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The point to choose an ally comes too soon!
backyardserenade
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Hey guys,
I'm extremely enjoying the Legacy of Romulus update so far. The mission design and writing is quite good and there are a couple of interesting surprises along the way (BOFFs with backstories, cool Romulan tutorial, wonderful Romulan customization options and gameplay ideas).
Today I hit level 10 and had to choose an ally. And I have to say that this decision comes WAY too soon in the game. I would have loved to play as a Romulan refugee a little longer: Being on my own, supporting the Flotilla, getting to know both Factions through some more interactions and missions.
I'd say that level 20 is a much better point to make that decision. Especially considering there might be entirely new players who play the game for the very first time with a Romulan character.
I'm not sure if this is really an option anymore? The choice of an ally is very integral to the Romulan story and gameplay (considering things like PVE, PVP, DOFF System and Fleet progression depend on that choice). But maybe the devs could consder pushing this moment a little further back.
(And just to make that clear: I'm not questioning the choice itself. It makes sense to me and I like the way it is presented in game. It's just about letting players explore the universe and as lone wolves a little longer before forcing us to decide on an ally).
I'm extremely enjoying the Legacy of Romulus update so far. The mission design and writing is quite good and there are a couple of interesting surprises along the way (BOFFs with backstories, cool Romulan tutorial, wonderful Romulan customization options and gameplay ideas).
Today I hit level 10 and had to choose an ally. And I have to say that this decision comes WAY too soon in the game. I would have loved to play as a Romulan refugee a little longer: Being on my own, supporting the Flotilla, getting to know both Factions through some more interactions and missions.
I'd say that level 20 is a much better point to make that decision. Especially considering there might be entirely new players who play the game for the very first time with a Romulan character.
I'm not sure if this is really an option anymore? The choice of an ally is very integral to the Romulan story and gameplay (considering things like PVE, PVP, DOFF System and Fleet progression depend on that choice). But maybe the devs could consder pushing this moment a little further back.
(And just to make that clear: I'm not questioning the choice itself. It makes sense to me and I like the way it is presented in game. It's just about letting players explore the universe and as lone wolves a little longer before forcing us to decide on an ally).
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"Sometimes you have to do things that you hate, so you can survive to fight another day."
"Sometimes you have to do things that you hate, so you can survive to fight another day."
Post edited by backyardserenade on
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Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
It detracts from the entire Romulan experience. They could have come up with a better way to deal with the mechanics....
Our choice should really be with the Glorious Romulan Star Empire. Or D'Tan and his petting zoo commune.
I mentioned the suggestion in the episode feedback thread, but I really feel there should be a mission or two where you end up running into each faction before the summit and either have to work towards a mutual goal with each of them.. or end up at odds with each of them. That way, a player who is either ignorant to the game mechanics or the franchise itself will get some impression of how their playstyles differ and the difference of philosophy between them.
The problem is the Feds are inferior aliens and the Klingons have been our Blood Enemies for centuries. Neither is very palatable.
Our best route would be to ally with the Cardassians. The True way. Not the peacenik ones.
Which brings me to another point which is if Cardassions ever appear they'll end up watered down bargain basement Feds as well fighting for truth, justice and the American way.
I appreciate that not everyone is happy with this, but it is the story we're telling and some will like it and some will not.
It was not an arbitrary decision and the way the Romulans faction is implemented on TRIBBLE is how it will be on May 21.
"Sometimes you have to do things that you hate, so you can survive to fight another day."
OK... I personally cant stand this being forced to ally with our enemies...
but if we have to do it... there needs to be a better explanation as to WHY we are doing it. Maybe I missed some text or didnt scroll enough but I dont think ist really explained WHY you have to do this.
It also doesnt really give the player any info on the potential benefits or drawbacks for either side. Old players will get it. New players wont know the missions or equipment or DOFF assignments etc.
Also I dont really get how some of us can be Allied with the Feds and some the Klingons. Makes absolutly no sense.
I think they need to allow the the player to be able to switch at some point. Its not really fair to new players to make them make a decision that is set in stone when they really have no idea what the decision actually entails.
Like for me, I had a specific reason for choosing Fed and it was based soley on lock box loot. But after playing a while I discovered that I really didnt enjoy the forced Fed experience. Oh well. Too bad. Stuck with it forever.
New Players cant make an informed choice at level 10. You barely know about your own (so-called) Faction let alone what the others are like.
Honestly, if I had to pick a problem with the "choose and ally" part this pretty well somes up my thoughts.
From a story perspective it makes sense. D'tan and the Republic are trying to form their own society. And it is clear from the mission, Sela is not happy about it. That said, having the Klingons or Federation as your ally adds legitimacy to your cause. In a way it kind of mirrors the American Revolution in that way, with the Colonies seeing an ally in France.
The problem is, I don't understand the other sides reasons for doing it. Specifically the Federation. T'nae basically reads you the riot act early in the mission (in a rather unvulcan manner if you ask me) and who do we have who is on board at the end. The blabbermouth who wasn't all that against it to begin with.
