test content
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Options

A perspective from our fleet members

2

Comments

  • Options
    larouche55larouche55 Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    syberghost wrote: »
    But, there is. If you have to play more to get them, and you want them, you'll pay for things that make this extra play more convenient for you, such as consumables and better ships.

    Further, by making progression take longer, at least some of the audience will stick around longer before they reach the post-progression burnout.

    Fair enough, I was thinking more along the lines of the direct relationship of say zen for fleet marks. The time issue is absolutely valid. I think they just took it a step too far with how much time is required now, even at a lower tier. It'll be interesting to see how long it takes for burnout to kick in under the newer levels.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Options
    duaths1duaths1 Member Posts: 1,232 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    larouche55 wrote: »
    Fair enough, I was thinking more along the lines of the direct relationship of say zen for fleet marks. The time issue is absolutely valid. I think they just took it a step too far with how much time is required now, even at a lower tier. It'll be interesting to see how long it takes for burnout to kick in under the newer levels.

    He, just talking with a fleet pal from our 2 man fleet - we are going back to Dill and EC grinding gangnam style, waiting for foundry to be available and roleplaying..

    Both having KHG MK XI and XII on our mains, so...
  • Options
    momawmomaw Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    We have a small fleet. Our starbase has effectively stopped. Nobody wants to spend dil on it because we're all trying to stockpile dil against the costs of high level gear from reputation stores. We have hundreds of marks that we can't spend, not enough time to max out our dil, and the impending threat of massive personal costs. There's also the problem that the private queue system isn't working, so it becomes a lot harder to coordinate because we can't do anything cross-faction.
  • Options
    aelfwin1aelfwin1 Member Posts: 2,896 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    Don't complain about having your earnings potential stripped away - you were exploiting a failure in their system. Which they have now fixed. You're wasting your time complaining about that, and not acknowledging that it was a long-overdue FIX just smacks of entitlement and greed.

    Aaaand can you please tell me why it took them about a year to fix that ?
    What does that smack of , hmmm ?

    Here's a point that you may have trouble understanding :

    - Once you do something enough times , you become accustomed to it .
    Be that clicky missions , be that STF's , be that whatever YOUR routine is .

    Some ppl react badly to change .
    Some react VERY badly to change .

    Aaaand according to what happened in the first 24 hours of Season 7 ... , well if you followed the rocus on the Forums & Ingame chat channels , or if you looked at the empty STF queues ... -- well there you have your answer to how ppl react when you Really upset them .

    I myself have logged in once since S.7 hit .
    Not much interest ... , and right now I'm tempted to just say "See you in Season 8" and go do other stuff .
    And (sadly) , I know that I am soooo not lone in this feeling .

    Proud STF-er , "elitist" Real 1000 day Vet , signing off . :P
  • Options
    darramouss1darramouss1 Member Posts: 1,811 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    aelfwin1 wrote: »
    Aaaand according to what happened in the first 24 hours of Season 7 ... , well if you followed the rocus on the Forums & Ingame chat channels , or if you looked at the empty STF queues ... -- well there you have your answer to how ppl react when you Really upset them .

    I've found that every queue I've gone in for I've had to wait no longer than a minute. For me, that was the same as before. Aaaaaand now there are more queued missions.

    I just think the naysayers are louder than everyone else making them seem a larger group than what they are.
  • Options
    nicha0nicha0 Member Posts: 1,456 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I've found that every queue I've gone in for I've had to wait no longer than a minute. For me, that was the same as before. Aaaaaand now there are more queued missions.

    I just think the naysayers are louder than everyone else making them seem a larger group than what they are.

    Well this thread is about how the members of my fleet feels, not everyone else.
    I have not heard much in the way of positives other than the graphics of New Romulus. Actually other than New Romulus's graphics there have been no positives, I've been hit with numerous mails, PMs and fleet chat full of negativity and these are the non-vocal. This invalidates your theory, I guess.
    Delirium Tremens
    Completed Starbase, Embassy, Mine, Spire and No Win Scenario
    Nothing to do anymore.
    http://dtfleet.com/
    Visit our Youtube channel
  • Options
    aelfwin1aelfwin1 Member Posts: 2,896 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I think, however, that a lot of players are trying to get that value by trying to steer the game in directions it's just not going to go.

