Im not looking for a fight, im just saying that it seems like lip service, I understand fed side is full of whales that dont want to miss out and Im not trying to deny cryptic their revenue, but just dont say its year of Klingon and then do nothing significant.
What Klingon Only ship should they add then?
I am the first in line to put Cryptic to the fire, but lets be honest here.. they have to work with the material given and Star Trek is told mostly from a Federation Perspective. Most of the ships shown on screen are Federation Ships with the other factions making little more then 'cameo appearances,' so obviously there is far more material to draw from for Feds.
Which KDF only ship do you think should be added to the game? Discovery is the most recent (non animated) series and all of the ships from that show have been added. So what's missing?
K'vort, the Gr'oth variant D-7, Goroth's ship from ENT episode Bounty...
At some point you are going to have to give in that they are NOT focusing on the KDF...
Um... wut? I am quite literally confused by this statement.
I never said they were focusing on the KDF. I'm saying that a lot of OTHER people expected a total dead stop to anything BUT KDF attention.
The Gr'oth was a normal D7. The DS9 crew took liberties when they made "Trials and Tribble-ations" but the remastered TOS, which came out later, had it has a normal D7, which makes it a normal D7 in canon.
The K'vort was an alternate timeline name for the B'rel that was larger, and footage of the K'Vort from "Yesterday's Enterprise" was used in a later episode, and it was specifically called a B'rel in that episode. Its the same ship.
and how many alternate timeline ships are already in the game? Galaxy-X for example? BTW the K'vort appeared in The Defector, which preceded Yesterdays enterprise by weeks when it aired. it is NOT the same as a B'rel, any more than Enterprise CV 6 is the same as Enterprise CVN-65
No one ever claimed that YOK meant KDF content only.
No one ever claimed that YOK meant the other factions would not get any content of their own.
No one ever said either of those things.
The misunderstanding some people seem to have is regarding the AMOUNT of content Klingons would get, and the AMOUNT of content other factions would get. Some people seem to think YOK meant the MAJORITY (not all) of content would be for the KDF, not the other factions. And for better or worse, that simply isn't true. What is true is that Klingons are getting more content than they normally would in a "normal" (non YOK) year.
So when you respond to someone who misunderstood the AMOUNT of content YOK meant ffor both KDF and non-KDF factions, don't act like they said YOK meant ONLY klingon content when they didn't say that.
No one ever claimed that YOK meant KDF content only.
No one ever claimed that YOK meant the other factions would not get any content of their own.
No one ever said either of those things.
Nagus, there have been many people, both on here, and on Reddit, saying that they though YoK would mean we would only get KDF content, and have based Cryptic for giving any of the factions content at all.
I'm sorry, but that is an extreme exaggeration of what the actual "complaint" is. No one said that YOK literally meant ONLY klingon content, and that the other factions would get NO content at all. No. one. said. that.
It is true, however, that some people are upset that Klingons are not getting as MUCH(key word) content as they THOUGHT they would (and that misunderstand is their own fault, I agree). But because some people are upset about that, every time a non-Klingon ship gets released they complain about it and say (to paraphrase) "I thought this was supposed to be YOK!".
But when they say "I thought this was supposed to be YOK!" they are expressing what I just said above. It means "I thought the majority of content this year was supposed to be for Klingons!". It does not mean "YOK is literally supposed to be KDF content only".
So if you actually want to have a discussion with these people (why else reply to their post?) then reply to their actual issue/misunderstanding.
In fact, the OP of this thread is the perfect example of what I'm saying. If you read through all of his posts he never claims YOK is supposed to be KDF content only. He is simply upset because he thinks there is not ENOUGH kdf content (ships in this case) compared to the non KDF ships being released recently.
Whether you agree with his opinion or not doesn't really matter (it's completely subjective). What does matter is his issue is NOT "YOK means KDF content only", it is that he feels Klingons should be getting MORE content(ships) than they have so far. Those 2 statements/issue are not the same thing.
