Maximised Starbases
Making LOTS of new friends
Playing MISSIONS from the foundry
playing missions with friends
Advanced (Equal) PVP where skill counts over MONEY
never having to spend 300 hours repeating a STF trying to get a stupid ENGINE part
No "economy"
No scams no more griefing
Starfleet is not the ferengi alliance you know
they don't say "im sorry Captain we can't let you have a new shuttle because you didn't earn 40,000 EC this week"
and no more me, because this would be the worlds most bland, boring, "hey we all look alike and now have the exact same play style" game in the existence of games.
Sollvax doesn't want to play Star Trek Online, he wants to play Stepford Trek Online.
A Miranda at level 4 does not Do STFS
it does fleet alert most likely
or blockade
DPS means JACK in there (blockade)
He should be concentrating fire on Torps , warheads , fighters
stuff he CAN clear
and leave the big stuff to the big ships
A heavily armed pvp spec defiant is about as much use in blockade as a PVE speced Science ship in a 5-1 PVP
I didn't see any torps, warheads, or fighters. Either I was in the wrong place, or someone took them out before me. I'm not too skilled, and you expect me to be able to track down these torps on a huge map in a miranda. While being shot at. By dreadnaughts.
anytime you want some practice and need someone with bigger guns to run cover (assuming im online which im not at the minute due to a slow connection today) I'll happily fly with you
#2 until people allow Cruisers and beams in STFS without throwing a wobbly we need to do away with DPS
#3 Several in my case (Dozens better at one thing or another a few better at everything)
#4 Here people believe its rarity (it isn't)
its horses for courses
a spread of ordinary photons beats a tricobalt if you are clearing mines
A phaser beats plasma weapons against most pvp speced ships etc
#5 you are thinking PVP which won't exist soon anyway with the current situation (my assessment only don't panic)
#6 try this one "one word too many , one freedom too far and democracy becomes anarchy"
Which admittedly is a former and slightly MAD head of the FBI
#1 That wasn't clear and so now my Phaser Sniper Rifle, Plasma Pulsewaves become Phaser Stun Pistol and Phaser Stun Pistol... Sounds awesome
#2 I fly a Beam Boat Sovereign Cruiser in E-STF and nobody ever throws a wobbly, I still get the optional. I didn't even bring up DPS, I was criticising the removal of choices.
#3 Well we agree on something, Several are better than me too.
#4 A Tricobalts AOE is as effective on Mines as a Torpedo Spread, although I would consider both a waste of a long cooldown. Under your everything the same policy there would be no Tricobalts but.
#5 I'm not thinking PVP, Ping effects every aspect of an Online game. I'm not in America so my lag is worse than most.
#6 Why are we talking about Democracy? There is no Democracy in STO. I was badly misquoting the guy who quotes and miscredits Picard.
You love to bring issues that aren't here into the discussion.
I've read an example above of a low level player who feels bad joining something that he thought was for everyone and finding out it's not. I hope the others didn't abuse him about it. Being thrown into content your not ready for is not fun. Normalising everybody up to MK 12 gear doesn't help if you don't have the other resources to back it up.
It would be fairer to blandise* the lowbies into T5 equivalents of their ships with a preset BOFF layouts, this of course would be confusing to suddenly have a new control scheme thrown at you. At the moment it's like entering a race and finding you've been matched to Usain Bolt, your totally outclassed. I don't care if it's an event he's not fond of he's probably going to win, even in a swimming race.
Most people are saying make it more like the Mirror Event, which is balanced and fair for the lower Tier player as the challenge is matched to them for the Tier they are in. Where as the Fleet stuff is only matched to T5. The game doesn't even give you a warning that your ship and gear will be normalised to a T5.
The ground stuff on the other hand, if you have an Exploit and Expose Weapons and a decent kit your fine at any level. As the Normalising works so much better there.
*Blandise a word I just made up, it essentially means removing choices.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001. If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why. When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
Alright, even a lowly Cheyenne or Saber class on a lowbie toon can to a Repulsor Ram attack + engine battery + evasive maneuvers to push enemy raiders more than 10km from the freighter.
So it won't be able to DPS the entire enemy group by itself but it means a low level character and ship can play a decisive role saving a freighter by itself, just like the specialist freighter escort science vessel posted above.
Sure, most Fleet teams will be specced for DPS, max area control and aim to get high scores of 19 and above but sometimes we do get new pilots in just for fun and that's what we have them do - fly specialized roles and leave the DPS to us.
