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Fed players too fleet happy?
jestersage
Member Posts: 8 Arc User
I have started to notice one of the problem with playing Fed:
All players will only recommend fleet stuff. And tell people l2p.
However, on KDF side, people would always put fleet stuff recommendation next to c-store purchases recommendation.
I found myself drifting back to my Romulans and KDF more and more, because every single time I ask a question on fed side, the only response I get is either a l2p or fleet stuff. l2p to a cetain degree is fine, but it's not helpful when someone need to make a purchasing decision:
-Atrox is too sci heavy. No frigates.
-No experience with Vesta, didn't buy it because people did not say anything about shield tanking, or shield is more useful then hull point. They just say oh it's okay and versatile.
-Ended up going with Escort carrier which I dislike because people keep telling me to l2p instead of improving shield (I ended up finding my solution)... or get fleet stuff. A bit hard when you are in a t3 fleet. I ask people if it's honorable to just leave the fleet and no one give me a response.
While if I am on KDF or Romulan side, they will just tell me which equipment to get or buy, I get it and I am a happy camper.
Before LoR was release, my fellow KDF try to persude Rom to join KDF, say the benefit of joining KDF is that people over there are more friendly. As much as I hate to deny that statement, they are unfortunately right. l2p and fleet equipments are definitely not friendly advices.
Considering that no one tell me to l2p in KDF or use fleet gears (or only provide fleet gears), I do not think it's necessary my skillset having issue. Which means the advice givers on the fed side have problems..
TL;DR
So here's the question to Fed: Is there a reason you guys are so Fleet oriented, and so "l2p" happy? Before you say that's because how the game is played, I need to remind you it does not happen on KDF or Romulan side.
All players will only recommend fleet stuff. And tell people l2p.
However, on KDF side, people would always put fleet stuff recommendation next to c-store purchases recommendation.
I found myself drifting back to my Romulans and KDF more and more, because every single time I ask a question on fed side, the only response I get is either a l2p or fleet stuff. l2p to a cetain degree is fine, but it's not helpful when someone need to make a purchasing decision:
-Atrox is too sci heavy. No frigates.
-No experience with Vesta, didn't buy it because people did not say anything about shield tanking, or shield is more useful then hull point. They just say oh it's okay and versatile.
-Ended up going with Escort carrier which I dislike because people keep telling me to l2p instead of improving shield (I ended up finding my solution)... or get fleet stuff. A bit hard when you are in a t3 fleet. I ask people if it's honorable to just leave the fleet and no one give me a response.
While if I am on KDF or Romulan side, they will just tell me which equipment to get or buy, I get it and I am a happy camper.
Before LoR was release, my fellow KDF try to persude Rom to join KDF, say the benefit of joining KDF is that people over there are more friendly. As much as I hate to deny that statement, they are unfortunately right. l2p and fleet equipments are definitely not friendly advices.
Considering that no one tell me to l2p in KDF or use fleet gears (or only provide fleet gears), I do not think it's necessary my skillset having issue. Which means the advice givers on the fed side have problems..
TL;DR
So here's the question to Fed: Is there a reason you guys are so Fleet oriented, and so "l2p" happy? Before you say that's because how the game is played, I need to remind you it does not happen on KDF or Romulan side.
Post edited by jestersage on
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Comments
Your best bet for anything is to check the forums here, asking for anything in-game is just looking to get trolled by the same idiots that seem to populate zone chat all over the place.
-Ask about a good carrier and no one can give me a definite answer (just a wishy-washy aspect that never touched my questions), making me go with Escort carrier which I later found otu hull point is a non matter since shields are more important
-Ask about how to improve my ship and everyone, if they are not using the l2p answer, is to use fleet stuff instead of c-stuff - fleet stuff is hard to access because it's only t3.
-Ask about eSTF problem and all they can tell me is forming private queue with my fleet mate... well, my fleet had problem doing that.
The problem with Fed is the fleet system. Some may call it a nice thing. But I found that it's too surround the fleet system. I am not just saying the items, but also the mentality
I do not want fleet ship
I do not want fleet items.
Is it so hard to just give me an answer when i ask for ship that is good for such and such, instead of saying l2p and fleet stuff?
I am glad that scimatar will come out for my Rom Fed, because the only thing to go for Fed is the customization option.
The Vesta is in kind of an odd spot in player minds, with some people having hype-aversion (when it came out people were a bit over-excited about it), and others having anti-hype-aversion (the thing is honestly hard to spec and gear well, and very easy to over-universal, but not nearly as bad as some of the detractors say). So, a good portion of the players split the middle and go with 'OK'.
So long as you have Provisioned Store access and your fleet has provisions of that type, you don't need to leave your fleet, just be invited to a higher tiered fleetbase to gain access.
Probably because there really isn't a good carrier Fed side with the way you want to play. The Atrox has a higher shield mod than the Vo'quv and only slightly less hull, but since you don't like the Sci focus and lack of frigates, there isn't a C-Store option. The Recluse Lobi ship might fit your needs, but that's quite expensive.
