The tactics that you're talking about prove to be quite effective indeed. The fact that you said 'possible counter to' tells me that you are well aware of other ways to prevent this tactic, why not try some of those?
First off, thanks for corroborating what I've been hearing.
Second, now that those fleets know that we know, they'd have to be pretty stupid to try using that tactic against us, Nadeon Detonator or no, wouldn't they?
Lastly, now that you've confirmed a potential ulterior motive for banning Nadeon Detonator you had better provide an answer to my original query: What exactly is the motivation behind the ban?
Forgive me if I am wrong but didn't Sad Pandas have a member of the Fleet in the conversation when these rules were decided? I find it hard to believe Mech Warriors is so engaging that it isn't possible to log off for a few moments to discuss the rules of the tournament? :rolleyes:
I was at work, but I understand Biebs was there and left with a similar impression -- that some of the fleets couldn't give a hoot about balance and would rather push or oppose rules based on how they benefit themselves.
First off, thanks for corroborating what I've been hearing.
I corroborated nothing. Merely confirmed (and was extremely flattered) that the tactic you speak of must work well against you for it to be the first one to pop into your head in correlation with that console?
I was at work, but I understand Biebs was there and left with a similar impression -- that some of the fleets couldn't give a hoot about balance and would rather push or oppose rules based on how they benefit themselves.
I'm not sure why he would have left with any kind of negative impression? He should have left satisfied with the rules as that was one of the reasons he was there in the first place, was it not?
Let's keep the discussion about the rules. The results of the tournament will speak for itself.
Merely an observation. Turkish RP Heroes isn't in the tournament to win. We're in to have fun and give our new members in the Fleet some tough matches to fight in! Hopefully Pandas can provide a tough fight and regardless of the outcome, our members will have won. They will have won the experience we aimed to give them!
Did it (the PSW torp console) get broken in some way that I'm unaware of?
I think someone mentioned that there is a problem with its cooldown when combined with photonic officer and photonic doffs. You can push the cooldown down to 20s(?) or some other really low number.
Is the 8=5+3 the max? Or can we remove old players and add new ones during the run of the tournament? In essence: Is 5+3 the limit for each round or for the entire tournament?
Another thing:
Can we make Cracked Planet the default map? So that people won't try to lag others out by starting a Solar Wind?
I think someone mentioned that there is a problem with its cooldown when combined with photonic officer and photonic doffs. You can push the cooldown down to 20s(?) or some other really low number.
The doffs are incredibly problematic, and one thing that you're going to see used in this tournament is PSW combined with both the cooldown reduction and aftershock doffs. It's too incredibly powerful not to use it. Even two people properly set up can more or less nullify all of the extends on the other team, and the stun is great at both breaking cadence and guaranteeing a kill versus a repulsed (;)) target.
Detonators aggravate the problem, but are not the cause of it. The doffs are the cause, obviously, and the only rule that makes sense is to limit the doffs.
A certain group thinks they can have their cake and eat it too -- mass repulsors make a team relatively safe against PSW with a 5 km repulse being a rather good counter against a 3km AOE stun. Banning Detonators just means that you can't stun them, but they can stun you. This tactic is pure cheese, and while it won't work against Pandas it will make every other team (with the possible exception of TSI, now that they have read this) that comes across it have a very bad day.
It's also interesting that SS is banned. I doubt anyone can claim with a straight face that SS is still OP, but three or more copies of it is the best hard counter to the strategy I outlined above.
Like I said earlier, these rules should be about balance, not about artificially buffing uncreative playstyles that would otherwise be vulnerable or flawed. What we have right now isn't going to teach these new fleets we have joining up how to PvP, and it isn't going to give them an experience they'll want to return for.
You seem to have a very misguided impression of the extent of our fleet's influence, particularly on this event's ruleset. From what I understand, no one had a privileged status, and all attending at the meeting had to come to a consensus before some item or another was agreed upon. It's very unlikely that an item slipped in because a single fleet wanted it there (this goes for "Nadeon Detonator", a console or a power which frankly few of us had heard of before tonight).
