What makes a 300 or 3000 dollar ship better then a 30 dollar ship? Is there any advantage in paying more for a ship thats in a lock box compared to one thats on a C-Store? I may be somewhat ignorant but why pay hundreds even thousands of US dollars on a ship when a 30 or 40 dollar ship works and functions on equal ground? Am I missing something here?
Except for looks is there any tactical advantages? If it a certain ship type you want and want to have if you work hard I can see it to farm for or buy as far as favorite ships go. However tactical advantages wise whats the difference?
If it is just a off the wall ship someone drew up and then find it way in a lock box why should I pay 300 or 3000 dollars on it when I got other T6 ships that work just as well?
There are certainly people that buy some of these ships just for a particular thought-after starship mastery trait, and every lockbox/promo ships tend to have some combination of spec seats and bridge officer seats that's different from C-Store ships. These hips are in fact the only ones so far that have seats of two different specs. So yeah, you can make something a bit more powerful with these ships. But the differences are never that big that it really matters. With every Tier 6 ship you can make builds that serve you well for Advanced difficulty content at least, probably Elite as well.
I think the more "exciting" aspect of these ships is that you get visuals that you can't have otherwise. So it's enticing for collectors and people that fell in love with a particular starship. If you love the Defiant best, you're in luck, it's a C-Store ship, but if you love the DSC Constitution, you are going to have to buy a promo ship. (And if you love the Nova, you're out of luck, no Tier 6 version so far...) Other people love to fly the biggest and badass looking ship there are, and many of the big ones are lockbox/lobi/promo ships. Others like to show off with a rarely seen ship, and some of the lockbox/promo/lobi ships are rare. (Of course, I think that is partially countered by the fact that many C-Store ships have more kitbash options... But I guess if you want to be a special snowflake, flying a Benthan Cruiser could do the trick even better...)
Do any of these perks and differences justify the cost - well, we're talking about luxury goods here, so there is no objective answer. It's something for you. If all you worry about is making it through the content, levelling your reputations and being ready to handle whatever the next story mission is going to throw at you - you'll do fine without any promo/lockbox/lobi ships.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
These hips are in fact the only ones so far that have seats of two different specs.
I think the more "exciting" aspect of these ships is that you get visuals that you can't have otherwise.
The combination of these two aspects is exactly why I even bothered with *certain* lockbox- and promo-ships. Some of the traits/consoles/unique weapons are a nice bonus.
My only gripe is that promo is essentially the only way to get certain "hero-ships" at T6-level and without account-unlock. I perfectly understand those players who were really butthurt about this rather unfair way of generating revenue.
These hips are in fact the only ones so far that have seats of two different specs.
I think the more "exciting" aspect of these ships is that you get visuals that you can't have otherwise.
The combination of these two aspects is exactly why I even bothered with *certain* lockbox- and promo-ships. Some of the traits/consoles/unique weapons are a nice bonus.
My only gripe is that promo is essentially the only way to get certain "hero-ships" at T6-level and without account-unlock. I perfectly understand those players who were really butthurt about this rather unfair way of generating revenue.
"Sorry mom the mob has spoken." People chose the F2P model over subscriptions, this is one of the consequences of it. It's like ads on websites. We refused to subscribe to sites, we get ads. And a monorail!
What makes a 300 or 3000 dollar ship better then a 30 dollar ship? Is there any advantage in paying more for a ship thats in a lock box compared to one thats on a C-Store? I may be somewhat ignorant but why pay hundreds even thousands of US dollars on a ship when a 30 or 40 dollar ship works and functions on equal ground? Am I missing something here?
Except for looks is there any tactical advantages? If it a certain ship type you want and want to have if you work hard I can see it to farm for or buy as far as favorite ships go. However tactical advantages wise whats the difference?
If it is just a off the wall ship someone drew up and then find it way in a lock box why should I pay 300 or 3000 dollars on it when I got other T6 ships that work just as well?
As far as to what ship is "best" is subjective as there is no set in stone winner take all best ship. There are certain ships that will lend more advantages to certain build types than others, but that's where what is "best" ends. I've heard of guys spending over $400 on rare occasions before to get a ship to drop, but $3000, good grief man. That's 300,000 zen which is 2,660 lockbox keys with a value of 12,502,000,000 EC at 4.7m per key. You would need 7 toons just to hold all of that EC. That's at least 10 times the amount of EC you would need to buy virtually any ship in game at the moment that's not cstore. For that matter you could buy 100 cstore ships at 3k zen a pop. If someone drops $3000 and still can't get the ship they're after, they're doing something bad wrong.
As far as the game is right now, you can do fairly well in game using nothing but the free stuff they give you and the free ships they give you from leveling and events. Sure some of the other ships can give you some nice bells and whistles to play with, but they're absolutely not required in today's game or even yesterday's game. What someone loads a ship with and how they fly it will determine how effective that ship is. Even the most high end of promo ships can be outdone by a free ship if one pilot doesn't know what they're doing, but the other does.
