I am danm happy they nuked Nukara becasue I was like - working my A$$ off and hearing the small fleet guys saying yeah I just farmed for 700 marks on a good run - WTF?? That not right.
and THAT's not fair!
Gotcha, Thanks for letting us all know you were just jealous of others not having to bust there rears off like you were.
Gotcha, Thanks for letting us all know you were just jealous of others not having to bust there rears off like you were.
nice selective quoting there - adding the "and THAT's not fair!" when it did not come after that pervious sentence - gotcha
Anyways - I would not call it jealously - more like a mild form of anger - after doing Nukara once after the fix that grind is one of the most mind-numbing of all so I am not sorry I missed it.
The people who got it while they did should be DAMN happy and gratful - but instead they come on these forums to whine and cry that it was taken away from them.
So yeah - not jealous - but I want to here those people come on here and say than goodness I got lucky for as long as I did - it really relped me out alot - funny I have not seen a post like that yet!!
I'm in no rush, so long as I can continue to afford the featured projects i'm happy to take as long as necessary to upgrade the rest. It's simple enough to grind the dilithium on multiple alts and any leftover that I need I can easily buy with stipend/survey zen.
I'm just hoping we get some feature projects to completely redesign the lower decks, as it is right now the interior designer featured project doesn't even extend to them.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Opening a lockbox is like using a public restroom when u gotta poo.
You are just hoping nobody blew on the seat or that all the toilet paper is gone.
nice selective quoting there - adding the "and THAT's not fair!" when it did not come after that pervious sentence - gotcha
Anyways - I would not call it jealously - more like a mild form of anger - after doing Nukara once after the fix that grind is one of the most mind-numbing of all so I am not sorry I missed it.
The people who got it while they did should be DAMN happy and gratful - but instead they come on these forums to whine and cry that it was taken away from them.
So yeah - not jealous - but I want to here those people come on here and say than goodness I got lucky for as long as I did - it really relped me out alot - funny I have not seen a post like that yet!!
And its not selective quoting, its taking a giant whine post and shrinking it up.
Here's what it allowed ppl to do. It allowed them to grind for 2 hours get their fleet marks then play the game, instead of now, having to grind instead of having fun playing.
I am not a cryptic fanboy by any means - but they should find all the posts from the cry baby/whinners - calling them names - saying they "screwed" the small fleets - abusive and insulting!
They did what was needed to be done to fix a glaring error - and instead of the people who took advatage of that posting they were thankful that it lasted as long as it did - we get non-stop cryptic bashing by people who now are thrown back to reality that starbases were ment to be massive long term/major commitment projects.
so far the only legit claim I have heard is that cryptic should make nukara provide FM 24/7 like the other missions - but the cooldown is perfect
and from the thread feedback so far you seem to be in the minority - personally I look at the title and formulated it as most news articles do these days - as an attention grabber - not to single out someone and call them names
So far other than Nukara not providing FM 24/7 - Cryptic was spot on in their "fix" - in fact they should have done it much earlier.
I'm in a small fleet, and I'm a whiney cry baby. I'll tell you how I see it. Currently my fleet has less than half a dozen active members. We have gotten by up until now just fine, the game has never punished us or excluded us from the game because of our choice to have a tight nit group of active players who don't want to have a massive group of randoms in a non-personal fleet.
Then Starbases comes along, and we are being punished for not conforming to a massive group of faceless fleet members. On top of that, what normally takes a fleet 10 minutes to do with 200 members, takes our core group of players hours or even days. Tell me who worked "harder" to upgrade our station. Sure you can look at the game like its "realistic" (lol, yeah...) and say that a bigger group is going to have more muscle to do the work, but it took 200 players 30 secs to each contribute one thing, where as us 6 have to spend hours doing the same. So the reward to cost/work ratio is non existent. Why reward a massive fleet that has to do nothing but just have members with such a reward and TRIBBLE on the little guy.
On top of that, the announcement for starbases even said they made it easy for fleet of all sizes to do it. Which I must be missing something because thats not the case.
