Yes, yes, of course! We'll let some weak Romulan colony go so that we can 'prepare ourselves' to fight a rather laughable excuse for Iconians (Iconians that differ quite a bit from how the novelizations depict them. . .which are the only thing that have information about Iconians beyond surface depictions). Oh, the Iconians are returning to subvert and conquer us all! As if we didn't have enough plotlines going on with the effing Borg, Undine, Federation-Klingon war, etc.
I'm not buying this Iconian-war bull****, and I never have tbh. It's always been a unnecessary sideshow in my mind, to make the Romulan story arc a little more 'interesting'.
It's the other war around - the Romulans, FvK war, Undine, etc are all part of the Iconian storyline.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
My whole point was that instead of pushing out copy/paste content to have us wait a few weeks after the feds get theirs for us to get the same mission from a different point of view.
The Klingons and Federation are two completely different organisations but from how Cryptic have portrayed them they both think and act exactly the same, thus making the whole war situation a bit... pants.
I understand that they have time constraints and even financial constraints and that is why we get these copy/paste situations but honestly it would be far more rewarding for the community and Cryptic if they just delayed KDF content for the month/season after its Federation release so that it can get a true KDF feel to it.
It would also bolster the numbers of KDF players as Feds would be curious to what the missions were like and thus boost sales for KDF content in the store.
My biggest issue with STO has always been the way the whole setting does not make sense because both factions are identical in what content they share other than simple aesthetics.
You touch on a lot of good points here. Would fans/players be willing to wait for faction-specific mission? I think yes, some have waited for nearly 3 year now for anything-KDF -specific. I haven't been playing STO exclusively for those three years, but even when not playing, I'm still waiting...
Somehow, all those Cthulhu-looking things on New Romulus... I don't feel like my Gorn should be 'tagging' them (giggiddy) but rather mowing them down in a frenzy of disruptor fire, and setting the big one at the back of the river on fire.
I find it hard to play any of my KDF toons on New Romulus. The mission break my immersion in my character. I'm a f&%$ing Lieutenant General. The Fehk'iri tremble at the sound of my name. I have slaughtered countless Borg. I have chartered fluidic space. I have faced the Undine, and lived to tell the tale. Women want me, men want to be me, and immigrants want to take night classes and learn Klingon so they can talk about soccer with me.
But, yeah, sure, you need someone to go water the plants, I'm your man little Romulan friend. Nope, nothing else on the schedule for today, guess I must have done killed it all.
I also think releasing KDF-version content a few weeks/month later, it would give Feds something to do now and then something to do later as well. It would definitely be a tease to some long-standing Fed-exclusive players, to simply try the other faction out.
Also, it wouldn't feel the same as a Fed playing the mission on his Fed alt (even when it's his KDF alt). Idk, a player might get 'immersed' more into the KDF, and actually play it more (or, at least take it more seriously).
I always thought Facility 2049-or w/e would be terrific to play as a 'remastered' KDF mission, where you had to break someone out of Rurha Penthe.
why, how about arena's that have players backing up AI faction fleets against the other faction.. you can shoot other players, you can shoot AI ships...
Run continuously...
Player rewards could be a player selection choice of
if your not so good at pvP.. then go after the AI ships.. if your good at pvP go after other players..
But by all means make it a great big mugging mother of all battles...
and take a page from the STF's have a normal version, and an "elite" version..
suddenly BAM! we have a war between the feds and the KDF that means something to the players, and rewards them for taking part..
I've also always been a fan of the concept of PvP ground battles where the player wades into combat WITH thier away team... (gives players even more excuse to trick out thier away team ya know!)
As for season 8.. I'll belive there will be KDF content when i see it... 3 years of unfulfilled promises.. Not that we haven't seen some KDF content.. but its certainly not very much compared to the fed content.
As for why we've been seeing so many more KDF players lately.. i can only guess that many fed players have so played out the fed content that they're now wanting to try the other side.
And yes, I've also noticed a lot more KDF players lately.. Qo'nos space is positivly crowded these days..
Maybe its because the KDF fleet starbases have things like fireplaces, bloodwine fountains, and orion Dancing girls doing the nerve tonic dance..
I know I can sit in the fleet bar for hours on end waiting for DOFF missions to complete watching the dancers.....(sigh!)
... could it be that simple?
KDF starbases have better decor, and a more fun bar life?.. Meh? could be!
It's the other war around - the Romulans, FvK war, Undine, etc are all part of the Iconian storyline.
Yes, isn't that awfully convenient. Hmph.
I guess I just don't like the Iconian concept. Maybe I just have difficulty believing that, after hundreds of thousands of years of hiding out wherever they've set up shop, they've decided to try re-conquering stuff. They'd have done it long ago, if they had possessed the capability or still existed.
I'd have been fine with another species-specific story arc, maybe one that's focused on Cardassians, both the True Way and the puppet government. Perhaps the KDF could side with the True Way and establish an alliance in order to remove the Federation's influence on Cardassian space. Since Cryptic seems content to treat the 'Federation-Klingon War' as a cold war, this would make perfect sense. Cut off the Federation's access to allies (Cardassians, Romulans, etc), and expand PvP so that there's more of a 'wartime' feel to things.
This would make far too much sense, though, so they'll just stick to throwing lockbox goodies at foolish money-loaded players and creating blatantly Federation-based content with a nearly-transparent 'Klingon' wrapper for the KDF version.
My PvP toon is Krov, of The House of Snoo. Beware of my Hegh'ta of doom.
The sad truth to all this is even though there is a demand for KDF specific content we will never really get it.