Ultimately the rules are out of our hands, and if some change is made or deemed necessary we'll gladly adapt and move on. But none of the rules or proposals we make are there to protect us, I can assure you.
The Devs have already said that cd reduction DOFFs affecting consoles that benefit from the same skill(s) (ie: ICC and Conn Officers) is working as intended. Following that logic, it doesn't sound like the interaction, between Photonic DOFFs and Nadeon, is a bug. I'm sure we can get word on this, from a Dev, before the tournament begins.
btw, What council is deciding on the Additional Rules posted in Red? Just curious.
The doffs are incredibly problematic, and one thing that you're going to see used in this tournament is PSW combined with both the cooldown reduction and aftershock doffs. It's too incredibly powerful not to use it. Even two people properly set up can more or less nullify all of the extends on the other team, and the stun is great at both breaking cadence and guaranteeing a kill versus a repulsed (;)) target.
Detonators aggravate the problem, but are not the cause of it. The doffs are the cause, obviously, and the only rule that makes sense is to limit the doffs.
A certain group thinks they can have their cake and eat it too -- mass repulsors make a team relatively safe against PSW with a 5 km repulse being a rather good counter against a 3km AOE stun. Banning Detonators just means that you can't stun them, but they can stun you. This tactic is pure cheese, and while it won't work against Pandas it will make every other team (with the possible exception of TSI, now that they have read this) that comes across it have a very bad day.
It's also interesting that SS is banned. I doubt anyone can claim with a straight face that SS is still OP, but three or more copies of it is the best hard counter to the strategy I outlined above.
Like I said earlier, these rules should be about balance, not about artificially buffing uncreative playstyles that would otherwise be vulnerable or flawed. What we have right now isn't going to teach these new fleets we have joining up how to PvP, and it isn't going to give them an experience they'll want to return for.
You sincerely think we made the rules in suggesting it in so many words.
Well we didn't.
You're paranoid and delusional at this point to think we have that kind of leverage in doing such a thing. We also have put together 2 rosters, in fact aided another fleet in the putting together of a 3rd roster with TRH members.
We spread all of our best across these teams in effort to let everyone have an experienced run rather than a stacked run. Now your overwhelming confidence and arrogance on this forum about yourself your Panda aura is old news. We discussed this negative attitude in good detail with one of your fleet members, and for this none sense to be set aside and avoided all together.
We have proven ourselves against your fleet on many separate occasions, 3 of which that are on youtube.
Previous Tournament: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nnt6aUPRUPM
Where the timer ran out, which your team was aware of and then once your team had a lead you claimed victory. Cheap, but no cigar.
A pug made with TRH http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zew7j_IuAiE
A Panda coming into our TS after the match is in the video, and providing excuses through the roof was gravy.
Our fleet does`t need to convince you that we had nothing to do with the rules being made aside from the meeting your team member also attended. We also do not need to convince your fleet we`re a formidable team and emboldened by those which you banned wrongfully. We also do not need to convince you that we need special rules to beat you. So take your negative assumptions about us elsewhere.
However, we will convince our own fleet members that they are more important than our quarrel with your rotten attitude. We will employ a sportive attitude in the development of their game play rather than stack a team with the more experienced and be obsessed with winning a tournament. In this case you will no doubt will be doing, leaving all your less experienced under development phase.
You take care now, I`ve said all that`s needed to be said on the subject matter. And good luck on your tournament run.
I think you are one of the best guys in the game, on the piloting and build tip, as well as the team composition tip, on top of your great attitude..... Just make you a great player to be around, and a great person to banter with.
Jorf,
You are possibly the smartest guy I've ever played the game with. Your analyzation of the current environment and how to tackle it are possibly unparalleled in STO. You also make flying a Sci/Sci look flawlessly easy.
