Aux2bat is good on some ships but I see way too many people that use it on ships that don't need it. Jem Dreadnought, Mobius, Steamrunner and Mogai all have enough tac already and will not have much eng or sci left over for heals if aux2bat is done with them, so benefit little from these builds, lose a lot, yet I still see them all the time.
Ships that are good for it are Dhelan, vet ship, Scimitar, T'varo, D'Deridex, Kamarag, Ambassador, Regent, Excelsior, Galor, K'tinga, Jem HEC.
There is the vs Borg Warfare specialist, but apart from that, what you listed is pretty much it. Shield Distribution doff is the best option for an empty slot IMO. I don't see what crucial doff one would be missing with only two free slots.
Granted, with aux2bat the need for Marion is substantially lessened. Still, next to shield distro doffs, which many ppl seem to prefer almost exclusively, there's lot of extra goodies out there. I myself am particularly fond of the EPtX-buff variety. Like chance for extra power on EPtX (see Penni Antonia Seeman, I mentioned above); or the newer ones, that clear all negative effects on you upon EPtX (it's like a built-in every-15-secs Hazard Emitters).
Anyway, like I said, with Penni slotted as default, and 3x purple ones for A2B, I usually only have 1 left. And that tends to go to one that gives 10% extra dmg against Borg (or Tholians) or something. Making A2B, whilst otherwise awesome, a bit boring in the doff department.
Yeah, they sure keep adding a lot of new doff varieties with every new lockbox or doffpack, but going by the release notes descriptions, few if any have really caught my interest.
As I say, when I use Aux2Batt (with 3 technicians), there's usually nothing else I'd really want to slot.
If I don't use Aux2Batt, I stay traditional with DCEs, SDOs and Tac team CD reducing Conn officers. I never even tried the 'plus *species* damage bonus', as I have doubts many of the targets would even get recognised for said species. And well, as for new doffs, they tend to be more expensive (hard to get otherwise, by doffing for instance) and I'm largely doubtful about their utility in a non-PvP environment.
TOIVA, Toi Vaxx, Toia Vix, Toveg, T'vritha, To Vrax: Bring in the Allegiance class. Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider. Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
I never even tried the 'plus *species* damage bonus', as I have doubts many of the targets would even get recognised for said species.
Actually, now that you mention it, I have heard the workings of those get questioned before (like KDF Adapted ships not being recognized as Borg in CSE or something). I should do some extensive testing on it.
To be heretical, I see A2B builds as a means of getting TACs in cruisers power management advantages (and the benefits thereof) normally reserved for engineers to go along with their combat buffs. I don?t see it as a big benefit to a smart engineer as there are already other (and perhaps better) means of netting BOFF combat ability CD reductions and your natural abilities cover for any gaps in an EMPtX chain. I have to question if it is what Cryptic really intended.
In current times the ENG captain?s place in the space game is threatened. SCI trump them for both healing and tanking with hazard emitters and transfer shield strength on top of their dampening field ability (who needs miracle worker.) Just for example take a SCI cap, load up an Atrox with dual TRAC 1, HEM2 , TSS 3, and a GW3 and there is not an ENG cruiser in game that can heal or tank as well while still throwing out reasonable DPS (pets) and great crowd control.
ENG can be great fun for the solo player in a cruiser but there is not much point to them now. Who needs engineering team in the day of dual TAC teams, ASIF when you can have HEM with an HOT and its cleanses or extend shields where TSS has so much more reach without the silly fly close limitations. Warp plasma vs gravity well? Don?t make me laugh.
Good thing the Enterprise went off to explore the frontier rather than sticking around to help fight the war like everyone else. Who wants it on their team outside of nostalgia? They can?t even mount a torpedo tube effectively for combat DPS. STO, a game where no one wants the Enterprise in an STF and no one wants an ENG Capitan like Kirk on their team and the flagship of the federation can?t effectively fire torpedoes. Great representation of the IP there...
