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Missions are impossible to create.
martok16
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
After multiple attempts and multiple fails for 3 weeks, I've come to the conclusion, that creating missions are strictly for Einsteins with a masters degree, simply because the UI is not user friendly enough, there's insufficient content, and objects can not be edited/moved within the 3D world.
The only way I can get a grasp on how the inferior UI works is to share my screen with a professional mission creator using Skype, along with Skype voice chat to walk me through from start to finish, including all the workarounds.
Online tutorials? Way out of date, and there are no actual PDF files for step-by-step instructions on creating missions, from start and ending with a fully working mission, including workarounds, with coverage on everything that can be done, and how it's done.
The only way I can get a grasp on how the inferior UI works is to share my screen with a professional mission creator using Skype, along with Skype voice chat to walk me through from start to finish, including all the workarounds.
Online tutorials? Way out of date, and there are no actual PDF files for step-by-step instructions on creating missions, from start and ending with a fully working mission, including workarounds, with coverage on everything that can be done, and how it's done.
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Parallels: my second mission for Fed aligned Romulans.
It so happens that the first Foundry Authors Academy occurred a week ago and recently had the recording posted. This was made for new authors and is a great tutorial for showing you all the basics how to build a mission. It's about 3 hours long so you may want to set aside an afternoon to go through. (I'm told more bite sized chucks are coming soon.)
One thing to keep in mind is that you will at times need to alter an aspect of your story to fit with in the confines of the Foundry. A lot of new authors will hit a road block and stop not realizing that a small change in the way the story is presented can sidestep the block. If you do run into these problems or am just confused about a particular aspect of the Foundry, you can post your question here on the forums or head over to the Starbase UGC chat room for quicker feedback. Most of the Foundry authors are more than happy to help and throw their experience at your problem.
Lastly, while the NW foundry is more polished than STO's, at the core, it's the same Foundry. The way missions are constructed in both are very similar, so running to NW won't solve problems you have here.
Impossible? No
Complicated? Yes
Extra Creativity? Yes
The Foundry is a mess (Blame Beta verison?) but it is not impossible to create missions.
I am not a master mind of the craft, but I have watched lot of Youtube sessions and after that I was pretty much solo going.
The thing is, that The Foundry is not complicated, its simple, to simple it makes it kind of complicated. Do you want to do advanced stuff, then you need to get your creativity going and know how you are going to bend the simple to advance.
Example, A object can only be used in one objective, after that it can't be selected.
So, how to break this? Easly, make two consoles, A & B.
A is for the first objective
B is for the second objective
Stack them togheter on the map.
Make the B invisible till the first objective is done and then make it visible when the second objective is active and make object A invisible after the first objective is done.
I suppose it sounds like nonsense to you, but it is a complicated messure that must be done in a simple program to make an advanced map.
Anyway, I don't know if I am just rambling here but to the point.
Make simple missions to begin with and then move up the ladder.
I have had to much prestige in my Foundry missions, so advanced that I never really complete them because I lack knowledge and time.
The best learning process is by doing.
Good luck
Parallels: my second mission for Fed aligned Romulans.
My character Tsin'xing
That was what I meant, but I am a poor english-writer when I am tired
But as we both said, it is a simple system you need to bend with your creativity to make it more advanced.
As to the original post, Yes, the Foundry is a somewhat complicated tool that has a difficult and steep learning curve. But "impossible" ? nah.
There are a lot of resources available to assist in learning the tool.
(1) The tutorials, while many have grown outdated, there are a LOT of available tutorials that can really help you get a great and basic grasp of the way things work.
(2) The Forums, and asking specific questions regarding your difficulties. Often I have found gets a bunch of good responses.
(3) Direct Interaction with people who know how the tool works. Can be via Skype as you describe in your OP. which I don't understand why you seem to feel this is a "bad" or negative thing. It's simply one other avenue of learning from my perspective. Personally I learn far better with the assistance of a knowledgable mentor.
ALTERNATELY
There are multiple places that have Chat rooms. I personally love the community over at StarbaseUGC.Com and the chat room available there. Fun, silly people pretty much always willing to answer any questions and help however they can.
(4) Write to various Foundry focused podcasts and ask them to discuss aspects of mission building you want more info on.
Basically, I agree that the tool is difficult and not the best. It is riddled with bugs that make testing before publishing near impossible. But for all it's flaws , it is not impossible to create missions.
Believe me, if a technologically impaired old hippie like me can figure the thing out, anyone can.
Heck, I had trouble finding the "any key" one time.
Here's hoping that you find the support and assistance you need to create awesome Foundry missions.
As someone who still spends time modding Space Empires 5 and who used to mod Diablo 2, That is VERY true!