Those things aside, we have spoken at length on my opinion, both of you, about the game, and restrictions for tournament rules.
The addition of the nadion detination console did raise my eyebrows greatly, on top of the exclusion of just 1 boff power being scrambles.
I just do not see how this should not have already caught the attention of the better thinkers in this game. I would not participate in this tournament even if I could. Which I wish I could, but real life is kicking me in the balls right now.... And I would not participate because of the rule set and the knowledge I have of what fleets are running right now. This knowledge I have acquired through teaming with, and teaming against, as well as pug matches with the fleets involved.
And you guys know me, I don't stir the pot, cause drama, troll people, ect ect.... But I think that all parties involved in this tourney should reevaluate all things.
Once again, you know I have respect for both of you, but I think that Jorf has a point, and Pax does as well. Hopefully there is no underhanded business goin on, but because I am aware, and for a living monitor trends and make adjustments, I can't help but throw up a red flag at these rules.
I know one thing was good when this tournament started - Various fleets coming together to create the rules.
I have 1 question:
Were the new additions to the rules made in the same manner as you made the original rules? (As a collection of fleets and not unilaterally?)
Paxi, Paxi,
I have been civil for a while and stayed "in the shadows" so to speak in these forums, but this remark just infuriated me when I saw it and I had to respond:
"Where the timer ran out, which your team was aware of and then once your team had a lead you claimed victory. Cheap, but no cigar."
Within 2 minutes of the match being over, we clearly said you had won. So it seems like your lieing seems to be continuing. I distinctly remember saying on that occasion that the better team on the day won.
Pascal,
I know I never saw eye to eye with you in the past, but I have had respect growing for you over the last few months for the way you openly came out and asked for a "Fresh start" with the PVP community and especially for organising this tournament.
I know it must be really difficult for you to manage the tournament, however all I ask is that you put the "red" rules to the same vote as you did with the originals as these additions seem to feel as if they were decided on unilateraly.
If you want to discuss the above statement, you know you always get my ear when you ask.
I assume you guys are all aware that the rules have agreed upon collectivly. So no foul play there.
May I iterate a sentence that I posted before: "Since this endeavour is supported by Cryptic, I tried (as the representative of TRH during that meeting) to work towards having as few rules as possible, in order to ensure widest possible participation in this tournament. "
Only exception: Stuff that is broken or exploitative in nature.
Now, some stuff has been prohibited from the tourney that is IMO not broken. Oh well. Wasnt too happy about it but nothings perfect...
Regarding the time ship stuff: see my previous in this thread.
Regarding this nadeon console: Until I read about it here I really didnt know anything about it. But how about that:
I think someone mentioned that there is a problem with its cooldown when combined with photonic officer and photonic doffs. You can push the cooldown down to 20s(?) or some other really low number.
So a P2W console with a 3 minutes cooldown is getting reduced to less than 20 seconds? Wow call me crazy but I dont think thats working as intended... BTW same reasoning why D'Kora EMP is also prohibited.
I can understand why that console has been banned.
btw, What council is deciding on the Additional Rules posted in Red?
I am not aware that any kind of voting has been conducted for the additional rules. I'd say we should cut the organizers some slack though. They want this enterprise to succed. But maybe we can come all together and vote as a community on those new rules?
.The Spanish Inquisition. TSI -- Star Trek Online PvP Vidoes (Youtube) /channel_join OrganizedPVP If you are interested in learning PVP, looking for a team, or a private match.
You sincerely think we made the rules in suggesting it in so many words.
I haven't mentioned TRPH once, so the only way you're coming to that conclusion is if there is truth to what I'm saying.
From what I can tell, you aren't the only fleet gearing up for this style of play, and whether it comes from intentionally gaming the rules or figuring out a gaping flaw in them after the fact, it's not a good thing and needs to change.
- if you loose some members due to any problems ( real life, kicked from the team ),
you may delete those and add new players who do not belong to another team. Always make sure though to not have more then 8 players total. That will be possible through out the tournament.