In current times the ENG captain?s place in the space game is threatened. SCI trump them for both healing and tanking with hazard emitters and transfer shield strength on top of their dampening field ability (who needs miracle worker.) Just for example take a SCI cap, load up an Atrox with dual TRAC 1, HEM2 , TSS 3, and a GW3 and there is not an ENG cruiser in game that can heal or tank as well while still throwing out reasonable DPS (pets) and great crowd control.
now that makes no sense...here is why: the engineer can actually outperform a sci in the scenario you depict.
1)subsystem power buff = more resiliant, faster fighter launch, more heal with HEM and TSS, more dmg with GW
more dmg with main weapons
2)additional shield heal with resistance buff means more heals available for group
3)"oh ****" button that resets quite fast under constant fire
4)nobody forbits an engi captain to skill science skills like graviton generator or particle generator
science boff abilites are not exclusive to science captains, and since most are dependent of aux powerlevel the engi has the advantage there.
in that scenario i see only 2 things the science captain has as advantage for dps...sensor scan and photonic fleet. great abilities, which balance things out, but don't make science a far better class over engineer.
dampening field has a limited range, which makes it sort of good for you, but your pets tend to leave the circle too much, and it does't save YOUR TRIBBLE from 10% hull and shield left.
all in all the atrox example you give is actually an excellent example where an engi can outshine a science captain.
now that makes no sense...here is why: the engineer can actually outperform a sci in the scenario you depict.
1)subsystem power buff = more resiliant, faster fighter launch, more heal with HEM and TSS, more dmg with GW
more dmg with main weapons
2)additional shield heal with resistance buff means more heals available for group
3)"oh ****" button that resets quite fast under constant fire
4)nobody forbits an engi captain to skill science skills like graviton generator or particle generator
science boff abilites are not exclusive to science captains, and since most are dependent of aux powerlevel the engi has the advantage there.
in that scenario i see only 2 things the science captain has as advantage for dps...sensor scan and photonic fleet. great abilities, which balance things out, but don't make science a far better class over engineer.
dampening field has a limited range, which makes it sort of good for you, but your pets tend to leave the circle too much, and it does't save YOUR TRIBBLE from 10% hull and shield left.
all in all the atrox example you give is actually an excellent example where an engi can outshine a science captain.
Oh bull ****. As I noted there is not an "engineering cruiser" in the game that will out preform it. How does saying an ENG should pilot an Atrox in your view disprove that? Instead you've got an ENG resorting to SCI powers in your twist to heal and tank because their native abilities (BOFF) and ships are worthless in comparison for the job...
Miracle worker in no way benefits the entire group's ability to defend itself like scattering field has nearly twice the cooldown and is only useful as a oh TRIBBLE button vs spike damage which scattering field can defend the "entire group" from as well more consistently when the other guys or NPCs decide to ignore you by taking HALF the incoming DPS away for like 18 seconds.
Power levels? Man pop a battery and use a flight deck DOFF or just mount a plasmonic leech... Like ANYONE has power issues in this game (outside of the occasional romulan) or like running AUX high is an issue in a tank / heal / support role?
Do not even start on the extra shield buff. Like it isn't over shadowed by a timed sub nuc leaving them helpless while you, you know heal those shields or pop em...
This is supposed to make me feel good about the state of the engineer in game? There is nothing they do for a group that any one needs now. Leave em to solo players that don't want to die in solo PVE (yeah you read that right lol.)
Put the SCI there every time. They bring more to the table. Ask any premade. Heck, put a sci there in PVE too as their utility is far greater all across the board. And for all the SCI' current superiority over the ENG well they are in trouble too.
I tell you what man just put a TAC in everything as DPS has become the only thing that really matters in play. And how silly is it that you need 4 SCI and 1 TAC to fight anymore.. Oh geesh.
Yep I am grouchy and jaded and no one has a good cookie for me to smile about,
There is the vs Borg Warfare specialist, but apart from that, what you listed is pretty much it. Shield Distribution doff is the best option for an empty slot IMO. I don't see what crucial doff one would be missing with only two free slots.
