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Stop letting lower level players in the same queue as level 50s
simeion1
Member Posts: 898 Arc User
Ok, this has been bugging me since its inception! Here recently I have entered and fleet event and when I spawn there is a level 10 through whatever level in the same star base defense alert. I have no problem with people having lower level characters, but they should be in their own level map. Today I entered and there was a level 10 escort and a level 27 cruiser captains. The other two participants to include myself were level 50. The map was level 50. This is not right in many ways. First off the two lower level contestants are fighting enemies stronger than they are. Second, it makes the other people angry when they cannot make up the lack of DPS or skill that should have been there with other level 50s. I suggest capping the events with level restrictions either by saying they have to be level 40+ to enter, or setting up groups of leveling where 1-19 play together 20-39 play together, and 40 and higher play together. This would be more like the Mirror Universe queue. I would also make sure this would take the ship into question when queued; this would prevent a level 50 captain from enter a queue with a tier 2 ship, something I see a lot now in STFs. Help stop the grieving.
Post edited by simeion1 on
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This may be the first post of it's kind that I actually agree with. Frankly from a newer player's perspective it can be daunting and intimidating to have the same thing happen. I know I've accidentally joined some groups like this when on lower or even higher level chars. For me it's usually been when trying to find patrol missions to do for my lower chars and I zone in to find I'm grouped with someone else that never even talks. Now if it's a patrol mission I don't know I never even take them as I don't want to wind up TRIBBLE things up for someone else and admittedly I'm a bit antisocial. Putting level caps as in other games would be a good thing for them to do.
it needs to vanish forever from stats
its used to justify discrimination and outright hatred (often of better players)
If Starbase defence was level cap queued no one over Captain would EVER get to play it (not enough VA's queue)
Take your "Good intentions" somewhere else and stay on topic.
OP has presented a very valid point regarding map instance assignment.
IMO Private queues should have no level cap, while public (PUG) ones that rely on same-level and max DPS should be level gated in the interest of fairness.
This will prevent the 20-man starbase defence mission from having a dozen low tier ships and players in a level 50 map and we all know how comical / frustrating it is listening to a Galaxy-R captain talk about tanking an entire fleet of Orion warships by himself.
The rest of the game's queues are level gated and if it ain't broke, Cryptic shouldn't have tried to "make things better".
My Youtube Channel
At least the public ques should be sticked to tires.
that is the topic he used DPS to justify blocking people
in your view
id say the exact opposite
.
He should have no difficulty doing so if the escorts are doing their job and escorting
But the Starbase defence would NEVER launch if it was VA only (there aren't enough VA's who run this mission)
the rest of the events do not have "fleet " in them
I very rarely get lower level characters in the instances I run and get into the map within a couple of minutes of queueing, even in the morning GMT when there's a lot less people on line. TBH I don't recall seeing more than one or two lower tiers in any of the Defence missions I've run and I used to run it a lot so I fail to see how level locking it will prevent VAs from running the instance.
I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this
I run starbase defence ONLY with ranks over Admiral mainly because its not nice to show up in a gun fight with a knife
I have NEVER seen more than 5 VA's in the same event
now maybe some people are getting better results but I doubt it
As to the others
well at Captain fleet alert and blockade are doable (and its quite easy to get maximum marks as a captain)
Incursion can be run at any level /rank and is where the lowbies belong and should be allowed and welcomed
fleet alert with fleet members is also ok for lts and lt com
id avoid blockade if you are an escort below Captain
Sci ships and cruisers can cope if they remember its protection detail and DPS means less than nothing
Sollvax, as usual, brought up his point of view and solution, that obviously would benefit him the most, since he is literaly flying a 0 DPS cruiser.
myself i can only support the idea of level caped instances (41-50 seems reasonable), even if it killed the queues in lower ranks...because let's face it...the waiting times would get very long for lower tiers.