They have added a few ships and costumes to make money from the few members of the faction but otherwise they don't seem too interested. Each season there is mention of KDF content and each season we don't get it.
Also its well known that the devs don't really pay much attention to what their fanbase are saying. They may well act on a few topics that are brought up on the monthly question time but mostly it is responded with 'we are aiming to get this put in'.
I have huge respect for D Stahl and I think he somewhat rescued STO from Zinkeveich's (sp) reign, unfortunately Atari being the horrible people that they are threw the company into the hands of PWE which has been the worst thing for STO since its creation. Each update im continuously finding more of a reason to dislike the game due to its infatuation with scamming its playerbase.
I only hope they stick true to their words of KDF content appearing in season 8.
Having said all that we all know that the KDF content will only be a copy/paste so im unsure as to whether its worth adding it at all.
The new T5 fleet B'rel was a veryvnice gesture so the " we got what we got and ain't never gonna be more.." statements just don't cut it anymore.
The devs did not have to but did and I hope it means that possibly fleet Karfi and Gurambu fleet ships in the future. So its obviuos they know we are here.
I just wish they would stop meshing such content as the FEs and the new Rommie stuff to jist be fed in flavor and actually go the next step and faction the factions enough so the player experiences the fed and KDF flavors
They've shown its possible in the past.... once I think... with the Bajaron world spy stuff and even in how the Npc Klingons were keeping order ridged style.
So why not take the leap and do this in all endgame crossfaction play?
Otherwise its not a two faction game at all, just snazzy what ever...
Honestly, Its getting tiresome having to rehash this all the time.
The devs are not idiots. They know we exist. I just do not know why they do not more with us.
Yeah it seems like the undine and dishonorable remains of the house of duras and their allies where it seemed at the end of the tng/ds9 era that they were pretty much crushed this game puts them on a pedestal where they went from being extinct to basically running the empire. Not to mention the Undine pretty much controlling the alpha quadrant and KDF content where its going to boil down to if you want actual KDF content that isn't a Klingon on a Fed diet then you will have to use the foundry.
They really need to consolidate the factions as far as development because they keep stating they understand the "build it and they will come aspect" but they aren't building anything KDF and keep saying that they are loosing money on it... I guess the green paint costs are on the rise and too much to afford. TBH though there are so many story arcs and so many ship designs involving everything surrounding the KDF in their story that just hasn't been done you can almost say that there is more KDF than fed content just based off canon to put in this game. It pretty much looks like they were basing most of the game off TOS and then sprinkled a little TNG and DS9 here and there.
Plus on another note a lot of what made Star Trek what it was... WAS the KDF. Between the Khitomer Treaty to the end of DS9 there would be no federation if it wasn't for the assistance of the KDF. This new romulus thing would make sense except for the fact that the undine plot isn't resolved, the duras/jmpok arc isnt resolved, the fek'ihr arc isn't resolved, and the dominion okay they aren't officially engaged in any war in the alpha quadrant... The feds resolved their side with their dominion arc. Okay then why do we have defenses vs the dominion since they aren't officially attacking the Feds or KDF? It just seems they will pile any kind of dead gagh at us and expect us to like it but the whole point of story and anything resembling canon goes out the window with dilithium and zen TRIBBLE that we aren't even getting c-store ships popping out. Sure Sure they put a fleet b'rel out there but its freaking T5 shipyard and its not like decent fleets are getting people swamped with donations to even get their so it makes sense the way they did starbases and story with feds but with the KDF its just a fed diet given to us to stay fed healthy.
I have to say I too have noticed a few things that have been added that go completely against canon.
CBS are meant to have some sort of say in what does and doesn't get put in yet we get silly things like said dominion attacks happening.
I also personally hate how they keep adding non-faction ships to the game. Why the hell would a Starfleet officer fly a Tholian ship...
Maybe im poking holes and I know it stirrs the non-trekkies wild into buying lockboxes (genius idea!) but I still dislike it.
And yea lockboxes... Bloody brilliant idea. It often amuses me with the whiney posts about how someone bought ?50 worth of keys and they still didn't get the ship, etc. Id love to see how much money they have made on people gambling on these lockboxes. Its genius...
I don't understand why KDF players think this "build it and they will come" philosophy is going to be the savior of the KDF faction.
The KDF tutorial is an annoying as back and forth disaster, the whole city has absolutely no fundamental design structure to it and isn't really enjoyable to be at, and the spacedock interactions/explore the station and get you're first ship interaction is clumsy at best.
Nuke the KDF, pick out the pieces that are decent get the KDF players to make some solid foundry missions that could port to episodes and start the whole thing from scratch not the pre and post launch mess it is.
And no matter what the baseline issue still exists, Cryptic has lost money focusing on the KDF. I believe it was the November Ask Cryptic where Dan stated this fact again.
sometimes they best way to save something is to destroy it and start over.
I am not going to give credit where I think it is due. In fact, I am going to do the direct opposite.
What faction in either WOW or EVE is neglected as much as the KDF by either CCCP or Blizzard?
I think Cryptic management is failing to grasp that concept that right or wrong, good or bad, the KDF is part of THEIR game. If they don?t fix it (and they have admitted it is lacking) then they are squarely the problem.
And since it is the problem, then we are all backing a looser!
I don't understand why KDF players think this "build it and they will come" philosophy is going to be the savior of the KDF faction.
The KDF tutorial is an annoying as back and forth disaster, the whole city has absolutely no fundamental design structure to it and isn't really enjoyable to be at, and the spacedock interactions/explore the station and get you're first ship interaction is clumsy at best.
