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Balance Through Saturation
naz4
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I think Husanak touched on this a while ago, but the more and more i think about it, the more and more it makes sense and i have to grudgingly agree.
If there are (for the sake of argument) 30 over powered consoles, but you only have 10 slots in a ship, which 10 of the 30 would you take (not even taking into consideration standard consoles)?
This way, there would be more variety in the game and Cryptic won't have to worry about "micro balance" at all.
Now, they can release as many ships, consoles, pets etc. (which they are doing now) and not have to worry about "balance". As long as they have fixed ship slots, they will balance through slots rather than micro manage / tweak powers.
I'm not saying I agree or like this (personally, i think it stinks), but the way their business model is working and from what they have said / not said in the past, this seems the most logical choice for Cryptic.
If we can't face this fact, we should probably move on to pastures new.
I think Cryptpic made the biggest mistake in not making PvP a priority sooner. Look at DOTA 2 and LoL - All about PvP and very successful.
Now imagine if it had become a priority in season 2 - We might have been having full on International e-sport tournaments by now with real prizes and real publicity. Not "does my bum look big in this" outfits in the Zen store (Rant over...)
Hope you see what i'm getting at.
If there are (for the sake of argument) 30 over powered consoles, but you only have 10 slots in a ship, which 10 of the 30 would you take (not even taking into consideration standard consoles)?
This way, there would be more variety in the game and Cryptic won't have to worry about "micro balance" at all.
Now, they can release as many ships, consoles, pets etc. (which they are doing now) and not have to worry about "balance". As long as they have fixed ship slots, they will balance through slots rather than micro manage / tweak powers.
I'm not saying I agree or like this (personally, i think it stinks), but the way their business model is working and from what they have said / not said in the past, this seems the most logical choice for Cryptic.
If we can't face this fact, we should probably move on to pastures new.
I think Cryptpic made the biggest mistake in not making PvP a priority sooner. Look at DOTA 2 and LoL - All about PvP and very successful.
Now imagine if it had become a priority in season 2 - We might have been having full on International e-sport tournaments by now with real prizes and real publicity. Not "does my bum look big in this" outfits in the Zen store (Rant over...)
Hope you see what i'm getting at.
Post edited by naz4 on
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Waiting for Star Citizen is like waiting for Christmas as a kid, just hope it's not the piece of coal this game is.
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13159-15-Million
I misread that earlier and assumed they'd already hit the 17 million mark, but if you haven't taken a look at their website it's worth a look.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPsHSpRBB04
Random Quote from Kerrat
"Sumlobus@****: your mums eat Iced Targ Poo"
C&H Fed banter
Imagine that and Oculus Rift together - Match made in heaven
The romulan ships prove the theory... how many people are NOT running new fantastic armour + RCS units on there roms cause they just don't have the room.... or Embassy consoles...
I can't remember the last time a Rom hit me with Grave Pulse... OR AMSed me... its not that there not good... they just won't give up there valdore console for either one. lol
Honestly I like what they did with the roms that way instead of making things built into the ships they made everything a console.
Honestly I hope we see some Elite Fed and Klink ships soon that come with one part of a 2 piece ship set console. DO the same thing to the fed and klinks eat our console slots with OP toys... and people can't run everything... so it will balance out.... we might even see people swapping consoles half way through a match.
A properly made flight sim MMO will at least get the customers it deserves.
@Aquitaine985
Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
PWE seems to have plenty of good pvp games...
I understand Perfect World has good pvp... Blacklight is all pvp.
Lots of us where a optimistic when PWE took over... cause they had a rep for being devs that liked to pvp themselves.
It seems they haven't push that on there Cryptic guys though.
It's terrible but easy, and these Borg are way cooler than the mess STO and Voyager left us.
Off-topic...
Don't count on it drawing off too many STO players outside of the PvP community. I look at that other game and the first thing that comes to my mind is Elite and Frontier.
Not a terrible game for its' time, but that doesn't mean I'm going to pay to play the reinvented version so I can haul cargo, fight pirates, and lose my shirt playing the commodities market.
Anyway, that's really off-topic and we should not derail threads about STO in order to promote some other game.
Back on topic...
I wouldn't necessarily advocate every sort of gimmick p2w console you can think of, or throwing per item balance out the airlock, but I do welcome the idea that every choice you make should involve some kind of tradeoff.