Also if you are going to limit the amount of fleet marks we can get by time, that kills us off effectively, not matter how hard our small fleet works. Limiting us to about 100 fleet marks every few hours punishes us again despite working many times harder than other fleets.
I'm not really asking to be given everything up front, but how about instead of making a small number of massive tiers and massive costs, maybe add a ton of smaller rewards, make it feel more tangible, like we have accomplished something, give us small rewards like minor upgrades to the interior, bank/exhange access for cheap. I'm not asking to be handed level 4 shipyards and a bunch of free ships, but make it feel like after I have put in 70 hours this week, I have more to show for it then 10% of the way to Military 1 and Science 1. When a massive fleet does nothing and its finished. Maybe give me some very minor upgrades to the starbase, esthetics maybe, or add more traffic in the space outside... Break everything up into smaller reward chunks. So I can do something and feel good about it after 15 hours, not 2000...
Right now the station that our group has put about 400 hours of work into, is just an empty shell of uselessness, there is no reason to even go there or be there and hang out. Its a waste.
I'm in a small fleet, and I'm a whiney cry baby. I'll tell you how I see it. Currently my fleet has less than half a dozen active members. We have gotten by up until now just fine, the game has never punished us or excluded us from the game because of our choice to have a tight nit group of active players who don't want to have a massive group of randoms in a non-personal fleet.....
Right now the station that our group has put about 400 hours of work into, is just an empty shell of uselessness, there is no reason to even go there or be there and hang out. Its a waste.
I hear exactly what you are saying as I am myself am a solo fleet - as stated orginally just for the bank slots - but I have been in a super fleet and it was ultra useless as the top tier of "officers" only spoke to each other on officer chat and hardly ever interacted with the common rabble.
My suggestion is still that things remain as they are construction wise - but that after x amount of fleets have openned up a tier that the items be put up for sale in a "general" starbase - even ESD - which could become empty in a few months.
Each player would use Fleet marks to buy the ships and gear that they wanted but I think that they would have to put a premium on the items so that the large fleets who actually built the bases don't complain(which they would have a right to) Maybe 2x the amount of Fleet marks + x amout of provisioning credits
Transwarped/visited my starbase for the first time today - yeah! Well kinda yeah - its not as amazing as ESD and there is nobody there - as I am solo - but heck I am almost to tier 2 so I will keep going for awhile
The grind is wearing me down so I am pulling back when I hit tier 2
I see more whinners in the Nukara cooldown thread - this is something that is supposed to take a small fleet years
I don't see what the big deal is all about - unless you are in a small fleet and had the super unrealistic expectation that you were going to get a base completed in under 12 months
I think you will find that most of those players grinding out thousands of Fleet Marks were not the solo fleet type people. On the contrary, they were most likely the larger fleet members trying to earn their marks to squeeze in a donation so they would get enough credits to attempt to purchase one of the first few fleet ships at 20k-200k fleet credits a pop.
"We" solo type fleet-owners\ players are more laid-back, calculating and into these SB projects for the long haul. We're not in it for the instant gratification. We understand that we'll be hitting the next few tiers weeks or months after the larger fleets.
One of the nice things that we will be able to do, that larger fleets WILL NOT be able to do, is attempt to fill the demand for the lower tier fleet ships more easily. 5 fleet ship project on a 20hr CD x 200 fleeties? Come on. There's going to be LOTS of heartache and drama in the larger fleets as the demand for those ships heats up and the fleet management staffs start playing favorites. Those disgruntled fleeties are going to want to take their fleet credits and buy the ship that they want. Where will they turn to? Another large 200-500 member fleet with a limited shipyard availability and everyone wanting their particular fleet ship?
Maybe you should think a tad bit longer on your opinion.