Thinking "YOK = KDF only" is clearly an unreasonable opinion. Thinking they have not released enough KDF ships so far is not (it's valid, whether you agree or not). So don't try to paint those unhappy with YOK as if they have the extremely unreasonable opinion of "YOK = KDF only" when that's not their actual issue.
rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,586Community Moderator
There have been people who went that far though.
And what happened when something NOT Klingon related came up? Instant accusations of lies and complaints about the Year of Klingon being over already. We saw it with the Lower Decks DOffs, we saw it with the Inquiry class, and we saw it with the Nebula revamp. Hell... I think there were complaints with the new carriers, DESPITE HAVING A KLINGON CARRIER ADDED AS WELL.
Hell... we had some in this very thread. And when confronted with how much Klingon content has been released, and the fact that there's more coming... just gets blown off in favor of MORE complaining that they didn't get anything.
Its not just a few people complaining about not getting enough. There literally are people who believed, and some who probably still believe, that Year of Klingon = full dead stop to anything NOT Klingon. And if something not Klingon comes out... WE'VE BEEN LIED TO! GET THE PITCHFORKS!
Even Darkblade had to address that issue in this very thread!
All I can tell you is I have not seen anyone actually say that "YOK = KDF only" or "YOK = literally no content for the other factions".
To be clear, I'm not claiming some people aren't being unreasonable. I'm not claiming some people aren't saying Cryptic "lied" or "YOK is over", or whatever.
But if you have actually seen someone say "YOK = KDF only" or "YOK = literally no content for other factions" please show me. I would actually like to see that so I can know it's real.
For the record: I am willing to admit that I may be wrong. Someone may have literally said YOK = KDF only. All I can say is that I haven't seen it, and if you HAVE seen it please post a link. That's not a challenge; it's me wanting to actually see it.
That said, until I do see it I have to maintain my position that that is not actually what people are saying. And even if some are saying it, that should not be attributed to people like the OP (who has definitely not said it in this thread).
The thing is, the statement "YOK = KDF only" is borderline insane. The OP thinking there should be more(not "only") KDF ships and less(not "zero") non-KDF ships is a valid opinion (whether you agree with it or not). So it's not right to treat his valid opinion like it's insane.
Im not looking for a fight, im just saying that it seems like lip service, I understand fed side is full of whales that dont want to miss out and Im not trying to deny cryptic their revenue, but just dont say its year of Klingon and then do nothing significant.
What Klingon Only ship should they add then?
I am the first in line to put Cryptic to the fire, but lets be honest here.. they have to work with the material given and Star Trek is told mostly from a Federation Perspective. Most of the ships shown on screen are Federation Ships with the other factions making little more then 'cameo appearances,' so obviously there is far more material to draw from for Feds.
Which KDF only ship do you think should be added to the game? Discovery is the most recent (non animated) series and all of the ships from that show have been added. So what's missing?
A D7 for Zen.
ALL the D7's are whale-only, hidden behind lockboxes or massive amounts of ec most casual players will never see. The D7 is perhaps, arguably, the second most iconic Klingon ship in the canon behind (or alongside perhaps) the Bird of Prey.
Give us a D7, even a legendary for 6k like the Rom and you'll see the majority of us Klinks silenced and purring like a Targ being given a tummy tickle!
I'm pretty sure they confirmed all the KDF specific missions will get revamped. P1 covered the tutorial and Empire arcs, so P2 will cover the Warzone and Fek'ihri arcs most likely.
They have previously talked about how the big attack on the Federation in the Warzone arc will be a much bigger battle.
Cool, I hope those plans work out. Look forward to replying them after they are updated
The attack on the Mars shipyards is still my fave mission of all of them to be honest. The only one I replay for funm when I'm bored.
> @fallenkezef#4581 said: > (Quote) > > A D7 for Zen. > > ALL the D7's are whale-only,
-------------
There is a t5 K'tinga in the regular ship store, for what that's worth.