I have a mix of toons from each faction and all of them are in the same fleets respectively (my gaming groups fleet) which is incredibly small, so much so that I'm usually the only person on. Generally I avoid Zone chat because it's full of idiots who would start a fight with you if you said the sky is blue.
If you're having trouble getting help from your Fed fleet mates, it may be time to find a nicer fleet.
Of course I know I can bribe a fleet. I just need to make sure to take out all my EC to do that.
And it's worse than a-hole. It's the fact that the Fed players actually treat l2p advices as a kindness, that using fleet instead of c-store ship is a good thing. At least when a-hole say those you know they do want to be a troll.
If there's anyway to ask for a refund for the Heavy Escort Carrier, I will do it pronto.
You were whining about having to potentially leave your fleet if you wanted anything good, and I pointed out you didn't have to leave it.
Fleet stores are Cryptics new way of making money, as some people will spend real dollars to help out their guild, and to advance at a decent manor means using a lot resources, most all able to be gotten via real money exchanges. So, to get a good portion of the players interested in the Fleet progression, they put some pretty nice stuff in it.
As far as the KDF, one of the best battle cruisers is the Fleet Tor'kaht, though it's a lot lower Shipyard Tier compared to the Fed equivelants. Head on over to the Klingon Fleetyards subforum, lots of recommendations for it.
He said he doesn't want to use Fleet gear, not that he doesn't want to leave his fleet. He wants to avoid using Fleet ships and gear, and was asking for C-store alternatives and other alternatives. His point was that Federation players tend to just talk about Fleet gear, without discussing viable non-fleet options, and that the Federation players tend to be insulting about it.
Thank you. That voices my concerns exactly.
If I really hate my fleet, then I would not even ask if it's worthwhile to leave. Yet I do have to face the following reality:
1) I do not have resoruces to bribe a map invite.
2) The fleet I am in is only t3.
That's the problem with HEC - it is good, but only if you have a good fleet, or can bribe a good fleet. Otherwise it's way more expensive then $50, by then I may as well get the Vesta pack instead. Of coruse compare with Fleet gear it does not hold a candle, but I am comparing apple to apple (non-fleet versus non-fleet) - the use of Aux DHC gives it somethign similar to fleet gear, which is good enough for me. Too bad cryptic won't give me a refund so that i can get the Vesta pack instead, but seems like the scimatar is an even better match for me.
If I want to play something that is non-fed, I have two other factions to pick. I am trying to give Federation a chance, but I am not even certain what's the benefit of playing federation once I reach lv50. If it's content, then I can just play my Rom-Fed.
I also noticed that timezarg has a KDF logo - I guess your main is KDF, right? If so, what does that say about Federation players, who's view point seems to be fleet and fleet?
I don't know if it's the worst community ever but the need rolling thing in STFs is extremely annoying. And it forces to either need roll on everything as well or never get any loot.
It's quite unpleasant. I'd like to see the need/greed mechanic removed from these and put everything up for a random roll.
People recommend you fleet gear because its generally the best, if you arent gonna go for the best it doesnt matter what you go for cause just about anything is viable. If you keep getting the same answer and you dont like the one you are getting perhaps its time to take a look at the question.
If fleet gear is out then purple xi and some sets from factions are as good as you are gonna get for the most part. Most of the other answers you are looking for can come from simply looking at ship stats and boff configurations to determine what to do (hint if it only has 3 engineer skill slots its probably not the biggest hull tanker in the world)
If this is still not enough and you have questions about ship builds etc I suggest going to the either the shipyards forum for the faction in question or the builds forum to gain some understanding of mechanics at work, I am not sure what you have played before this but asking in zone chat ingame is pretty much universally the wrong way to get in depth information about a game mechanic or setup in any game ever made with a chat function, use the forums this is what they are there for.
I just wish I can get another pick, and choose vesta instead of HEC. as of now, in order to play the style that I want, I have to pick the two other factions.
EDIT: How much is it to access someone's t5 fleet base?
T4 invites can be had for free, I hand them out all the time.
Arm and a leg, usually. I recommend not doing business with these pirates, it just encourages them.
And looking at these discussion, there are just no way, no how, a fed can get even good enough tanking gears unless they invest wayy too much time. May be good for people who have nothing to do, but anyone with a good enough job would likely pay for good gears then grind, which is what the fleet system is. worse, unlike rep grind, there are no guarantee to get good gears, since they may charge a lot for stuff.
I may still end up getting Vesta like half a year later, and I will also attempt to do a high DPS build - WITHOUT fleet gear. Fleet is the worst thing this game has, and fortunately teh bad thing about fleet is only restricted to Federation for now.
And here's the TL;DR: Fed's gameplay sucks due to everythign surround the fleet. If you want good gameplay, good gear, and good content, roll a Rom fed, and buy the scimatar when it comes out. If you want to RP a Fed, and want a good enough carrier, get the sci-heavy Atrox (which have too much problems) or teh Vesta packs.
