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Banned - LOR Starter/Legacy Pack

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  • newromulan1newromulan1 Member Posts: 2,229
    edited May 2013
    Personally I don't think this thread serves anyone here any more useful purpose.

    End Transmission.
  • grouchyotakugrouchyotaku Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    And another person who didn't bother to read the 'Terms of Service' Agreement...
    You understand and agree that the cancellation of your User Id is your sole right and remedy with respect to any dispute, including, but not limited to, any related to, or arising out of: (i) any term of this Agreement or PWE's enforcement or application of this Agreement; (ii) the User Contents; (iii) your ability to access and/or use the Service or the Website; or (iv) the amount or type of fees, surcharges, applicable taxes, billing methods, or any change to the fees, applicable taxes, surcharges or billing methods.
    http://www.perfectworld.com/about/terms
  • torgaddon101torgaddon101 Member Posts: 600 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    And all of this has nothing to do with the OP's problem because he would still have gotten his account banned for filing a charge back.

    I think?

    before you post is understand your consumer rights, and read the T&C of any agreement... (agreements and contracts are very different in Law)

    whether it be with PWE/cryptic or paypal or your credit card company, there are different levels of credit protection to both sides, which gives both side an element of protection.

    I'm more stunned by some of the posts criticizing the OP and then blaming him..!

    all that has happened here is a glitch, where he/she tried to contact customer services and got no response.

    so he/she vented on the forums.. if this had happened to you; would you not maybe have done the same thing.?

    and before anyone starts about law.. i'll ask you to define whats legal and lawful or what illegal or unlawful...

    then we can have a debate.

    until then give the OP some compassion...
  • grouchyotakugrouchyotaku Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    ...

    all that has happened here is a glitch, where he/she tried to contact customer services and got no response.

    so he/she vented on the forums.. if this had happened to you; would you not maybe have done the same thing.?
    Having a issue with Billing and Custormer Support is one thing. Disputing a Credit Card payment that was made willingly made is an entirely different matter, which really has no justification...

    The user decided to use the Nuclear Option, and got a Nuclear response... End of Story.
  • krystallos66krystallos66 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Do you not dispute charges for items you do not receive? After attempting to resolve this several times and just getting automated responses with no answer to the problem this looked to me to be my only option.

    At least when I had problems with World of ******** I could call Blizzards support department and get things fixed. Here I can send them an email and get an automated email response that doesn't help me. If someone has a number where I can contact their customer support I would gladly do so as I have not been able to find one.
  • beefsupreme79beefsupreme79 Member Posts: 234 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    woppy1 wrote: »
    why should I be patient, I have paid 100's if not 1000's of dollars to play this game and I cant even access my main toon that I have played with since year DOT, it has been like this for THREE yes THREE F*****G days now yet all we see is new lockbox available, master key sale extended(we want your money only Interested IN F*****G MONEY) what we don't see is a fix incoming, no server maintained today so im now left until Monday afternoon at the earliest for a fix, that will be FIVE F*****G DAYS!!!!!

    ^^ agreed, it dosent take a rocket scientist to see all pwe cares about is profit. profit is fine, its the point of a buisness. But low class organizations neglect everything else: game integrety (balance), customer service, tech upkeep, proper testing etc.

    Unfortunately cryptics parent company is known in the gaming world for taking a game. squeezing the most it can out of it via overpriced packages, overpowered ships, lotteries etc.

    than when all respect and quality is gone along with most of the playerbase they move along to there next exploit (game)

    dont bother countering my reply with "you would be wrong" deaf ears my friends
  • panicswitchedpanicswitched Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Legacy of Romulus Launched a few days ago...to initiate a chargeback you have to wait a period of time after the listed delivery date and attempt to work it out with the merchant (even if they are not responsive). PWE and Cryptic would have eventually sorted it out within a week or so.

    I have yet to see an MMO launch or expansion launch that doesn't cause this kind of problem. It's sadly become the de facto standard for launch...

    The OP waited less than 3 days before initiating a chargeback. As a previous poster said, the OP went Nuclear, and PWE/Cryptic responded back in kind.

    It sucks for OP but I have no sympathy because they over-reacted and lack patience...there are hundreds of other games to play and wait.
  • redsnake721redsnake721 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I have had Billing issues in the past and there is a Toll Free 1-800 number to call and speak to a real person. I was able to get my issues taken care of right then. I didnet want to post the number because im not sure if that is not allowed on the forums for some reason but it is on the PWE support page under billing support.
  • krystallos66krystallos66 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Legacy of Romulus Launched a few days ago...to initiate a chargeback you have to wait a period of time after the listed delivery date and attempt to work it out with the merchant (even if they are not responsive). PWE and Cryptic would have eventually sorted it out within a week or so.