These hips are in fact the only ones so far that have seats of two different specs.
I think the more "exciting" aspect of these ships is that you get visuals that you can't have otherwise.
The combination of these two aspects is exactly why I even bothered with *certain* lockbox- and promo-ships. Some of the traits/consoles/unique weapons are a nice bonus.
My only gripe is that promo is essentially the only way to get certain "hero-ships" at T6-level and without account-unlock. I perfectly understand those players who were really butthurt about this rather unfair way of generating revenue.
First, no one is forcing people to invest in lockbox/lobi or promo ships. If folks do so its of their own accord. No one is going to hold a phaser to someone's head and say to them "you're going to buy that ship, and you're going to like it, or I'm going to vaporize you harder than the Thanos snap." Nothing is obligating people to buy those ships. Folks can acquire them through free to play means. I own the entirety of the cstore as well as most lockbox/lobi and promo ships in game. In fact it's far easier to name ships I don't own vs those I do. Some of that I ground out, and some I dropped cash for. If folks want to support the game by making purchases, they are free to do so, and for those that don't want to they can still play.
What would be unfair is they made a certain ship/item mandatory to where you couldn't survive or deal damage without it. That would be unfair. Making certain box/lobi/promo ships have more bells and whistles to entice folks to buy isn't unfair.
"Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations
What makes a 300 or 3000 dollar ship better then a 30 dollar ship? Is there any advantage in paying more for a ship thats in a lock box compared to one thats on a C-Store? I may be somewhat ignorant but why pay hundreds even thousands of US dollars on a ship when a 30 or 40 dollar ship works and functions on equal ground? Am I missing something here?
Except for looks is there any tactical advantages? If it a certain ship type you want and want to have if you work hard I can see it to farm for or buy as far as favorite ships go. However tactical advantages wise whats the difference?
If it is just a off the wall ship someone drew up and then find it way in a lock box why should I pay 300 or 3000 dollars on it when I got other T6 ships that work just as well?
As far as to what ship is "best" is subjective as there is no set in stone winner take all best ship. There are certain ships that will lend more advantages to certain build types than others, but that's where what is "best" ends. I've heard of guys spending over $400 on rare occasions before to get a ship to drop, but $3000, good grief man. That's 300,000 zen which is 2,660 lockbox keys with a value of 12,502,000,000 EC at 4.7m per key. You would need 7 toons just to hold all of that EC. That's at least 10 times the amount of EC you would need to buy virtually any ship in game at the moment that's not cstore. For that matter you could buy 100 cstore ships at 3k zen a pop. If someone drops $3000 and still can't get the ship they're after, they're doing something bad wrong.
As far as the game is right now, you can do fairly well in game using nothing but the free stuff they give you and the free ships they give you from leveling and events. Sure some of the other ships can give you some nice bells and whistles to play with, but they're absolutely not required in today's game or even yesterday's game. What someone loads a ship with and how they fly it will determine how effective that ship is. Even the most high end of promo ships can be outdone by a free ship if one pilot doesn't know what they're doing, but the other does.
These hips are in fact the only ones so far that have seats of two different specs.
I think the more "exciting" aspect of these ships is that you get visuals that you can't have otherwise.
The combination of these two aspects is exactly why I even bothered with *certain* lockbox- and promo-ships. Some of the traits/consoles/unique weapons are a nice bonus.
My only gripe is that promo is essentially the only way to get certain "hero-ships" at T6-level and without account-unlock. I perfectly understand those players who were really butthurt about this rather unfair way of generating revenue.
First, no one is forcing people to invest in lockbox/lobi or promo ships. If folks do so its of their own accord. No one is going to hold a phaser to someone's head and say to them "you're going to buy that ship, and you're going to like it, or I'm going to vaporize you harder than the Thanos snap." Nothing is obligating people to buy those ships. Folks can acquire them through free to play means. I own the entirety of the cstore as well as most lockbox/lobi and promo ships in game. In fact it's far easier to name ships I don't own vs those I do. Some of that I ground out, and some I dropped cash for. If folks want to support the game by making purchases, they are free to do so, and for those that don't want to they can still play.
What would be unfair is they made a certain ship/item mandatory to where you couldn't survive or deal damage without it. That would be unfair. Making certain box/lobi/promo ships have more bells and whistles to entice folks to buy isn't unfair.
That is essentially what lock boxes are. It's a luxury that for some, might be unaffordable or they just don't like the less than half a percent odds for lock boxes and even less for the more expensive various promo packs. Some of the consoles might be good to have but there are plenty of alternatives that can be earned from missions and special events. Sadly, the Lobi events seem to have disappeared. The Lobi Store is essentially for cheaper fluff though, none of which is crucial to being successful in playing this game.
