but why cant cryptic just offer ships as a single buy without the disco ball and gambling around it all? many people have expressed the desire to obtain one or two even if the single price was a tad higher then the norm.
They can, they just don't want/need to.
And why should they? They currently put the most desirable ships behind the 'gamble wall' and guess what? People fork out the money. They pay those prices to get the ship so Cryptic simply has no motivation to bundle the ships for a more 'reasonable' price. Why lower the price on something that's already selling at the inflated rate?
I won't go into my personal opinion on rather or not I feel the cost is warranted, I am just explaining why (in my opinion) that Cryptic doesn't sell single promo ships for 'slightly more.' It's because right now, they're 'way more' and people are paying. Until that changes, Cryptic has no reason to re-examine the policy.
Frankly, what grinds my gears the most about this bundle is all the unnecessary fluff they piled on top to justify the high cost.
Cut. It. Out.
Plus the illusion of some kind of Romulan Republic exclusivity is annoying.
The current campaign to earn your choice of a free T6 C-Store ship or a lobi ship
Zero cost for playing all content including TFOs, with no very long lockout period like in MMOs that sell their expansions
No cost for crafting materials (you can earn more than enough in-game) or for upgrading gear to endgame level. And trading dil for upgrade tokens gets you a tiny, tiny chance of also getting another T6 even ship.
The ability to earn cash shop currency in-game, and for players to sell gamble box content on the exchange
Your definition of "worst/greedy" is ... different.
The current campaign to earn your choice of a free T6 C-Store ship or a lobi ship
Zero cost for playing all content including TFOs, with no very long lockout period like in MMOs that sell their expansions
No cost for crafting materials (you can earn more than enough in-game) or for upgrading gear to endgame level. And trading dil for upgrade tokens gets you a tiny, tiny chance of also getting another T6 even ship.
The ability to earn cash shop currency in-game, and for players to sell gamble box content on the exchange
Your definition of "worst/greedy" is ... different.
While I am not the most enthusiastic person when it comes to Cryptic.. every word of this is ridiculous. They're not perfect by any means.. but come on. Pay2win? Seriously?
I personally think they should just lock it behind lock boxes as it originally was and let that be that. Players will still pay the massively inflated prices but then the conversation wouldn't cause introspective, it would literally be players begging to pay any price if it was in the C-store. As opposed to them decrying that any price that requires an ounce of sacrifice is too high. Players need to understand their role in this and stop pointing fingers without reflection. It's predictable but that's just me.
As it seems any price that's not free for a ship that costed players that own the TOS ships that much money wouldn't be enough. Everyone is saying how unfair it is to them they have to pay such a discounted price for a ship plus fanfare. What about the people that paid the ultimate price for it. The 1.5B for it. They paid more for less and now it's released for pennies on the dollar.
I also find it hard to believe most players are losing as much money on a game that literally gives you all types of ways to negate prices and make your own discounts with in game work that transfers to real world money. With so many alts dropping Dil and zen trades and whatnot. How any item isn't absolutely free is beyond me. I have only one toon and a few recruit toons and I understand this dynamic without ever doing it. But that's just me. Players make it seem as if they are starting from absolute zero on any of this stuff. I guess it's easier to complain about perceived numbers then to actually put in the work and realize. Wait I am paying 15.00 for it. Or 35.00 for it. or 50.00 for it. Is it worth that? With the dil I I have on my toon currently just from Dil I would be paying about 5.00 for this ship. So keep that in mind
$100+ for 1 ship and a cheap lvl boost is just plain stupid and beyond greedy.
Yes, its absurd but STO is full of great ships that you need only a fraction if at all of that price to be effective* so enjoy these
Its a f2p game but they need income to keep the lights on and they need to test out new methods of income in case other sources might become less reliable or cant be used anymore.
*Unless you PvP then you are <insert favorite explicit word here>.
To be honest, the most glaring flaw in the "STO is Pay to Win" argument is that there is almost no content with a fail condition.