Transwarped/visited my starbase for the first time today - yeah! Well kinda yeah - its not as amazing as ESD and there is nobody there - as I am solo - but heck I am almost to tier 2 so I will keep going for awhile
The grind is wearing me down so I am pulling back when I hit tier 2
I see more whinners in the Nukara cooldown thread - this is something that is supposed to take a small fleet years
I don't see what the big deal is all about - unless you are in a small fleet and had the super unrealistic expectation that you were going to get a base completed in under 12 months
Starbases are big, expensive things that should take a long time to build. That much we can agree on.
The problem I see with the current economic system is that it focuses far too much on grinding a very small amount of content over and over when it should be encouraging play/replay of all content.
I don't have a problem with a project like this taking a lot of time. It took me years to get my bases in City of Heroes fitted out the way I wanted them
When I was building those bases I got everything I needed from regular game play of my various characters. I could play when I wanted for as long as I wanted and be guaranteed to get something useful for my base building project. Nothing needed was locked away behind 'exclusive' content.
But in STO, one absolutely essential material (FMs) is locked in a handful of missions and awarded in those missions only grudgingly unless you play them during randomly scheduled events for slightly enhanced rewards.
In CoH players earn Prestige (the main base building currency) simply by being in a super group and playing the game. Prestige, in combination with other salvage items (also earned during regular play), is used to craft and install everything in the base
Why not do FMs the same way here?
Make FMs the primary fleet currency by attaching them to each arc in the game with either a few per mission or a large lump sum at the end and allow them to be converted into other required materials (at a reasonable rate) to allow constant, measurable progress on base building. Materials could also be donated as they are now to allow additional flexibility.
This has the added benefit of making ALL content in the game desireable for replay. Given that the Devs have all but directly stated that 'play-it-once' content is dead, this is a good thing.
Have the current fleet events award larger numbers of FMs than they currently do but increase the cooldown accordingly to maintain balance. This would allow for larger crunches of materials to cover special projects like the interior decorating ones we've already had assuming they use something other than dilithium.
All of this should allow small (even solo) fleets to get more enjoyment, and less frustration, out of what is now the center piece of the game.
I think you will find that most of those players grinding out thousands of Fleet Marks were not the solo fleet type people. On the contrary, they were most likely the larger fleet members trying to earn their marks to squeeze in a donation so they would get enough credits to attempt to purchase one of the first few fleet ships at 20k-200k fleet credits a pop.
"We" solo type fleet-owners\ players are more laid-back, calculating and into these SB projects for the long haul. We're not in it for the instant gratification. We understand that we'll be hitting the next few tiers weeks or months after the larger fleets.
One of the nice things that we will be able to do, that larger fleets WILL NOT be able to do, is attempt to fill the demand for the lower tier fleet ships more easily. 5 fleet ship project on a 20hr CD x 200 fleeties? Come on. There's going to be LOTS of heartache and drama in the larger fleets as the demand for those ships heats up and the fleet management staffs start playing favorites. Those disgruntled fleeties are going to want to take their fleet credits and buy the ship that they want. Where will they turn to? Another large 200-500 member fleet with a limited shipyard availability and everyone wanting their particular fleet ship?
Maybe you should think a tad bit longer on your opinion.
3 things:
1) Cryptic should make Nukara 24/7 just like the others - I have always stated that.
2) Cryptic should make fleet marks available from all PvE missions(but right now they want eveyone to get used to the new ones)
3) By next Monday I will have a FULLY operational tier 2(two) Starbase with a tier 2 shipyard and I have no interest in making any ships! (I say fully because i keep all three section going at pretty much the same pace - all are at 19k xp right now)
Perhaps if others want to build ships I may be able to help
The people who got it while they did should be DAMN happy and gratful - but instead they come on these forums to whine and cry that it was taken away from them.
To me sounds like that is exactly what you are doing, instead of just ignoring it and moving on.
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Comments
Gotcha, Thanks for letting us all know you were just jealous of others not having to bust there rears off like you were.
My fleet likes them. it makes the base less spartan and more lived in.
nice selective quoting there - adding the "and THAT's not fair!" when it did not come after that pervious sentence - gotcha
Anyways - I would not call it jealously - more like a mild form of anger - after doing Nukara once after the fix that grind is one of the most mind-numbing of all so I am not sorry I missed it.