    If I'm not mistaken , "a lot of players" have asked for "value" for almost 3 years and have been met with excuses and promises .
    You are taking a magnifying lens to the clicky missions and the B'Tran thing and hold them up as "trophy" that signify where "the players went wrong" -- because you presume that you have some sort of higher MORAL standards ???

    How about the "STO is not going F2P" , or the "Two Full Factions" or the other promises & lies over the years from Cryptic ?
    How about The Year of Hell ?
    How about 2 new PVP maps in 3 years ?
    How about releasing the Foundry tool with ZERO tutorial as to how to use it ?
    How about using the playerbase as your own personal QA team on Tribble and then IGNORING the incoming feedback time and time and time again ?

    Just who the heck do you think you are defending here ?
    Saints & Co. ?

    YOU THINK THE PLAYERS ARE "BAD" ???
    TRY THE COMPANY ... .
  • Options
    izdubar6izdubar6 Member Posts: 38 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    nicha0 wrote: »
    Well this thread is about how the members of my fleet feels, not everyone else.
    I have not heard much in the way of positives other than the graphics of New Romulus. Actually other than New Romulus's graphics there have been no positives, I've been hit with numerous mails, PMs and fleet chat full of negativity and these are the non-vocal. This invalidates your theory, I guess.

    Ignore the elitist fanboys. They're the worst kind of "fans" a game company can have.
  • Options
    darramouss1darramouss1 Member Posts: 1,811 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    aelfwin1 wrote: »
    Just who the heck do you think you are defending here ?
    Saints & Co. ?

    I'm not defending anyone else but my opinion. Everyone else seems to be doing it. Far more aggressively than I am, by the way. Why, do you think I don't have the right to?
  • Options
    admiralq1732admiralq1732 Member Posts: 1,560 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I'm not defending anyone else but my opinion. Everyone else seems to be doing it. Far more aggressively than I am, by the way. Why, do you think I don't have the right to?

    well that's how you're coming off. You seem to be finding some way to defend these actions by the company. I was willing to spend hours and hours worth of time doing STFs for dilithioum and the gear to either use or sell. 95% of the players dislike S7 for one reason or another. THAT HAS TO BE ADDRESSED.
  • Options
    syberghostsyberghost Member Posts: 1,711 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    well that's how you're coming off. You seem to be finding some way to defend these actions by the company. I was willing to spend hours and hours worth of time doing STFs for dilithioum and the gear to either use or sell. 95% of the players dislike S7 for one reason or another. THAT HAS TO BE ADDRESSED.

    No, that doesn't necessarily follow. People always want things to be easier, and dislike things that are harder, but that doesn't mean doing what they say improves the health of the game.

    Replacing big payoffs with little ones is often better for reducing churn than the opposite, as long as it feels like SOME reward is coming. It can in fact improve profits, as people who have to play longer to get the rewards often spend more money on conveniences such as consumables and minor combat improvements.
    Former moderator of these forums. Lifetime sub since before launch. Been here since before public betas. Foundry author of "Franklin Drake Must Die".
  • Options
    crusader2007crusader2007 Member Posts: 1,865 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I'm ready for my second job...grinding here I go....

    I agree with the original content on this forum....this game is getting to be a drag...who needs more grinding....countless grinding...STO where no one has grinded that much before

    Keep it up and it will be a lonesome MMO:mad:
    DUwNP.gif

  • Options
    admiralandyadmiralandy Member Posts: 189 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I'm not defending anyone else but my opinion. Everyone else seems to be doing it. Far more aggressively than I am, by the way. Why, do you think I don't have the right to?

    To be honest you sound like you a forum ninja who works for Cryptic and comes in to derail the 'naysayers'

    Is there anything about Season 7 you don't like?

    Overall there are some positives but if you don't get how Cryptics actions have infuriated players you either are working for Cryptic or don't understand people very well.

    Its quite simple people feel they had more in season 6, now they have less.

    One of the biggest impacts for me is the slow way of gaining fleet marks something I think needs to be redressed.
  • Options
    sussethraisussethrai Member Posts: 137 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    Admiralandy, I thought it was just me noticing the same 2-3 posters showing up in any critical thread to vehemently defend "You iz all just whinybabbies and S7 iz teh bestest and it's all working az planned and WHARRRGARRRBLE."