I actually miss this because it results in skipped optional objectives in TFOs(though if you TRIBBLE up a few optional objectives on some TFOs it will fail them), resulting in less mark payout for such. I remember the amount of missions and stuff that could fail back in the day...yeah some needed fixed, but generally it's hard to now.
As for the argument of the others stating P2W: Ehhh...this game does give you actual T6 stuff if you play, grind if you will, and with enough leeway for missing a couple or few of days of an event. Everything can be earned in game, paying Zen just speeds up and helps keep a subscription from existing anymore.
As for the Bundle: Seems expensive at first, but you won't buy at full price if you get it at the offered deal. You are getting character maxed to 65 ready to be customized without waiting to set skills; an account wide ship and trait after getting a character only T6 ship trait from R/D promo ship -Built to Last, and Zen store normal T6 trait-Withering Barrage. Getting 3 set consoles from the T5, T6, now Dil only T1, and a R&D Promotion only console. You are in addition getting 1,000,000 Expertise, 250,000 Rep Dilithium Vouchers, meaning you can avoid using any you earn to get Reps to Tier 6, and focus earned Dil on upgrade a character's stuff, fleet, or slot projects. Instant +36 Inventory, +12 Bank, +6 Boff officer slots, +2 ship slots, and + 5 Specialization Qualifications for Boff training.
Things that should be questioned: Are the +6 VR BOFFs, even upped to commander, with XIV VR gear, along with the XIV VR suite of gear provided for space and ground defined? What type of Gear? What Traits on the Boffs? What Species? Do they have good threads to wear? Have they been hit by the ugly stick?
Things that should get side eyed:One Million EC is a small sum considering Exchange, should probably make it 50 Million EC considering the Exchange's rapid fluctuating inflation, and to sweeten the deal per say. The 5 Enhanced Universal Tech Upgrades...Should either alter the amount to 10-15, or make the 5 Ultimate Tech Upgrades.
They said that all the Standard Boff Powers for their profession (Science, etc.) will be automatically learned. Now since this is an Intel/Command Ship I wonder if all Boffs will have those Specs and all those Powers also learned.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
There are two major factors that determine a price. The amount of work you have to put in and the rarity of the item relative to demand. Obviously Cryptic didn't spend more time on the Picard T'liss than on any new c-store ship. In fact one could argue that since the new T'liss lacks its own console, it was even cheaper to create. The descision to sell one ship at $30 and the other at $120 is completely arbitrary at this point. Artificial scarcity for a digital item that could be created in infinite numbers without any additional effort.
Obviously Cryptic and STO need to be profitable. And the ship models that they make today are considerably more detailed than the first T6 ships they released. But I would rather have them increase the price of regular new c-store ships than making a copy of an existing ship, changing a few details, calling it "legendary" and selling it as a bundle-exclusive at 4x the price of the original.
$100+ for 1 ship and a cheap lvl boost is just plain stupid and beyond greedy.
I agree, that PWE has one of the worst/greedy Ingameshop in the world. ....
3 free T6 event ships per year.
The current campaign to earn your choice of a free T6 C-Store ship or a lobi ship
Zero cost for playing all content including TFOs, with no very long lockout period like in MMOs that sell their expansions
No cost for crafting materials (you can earn more than enough in-game) or for upgrading gear to endgame level. And trading dil for upgrade tokens gets you a tiny, tiny chance of also getting another T6 even ship.
The ability to earn cash shop currency in-game, and for players to sell gamble box content on the exchange
Your definition of "worst/greedy" is ... different.
Yeah, I never do lockboxes so I don't generate lobi. I bought out the event while the lobi sale was ongoing so now have all the major lobi consoles for the cost of 2k zen.
I've played REAL P2W mmo's and quit in disgust, STO is a great game with a pretty good marketing plan in my most humble of opinions.