There's a new doff I like for the 5th slot- a Warp Core Engineer from the Tal Shiar command code thingy. Chance to cleanse hazards on activation of any EPtX ability. Great for any tanking cruiser.
if i understand correct is A2B useful only for cruisers ? ( which have only few tac Boffs )
because i run escorts mostly and i have usualy enrought power in everything i need ..
125(+) in weaps , shields are boosted from Epts , engines from skills so i have enrought impulse speed for max deff (i think 75% is cap or not ) and turning ? evasive , APA , APO , EptE ..... if i need better
auxiliary power i keep at least 50+ , i run 2 HE for healing
Yes, it's true that there are plenty of 'huge DPS in STFs', especially with A2B builds. But a good portion of these builds are usually doing the following:
FAW, and APB...a lot. They hit FAW, hit APB, and start shooting everything around them. So everything is getting debuffed and taking more damage, that is all very true.
But in most STFs, stuff like Transformers and Gates are gonna be healing off that damage instantly (presuming it just started), plus any spheres, cubes, and probes are gonna only receive just a few taps from that person. So while they may parse these huge numbers, as for how truly effective that is...is really in the eye of the beholder. Using FAW means it lacks focus fire.
I'm not saying it doesn't work because it does, I'm just saying that while people are seeing these huge numbers, it doesn't mean that the huge numbers are real, permanent damage if so much of it is because of debuffs, and also gets healed away.
I only recently realized that THIS is why people are so in love with FAW when I have NEVER once felt a FAW assault do more than tickle my shields and consistently outkill FAW boats with BO or cannons.
Being able to deal a tiny bit of damage to a whole lot of things is pretty eh. Gravity Well can do that but it does not make it awesome and devastating.
Being able to actually KILL is far more important.
Also DPS can frequently be far less relevant than spike. I know in PvP DPS hardly ever kills anyone with a proper tank but Spike does.
I only recently realized that THIS is why people are so in love with FAW when I have NEVER once felt a FAW assault do more than tickle my shields and consistently outkill FAW boats with BO or cannons.
Being able to deal a tiny bit of damage to a whole lot of things is pretty eh. Gravity Well can do that but it does not make it awesome and devastating.
Being able to actually KILL is far more important.
Also DPS can frequently be far less relevant than spike. I know in PvP DPS hardly ever kills anyone with a proper tank but Spike does.
That's exactly how if feel about it too.
FAW just artifically boosts your overall damage, by tickling everything in range.
I find it just unsatisfying and not really useful when attacking, others may celebrate their overall DPS exeeds 2million but for me it's just pointless.
Don't get me wrong FAW has its purpose (clearing mine spam etc.), but when attacking a single target or a small group it's utterly pointless.
I wish there where Beam weapons benefitting from Cannon BOFF powers, like Scatter Volley (much smaller AOE) or Rapid Fire (focussing on one Target).
But as always Escorts or DHC capable ships get the real good stuff, while everyone else just gets only secondars stuff. But that's just my personal opinion.
"...'With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied--chains us all irrevocably.' ... The first time any man's freedom is trodden on, we're all damaged. I fear that today--"
- (TNG) Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie
the only situation i feel that my FAW just "tickles" enemys is in crystaline entity encounter...
all other situations it absolutely melts faces!
+1 My engineer can clear the taw dewa patrol in the half of the time it takes my tactical toon be cause he doesnt need to turn l. I just fly into the middle of the enemy when they spawn and FAW spam like its going out of style
FAW just artifically boosts your overall damage, by tickling everything in range.
I find it just unsatisfying and not really useful when attacking, others may celebrate their overall DPS exeeds 2million but for me it's just pointless.
Don't get me wrong FAW has its purpose (clearing mine spam etc.), but when attacking a single target or a small group it's utterly pointless.
I wish there where Beam weapons benefitting from Cannon BOFF powers, like Scatter Volley (much smaller AOE) or Rapid Fire (focussing on one Target).
But as always Escorts or DHC capable ships get the real good stuff, while everyone else just gets only secondars stuff. But that's just my personal opinion.