I don't believe for a second that PWE is told by CBS that a ship must be limited in numbers in the game. I think it is a simple business decision. This ship will be in such high demand, we can make a heck of a lot more by putting it in a lock box. From a business standpoint, it makes perfect sense even though it sucks for those who don't want to participate in digital gambling or find other methods to earn enough to buy one off of the Exchange. This game is based on a 15 year old engine that showed it's age when STO first launched. The chore I'm sure it has been to try and make the best of it can't be easy. The dev's do try though and that aspect does show. Especially when it comes to some of the ship models.
I don't believe for a second that PWE is told by CBS that a ship must be limited in numbers in the game. I think it is a simple business decision. This ship will be in such high demand, we can make a heck of a lot more by putting it in a lock box. From a business standpoint, it makes perfect sense even though it sucks for those who don't want to participate in digital gambling or find other methods to earn enough to buy one off of the Exchange. This game is based on a 15 year old engine that showed it's age when STO first launched. The chore I'm sure it has been to try and make the best of it can't be easy. The dev's do try though and that aspect does show. Especially when it comes to some of the ship models.
Fair enough.
My theory on the distribution of the Discoprise was based on what Cryptic themselves said in the past about CBS wanting the Connie to be rare. That's what we were told for years, but obviously I wasn't there for this meeting and can't say for sure one way or the other if it's actually true or not. It's entirely possible that Cryptic just said 'hey, we'll make a whole ton more if we put it in a lock box so TRIBBLE what people want.. lets make some money.'
I actually don't believe that.. but that's why I prefaced my thought with a clarification that was nothing but a theory. It's nothing but my personal opinion based on a limited amount of information available to me.
If PWE had been involved from day one, and had the game launched as a F2P game at the start, I can guarantee every (then T5 now T6) "Hero Ship" from a Trek TV series or feature film would have been in a Lockbox or a promo pack.
The C-Store would have had all the lower Tier versions of these ships; and all the lesser know ships that appeared over the years. That'll be the way they go for any of the "Hero Ships" of the CBS AA live action series ST: Picard, and Section 31 (assuming that show is still moving forward with Michelle Yeoh as the lead).
We may see the ships from the animated "Lower Decks" and the other animated Star trek series bering done for Nickelodeon - and I base that on the fact that the new FED Science ship that we recently got in the C-Store was out of a a related IDW Star Trek: Discovery comic book tie in series.
But yeah any of the main ships from further/future live action CBSAA Trek series will be introduced via Lock Box or Promo Pack. (There's a reason the last year has been the most profitable for STO/Cryptic and they'll stick with that Paradigm as a result.) If they could have done it this way from Day One - they would have.
Formerly known as Armsman from June 2008 to June 20, 2012 PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
I don't believe for a second that PWE is told by CBS that a ship must be limited in numbers in the game. I think it is a simple business decision. This ship will be in such high demand, we can make a heck of a lot more by putting it in a lock box. From a business standpoint, it makes perfect sense even though it sucks for those who don't want to participate in digital gambling or find other methods to earn enough to buy one off of the Exchange. This game is based on a 15 year old engine that showed it's age when STO first launched. The chore I'm sure it has been to try and make the best of it can't be easy. The dev's do try though and that aspect does show. Especially when it comes to some of the ship models.
Fair enough.
My theory on the distribution of the Discoprise was based on what Cryptic themselves said in the past about CBS wanting the Connie to be rare. That's what we were told for years, but obviously I wasn't there for this meeting and can't say for sure one way or the other if it's actually true or not. It's entirely possible that Cryptic just said 'hey, we'll make a whole ton more if we put it in a lock box so TRIBBLE what people want.. lets make some money.'
I actually don't believe that.. but that's why I prefaced my thought with a clarification that was nothing but a theory. It's nothing but my personal opinion based on a limited amount of information available to me.
I remember that. That came off to me as marketing speak to calm the very vocal unhappy group about the ship they want costing them at least 10 times more than a C-Store ship. I'm sure CBS is fine with whatever PWE does though to maximize the money they get paid for the license. Most would agree that CBS stopped caring about Star Trek fans quite a while ago. Now... If they said they had to put The Orville in a lock box because it doesn't belong in the Star Trek multiverse and as a result, they have to limit the rarity. That would make more sense. I would also shell out for that in one way or another.
Yeah also the thing about the Orville the rights to that aren't owned by CBS (or Paramount) so if they don't want to get sued they can't touch that. Rights to the Orville are owned by a different company that's a direct competitor to CBS so they'd rather have to pay the license fees just to please a subset of their fans (yes it might come as a shock to some but you can actually like Star Trek and not like the Orville or as is the case for me personally be neutral about said show as I've not seen Orville).