> @somtaawkhar said: > (Quote) > I would suspect there is no zen based T6 D7 for the same reason there isn't one for the Connie, aka CBS mandates. If not directly mandated by CBS, then they did it for faction parity so that the Feds, and KDF, had their respective era "hero" ships obtained in the same manner. > > If we do get a C-store D7, it will almost certainly be the same deal as the Legendary Fed pack was, and you wont be ale to buy it seperatly out of that pack. ------------
The D7 is the KDF equivalent of the TOS rom BOP(and the same promo pack rarity). I'm not sure why they decide to release the BOP individually, but there is that precedent now.
That said, I do agree a multie ship pack is more likely, simply for the reason of it having a higher price tag attached.
I think the fed focused players tend to miss, sometimes deliberately, the point here.
KDF players, for the most part, are not demanding a halt to all content but KDF. What they are asking for is a bit more parity. The YoK thing feels token and in many ways not what we have been asking for.
I think I speak for many KDF players here, what we want isn't a revamp of missions we've already done. The OP trait for the new fed ship is an example, the two space barbie bundles for the fed ships recently is another example.
If KDF players had a space barbie bundle for the Vorcha would be welcome. Hell more space barbie options in general would go a long way to satisfying KDF wishes. The whole series of "bug" BoP ships at lower tiers are awesome but we can't use them at T6.
More raptor options would be great, it's not a huge ask for some space barbie options
But if you have actually seen someone say "YOK = KDF only" or "YOK = literally no content for other factions" please show me. I would actually like to see that so I can know it's real.
I would... except all the ones I can think of have been Redacted by Mods due to flames.
I am not sure a KDF legendary bundle or even ship will happen. I don’t think the Romulan BOP sold very well. And the reason was probably the price point. But Cryptic doesn’t seem interested in walking back prices—so I think even a 6,000 zen D7 may Be a hard sell
I think the best is to come back to balance, they used to release Fed, Rom and KDF ships for example in the past and occasionally now a 4 ship pack(we had warships, sci ships and carriers so far I believe although the sci might had been a 2-pack, I dont remember). They could instead rushing to release a single fed ship(to aggressive monetization lately) to take their time and make packs that include all 4. For content no matter if to some of us feels slow or fast, they are doing a Klingon revamp as promised so no complaints there and they added already 2 episodes with good quality.
For ships, well Feds are probably 2/3 fanbase and the rush they get things out(mostly into one of two lockbox types) along with the monetization of various things over last year suggests they may need more cash but they dont want to increase for example the price of zen store ships in fear of the reactions. More likely its a combination of Covid and development costs of a modern game(Magic Legends) that drove them to that. I dont like many of their moves but I like the game overall(of course there are things they can improve but overall its positive) and I do like they do something for us, KDF players, after a long time
I am not sure a KDF legendary bundle or even ship will happen. I don’t think the Romulan BOP sold very well. And the reason was probably the price point. But Cryptic doesn’t seem interested in walking back prices—so I think even a 6,000 zen D7 may Be a hard sell
I think the fed focused players tend to miss, sometimes deliberately, the point here.
KDF players, for the most part, are not demanding a halt to all content but KDF. What they are asking for is a bit more parity. The YoK thing feels token and in many ways not what we have been asking for.
I think I speak for many KDF players here, what we want isn't a revamp of missions we've already done. The OP trait for the new fed ship is an example, the two space barbie bundles for the fed ships recently is another example.
If KDF players had a space barbie bundle for the Vorcha would be welcome. Hell more space barbie options in general would go a long way to satisfying KDF wishes. The whole series of "bug" BoP ships at lower tiers are awesome but we can't use them at T6.
More raptor options would be great, it's not a huge ask for some space barbie options
I think that Klingon ships as a whole are really missing a lot of options for space barbie when it comes to what is available at endgame. The following are canon ships that have space barbie parts and are currently endgame:
- B'rel bird-of-prey has the base B'rel (starter ship), the Koloth which came free with the B'rel, the B'rotlh (formerly a C-store ship, now obtainable via dilithium purchase per character) & the Kor.
