trek, PERIOD, then we would not be having this discussion.
But since he insisted on trying to have his take on characters like Kirk, Spock, McCoy, etc, and not only that, poorly mimic previous TV show and movie elements, then he himself set to walk on broken glass with bare feet.
Not only that,with STO currently leading the prime universe storyline,creating a series on the original timeline would mean for them to accept the STO version and would tie up the two irrevocably.Just imagine,Cryptic has a new ship for the Klingons but cant release it as CBS will use it in an episode after some months!
Better to go off with the alternate timeline.
The only thing JJ royally screwed up was ships shooting each other in subspace(the Vengeance did it on the enterprise).Its supposed to create subspace ripples,the very basis of YOUR storyline dammit!!
Flagship - N.C.C.-99635-A U.S.S. Asterion
I support playable Typhoon class!!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
What I do not understand is why especially the hard-core trekkies hate them. To dislike them, ok, no problemo. I disliked how Voyager and Enterprise ended their series. I do not hate them.
Now why is it odd that especially the hard-core trekkies HATE the Abramsverse? If there is one thing that Star Trek is trying to teach us it is that diversity isn't a bad thing. They taught us to embrace new things, not reject them for continuing on something old. They were about accepting differences. Any real hard-core trekkie knows this and should have these values. Yet they oppose the Abramsverse with one of the most common reasons: because its different.
Like I said, if you don't like the new movies because the stories aren't your thing, thats ok. If you don't like the characters, thats ok. If you aren't particulary fond of the special effects, thats ok. But to dislike, and even hate, the Abramsverse simply because it is different than the other series, that only shows me one thing: you failed to learn the most important lesson ever from Star Trek.
Those people, that call themselves trekkies, should really rewatch all of the other series. And then, with this moral code embedded in your mind, watch XI and XII. You'll find them pretty good movies. Not as excellent as some of the other movies (TWOK, UC, FC), but a lot better than TMP and TFF. (those are short for movies).
*Interrupted by Ops officer*
Captain, based on my calculations there is a 95% chance of haters preparing to open fire.
Very well then, prepare for an immediate transwarp to REDACTED.
Join the Deltas today!