My character Tsin'xing
http://starbaseugc.com/index.php/noob-guides/tutorials-guide/
Look for New! under video tutorials.
This guy is a foundry Guru. His tutorials helped me get up to speed.
Parallels: my second mission for Fed aligned Romulans.
But, I still say the UI is inferior as apposed to a lot of "configurable" gaming systems I've seen, for instance, the 2D map could have a 3D option along side the "Play Map" button, so that when objects are dropped on the map, click the "Edit in 3D" button, and the map would show just like if hitting the "Play Map" button, but does not show any NPC's, just scenery and placed objects, then, when an object is clicked/selected, then holding alt, would show a rotation axis around the object, then still holding alt, then using the mouse button to drag to rotate the object, or, holding ctrl+alt would show a movement axis, then again by still holding ctrl+alt and click dragging on either the x,y,z axis would move the object within the 3D world, then when satisfied all objects have been placed, then click on "exit 3D edit", which would return to the 2D map to continue the storyline.
using the current UI, it would take 3 weeks, just to create an arena with a force field surrounding the activation console, IE.
1......Drag pattern enhancers to map
2......Lay them out approximately in a circle, the diameter big enough to have the console, a contact NPC, and BOFF's inside.
3......Drop an invisible "force field" between the pattern enhancers, (this is the tricky bit).
To place the invisible "force fields" exactly between each of the pattern enhancers (using current UI) is nothing but trial and error:-
1.....Drop force field.
2.....Move it
3.....Hit Play Map
4.....Don't look right, repeat steps 2 & 3 until positioned close enough.
5.....Rotate 1 grid mark left or right.
6.....Hit Play Map
7.....Don't fit right?, repeat steps 5 & 6 until force field is central between pattern enhancers
8.....Repeat all steps for the remaining force fields.
Those steps, can take up to 3 weeks or more to get right, that's the reason for my original post. I guess I won't be using the UI until a better one comes along.
It's a pity that the UI can't import missions created by other people, otherwise, I could ask a "professional" creator to create one to my storyline and I could import it into my account.
My character Tsin'xing
You should not need more than 30 mins for that circular pattern enhancer-forcefield build.
Answered a lot of questions I had. Thanks again.
Parallels: my second mission for Fed aligned Romulans.
Missions are not impossible to create, as frankly the staggering amount in the Foundry shows, and great missions are not out of reach either, just look at Spotlight.
I myself am fairly new to Foundry but am plugging away at a couple of missions. You can no way in hell crank one out over night unless you are doing a quick shooter, but to say impossible, is wrong, and most of your comments are incorrect.
Ok yes the online tutorials are out of date but they are STILL very helpful, and valuable. I have learned a lot from them. The UI statements tho are sadly very true.
The UI is tragic. The piece of paper map placement (Which doesn't even show anything really resembling outlines of anything on the maps) is wrong, it should be 3d WYSIWYG which would make placement far easier and accurate. as it stands, it is still very primitive, lets hope the planned upgrade sorts this out.
***Disenchanted***
Real Join Date: Monday, 17 May 2010
Sounds like you might also have the snap to grid on as well. If you zoom in, as suggested, and make sure the snap to grid is not on, you can adjust things pretty quick. There is no reason it should take such an insane amount of time to do that task.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
by Duke-of-Rock Available on Holodeck
You have SE5? :eek:
Calculating the XYZ coordinates works too.
It could take less, it could take more - depending on how precise you are.
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
My character Tsin'xing
What about it?
Me, I wish it didn't lose just about every good thing in its combat system when trying to play multiplayer. And that it was actually possible to RANDOMLY find somebody to play. :mad:
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
My character Tsin'xing
PBW?
Also, 7zip.
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
My character Tsin'xing
Meh, even so, the best part about SE5's combat system was the ability to maneuver your ships. Something you don't get in multiplayer.
In that respect, it's like Imperium Galactica 2 or Star Wars Empire at War.
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
My character Tsin'xing
That's why I don't make fleets of 20+ - I just carefully command my 1 single dreadnought and, sooner or later, destroy the entire opposing fleet.
Edit: I do believe SE4 didn't have player-controlled combat in multiplayer either, and at least there you could command entire armadas properly.
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
Hehe, you should see the cheap tricks I used on the AIs in SE2.
In SE5, I just out research the AI.... that makes things stupidly easy....
My character Tsin'xing
Yeah, outresearching them always works. Though I will admit, making my own warp points also helps... I improvised a Stargate hyperdrive using the warp point opener, warp point closer, and the repair bay. Takes a lot of space, but you don't need it on ALL ships.
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.