test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Options

Apologies

brandonflbrandonfl Member Posts: 892
edited December 2012 in PvP Gameplay
I would like to apologize for the incorrect statement I made yesterday. Cryptic didn't take down the servers to fix insignia clipping on more buxom toons. It was a tailor access bug for some that prompted the hotfix. The insignia clipping issue was actually addressed in a normal patch around the same timeframe.

The point, however, remains the same. Cryptic Devs are capable of rapidly fixing issues, but continue to ignore or postpone fixing actual gameplay/gamebreaking bugs. I appreciate the heads up that the new Voldemort bug is being fixed with the next patch, but it should have been fixed as soon as it was reproduced by a dev. It should not have waited, at all.

Gamebreaking bugs should always prompt immediate response, especially when they are as widespread as the current Voldy. I believe the crit bug on Tric Mines + DP's ranks up there as well, and requires immediate attention.
LOLSTO
Post edited by brandonfl on
«1

Comments

  • Options
    webdeathwebdeath Member Posts: 1,570 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I think the reason for the delay in fixing the Crits issue, may very well be more ingraned to the way Crits get handled in general some where in the game engine. And while they did get it fixed in Champions Online, STO may use different variables that they haven't quite figured out how to modify with out bringing down the whole system.. That and the fact is, the effects on PVP are much smaller then the PVE Effects, and the PVE effects haven't effected players enough to cause mass riots and pitch forks that demands a fix like this to be taken care of imeaditely.

    In other words, it's not a show stopping bug. Seems almost any bug that effects PVP more then PVE, or in greater detail, are always lower on the totem poll. :(
    You think that your beta test was bad?
    Think about this:
    American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Options
    paxottomanpaxottoman Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    *Should be
    brandonfl wrote: »
    fixed with the next patch,
    Turkish RP Heroes
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Options
    brandonflbrandonfl Member Posts: 892
    edited November 2012
    paxottoman wrote: »
    *Should be

    Thanks for fixing that :)
    LOLSTO
  • Options
    pwebranflakespwebranflakes Member Posts: 7,741
    edited November 2012
    Apology accepted :)
    paxottoman wrote: »
    *Should be

    Yep. I said "should be". But, I just checked in with the team and, unfortunately, it may not be in the next patch -- hopefully the one after that if not. We're still testing potential fixes as it's actually a bit trickier than it seems.

    Sorry, Captains :(

    Cheers,

    Brandon =/\=
  • Options
    velldunvelldun Member Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    My Theory, and it's just a theory, is that they're letting it stay in the game to get some game data about how people are using a 5th boff. Because, eventually, new ships will come with 5 Boffs, or 6, or 12. Power creep is a fact of life in MMOs. Also, a good money maker as my oddy , my vesta, and fleet defiant, and lock box ships get gradually thrown into the dustbin along with my old Connie.
  • Options
    thepleasuredomethepleasuredome Member Posts: 308
    edited November 2012
    I see no reason for you to apologize Brandon, but that was a class act regardless.

    Cryptic makes colossal mistakes on a monthly basis that affects the playerbase as a whole, never mind pve/pvp, and sees fit to double down on said mistakes instead of apologizing for engaging in such un-customer friendly decisions.

    You are also right, the sentiment is the same. Being that Brandon can come in here and say apology accepted in the same breath as saying the fix won't go live for at least another week is just another example of Cryptic's constant duplicity.
    Arawn & Ihasa
    OP *is* the new balance, whether you know it or not! Gecko says so.
    Season 7 - Exodus, available online. U buy nao!
    http://seekingalpha.com/article/738221-monetizing-perfect-world-s-latest-update
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Options
    pwebranflakespwebranflakes Member Posts: 7,741
    edited November 2012
    velldun wrote: »
    My Theory, and it's just a theory, is that they're letting it stay in the game to get some game data about how people are using a 5th boff. Because, eventually, new ships will come with 5 Boffs, or 6, or 12. Power creep is a fact of life in MMOs. Also, a good money maker as my oddy , my vesta, and fleet defiant, and lock box ships get gradually thrown into the dustbin along with my old Connie.

    Interesting theory, but it's still in the game because we're still testing potential fixes. Ultimately, it was an error in the code that resulted from an oversight.

    Cheers,

    Brandon =/\=
  • Options
    tangolighttangolight Member Posts: 777 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I see no reason for you to apologize Brandon, but that was a class act regardless.