Nova Aurora Polaris
- Nova Aurora Polaris - @pascalb1
transphasics Custer torpedos run on 80% penetration from the mines unleashed lets say 12 mines fully crit, under a fully buffed tactical it can be one shot enemies with every buff launched, just like a tric mine!
Having this in tournament will make the tournament suffer!
a) because all teams will just insta pop each other.
transphasics Custer torpedos run on 80% penetration from the mines unleashed lets say 12 mines fully crit, under a fully buffed tactical it can be one shot enemies with every buff launched, just like a tric mine!
Having this in tournament will make the tournament suffer!
a) because all teams will just insta pop each other.
b) its just lame play!
Unless I am mistaken, the tool tip for the cluster torpedoes are 40% shield penetration unlike the generic transphasic mine itself. I could be wrong though, unless the tool tip is incorrect...
All mines are effected by the whole if one crits, they all crit...
At this point I really do not know what to say or where to draw the line. TRIBBLE guys brought up the same point the other day, and I kind of agree on the mere fact about the if 1 critz they all crit. However, I won`t go as far as comparing them to tric mines.
Tool tip on sub nucleonic beam also says: Removes all buffs from target. This isn`t working on extends. But in some versions of the game, it has and in others it hasn`t. Oddly enough we can be here all year dissecting the game for it`s bugs. lol.
1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurleybird View Post
So, can someone tell me my the hell is a relatively harmless console like the Nadeon Detonator is now banned?
I can only think of three reasons:
Did you guys smoke some dope?
Did it get broken in some way that I'm unaware of?
Or does it just mess with a strategy that some of the organizers are going to use? Like countering TBR separation tactics?
I would very much like to hear the reasoning behind this addition to the rules. Hell, it would be good if some kind of justification or explanation was given to all of the rules so we can understand the rational behind them. Most of the rules seem good, but a few are rather questionable.
I would very much like to hear the reasoning behind your blatant rudeness.
If you don't like the rules, don't play. Simple as that.
Just cause you need Nadeon Detonators to win all of your Mech Warriors matches, doesn't mean they should be needed in Star Trek Online.
I once heard that if you cry more, you get rules changed. Maybe try that?
Thanks! ( rjam0 )
2.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjam0 View Post
I would very much like to hear the reasoning behind your blatant rudeness.
It's quite simple:
You see, I'm used to reading silly rules in PvP tournaments. Most people have next to no understanding of game balance, and though this crowd isn't a complete exception it is easily knowledgeable enough to avoid silly rules like "only two tacs" or *cough* "no Nadeon Detonator"
Even then I would have give the benefit of the doubt to simple ignorance, but people love to talk and it appears that a couple of prominent fleets are banking heavily on tactics that Nadeon Detonator is a possible counter to.
That's not going to fool anyone with a modicum of understanding for how PvP works. It also forces me to place other rules that look a bit odd under scrutiny.
Frankly, it's pathetic. We all know what's obviously broken, we all know what obviously isn't, and we all know what's in the gray area. We should be above these kinds of shenanigans. The fact that we aren't is deserving of a measure of contempt, and that's the reasoning behind my "blatant rudeness"
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjam0 View Post
If you don't like the rules, don't play. Simple as that.
Wouldn't you like that?
P.S. Apologies in advance for posting my spiel in the wrong thread. The feedback thread was buried at the time. I suggest we move our conversation there. Mods feel free to move this discussions to the appropriate thread, and perhaps consider a sticky for it.