Sorry but I don't think you're using BFAW or an A2B build to it's best. With BFAW3 and APB3 you put massive debuffs on enemies and will destroy most enemies in a few shots once past shields. In STF most things either have poor shields or no shields so this makes that combo lethal (or even BFAW2 + APB2) and has an advantage of wider firing arcs with less damage drop off over range.
If you pilot your ship properly you can make sure that when you activate BFAW there's only 2-3 targets in range so you get the increased fire rate distributed amongst those 2-3 rather than 10 different targets. This will increase effectiveness dramatically.
Finally, ever seen 5 A2B cruisers doing the BFAW tickle as above? Most things die in seconds due to the number of massive hits they take to the hull. As someone pointed out earlier, there might be some inflated damage due to healing but you can't argue with completion times and 5 cruisers do it as quick as 5 tacscorts, maybe even quicker.
Oh and to the person(s) saying you can't hold aggro against someone using BFAW + APB A2B combo. APB increases the damage done by everyone to the target, including the tank. I have played a tank cruiser with 4 other A2B cruisers and you will see even the tanks damage skyrocket so they will be able to hold aggro just fine if specced sensibly into threat (6 points, maybe an embassy console) and allow the A2B cruisers to go all out.
+1 My engineer can clear the taw dewa patrol in the half of the time it takes my tactical toon be cause he doesnt need to turn l. I just fly into the middle of the enemy when they spawn and FAW spam like its going out of style
lol... Then your Tact needs to learn to fly. Not to be mean but seriously...
Sorry but I don't think you're using BFAW or an A2B build to it's best. With BFAW3 and APB3 you put massive debuffs on enemies and will destroy most enemies in a few shots once past shields. In STF most things either have poor shields or no shields so this makes that combo lethal (or even BFAW2 + APB2) and has an advantage of wider firing arcs with less damage drop off over range.
If you pilot your ship properly you can make sure that when you activate BFAW there's only 2-3 targets in range so you get the increased fire rate distributed amongst those 2-3 rather than 10 different targets. This will increase effectiveness dramatically.
Finally, ever seen 5 A2B cruisers doing the BFAW tickle as above? Most things die in seconds due to the number of massive hits they take to the hull. As someone pointed out earlier, there might be some inflated damage due to healing but you can't argue with completion times and 5 cruisers do it as quick as 5 tacscorts, maybe even quicker.
Oh and to the person(s) saying you can't hold aggro against someone using BFAW + APB A2B combo. APB increases the damage done by everyone to the target, including the tank. I have played a tank cruiser with 4 other A2B cruisers and you will see even the tanks damage skyrocket so they will be able to hold aggro just fine if specced sensibly into threat (6 points, maybe an embassy console) and allow the A2B cruisers to go all out.
You can do the same thing with Cannon Scatter Volley 3 if we are talking 2-3 targets and deal WAY more damage and STILL deal WAY more damage to a single target as well.
5 Cruisers running BFAW will still never compare to 5 Escorts with proper builds doing the same task. Some Cruiser builds (like Single Cannon builds) can start to actually compare well with Escorts and still tank well but beam broadsiders... Not really bringing the A game there. I will throw in the caveat that of course you do not NEED maximum power and kill force in PvE by any stretch to even get optionals but still...
As for holding Aggro... I have seen them do that fine to a group but if it is one target they lose Aggro in the blink of an eye to anything dealing real damage unless they use threat scaling Embassy consoles. (Which can be somewhat tricky)
lol... Then your Tact needs to learn to fly. Not to be mean but seriously...
You can do the same thing with Cannon Rapid Fire 3 if we are talking 2-3 targets and deal WAY more damage and STILL deal WAY more damage to a single target as well.
5 Cruisers running BFAW will still never compare to 5 Escorts with proper builds doing the same task. Some Cruiser builds (like Single Cannon builds) can start to actually compare well with Escorts and still tank well but beam broadsiders... Not really bringing the A game there. I will throw in the caveat that of course you do not NEED maximum power and kill force in PvE by any stretch to even get optionals but still...