    My small fleet (about 15 active, plus friends in other fleets who work with us) knew that we were going to hit a big slowdown once Tier 3 on the starbase went active, just due to the huge resource sink. Unfortunately that coincided with the release of S7, and the removal of many time effective ways to accrue dil, marks, and anything else needed to build the base. Our progress is at a standstill, not least because we have to grind for several hours a day to make our 8000 dil and/or 120 fleet marks. It's not fun anymore.

    If Cryptic/PW wanted to increase our participation with the new barriers, they have shot themselves in the foot. All our people have lives outside STO, and the new content, while pretty, isn't enough to keep us clicking the rat feed bar.
    "Susse-thrai" had been the name bestowed upon her, half in anger, half in affection, by her old crew on Bloodwing; the keen-nosed, cranky, wily old she-beast, never less dangerous than when you thought her defenseless, and always growing new teeth far back in her throat to replace the old ones broken in biting out the last foe's heart.
    Romulans: left one homeworld, lost another, third time's the charm?
  • Options
    bareelbareel Member Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I'm not defending anyone else but my opinion. Everyone else seems to be doing it. Far more aggressively than I am, by the way. Why, do you think I don't have the right to?

    When you attempt to tell someone that their opinion is invalid and then proceed to explain to them why that is they tend to get aggressive.

    Hence why I do not like to talk of opinions, only facts.

    Fact: Several key customer demographics have been negatively impacted by season 7's changes and new direction. These include but are not limited to...

    Casual Players with little time or resources who wish to progress
    Fleets with casual players
    Gamblers, or those who enjoy the thrill of the random loot drop
    Zen sellers, as the market value is going down
    Grinders, as they now have to stare at a progress bar they cannot effect

    Cryptic, as revenue decreases
  • Options
    eisenw0lfeisenw0lf Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    Grinding Fleetmarks has become a total nightmare, especially for KDF. Its playerbase is almost nonexistant when in comes to Fleetactions. Queues for FM-PvE are almost always empty in my timezone. The only small chance to see enough players for a game to start is during the daily Fleetmarkevents and this is not even remotely enough to fill the demand of Starbaseprojects.

    And don't even mention Nukara. 6 Marks for a medium mission? This is ridiculous.
  • Options
    tancrediivtancrediiv Member Posts: 728 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    Original Poster, you could not possibly be more succinctly correct in your post and I am in full agreement. I put my hours in with my employer. I play this game for fun. I want to get back to flying my ship, kicking posteriors on the ground, and playing the game with my fleet mates. Stop the grind and charge fair market prices for items and services.

    Player and forumite formerly known as FEELTHETHUNDER

    Expatriot Might Characters in EXILE
  • Options
    admiralq1732admiralq1732 Member Posts: 1,560 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    syberghost wrote: »
    No, that doesn't necessarily follow. People always want things to be easier, and dislike things that are harder, but that doesn't mean doing what they say improves the health of the game.

    Replacing big payoffs with little ones is often better for reducing churn than the opposite, as long as it feels like SOME reward is coming. It can in fact improve profits, as people who have to play longer to get the rewards often spend more money on conveniences such as consumables and minor combat improvements.

    how ever they have failed in even making the changes effective. I heard of Stf being nerf in dilithium but the said there would be more ways to get it. I was fine with that but eliminating the STF reward and ONLY have it in FA wasn't it. face it, they LIED to us and don't listen to what content we want.
  • Options
    jellico1jellico1 Member Posts: 2,719
    edited November 2012
    I agree with the OP

    Also my Dil earnings from stfs has been cut over
    66% , selling the Borg salvage with the mission Dil payoff
    Gave me my dill quota I'n no time

    That left me time to help fleetembers with problems
    Answering questions helping them level up or do story
    Missions with them.I had time to pvp and try out outlandish
    Builds you know fun stuff.

    Now I need to grind out things I don't see as fun to
    Keep my character progressing

    When our fleet does a STF and completes it
    They say, ( That's it ? ) no loot drop

    Winning a STF seems hollow now before it was
    What did you get ? Everyone was excited, now it's silenc

    Now it feels like a grind not like a accomplishment

    If it's not fun they won't play
    That's a fact Jack
    Jellico....Engineer ground.....Da'val Romulan space Sci
    Saphire.. Science ground......Ko'el Romulan space Tac
    Leva........Tactical ground.....Koj Romulan space Eng

    JJ-Verse will never be Canon or considered Lore...It will always be JJ-Verse
  • Options
    darramouss1darramouss1 Member Posts: 1,811 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    To be honest you sound like you a forum ninja who works for Cryptic and comes in to derail the 'naysayers'

    Is there anything about Season 7 you don't like?