( hurleybird )
3. even though i cannot participate, i would like to chime in here,
the train of thought along current optimal team builds and current mechanics and dynamics of the game, combined with the rule set layed out, along with the recent addition of the nadion detinator console being added to the no go list...
well, did raise my eye brows.
for such a list to be constructed tends to lean the margin of favor towards the team that understands those principals of the game itself.
my fear is that the nature of this tournament will not encourage new 5 man pvp teams to participate in our community, based on the fact that some teams may have found an optimal play style or combination of playstyles within their fleet's pilots to maximize on such a ruleset.
this in itself will only contribute to further divide the pvp community.
as players who DO understand the game will catch on to such trends, and therefore either are no longer willing to participate because of such restrictions, and the team that has no clue....well, they are doomed from the start....either way...its not a pretty picture.
have fun kill bad guys
-thrusters on full-
afterthought / forethought: the team that sets the rules has the advantage. therefore, the persons making or contributing to the guidelines in such a tournament should not participate. ( thishorizon )
4. I remember when I was known as the saddest panda ( thishorizon )
5.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thishorizon View Post
I remember when I was known as the saddest panda
Love you too - Sriously though the door to being the saddest again is always WIDE open for ya buddy ( naz4 )
Nova Aurora Polaris
- Nova Aurora Polaris - @pascalb1
Instead of arguing here guys, let's jump onto a server chat and just agree the final rules. Let's not kill the tourney before it starts with this bickering. Not good impression for the bootcamp students as well.
Instead of arguing here guys, let's jump onto a server chat and just agree the final rules. Let's not kill the tourney before it starts with this bickering. Not good impression for the bootcamp students as well.
We can convene at TRH TS ? Or perhaps Pascals? I wasn't part of that rule making committee, so I suppose the same guys reconvene?
Comments
have fun kill bad guys
-thrusters on full-
First off, thanks for corroborating what I've been hearing.
Second, now that those fleets know that we know, they'd have to be pretty stupid to try using that tactic against us, Nadeon Detonator or no, wouldn't they?
Lastly, now that you've confirmed a potential ulterior motive for banning Nadeon Detonator you had better provide an answer to my original query: What exactly is the motivation behind the ban?
I was at work, but I understand Biebs was there and left with a similar impression -- that some of the fleets couldn't give a hoot about balance and would rather push or oppose rules based on how they benefit themselves.
Let's keep the discussion about the rules. The results of the tournament will speak for itself.
I corroborated nothing.
I'm not sure, I wasn't involved in the rule making. Perhaps talk to pascal about the ban instead of q_qing over it publically?
I'm not sure why he would have left with any kind of negative impression? He should have left satisfied with the rules as that was one of the reasons he was there in the first place, was it not?
Merely an observation. Turkish RP Heroes isn't in the tournament to win. We're in to have fun and give our new members in the Fleet some tough matches to fight in! Hopefully Pandas can provide a tough fight and regardless of the outcome, our members will have won. They will have won the experience we aimed to give them!
Is the 8=5+3 the max? Or can we remove old players and add new ones during the run of the tournament? In essence: Is 5+3 the limit for each round or for the entire tournament?
Another thing:
Can we make Cracked Planet the default map? So that people won't try to lag others out by starting a Solar Wind?
TRH needs you and Thales. Please come to our TS for details regarding this or send mail to @Jam0, @ilhansk.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
and are several teams form one fleet (each team with his own 5+3 players) allowed?
Yes
The doffs are incredibly problematic, and one thing that you're going to see used in this tournament is PSW combined with both the cooldown reduction and aftershock doffs. It's too incredibly powerful not to use it. Even two people properly set up can more or less nullify all of the extends on the other team, and the stun is great at both breaking cadence and guaranteeing a kill versus a repulsed (;)) target.
Detonators aggravate the problem, but are not the cause of it. The doffs are the cause, obviously, and the only rule that makes sense is to limit the doffs.
A certain group thinks they can have their cake and eat it too -- mass repulsors make a team relatively safe against PSW with a 5 km repulse being a rather good counter against a 3km AOE stun. Banning Detonators just means that you can't stun them, but they can stun you. This tactic is pure cheese, and while it won't work against Pandas it will make every other team (with the possible exception of TSI, now that they have read this) that comes across it have a very bad day.
