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Aegis Set outclassed

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    quiscustodietquiscustodiet Member Posts: 350
    edited July 2012
    Even worse, also totally outdated and obsolete are:
    • Very Rare Shield Array
    • Very Rare Covariant Shield Array
    • Very Rare Regenerate Shield Array
    • Very Rare Resilient Shield Array
    • Very Rare Impulse Engine
    • Very Rare Combat Impulse Engine
    • Very Rare Hyper-Impulse Engine
    And let's not talk about Deflectors. (mostly because I forgot all their variants).

    All obsolete thanks to sets items that are not just very rare with unique modes often better than what you can normally found on such shields, if you combine items from a set, you get additional powers and benefits!

    I am not against set, but I would have expected that they would introduce a balanced choice between very rare, individual items, and set items. Sacrifice a bit of a mod to get a special ability you couldn't otherwise get.

    I agree with the point that Sets have the unfortunate effects of killing mix-matching, but not with the point that endgame gear shouldn't obsolete exchange gear.

    But anyway, those birds have flown. You'd need pretty amazing gear to outperform sets now that we have them, especially considering the Borg Set only requires 1-2 piece for the good bonuses.
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    p2wsucksp2wsucks Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    The 3 part Aegis may have a niche w/the Sci Brel (designed to spam CC and Cronts). Since it gets 10% defense boost w/hull resists boost. But, that's pretty much it for the 3 part bonus. Perhaps when fighting a heavy bleed through damage dealing team switch to 3-part Aegis as well for hull resists.

    The 2 part bonus wouldn't be bad w/KHG shields for the combined effect of -25% acc on KHG shield proc + 10% defense bonus (from Aegis Engines & Deflector). I'd consider this for non-cloaking and/or slow ships in a good cross healing team.

    The engine's 5% defense bonus is ok to mix into escort style ships.

    It's not great, but still has potential uses.

    But, I do agree it shouldn't be left to gather dust and it's harder to acquire than the old Borg set which fits in more situations than the Aegis does.
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    marc8219marc8219 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    It is ok for a Mk X very rare set, I just wish there was a way to upgrade it to Mk XI then Mk XII very rare. It shouldn't be easy though, maybe with Doff missions with high failure rate. Maybe I would get interested in actually doing doff missions again.
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    carl103carl103 Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    It is ok for a Mk X very rare set

    Except it's not. Ok yes in comparision to the MKX Breen and Dom sets it's ok. the trouble is you the borg set becomes avlibile at 44, this becomes avalibile at 40. Thats 4 levels of being useful before the first MkXII equivelent comes in. For a set this expensive in dilithium (or EC's if you go tha route), it's shockingly inadequete.

    That actually raises an idea. What about dropping it's mark number to MkVIII but leaving all stats exactly as they are? Being able to use it from 30 would be a huge boon to levelers, and it suddenly seems quite viable to get it prior to the borg set.
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    matteo716maikaimatteo716maikai Member Posts: 823
    edited July 2012
    i would like the option to show the skins of sets, if we have the complete set. but dont have to have it equiped.

    i think this would solve a lot of problems. people like how it looks but want to use better gear.
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    trek21trek21 Member Posts: 2,246 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    I must point out that those who don't do STF's for any reason, like me, Aegis is a good choice. Your only competition is the Jem'Hadar and Breen Set. And the Borg console from Assimilation can be used with any of those sets, mix-and-match or not.

    And it's got a cool aesthetic look :)
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    dontdrunkimshootdontdrunkimshoot Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    the biggest problem is that the shield is just a mkx cap2 cov with a bit of extra energy bonus. if it was a cap3 or something, like they made the reman shield, it would be worth useing, the resists and bonus defense is actually really nice.
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    centersolacecentersolace Member Posts: 11,178 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    Aegis isn't outclassed, not nearly. It's not as hard to get as people think, it just takes patience. It doesn't have any level requirements and it isn't Bind on Pickup either. If you have a medium sized fleet (or just a nice one), it isn't hard to get the required materials. It works very well with a build designed with movement in mind.

    Plus with all the "Updates" to STF's making them more difficult, it's now almost impossible to get Mk XII M.A.C.O. and Omega force space now.

    All in all. A fairly decent set, and one that doesn't require failing hundreds of STF's or putting up with the leavers, gankers, griefers, or noobs that clog them to get the one part you're missing. Or waiting hours to run the Vault over, and over, and over, and over, and over again.

    So that's a plus.
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    lordmalak1lordmalak1 Member Posts: 4,681 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    I bought my Aegis set for about 7 mil EC on the exchange.

    I'm still trying to catch the Vault shuttle event so I can get enough Reman Datalogs to craft my first reman set.. not counting what I need to grind to make the next two sets higher.

    The crafting is far easier than grinding Vault missions in order to make a Reman Set.

    and STF is random luck to get the Omega or MACO set.. I'm trying to get the Omega set.. 265 STF elites and only have gotten the MK XII Deflector for the Omega set.

    So which is harder.. go to exchange and buy mats and craft the Aegis set or grind hundreds of missions in order to manufacture / luck out on a set?

    Yer joking, right ?
    My FIRST elite STF (I'm STILL running AEGIS gear) I got a purple borg shield drop. You've got some really bad luck with your drops.

    BTW, been upgrading the REMAN gear myself and aside from the plasma torp buff the REMAN set isn't my fav by a longshot (notice I stopped short of calling it junk). I still havent bought my mkXII KHG shield yet- havent really needed it yet as the AEGIS set works quite well if you use it correctly.

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    r37r37 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    The single biggest issue with the Aegis set is the lack of Pla resistance for the shields (for STF's), and the less than thrilling set bonus for the set. Out side that it's no all that bad, and for those who argue that the newer sets require more time/effort to get, I laugh at you. My sci was in MkX in 3 runs, it would take me longer to grind the mats & the dli for the Aegis set.

    And again, for those who will argue that Maco/Omega has to be MkXII to count I continue to laugh. The gap between X to XII is small as hell to the point that it's actually not worth putting in the effort to get MkXII over MkX let alone MkXI.

    The borg set is still far and away the best set to get for defence & the time investment is not huge nor challenging. I see no reason for the Aegis to not be buffed a little to at least make it a viable contender.
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    zachverantzachverant Member Posts: 111 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    Aegis is still a good set, I use it as a default. I feel it is probably 4th or 5th best set in the game.

    my 2ec's worth...:P
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    vesphavespha Member Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    kaeaja wrote: »
    Just WHY Cryptic? Why have you allowed a hard to make set get outclassed by everything else? Defensively its outclassed by the Reman Set for one.....and the Aegis is supposed to be a defensive set so why?

    Umm where have you been? And why are you just NOW speaking up? Bad troll...? Perhaps
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    crypticvyper#7920 crypticvyper Member Posts: 47 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    r37 wrote: »
    ... and for those who argue that the newer sets require more time/effort to get, I laugh at you. My sci was in MkX in 3 runs, it would take me longer to grind the mats & the dli for the Aegis set.

    Um.. seeing as how you can only get 2 Encrypted Data Chips per Elite run (once in a while the optional Data chip from a ground drop or space drop).. but speaking strictly Mission Rewards.. I call you out on this one unless you have PROOF (Vidoe or play formula) that will allow everyone to get a full MK X set, Borg or otherwise in just "3 runs".

    You haven't even specificed what constitutes a run.. If a run is a mission, you piling the room full.

    it takes 5 EDC for 1 MK X borg item (not counting Universal Console).

    so lets translate that into mission runs without the "extra" EDC drops.

    so, during Non STF event times.. Normal drops 1 EDC.. that is 5 missions or "runs" to get 1 Borg device

    that means 15 mission to get the 3 piece set from Roxy, 16 missions to have the complete 4 piece set all on Normal.

    For Elite, you get 2 EDC per mission during non STF Event times.. as such 2.5 mission per Borg item from Roxy.. that makes 8 STF missions for 16 EDC, plus 1 normal mission for the 4th console to make the entire 4 piece Borg set.

    MACO set is 20 EDC per piece for MK X gear.. let you do the math for Normal and again for Elite.. 40 EDC for each MK XI piece, and Prototype drops for each MK XII piece.

    Now if you are claiming a Run as 3 space STF missions, then that is still 3 EDC per run, and 9 EDC for 3 runs.

    Now if you are counting all 6 STF missions as a run, then I agree that 3 runs for 18 EDC in normal mode can get you the Borg set (plus the standard mission for the 4th piece) but still not enough to get the MACO set.

    Now if you are saying 3 - 6 mission runs Elite, then that is 32 EDC still not enought get the full MK X MACO set.. You would nave to at almost double that it would take 5 - 6 mission runs to get a full MACO MK X set.

    Still, this isn't what was being discussed.. the discussion was the work to get the MACO sets and the Reman sets vs the crafting of the Aegis set... Aegis requires no grinding what so ever if you have the Energy Credits to buy the mats off the exchange or the credits just to buy the set itself off the exchange.

    the Reman set requires the most work to obtain of any set, especially since it is time slotted in order to obtain the datalogs in order to create or upgrade the sets..

    Now with STFs, sure it is possible to get really lucky and get the MK XII Prototype drops for the sets in 3 missions.. but many have done 200 to 500 STFs and are 1 or 2 pieces short of a full MK XII set.

    but saying tha you got a full MK X set in 3 runs.. I call hogwash on that.
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    r37r37 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    I was talking about the normal STF gear only taking 3 runs because of common tech drops. Borg gear has a set cost, as everyone knows, yet it's still easy as hell to afford & yes it still takes less time to get 3 peace borg then aegis with the crafting mat cost, unless they have changed it.

    Yes you can get 3 borg common tech in 3 runs on normal, and yes I have managed to get all 3 with a single run (of each Space Normal) on one of my characters. Believe it or not the COMMON tech is COMMON enough that you don't have to spend 50/100 runs to get it. The Rare Tech takes a lot more work & the Prototype tech is simply a waste of time and effort. As I said the gap between X & XII is minimal. Out of 5 characters I've managed to get a full set of MkX gear no later then 30 runs in doing normal. So yes it can take a while, but normal's are not hard... hell you can't even fail infected normal & I've yet to see cure normal fail either.

    Borg gear can be easier or harder to get given your luck, but I've managed to get at least 2 tech's by the time I could afford the borg Engine & Deflector on all 5 of my characters & lets be honest who the hell buys the shield, you are better off using rare salvage to buy the standard shield's with Pla resistance until you score a shield tech.

    The fact remains that even if you unlucky you can still get the 3 peace borg set in 10 runs of normal + the mission & there's a good chance you will pick up a common tech or 2 along the way. There's nothing hard about Normal STF's & there's no real challenge to get STF only gear. I see no major reason for Aegis to not get a slight buff just because people feel STF's require effort. Loging into the game requires more effort then STF's do. Hell just look at all the people who AFK in STF's, is that effort ? lol
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    tanith1989tanith1989 Member Posts: 109 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    r37 wrote: »
    The fact remains that even if you unlucky you can still get the 3 peace borg set in 10 runs of normal + the mission & there's a good chance you will pick up a common tech or 2 along the way. There's nothing hard about Normal STF's & there's no real challenge to get STF only gear. I see no major reason for Aegis to not get a slight buff just because people feel STF's require effort. Loging into the game requires more effort then STF's do. Hell just look at all the people who AFK in STF's, is that effort ? lol

    Sorry i fail to see your point about the Borg set it used to be even easier to get all you would have to do is run the STFs once not including Terradome and you were done. they have made it harder to get this set and well i for one think the MkXII MACO OMEGA sets are far to hard to get its shouldnt be random.

    As for the Aegis set i would say make it upgradable via crafting keep it as the end reward for crafting or even as a stepping stone to another set
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    dwhornetdwhornet Member Posts: 108 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    Borg set can be gotten in a 1 night. It will take atleast 3 days to grind Dil for aegis and a very long time to accumulate all the particles. Thoron Distortion Field is just misunderstood by players.
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    r37r37 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    My point ? that effort in STF's is laughable out side of MKXII gear and the argument that some how STF gear "requires" more effort and as such should be better then crafted gear is down right silly. The only gear in the game that truly requires a great deal of effort is MkXII gear, but if you are a fool enough to try for it... who's fault is that ? The stats just don't support the effort to get it, so why bother in the first place.

    Mk X is a breeze to get as is the borg set, MkXI takes a bit more time & MkXII is a waste of time.
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    theindefatigabletheindefatigable Member Posts: 351 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    Count me in as a player who would like to see either a scaling Aegis set or something like what they did with the Reman set...make the set upgradable through missions or perhaps crafting.
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    marctraiderzmarctraiderz Member Posts: 539 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    I'm a big fan of the AEGIS, and still use it for my non-STF ship (which is to say, my "main" ship as I don't STF often). However, I think it's fair that the AEGIS is "outclassed" by the others.

    AEGIS can be made by anyone that cares to level crafting (not hard).

    MACO, KHG, and MACO sets (can) take (most people) a very long time to get, through doing STFs over and over and over again.

    Even the Reman Mk XII's take a long time to work for. It will take less time when The Vault 5-man gets added to the PvE queue, but still not as easy as crafting a set of AEGIS.

    Does it really matter for a non PvPer what shields he takes? Get real. With a proper setup u can do the elite STF's with Maco, Omega, BOrg, Aegis, Even breen shield it doesnt matter $#@%#@^.
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    matteo716maikaimatteo716maikai Member Posts: 823
    edited July 2012
    zachverant wrote: »
    Aegis is still a good set, I use it as a default. I feel it is probably 4th or 5th best set in the game.

    my 2ec's worth...:P

    but... isnt there only like 4 or 5 "different" sets in the game? lol
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    quiscustodietquiscustodiet Member Posts: 350
    edited July 2012
    dwhornet wrote: »
    Borg set can be gotten in a 1 night. It will take atleast 3 days to grind Dil for aegis and a very long time to accumulate all the particles.

    Or a couple of hours to make ~3M EC (IIRC) and buy it.
    Or 5 minutes, a credit card and a quick visit to the Dilithium Exchange, for those so inclined.
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    sortofsortof Member Posts: 196 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    to say that common tech drop is common ... is totally wrong. I dont doubt that one might get 3 common techs in 3 runs. But the odds of that are minimal. I have run hundreds of STFs to only see a common tech drop once. A freaking single time. I was astonished, I did not realize it existed. So common this drop it is.
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    leviathan99#2867 leviathan99 Member Posts: 7,747 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    carl103 wrote: »
    I agree with the OP. The borg set is vastly supiriour to the AEGIS and vastly easier to aquire, beetween saving my dilithium for CP's and not being a 1,000 day vet with oodles of money to blow in the exchange getting the set is no small matter, and i can MUCH more easilly aquire a better alternative than i can the dilithium or money.

    I've actually started laying out some set idea's in a document that i'm going to post, and one of those is a "AEGIS 2" set.

    Part of the issue is that the borg set is too strong IMHO. It's set bonusus outclass everything else by so much there's not a lot of contest. Especially at 3 peices.

    Part of this boils down to what Cryptic wants you to do more.

    They know some people will never STF. They would rather you STF than craft at this point. They stack the deck in that direction.

    I think what the Aegis needs is something similar to the Reman set upgrades.

    You know, a Doff assignment that takes an Aegis part, 5 Reman Datalogs and 5 EDC, and produces a Mark XI version. Then repeat for a Mark XII version.

    Also from a design standpoint, I'd probably look at making EDC more like Reman Datalogs, a crafting component used by Duty Officers, as opposed to a vendor currency. That would dramatically streamline the EDC store menu. I'd also have these assignments and the Reman Datalogs ones award crafting skill.

    I'd also look at making them hard or impossible to fail but make it so that a crit gives you the next tier up of gear.

    So 20 EDC would have a 95% chance of giving you Mk X gear and a 5% chance of Mk XI gear. The 40 EDC assignment would have a 95% chance of awarding Mk XI gear and a 5% chance of awarding Mk XII gear.

    That way people who hate relying on Elite STF drops would have another shot at Mk XII sets.

    Now, from there, I'd make the EDC purchased DOffs be the only ones who increase your chance at a Crit success by giving them a special trait.

    So if you REALLY, REALLY want Mk XII gear and it isn't dropping or you hate Elite STFs, you go through and buy up the EDC Liberated Borg DOffs and, with a full team of them, get something like a 50% shot at a Mk XII requisition from the 40 EDC assignment.
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    theindefatigabletheindefatigable Member Posts: 351 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    Does it really matter for a non PvPer what shields he takes? Get real. With a proper setup u can do the elite STF's with Maco, Omega, BOrg, Aegis, Even breen shield it doesnt matter $#@%#@^.

    You have a good point here. The more STF's I run the more likely I am to experiment with sets focused towards DPS instead of defense.

    I still think the aegis set looks purdy though and fills a nice niche and would like to see full-on mk xii versions of this...and the breen and jem'hadar...sets eventually!
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    badname834854badname834854 Member Posts: 1,186 Arc User
    edited July 2012
    The Aegis set isn't bad; I've used it on several 'toons until I either had enough EDC for something or, I mixed and matched to get an interesting layout. 2 borg + 2 Aegis can give you a nice +10 to shields if you do it right.

    3 Borg plus Jem shield perhaps? I mean, there are options. Not optimal, but certainly useful and serviceable. Besides, 3 borg + shield of choice is optimal for Feds anyhow.
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