The people who got it while they did should be DAMN happy and gratful - but instead they come on these forums to whine and cry that it was taken away from them.
So yeah - not jealous - but I want to here those people come on here and say than goodness I got lucky for as long as I did - it really relped me out alot - funny I have not seen a post like that yet!!
I'm just hoping we get some feature projects to completely redesign the lower decks, as it is right now the interior designer featured project doesn't even extend to them.
Hopefully a moderator is not too far behind
Opening a lockbox is like using a public restroom when u gotta poo.
You are just hoping nobody blew on the seat or that all the toilet paper is gone.
Well you must not be looking far. There were numerous threads about it that got merged.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=330511&page=16
And its not selective quoting, its taking a giant whine post and shrinking it up.
Here's what it allowed ppl to do. It allowed them to grind for 2 hours get their fleet marks then play the game, instead of now, having to grind instead of having fun playing.
You're probably right. That was the way it was in WoW. The bigger the guild, the smaller the lifespan.
I am not a cryptic fanboy by any means - but they should find all the posts from the cry baby/whinners - calling them names - saying they "screwed" the small fleets - abusive and insulting!
They did what was needed to be done to fix a glaring error - and instead of the people who took advatage of that posting they were thankful that it lasted as long as it did - we get non-stop cryptic bashing by people who now are thrown back to reality that starbases were ment to be massive long term/major commitment projects.
so far the only legit claim I have heard is that cryptic should make nukara provide FM 24/7 like the other missions - but the cooldown is perfect
and from the thread feedback so far you seem to be in the minority - personally I look at the title and formulated it as most news articles do these days - as an attention grabber - not to single out someone and call them names
So far other than Nukara not providing FM 24/7 - Cryptic was spot on in their "fix" - in fact they should have done it much earlier.
Then Starbases comes along, and we are being punished for not conforming to a massive group of faceless fleet members. On top of that, what normally takes a fleet 10 minutes to do with 200 members, takes our core group of players hours or even days. Tell me who worked "harder" to upgrade our station. Sure you can look at the game like its "realistic" (lol, yeah...) and say that a bigger group is going to have more muscle to do the work, but it took 200 players 30 secs to each contribute one thing, where as us 6 have to spend hours doing the same. So the reward to cost/work ratio is non existent. Why reward a massive fleet that has to do nothing but just have members with such a reward and TRIBBLE on the little guy.
On top of that, the announcement for starbases even said they made it easy for fleet of all sizes to do it. Which I must be missing something because thats not the case.
Also if you are going to limit the amount of fleet marks we can get by time, that kills us off effectively, not matter how hard our small fleet works. Limiting us to about 100 fleet marks every few hours punishes us again despite working many times harder than other fleets.
I'm not really asking to be given everything up front, but how about instead of making a small number of massive tiers and massive costs, maybe add a ton of smaller rewards, make it feel more tangible, like we have accomplished something, give us small rewards like minor upgrades to the interior, bank/exhange access for cheap. I'm not asking to be handed level 4 shipyards and a bunch of free ships, but make it feel like after I have put in 70 hours this week, I have more to show for it then 10% of the way to Military 1 and Science 1. When a massive fleet does nothing and its finished. Maybe give me some very minor upgrades to the starbase, esthetics maybe, or add more traffic in the space outside... Break everything up into smaller reward chunks. So I can do something and feel good about it after 15 hours, not 2000...
Right now the station that our group has put about 400 hours of work into, is just an empty shell of uselessness, there is no reason to even go there or be there and hang out. Its a waste.
I hear exactly what you are saying as I am myself am a solo fleet - as stated orginally just for the bank slots - but I have been in a super fleet and it was ultra useless as the top tier of "officers" only spoke to each other on officer chat and hardly ever interacted with the common rabble.
My suggestion is still that things remain as they are construction wise - but that after x amount of fleets have openned up a tier that the items be put up for sale in a "general" starbase - even ESD - which could become empty in a few months.