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
You can try to armchair quarterback this thing all you want, you have literally no basis, i.e. no numbers, to back up your claims. And no one owes you any numbers, either. Personally, I don't care to change your mind. Just stop talking nonsense.
Help me out. Exactly what is the "thing" that I have tried to armchair quarterback? Exactly which claims have I made that I have no basis for? When have I said that anyone owes me numbers? Show me, please.
__________________________________
STO Forum member since before February 2010. STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
Anyone with even a basic study of economics knows that having 10 years of sales data is more then enough to extrapolate a safe estimate for comparison. It's always a game of 'projections' which are essentially guesses.. but those guesses are highly educated guesses made using years of comprehensive data.
Cryptic can absolutely calculate projected profits from a C-Store item.. in fact, they could do this quite easily.
Are you familiar with the Edsel?
__________________________________
STO Forum member since before February 2010. STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I think the results of my last poll showed that roughly one quarter of the peeps around here got the donnie even though it came at such a price. Yep, yep only a very small group of player even uses the forums blabla but still. The figure corresponded nicely with what I was able to witness in game when the ship was new. In PvE, around ESD: Donnies everywhere!
The way cryptic has chosen here to hand out those ships may be very displeasing for the player but it does not seem to stop those who want to have the ship from actually getting it. The figure of "I would get it if it would be cheaper" is most likely of no influence as those players simply get something else in their price range instead.
It’s the same with so many other stuff in game. The player base of STO has an extremely high pain tolerance threshold when it comes to their free time. Why should it be any different with their money? For as long as it is labled Star Trek all works out.
Cryptic knows that and designs the game accordingly.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I think the results of my last poll showed that roughly one quarter of the peeps around here got the donnie even though it came at such a price. Yep, yep only a very small group of player even uses the forums blabla but still. The figure corresponded nicely with what I was able to witness in game when the ship was new. In PvE, around ESD: Donnies everywhere!
The way cryptic has chosen here to hand out those ships may be very displeasing for the player but it does not seem to stop those who want to have the ship from actually getting it. The figure of "I would get it if it would be cheaper" is most likely of no influence as those players simply get something else in their price range instead.
It’s the same with so many other stuff in game. The player base of STO has an extremely high pain tolerance threshold when it comes to their free time. Why should it be any different with their money? For as long as it is labled Star Trek all works out.
Cryptic knows that and designs the game accordingly.
That's exactly why I don't freak out on stuff like this. Even if they put something I want in a 'Gamble Box,' I don't care..
It's easy to get anything you want in this game, even rare items. If I can do it, anyone can.
That is essentially what lock boxes are. It's a luxury that for some, might be unaffordable or they just don't like the less than half a percent odds for lock boxes and even less for the more expensive various promo packs. Some of the consoles might be good to have but there are plenty of alternatives that can be earned from missions and special events. Sadly, the Lobi events seem to have disappeared. The Lobi Store is essentially for cheaper fluff though, none of which is crucial to being successful in playing this game.
I don't believe for a second that PWE is told by CBS that a ship must be limited in numbers in the game. I think it is a simple business decision. This ship will be in such high demand, we can make a heck of a lot more by putting it in a lock box. From a business standpoint, it makes perfect sense even though it sucks for those who don't want to participate in digital gambling or find other methods to earn enough to buy one off of the Exchange. This game is based on a 15 year old engine that showed it's age when STO first launched. The chore I'm sure it has been to try and make the best of it can't be easy. The dev's do try though and that aspect does show. Especially when it comes to some of the ship models.
Folks aren't required to like the lockbox odds and for that matter I don't either. However that's not what is being debated here.
As it is right now I own the entirety of the cstore, virtually every box ship, lobi ship, and promo ship I care to own. Everything I have now folks can get in time without having to sink a dime into the game. In fact I know several that have just as much as I do. I say that to prove the point anyone determined enough to get something can grind for it, even something like the disco constitution.
As for what CBS did or didn't say, I will remind you that initially CBS said no end game Constitution period. Initially there was no end game variant because CBS flat out said no to it. They don't do things like that often, but from time to time it does happen. They eventually gave the green light for the Kelvin Constitution which was put in a box. In part this was done because they didn't want the game to be nothing but 23rd century Constitution class ships running around in a 25th century game. This is also part of why whenever we did get a legit 23rd century Constitution in the Temporal Light Cruiser, it was made into a promo ship. Part of it I'm sure was a business decision, however it doesn't negate their precedent that they don't want an end game Constitution to be super easy to get in that regard. The discovery constitution simply proves that point even further. I wouldn't mind seeing a variant hit the cstore anymore than the next person would, but I'm not going to hold my breath either. In regards to the gambling, we're not going there as everyone is entitled to their opinion and there are other times and places for that. As to the engine, it's not the same stock engine as 15 years ago, and has been given several updates as time has went on. Just because something is older doesn't mean it's not good or can't be good.