    Cryptic makes colossal mistakes on a monthly basis that affects the playerbase as a whole, never mind pve/pvp, and sees fit to double down on said mistakes instead of apologizing for engaging in such un-customer friendly decisions.

    You are also right, the sentiment is the same. Being that Brandon can come in here and say apology accepted in the same breath as saying the fix won't go live for at least another week is just another example of Cryptic's constant duplicity.

    How is that duplicity? He accepted the apology, and gave us information that the fix has been delayed. Unless you're suggesting they're delaying the fix on purpose just to spite us, all he's telling us is that the programmers need extra time to make sure the fix works and doesn't break more stuff in the process.
  • Options
    game5pockgame5pock Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012



    Yep. I said "should be". But, I just checked in with the team and, unfortunately, it may not be in the next patch -- hopefully the one after that if not. We're still testing potential fixes as it's actually a bit trickier than it seems.


    Brandon =/\=


    I hope it gets fixed ASAP, because I stumbled upon the dumb thing myself today. I only mention this because if *I* can stumble upon it; anybody can! ;)
  • Options
    playhard88playhard88 Member Posts: 733 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    velldun wrote: »
    My Theory, and it's just a theory, is that they're letting it stay in the game to get some game data about how people are using a 5th boff. Because, eventually, new ships will come with 5 Boffs, or 6, or 12. Power creep is a fact of life in MMOs. Also, a good money maker as my oddy , my vesta, and fleet defiant, and lock box ships get gradually thrown into the dustbin along with my old Connie.

    Perfect time for a picard moment

    http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/39/2010/02/500x_picard-facepalm20100225.jpg
    John Sheridan@playhard88 - FED Tactical
    Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
    K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
    Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)
  • Options
    maicake716maicake716 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    Apology accepted :)



    Yep. I said "should be". But, I just checked in with the team and, unfortunately, it may not be in the next patch -- hopefully the one after that if not. We're still testing potential fixes as it's actually a bit trickier than it seems.

    Sorry, Captains :(

    Cheers,

    Brandon =/\=

    appology not accepted.

    and somehow i'm not surprised.
    mancom wrote: »
    Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
    Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
    Do you even Science Bro?
  • Options
    aquitaine985aquitaine985 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    Maybe i'll wait another week...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    @Aquitaine985
    Lag Industries STO PvP Fleet - Executive
    A Sad Panda of Industrial calibre.
    2010: This is Cryptic PvP. Please hold the line, your call is very important to us...
  • Options
    virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    velldun wrote: »
    My Theory, and it's just a theory, is that they're letting it stay in the game to get some game data about how people are using a 5th boff.

    FOFF slot now! :)
  • Options
    dontdrunkimshootdontdrunkimshoot Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    christ, if vold cant be fixed this week, then the code that went into having a designated shuttle needs to be walked back too. that clearly completely broke the station setup code. go ahead and reintroduce it after its all fixed. the game code seems to be coming apart at the seams lately.
  • Options
    futurepastnowfuturepastnow Member Posts: 3,660 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    There's no need to apologize over bugs. I just wish Cryptic did better testing before things went live.
  • Options
    brandonflbrandonfl Member Posts: 892
    edited November 2012
    Well, we can't get made at Brandon (BranFlakes) for this one or for any development decision. He's just doing his job, which is to serve as the Forum Community Manager. He has been doing it well, and has made an honest attempt at keeping us up to date on the state of things.

    Now, whichever manager is deciding what gets developer priority, is obviously not deserving of his position. Gamebreaking BUGs and Exploits (or non-exploit exploits) should never be allowed to remain, for any length of time. Voldy should have been given first priority. The private queues should have been given just as high or higher of a priority, since it effects all players in the game, not just PvPers.

    Cryptic's reaction to these issues makes them look unprofessional and generally bad at game development. It broadcasts their lack of understanding about PvP gameplay, in their own game, and reminds us that they could care less.

    Borticus, if you read this. Based on what I've heard about the boot camp project, I believe you care about PvP. You are the only (remaining) dev that has shown any interest in that aspect of gameplay (seriously, we should be seeing devs in the queues regularly, maybe even during scheduled events... a vital part of PvP in any game is that the developers understand it which you can't do if you don't play), and I hope you can find a way to convince your bosses that it deserves the time it would take to fix it. No other aspect of STO has as big of a chance to be a standout performer in the world of MMO's. STO's space combat system is unique and has the potential to be quite fun and generate [good] buzz in the gaming community.