It's also interesting that SS is banned. I doubt anyone can claim with a straight face that SS is still OP, but three or more copies of it is the best hard counter to the strategy I outlined above.
Like I said earlier, these rules should be about balance, not about artificially buffing uncreative playstyles that would otherwise be vulnerable or flawed. What we have right now isn't going to teach these new fleets we have joining up how to PvP, and it isn't going to give them an experience they'll want to return for.
Ultimately the rules are out of our hands, and if some change is made or deemed necessary we'll gladly adapt and move on. But none of the rules or proposals we make are there to protect us, I can assure you.
vids and guides and stuff
[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples
The Devs have already said that cd reduction DOFFs affecting consoles that benefit from the same skill(s) (ie: ICC and Conn Officers) is working as intended. Following that logic, it doesn't sound like the interaction, between Photonic DOFFs and Nadeon, is a bug. I'm sure we can get word on this, from a Dev, before the tournament begins.
btw, What council is deciding on the Additional Rules posted in Red? Just curious.
You sincerely think we made the rules in suggesting it in so many words.
Well we didn't.
You're paranoid and delusional at this point to think we have that kind of leverage in doing such a thing. We also have put together 2 rosters, in fact aided another fleet in the putting together of a 3rd roster with TRH members.
We spread all of our best across these teams in effort to let everyone have an experienced run rather than a stacked run. Now your overwhelming confidence and arrogance on this forum about yourself your Panda aura is old news. We discussed this negative attitude in good detail with one of your fleet members, and for this none sense to be set aside and avoided all together.
We have proven ourselves against your fleet on many separate occasions, 3 of which that are on youtube.
Previous Tournament:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nnt6aUPRUPM
Where the timer ran out, which your team was aware of and then once your team had a lead you claimed victory. Cheap, but no cigar.
A pug made with TRH
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zew7j_IuAiE
A Panda coming into our TS after the match is in the video, and providing excuses through the roof was gravy.
And my personal favorite, 15-0 with 1 pug on each team.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiGAplZUyNM
Our fleet does`t need to convince you that we had nothing to do with the rules being made aside from the meeting your team member also attended. We also do not need to convince your fleet we`re a formidable team and emboldened by those which you banned wrongfully. We also do not need to convince you that we need special rules to beat you. So take your negative assumptions about us elsewhere.
However, we will convince our own fleet members that they are more important than our quarrel with your rotten attitude. We will employ a sportive attitude in the development of their game play rather than stack a team with the more experienced and be obsessed with winning a tournament. In this case you will no doubt will be doing, leaving all your less experienced under development phase.
You take care now, I`ve said all that`s needed to be said on the subject matter. And good luck on your tournament run.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I think you are one of the best guys in the game, on the piloting and build tip, as well as the team composition tip, on top of your great attitude..... Just make you a great player to be around, and a great person to banter with.
Jorf,
You are possibly the smartest guy I've ever played the game with. Your analyzation of the current environment and how to tackle it are possibly unparalleled in STO. You also make flying a Sci/Sci look flawlessly easy.
Those things aside, we have spoken at length on my opinion, both of you, about the game, and restrictions for tournament rules.
The addition of the nadion detination console did raise my eyebrows greatly, on top of the exclusion of just 1 boff power being scrambles.
I just do not see how this should not have already caught the attention of the better thinkers in this game. I would not participate in this tournament even if I could. Which I wish I could, but real life is kicking me in the balls right now.... And I would not participate because of the rule set and the knowledge I have of what fleets are running right now. This knowledge I have acquired through teaming with, and teaming against, as well as pug matches with the fleets involved.
And you guys know me, I don't stir the pot, cause drama, troll people, ect ect.... But I think that all parties involved in this tourney should reevaluate all things.
Once again, you know I have respect for both of you, but I think that Jorf has a point, and Pax does as well. Hopefully there is no underhanded business goin on, but because I am aware, and for a living monitor trends and make adjustments, I can't help but throw up a red flag at these rules.