For me I like to mod older games like Star Trek Armada II and Bridge Commander. honestly I find it easier to mod them sometimes than I do the newer stuff. Newer doesn't always mean better.
"Someone once told me that time was a predator that stalked us all our lives. I rather believe that time is a companion who goes with us on the journey and reminds us to cherish every moment, because it will never come again." - Jean Luc Picard in Star Trek Generations
I think the results of my last poll showed that roughly one quarter of the peeps around here got the donnie even though it came at such a price. Yep, yep only a very small group of player even uses the forums blabla but still. The figure corresponded nicely with what I was able to witness in game when the ship was new. In PvE, around ESD: Donnies everywhere!
The way cryptic has chosen here to hand out those ships may be very displeasing for the player but it does not seem to stop those who want to have the ship from actually getting it. The figure of "I would get it if it would be cheaper" is most likely of no influence as those players simply get something else in their price range instead.
It’s the same with so many other stuff in game. The player base of STO has an extremely high pain tolerance threshold when it comes to their free time. Why should it be any different with their money? For as long as it is labled Star Trek all works out.
Cryptic knows that and designs the game accordingly.
That's exactly why I don't freak out on stuff like this. Even if they put something I want in a 'Gamble Box,' I don't care..
It's easy to get anything you want in this game, even rare items. If I can do it, anyone can.
I think the results of my last poll showed that roughly one quarter of the peeps around here got the donnie even though it came at such a price. Yep, yep only a very small group of player even uses the forums blabla but still. The figure corresponded nicely with what I was able to witness in game when the ship was new. In PvE, around ESD: Donnies everywhere!
The way cryptic has chosen here to hand out those ships may be very displeasing for the player but it does not seem to stop those who want to have the ship from actually getting it. The figure of "I would get it if it would be cheaper" is most likely of no influence as those players simply get something else in their price range instead.
It’s the same with so many other stuff in game. The player base of STO has an extremely high pain tolerance threshold when it comes to their free time. Why should it be any different with their money? For as long as it is labled Star Trek all works out.
Cryptic knows that and designs the game accordingly.
Agreed.
To be honest, without meaning to sound arrogant, I saw this coming. As said in your poll thread, I was fortunate enough to win a R&D Promo ship box on New Year's Day; I put it in the bank and left it there, assuming that if/when the DSC Constitution appeared in-game it would be a prize ship.
My assumption proved correct and I daresay that, since I had the box already (i.e didn't have to buy and open promo packs or wait for one to appear on the exchange), I was one of the first players to own a DSC Constitution when the servers came back online on the day of release.
Let’s better not tell anybody what a great ship is.
Canon, aesthetics, flexiblility, current game mechanics… It’s really the top reference for a Federation/Klingon ship in STO at the moment.
Looking for a fun PvE fleet? Join us at Omega Combat Division today.
I think the premise that everyone would get a Connie if they could is fundamentally ridiculous. The Excelsior is the far better TOS era ship, and its easy to get a T6 Excelsior. Do people all fly Excelsiors? Nope. Or people who grew up on TNG can get every character in a Galaxy or Sovereign. Do they? Nope. Well of course there are people who liked DS9 or Voyager the best. Do those people fly around in nothing but Defiants and Intrepids? Nope again.
When it comes down to it, people fly what they want to. They might like to have one for nostalgia or whatever, but they aren't going to only fly that ship. Actually people like a lot of different ships for many reasons. In fact the ship diversity is so high in game that I don't even know this is a Star Trek game anymore when perhaps most of the ships I see in orbit of Earth are such obscure ships in ST that you didn't know they were in ST if you don't have a positronic brain to remember all the seen-once ships, and tons of ships are purely derivative Cryptic designs.
For me the only ship I fly that was named Enterprise or otherwise star of a show is the T6 Excelsior. As I think about it, my KDF aligned characters all fly Cryptic designs (which shouldn't be a surprise), except for two characters. My Feds are about half Cryptic designs, the rest are in stuff that was seen in a show or movie at least once. So only a quarter of my characters are using "canon" ships. Why? Well it would get pretty boring if they were all in Excelsiors.
I think the premise that everyone would get a Connie if they could is fundamentally ridiculous. The Excelsior is the far better TOS era ship, and its easy to get a T6 Excelsior. Do people all fly Excelsiors? Nope. Or people who grew up on TNG can get every character in a Galaxy or Sovereign. Do they? Nope. Well of course there are people who liked DS9 or Voyager the best. Do those people fly around in nothing but Defiants and Intrepids? Nope again.