Not sure how the game would be overall P2W. Is there p2w content? I guess if you stretch the imagination to include things like romulan minefield, That old star-base content, and maybe Crystalline encounter. Since those are heavily based on dps and players that pay tend to do a lot more dps then non paying players. But again. That's subjective since literally anyone can win those titles of number 1 depending on when you go in how often you go in and whom you go in with.
But in any other aspect it really doesn't matter how strong you are. In fact stronger players are actually a detriment to the game and not a boost with the way the game allocates resources.
Besides a few really specialized consoles and a trait here and there. And I do mean one or two here and there, there really isn't a real tangible reason to have to pay for anything in this game other then hubris.
There is no such thing as P2W in this particular F2P title. I loathe F2P in principle because it simply promotes an exploitative development policy which in my opinion is aimed at mental health issues to say the least. With that said...
In terms of 'winning' I consider STO to really be - wait for it...
SPACE BARBIE HO!
Seriously it is all about the way you build your toon and ship and what you are looking for in particular with different things.
Accordingly, to me a win constitutes the best possible build I can have at any particular time for any particular objective.
For example, my current win build on my main toon is a plasma primary DPS with a secondary DOT augment and tertiary bust DMG setup. My previous winning build was a Pen, Haste, Acc focused setup.
Regarding the other dimension of STO, I then use different concepts for the ground aspect so there is a mix option to prevent boredom with the mind-numbingly monotonous unnecessary grid do the stupid F2P nature.
Anyway, that is just my opinion. I could be wrong...
If you are looking for an excellent PvE fleet consider: Omega Combat Division today.
Former member of the Cryptic Family & FriendsTesting Team. Sadly, one day, it simply vanished - without a word or trace...
Comments
They can, they just don't want/need to.
And why should they? They currently put the most desirable ships behind the 'gamble wall' and guess what? People fork out the money. They pay those prices to get the ship so Cryptic simply has no motivation to bundle the ships for a more 'reasonable' price. Why lower the price on something that's already selling at the inflated rate?
I won't go into my personal opinion on rather or not I feel the cost is warranted, I am just explaining why (in my opinion) that Cryptic doesn't sell single promo ships for 'slightly more.' It's because right now, they're 'way more' and people are paying. Until that changes, Cryptic has no reason to re-examine the policy.
Cut. It. Out.
Plus the illusion of some kind of Romulan Republic exclusivity is annoying.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
3 free T6 event ships per year.
The current campaign to earn your choice of a free T6 C-Store ship or a lobi ship
Zero cost for playing all content including TFOs, with no very long lockout period like in MMOs that sell their expansions
No cost for crafting materials (you can earn more than enough in-game) or for upgrading gear to endgame level. And trading dil for upgrade tokens gets you a tiny, tiny chance of also getting another T6 even ship.
The ability to earn cash shop currency in-game, and for players to sell gamble box content on the exchange
Your definition of "worst/greedy" is ... different.
While I am not the most enthusiastic person when it comes to Cryptic.. every word of this is ridiculous. They're not perfect by any means.. but come on. Pay2win? Seriously?
Ridiculous.
As it seems any price that's not free for a ship that costed players that own the TOS ships that much money wouldn't be enough. Everyone is saying how unfair it is to them they have to pay such a discounted price for a ship plus fanfare. What about the people that paid the ultimate price for it. The 1.5B for it. They paid more for less and now it's released for pennies on the dollar.
I also find it hard to believe most players are losing as much money on a game that literally gives you all types of ways to negate prices and make your own discounts with in game work that transfers to real world money. With so many alts dropping Dil and zen trades and whatnot. How any item isn't absolutely free is beyond me. I have only one toon and a few recruit toons and I understand this dynamic without ever doing it. But that's just me. Players make it seem as if they are starting from absolute zero on any of this stuff. I guess it's easier to complain about perceived numbers then to actually put in the work and realize. Wait I am paying 15.00 for it. Or 35.00 for it. or 50.00 for it. Is it worth that? With the dil I I have on my toon currently just from Dil I would be paying about 5.00 for this ship. So keep that in mind
Yes, its absurd but STO is full of great ships that you need only a fraction if at all of that price to be effective* so enjoy these
Its a f2p game but they need income to keep the lights on and they need to test out new methods of income in case other sources might become less reliable or cant be used anymore.