I call that fair.
I am also known to win the map with full power to auxiliary and engines and just spam Tractor Beam Repulsors, torpedo spread and engineering teams on the freighters. Auxiliary to Dampers II to get the whale moving from site to site faster. This too is a non-DPS winning strategy just about anyone above Captain level can pull off.
It is not about DPS or letting low level in there own queue. It is about making it fair. If you are a level 17 and in a level 50 event it is real eay to be taken out. I also did not say anything about the freighters, I am talking about all queues. You never know who you are going to be queued with. I play a crowd control science, when you queue with to low level players and the other two players are not that good you have just waisted my time and theirs. I am fine with failing an event. This happened in a fleet alert by the way.
When a low level character is in the event gear against level 50 enemies they die. Then they get the death penalty. Now they can't help at all. I know with the right group this can be accomplished. But when you are pugging the group you don't know who you are going to get. All I am saying is you should be queued together as similar levels.
I think it's a excellent idea to mix ranks I'n all game play and it is also cannon , when all available ships are called to defend against a enemy even ****tlecraft respond to the call for aid.
What needs to be done is the rewards need to match the new difficulty level and the goal of the mission should be be attainable, rewards should also scale to the player. Rewards should scale to Dps used special powers used ect.
Other games have done this I'n the past this game can do it too
A vice admiral a captian and 3 lieutenants are a more realistic fleet than 5 vice admirals
We would also get more content this way because rank specific content would not have to be created, if handled correctly the game would improve dramatically.
Just so long as YOU'RE the VA right? With the VA ship.. and the VA DPS.. and the VA Boff powers.. and all their loots are belonging to you. The VA.
Your Phaser will be a phaser
So Suppose your team of boffs carry
Main lt com character Phaser pulsewave and Hand phaser Type 2
Tac Lt Phaser minigun
Eng Lt Phaser sniper rifle
Tac Ens Hand phaser
Sci Ens Full auto phaser rifle
Now Each of these guys does damage BY weapon (so the weapon damages remain the same)
But when YOU rank up to commander the WEAPONS rank up with you
so at Ensign and lt they fire as current mk 2
at lt com they fire as mk 4
commander mk 6
captain mk 8
Ra mk 10
VA Mk 12
no replacing all your gear every level
And a Tetryon weapon would do EXACTLY the same damage as the same weapon in plasma (but it would not be plasma damage)
less work , less coding , less grind , less merchanting , less griefing
you would know from minute 1 that ANY VA you worked with had a mk 12 weapon
I agree with the OP, but only in regard to standard PvE events. However, this is because I think lower-level players are generally out-gunned in those, and it is indeed an exercise in frustration for them, not because they have no place or usefulness. Of course, even then, my question would be: how the hell are they supposed to learn otherwise?
That said, I think anything that is fleet-specific (i.e., contain the word "Fleet") should be available to anyone who is a part of a fleet. After all, fleets aren't made up of only VAs and, if they are, they are sort of defeating the purpose, in my opinion. Everyone should be doing his/her job in any group mission and, to be honest, I have seen a lot of "Commanders" and "Captains" do a better job than many VAs, especially when it comes to being a part of a team.
At any rate, if a fleet engages in a "Fleet" mission, they should be allowed to bring in anyone in their fleet, regardless of level.
My two cents' worth...
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge (...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
Your Phaser will be a phaser
So Suppose your team of boffs carry
Main lt com character Phaser pulsewave and Hand phaser Type 2
Tac Lt Phaser minigun
Eng Lt Phaser sniper rifle
Tac Ens Hand phaser
Sci Ens Full auto phaser rifle
Now Each of these guys does damage BY weapon (so the weapon damages remain the same)
But when YOU rank up to commander the WEAPONS rank up with you
so at Ensign and lt they fire as current mk 2
at lt com they fire as mk 4
commander mk 6
captain mk 8
Ra mk 10
VA Mk 12
no replacing all your gear every level
And a Tetryon weapon would do EXACTLY the same damage as the same weapon in plasma (but it would not be plasma damage)
less work , less coding , less grind , less merchanting , less griefing
you would know from minute 1 that ANY VA you worked with had a mk 12 weapon
in space the same would apply
All phasers would be Phasers
and scale
Well that explanation makes a lot more sense with one exception. It's a heck of a lot more coding. Because your changing a system that's already in place with your scaling system.