As for holding Aggro... I have seen them do that fine to a group but if it is one target they lose Aggro in the blink of an eye to anything dealing real damage unless they use threat scaling Embassy consoles. (Which can be somewhat tricky)
I believe the time to completion was 3m32s, was only meant to be a dry run and not the final product but they still beat the record set by another team so they were happy. You can try the same build on an escort and cannons but saying they will be better just coz cannonz iz da bestest, isn't true. The combat log had the escort which is set up very well with cannons place half way in the damage dealt + DPS and is certainly no noob when it comes to builds.
Also CSV is much quicker for killing anything over 2 targets than CRF a quick look at the MANY threads on any of those topics will tell you why and is generally much more useful in ISE due to nearly always being able to have 2 or more targets to shoot at with good positioning.
lol... Then your Tact needs to learn to fly. Not to be mean but seriously...
I know how to fly. My tac still needs to turn, CRF or no CRF, I can't nail 6 targets on all sides at once in an escort like my cruiser can with FAW. Instead of taking out 3 targets at a time (which I hardly need CRF for), then turning around and nailing the other 3 takes a few seconds longer than taking all 6 out at the same time.
===post above is by jagdhippies===
EDIT: Closed for necroing an old thread. Remember, if a thread has been inactive for 30 days, you should not post to it. Feel free to create a new thread on the subject if you would like to discuss further ~BranFlakes
Comments
Ships that are good for it are Dhelan, vet ship, Scimitar, T'varo, D'Deridex, Kamarag, Ambassador, Regent, Excelsior, Galor, K'tinga, Jem HEC.
Granted, with aux2bat the need for Marion is substantially lessened. Still, next to shield distro doffs, which many ppl seem to prefer almost exclusively, there's lot of extra goodies out there. I myself am particularly fond of the EPtX-buff variety. Like chance for extra power on EPtX (see Penni Antonia Seeman, I mentioned above); or the newer ones, that clear all negative effects on you upon EPtX (it's like a built-in every-15-secs Hazard Emitters).
Anyway, like I said, with Penni slotted as default, and 3x purple ones for A2B, I usually only have 1 left. And that tends to go to one that gives 10% extra dmg against Borg (or Tholians) or something. Making A2B, whilst otherwise awesome, a bit boring in the doff department.
As I say, when I use Aux2Batt (with 3 technicians), there's usually nothing else I'd really want to slot.
If I don't use Aux2Batt, I stay traditional with DCEs, SDOs and Tac team CD reducing Conn officers. I never even tried the 'plus *species* damage bonus', as I have doubts many of the targets would even get recognised for said species. And well, as for new doffs, they tend to be more expensive (hard to get otherwise, by doffing for instance) and I'm largely doubtful about their utility in a non-PvP environment.
Toi'Va, Ti'vath, Toivia, Ty'Vris, Tia Vex, Toi'Virth: Add Tier 6 KDF Carrier and Raider.
Tae'Va, T'Vaya, To'Var, Tevra, T'Vira, To'Vrak: Give us Asylums for Romulans.
Don't make ARC mandatory! Keep it optional only!
Actually, now that you mention it, I have heard the workings of those get questioned before (like KDF Adapted ships not being recognized as Borg in CSE or something). I should do some extensive testing on it.
In current times the ENG captain?s place in the space game is threatened. SCI trump them for both healing and tanking with hazard emitters and transfer shield strength on top of their dampening field ability (who needs miracle worker.) Just for example take a SCI cap, load up an Atrox with dual TRAC 1, HEM2 , TSS 3, and a GW3 and there is not an ENG cruiser in game that can heal or tank as well while still throwing out reasonable DPS (pets) and great crowd control.
ENG can be great fun for the solo player in a cruiser but there is not much point to them now. Who needs engineering team in the day of dual TAC teams, ASIF when you can have HEM with an HOT and its cleanses or extend shields where TSS has so much more reach without the silly fly close limitations. Warp plasma vs gravity well? Don?t make me laugh.