    The OP waited less than 3 days before initiating a chargeback. As a previous poster said, the OP went Nuclear, and PWE/Cryptic responded back in kind.

    It sucks for OP but I have no sympathy.

    That is what the Dispute does when going through Paypal, it allows them to respond to your dispute before you are given the money back. They immediately banned my account when the Dispute was initiated, not after it had completed.

    I can understand if they did just put a hold on my receiving the Starter Pack (which I still had not). But instead they banned my entire LIFETIME account, which I have spent a LOT of money on because I am disputing the charge for the Starter Pack which I did not get.
  • john53ajohn53a Member Posts: 59 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I checked Bundles (first since this was where it was supposed to be) and Legacy unlocks. In fact I looked in EVERY section of the store both inside the game and from the website and it is not there. And yes, I did use Romulan characters to look. I also used a couple of different browsers to check... still not there. As much money as I have already spent on this game at this point I would just rather have my game turned back on and eat the $20. I already closed my dispute in Paypal hoping I can get it turned back on but it probably won't happen til next week at this point.

    I, for one, would have been happy with a "Hey, we know about your problem and are working to fix it" but all I got was closed in game tickets and repeated automated reply emails with solutions that did not work.

    yeah you got to love those master keys...and the box that drops TRIBBLE and if you are lucky in box 20 or 30 wow a ship. To me this is the biggest scam they got going, not just letting the keys drop randomly no pay us 125 zen for 1, or 10 for 1100 zen we love your money TRIBBLE the problems.
    Every since F2P this game has been harder to play, and yes I am a lifetime member who will use the store now and then but I refuse to waste money on keys that get me nothing unless i spend $50 just so i might get a ship. PW/Cryptic shame on you for that.
  • chiefbrexchiefbrex Member Posts: 111 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I ordered the LOR Starter Pack a few weeks ago. When LOR went live I started some Romulan characters and tried to retrieve my Starter Pack which I had already paid for. It was not showing up in the C-Store for me to claim. I sent in several tickets to get this addressed. I tried their methods from the forum posts on how to retrieve, still could not. I wrote more tickets. All they have done is send me the same automated reply about doing the same thing the forum posts says, which does not work. It showed on my transaction that my purchase had completed on 5/7/13.

    There are many others experiencing this same problem. I got tired of getting absolutely no response about this matter and disputed my payment for the Starter Pack which I still had not received with Paypal. Well in warning to any others who have this problem... they cannot get you your purchase but they can ban you within minutes of disputing payment for it.

    So I guess if you are interested in continuing to play you just have to let them TRIBBLE you out of your recent purchase or suffer the same consequences as me.

    Regards...
    A Very Unhappy Customer

    Did you follow the instructions to check the email address that you have/had tied to your STO account? Because, after your purchase, you get an email sent to that address from PWE. In it is a link that connects your account in STO to your Starter Pack. Then, when you roll your Romulan character, you go to the Zen Store, click on Bundles, and in that list, is your Starter Pack.

    By disputing your purchase through paypal, you essentially told Cryptic that you were getting your Starter Pack for free, one way or another. As far as they're concerned, you got your product. So, I can understand then banning you for that. It usually pays to read through all the material and follow instructions exactly. Everyone who has complained about this being a "bug," have essentially ignored the fact that they got an email from PWE with instructions on how to retrieve their Starter/Legacy Pack.

    Furthermore, if there was any confusion, the Forum moderators/Devs, even put notices at the top of every forum page, in green and yellow, and light blue text, showing you how to retrieve your pack.

    Clearly, you didn't follow instructions.
  • panicswitchedpanicswitched Member Posts: 26 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    That is what the Dispute does when going through Paypal, it allows them to respond to your dispute before you are given the money back. They immediately banned my account when the Dispute was initiated, not after it had completed.

    I can understand if they did just put a hold on my receiving the Starter Pack (which I still had not). But instead they banned my entire LIFETIME account, which I have spent a LOT of money on because I am disputing the charge for the Starter Pack which I did not get.

    PayPal themselves state that buyers should generally wait 7 business days after the expected delivery / payment date before opening a dispute. It sucks that you got crappy responses, but you did jump the gun here.

    Paypal is notoriously anti-seller and many vendors (including Steam and Microsoft) have policies in place to ban/lock accounts that initiate chargebacks or disputes without attempting to contact them (in-game is not always the right way). A phone call or other method would have been appropriate.