- Negh'Var Heavy Battlecruiser has the base (Tier 4) with 2 versions, a second skin that has 2 versions and a third skin that is single. The only other part you can get for the ship is at Tier 6 which is the Negh'Tev Heavy Battlecruiser.
- The Vor'cha Battlecruiser starts as the base (Tier 5) and gets the Vor'kang as an alternative part for space barbie. There's a Tier 5 mirror version which unlocks a skin if you own it, but this ship didn't get a c-store equivalent version, only a fleet version which unlocks another set of parts, but costs 4 fleet ship modules to acquire. As we witnessed, the Vor'cha finally got some love with the Vor'ral Support Cruiser, being paired with the Ambassador Tier 6.
- D7/K't'inga Battlecruiser is an interesting ship. Before Tier 6 became possible for leveling, The K't'inga was one of the earlier canon ships that could be obtained via leveling up. The D7 and the K't'inga use the same parts, so the Tier 3 ship had the aging D7, K't'inga and K't'inga refit parts unlocked at the start. The Koro't'inga parts are unlocked via purchase from the ship vendor (originally C-store). There's also the Temporal D7 skin option which only gets unlocked via owning the T6 D7 Temporal Battlecruiser, which is the only Tier 6 version of the ship.
- There is a raptor that you could say came from Enterprise (it's not the same ship, more like a recreated variant), the Somraw raptor, but to this date it remains the only ship from canon that has no Tier 6 version and also has the fewest options, only having the base skin or a mirror skin.
- Then there is the D5 which was placed as a counterpart to the playable version of the Kobayashi Maru and made a freighter.
As far as canon ships go, I only see 2 others that currently exist that are distinct enough to be made into ships for the Klingons/
1. 21st Century Bird-of-Prey which would be more likely saved for an Enterprise series pack, were they to do it.
2. 21st century Warship This is another ship that existed around the time of Archer and was used by a Klingon Augment Warrior. It looks bird-of-prey ish and almost like it could pass for the child of a B'rel and a D5. Since its another Enterprise ship, I am willing to bet they'd save it too for a possible Enterpise pack.
So, in all, there's really only 2 ships left from canon that could be made to fill out the rosters. The only other thing I could think of would be that they take their older designed ships and Tier 6 them so that there's more variety, but that's a stretch.
Comments
K'vort, the Gr'oth variant D-7, Goroth's ship from ENT episode Bounty...
Um... wut? I am quite literally confused by this statement.
I never said they were focusing on the KDF. I'm saying that a lot of OTHER people expected a total dead stop to anything BUT KDF attention.
and how many alternate timeline ships are already in the game? Galaxy-X for example? BTW the K'vort appeared in The Defector, which preceded Yesterdays enterprise by weeks when it aired. it is NOT the same as a B'rel, any more than Enterprise CV 6 is the same as Enterprise CVN-65
No one ever claimed that YOK meant KDF content only.
No one ever claimed that YOK meant the other factions would not get any content of their own.
No one ever said either of those things.
The misunderstanding some people seem to have is regarding the AMOUNT of content Klingons would get, and the AMOUNT of content other factions would get. Some people seem to think YOK meant the MAJORITY (not all) of content would be for the KDF, not the other factions. And for better or worse, that simply isn't true. What is true is that Klingons are getting more content than they normally would in a "normal" (non YOK) year.
So when you respond to someone who misunderstood the AMOUNT of content YOK meant ffor both KDF and non-KDF factions, don't act like they said YOK meant ONLY klingon content when they didn't say that.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I'm sorry, but that is an extreme exaggeration of what the actual "complaint" is. No one said that YOK literally meant ONLY klingon content, and that the other factions would get NO content at all. No. one. said. that.