*Unless you PvP then you are <insert favorite explicit word here>.
So what is the person winning?
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
Cryptic gives you 4 free T6 ships every year, and you can upgrade gear to XV Epic using free dilithium (Phoenix boxes => upgrade tokens).
What content requires more than that to win?
"The cosmetics I want aren't free" is NOT p2w.
As for the argument of the others stating P2W: Ehhh...this game does give you actual T6 stuff if you play, grind if you will, and with enough leeway for missing a couple or few of days of an event. Everything can be earned in game, paying Zen just speeds up and helps keep a subscription from existing anymore.
As for the Bundle: Seems expensive at first, but you won't buy at full price if you get it at the offered deal. You are getting character maxed to 65 ready to be customized without waiting to set skills; an account wide ship and trait after getting a character only T6 ship trait from R/D promo ship -Built to Last, and Zen store normal T6 trait-Withering Barrage. Getting 3 set consoles from the T5, T6, now Dil only T1, and a R&D Promotion only console. You are in addition getting 1,000,000 Expertise, 250,000 Rep Dilithium Vouchers, meaning you can avoid using any you earn to get Reps to Tier 6, and focus earned Dil on upgrade a character's stuff, fleet, or slot projects. Instant +36 Inventory, +12 Bank, +6 Boff officer slots, +2 ship slots, and + 5 Specialization Qualifications for Boff training.
Things that should be questioned: Are the +6 VR BOFFs, even upped to commander, with XIV VR gear, along with the XIV VR suite of gear provided for space and ground defined? What type of Gear? What Traits on the Boffs? What Species? Do they have good threads to wear? Have they been hit by the ugly stick?
Things that should get side eyed: One Million EC is a small sum considering Exchange, should probably make it 50 Million EC considering the Exchange's rapid fluctuating inflation, and to sweeten the deal per say. The 5 Enhanced Universal Tech Upgrades...Should either alter the amount to 10-15, or make the 5 Ultimate Tech Upgrades.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Obviously Cryptic and STO need to be profitable. And the ship models that they make today are considerably more detailed than the first T6 ships they released. But I would rather have them increase the price of regular new c-store ships than making a copy of an existing ship, changing a few details, calling it "legendary" and selling it as a bundle-exclusive at 4x the price of the original.
Yeah, I never do lockboxes so I don't generate lobi. I bought out the event while the lobi sale was ongoing so now have all the major lobi consoles for the cost of 2k zen.
I've played REAL P2W mmo's and quit in disgust, STO is a great game with a pretty good marketing plan in my most humble of opinions.
Once again, what are people "winning"?
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
But in any other aspect it really doesn't matter how strong you are. In fact stronger players are actually a detriment to the game and not a boost with the way the game allocates resources.
Besides a few really specialized consoles and a trait here and there. And I do mean one or two here and there, there really isn't a real tangible reason to have to pay for anything in this game other then hubris.
In terms of 'winning' I consider STO to really be - wait for it...
SPACE BARBIE HO!
Seriously it is all about the way you build your toon and ship and what you are looking for in particular with different things.
Accordingly, to me a win constitutes the best possible build I can have at any particular time for any particular objective.
For example, my current win build on my main toon is a plasma primary DPS with a secondary DOT augment and tertiary bust DMG setup. My previous winning build was a Pen, Haste, Acc focused setup.
Regarding the other dimension of STO, I then use different concepts for the ground aspect so there is a mix option to prevent boredom with the mind-numbingly monotonous unnecessary grid do the stupid F2P nature.
Anyway, that is just my opinion. I could be wrong...
ingame: @.Spartan
Original Cryptic Forum Name: Spartan (member #124)
The Glorious, Kirk’s Protegè