There are too many "no-brainer-gotta-have-it" things that don't really force the player to give up something good to get something else. More options, not less, and more downsides to the things you have to give up would shake things up and make builds more dynamic.
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While there are some "choices" to make amongst special consoles, that group of consoles you choose from is relatively limited.
There are plenty of "duds" that aren't even considered and quite a few that I still won't touch because they are clearly cheese-ball items that do too much of the heavy lifting for the player.
There is still quite a gap of "haves" and "have nots" amongst ships and ship classes, and I don't think anyone has any illusions as to which "faction" has almost every possible advantage you could want with minimal to zero downsides - at least for a Tac.
[Kluless][Kold][Steel Heels][Snagtooth]
[Louis Cipher][Outta Gum][Thysa Kymbo][Spanner][Frakk]
[D'Mented][D'Licious]
Joined October 2009. READ BEFORE POSTING
Passive ability - 100% chance to cause the enemy ship to experience a warpcore breach on any energy weapon attack - by-passes shields.:eek:
You mean like TIF?
I still dont get why a ship should be able to have AoE subnuc like effects (talking about cooldowns) plus movement debuffs.To make things workse they said "this game PvP is for 5v5"....somebody explain me how is normal for 1 ship is able to affect aka TRIBBLE 5 ships by clicking 1 button if the game pvp was designed for 5 vs 5.
ok to make things even more pay2ruin_game the TIF debuff/buff icon has no time under it so if you run away (running is not considered a counter) you have no idea when that sheet is over so you can get your offensive buffs/strategy ready.
can it get even more worse? yes it can ...5 people using that sheet.Im sure some game hero already has the counter for that (remember running away is not a counter)
you mean they could make a pvp tutorial with the help from pvpers and make a mission like in which new people learn how to equip and use the powers ,or add a ingame macro creator.When you will see new people trying pvp is because they want to pvp and stop pvp when they get stomped.This happens because there no tutorial and no pvp support.This game would have the most addictive pvp in all mmos if they would have a damn tutorial for it.
It's terrible but easy, and these Borg are way cooler than the mess STO and Voyager left us.
An almost given is going full tactical consoles. For my Fleet Defiant, that means I have 5 consoles to work with. Then throw in musts like the Tachyokinetic Converter and Assimilated Module. Now I have 3 consoles to work with.
I prefer passive consoles over ability consoles (except for the Cloaking Device) and I'm obsessed with turn rate. So, that really only give me one console to work with.
With the AMP warp cores, I'm going to need Plasmonic Leech, so now I have no consoles I can swap out. Well, I do swap out the Cloaking Device in certain scenarios.
But, if another captain were to decide to stuff as many ability consoles as they can on their ship, that means less passive consoles and 2-5 mins of them being substantially weaker than my ship.
How about you stop drinking other people's kool-aid, think for yourself (don't worry it's not actually impossible) and stop peddling idiotic rumors and heresay?
These are the buttons most of us push. The rest is coordination, teamwork and skill.
W "+invertibleup$$+power_exec Distribute_Shields $$ +trayexecbytray 9 9 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 8 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 7 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 6"
S "+invertibledown$$+power_exec Distribute_Shields $$ +trayexecbytray 9 9 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 8 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 7 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 6"
A "+left$$+power_exec Distribute_Shields $$ +trayexecbytray 9 9 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 8 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 7 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 6"
D "+right$$+power_exec Distribute_Shields $$ +trayexecbytray 9 9 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 8 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 7 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 6"
E "throttleadjust .25$$+power_exec Distribute_Shields $$ +trayexecbytray 9 9 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 8 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 7 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 6"
Q "throttleadjust -.25$$+power_exec Distribute_Shields $$ +trayexecbytray 9 9 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 8 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 7 $$ +trayexecbytray 9 6"
Feel free to use them, and while you're at it HTFU cupcake.
I think you better check with your fleetmates you know the one i was talking about in the first place that you felt you had to defend.
i know to be in a fleet i wont mention you have to blindly defend all the bs they use. i feel bad for you it must suck being a part of the b team or c team in the unnamed fleet and have to do there dirty work.
But we all know what buttons pixel recognition pushes for you or wait maybe the unnamed fleet doesnt give the b and c team those pixels.
Dont make yourself look a fool. If you want to defend something that has already been admitted to by the unnamed fleet then by all means make an TRIBBLE of yourself you wouldnt be the first one to do so.