Nuke the KDF, pick out the pieces that are decent get the KDF players to make some solid foundry missions that could port to episodes and start the whole thing from scratch not the pre and post launch mess it is.
And no matter what the baseline issue still exists, Cryptic has lost money focusing on the KDF. I believe it was the November Ask Cryptic where Dan stated this fact again.
sometimes they best way to save something is to destroy it and start over.
I don't think "starting it over" is necessary, but I do agree the tutorial (if you can call it that) is a pretty big part of the problem. It's so long and so much work that most new players will give up on KDF pretty quickly.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them." -Thomas Marrone
I don't understand why KDF players think this "build it and they will come" philosophy is going to be the savior of the KDF faction.
The KDF tutorial is an annoying as back and forth disaster, the whole city has absolutely no fundamental design structure to it and isn't really enjoyable to be at, and the spacedock interactions/explore the station and get you're first ship interaction is clumsy at best.
Nuke the KDF, pick out the pieces that are decent get the KDF players to make some solid foundry missions that could port to episodes and start the whole thing from scratch not the pre and post launch mess it is.
And no matter what the baseline issue still exists, Cryptic has lost money focusing on the KDF. I believe it was the November Ask Cryptic where Dan stated this fact again.
sometimes they best way to save something is to destroy it and start over.
I actually have to agree with you here...
As much as it pains me so I do have to...
They never did get the KDF right and every half-arsed attempt so far just compliments their failure.
Sure Stahl may say every so often that they plan to work on the KDF but all he goes on about is a bloody tutorial. Does he not realise that down to his own design of only allowing level 25 characters to be KDF that noone will actually play the said tutorial?
Best thing they can do is, as you say completely wipe the slate and start again.
Id love to play a STO or just Trek MMO (my faith in this one is lacking) and get to be a part of something different than the same old tree-hugging TRIBBLE that Starfleet get up to. Even though this Starfleet is gung-ho and shoot at anything and everything they still lack anything KDF which is unfortunate as all KDF 'content' is essentially just a copy/paste.
All I can say is if they do intend to make Season 8 KDF based then it better be the biggest patch to date. Anything less simply won't do.
Painting over a crack in a wall only hides the problem for a short duration. You have to fix the crack for it to go completely...
KDF fans believe the " build it and they will come" becuase Cryptics "half created" aproach did not work and completing the faction so its a full game play experience will certainly not chase away players if one of the complaints about the KDF is there is not enough draw worth bothering over it about.
they will continue to lose players interested in even attempting the KDF and a potential revenue source if they just ignore it and pander only to the feds.
I really hope they don't actually listen to any of the wipe the KDF from the game BS here. From I've seen of them listening to the KDF, I doubt I have to worry about it too.
Regardless, I like the new First City. I don't play STO often but when I do it almost exclusively my KDF toon so I would really not like 'losing' it because of other players whining about the 2nd class nature of KDF or lack of content. Its a simple reality of the IP that Klingons are not going to be centerpiece - no matter how developed and refined they are in the IP, Star Trek just isn't about the Klingons: they are a distinct but secondary element/aspect of Star Trek.
If you feel like your being ignored because you Really like the Klingon parts of the IP/Game then I can understand that because as I said I primarily play my KDF toon.
Please don't speak about something that would ruin the game for your fellow KDF player community....PW/Cryptic might actually listen for a change and that would ruin our [not just your game] game (even more so than it may be already).
I would not fear a Wipe of the KDF at all.
All we have to do is continue to express our desires in a less than angry way and wait upon season 8 as the "KDF" season, at least in part in that we KDF fans will hoepfully see the start of the completion of the faction.
In fact a more respectful, towards the Dev anyways, approach may be the best thing for us to allieviate old hard feelings but I will leave such a decision up to the individual warrior.
KDF fans believe the " build it and they will come" becuase Cryptics "half created" aproach did not work and completing the faction so its a full game play experience will certainly not chase away players if one of the complaints about the KDF is there is not enough draw worth bothering over it about.
they will continue to lose players interested in even attempting the KDF and a potential revenue source if they just ignore it and pander only to the feds.
If they were not prepared to build and support a multiple faction MMO then they should have only made the Federation and called the game Starfleet online.
I keep hearing that Cryptic staff has double in size over the past couple of years and yet they still can't seem to find any time to devote to the growth of the KDF faction.
At this point there should be a development group within Cryptic that only works on KDF content.
We were told that once again an upcoming season (this time #8) will be the season that the KDF will get some of the attention that it so sorely needs and I'm already waiting for the back tracking to begin.
The current copy N past content that the KDF gets now would not be so bad if the faction had its own level 1-50 mission content with a decent tutorial like the Federation has.
We all are fans of Star Trek but we are not all treated equal and I think that is my biggest gripe when it comes to Cryptic.
Yep it's my fault the KDF Faction is in the state that it is, I guess I'll try harder :rolleyes:
I keep on saying this. The KDF side has got potential to be awesome, sure that there a few episodes based on the KDF during the the run of all the trek series, but there is so much room to expand story wise and STO could take advantage of that.
IMO Federation gameplay in STO is just cut and paste from TOS, ST:NG, ST:DS9 and ST:Voy. It is boring and we've all seen it before. It is a shame that developers use copy and paste Fed stuff for the KDF while they are sitting on a gold mine of future trek canon for the KDF faction.
There was once a General named Chang that quoted this at a Diplomatic dinner aboard a federation vessel called U.S.S. ENTERPRISE 1701-A; "We need breathing room".