When it comes down to it, people fly what they want to. They might like to have one for nostalgia or whatever, but they aren't going to only fly that ship. Actually people like a lot of different ships for many reasons. In fact the ship diversity is so high in game that I don't even know this is a Star Trek game anymore when perhaps most of the ships I see in orbit of Earth are such obscure ships in ST that you didn't know they were in ST if you don't have a positronic brain to remember all the seen-once ships, and tons of ships are purely derivative Cryptic designs.
For me the only ship I fly that was named Enterprise or otherwise star of a show is the T6 Excelsior. As I think about it, my KDF aligned characters all fly Cryptic designs (which shouldn't be a surprise), except for two characters. My Feds are about half Cryptic designs, the rest are in stuff that was seen in a show or movie at least once. So only a quarter of my characters are using "canon" ships. Why? Well it would get pretty boring if they were all in Excelsiors.
Sorry to say it, but the T6 Excelsior/Resolute is actually considered a sub-par T6 choice.
- It lacks a universal BOFF station of any kind - not even at Ensign level. This limits what can be done in terms of builds.
- It's too Engineering-heavy
- The console that it comes with is not of huge benefit and doesn't do anything that can't be acheived with a Competetive reputation engine (which doesn't suffer the console's cooldown)
- It's trait isn't particuarly great either
I'm not saying it's a bad ship; it will certainly do the job, as will any ship in STO - heck T5 ships can handle PvE content. But "the far better TOS era ship"? Sorry, I'd argue that the T6 Miranda and both T6 Constitution class ships are more versatile than the T6 Excelsior.
You completely missed the context what I was saying. I understand it is easy to confuse if you take it out of context, but I wasn't commenting at all about the actual in game ships beyond the point that people can have some of their favorite designs easily, in game.
In any case, I can't agree with your assessment.
Universal boffs are nice, but often overrated. How often do you swap them around? I don't tend to do that except in rare circumstances and usually only in a raider type with tons of uni slots so I don't actually lose a ton by switching it around. It tends to be a fixed slot in practice.
Engineering heavy was a problem with the T5 version, but the T6 has command seating. There are also a few more ensign engie abilities since then. Engie consoles are pretty commonly used for universal consoles so that's not an issue.
Sure the console doesn't give you the same on demand speed on a competitive engine, but what if you'd rather use a different set engine? The console does give a sizeable damage boost which you don't get from the engines. Do you really need that kind of speed and turn on a cruiser? My own Excelsior is plenty fast as it is and tend to run a low throttle because of it.
The trait is meh, yes, like many are. It is far too narrowly tailored to a couple abilities, and is fairly unimpressive, but at least the ship is well suited to use it.
And how does it compare to in game Connies and Miranda? I don't actually care and again, wasn't making any such claim. I like my T6 Miranda too, but it is a totally different ship to the Excelsior. I have no Connies so I have no real opinion on them.
Comments
There are certainly people that buy some of these ships just for a particular thought-after starship mastery trait, and every lockbox/promo ships tend to have some combination of spec seats and bridge officer seats that's different from C-Store ships. These hips are in fact the only ones so far that have seats of two different specs. So yeah, you can make something a bit more powerful with these ships. But the differences are never that big that it really matters. With every Tier 6 ship you can make builds that serve you well for Advanced difficulty content at least, probably Elite as well.
I think the more "exciting" aspect of these ships is that you get visuals that you can't have otherwise. So it's enticing for collectors and people that fell in love with a particular starship. If you love the Defiant best, you're in luck, it's a C-Store ship, but if you love the DSC Constitution, you are going to have to buy a promo ship. (And if you love the Nova, you're out of luck, no Tier 6 version so far...) Other people love to fly the biggest and badass looking ship there are, and many of the big ones are lockbox/lobi/promo ships. Others like to show off with a rarely seen ship, and some of the lockbox/promo/lobi ships are rare. (Of course, I think that is partially countered by the fact that many C-Store ships have more kitbash options... But I guess if you want to be a special snowflake, flying a Benthan Cruiser could do the trick even better...)
Do any of these perks and differences justify the cost - well, we're talking about luxury goods here, so there is no objective answer. It's something for you. If all you worry about is making it through the content, levelling your reputations and being ready to handle whatever the next story mission is going to throw at you - you'll do fine without any promo/lockbox/lobi ships.
The combination of these two aspects is exactly why I even bothered with *certain* lockbox- and promo-ships. Some of the traits/consoles/unique weapons are a nice bonus.
My only gripe is that promo is essentially the only way to get certain "hero-ships" at T6-level and without account-unlock. I perfectly understand those players who were really butthurt about this rather unfair way of generating revenue.
"Sorry mom the mob has spoken." People chose the F2P model over subscriptions, this is one of the consequences of it. It's like ads on websites. We refused to subscribe to sites, we get ads. And a monorail!
