=.= community broken: Need or Greed system

jandraelune · June 2013

Might as well be Greed or Pass as Need don't work. The over greedy just > Need < everything.

Those that are not greedy can only resort to Pass on everything with out falling to the same low.

Shouldn't we be striving to make things better...not join with the same failure?

belthazorx · June 2013

Well... mostly if I see something interesting I just click "need". For my thoughts it works pretty well as I normally end up with the item. So in my eyes "greed" doesn't surpasses Need..

Which I used before.. I think need works better than greed.

Better make it Need or Pass.:)

lucianazeta · June 2013

There is no point to the greed button.

You only cheat yourself out of an item, the button would work in premade guild teams where whether or not someone truly needs something is important.

In PUGs I always press need exactly because of what I said, someone will always press need whether they need it or not, thus the only way to have an equal chance is to press need as well.

blafi · June 2013

Greed = bad mmkay.. :cool:

mosquito214 · June 2013

I try to use Pass and Greed a lot in the hopes that it builds up karma for when something comes along I really want, to hit Need with.

It never works. I just end up almost never getting anything.

daan2006 · June 2013

in sto pugs unless you don't want any thing you always need

jandraelune · June 2013

And we have people that instead of trying to fix the issue insist on joining with the problem.

gfreeman98 · June 2013

jandraelune, I hope you are in every PUG I happen to join.

macfelly · June 2013

Greed is for when you are in a team with your fleet or friends. Need is for pugs, why people choose to fight this or impose their own rules is asinine.

x0ligy · June 2013

As already said there is no need for the Greed option should just be Need and Pass but then again when i saw a player always click Greed and never really win it made me chuckle!

(was happening last week)

Personally if there was a way to ignore greedy players in stfs and what not id be game for that, let the greedy's play with themselfs and the others need and pass. Suppose they could also code in some sore of punishment for those that always press greed where they build up a bad reputation with bad luck but it probably come out wrong knowing cryptic :rolleyes:

thratch1 · June 2013

Everybody does need everything, on both levels.

They need everything in practice, naturally.

But they also need everything in the sense that they can use it.

You would have a point if missions and dailies rewarded EC on top of their current rewards, but they don't. Cryptic has not supplied any way for people to earn EC in this game except selling loot. At all. That's why people need on everything -- all of that loot that drops just looks like EC to most people.

It's sad for people who could actually use some drops as upgrades, but the fact is that Cryptic neglected to supply players a way to actually reliably make EC, which means players are resorted to grabbing up whatever loot they can. When looking at the prices on the Exchange for some basic stuff (average of 3 million EC per Very Rare Mk XI Phaser Relay, for instance), people -- especially beginning players -- need a constant stream of EC that they aren't getting from anywhere else.

That's why people are aggressively hitting that Need button.

sparhawk · June 2013

lucianazeta wrote: »

There is no point to the greed button.

You only cheat yourself out of an item, the button would work in premade guild teams where whether or not someone truly needs something is important.

In PUGs I always press need exactly because of what I said, someone will always press need whether they need it or not, thus the only way to have an equal chance is to press need as well.

This. The only way to truly improve this system would be to implement individual loot drops for everyone (standard random chance per critter plus guaranteed boss drops).

ficr · June 2013

mosquito214 wrote: »

I try to use Pass and Greed a lot in the hopes that it builds up karma for when something comes along I really want, to hit Need with.

It never works. I just end up almost never getting anything.

This.

Ideally the number generator would take into account player behavior.
Round 1:
Player 1 Need
Player 2 Greed
Player 3 Pass

Round 2:
Player 1 Need
Player 2 Greed
Player 3 Pass

Round 3:
Player 1 Need
Player 2 Greed
Player 3 Need

Ideally, in Round 3 Player 3 should have the highest chance at receiving the item.

johnsteward · June 2013

thratch1 wrote: »

Everybody does need everything, on both levels.

They need everything in practice, naturally.

But they also need everything in the sense that they can use it.

You would have a point if missions and dailies rewarded EC on top of their current rewards, but they don't. Cryptic has not supplied any way for people to earn EC in this game except selling loot. At all. That's why people need on everything -- all of that loot that drops just looks like EC to most people.

It's sad for people who could actually use some drops as upgrades, but the fact is that Cryptic neglected to supply players a way to actually reliably make EC, which means players are resorted to grabbing up whatever loot they can. When looking at the prices on the Exchange for some basic stuff (average of 3 million EC per Very Rare Mk XI Phaser Relay, for instance), people -- especially beginning players -- need a constant stream of EC that they aren't getting from anywhere else.

That's why people are aggressively hitting that Need button.

this is basically the final answer to the topic..

there is some EC you can make by Tour the Universe but thats it. Given the prices for good doffs/items in general in the exchange means that everyone needs every single little credit they can get. Add starbases and rep projects who need you to buy loads of commodities. So basically i always use need and dont feel bad about it because i do need it.
If there where other more effective ways to get EC other than the current way i would go for it but there isnt, so there you go.

ficr · June 2013

thratch1 wrote: »

Everybody does need everything, on both levels.

They need everything in practice, naturally.

But they also need everything in the sense that they can use it.

You would have a point if missions and dailies rewarded EC on top of their current rewards, but they don't. Cryptic has not supplied any way for people to earn EC in this game except selling loot. At all. That's why people need on everything -- all of that loot that drops just looks like EC to most people.

It's sad for people who could actually use some drops as upgrades, but the fact is that Cryptic neglected to supply players a way to actually reliably make EC, which means players are resorted to grabbing up whatever loot they can. When looking at the prices on the Exchange for some basic stuff (average of 3 million EC per Very Rare Mk XI Phaser Relay, for instance), people -- especially beginning players -- need a constant stream of EC that they aren't getting from anywhere else.