On the other hand, T'nae I guess is just as happy with it? Seems rather illogical to me.
I have to agree with this completely. We can't argue the dynamics at this point, as Dan has said, this is not up for debate, as much as many of us would like to debate it.
However, as mentioned, the input we are trying to convey is that at level 10, based on the experiences of the story so far, and the severe lack of information as to how THE CHOICE will impact future character development, the player can not make an educated choice.
- There has not been enough interaction, story-wise, with either main faction, to make a decision based on in-character experiences. If one would value the storyline 'feel' up until that point, it most definitely leads to just one choice: Fed...the story is much too 'Humanity' centric in terms of the overall feel and tempo of it. It is only at the very end at the Khitomer conference that the KDF is involved, and it is conflicting.
- There is not enough information on how THE CHOICE affects future gameplay, in terms of Reputation advancement, Fleets, Ships and equipment, etc. Most of that info is incomplete, and gained by heresay on chat and forums, and vague FAQ dev posts. Nothing points the player to this information at this point in the story line (lvl 10). You are assuming too much that this information has been provided to the player at this point. It hasn't. (Edit: Ok, the actual final choice screen gives a little more info on what the choice determines, but it is still fairly vague.)
You are asking, scratch that, FORCING the player to make a poorly informed decision that they can not back out of. THIS is what we are trying to say. The storyline path points at nothing, the Ambassadors in the Flotilla Choice room are useless. When experienced players do not have the information to make their decision, how do you expect players new to the game make it?
Yeah pretty much. The Federation in particular are almost complete non-entities at this stage to your Romulan, and the sample size of people from Starfleet, who should be helping you to gauge them by, are quite frankly pee poor. Simply put, it seems like the Federation isn't taking the gravity of the situation all that seriously.
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
Personaly I would be happy to wait untill level 50 and unlock fed and kdf ships through a reputation system with them insted. Or just have limited ship choices untill more romulan ones can be created. But as that aint happening I would prefer level 30.
They can choose 3 factions to start with, but they can only end up in 2 factions.
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I have to agree with this, the storyline does no justice when it comes to choosing a side. You are just suddenly thrown the decision when you complete the first Arc.
You have no idea of the ramifications of your decision on what would be a better decision. And for a new player, they would have no idea what would be the better choice for them.
The Dev Team really should've thought this out more.
Except for the fact that the Romulans ARE a complete faction, with as much unique main-story content as the Federation or KDF, a complement of unique ships, and a whole unique experience of play.
Then what reason is there to FORCE us to be in another Faction we dont want to be in?
I did like the mission (I forget the name) in which you encounter a Romulan captain who's allied with the opposing faction, and reaffirm that it's not important - all Captains of the Romulan Republic are, ultimately, on the same side.
Don't join a fleet and pretend you have no friends.
Problem solved.
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Then my suggestion is you need to rework that mission. Personally I wanted to take one of the bombs and shove it down Jiro's throat just to shut him up.
It honestly seems with my impression that you want the Romulans to side with the Klingons, just to bulk up the Klingon faction. Heck, you save a Klingon ambassador, fight next to a Klingon warrior, the other Klingons don't trust you (I can't blame them) but they seem pretty cool.
You talk with one Federation character, and I wanted to give him to the Tal Shiar.
So while I get you're artifically trying to load more players onto the Klingon Faction, it doesn't give us a proper introduction to the Federation side, which possible many new players may not be familiar with, outside of JJ Star Trek.
It depends who the timing is aimed at.
For new players it's a really truly exceptionally bad choice. 3 hours into the game without any real feel for the gameplay differences or population or anything between the factions and you have to choose which side you're on. It's building up a choice that belongs at character creation without actually better preparing the player for the choice as part of the buildup.
For old players it's more of an oddity than an actual problem. They already know presumably which faction they want to be part of, and the choice could be made as easily at character creation as later in the leveling curve.
You're right though. Your team has designed itself into a hole there's no cheap way out of. Probably that means you should hire better designers or leads who make better choices. You can't really push the choice much later because it would start to impact serious game systems (like queuing for events and the doff system etc.) and you can't really redo all of the missions to have it happen earlier now. It's unfortunate it has been screwed up this badly, but it's not, on the scale of things a great deal worse than just asking new players to pick a faction at creation and hope they are happy with it 50 or 60 hours from now.
This isn't just the story you're telling. That's the wrong way to think about MMO design. You have built a world for players, and you want to them to make chioces that get them to where they want to be in that world. You can reveal those choices and tradeoffs through story, but that's not the same as giving them story choices that just confuses the issues or obfuscate the consequences of those choices. Which is what the current system does.
There are things that could be done to fix it without shifting the level though. Send players to ESD and Qo'nos first, have some more dialogue explaining some of the actual faction differences, send them off to the combined fleet at gamma orionis, that sort of thing.
But, for new players, they won't see Jiro before they hit VA on their federation characters, so they won't get the joke, and it won't tell them anything useful about the federation as an ally faction.
This... honestly, I think it's just this one character, muddies the entire choice process massively.