    Overall there are some positives but if you don't get how Cryptics actions have infuriated players you either are working for Cryptic or don't understand people very well.

    Its quite simple people feel they had more in season 6, now they have less.

    One of the biggest impacts for me is the slow way of gaining fleet marks something I think needs to be redressed.

    Do I work for cryptic? No. I'm a photographer and I work for myself. Are there things I don't like? Yes, I think it's very hard to get fleet marks. That being said, I understand that no MMO is ever going to to be perfect to the point where it pleases me 100% let alone an entire gaming community.

    I think I understand people pretty well. I understand that people don't like and can resist change. I also understand that people don't like it when things are made a little more difficult. Additionally, I understand that people can look over positives because they can get hung up on the negatives.

    People may think they have less now, but are people taking in to consideration the fact that there are new sets, new captain abilities/powers, new missions, new sector space in addition to new gameplay systems or are they just looking at the now with no consideration for the bigger picture?

    I don't work for cryptic, nor do I support everything they do, but I do think they did a good job. That's my opinion. I won't tell others they're wrong. I do wish people would give it a go, though. A fair go.
  • Options
    endafreshendafresh Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I understand where most players are coming from.
    Here is how I'm interpreting it as from a game developer perspective.
    Whiny little brats, they want everything spoon-fed to them. Don't they know how damn expensive it is to create new content, and voiced content at that! Nimoy's bills alone eat up more than half our budget and these stupid little ****s want more of that? Really? They should be glad we give them the paid privilege of making new missions for their fellow players. PWE breaks our backs and if we don't comply they'll shut the game down. We gotta play by their rules cause they own us and our company and assets.

    You ****ing Trekkies want a game? You want STO to continue? Quit yer ******** and either pay up or leave. More will replace you.

    I don't doubt for a minute that at least some of that in quotes was spoken or implied in the development mentality behind this season 7 update.

    They don't respect the players, that much is obvious.

    They don't respect their SUBSCRIBERS, terribad mistake. I looked at the 'features matrix' and I'm shocked that the gold subscribers haven't been more vocal about paying $15/month to have less features than prior to the F2P launch. The mere fact that they still require even subscribers to buy from the cash shop to unlock certain features like increased bank/inventory is just ridiculous!

    So here's the deal. They need money and this has been their attempt to get more money. Either you pay with money or time, that's the deal. That's what they've said in their dev diaries about the role of dil in the economy. More dil = you spent more time.

    Dil wasn't ever meant to be reliably 'farmable' in such insane quantities as it has been previously. They were actually a little too generous and they had to tighten the belt.

    Yes it SUCKS, a lot. But instead of f2p players throwing tantrums like 5 year olds cause the lollipop was taken away, grow up and deal with it. Pay with money or time, voice your concerns, but your whining will fall on deaf ears.

    Oh right, the 'concessions'? LOL. Heavily nerfed the dil gains from easier content (SB24) to give a pittance of dil at your end-game STFs. Works for them, not for you, suckers :P

    I hope people don't quit just cause it isn't 'easy mode' anymore. It is only a 2nd job if you make it that way. Play a little bit each day and enjoy your incremental progress. Having random drops of 1% or w/e is still worse than being able to grind reputation to actually earn it. Perhaps at least dropping some 'junk' items that can be vendored would help out?

    Be glad it ain't worse. Be glad they haven't *censored* so that you have to farm drops from *censored* just to *censored* to add in even more steps for *censored*. Censoring so they don't get any bright ideas :P
  • Options
    admiralq1732admiralq1732 Member Posts: 1,560 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    dude it's also the bloody cost for things now. look at the cost for some base projects. Yes subs should get more goodies for being subs but come on with the dilithium. face it right now we are over grinded. And note many subs are leaving due to S7 so it isn't just we F2Pers who have problems.
  • Options
    slurmerslurmer Member Posts: 62 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I think the season 7 changes have allowed players to see how shallow this game is and I'm not sure even changing it back would fix the problem.