    In the meantime folks, don't take your frustration out on Brandon, he's here for us. Instead write letters/emails, twitter messages, forum posts (civil) to his bosses. Tell them how badly they are failing, and urge them to listen. It might not do any good, but if anyone needs to hear it, it's them, not BranFlakes.

    BranFlakes, I hope you can adequately convey our frustrations and current anger levels to your bosses. Consider this an official request from me to our community manager. It would be nice to know, at least, that they know what is going on in here and in the game. PvPers are mad, and the blame lies squarely at their feet.
    LOLSTO
  • Options
    broadnaxbroadnax Member Posts: 340 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    brandonfl wrote: »
    Now, whichever manager is deciding what gets developer priority, is obviously not deserving of his position. Gamebreaking BUGs and Exploits (or non-exploit exploits) should never be allowed to remain, for any length of time.

    Has it ever occurred to you that smaller bugs get fixed faster because they're easier to identify and less likely to damage other systems when fixed?

    Sometimes larger bugs remain longer because of their complexity; "fixing" them quickly may break something else and cause even more gnashing of teeth on the forums.

    Just because a bug is not fixed in a "timely" manner does not mean it is not being worked on or is not the highest priority on the list. It might well just mean that it's harder to fix and will take longer. Rushing out a major fix can be a major mistake.

    Since the majority of the game seems to be playable, there apparently are no "gamebreaking" bugs. Parts might be broken or not working as intended, but as a whole, the bulk of the game is perfectly playable. If certain bugs should "never be allowed to remain, for any length of time" leads to them having to take the game down completely until it can be ironed out, that would be far worse than allowing a bug to remain in the live environment while it is being investigated in a test environment.
  • Options
    paxottomanpaxottoman Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I had mentioned on an earlier thread the history about the voldemort bug.

    It did take 1 entire season to fix it last time.

    We came up with a theory at TRH that older versions of the game are being patched with new content. Compatibility with these older versions has been of some concern.

    The reason for this strategy has both benefits and disadvantages in our view.

    Advantages:

    New content can be worked on exclusively and applied to older versions in a quicker demeanor rather than a more in depth recoding of the entire game. Reason for new content coming out very quickly rather than before. There was a new content blockage for a whole year almost. They fixed the game, polished up, then sold it to PWE.

    This also addresses the limited staff that they have at Cryptic Studios in order to address a lot of problems with the game. However, I somehow doubt they think this is working as much as we think it is.

    Whoever made the original versions, made sure they were compatible with later versions of the game. In other words in more "star trek terms" picture the Holodeck server a Trill, picture the patch as a symbiote. They put that weird looking worm in, and hope there will be no side effects. If there are, they look for another host (another version).

    Disadvantages:

    They seem to be not at capacity to deal with problems directly. Including balancing of PvP or content. Reason being is that they applied a patch to an older version, and looking for a new version for compatibility is also going to be time consuming.

    Where as where one thing breaks in this version, don't be surprised if something else breaks in the next one. It is obvious there is conflicts between the versions being patched.

    They will never tell us this is what they're doing. Mainly because, well it's a quick way of running their game.


    Solutions:

    They could be working on a new game client in the back ground to address this TRIBBLE once and for all. For all we know that could very well be the client PvPers are looking for, as well as PvE'ers but if you dangle an STF infront of PvE'er they're rolling on the ground laughing in joy. So, really, this could be the case but don't get your hopes up.
    Turkish RP Heroes
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Options
    virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    broadnax wrote: »
    the bulk of the game is perfectly playable.

    The question arises, mind you - well to me at least; how much of the game is "perfectly" playable because of the various bugs?

    People tend to think of gamebreaking bugs as things that prevent you from playing the game. They often ignore gamebreaking bugs that allow you to play the game better than intended.

    In a twisted manner, PvPers are advocates for NPCs. After all, the NPCs can't complain...
  • Options
    xtremenoob1xtremenoob1 Member Posts: 489 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    For those interested, private queues and voldemort appear to be fixed on tribble and since the normal patch day has been Thursday, I will take a leap and assume this issue resolved once the next patch occurs.

    I did two tests.

    1. I logged into a copy of my character effected by the bug. All my boffs were NIL.
    2. I attempted to reproduce the bug (which is stupid easy,) and nothing.

    It will be easy enough to verify once live.