    PWE and Cryptic could have definitely handled it better since you are a loyal customer, but in this case, you messed up. As I stated before it is just a game, waiting a few days wouldn't hurt anything. Also if the ban happened within minutes, it's also likely that you triggered an automated fraud/anti-theft measure within their system.
  • krystallos66krystallos66 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    If calling them had been an option I would gladly and most definitely have tried but I cannot find a customer support number, can you?

    As for those saying they have no sympathy... honestly, get over yourselves no one is asking for nor cares for your sympathy. My initial post was a warning to others who might be having the same problem I am and what they could expect if they responded the same way I did. If my post has helped a few people keep doing what they enjoy doing then I'm glad I took the time.
  • jessiecoltjessiecolt Member Posts: 80 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    1. Suspending/banning an account is standard operating procedure for most gaming companies when you charge-back on an order that shows completed. Their system shows you got what you paid for. If you are having trouble claiming the item, that is a separate issue from your actual purchase.

    You should contact PayPal and drop/cancel the dispute, then reply to your original Support Case that you filed with the company and update the case to indicate that you have dropped the dispute.

    2. Most of the goodie/pack purchase information I have seen includes a game code you have to redeem through your account on the web site before you can claim it through the store. Did you check to see if this is the case with the Legacy Packs? Yes, look in your spam folders too.

    3. It is a US Holiday weekend. No matter what you do at this point, do not expect to get any reply/help until after Tuesday, even if you live in a non US country. Why? Because 1000X more people will be flooding the servers and other tech issues will be the focus of the company this weekend and into the early part of the week.
  • bpharmabpharma Member Posts: 2,022
    edited May 2013
    Well they DID try to help you:

    "I, for one, would have been happy with a "Hey, we know about your problem and are working to fix it" but all I got was closed in game tickets and repeated automated reply emails with solutions that did not work" - krystallos66

    Then you went for a claim to say you had not recieved it through paypal after less than 7 days. Now swallow your pride and PM redsnake on page 4, he may be able to provide the link or the phone number of who to contact. If you stay calm and play dumb on the phone to them they will most likely restore everything and even sort out your starter/legacy pack problem.

    Then you can join us all for the fun in queue ^.^

    It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
    A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.

    Has damage got out of control?
    This is the last thing I will post.
  • redsnake721redsnake721 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I hope in not doing anything wrong by posting this but the billing support number for PWE is:

    1-888-344-4478 (phone hours are 10am to 7pm PDT M-F)
  • krystallos66krystallos66 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    jessiecolt wrote: »
    1. Suspending/banning an account is standard operating procedure for most gaming companies when you charge-back on an order that shows completed. Their system shows you got what you paid for. If you are having trouble claiming the item, that is a separate issue from your actual purchase.

    You should contact PayPal and drop/cancel the dispute, then reply to your original Support Case that you filed with the company and update the case to indicate that you have dropped the dispute.

    2. Most of the goodie/pack purchase information I have seen includes a game code you have to redeem through your account on the web site before you can claim it through the store. Did you check to see if this is the case with the Legacy Packs? Yes, look in your spam folders too.

    3. It is a US Holiday weekend. No matter what you do at this point, do not expect to get any reply/help until after Tuesday, even if you live in a non US country. Why? Because 1000X more people will be flooding the servers and other tech issues will be the focus of the company this weekend and into the early part of the week.


    1. In an earlier post I mentioned that I had went back and dropped the disputed charge, I also sent in a support ticket with that info.

    2. I purchased directly from this website so there was no 3rd party code to apply.

    3. I know now that I am screwed out of playing until Tuesday at the earliest, at least I will be working 12 hour shifts 3 of those nights :)

    Also, thanks redsnake, for the number.
  • leviathan99#2867 leviathan99 Member Posts: 7,747 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    PayPal themselves state that buyers should generally wait 7 business days after the expected delivery / payment date before opening a dispute. It sucks that you got crappy responses, but you did jump the gun here.

    Paypal is notoriously anti-seller and many vendors (including Steam and Microsoft) have policies in place to ban/lock accounts that initiate chargebacks or disputes without attempting to contact them (in-game is not always the right way). A phone call or other method would have been appropriate.

    PWE and Cryptic could have definitely handled it better since you are a loyal customer, but in this case, you messed up. As I stated before it is just a game, waiting a few days wouldn't hurt anything. Also if the ban happened within minutes, it's also likely that you triggered an automated fraud/anti-theft measure within their system.

    I went through this once and waited two weeks before doing the dispute.