    My logged on time has gone down 80% and when I am on I don't see many friends on either, we used to get 2 lots of stfs running at the same time in our fleet, now there's a struggle to get another player...

    I'm reading about similar occurrences .....it does not bode well for our game and the devs livelihood....

    *count down to self destruct*....

    I feel sorry for my fleet mates that just bought lifetime subs....
  • Options
    megacharge07megacharge07 Member Posts: 476 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I also agree with the OP, he has summed it up accurately.

    I'm so glad I didn't buy the lifetime sub. *phew*
    tumblr_mt0cmzAQpC1rm3hhlo2_500.gif
  • Options
    kara445kara445 Member Posts: 96 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I'm agree with the OP too, i wish can tell my feeling about what they do but my english is not so good.

    I'm a gold member I support this game since the closed beta, i pay every month because i though this game and all people who work on this game deserved it.

    But what they do now it just show to us what they want, it's not the game, it's not a deal between us and them like we do everything for you enjoy it and you support us. No it just about money and nothing more.

    This season make me think about all the promise we had, like my favourite : the shop will be only for cosmetic stuff.

    Yes that true this season is not fun, a lot of good idea and beautiful thing but when i see i will have to do every day and many time per day the same thing for win just a little bit i can't, that should be a game not a work.


    What make me the most angry is when i see as a gold member i have the same problem and the same need too pay more than the free member.
  • Options
    xsharpexxsharpex Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    it's very nice that some people are enjoying what season 7 has to offer. that's fine and dandy, however, it does not give them or anyone else the right to dismiss the growing dissent among the game's population. you might be happy not, but how happy will you be when this game becomes Star Trek Offline?

    Most of us fight and argue because we truly love playing this game and want it to survive. We don't ***** and moan to hear ourselves speak, but are fighting for a cause that we would like to see rectified. Klingons not getting a fair shake not your cause, no problem. PVP inbalance not your cause, no problem. Just don't fight us every step of the way, because it doesn't affect you. You have your opinions and we have ours. We're fighting to improve aspects of this game. What are you fighting for?
  • Options
    chicochavezchicochavez Member Posts: 115 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    I keep hearing about people having trouble with a lack of Fleet Marks and I need to ask; Are you folks running the commendation reports at your Starbase? I don't know if your fleet mates have hit rank 4 in any Doff xp categories, but I've been doing pretty good spending the extra CXP for fleet marks. Once you have most categories maxed out and the doffs busy you should be able to net 300 or 400 marks a week if not more just from that, and that's not counting critting any of those assignments.

    As for the OP I can understand what you're feeling. Personally my big issue is the length of the timers on the reputation projects, but that's a whole other story. In your situation it might just be a matter of saying "TRIBBLE it" and ignore the reputation projects and starbase, or at least not be too concerned about them, and go have fun. I know the best time I've had in a while was getting 4 of my fleet mates together and running around Defera with swords making like Zerglings and tearing apart all the Borg through the city area. If you think what Cryptic is making you do is a grind just go and make your own fun. It's obvious dil is going to be harder to come by now (which makes me kind of wonder about this game's financials) so it might be a matter of finding the new normal and finding our own pockets of fun in this universe.
    Play Star Trek: Allegiance - my first series in the Foundry
  • Options
    rachel1018rachel1018 Member Posts: 75 Arc User
    edited November 2012
    Dead on, it's become another job. In the past I had enough fun I had to set an alarm to remember to go to bed and not keep playing all night, but now even the STFs I used to lose myself in feel like work. Why?

    Because rewards from them have been significantly reduced as there is absolutely 0 chance of picking up any form of upgrade or chunk of extra dilithium

    Because 4/5 of my Fleet feel it's become too much grind as well and aren't spending more than an hour online now, assuming they log on at all

    Because many of use are tired of being ignored over the years. Yes, we wanted to have the loot system changed. We even specifically told you that we wanted to move those salvage and tech drops to group rolls, but instead we get a time gated rep system that costs us quite a bit to open..... not to mention those hundreds to thousands of runs you've already done don't count toward this new system

    Those were all S7 changes. THOSE are why fleets are withering already, not the dilithium changes, thought they certainly didn't help. But all the defenders want to see and poke at is the anger over the dilithium changes, which tells me many of them probably aren't happy with the rest so they cling to the one set of changes they feel strongly in favor of.
Sign In or Register to comment.