I am primarily a KDF player and I agree that Cryptic is sitting on a gold mine if they look at the bigger picture to develop the KDF Faction. Unfortunately they cater to the Federation player as they seem to be more abundance of players due to being forced to play federation until level 25 before you can create a KDF character. By the time you reach level 25 the player loses interest in creating a KDF player that he/she has to grind all over again. Sure your KDF character starts off at a higher level but still less than level 25. So most players don't want to start over to grind to a level they just reached.
Unfortunately thats the nature of most players. Unless your like me and several other die hard KDF players that prefer to play Klingon. When season 8 arrives it will be a testament to whether cryptic sincerely wants to flesh out KDF faction to be equal to its counterpart the federation. In my opinion if the developers are truly trying to upgrade and add equal new content to the KDF faction they should do it in season 8. As I agree to a previous reply it should be one huge patch to fix the problem. I can only say hope cryptic realizes how much more they can get by developing the KDF Faction as I stated and many others they have a gold mine that has lots of potential.:D:);):cool:
There was once a General named Chang that quoted this at a Diplomatic dinner aboard a federation vessel called U.S.S. ENTERPRISE 1701-A; "We need breathing room".
I am primarily a KDF player and I agree that Cryptic is sitting on a gold mine if they look at the bigger picture to develop the KDF Faction. Unfortunately they cater to the Federation player as they seem to be more abundance of players due to being forced to play federation until level 25 before you can create a KDF character. By the time you reach level 25 the player loses interest in creating a KDF player that he/she has to grind all over again. Sure your KDF character starts off at a higher level but still less than level 25. So most players don't want to start over to grind to a level they just reached.
Unfortunately thats the nature of most players. Unless your like me and several other die hard KDF players that prefer to play Klingon. When season 8 arrives it will be a testament to whether cryptic sincerely wants to flesh out KDF faction to be equal to its counterpart the federation. In my opinion if the developers are truly trying to upgrade and add equal new content to the KDF faction they should do it in season 8. As I agree to a previous reply it should be one huge patch to fix the problem. I can only say hope cryptic realizes how much more they can get by developing the KDF Faction as I stated and many others they have a gold mine that has lots of potential.:D:);):cool:
I was playing KDF from game launch when you had to grind PvP scenarios to get any form of XP as KDF. THOSE were the days when levelling a Klingon were hard.
That being said im sure there is truth to your words...
Also Chang... As good as he was he was about as much Klingon as Torres is. That being not much at all... Sure he wore red and fought with honour but no Klingon would even care who Shakespeare was let alone recite it. Everyone except the English care not for who Shakespeare was and that's just Earth.
Q: (hippiejon) If there was ONE thing you can add to the game. Your personal dream update. Big or Small. What would it be?
Dstahl: Klingon PvE content from 1-50 with a solid PvE and PvP endgame. Plain and simple. Then after that, real Star Trek exploration.
Well Dan Stahl, given every statement you and other devs as well as STO reps have made about making the KDF a full faction equal to the Federation, I won't hold my breathe or cross my fingers until we the players actually see it. We have been promised this from the beginning when the game launched and all we have gotten since are "empty promises" but as you yourself have said in the past, "As I've said in numerous interviews - don't take me at my word - just look at my track record for making the improvements that I said we would with the KDF and judge by that."
Alright Dan, if we are to truly "judge you on the improvements that have been made to the KDF," I myself in my honest opinion think your track record "for improvemnts" isn't worth the mud on any of my captains' boots! So much for the devs doing what they promise they will.
At this point if they say they want to flesh out the KDF chances are they are just saying it, and they have been saying it for a while so do not expect it to ever happen. We will see romulan factions fully fleshed out first as a pay expansion of some nature.
After which you will probably see 'KDF coming soon! (tm)' to which it will probably be some cut and past missions.
Granted there are some KDF only missions there, but if i recall it was one like..every 5 or 10 levels. Anything eles to level on was weekly episodes or dailies.
I would personally love to see more KDF content, but I'm a person who has been here since launch and use to the "We are working on it" line for some time. If it happens, great, if not well I would expect much.
Game companies these days do not ever seem to be able to keep their word, I would sooner trust a congressman's word about economic recovery than theirs.
Thats not to say I'm not greatful for whats here, I am., but you can not really expect us to trust what they say about the KDF at this point. It seem all the money is coming from the Starfleet side (Ironic considering Starfleet itself dosent belive in money) so thats where the building goes. I can understand that, Cryptic/PE wants to make money. What I can not forgive, is being constantly lied too and strung along.
I have to agree with statements against Cryptic on KDF advancement. I have been here since February 2010 and I have watched Dan spend his time lying (read: not telling the truth) to his customers for almost three years now. I have watched Cryptic, Atari, and PWE continue the only process they know- tell you what you want to hear and not deliver.
I really think the company needs a fresh start at the top, new prospectives and new ideas.
I don't think that Cryptic wants to finish the KDF.
I do think they want to add different factions as playable spieces in the future.
I don't think they know how to get there.
They really need to stop calling this a multi-faction game and start calling it a multi-spiece game. EVE has four factions, this game has one faction and a group of heritics to PvP with.
Yep it's my fault the KDF Faction is in the state that it is, I guess I'll try harder :rolleyes:
Only Cryptic has said its the Fans fault that the KDF is so under developed.
It is a lie meant to cover themselves and since 80% of the game is sicophants to Cryptic, the line was accepted and moved past.