    Frankly, the billing error I had was so weird that had I not done something, I'd have been out $50 without any ZEN to show or it. You can have errors like this if you buy when account servers are being prepped for or are in maintenance.

    I don't blame people for opening a dispute if they get no response. You will get auto banned but you can get restored IF you either withdrawal your claim or PWE can verify their error.

    Again, I'd suggest contacting Brandon and PWE billing separately. Always better to have both sides looking into it. Brandon can have Cryptic people investigate while PWE can look at billing.

    Now, if it were my company, I wouldn't ban over in progress disputes. It's heavy handed. I'd save bans for completed chargebacks where I couldn't verify error on my side or perhaps if the dispute remains open too long. But instant ban isn't exactly striving to be the Cadillac of customer service. Which I do think ALL entertainment companies really should strive for.

    It sucks. It can be resolved. It won't be resolved this weekend. My advice to the OP is to understand that system errors are design errors are human errors. And getting this resolved means reaching out to people at Cryptic and PWE. It's better to approach those people with the attitude that the dispute here is all business and that you want to cooperate to track down the error and get it fixed, that the dispute isn't personal but is your attempt to avoid being charged for something you never received. If you make clear that they're not the enemy, it can be easier to get help.
  • bpharmabpharma Member Posts: 2,022
    edited May 2013
    Redsnake you shouldn't be banned for that as it is a PWE number for support and you were helping someone else out. Thank you for helping.

    It is through repetition that we learn our weakness.
    A master with a stone is better than a novice with a sword.

    Has damage got out of control?
    This is the last thing I will post.
  • krystallos66krystallos66 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    chiefbrex wrote: »
    Did you follow the instructions to check the email address that you have/had tied to your STO account? Because, after your purchase, you get an email sent to that address from PWE. In it is a link that connects your account in STO to your Starter Pack. Then, when you roll your Romulan character, you go to the Zen Store, click on Bundles, and in that list, is your Starter Pack.

    By disputing your purchase through paypal, you essentially told Cryptic that you were getting your Starter Pack for free, one way or another. As far as they're concerned, you got your product. So, I can understand then banning you for that. It usually pays to read through all the material and follow instructions exactly. Everyone who has complained about this being a "bug," have essentially ignored the fact that they got an email from PWE with instructions on how to retrieve their Starter/Legacy Pack.

    Furthermore, if there was any confusion, the Forum moderators/Devs, even put notices at the top of every forum page, in green and yellow, and light blue text, showing you how to retrieve your pack.

    Clearly, you didn't follow instructions.

    Clearly you don't know what the F you are talking about. I followed the links. I followed the directions, mine simply does not work that way. My transaction shows to be complete. There are others who are experiencing the same thing.
  • spektre12spektre12 Member Posts: 90 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I was experiencing this problem as well. They sent out a mini patch because when I logged back in the next day it re-patched the entire 6+ GB Romulan faction and then a smaller patch immediately afterward.

    It was only after that my bundle showed up under the bundles tab. I'm sorry this has happened to you but maybe you can do a ban dispute and take screen captures of your completed transactions?

    :D
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • krystallos66krystallos66 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    The instructions you didn't follow were the ones with Customer Support, by being patient and giving everyone involved a chance to resolve the problem for you.


    Instead in less than four days from launch you decided to jump the gun and filed a charge back for which you were rightfully banned.

    There are consequences when you get impatient.

    You are not adding to the conversation troll so please move on.

    The new Defiance game has been a nice distraction (especially if you are a Borderlands fan) as it is free to play around on this weekend. Even more interesting to see Rift going free to play next month.
  • donutsmasherdonutsmasher Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    woppy1 wrote: »
    where in my post did I say I had done a charge back, I said I would do one. reading helps:rolleyes:


    Here.
    woppy1 wrote: »
    I got tired of getting absolutely no response about this matter and disputed my payment for the Starter Pack which I still had not received with Paypal.

    Use of past tense and overall sentence construction is indicative of a factual assertion that a specific action, or sequence of actions, has taken place.

    Disputing a payment with a bank or credit facility automatically puts said payment on hold whilst an investigation is carried out. This is standard practice for all financial institutions regardless of whether they have a real world presence or an online one.

    Perhaps in future if you do not wish to be called a liar or any colorful metaphor, you might wish to be honest in the first instance, rather than back-track at a later point.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Sig by my better half.
  • krystallos66krystallos66 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Mocking you would be trolling. Pointing out that you brought this problem on yourself on the off chance that you might learn from your mistake and not make it again in the future is not.