Good thing the Enterprise went off to explore the frontier rather than sticking around to help fight the war like everyone else. Who wants it on their team outside of nostalgia? They can?t even mount a torpedo tube effectively for combat DPS. STO, a game where no one wants the Enterprise in an STF and no one wants an ENG Capitan like Kirk on their team and the flagship of the federation can?t effectively fire torpedoes. Great representation of the IP there...
Yes, I am jaded and cynical about it all.
now that makes no sense...here is why: the engineer can actually outperform a sci in the scenario you depict.
1)subsystem power buff = more resiliant, faster fighter launch, more heal with HEM and TSS, more dmg with GW
more dmg with main weapons
2)additional shield heal with resistance buff means more heals available for group
3)"oh ****" button that resets quite fast under constant fire
4)nobody forbits an engi captain to skill science skills like graviton generator or particle generator
science boff abilites are not exclusive to science captains, and since most are dependent of aux powerlevel the engi has the advantage there.
in that scenario i see only 2 things the science captain has as advantage for dps...sensor scan and photonic fleet. great abilities, which balance things out, but don't make science a far better class over engineer.
dampening field has a limited range, which makes it sort of good for you, but your pets tend to leave the circle too much, and it does't save YOUR TRIBBLE from 10% hull and shield left.
all in all the atrox example you give is actually an excellent example where an engi can outshine a science captain.
Oh bull ****. As I noted there is not an "engineering cruiser" in the game that will out preform it. How does saying an ENG should pilot an Atrox in your view disprove that? Instead you've got an ENG resorting to SCI powers in your twist to heal and tank because their native abilities (BOFF) and ships are worthless in comparison for the job...
Miracle worker in no way benefits the entire group's ability to defend itself like scattering field has nearly twice the cooldown and is only useful as a oh TRIBBLE button vs spike damage which scattering field can defend the "entire group" from as well more consistently when the other guys or NPCs decide to ignore you by taking HALF the incoming DPS away for like 18 seconds.
Power levels? Man pop a battery and use a flight deck DOFF or just mount a plasmonic leech... Like ANYONE has power issues in this game (outside of the occasional romulan) or like running AUX high is an issue in a tank / heal / support role?
Do not even start on the extra shield buff. Like it isn't over shadowed by a timed sub nuc leaving them helpless while you, you know heal those shields or pop em...
This is supposed to make me feel good about the state of the engineer in game? There is nothing they do for a group that any one needs now. Leave em to solo players that don't want to die in solo PVE (yeah you read that right lol.)
Put the SCI there every time. They bring more to the table. Ask any premade. Heck, put a sci there in PVE too as their utility is far greater all across the board. And for all the SCI' current superiority over the ENG well they are in trouble too.
I tell you what man just put a TAC in everything as DPS has become the only thing that really matters in play. And how silly is it that you need 4 SCI and 1 TAC to fight anymore.. Oh geesh.
Yep I am grouchy and jaded and no one has a good cookie for me to smile about,
There's a new doff I like for the 5th slot- a Warp Core Engineer from the Tal Shiar command code thingy. Chance to cleanse hazards on activation of any EPtX ability. Great for any tanking cruiser.
because i run escorts mostly and i have usualy enrought power in everything i need ..
125(+) in weaps , shields are boosted from Epts , engines from skills so i have enrought impulse speed for max deff (i think 75% is cap or not ) and turning ? evasive , APA , APO , EptE ..... if i need better
auxiliary power i keep at least 50+ , i run 2 HE for healing
I only recently realized that THIS is why people are so in love with FAW when I have NEVER once felt a FAW assault do more than tickle my shields and consistently outkill FAW boats with BO or cannons.
Being able to deal a tiny bit of damage to a whole lot of things is pretty eh. Gravity Well can do that but it does not make it awesome and devastating.
Being able to actually KILL is far more important.
Also DPS can frequently be far less relevant than spike. I know in PvP DPS hardly ever kills anyone with a proper tank but Spike does.
That's exactly how if feel about it too.
FAW just artifically boosts your overall damage, by tickling everything in range.