If you had of said make weapons scale rather than make a phaser a phaser it would have made a lot more sense.
Of course if weapons scale the price of weapons all increases dramatically as they are now all viable at VA level and VA's have a ton of money.
I was once DKnight1000, apparently I had taken my own name so now I'm DKnight0001. If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why. When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
i dont agree with what the OP is saying a decent group of level 50 players should carry some lowbies with no issues
its good that lowbies have equal chance to earn marks and learn about how to play in a high level instance
you could seperate into tiers , and on the face of it sounds good but will result in longer queues possibly .
Maximised Starbases
Making LOTS of new friends
Playing MISSIONS from the foundry
playing missions with friends
Advanced (Equal) PVP where skill counts over MONEY
never having to spend 300 hours repeating a STF trying to get a stupid ENGINE part
No "economy"
No scams no more griefing
Starfleet is not the ferengi alliance you know
they don't say "im sorry Captain we can't let you have a new shuttle because you didn't earn 40,000 EC this week"
shouldn't it read "Making LOTS of new enemies" in your case?
I have very few enemies (and most of the ones I have are only enemies in their own Heads)
Oh its true I oppose maulers (which means for those with limited data "people who form mauler packs and team up on people in pvp for the purpose of robbery or Harrassment " not "people who can win a one on one fight against an average player")
I also oppose "leets" defined as "people who think they are better than everyone else (regardless if they are or not) and use the words "leet" "elite" or "l33t" to show their crime"
And of course I am pretty much at war with a certain fleet of badly dressed harrassment merchants
But then
Maulers in this game few and far between
Elites a handful (less than 5% even on the forum a lot less in game)
and the Griefers?
Well By my best count so far there are about 14 of them
(might be missing a few here and there)
Anyway back on the topic
Weapons would not go up if they scaled
you would go to the Vendor on ESD
and BUY a "hand phaser" for 240 ec
you would NEVER need another one
Ok, this has been bugging me since its inception! Here recently I have entered and fleet event and when I spawn there is a level 10 through whatever level in the same star base defense alert. I have no problem with people having lower level characters, but they should be in their own level map. Today I entered and there was a level 10 escort and a level 27 cruiser captains. The other two participants to include myself were level 50. The map was level 50. This is not right in many ways. First off the two lower level contestants are fighting enemies stronger than they are. Second, it makes the other people angry when they cannot make up the lack of DPS or skill that should have been there with other level 50s. I suggest capping the events with level restrictions either by saying they have to be level 40+ to enter, or setting up groups of leveling where 1-19 play together 20-39 play together, and 40 and higher play together. This would be more like the Mirror Universe queue. I would also make sure this would take the ship into question when queued; this would prevent a level 50 captain from enter a queue with a tier 2 ship, something I see a lot now in STFs. Help stop the grieving.
grieving?
I think you may be confusing some of the fleet refits with being low level?
For instance, I have in our fleet a great escort pilot, who has a Tier 2, Fleet Refit escort, that has been buffed to be T5. It looks like like the T2 ship that a LTC gets. no different. Could you be mistaking some of those? and the Cruisers are T3 ships that have been refitted to be t5. I own one, good freaking little ship...
Myself I have done the fleet defense with some lower teir ships. Heck was most fun I had in a while. Good folks, jsut trying to enjoy a game like we are.
thing is, grievers will still grieve. Be it in a T2, t3, t4 or a T5 vessel. Place them on ignore and move on.
I see a lower level, usually a Lt. on average of every 5 matches I play. No they are not using the fleet versions, their level reported is literally shows their original level with the "Matching VA 50".
This game has allot of its mechanics in the BOF and kit powers which are very limiting to new levels. It doesn't matter how good your weapons are or how much HP is, if you cannot engage the full range of abilities, you are not going to make it. In Fleet Alert against Orions, you will be dealing with target subsystems, boarding and tractor beams. That right there to counter can eat up all three BOFF of a miranda, while a VA ship can counter those with Tac Team, Eng Team and PH while having plenty to spare for damage boosts, heals and/or crowd control.
An interesting point, but if you ever pay attention in the FED mirror event (VA), those Mirandas actually have more abilities than what a player has. I've seen them use EPtS, EPtE and extended shields. That should lay some hint that unless ships can use higher ranked abilities and multiple of them, they cannot function well with VAs.