Each player would use Fleet marks to buy the ships and gear that they wanted but I think that they would have to put a premium on the items so that the large fleets who actually built the bases don't complain(which they would have a right to) Maybe 2x the amount of Fleet marks + x amout of provisioning credits
The grind is wearing me down so I am pulling back when I hit tier 2
I see more whinners in the Nukara cooldown thread - this is something that is supposed to take a small fleet years
I don't see what the big deal is all about - unless you are in a small fleet and had the super unrealistic expectation that you were going to get a base completed in under 12 months
I think you will find that most of those players grinding out thousands of Fleet Marks were not the solo fleet type people. On the contrary, they were most likely the larger fleet members trying to earn their marks to squeeze in a donation so they would get enough credits to attempt to purchase one of the first few fleet ships at 20k-200k fleet credits a pop.
"We" solo type fleet-owners\ players are more laid-back, calculating and into these SB projects for the long haul. We're not in it for the instant gratification. We understand that we'll be hitting the next few tiers weeks or months after the larger fleets.
One of the nice things that we will be able to do, that larger fleets WILL NOT be able to do, is attempt to fill the demand for the lower tier fleet ships more easily. 5 fleet ship project on a 20hr CD x 200 fleeties? Come on. There's going to be LOTS of heartache and drama in the larger fleets as the demand for those ships heats up and the fleet management staffs start playing favorites. Those disgruntled fleeties are going to want to take their fleet credits and buy the ship that they want. Where will they turn to? Another large 200-500 member fleet with a limited shipyard availability and everyone wanting their particular fleet ship?
Maybe you should think a tad bit longer on your opinion.
Starbases are big, expensive things that should take a long time to build. That much we can agree on.
The problem I see with the current economic system is that it focuses far too much on grinding a very small amount of content over and over when it should be encouraging play/replay of all content.
I don't have a problem with a project like this taking a lot of time. It took me years to get my bases in City of Heroes fitted out the way I wanted them
When I was building those bases I got everything I needed from regular game play of my various characters. I could play when I wanted for as long as I wanted and be guaranteed to get something useful for my base building project. Nothing needed was locked away behind 'exclusive' content.
But in STO, one absolutely essential material (FMs) is locked in a handful of missions and awarded in those missions only grudgingly unless you play them during randomly scheduled events for slightly enhanced rewards.
In CoH players earn Prestige (the main base building currency) simply by being in a super group and playing the game. Prestige, in combination with other salvage items (also earned during regular play), is used to craft and install everything in the base
Why not do FMs the same way here?
Make FMs the primary fleet currency by attaching them to each arc in the game with either a few per mission or a large lump sum at the end and allow them to be converted into other required materials (at a reasonable rate) to allow constant, measurable progress on base building. Materials could also be donated as they are now to allow additional flexibility.
This has the added benefit of making ALL content in the game desireable for replay. Given that the Devs have all but directly stated that 'play-it-once' content is dead, this is a good thing.
Have the current fleet events award larger numbers of FMs than they currently do but increase the cooldown accordingly to maintain balance. This would allow for larger crunches of materials to cover special projects like the interior decorating ones we've already had assuming they use something other than dilithium.
All of this should allow small (even solo) fleets to get more enjoyment, and less frustration, out of what is now the center piece of the game.
3 things:
1) Cryptic should make Nukara 24/7 just like the others - I have always stated that.
2) Cryptic should make fleet marks available from all PvE missions(but right now they want eveyone to get used to the new ones)
3) By next Monday I will have a FULLY operational tier 2(two) Starbase with a tier 2 shipyard and I have no interest in making any ships! (I say fully because i keep all three section going at pretty much the same pace - all are at 19k xp right now)
Perhaps if others want to build ships I may be able to help
To me sounds like that is exactly what you are doing, instead of just ignoring it and moving on.
True - their anger is already giving way to acceptence.
"Your right as always doctor - they must have mistaken me for someone else"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pFWuSH4FywA
Thanks I will pass.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qKcJF4fOPs&feature=related