My statement of not insulting the Devs is meant merely to stop the insulting of the Devs that has not helped us achieve what we wish yet and will not help us achieve it in the future. A change of Tactics , if you will.
Post what you feel is important, offer complaint on what upsets you, give honest review of what you feel is lacking for the KDF. Do not give up the good fight and wait and see if it happens.
If Cryptic and Dan have lied to us then only they will suffer as the KDF fanbase leaves and STO dies a little more in the process. Its not as if we have to stay and play STO.
At this point there should be a development group within Cryptic that only works on KDF content.
It's a nice idea, but I think it's way too soon in the game's ongoing development to be talking about a dedicated KDF team. Before they can justify doing that, they need to increase the KDF player rolls... a 1-50 levelling experience would help. I also think they need to spend a little bit more time on figuring out what KDF players will buy and putting that stuff in the C-Store.
Q: (hippiejon) If there was ONE thing you can add to the game. Your personal dream update. Big or Small. What would it be?
Dstahl: Klingon PvE content from 1-50 with a solid PvE and PvP endgame. Plain and simple. Then after that, real Star Trek exploration.
Well Dan Stahl, given every statement you and other devs as well as STO reps have made about making the KDF a full faction equal to the Federation, I won't hold my breathe or cross my fingers until we the players actually see it. We have been promised this from the beginning when the game launched and all we have gotten since are "empty promises"
If you read that carefully, you will notice that Dan Stahl never promised anything there. That was his personal wishlist of what he'd add to the game if he got his wish. That's not the same thing as putting on his EP hat and saying "this is what we're going to add to the game in Season X".
When I read between the lines, I sense that Cryptic has a long range plan that they are, more or less, trying to execute. We aren't told exactly what that is because it's subject to change, as always, and because we as a group will probably rake them over the coals if they don't deliver when or what they said they would.
Right now Job One is keeping the cash flow going while addressing some basic weaknesses and inconsistencies in gameplay for all of the players. This is partly why FE's got put on hold the past two seasons in favor of Starbases, Fleet Actions, STF revamps and the Romulan Adventure Zone: they needed replayable long-term content for high-level characters. If they aren't able to put out FE's at least once a year, they probably don't have resources to do something like focus on KDF either.
Not holding your breath is probably wise... even if they did decide to add full KDF progression in Season 8, that's months away. I have faith that they will officially address everything on Dan's wishlist in due time... just not necessarily according to our schedule.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
If you read that carefully, you will notice that Dan Stahl never promised anything there. That was his personal wishlist of what he'd add to the game if he got his wish. That's not the same thing as putting on his EP hat and saying "this is what we're going to add to the game in Season X".
I read this as a politician saying he cares about something, or that something is an important issue, or that he empathizes with an audience and their situation. It sure doesn't mean that the politician is going to get into office and vote a certain way. It's a bunch of hot air.
Were I being less kind I would say it's like a drunk telling his wife that he wants to stop abusing her. Of course that would make me the enabling partner who keeps believing the person who refuses to match deeds to words. Well, pinch my butt and call me Sally I guess.
It is Dan Stahl's goal to make certain the princess is always in another castle. The Twitter quote in my signature sums it up pretty well.
Jack Emmert: "Starfleet and Klingon. ... So two factions, full PvE content." Al Rivera hates Klingons Star Trek Online: Agents of Jack Emmert All cloaks should be canon.
But yeah, Blue, we'll keep the faith. Cause there's no other Trek out there, right?
Fair enough
You know the definition of faith, right?: "hope in that which is unseen"
If we'd seen it, I wouldn't need to have faith.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Comments
It's the other war around - the Romulans, FvK war, Undine, etc are all part of the Iconian storyline.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
You touch on a lot of good points here. Would fans/players be willing to wait for faction-specific mission? I think yes, some have waited for nearly 3 year now for anything-KDF -specific. I haven't been playing STO exclusively for those three years, but even when not playing, I'm still waiting...
Somehow, all those Cthulhu-looking things on New Romulus... I don't feel like my Gorn should be 'tagging' them (giggiddy) but rather mowing them down in a frenzy of disruptor fire, and setting the big one at the back of the river on fire.
I find it hard to play any of my KDF toons on New Romulus. The mission break my immersion in my character. I'm a f&%$ing Lieutenant General. The Fehk'iri tremble at the sound of my name. I have slaughtered countless Borg. I have chartered fluidic space. I have faced the Undine, and lived to tell the tale. Women want me, men want to be me, and immigrants want to take night classes and learn Klingon so they can talk about soccer with me.
But, yeah, sure, you need someone to go water the plants, I'm your man little Romulan friend. Nope, nothing else on the schedule for today, guess I must have done killed it all.
I also think releasing KDF-version content a few weeks/month later, it would give Feds something to do now and then something to do later as well. It would definitely be a tease to some long-standing Fed-exclusive players, to simply try the other faction out.
Also, it wouldn't feel the same as a Fed playing the mission on his Fed alt (even when it's his KDF alt). Idk, a player might get 'immersed' more into the KDF, and actually play it more (or, at least take it more seriously).
I always thought Facility 2049-or w/e would be terrific to play as a 'remastered' KDF mission, where you had to break someone out of Rurha Penthe.
why, how about arena's that have players backing up AI faction fleets against the other faction.. you can shoot other players, you can shoot AI ships...
Run continuously...
Player rewards could be a player selection choice of
Dilithium
Faction rewards
Fleet rewards
LOBI crystals
what ever..
if your not so good at pvP.. then go after the AI ships.. if your good at pvP go after other players..