As far as to what ship is "best" is subjective as there is no set in stone winner take all best ship. There are certain ships that will lend more advantages to certain build types than others, but that's where what is "best" ends. I've heard of guys spending over $400 on rare occasions before to get a ship to drop, but $3000, good grief man. That's 300,000 zen which is 2,660 lockbox keys with a value of 12,502,000,000 EC at 4.7m per key. You would need 7 toons just to hold all of that EC. That's at least 10 times the amount of EC you would need to buy virtually any ship in game at the moment that's not cstore. For that matter you could buy 100 cstore ships at 3k zen a pop. If someone drops $3000 and still can't get the ship they're after, they're doing something bad wrong.
As far as the game is right now, you can do fairly well in game using nothing but the free stuff they give you and the free ships they give you from leveling and events. Sure some of the other ships can give you some nice bells and whistles to play with, but they're absolutely not required in today's game or even yesterday's game. What someone loads a ship with and how they fly it will determine how effective that ship is. Even the most high end of promo ships can be outdone by a free ship if one pilot doesn't know what they're doing, but the other does.
First, no one is forcing people to invest in lockbox/lobi or promo ships. If folks do so its of their own accord. No one is going to hold a phaser to someone's head and say to them "you're going to buy that ship, and you're going to like it, or I'm going to vaporize you harder than the Thanos snap." Nothing is obligating people to buy those ships. Folks can acquire them through free to play means. I own the entirety of the cstore as well as most lockbox/lobi and promo ships in game. In fact it's far easier to name ships I don't own vs those I do. Some of that I ground out, and some I dropped cash for. If folks want to support the game by making purchases, they are free to do so, and for those that don't want to they can still play.
What would be unfair is they made a certain ship/item mandatory to where you couldn't survive or deal damage without it. That would be unfair. Making certain box/lobi/promo ships have more bells and whistles to entice folks to buy isn't unfair.
Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
That is essentially what lock boxes are. It's a luxury that for some, might be unaffordable or they just don't like the less than half a percent odds for lock boxes and even less for the more expensive various promo packs. Some of the consoles might be good to have but there are plenty of alternatives that can be earned from missions and special events. Sadly, the Lobi events seem to have disappeared. The Lobi Store is essentially for cheaper fluff though, none of which is crucial to being successful in playing this game.
I don't believe for a second that PWE is told by CBS that a ship must be limited in numbers in the game. I think it is a simple business decision. This ship will be in such high demand, we can make a heck of a lot more by putting it in a lock box. From a business standpoint, it makes perfect sense even though it sucks for those who don't want to participate in digital gambling or find other methods to earn enough to buy one off of the Exchange. This game is based on a 15 year old engine that showed it's age when STO first launched. The chore I'm sure it has been to try and make the best of it can't be easy. The dev's do try though and that aspect does show. Especially when it comes to some of the ship models.
Fair enough.
My theory on the distribution of the Discoprise was based on what Cryptic themselves said in the past about CBS wanting the Connie to be rare. That's what we were told for years, but obviously I wasn't there for this meeting and can't say for sure one way or the other if it's actually true or not. It's entirely possible that Cryptic just said 'hey, we'll make a whole ton more if we put it in a lock box so TRIBBLE what people want.. lets make some money.'
I actually don't believe that.. but that's why I prefaced my thought with a clarification that was nothing but a theory. It's nothing but my personal opinion based on a limited amount of information available to me.
The C-Store would have had all the lower Tier versions of these ships; and all the lesser know ships that appeared over the years. That'll be the way they go for any of the "Hero Ships" of the CBS AA live action series ST: Picard, and Section 31 (assuming that show is still moving forward with Michelle Yeoh as the lead).
We may see the ships from the animated "Lower Decks" and the other animated Star trek series bering done for Nickelodeon - and I base that on the fact that the new FED Science ship that we recently got in the C-Store was out of a a related IDW Star Trek: Discovery comic book tie in series.
But yeah any of the main ships from further/future live action CBSAA Trek series will be introduced via Lock Box or Promo Pack. (There's a reason the last year has been the most profitable for STO/Cryptic and they'll stick with that Paradigm as a result.) If they could have done it this way from Day One - they would have.
PWE ARC Drone says: "Your STO forum community as you have known it is ended...Display names are irrelevant...Any further sense of community is irrelevant...Resistance is futile...You will be assimilated..."
I remember that. That came off to me as marketing speak to calm the very vocal unhappy group about the ship they want costing them at least 10 times more than a C-Store ship. I'm sure CBS is fine with whatever PWE does though to maximize the money they get paid for the license. Most would agree that CBS stopped caring about Star Trek fans quite a while ago. Now... If they said they had to put The Orville in a lock box because it doesn't belong in the Star Trek multiverse and as a result, they have to limit the rarity. That would make more sense. I would also shell out for that in one way or another.
In fact most of the lockboxes have villain ships.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Help me out. Exactly what is the "thing" that I have tried to armchair quarterback? Exactly which claims have I made that I have no basis for? When have I said that anyone owes me numbers? Show me, please.