It is true, however, that some people are upset that Klingons are not getting as MUCH(key word) content as they THOUGHT they would (and that misunderstand is their own fault, I agree). But because some people are upset about that, every time a non-Klingon ship gets released they complain about it and say (to paraphrase) "I thought this was supposed to be YOK!".
But when they say "I thought this was supposed to be YOK!" they are expressing what I just said above. It means "I thought the majority of content this year was supposed to be for Klingons!". It does not mean "YOK is literally supposed to be KDF content only".
So if you actually want to have a discussion with these people (why else reply to their post?) then reply to their actual issue/misunderstanding.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Whether you agree with his opinion or not doesn't really matter (it's completely subjective). What does matter is his issue is NOT "YOK means KDF content only", it is that he feels Klingons should be getting MORE content(ships) than they have so far. Those 2 statements/issue are not the same thing.
Thinking "YOK = KDF only" is clearly an unreasonable opinion. Thinking they have not released enough KDF ships so far is not (it's valid, whether you agree or not). So don't try to paint those unhappy with YOK as if they have the extremely unreasonable opinion of "YOK = KDF only" when that's not their actual issue.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
And what happened when something NOT Klingon related came up? Instant accusations of lies and complaints about the Year of Klingon being over already. We saw it with the Lower Decks DOffs, we saw it with the Inquiry class, and we saw it with the Nebula revamp. Hell... I think there were complaints with the new carriers, DESPITE HAVING A KLINGON CARRIER ADDED AS WELL.
Hell... we had some in this very thread. And when confronted with how much Klingon content has been released, and the fact that there's more coming... just gets blown off in favor of MORE complaining that they didn't get anything.
Its not just a few people complaining about not getting enough. There literally are people who believed, and some who probably still believe, that Year of Klingon = full dead stop to anything NOT Klingon. And if something not Klingon comes out... WE'VE BEEN LIED TO! GET THE PITCHFORKS!
Even Darkblade had to address that issue in this very thread!
All I can tell you is I have not seen anyone actually say that "YOK = KDF only" or "YOK = literally no content for the other factions".
To be clear, I'm not claiming some people aren't being unreasonable. I'm not claiming some people aren't saying Cryptic "lied" or "YOK is over", or whatever.
But if you have actually seen someone say "YOK = KDF only" or "YOK = literally no content for other factions" please show me. I would actually like to see that so I can know it's real.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
That said, until I do see it I have to maintain my position that that is not actually what people are saying. And even if some are saying it, that should not be attributed to people like the OP (who has definitely not said it in this thread).
The thing is, the statement "YOK = KDF only" is borderline insane. The OP thinking there should be more(not "only") KDF ships and less(not "zero") non-KDF ships is a valid opinion (whether you agree with it or not). So it's not right to treat his valid opinion like it's insane.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
A D7 for Zen.
ALL the D7's are whale-only, hidden behind lockboxes or massive amounts of ec most casual players will never see. The D7 is perhaps, arguably, the second most iconic Klingon ship in the canon behind (or alongside perhaps) the Bird of Prey.
Give us a D7, even a legendary for 6k like the Rom and you'll see the majority of us Klinks silenced and purring like a Targ being given a tummy tickle!
The attack on the Mars shipyards is still my fave mission of all of them to be honest. The only one I replay for funm when I'm bored.
> (Quote)
>
> A D7 for Zen.
>
> ALL the D7's are whale-only,
-------------
There is a t5 K'tinga in the regular ship store, for what that's worth.
> @somtaawkhar said:
> (Quote)
> I would suspect there is no zen based T6 D7 for the same reason there isn't one for the Connie, aka CBS mandates. If not directly mandated by CBS, then they did it for faction parity so that the Feds, and KDF, had their respective era "hero" ships obtained in the same manner.
>
> If we do get a C-store D7, it will almost certainly be the same deal as the Legendary Fed pack was, and you wont be ale to buy it seperatly out of that pack.
------------
The D7 is the KDF equivalent of the TOS rom BOP(and the same promo pack rarity). I'm not sure why they decide to release the BOP individually, but there is that precedent now.