That's why people are aggressively hitting that Need button.

Doffing.
That's how I acquire EC, minerals, etc.

What I can't understand is the threads of people constantly hitting the dilithium refining limit. Granted, I have multiple alts, (yes I run other things besides doffing.) But even when I focus, I'm only over the limit for a day or 2.

assimilatedktar · June 2013

In ye good olden days in WoW needing everything was grounds for being kicked from the team and together with the absence of communication or the exclusive use of emotes a way to identify gold farmers. One of the many things that gets lost if everything is automated.

I usually hit greed the first one or two times and watch what the others do. If there are people who need on every bit of TRIBBLE I do the same. No need to cheat myself.

scrimpinion · June 2013

There's a simple solution to this: Need counts as TWO votes, but triggers an automatic Pass on the next roll. everything else is the same. either you want a chance at the loot, are willing to double the chances and skip the next one, or don't want more inventory litter.

durenas · June 2013

They could just raise the default threshold to purple, so you would only roll on purple things, and round-robin everything else.

mirrorchaos · June 2013

i only need on items i know will pull in a good tidy sum in the short term like TRIBBLE deflectors, shields, engines and warp cores. the rest i just pass on. when im on ground i need on all the borg protection hypos and grenades. i have not seen anyone else use them in any stf i have ran since i started playing them. with my reman engineer i can take down borg mobs myself with all that plus trans bomb and chron mines, so im amazed how little i have seen these immuno hypos been used and see people getting turned into a borg..

blafi · June 2013

They should make those stupid white/green/blue drops drop for all players in the instance. Then just Roll/pass on the purple stuff.

"Back in the old days" a self regulatory system like need/greed/pass worked** but nowadays with the influx of the "casual gamer" it just doesn't work anymore.

**It's what "oldbie" gamers want you to believe, i for one remember the same discussions we're having here went on in "the good old days" as well.

naevius · June 2013

Need/Greed/Pas is a completely inane system and a stupid legacy of old MMOs.
It should be abolished. Period. Loot needs to drop already assigned to individuals.

Until it changes I shall 'Need' everything without the slightest remorse.

topset · June 2013

macfelly wrote: »

Greed is for when you are in a team with your fleet or friends. Need is for pugs, why people choose to fight this or impose their own rules is asinine.

Me and my friends and fleet don't even bother with greed. What's the point?

Need on stuff you want, pass on stuff you don't.

The stuff people actually "need" that drops, pretty much never drops. I think I've seen maybe 5-10 items which it's possible for someone to legitimately need over the last 500 STFs. Small enough sample size to just ignore!

Everyone I run with just agrees need/pass before the game, much easier (I don't pug)

darkjeff · June 2013

topset wrote: »

The stuff people actually "need" that drops, pretty much never drops. I think I've seen maybe 5-10 items which it's possible for someone to legitimately need over the last 500 STFs.

This is the truth.

Nobody actually "Needs" anything that drops, so it's either Need if you want it, or Pass if you don't.

It actually works in Neverwinter where there are class items, and people regularly only Need stuff they can use and Greed things they can't.

In STO, there's no point - either everybody Greeds, or everybody Needs.

glassguitar · June 2013

naevius wrote: »

Need/Greed/Pas is a completely inane system and a stupid legacy of old MMOs.
It should be abolished. Period. Loot needs to drop already assigned to individuals.

Until it changes I shall 'Need' everything without the slightest remorse.

^^^^
THIS!!

Having to click the need -vs- greed button is an pointless slowdown to gameplay.

zerobang · June 2013

just bind Need to Spacebar and stop bothering with it,
even the Elite channels need on everything by now. completely obsolete functionality with no real life purpose anymore.

No need to cry about it either.

artanisen · June 2013

Actually Greed is broken,

if everyone presses need it will choose a random person,

but thats just what i think.
--
but to me the hole thing greed and need, needs to be removed
and just have the hole system automatically randomly choose a
person everytime someone picks up an item.

i wish i could set it on need auto, get tired of pressing need
every 5 seconds during a battle. yes i press need,
no point in pressing greed when everyone clicks need.

millimidget · June 2013

jandraelune wrote: »

Might as well be Greed or Pass as Need don't work. The over greedy just > Need < everything.

Everything that drops that way is vendor trash anyway.

ricorosebud · June 2013

jandraelune wrote: »

And we have people that instead of trying to fix the issue insist on joining with the problem.

Trying to impose what you think others should do upon an online gaming community? You will find the same amount of success trying to herd cats.

Need or Greed is stupid, I agree. But the system needs to change. Players ain't gonna. There will always be "those guys".

jorantomalak · June 2013

ricorosebud wrote: »

Trying to impose what you think others should do upon an online gaming community? You will find the same amount of success trying to herd cats.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-VsxiABZ5S9s/Tcko757nyAI/AAAAAAAABxY/Svrxx2tZ1nM/s1600/HerdingCats.jpg

ricorosebud · June 2013

jorantomalak wrote: »

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-VsxiABZ5S9s/Tcko757nyAI/AAAAAAAABxY/Svrxx2tZ1nM/s1600/HerdingCats.jpg

Meanwhile, back at "Meow Ranch"......

thratch1 · June 2013

sopwithsnipe wrote: »

And what's sad is that when Cryptic made City of Heroes they didn't use the Need/Greed/Pass system. Each character automatically made individual rolls for loot and it went right into their inventory.

Players never fought over drops, there was no d-baggery or animosity over people being greedy jerks.

To be fair, loot was drastically different in City of Heroes.

Plus, while the company name is the same, you have to wonder how many of the old CoH team is even still working at Cryptic.

=.= community broken: Need or Greed system

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