And yes we have all heard it before about that great teamwork before in opvp after the unnamed fleet was accused for the past 2 years and yes most of the blind sheep believed.
When an unkown player would joke or atleast most of the blind sheep thought he was joking about the hax tool.
You know the old hide in plain site tactic that worked for so long.
How shocked were all the blind sheep when it turned out its true. the tool really exists. Not only that but the unnamed player made a post on these very forums with a link to it.
With a pixel recognition command that according to the fleet didnt work.Hmmm why did it not work why after lor was the unnamed fleet not in the q?
Oh wait cryptic made some changes that made there pixel recognition not work.Then all the blind sheep said ohh it doesnt work anymore lets move on.
Well all it took was the unnamed player to make a few changes to the script change some colors and bam it works again lets pvp lol. so keep being a blind sheep and programmer vs programmer will live long and prosper in sto.
It depends on the ship, but these are typically the powers slotted there:
> EPTx (2 to 4 total powers)
> Hangar(s) if available
> GDF if available
> BO copies for pre-loading, if available
> Torpedo powers for pre-loading, if available
> Aux to Batts if available.
It's very flexible, and allows me to have nearly the same keybind layout across multiple characters.
All I need to do is slot what powers I want in those sections of the bar as needed.
EPTx always, Tac Team never.
Tac team (or Sci Team) is something I always manually activate in order to make sure that both escorts don't accidentally toss 2x TT onto the same ally at the same time.
Other powers like CRF, HE, TSS, TB, any DBB I have, any Torp Launcher I might have, etc are all fired manually. It's the only way to have full fine-tuned control over them.
Let me know when you're able to think for yourself, and not just repeat someone else's words.
In Fact, the OP is among the most credible members of our community, love him or hate him.
We're well past the "smack talk" stage at this point and I have to assume a few people have temporarily forgotten the forum rules.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/announcement.php?f=128&a=51
Flaming and/or Trolling
You may not post content which contains insults to other users or Perfect World Entertainment Staff, are specifically made to create undue discontent on the forums, disturbances in forum threads, pick fights or otherwise promote unfriendly conversation.
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Let me give you an example of the concept.
Lets say you are going to be flying a T'varo Refit....
Consoles to consider running.
1)
Console - Universal - Singularity Stabilizer (first piece of T'varo set)
2)
Console - Universal - Plasma Destabilizer
3)
Console - Universal - Singularity Inverter (added shield resit makes up for loss of shield power)
4)
Console - Universal - Shield Absorptive Frequency Generator (love it or hate it its one to consider)
5)
Console - Universal - Phase Inverter (great save button another good option)
6)
Borg Console
7)
Romulan Crit Console
8)
Plasmotic Leech
9)
Tachyo Crit Console
Now the point is the T'varo Refit has 6 Non Tactical Console slots.... you see what just happened there are 3 consoles you would love to run that you don't have room for... thats if you don't mind running ZERO armour No field Gens No science consoles No turn consoles... ect.
If I was the one balancing the game... I would release Elite Fleet Federation and Klingon ships soon....
Elite Fleet ships would have the EXACT same console and hull and shield numbers the regular fleet ships have... they would cost 2 more fleet mods... they would come with 2 consoles each.
Imagine this type of stuff....
E Fleet Defiant consoles.....
1 -
Defiant Armour Generator
Provides Adapted Hull resistance based on incoming dmg type. (Same effect as Aegis)
2-
Enhanced Defiant Cloaking Unit
Provides Regular Cloak
- 2 Piece bonus effect - Cloaking effect is usable while in battle.
E Fleet Science Vessel
1 -
Secondary Shield Burst
Instantly provides X amount of secondary shields. Shielding lasts X amount of time.
2 -
Daystrom M-6 Super Computer console.
Provides a 30s boost to all science skills.
- 2 piece bonus effect - Beta Tachyon Burst (BT burst drops the main shielding for 2s and hot restarts it instantly restoring 100% of main shielding)
That is how I would balance this thing... Give every ship a few Iconic Star trek skills that are only open to you if you burn some console space. At that point it balanced itself... you can't run 2-3 Mine Armor consoles... and 2-3 embassy consoles... and have your ship set consoles... run the defacto plasmotic leech that we all have to run anymore... and then still have room for every annoying p2w console. You would have to make real choices.... and at that point its all OP and none of it is OP.