I roll need on everything because doing otherwise will give me the choice of either not getting anything at all or dividing my attention between the mission and looking at the drop
Most mission timers start at as soon as you spawn in. For those that don't some dummy usually activates the mission timer as soon as possible. There isn't a great variety of end-game content and most of strategy is deciding how quickly you want to kill things
I agree, perfect DPS builds are boring ships to fly - same routine every time. My bank is filling up with different sets of weapons cause I am having so much fun trying out them all one at a time. My DPS is lower, it takes me longer to make a kill sometimes, but it sure is a lot more fun than not!
And what the heck is l2p?
What the hell is an MK V item even DOING in an STF, anyway?
Probably doing a Fleet Event and there's a low level character there.
On to the OP,
You picked an Escort, with out going into things. The Ship is not designed to be tanky. You'd be better off with the Patrol. Tanking gear is only from Fleet stuff? I got a MACO shield before it was a 40 day grind but you don't need the MK XII, a Mk X should be fine for most PVE including ESTF.
Dilithium is the important currency here, which is available via real cash. Mk XI blue consoles which I use on almost every ship. I have one ship where I got lucky and made a Blue Mk XII that I use.
Now I could be wrong but perhaps your asking for help the wrong way. I need help with my HEC will have people telling you about DHC's and Tac Teams. Explaining what your trying to do and how to do it may get better results. When asking how to do the most DPS possible your going to get recommendations involving the best equipment possible.
If you want DHC's on a Cruiser, roll Klingon. The Stock T5 Vor'cha is not as good as it's fleet version, but it's still a ship that with a bit of effort can happily use DHC's in PVE.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Ok... How about this... Fly the HEC with an Engineering Captain. Use Romulan Plasma Dual Heavy Cannons with the Romulan Hyper Plasma Torpedo and Experimental Beam Array. Grab the Omega Cutting Beam and 2 Turrets. Get yourself Elite Scorpion Fighters or Advanced Shield healing Shuttles (From the Dilithium Store) for extra Tanking. That setup will take care of any PvE fighting you want to do without a single piece of Fleet Equipment.
You said Tier III fleet BTW which means you have access to Advanced Fleet gear which is VERY good stuff. So there should be little issue with using that.
As for the Vesta... Well yes... It can be very potent if you know how to use it but it is complicated.
Where did you find this?
Presumably it stands for "Learn To Play."
The KDF players, on the other hand, tend to be somewhat more patient and think along with the person asking the question (is it because of the design history? The nature of people going for the non-standard faction choice? Who knows...). There's also something more of a making-do-attitude, allowing people the freedom to work with what they got/can get, and telling them how to make the best of that.
I'm not a big fan of sweeping statements about groups, but this does seem the trend, in major hub zone chats.
I will admit, though, I find myself being more helpful playing my KDF characters than my Feds. I think it's mostly because there's more of a chance you'll actually get through to people there, whereas the Fed zone-chats tend to be one big troll-fest rolling over any attempt at helpful conversation :P
Perhaps it's also that Fleet equipment and lockbox ships simply ARE noticably better than most RA, mirror and c-store ships (with the exception of the 3-packs).
There is currently no way to compare and tell weather a c-store MVAM, the Tactical Refit, the HEC, any of the Mirror escorts or any other ship on that level is better than the other. They are on the same level, with only marginal differences. We're missing encounters on which to test them and reliable, accurate data extraction to make out those tiny differences between them.
So the only real difference is weather it's a 9-console ship, or a 10-console one which have more hull, an additional console slot, better shields and often a more practicable Boff setup. And 10-console ships only come from fleets, lockboxes or one of the 3-packs.
If someone is flying a RA Patrol Escort for example and is asking how he could improve on that, there is simply no way to do so, other than pointing him to Fleet versions as most of the other comparable ships are basically the same.
The KDF has the advantage that, while having less designs, they have more ship types. Fed RA escorts are marginable different, while there are noticable differences between KDF BoPs, Raptors or Battlecruisers for example
Assault cruiser, regent
Defiant
all ok to great end game ships. what is the hard thing about finding viable end game ships exactly?
Dont like fleet gear? Advanced fleet gear is as good or better, crappy shield heal for elite weapons meh.
Outside of that stuff you got, mk x out of the dilithium store. But they are what 15 20k dil per for weapons? And most mk x purple stuff is cheap on the exchange.
Exchange in general if you are not into fleet gear, outside of AP, most weapon types up to xi are not too badly priced in general. If you even are thinking about ap advanced fleet weapons have AP that are hellaciously cheaper than the prices on the exchange, sorry but its the fact vs 20 to 30 million for some of the ap stuff on the exchange.
Spiral arrays if your lucky enough to score/afford a galor. but you will be saving dil for about 2 weeks to kite out a t4 t5 ship after you get the galor with its 4 arrays.
Tac consoles xi purples or xii blues, depending on weapon type can be expensive, but get the best you can.
So bolls down to dilithium store, exchange, reputation, lucky elite stf drops, if you are against fleet gear.
At RA tho that 10 mil to rent a t5 base isnt all that bad, one lucky stf drop, a good pull out of a lockbox, or just simple farming for junk drops to vendor, and heck i have seen people offer free t5 yard access, or people renting for a mere 5 mil if you look hard enough. Its not like any of that is overly pricey to get access to elite fleet gear/ships.