Ground isn't as bad, but it still causes issues not to have decent kit abilities. An engineer will not have decent support tools like gens or weapon malfunction, sciences will have very limited heal or very limited control and tacticals will have only a small boost to damage.
You have to keep in mind the NPCs that are used in these events were designed with a VA layout in mind; you cannot toss in a lower level and adjust their DPS/Hull to match an unbuffed VA and expect it to work. This is exactly why the mirror event is tier; to provide to appropiet challenge and reasonable chance of victory to the players.
Comments
and no more me, because this would be the worlds most bland, boring, "hey we all look alike and now have the exact same play style" game in the existence of games.
Sollvax doesn't want to play Star Trek Online, he wants to play Stepford Trek Online.
Not that anyone will get the reference.
I didn't see any torps, warheads, or fighters. Either I was in the wrong place, or someone took them out before me. I'm not too skilled, and you expect me to be able to track down these torps on a huge map in a miranda. While being shot at. By dreadnaughts.
Sounds legit.
Fair warning I fly cruisers
#1 That wasn't clear and so now my Phaser Sniper Rifle, Plasma Pulsewaves become Phaser Stun Pistol and Phaser Stun Pistol... Sounds awesome
#2 I fly a Beam Boat Sovereign Cruiser in E-STF and nobody ever throws a wobbly, I still get the optional. I didn't even bring up DPS, I was criticising the removal of choices.
#3 Well we agree on something, Several are better than me too.
#4 A Tricobalts AOE is as effective on Mines as a Torpedo Spread, although I would consider both a waste of a long cooldown. Under your everything the same policy there would be no Tricobalts but.
#5 I'm not thinking PVP, Ping effects every aspect of an Online game. I'm not in America so my lag is worse than most.
#6 Why are we talking about Democracy? There is no Democracy in STO. I was badly misquoting the guy who quotes and miscredits Picard.
You love to bring issues that aren't here into the discussion.
I've read an example above of a low level player who feels bad joining something that he thought was for everyone and finding out it's not. I hope the others didn't abuse him about it. Being thrown into content your not ready for is not fun. Normalising everybody up to MK 12 gear doesn't help if you don't have the other resources to back it up.
It would be fairer to blandise* the lowbies into T5 equivalents of their ships with a preset BOFF layouts, this of course would be confusing to suddenly have a new control scheme thrown at you. At the moment it's like entering a race and finding you've been matched to Usain Bolt, your totally outclassed. I don't care if it's an event he's not fond of he's probably going to win, even in a swimming race.
Most people are saying make it more like the Mirror Event, which is balanced and fair for the lower Tier player as the challenge is matched to them for the Tier they are in. Where as the Fleet stuff is only matched to T5. The game doesn't even give you a warning that your ship and gear will be normalised to a T5.
The ground stuff on the other hand, if you have an Exploit and Expose Weapons and a decent kit your fine at any level. As the Normalising works so much better there.
*Blandise a word I just made up, it essentially means removing choices.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
It is not about DPS or letting low level in there own queue. It is about making it fair. If you are a level 17 and in a level 50 event it is real eay to be taken out. I also did not say anything about the freighters, I am talking about all queues. You never know who you are going to be queued with. I play a crowd control science, when you queue with to low level players and the other two players are not that good you have just waisted my time and theirs. I am fine with failing an event. This happened in a fleet alert by the way.
When a low level character is in the event gear against level 50 enemies they die. Then they get the death penalty. Now they can't help at all. I know with the right group this can be accomplished. But when you are pugging the group you don't know who you are going to get. All I am saying is you should be queued together as similar levels.
At this point, I'm just going to give you the benefit of the doubt and believe your merely trying to stir the puddin' I hope it's bannana.
Just so long as YOU'RE the VA right? With the VA ship.. and the VA DPS.. and the VA Boff powers.. and all their loots are belonging to you. The VA.
Engage fighters, destructible projectiles, frigate-class enemies.
And in between all of that, adding more weapons procs to the mix never hurts. And subsystem targeting for science vessels.