Have fun kill bad guys
-thrusters on full-
A Panda coming into our TS after the match is in the video, and providing excuses through the roof was gravy.
Recording peoples voices is against peoples privacy and is highly illegal! I shall be pursing this with the authorities! it is against the law!
I have 1 question:
Were the new additions to the rules made in the same manner as you made the original rules? (As a collection of fleets and not unilaterally?)
Paxi, Paxi,
I have been civil for a while and stayed "in the shadows" so to speak in these forums, but this remark just infuriated me when I saw it and I had to respond:
"Where the timer ran out, which your team was aware of and then once your team had a lead you claimed victory. Cheap, but no cigar."
Within 2 minutes of the match being over, we clearly said you had won. So it seems like your lieing seems to be continuing. I distinctly remember saying on that occasion that the better team on the day won.
Pascal,
I know I never saw eye to eye with you in the past, but I have had respect growing for you over the last few months for the way you openly came out and asked for a "Fresh start" with the PVP community and especially for organising this tournament.
I know it must be really difficult for you to manage the tournament, however all I ask is that you put the "red" rules to the same vote as you did with the originals as these additions seem to feel as if they were decided on unilateraly.
If you want to discuss the above statement, you know you always get my ear when you ask.
I assume you guys are all aware that the rules have agreed upon collectivly. So no foul play there.
May I iterate a sentence that I posted before:
"Since this endeavour is supported by Cryptic, I tried (as the representative of TRH during that meeting) to work towards having as few rules as possible, in order to ensure widest possible participation in this tournament. "
Only exception: Stuff that is broken or exploitative in nature.
Now, some stuff has been prohibited from the tourney that is IMO not broken. Oh well. Wasnt too happy about it but nothings perfect...
Regarding the time ship stuff: see my previous in this thread.
Regarding this nadeon console: Until I read about it here I really didnt know anything about it. But how about that: So a P2W console with a 3 minutes cooldown is getting reduced to less than 20 seconds? Wow call me crazy but I dont think thats working as intended... BTW same reasoning why D'Kora EMP is also prohibited.
I can understand why that console has been banned.
I am not aware that any kind of voting has been conducted for the additional rules. I'd say we should cut the organizers some slack though. They want this enterprise to succed. But maybe we can come all together and vote as a community on those new rules?
TSI -- Star Trek Online PvP Vidoes (Youtube)
/channel_join OrganizedPVP If you are interested in learning PVP, looking for a team, or a private match.
I haven't mentioned TRPH once, so the only way you're coming to that conclusion is if there is truth to what I'm saying.
From what I can tell, you aren't the only fleet gearing up for this style of play, and whether it comes from intentionally gaming the rules or figuring out a gaping flaw in them after the fact, it's not a good thing and needs to change.
the person wasn't aware of it!
Explaination:
- you may have 8 members max
- if you loose some members due to any problems ( real life, kicked from the team ),
you may delete those and add new players who do not belong to another team. Always make sure though to not have more then 8 players total. That will be possible through out the tournament.
- Nova Aurora Polaris -
@pascalb1
Having this in tournament will make the tournament suffer!
a) because all teams will just insta pop each other.
b) its just lame play!
Unless I am mistaken, the tool tip for the cluster torpedoes are 40% shield penetration unlike the generic transphasic mine itself. I could be wrong though, unless the tool tip is incorrect...
All mines are effected by the whole if one crits, they all crit...
At this point I really do not know what to say or where to draw the line. TRIBBLE guys brought up the same point the other day, and I kind of agree on the mere fact about the if 1 critz they all crit. However, I won`t go as far as comparing them to tric mines.
Tool tip on sub nucleonic beam also says: Removes all buffs from target. This isn`t working on extends. But in some versions of the game, it has and in others it hasn`t. Oddly enough we can be here all year dissecting the game for it`s bugs. lol.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurleybird View Post
So, can someone tell me my the hell is a relatively harmless console like the Nadeon Detonator is now banned?