So in my opinion, to compensate for the fleet mark loss, lower levels should get fleet marks for comleteing patrol missions, story missions. I mean, if you finished a story mission the first time you get fleet marks...the second time not. By the time they played through all the story missions they accumulated gameplay experiance and know their ships and abilitys better and have reached VA.
season 6 was poorly implemeted and needs some major adjustments, some have been made already (Doff being exchangeable for lower tier doffs, made grinding for common doffs very easy) but there are still many issues with fleet events and the painfully little rewards you get from them. Lets be honest, by now, would anybody still do fleet events if there was any other possibility to get fleet marks?
and every time someone worships DPS a good man dies for it
challenge accepted!:D
oh holy DPS, hallowed be thy high numbers...and so on.
repeat x 10000000 :P
just think about it. it is hard enough to get 4 other ppl for STFs (not even elites, just normals) that know what to do, and have decent (not good) builds. now this times five, equals chaos
10k DPS Vesta threads: 1; 2
Okay, so let's talk about the ability of a Lt. Commander to contribute in terms of Crowd Control, Buffing, Debuffing, Tanking or Healing instead of talking about their ability to contribute DPS in space combat.
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They can't contribute much, can they? The ship doesn't have the BOff abilities. As a matter of fact, with their damage tuned up from level matching, unbuffed DPS is probably where a Lt. Commander will come closest to a VA. They still won't get near it, but they'll get nearer to it than they will for something like Crowd Control (is there even a good CC power available as a Lt BOff ability?).
I don't leave the instance when I see a lower level, I don't resent them for being there (they have every right to be) and I would prefer a lower level player with brains than an idiot VA. But all players being equal, Lt. Commanders, Commanders and even Captains are going to offer a lot less to a mission than a RA or VA, especially in space, even with Level matching. It's purely a product of game-design.
I'm fairly sure you yourself said that you wouldn't queue for Blockade at a lower rank than Captain? That's nothing to do with DPS since you don't believe in it as a measure of a player's contribution (despite the game design favouring it in the majority of its team-based missions), and also Blockade is one of the few missions that isn't DPS-centric. It's because you know you don't have the BOff slots to contribute properly.
Now that said, segregating them completely by rank will kill the queues below level 50. The queues for everything below 50 are undermanned (except Mirror Universe, and that's because people use it to power level). And I wouldn't bar players below level 50 from doing them. There's precious little for them to do that counts as team-play as it is without taking these away from them.
I think that each Starbase mission should have a queue that covers Lieutentant up to Commander (auto level matches to level 29) with the difficulty accounting for the fact that no one has access to Commander level BOff abilities, and then the existing queue covers Captain up to VA (auto matches to 50).
some people think it means "escort tac VA DPS over 1,000,000 "
DPS shall not be spoken about again this post.
Consider this challenge, two players, both VA with the same skill point allocation, both of about the same skill.
Having a Dual in Cruisers. One has a T5 Cruiser but will only be equipping 2 weapons fore and 2 weapons aft. The other a T2 Cruiser with 2 weapons fore and 2 weapons aft.
They are using stock white Mk IX gear from the vendor in ESD ship yard to equip the ships.
In the battle the ships have been normalised so they both have the same hull.
Who wins? The Tier 5 of course, he has more BOFFs, he can do more things than his opponent.
Now let's look at what Cryptic did for the Fleet Events. They needed to run a balance on say Blockade 4 times. Once for Fed enemies, once for Gorn, Klingon, Orion. The NPC's are level 52 and geared as such.
Now Compare to the Mirror Event Balanced 5 times, 1-9, 10-19, 20-29, 30-39, 40 - 50. The Mirror Event is fairer because instead of simply upranking everybody to L50 it was balanced for their Tier. Now if Blockade was balanced the same way. Well that's 18 balances that would have been needed (15 Fed, 3 KDF) rather than the 4 they did.
From a Financial point of view it's cheaper to do less, the problem is this screws over the lower tier players, because they are attempting to compete on a completely uneven playing field. It is not their fault, and to doubt their skill isn't right either.
To doubt that their ships are up to the task is quite accurate. Because a T2 ship is not up to the task of defeating T5 enemies in Fleet Blockade. The ships aren't designed to, and the game due to lack of resources forces them to do it.
Would it be fair to Limit T5 ships to the new Fleet events? No
It it fair to allow lowbies into an event they aren't equipped to deal with? No
Is there a simple Solution? Yes, the Mirror Event Tier gate
Do Cryptic have the resources to implement this? I sincerely doubt it.
Sollvax you should be loving Blockade, it's where anything other than an Escort is the best choice.