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
Are you familiar with the Edsel?
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
He went on to lead the Vietnam War effort.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
The way cryptic has chosen here to hand out those ships may be very displeasing for the player but it does not seem to stop those who want to have the ship from actually getting it. The figure of "I would get it if it would be cheaper" is most likely of no influence as those players simply get something else in their price range instead.
It’s the same with so many other stuff in game. The player base of STO has an extremely high pain tolerance threshold when it comes to their free time. Why should it be any different with their money? For as long as it is labled Star Trek all works out.
Cryptic knows that and designs the game accordingly.
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That's exactly why I don't freak out on stuff like this. Even if they put something I want in a 'Gamble Box,' I don't care..
It's easy to get anything you want in this game, even rare items. If I can do it, anyone can.
Folks aren't required to like the lockbox odds and for that matter I don't either. However that's not what is being debated here.
As it is right now I own the entirety of the cstore, virtually every box ship, lobi ship, and promo ship I care to own. Everything I have now folks can get in time without having to sink a dime into the game. In fact I know several that have just as much as I do. I say that to prove the point anyone determined enough to get something can grind for it, even something like the disco constitution.
As for what CBS did or didn't say, I will remind you that initially CBS said no end game Constitution period. Initially there was no end game variant because CBS flat out said no to it. They don't do things like that often, but from time to time it does happen. They eventually gave the green light for the Kelvin Constitution which was put in a box. In part this was done because they didn't want the game to be nothing but 23rd century Constitution class ships running around in a 25th century game. This is also part of why whenever we did get a legit 23rd century Constitution in the Temporal Light Cruiser, it was made into a promo ship. Part of it I'm sure was a business decision, however it doesn't negate their precedent that they don't want an end game Constitution to be super easy to get in that regard. The discovery constitution simply proves that point even further. I wouldn't mind seeing a variant hit the cstore anymore than the next person would, but I'm not going to hold my breath either. In regards to the gambling, we're not going there as everyone is entitled to their opinion and there are other times and places for that. As to the engine, it's not the same stock engine as 15 years ago, and has been given several updates as time has went on. Just because something is older doesn't mean it's not good or can't be good.
For me I like to mod older games like Star Trek Armada II and Bridge Commander. honestly I find it easier to mod them sometimes than I do the newer stuff. Newer doesn't always mean better.
Star Trek Online volunteer Community Moderator
Let’s better not tell anybody what a great ship is.
Canon, aesthetics, flexiblility, current game mechanics… It’s really the top reference for a Federation/Klingon ship in STO at the moment.
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When it comes down to it, people fly what they want to. They might like to have one for nostalgia or whatever, but they aren't going to only fly that ship. Actually people like a lot of different ships for many reasons. In fact the ship diversity is so high in game that I don't even know this is a Star Trek game anymore when perhaps most of the ships I see in orbit of Earth are such obscure ships in ST that you didn't know they were in ST if you don't have a positronic brain to remember all the seen-once ships, and tons of ships are purely derivative Cryptic designs.
For me the only ship I fly that was named Enterprise or otherwise star of a show is the T6 Excelsior. As I think about it, my KDF aligned characters all fly Cryptic designs (which shouldn't be a surprise), except for two characters. My Feds are about half Cryptic designs, the rest are in stuff that was seen in a show or movie at least once. So only a quarter of my characters are using "canon" ships. Why? Well it would get pretty boring if they were all in Excelsiors.
You completely missed the context what I was saying. I understand it is easy to confuse if you take it out of context, but I wasn't commenting at all about the actual in game ships beyond the point that people can have some of their favorite designs easily, in game.
In any case, I can't agree with your assessment.
Universal boffs are nice, but often overrated. How often do you swap them around? I don't tend to do that except in rare circumstances and usually only in a raider type with tons of uni slots so I don't actually lose a ton by switching it around. It tends to be a fixed slot in practice.
Engineering heavy was a problem with the T5 version, but the T6 has command seating. There are also a few more ensign engie abilities since then. Engie consoles are pretty commonly used for universal consoles so that's not an issue.
Sure the console doesn't give you the same on demand speed on a competitive engine, but what if you'd rather use a different set engine? The console does give a sizeable damage boost which you don't get from the engines. Do you really need that kind of speed and turn on a cruiser? My own Excelsior is plenty fast as it is and tend to run a low throttle because of it.
The trait is meh, yes, like many are. It is far too narrowly tailored to a couple abilities, and is fairly unimpressive, but at least the ship is well suited to use it.
And how does it compare to in game Connies and Miranda? I don't actually care and again, wasn't making any such claim. I like my T6 Miranda too, but it is a totally different ship to the Excelsior. I have no Connies so I have no real opinion on them.