That said, I do agree a multie ship pack is more likely, simply for the reason of it having a higher price tag attached.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
KDF players, for the most part, are not demanding a halt to all content but KDF. What they are asking for is a bit more parity. The YoK thing feels token and in many ways not what we have been asking for.
I think I speak for many KDF players here, what we want isn't a revamp of missions we've already done. The OP trait for the new fed ship is an example, the two space barbie bundles for the fed ships recently is another example.
If KDF players had a space barbie bundle for the Vorcha would be welcome. Hell more space barbie options in general would go a long way to satisfying KDF wishes. The whole series of "bug" BoP ships at lower tiers are awesome but we can't use them at T6.
More raptor options would be great, it's not a huge ask for some space barbie options
I would... except all the ones I can think of have been Redacted by Mods due to flames.
For ships, well Feds are probably 2/3 fanbase and the rush they get things out(mostly into one of two lockbox types) along with the monetization of various things over last year suggests they may need more cash but they dont want to increase for example the price of zen store ships in fear of the reactions. More likely its a combination of Covid and development costs of a modern game(Magic Legends) that drove them to that. I dont like many of their moves but I like the game overall(of course there are things they can improve but overall its positive) and I do like they do something for us, KDF players, after a long time
You underestimate the KDF playerbase.
I think that Klingon ships as a whole are really missing a lot of options for space barbie when it comes to what is available at endgame. The following are canon ships that have space barbie parts and are currently endgame:
- B'rel bird-of-prey has the base B'rel (starter ship), the Koloth which came free with the B'rel, the B'rotlh (formerly a C-store ship, now obtainable via dilithium purchase per character) & the Kor.
- Negh'Var Heavy Battlecruiser has the base (Tier 4) with 2 versions, a second skin that has 2 versions and a third skin that is single. The only other part you can get for the ship is at Tier 6 which is the Negh'Tev Heavy Battlecruiser.
- The Vor'cha Battlecruiser starts as the base (Tier 5) and gets the Vor'kang as an alternative part for space barbie. There's a Tier 5 mirror version which unlocks a skin if you own it, but this ship didn't get a c-store equivalent version, only a fleet version which unlocks another set of parts, but costs 4 fleet ship modules to acquire. As we witnessed, the Vor'cha finally got some love with the Vor'ral Support Cruiser, being paired with the Ambassador Tier 6.
- D7/K't'inga Battlecruiser is an interesting ship. Before Tier 6 became possible for leveling, The K't'inga was one of the earlier canon ships that could be obtained via leveling up. The D7 and the K't'inga use the same parts, so the Tier 3 ship had the aging D7, K't'inga and K't'inga refit parts unlocked at the start. The Koro't'inga parts are unlocked via purchase from the ship vendor (originally C-store). There's also the Temporal D7 skin option which only gets unlocked via owning the T6 D7 Temporal Battlecruiser, which is the only Tier 6 version of the ship.
- There is a raptor that you could say came from Enterprise (it's not the same ship, more like a recreated variant), the Somraw raptor, but to this date it remains the only ship from canon that has no Tier 6 version and also has the fewest options, only having the base skin or a mirror skin.
- Then there is the D5 which was placed as a counterpart to the playable version of the Kobayashi Maru and made a freighter.
As far as canon ships go, I only see 2 others that currently exist that are distinct enough to be made into ships for the Klingons/
1. 21st Century Bird-of-Prey which would be more likely saved for an Enterprise series pack, were they to do it.
2. 21st century Warship This is another ship that existed around the time of Archer and was used by a Klingon Augment Warrior. It looks bird-of-prey ish and almost like it could pass for the child of a B'rel and a D5. Since its another Enterprise ship, I am willing to bet they'd save it too for a possible Enterpise pack.
So, in all, there's really only 2 ships left from canon that could be made to fill out the rosters. The only other thing I could think of would be that they take their older designed ships and Tier 6 them so that there's more variety, but that's a stretch.