Ok Ground weapons
Your Phaser will be a phaser
So Suppose your team of boffs carry
Main lt com character Phaser pulsewave and Hand phaser Type 2
Tac Lt Phaser minigun
Eng Lt Phaser sniper rifle
Tac Ens Hand phaser
Sci Ens Full auto phaser rifle
Now Each of these guys does damage BY weapon (so the weapon damages remain the same)
But when YOU rank up to commander the WEAPONS rank up with you
so at Ensign and lt they fire as current mk 2
at lt com they fire as mk 4
commander mk 6
captain mk 8
Ra mk 10
VA Mk 12
no replacing all your gear every level
And a Tetryon weapon would do EXACTLY the same damage as the same weapon in plasma (but it would not be plasma damage)
less work , less coding , less grind , less merchanting , less griefing
you would know from minute 1 that ANY VA you worked with had a mk 12 weapon
in space the same would apply
All phasers would be Phasers
and scale
But you don't see a VA with mk 2 phasers in a shuttle anymore
That said, I think anything that is fleet-specific (i.e., contain the word "Fleet") should be available to anyone who is a part of a fleet. After all, fleets aren't made up of only VAs and, if they are, they are sort of defeating the purpose, in my opinion. Everyone should be doing his/her job in any group mission and, to be honest, I have seen a lot of "Commanders" and "Captains" do a better job than many VAs, especially when it comes to being a part of a team.
At any rate, if a fleet engages in a "Fleet" mission, they should be allowed to bring in anyone in their fleet, regardless of level.
My two cents' worth...
Fleet Commander
Caprica's Revenge
(...actually active since November 2010, which may one day be important to archaeologists, but not to anyone else...)
Well that explanation makes a lot more sense with one exception. It's a heck of a lot more coding. Because your changing a system that's already in place with your scaling system.
If you had of said make weapons scale rather than make a phaser a phaser it would have made a lot more sense.
Of course if weapons scale the price of weapons all increases dramatically as they are now all viable at VA level and VA's have a ton of money.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
its good that lowbies have equal chance to earn marks and learn about how to play in a high level instance
you could seperate into tiers , and on the face of it sounds good but will result in longer queues possibly .
shouldn't it read "Making LOTS of new enemies" in your case?
Oh its true I oppose maulers (which means for those with limited data "people who form mauler packs and team up on people in pvp for the purpose of robbery or Harrassment " not "people who can win a one on one fight against an average player")
I also oppose "leets" defined as "people who think they are better than everyone else (regardless if they are or not) and use the words "leet" "elite" or "l33t" to show their crime"
And of course I am pretty much at war with a certain fleet of badly dressed harrassment merchants
But then
Maulers in this game few and far between
Elites a handful (less than 5% even on the forum a lot less in game)
and the Griefers?
Well By my best count so far there are about 14 of them
(might be missing a few here and there)
Anyway back on the topic
Weapons would not go up if they scaled
you would go to the Vendor on ESD
and BUY a "hand phaser" for 240 ec
you would NEVER need another one
grieving?
I think you may be confusing some of the fleet refits with being low level?
For instance, I have in our fleet a great escort pilot, who has a Tier 2, Fleet Refit escort, that has been buffed to be T5. It looks like like the T2 ship that a LTC gets. no different. Could you be mistaking some of those? and the Cruisers are T3 ships that have been refitted to be t5. I own one, good freaking little ship...
Myself I have done the fleet defense with some lower teir ships. Heck was most fun I had in a while. Good folks, jsut trying to enjoy a game like we are.
thing is, grievers will still grieve. Be it in a T2, t3, t4 or a T5 vessel. Place them on ignore and move on.
This game has allot of its mechanics in the BOF and kit powers which are very limiting to new levels. It doesn't matter how good your weapons are or how much HP is, if you cannot engage the full range of abilities, you are not going to make it. In Fleet Alert against Orions, you will be dealing with target subsystems, boarding and tractor beams. That right there to counter can eat up all three BOFF of a miranda, while a VA ship can counter those with Tac Team, Eng Team and PH while having plenty to spare for damage boosts, heals and/or crowd control.
An interesting point, but if you ever pay attention in the FED mirror event (VA), those Mirandas actually have more abilities than what a player has. I've seen them use EPtS, EPtE and extended shields. That should lay some hint that unless ships can use higher ranked abilities and multiple of them, they cannot function well with VAs.
Ground isn't as bad, but it still causes issues not to have decent kit abilities. An engineer will not have decent support tools like gens or weapon malfunction, sciences will have very limited heal or very limited control and tacticals will have only a small boost to damage.
You have to keep in mind the NPCs that are used in these events were designed with a VA layout in mind; you cannot toss in a lower level and adjust their DPS/Hull to match an unbuffed VA and expect it to work. This is exactly why the mirror event is tier; to provide to appropiet challenge and reasonable chance of victory to the players.