I find it just unsatisfying and not really useful when attacking, others may celebrate their overall DPS exeeds 2million
Don't get me wrong FAW has its purpose (clearing mine spam etc.), but when attacking a single target or a small group it's utterly pointless.
I wish there where Beam weapons benefitting from Cannon BOFF powers, like Scatter Volley (much smaller AOE) or Rapid Fire (focussing on one Target).
But as always Escorts or DHC capable ships get the real good stuff, while everyone else just gets only secondars stuff. But that's just my personal opinion.
all other situations it absolutely melts faces!
+1 My engineer can clear the taw dewa patrol in the half of the time it takes my tactical toon be cause he doesnt need to turn l. I just fly into the middle of the enemy when they spawn and FAW spam like its going out of style
Sorry but I don't think you're using BFAW or an A2B build to it's best. With BFAW3 and APB3 you put massive debuffs on enemies and will destroy most enemies in a few shots once past shields. In STF most things either have poor shields or no shields so this makes that combo lethal (or even BFAW2 + APB2) and has an advantage of wider firing arcs with less damage drop off over range.
If you pilot your ship properly you can make sure that when you activate BFAW there's only 2-3 targets in range so you get the increased fire rate distributed amongst those 2-3 rather than 10 different targets. This will increase effectiveness dramatically.
Finally, ever seen 5 A2B cruisers doing the BFAW tickle as above? Most things die in seconds due to the number of massive hits they take to the hull. As someone pointed out earlier, there might be some inflated damage due to healing but you can't argue with completion times and 5 cruisers do it as quick as 5 tacscorts, maybe even quicker.
Oh and to the person(s) saying you can't hold aggro against someone using BFAW + APB A2B combo. APB increases the damage done by everyone to the target, including the tank. I have played a tank cruiser with 4 other A2B cruisers and you will see even the tanks damage skyrocket so they will be able to hold aggro just fine if specced sensibly into threat (6 points, maybe an embassy console) and allow the A2B cruisers to go all out.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
lol... Then your Tact needs to learn to fly. Not to be mean but seriously...
You can do the same thing with Cannon Scatter Volley 3 if we are talking 2-3 targets and deal WAY more damage and STILL deal WAY more damage to a single target as well.
5 Cruisers running BFAW will still never compare to 5 Escorts with proper builds doing the same task. Some Cruiser builds (like Single Cannon builds) can start to actually compare well with Escorts and still tank well but beam broadsiders... Not really bringing the A game there. I will throw in the caveat that of course you do not NEED maximum power and kill force in PvE by any stretch to even get optionals but still...
As for holding Aggro... I have seen them do that fine to a group but if it is one target they lose Aggro in the blink of an eye to anything dealing real damage unless they use threat scaling Embassy consoles. (Which can be somewhat tricky)
Well I'll link you to this ISE game with A2B builds (except the raptor) all using beams: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYzNdz-_IKg&feature=youtu.be
I believe the time to completion was 3m32s, was only meant to be a dry run and not the final product but they still beat the record set by another team so they were happy. You can try the same build on an escort and cannons but saying they will be better just coz cannonz iz da bestest, isn't true. The combat log had the escort which is set up very well with cannons place half way in the damage dealt + DPS and is certainly no noob when it comes to builds.
Also CSV is much quicker for killing anything over 2 targets than CRF a quick look at the MANY threads on any of those topics will tell you why and is generally much more useful in ISE due to nearly always being able to have 2 or more targets to shoot at with good positioning.
It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.
Has damage got out of control?
This is the last thing I will post.
I know how to fly. My tac still needs to turn, CRF or no CRF, I can't nail 6 targets on all sides at once in an escort like my cruiser can with FAW. Instead of taking out 3 targets at a time (which I hardly need CRF for), then turning around and nailing the other 3 takes a few seconds longer than taking all 6 out at the same time.
===post above is by jagdhippies===
EDIT: Closed for necroing an old thread. Remember, if a thread has been inactive for 30 days, you should not post to it. Feel free to create a new thread on the subject if you would like to discuss further