But by all means make it a great big mugging mother of all battles...
and take a page from the STF's have a normal version, and an "elite" version..
suddenly BAM! we have a war between the feds and the KDF that means something to the players, and rewards them for taking part..
I've also always been a fan of the concept of PvP ground battles where the player wades into combat WITH thier away team... (gives players even more excuse to trick out thier away team ya know!)
As for season 8.. I'll belive there will be KDF content when i see it... 3 years of unfulfilled promises.. Not that we haven't seen some KDF content.. but its certainly not very much compared to the fed content.
As for why we've been seeing so many more KDF players lately.. i can only guess that many fed players have so played out the fed content that they're now wanting to try the other side.
And yes, I've also noticed a lot more KDF players lately.. Qo'nos space is positivly crowded these days..
Maybe its because the KDF fleet starbases have things like fireplaces, bloodwine fountains, and orion Dancing girls doing the nerve tonic dance..
I know I can sit in the fleet bar for hours on end waiting for DOFF missions to complete watching the dancers.....(sigh!)
... could it be that simple?
KDF starbases have better decor, and a more fun bar life?.. Meh? could be!
Yes, isn't that awfully convenient. Hmph.
I guess I just don't like the Iconian concept. Maybe I just have difficulty believing that, after hundreds of thousands of years of hiding out wherever they've set up shop, they've decided to try re-conquering stuff. They'd have done it long ago, if they had possessed the capability or still existed.
I'd have been fine with another species-specific story arc, maybe one that's focused on Cardassians, both the True Way and the puppet government. Perhaps the KDF could side with the True Way and establish an alliance in order to remove the Federation's influence on Cardassian space. Since Cryptic seems content to treat the 'Federation-Klingon War' as a cold war, this would make perfect sense. Cut off the Federation's access to allies (Cardassians, Romulans, etc), and expand PvP so that there's more of a 'wartime' feel to things.
This would make far too much sense, though, so they'll just stick to throwing lockbox goodies at foolish money-loaded players and creating blatantly Federation-based content with a nearly-transparent 'Klingon' wrapper for the KDF version.
They have added a few ships and costumes to make money from the few members of the faction but otherwise they don't seem too interested. Each season there is mention of KDF content and each season we don't get it.
Also its well known that the devs don't really pay much attention to what their fanbase are saying. They may well act on a few topics that are brought up on the monthly question time but mostly it is responded with 'we are aiming to get this put in'.
I have huge respect for D Stahl and I think he somewhat rescued STO from Zinkeveich's (sp) reign, unfortunately Atari being the horrible people that they are threw the company into the hands of PWE which has been the worst thing for STO since its creation. Each update im continuously finding more of a reason to dislike the game due to its infatuation with scamming its playerbase.
I only hope they stick true to their words of KDF content appearing in season 8.
Having said all that we all know that the KDF content will only be a copy/paste so im unsure as to whether its worth adding it at all.
The devs did not have to but did and I hope it means that possibly fleet Karfi and Gurambu fleet ships in the future. So its obviuos they know we are here.
I just wish they would stop meshing such content as the FEs and the new Rommie stuff to jist be fed in flavor and actually go the next step and faction the factions enough so the player experiences the fed and KDF flavors
They've shown its possible in the past.... once I think... with the Bajaron world spy stuff and even in how the Npc Klingons were keeping order ridged style.
So why not take the leap and do this in all endgame crossfaction play?
Otherwise its not a two faction game at all, just snazzy what ever...
Honestly, Its getting tiresome having to rehash this all the time.
The devs are not idiots. They know we exist. I just do not know why they do not more with us.
R.I.P
They really need to consolidate the factions as far as development because they keep stating they understand the "build it and they will come aspect" but they aren't building anything KDF and keep saying that they are loosing money on it... I guess the green paint costs are on the rise and too much to afford. TBH though there are so many story arcs and so many ship designs involving everything surrounding the KDF in their story that just hasn't been done you can almost say that there is more KDF than fed content just based off canon to put in this game. It pretty much looks like they were basing most of the game off TOS and then sprinkled a little TNG and DS9 here and there.
Plus on another note a lot of what made Star Trek what it was... WAS the KDF. Between the Khitomer Treaty to the end of DS9 there would be no federation if it wasn't for the assistance of the KDF. This new romulus thing would make sense except for the fact that the undine plot isn't resolved, the duras/jmpok arc isnt resolved, the fek'ihr arc isn't resolved, and the dominion okay they aren't officially engaged in any war in the alpha quadrant... The feds resolved their side with their dominion arc. Okay then why do we have defenses vs the dominion since they aren't officially attacking the Feds or KDF? It just seems they will pile any kind of dead gagh at us and expect us to like it but the whole point of story and anything resembling canon goes out the window with dilithium and zen TRIBBLE that we aren't even getting c-store ships popping out. Sure Sure they put a fleet b'rel out there but its freaking T5 shipyard and its not like decent fleets are getting people swamped with donations to even get their so it makes sense the way they did starbases and story with feds but with the KDF its just a fed diet given to us to stay fed healthy.
CBS are meant to have some sort of say in what does and doesn't get put in yet we get silly things like said dominion attacks happening.
I also personally hate how they keep adding non-faction ships to the game. Why the hell would a Starfleet officer fly a Tholian ship...
Maybe im poking holes and I know it stirrs the non-trekkies wild into buying lockboxes (genius idea!) but I still dislike it.
And yea lockboxes... Bloody brilliant idea. It often amuses me with the whiney posts about how someone bought ?50 worth of keys and they still didn't get the ship, etc. Id love to see how much money they have made on people gambling on these lockboxes. Its genius...