    Your response to me however demonstrates that you haven't learned anything about accepting responsibility for ones actions. Which is sad because it means you'll be finding yourself in similar frustrating situations, and I pity the poor people that work in CS that will have to put up with you.:(

    I have been online gaming since '96 and have been on this planet 46 years and this is the first time I have encountered a situation like this personally. So to say I will be finding myself in more of these frustrating situations is laughable. Actually I am a pleasure to work with, a customer support reps dream to work with as I am polite and understanding.
  • grouchyotakugrouchyotaku Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Do you not dispute charges for items you do not receive? After attempting to resolve this several times and just getting automated responses with no answer to the problem this looked to me to be my only option.

    PWE policy on Billing disputes are posted in the 'Terms of Service' policy statement for all to see. And the 'Terms of Service' statement is posted for a reason, as by continuing to play STO is taken as defacto agreement to its terms.
    1. Legal Agreement

    These Terms constitute a legal agreement between you and PWE. Your using this Website or otherwise accessing or downloading any of our Games, shall constitute your agreement to accept and be bound by the terms and conditions appearing in these Terms, and your agreement to comply with any Rules of Conduct posted on the Website or otherwise provided to you by PWE (the "Rules of Conduct") and any end-user license agreement ("EULA") applicable to our Game software or other software that we may provide in connection with the Service (the "Software"), as they may be amended from time to time. If you do not agree with any of these Terms, please do not access or otherwise use the PWE Website and our Games.
    You understand and agree that the cancellation of your User Id is your sole right and remedy with respect to any dispute, including, but not limited to, any related to, or arising out of: (i) any term of this Agreement or PWE's enforcement or application of this Agreement; (ii) the User Contents; (iii) your ability to access and/or use the Service or the Website; or (iv) the amount or type of fees, surcharges, applicable taxes, billing methods, or any change to the fees, applicable taxes, surcharges or billing methods.
    http://www.perfectworld.com/about/terms
  • slurmerslurmer Member Posts: 62 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    In my opinion a ban for lodging a dispute is very heavy handed, its a dispute not auto refund, its a chance for the payee to indicated they are not happy or have not had their part of the contract fulfilled.

    Doing this will simply upset people.

    As for terms and conditions they are NOT legally binding, its important to remember this fact should something seem unfair and yet it is mentioned in the T's/C's.

    Perhaps the OP should of looked for other methods of recourse but I do think a instance ban on a dispute is lazy and detrimental to PWE
  • amahoodamahood Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I have had similar things happen when a payment bug resulted in no ZEN.

    My advice is to contact Brandon and submit both community and billing tickets.

    My suggestion here is that you probably forgot to click on the e-mail confirmation to apply the pack to your account or didn't get the e-mail. So from PWE's perspective, it's a reversed charge for something they delivered.

    I think this is the best advice. And also, always either record a video of your online purchase as proof or take a "screenshot" picture of it. That's what I always do.
  • krystallos66krystallos66 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    PWE policy on Billing disputes are posted in the 'Terms of Service' policy statement for all to see. And the 'Terms of Service' statement is posted for a reason, as by continuing to play STO is taken as defacto agreement to its terms.



    http://www.perfectworld.com/about/terms

    LOL... really? Pulling out the TOS? Ya, EVERYONE reads those. Of the many games I have played I have never read the TOS and I doubt 95 to 99 percent of people would say the same.

    If I made a mistake by disputing the charge for an item I did not receive it is easily remedied and I will suffer by not playing the game for a few days. By banning me they have ensured that a loyal customer (since beta) with a large amount of disposable income who often dropped 50 bucks on some ships just because they "looked cool" will no longer be supporting them. Missing out on a few days in game or losing a good paying customer for life, whose was the greater mistake?
  • nadiezjanadiezja Member Posts: 629 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    LOL... really? Pulling out the TOS? Ya, EVERYONE reads those. Of the many games I have played I have never read the TOS and I doubt 95 to 99 percent of people would say the same.

    If I made a mistake by disputing the charge for an item I did not receive it is easily remedied and I will suffer by not playing the game for a few days. By banning me they have ensured that a loyal customer (since beta) with a large amount of disposable income who often dropped 50 bucks on some ships just because they "looked cool" will no longer be supporting them. Missing out on a few days in game or losing a good paying customer for life, whose was the greater mistake?
    Losing a customer or allowing people to get away with reversing charges without first exhausting all mechanisms for handling the problem?

    I'd do the first. If you're reversing charges that quickly? You're NOT a good customer. Some forms of customer behavior aren't worth putting up with for any dollar amount, and that's one.
  • slurmerslurmer Member Posts: 62 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Its a dispute not a reverse charge, big difference
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