    Hopefully that gets patched tomorrow!
    -X-/Pandas - Pheo
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Options
    brandonflbrandonfl Member Posts: 892
    edited November 2012
    broadnax wrote: »
    Has it ever occurred to you that smaller bugs get fixed faster because they're easier to identify and less likely to damage other systems when fixed?

    Sometimes larger bugs remain longer because of their complexity; "fixing" them quickly may break something else and cause even more gnashing of teeth on the forums.

    Just because a bug is not fixed in a "timely" manner does not mean it is not being worked on or is not the highest priority on the list. It might well just mean that it's harder to fix and will take longer. Rushing out a major fix can be a major mistake.

    Since the majority of the game seems to be playable, there apparently are no "gamebreaking" bugs. Parts might be broken or not working as intended, but as a whole, the bulk of the game is perfectly playable. If certain bugs should "never be allowed to remain, for any length of time" leads to them having to take the game down completely until it can be ironed out, that would be far worse than allowing a bug to remain in the live environment while it is being investigated in a test environment.

    Following the DevTracker to the PvP subforums should trigger a disclaimer. "Warning: You may be stepping in over your head. Proceed at your own risk."
    The question arises, mind you - well to me at least; how much of the game is "perfectly" playable because of the various bugs?

    People tend to think of gamebreaking bugs as things that prevent you from playing the game. They often ignore gamebreaking bugs that allow you to play the game better than intended.

    In a twisted manner, PvPers are advocates for NPCs. After all, the NPCs can't complain...

    Case in point. I think that pretty much sums it up.
    LOLSTO
  • Options
    brandonflbrandonfl Member Posts: 892
    edited November 2012
    For those interested, private queues and voldemort appear to be fixed on tribble and since the normal patch day has been Thursday, I will take a leap and assume this issue resolved once the next patch occurs.

    I did two tests.

    1. I logged into a copy of my character effected by the bug. All my boffs were NIL.
    2. I attempted to reproduce the bug (which is stupid easy,) and nothing.

    It will be easy enough to verify once live.

    Hopefully that gets patched tomorrow!

    Awesome, great to hear.
    LOLSTO
  • Options
    aetam1aetam1 Member Posts: 228 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    From todays patch notes:
    Players may need to re-slot their Bridge Officers and/or Bridge Officer abilities.
    An issue was resolved that erroneously granted some players an extra Bridge Officer ability.

    My stomach is clear and my mind is full of bacon!
  • Options
    criminiuscriminius Member Posts: 184 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    Ever since I quit this game my IQ has gone up. I still read this forum, but the damage is not as great.
  • Options
    brandonflbrandonfl Member Posts: 892
    edited November 2012
    I think the patch notes are making me nervous. Was Cryptic attacking 1 specific bug that only allowed 1 extra BOFF, or did they tackle the "Wow, I have 72 BOFF abilities in my power list" bug?

    I never tried it myself, but have seen the results in screenshots and in gameplay.
    LOLSTO
  • Options
    virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    brandonfl wrote: »
    I think the patch notes are making me nervous. Was Cryptic attacking 1 specific bug that only allowed 1 extra BOFF, or did they tackle the "Wow, I have 72 BOFF abilities in my power list" bug?

    I never tried it myself, but have seen the results in screenshots and in gameplay.

    It's only a 633MB patch...so...they might have missed that. With it extended until x:45... if it's not extended again, we'll probably see shortly. They've already asked that folks let them know if things are still broken (er, you know - not as if they should know this - but sure, we can let them know)...
  • Options
    bitemepwebitemepwe Member Posts: 6,760 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    criminius wrote: »
    Ever since I quit this game my IQ has gone up. I still read this forum, but the damage is not as great.

    Oh Kahless, I'm doomed.

    what we talking about again? oh look, something shiny........:P
    Leonard Nimoy, Spock.....:(

    R.I.P
  • Options
    virusdancervirusdancer Member Posts: 18,687 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    bitemepwe wrote: »
    Oh Kahless, I'm doomed.

    what we talking about again? oh look, something shiny........:P

    I saw something shiny - but it turned out that it would take 40 hours before I could even see what it was...and then, I'd have to wait even longer to get it.

    Now I'm not so sure it was shiny...
  • Options
    upyournacelles2upyournacelles2 Member Posts: 197 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    bitemepwe wrote: »
    Oh Kahless, I'm doomed.

    what we talking about again? oh look, something shiny........:P

    Lol...you should be alrig....SQUIRREL! *chases squirrel*
Sign In or Register to comment.