The KDF tutorial is an annoying as back and forth disaster, the whole city has absolutely no fundamental design structure to it and isn't really enjoyable to be at, and the spacedock interactions/explore the station and get you're first ship interaction is clumsy at best.
Nuke the KDF, pick out the pieces that are decent get the KDF players to make some solid foundry missions that could port to episodes and start the whole thing from scratch not the pre and post launch mess it is.
And no matter what the baseline issue still exists, Cryptic has lost money focusing on the KDF. I believe it was the November Ask Cryptic where Dan stated this fact again.
sometimes they best way to save something is to destroy it and start over.
What faction in either WOW or EVE is neglected as much as the KDF by either CCCP or Blizzard?
I think Cryptic management is failing to grasp that concept that right or wrong, good or bad, the KDF is part of THEIR game. If they don?t fix it (and they have admitted it is lacking) then they are squarely the problem.
And since it is the problem, then we are all backing a looser!
Proof?
How about the words of their own players?
I don't think "starting it over" is necessary, but I do agree the tutorial (if you can call it that) is a pretty big part of the problem. It's so long and so much work that most new players will give up on KDF pretty quickly.
"Critics who say that the optimistic utopia Star Trek depicted is now outmoded forget the cultural context that gave birth to it: Star Trek was not a manifestation of optimism when optimism was easy. Star Trek declared a hope for a future that nobody stuck in the present could believe in. For all our struggles today, we haven’t outgrown the need for stories like Star Trek. We need tales of optimism, of heroes, of courage and goodness now as much as we’ve ever needed them."
-Thomas Marrone
I actually have to agree with you here...
As much as it pains me so I do have to...
They never did get the KDF right and every half-arsed attempt so far just compliments their failure.
Sure Stahl may say every so often that they plan to work on the KDF but all he goes on about is a bloody tutorial. Does he not realise that down to his own design of only allowing level 25 characters to be KDF that noone will actually play the said tutorial?
Best thing they can do is, as you say completely wipe the slate and start again.
Id love to play a STO or just Trek MMO (my faith in this one is lacking) and get to be a part of something different than the same old tree-hugging TRIBBLE that Starfleet get up to. Even though this Starfleet is gung-ho and shoot at anything and everything they still lack anything KDF which is unfortunate as all KDF 'content' is essentially just a copy/paste.
All I can say is if they do intend to make Season 8 KDF based then it better be the biggest patch to date. Anything less simply won't do.
Painting over a crack in a wall only hides the problem for a short duration. You have to fix the crack for it to go completely...
they will continue to lose players interested in even attempting the KDF and a potential revenue source if they just ignore it and pander only to the feds.
R.I.P
Regardless, I like the new First City. I don't play STO often but when I do it almost exclusively my KDF toon so I would really not like 'losing' it because of other players whining about the 2nd class nature of KDF or lack of content. Its a simple reality of the IP that Klingons are not going to be centerpiece - no matter how developed and refined they are in the IP, Star Trek just isn't about the Klingons: they are a distinct but secondary element/aspect of Star Trek.
If you feel like your being ignored because you Really like the Klingon parts of the IP/Game then I can understand that because as I said I primarily play my KDF toon.
Please don't speak about something that would ruin the game for your fellow KDF player community....PW/Cryptic might actually listen for a change and that would ruin our [not just your game] game (even more so than it may be already).
All we have to do is continue to express our desires in a less than angry way and wait upon season 8 as the "KDF" season, at least in part in that we KDF fans will hoepfully see the start of the completion of the faction.
In fact a more respectful, towards the Dev anyways, approach may be the best thing for us to allieviate old hard feelings but I will leave such a decision up to the individual warrior.
Politics is not my forte'
R.I.P
It astounds me how since day one that Cryptic has treated the KDF faction like the embodiment of Meg Griffin. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NN_y732VGQ
If they were not prepared to build and support a multiple faction MMO then they should have only made the Federation and called the game Starfleet online.
I keep hearing that Cryptic staff has double in size over the past couple of years and yet they still can't seem to find any time to devote to the growth of the KDF faction.
At this point there should be a development group within Cryptic that only works on KDF content.
We were told that once again an upcoming season (this time #8) will be the season that the KDF will get some of the attention that it so sorely needs and I'm already waiting for the back tracking to begin.
The current copy N past content that the KDF gets now would not be so bad if the faction had its own level 1-50 mission content with a decent tutorial like the Federation has.
We all are fans of Star Trek but we are not all treated equal and I think that is my biggest gripe when it comes to Cryptic.
Yep it's my fault the KDF Faction is in the state that it is, I guess I'll try harder :rolleyes:
IMO Federation gameplay in STO is just cut and paste from TOS, ST:NG, ST:DS9 and ST:Voy. It is boring and we've all seen it before. It is a shame that developers use copy and paste Fed stuff for the KDF while they are sitting on a gold mine of future trek canon for the KDF faction.
I am primarily a KDF player and I agree that Cryptic is sitting on a gold mine if they look at the bigger picture to develop the KDF Faction. Unfortunately they cater to the Federation player as they seem to be more abundance of players due to being forced to play federation until level 25 before you can create a KDF character. By the time you reach level 25 the player loses interest in creating a KDF player that he/she has to grind all over again. Sure your KDF character starts off at a higher level but still less than level 25. So most players don't want to start over to grind to a level they just reached.