I can only think of three reasons:
Did you guys smoke some dope?
Did it get broken in some way that I'm unaware of?
Or does it just mess with a strategy that some of the organizers are going to use? Like countering TBR separation tactics?
I would very much like to hear the reasoning behind this addition to the rules. Hell, it would be good if some kind of justification or explanation was given to all of the rules so we can understand the rational behind them. Most of the rules seem good, but a few are rather questionable.
I would very much like to hear the reasoning behind your blatant rudeness.
If you don't like the rules, don't play. Simple as that.
Just cause you need Nadeon Detonators to win all of your Mech Warriors matches, doesn't mean they should be needed in Star Trek Online.
I once heard that if you cry more, you get rules changed. Maybe try that?
Thanks! ( rjam0 )
2.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjam0 View Post
I would very much like to hear the reasoning behind your blatant rudeness.
It's quite simple:
You see, I'm used to reading silly rules in PvP tournaments. Most people have next to no understanding of game balance, and though this crowd isn't a complete exception it is easily knowledgeable enough to avoid silly rules like "only two tacs" or *cough* "no Nadeon Detonator"
Even then I would have give the benefit of the doubt to simple ignorance, but people love to talk and it appears that a couple of prominent fleets are banking heavily on tactics that Nadeon Detonator is a possible counter to.
That's not going to fool anyone with a modicum of understanding for how PvP works. It also forces me to place other rules that look a bit odd under scrutiny.
Frankly, it's pathetic. We all know what's obviously broken, we all know what obviously isn't, and we all know what's in the gray area. We should be above these kinds of shenanigans. The fact that we aren't is deserving of a measure of contempt, and that's the reasoning behind my "blatant rudeness"
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjam0 View Post
If you don't like the rules, don't play. Simple as that.
Wouldn't you like that?
P.S. Apologies in advance for posting my spiel in the wrong thread. The feedback thread was buried at the time. I suggest we move our conversation there. Mods feel free to move this discussions to the appropriate thread, and perhaps consider a sticky for it.
( hurleybird )
3. even though i cannot participate, i would like to chime in here,
the train of thought along current optimal team builds and current mechanics and dynamics of the game, combined with the rule set layed out, along with the recent addition of the nadion detinator console being added to the no go list...
well, did raise my eye brows.
for such a list to be constructed tends to lean the margin of favor towards the team that understands those principals of the game itself.
my fear is that the nature of this tournament will not encourage new 5 man pvp teams to participate in our community, based on the fact that some teams may have found an optimal play style or combination of playstyles within their fleet's pilots to maximize on such a ruleset.
this in itself will only contribute to further divide the pvp community.
as players who DO understand the game will catch on to such trends, and therefore either are no longer willing to participate because of such restrictions, and the team that has no clue....well, they are doomed from the start....either way...its not a pretty picture.
have fun kill bad guys
-thrusters on full-
afterthought / forethought: the team that sets the rules has the advantage. therefore, the persons making or contributing to the guidelines in such a tournament should not participate. ( thishorizon )
4. I remember when I was known as the saddest panda ( thishorizon )
5.
Quote:
Originally Posted by thishorizon View Post
I remember when I was known as the saddest panda
Love you too - Sriously though the door to being the saddest again is always WIDE open for ya buddy ( naz4 )
- Nova Aurora Polaris -
@pascalb1
also... im still not quite understanding why nadeon got banned.
i remember the tsi funday also had banned scramble sensors, and we learned that it makes science team nearly useless.
which ended with more tactical teams and more engy teams going around
which made matches last longer.
cause and effect and all that stuff.
Do you even Science Bro?
We can convene at TRH TS ? Or perhaps Pascals? I wasn't part of that rule making committee, so I suppose the same guys reconvene?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Well repulsors are fixed so why remove them they also are very simple to counter I laugh at repolsors!
If scrambles is fixed I say bring in Ralph and his 40 sec scramble spam!