If I ask you a question it is not an insult but a genuine attempt to understand why.
When I insult you I won't be discreet about it, I will be precise and to the point stupid.
its doable below in a well played cruiser
Now I would like to see an END to ranks linked to tiers
Let anyone who can afford it buy a fleet ship and give them the boff slots
same with C store #
so i dont have a prob to have lvl 1 players with me if 2 waves up i kill first wave 1 then wave 2 who cares^^
and also for blokade if i save 10 frigters with lowlvls or i save 20 with good one who cares.
and that low lvls can join stfs i read first time i remember access to stf mission begins with lvl 44 so how a lowlvl can enter there?
I also run dozens of fleet missions and rarely see low level characters, with how fast leveling is in game now I'm surprised anyone would waste time in a fleet event when they can just hit VA in a couple of days and start grinding fleet marks properly in a Tier 5 ship.
You're correct that DPS isn't required for Blockade but neither is a Cruiser. All you need is TBR and Evasive Manoeuvres and you'll never even have to fire your weapons, any ship above Tier 3 can equip at least TBR1 for Blockade but TBH a Science ship running two copies of TBR really shines in Blockade. It's not just Escort DPS that isn't great in Blockade; it's slow, lumbering Cruisers too.
I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this
hi can you tell me more about that read first time that this mission can be done without fireing any weapon?
how it works exactly?
In blockade you don't actually need to destroy the attacking NPCs, the objective is to protect the Freighter. By carrying Tractor Beam Repulsors you can push the NPCs out of range of the Freighter so that they can't damage it, using Evasive Manoeuvres whilst using TBR you can push them out to 20km or so which gives the freighter plenty of time to get to the starbase and unload before they catch up. Usually you'll end up having to push them a couple of times as a lot of NPCs have emergency to engines now but when used correctly TBR is very effective.
I consider it completely unimportant who in the party will vote, or how; but what is extraordinarily important is this
some of us aren't grinding
what do you call "doing the same mission 15 times a day"?
gave up on what?
are you even playing the same game as the rest of the people here? It sure as hell doesn't seem that way.
who is us? what are you doing, instead of grinding fleet marks?
why am I even bothered, by your nonsense comment?
I do it a different way. I blaze in at a 90 degree angle behind the freighter, and on the approach I give it tactical team and transfer shield strength. Then as I move around the back of the freighter I vent engine plasma (both to slow down enemy ships, and to trim off any pesky bio-neural warheads).
I only ever have the freighter targeted, so I can always give it tactical team as soon as it's available (2 BOffs have it, so there's only a few seconds when the freighter isn't rotating its shields as needed.. which is pretty much always to the aft of the ship), and also so I can use hull heals as required. I'd much rather do it this way than fire a few shots at an enemy ship, accidentally use tactical team on myself, and then watch the freighter explode with no shields at the back and 90% shields at the fore, port, and starboard sides.
Using this technique I find I can usually get a freighter safe alone, the only real problem is tractor beams pinning the freighter in place meaning it can't get a bit of distance between itself and the source of incoming fire.
Draw fire
spam visual effects
mess with everything
stay alive
don't bring a Defiant
don't cloak
don't rely on damage (its totally useless)
a good spread of torps or a faw will draw fire
Threat control (this is the only time in the UNIVERSE its useful)
So just to be clear, your a lvl 50, entering an event designed to give us players something to do to gain a reward, and to do so repeatedly.
But your not grinding.....
its not a Game then
well, you can use 2 TBR...you are moving away also...means that you can easily push them 20km from the freighter...by the time you are back, you can drop 1-2 heals and a tactical team on the freighter and begin the next push.
It really works, even in an escort...take out the light ships first, push away only battleships and cruiser.
sometimes you get funny waves with npcs who spam torpedos that means 2-3 hits and your frighter is not more...
if i jump into a group shott on the frighter nearest enemy a gravition well then spam mass aoes to finish out all enemys in ~40-50 secounds +1 shot on frighter ,aux2sif+hazzard 3 and happy on the end that the frighter not pops.
afther this epic 40~50 sec the frighter is 100% save and i can jump to next frighter so i lose no time your taktik makes no sense in my mind to push 10 min 1 group of enemys away....^^