Unfortunately thats the nature of most players. Unless your like me and several other die hard KDF players that prefer to play Klingon. When season 8 arrives it will be a testament to whether cryptic sincerely wants to flesh out KDF faction to be equal to its counterpart the federation. In my opinion if the developers are truly trying to upgrade and add equal new content to the KDF faction they should do it in season 8. As I agree to a previous reply it should be one huge patch to fix the problem. I can only say hope cryptic realizes how much more they can get by developing the KDF Faction as I stated and many others they have a gold mine that has lots of potential.:D:);):cool:
I was playing KDF from game launch when you had to grind PvP scenarios to get any form of XP as KDF. THOSE were the days when levelling a Klingon were hard.
That being said im sure there is truth to your words...
Also Chang... As good as he was he was about as much Klingon as Torres is. That being not much at all... Sure he wore red and fought with honour but no Klingon would even care who Shakespeare was let alone recite it. Everyone except the English care not for who Shakespeare was and that's just Earth.
Dstahl: Klingon PvE content from 1-50 with a solid PvE and PvP endgame. Plain and simple. Then after that, real Star Trek exploration.
Well Dan Stahl, given every statement you and other devs as well as STO reps have made about making the KDF a full faction equal to the Federation, I won't hold my breathe or cross my fingers until we the players actually see it. We have been promised this from the beginning when the game launched and all we have gotten since are "empty promises" but as you yourself have said in the past, "As I've said in numerous interviews - don't take me at my word - just look at my track record for making the improvements that I said we would with the KDF and judge by that."
Alright Dan, if we are to truly "judge you on the improvements that have been made to the KDF," I myself in my honest opinion think your track record "for improvemnts" isn't worth the mud on any of my captains' boots! So much for the devs doing what they promise they will.
After which you will probably see 'KDF coming soon! (tm)' to which it will probably be some cut and past missions.
Granted there are some KDF only missions there, but if i recall it was one like..every 5 or 10 levels. Anything eles to level on was weekly episodes or dailies.
I would personally love to see more KDF content, but I'm a person who has been here since launch and use to the "We are working on it" line for some time. If it happens, great, if not well I would expect much.
Game companies these days do not ever seem to be able to keep their word, I would sooner trust a congressman's word about economic recovery than theirs.
Thats not to say I'm not greatful for whats here, I am., but you can not really expect us to trust what they say about the KDF at this point. It seem all the money is coming from the Starfleet side (Ironic considering Starfleet itself dosent belive in money) so thats where the building goes. I can understand that, Cryptic/PE wants to make money. What I can not forgive, is being constantly lied too and strung along.
I really think the company needs a fresh start at the top, new prospectives and new ideas.
I don't think that Cryptic wants to finish the KDF.
I do think they want to add different factions as playable spieces in the future.
I don't think they know how to get there.
They really need to stop calling this a multi-faction game and start calling it a multi-spiece game. EVE has four factions, this game has one faction and a group of heritics to PvP with.
Only Cryptic has said its the Fans fault that the KDF is so under developed.
It is a lie meant to cover themselves and since 80% of the game is sicophants to Cryptic, the line was accepted and moved past.
My statement of not insulting the Devs is meant merely to stop the insulting of the Devs that has not helped us achieve what we wish yet and will not help us achieve it in the future. A change of Tactics , if you will.
Post what you feel is important, offer complaint on what upsets you, give honest review of what you feel is lacking for the KDF. Do not give up the good fight and wait and see if it happens.
If Cryptic and Dan have lied to us then only they will suffer as the KDF fanbase leaves and STO dies a little more in the process. Its not as if we have to stay and play STO.
R.I.P
It's a nice idea, but I think it's way too soon in the game's ongoing development to be talking about a dedicated KDF team. Before they can justify doing that, they need to increase the KDF player rolls... a 1-50 levelling experience would help. I also think they need to spend a little bit more time on figuring out what KDF players will buy and putting that stuff in the C-Store.
If you read that carefully, you will notice that Dan Stahl never promised anything there. That was his personal wishlist of what he'd add to the game if he got his wish. That's not the same thing as putting on his EP hat and saying "this is what we're going to add to the game in Season X".
When I read between the lines, I sense that Cryptic has a long range plan that they are, more or less, trying to execute. We aren't told exactly what that is because it's subject to change, as always, and because we as a group will probably rake them over the coals if they don't deliver when or what they said they would.
Right now Job One is keeping the cash flow going while addressing some basic weaknesses and inconsistencies in gameplay for all of the players. This is partly why FE's got put on hold the past two seasons in favor of Starbases, Fleet Actions, STF revamps and the Romulan Adventure Zone: they needed replayable long-term content for high-level characters. If they aren't able to put out FE's at least once a year, they probably don't have resources to do something like focus on KDF either.
Not holding your breath is probably wise... even if they did decide to add full KDF progression in Season 8, that's months away. I have faith that they will officially address everything on Dan's wishlist in due time... just not necessarily according to our schedule.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Were I being less kind I would say it's like a drunk telling his wife that he wants to stop abusing her. Of course that would make me the enabling partner who keeps believing the person who refuses to match deeds to words. Well, pinch my butt and call me Sally I guess.
Peregrine Falcon anyone?
But yeah, Blue, we'll keep the faith. Cause there's no other Trek out there, right?
CommanderDonatra@Capt.Sisko: ahhh is it supposed to do that?
Norvo Tigan@dontdrunkimshoot: hell ya, maybe
Al Rivera hates Klingons
Star Trek Online: Agents of Jack Emmert
All cloaks should be canon.
Fair enough
You know the definition of faith, right?: "hope in that which is unseen"
If we'd seen it, I wouldn't need to have faith.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek