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See a bit more Star Trek inspired, Conflict Resolution - Poll Develop?
strathkin
Member Posts: 2,666 Bug Hunter
Today I was talking to a long time friend on here, and the topic of Conflict only resolved by fighting to the death.
So we started a mini-debate: How might they evolve combat in STO, a bit more so everything isn't just endless slaughter unlike the Series (most of the time) that is.
PS: If anyone has idea's, or like to see a Forth Choice, post below I'll add it here (along with who suggested it) as this is more about Developing a Poll with Feedback, Debate, and Discussion.
Part I
What if more combat resulting in just seeing more ships being fired upon until disabled?
Note: The R&D Materials from fighting come from the wreckage, that was found around the ship; or on Ground is received by taken Weapons, Armor, or Shields just as we do now.
May likely REMOVE this option, per the Ten Forward Stream today that said, "After another prompt about "evil races" and Jeremy's remark that we kinda already have gameplay-induced murderfest, they talked about the ludonarrative dissonance and that in actual story killcounts are much lower and not every defeat is fatal, ets., and would've they made game with current knowledge and experience they would've made visuals of ships merely going dead in space, launching escape pods and such, alongside with tweaking the gameplay itself."
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1261333/ten-forward-weekly-04-14-202
Part II
Today only a very limited few allow Commendations to play a role mostly on Ground, Diplomacy 4 has a limited few, one or two of each given for Development 4, Engineering 4, Science 4, &/or Trade 4. Yet we also have several others that never rarely play a role.
NOTE: suggested by @paradox#7391, @strathkin & feedback from @sthe91 -revised and adapted, from my previous earlier version.
If STO was an RPG, it have dialog trees, there would be Commendation Options (Rank 4) depending on mission, a Career Class Option, a Racial Species Option (Examples: Nerve Pinch option -Vulcan, a Seduce option -Orion/TOS Human, Read Thoughts -Betazed, Duel/Melee -Klingon/Andorian, Murder 'Tal Shiar Spy' or Cunning 'Republic INT' -Romulan, or others as Cryptic thinks suit a Species for the Mission) or the typical 'try your luck' of individual Captains Choices depending what they choose. The goal here is more choice to some that may influence or change how the story is told, adapts, or unfolds in some ways smaller, others larger... ...it may add additional optional objectives based on choices, or how the paths forward in the mission changes. Some may have opportunity for Accolades, or Titles, more importantly the story adapt a bit more to choices made. For example maybe choosing Tacitcal 4, might find an alternative path into a Building; yet to find it may require Colonial 4 (and initiative) first to speak to Colonists caught in conflict or Refugees nearby.
.
So when developing new Missions, please consider how the choices influence story objectives to be a bit more dynamic.
Part III
Do nothing it's FINE just as it is, just maybe add a few more Commendation Opportunities in future missions.
Anyways just some thoughts to throw out and see what others think. I wanted to open this up to a Debate, invite others to submit other ideas, if others have some comment below or tag me; I can also add a Part IV option as a 4th Poll Choice. Then others can also see who contributed what at different points as well.
I mean what always encouraged me about Star Trek, then even more in TNG Forward, was the attempts to use Diplomacy, Cunning, Wit, and Intelligence to avoid Conflict. And when all else failed, they at least more often tried to limit casualties... ...rather than (always) a fight to the death, which I admit depends on Racial Species, or Choices made by individual Captains and how they perhaps got into the situation.
Okay, give a few people time to review or consider suggesting changes. Of course like all later Polls, asking does not mean receiving, just a way to provide feedback and see if they might be able to find a solution that could incorporate some of the idea's more.
So we started a mini-debate: How might they evolve combat in STO, a bit more so everything isn't just endless slaughter unlike the Series (most of the time) that is.
PS: If anyone has idea's, or like to see a Forth Choice, post below I'll add it here (along with who suggested it) as this is more about Developing a Poll with Feedback, Debate, and Discussion.
Part I
What if more combat resulting in just seeing more ships being fired upon until disabled?
Note: The R&D Materials from fighting come from the wreckage, that was found around the ship; or on Ground is received by taken Weapons, Armor, or Shields just as we do now.
May likely REMOVE this option, per the Ten Forward Stream today that said, "After another prompt about "evil races" and Jeremy's remark that we kinda already have gameplay-induced murderfest, they talked about the ludonarrative dissonance and that in actual story killcounts are much lower and not every defeat is fatal, ets., and would've they made game with current knowledge and experience they would've made visuals of ships merely going dead in space, launching escape pods and such, alongside with tweaking the gameplay itself."
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1261333/ten-forward-weekly-04-14-202
Part II
Today only a very limited few allow Commendations to play a role mostly on Ground, Diplomacy 4 has a limited few, one or two of each given for Development 4, Engineering 4, Science 4, &/or Trade 4. Yet we also have several others that never rarely play a role.
NOTE: suggested by @paradox#7391, @strathkin & feedback from @sthe91 -revised and adapted, from my previous earlier version.
If STO was an RPG, it have dialog trees, there would be Commendation Options (Rank 4) depending on mission, a Career Class Option, a Racial Species Option (Examples: Nerve Pinch option -Vulcan, a Seduce option -Orion/TOS Human, Read Thoughts -Betazed, Duel/Melee -Klingon/Andorian, Murder 'Tal Shiar Spy' or Cunning 'Republic INT' -Romulan, or others as Cryptic thinks suit a Species for the Mission) or the typical 'try your luck' of individual Captains Choices depending what they choose. The goal here is more choice to some that may influence or change how the story is told, adapts, or unfolds in some ways smaller, others larger... ...it may add additional optional objectives based on choices, or how the paths forward in the mission changes. Some may have opportunity for Accolades, or Titles, more importantly the story adapt a bit more to choices made. For example maybe choosing Tacitcal 4, might find an alternative path into a Building; yet to find it may require Colonial 4 (and initiative) first to speak to Colonists caught in conflict or Refugees nearby.
.So when developing new Missions, please consider how the choices influence story objectives to be a bit more dynamic.
Part III
Do nothing it's FINE just as it is, just maybe add a few more Commendation Opportunities in future missions.
Anyways just some thoughts to throw out and see what others think. I wanted to open this up to a Debate, invite others to submit other ideas, if others have some comment below or tag me; I can also add a Part IV option as a 4th Poll Choice. Then others can also see who contributed what at different points as well.
I mean what always encouraged me about Star Trek, then even more in TNG Forward, was the attempts to use Diplomacy, Cunning, Wit, and Intelligence to avoid Conflict. And when all else failed, they at least more often tried to limit casualties... ...rather than (always) a fight to the death, which I admit depends on Racial Species, or Choices made by individual Captains and how they perhaps got into the situation.
Okay, give a few people time to review or consider suggesting changes. Of course like all later Polls, asking does not mean receiving, just a way to provide feedback and see if they might be able to find a solution that could incorporate some of the idea's more.
Post edited by baddmoonrizin on
0
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
I suppose Cryptic could add a "lower violence" setting to the game where enemies are all just stunned and ships don't blow up they just disappear to lower the rendering load and keep the map visible.
For now, you're free to imagine that you beamed the enemy off-ship into a holding tank.
But I enjoy The Great Badlands Turkey Shoot!
By now, any time my ship warps into a system most of the enemy should be fleeing in terror aside from battle junkies that want to challenge the blood-soaked slaughterer of tens of thousands. Even my newest KDF captain has dismembered close to 1,000 enemies in single combat and destroyed well over 500 ships.
In MMO terms though, people say they want less violent stories like Sunrise then say they are boring to replay. Action episodes have a higher replay value than walking and talking episodes.
If we followed your thought-train, Cryptic would also have to change the game mechanics so capturing ships or stunning crews are profitable.
Roddenberry was only a pseudo-hippy anyway. Post-scarcity dreams can only be sold for dollars and cents; And players can only be motivated by credits, dilithium, and vender trash.
Roddenberry made Nimoy wear the IDIC pendant on the show so that he could sell it to fans. He might have liked the idea of a future Federation without greed, but he had a certain amount of it himself.
And wrote lyrics for the Star Trek theme (which weren't used) just so he could get half the royalties for the theme song.
Also if anyone else has an idea post it. and tag me in it and I'll review and add it above.
Of course the LAST choice to include is Leave as is.
I just never BEFORE seen anyone ask others for Discussion prior to creating a Poll - So thought I'd try.
That would be nifty, though waiting 5-7 years for new content would be hard. Also having to deal with CBS deciding what is and isn't allowed such as "no playable android captains".
Part III suggested by @paradox#7391
If STO was an RPG, it have dialog trees, there would be Commendation Options (Rank 3/4), a Career Option, a Racial Species Option, a Seduce option, a Murder Option depending on Mission. Each have opportunity for Accolades, and perhaps Titles. Where you'd have more than one option, aside from the preset choices where you try your luck--possible unexpected result as before.
Yet would need to confirm from him this is alright before I add a third option.
I admit his idea has me a bit intrigued; as I've always wanted to see slight variations of how story's unfold. It could even offer a mix of Commendation Rank 3-4, with also a few as he suggested. Perhaps both II & III would allow you to earn different Accolades, or even Titles too depending upon the mission.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I'm fine with it
I could see female Orions having the seduce option. As for the diplomatic option, the Federation, the KDF, Romulans, etc. Murder option would be the KDF, Romulans, and others that are not the Federation. I would support more career focused objectives in missions and I would like them to return. As well as not be bugged. Also, using the Commendation perks to unlock dialog options. I would also support missions where the ship just needs to be disabled and not destroyed. The idea of Stun or rendering someone unconscious would be great in a ground revamp since we already have animations for someone being vaporized or just dying without being vaporized. Another idea I have is for the ability to use your tac, eng, and sci BOFFs to help complete accolades where you need all three careers and not just asking for people of other careers to help you complete those.
I'm fine with it
Federation should also have the seduce option considering both Kirk and Riker, however Vulcans shouldn't get it unless you can explain why they're in Pon Farr mode.
Dammit! Now I'll have "Turkey in the Straw" playing in my head every time I go there. Thanks a lot!
I'll just have to have "Yakkety Sax" playing instead. Everything is more hilarious with "Yakkety Sax"!
To be fair, a large part of the misery in those missions is caused by the horribly -wriiten, -acted, and -directed NPCs, who make you wish for MORE violence...toward them. I'd love "Of Bajor" if there was this line for the PC: "LIEUTENANT Achebe, watch your tone of voice with a superior officer, or you'll spend the rest of your career on latrine duty in a Phage ward!" And from then on, she phrases everything as requests to a superior (which they ARE), chucking in enough "please sir"s or "please ma'am"s to sound like she's auditioning for a production of "Oliver".
And that whiny Reman in Coliseum - my Klingon alts would have given him an honourable death in the desert, rather than waste all that time and trouble running around finding homeopathic medicines for him. Why is there never an Undine when you need one? The Weak Shall Perish! Yeah, right!
Same with Tasha Yar in Temporal Ambassador, during the force field run in the boarding corridor. We should have an option to say, "You think you can do better? Then YOU hack the force fields, and I'll stand and unhelpfuly snark at you, b*tch! See how you like it." Cryptic's VO Director's idea of urgency is "whiny disrespect".
Kurland's snotty "Now, do YOU have anything to add?" in a supposedly diplomatic meeting is another one. Here you are, his superior in rank, in his own service (or in a foreign one with whom he is supposedly trying to ally), and his tone of voice is one that should be reserved for speaking to an Academy recruit caught taking a leak on Boothby's prize roses!
The real problem, though, is that the non-combat tasks Cryptic DOES add are things that your crew ought be doing, not a commanding officer. They did it right on Nimbus, when installing the bar replicator involved you ordering a DOFF mission. And aboard DS9, when Ambassador S'Tassk asks a KDF player character to have his DOFFs run spy missions, rather than asking the PC to do it himself. But on Bajor? Repair consoles? Sure, I'll have a couple of Engineering DOFFs handle it. Burn incense, or read the Temple books? Looks like a job for Science DOFFs, not an Admiral or General.
Neelix's tasks on the Talaxian asteroid base are even worse. Fix consoles? Engineering DOFFs. COLLECT FRELLING COOKING SPICES!? REALLY?!! Well, I have chef DOFFs that would be insulted to be asked to do that. Maybe a Quartermaster, or ... no, even better, a REFUGEE DOFF! Yeah, that's the ticket! Put one of those slackers to work for a change! The point is, high-ranking officers should never get jobs like that. The magic word is delegation. The ability to command and delegate tasks is a huge part of being a COMMANDING Officer.
Aye, there's the rub! Cryptic runs a Klingon Recruitment event, in order to attract new players. One of the first places you have to go in KDF (and where you will spend much time) is First City. On the most frequently used path, between the Bank/Mail/Exchange cluster and everywhere else, a place all the new people getting their first impressions of the game have to pass multiple times, are two Romulans chatting blithely about how nice things are, while they are EMBEDDED TO THEIR KNEES IN THE FLOOR! If this was Monty Python, that would be WAI and hilarious. As a Star Trek game's first impression to new players it's disgracefully shoddy QA. Similar seated people clipping through the floors are to be seen on your ship. The TOS interior lounge/rec room and briefing rooms are further examples.
+1