And since we're at disecting words, my take on the quote in question was:
"Next year's story arc, it's more than just a story arc, it's going to change the face of the game.... I'm not going to play 100 questions with you on what is going to change, but we are changing something significant as a result of the arc we are telling and how it will..."
My reading: He is not talking about just the story arc - there will be one anyway, so the very fact of its existence wouldn't be news. But it is an advertisement and when you hear "more than just a car" it in all likelihood is still a car. So I wouldn't call expecting all-story, no-mechanics changes as wrong. "something significant" may just be ad hyperbole, or, as some have speculated, some change of the status quo of the galaxy, but story wise. The undestruction of Romulus would be an example, though I personally consider it far fetched, I guess that's the category of stuff we're talking about. "As a result of the arc ...", unfortunately omitted sometimes in the quote, means at least story relation and makes mechanical changes unlikely - though not out of the question.
"I mean its not like hey we are on Nintendo now kind of changing the game kind of thing or now you have bridge commander gameplay, but there is a significant change to the game, and I think we are hoping to make a group of players that have been unhappy, happy"
I understand these as examples of what kind of changes not to expect. Neither expanding to a new platform nor a complete overhaul of gameplay. It doesn't rule out mechanics, but if taken pars pro toto it can easily mean that. If we're talking mechanics though, it needs to be something comparatively minor. T7 would be an example. I personally wouldn't call that "change the face" but again, it's an ad.
In the end I personally expect some stuff which will indeed not affect the core of gameplay at all. The more formal founding of the alliance, blowing up of First City (to explain a redesign), stuff along those lines.
My mother was an epohh and my father smelled of tulaberries
> @thegrandnagus1 said: > > I agree people often speculate and it turns out wrong. However your statement is also wrong. The quote in question says: > > "it is more than just a story arc" and "there is a significant change to the game" > > Those are direct quotes, and neither of those quotes are "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story", like you said. > > Now, I honestly don't care and therefore haven't been let down/disappointed by any of this. But don't say things that aren't true just to try to make people look silly about being wrong.
It's funny that you omitted the significant part of the quote to make a point 😁
The quote says "Next years story arc, it's going to be more than a story arc, it's going to change the face of the game". The object of the announcenent has always been the story arc.
Saying 'Thing X is more than X' is just empty banter. 'This Yogurt is more than a Yogurt! It's greek!'
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Being a greek myself and loving yogurt - its something I eat too often, I got negatively surprised when I bought yogurt during a travel abroad. I practicaIly ended sending it to trash bin and going for a plan B meal. I am not sure why they dont nail it abroad - it may have to do with maturation procedure that does take a bit of time but it shouldnt had been that hard. That said, as an example, I dont think it fits on this thread either as example since your example compares places of origin mainly and Al Rivera was promoting (early) an arc without comparisons being made. He just said it will be changing something too.
But yes it did sound like he wanted to show/advertise their work on that arc - or at least create hype, but if he/they want to be taken seriously in the future he does need to show a significant arc that changes something important in 2020. Else its a given he will never be taken seriously again by the fanbase even if times he will be serious and that wont be good for him, nor for cryptic, so hopefully he is hard at work to create something that backs his words
Being a greek myself and loving yogurt - its something I eat too often, I got negatively surprised when I bought yogurt during a travel abroad. I practicaIly ended sending it to trash bin and going for a plan B meal. I am not sure why they dont nail it abroad - it may have to do with maturation procedure that does take a bit of time but it shouldnt had been that hard. That said, as an example, I dont think it fits on this thread either as example since your example compares places of origin mainly and Al Rivera was promoting (early) an arc without comparisons being made. He just said it will be changing something too.
But yes it did sound like he wanted to show/advertise their work on that arc - or at least create hype, but if he/they want to be taken seriously in the future he does need to show a significant arc that changes something important in 2020. Else its a given he will never be taken seriously again by the fanbase even if times he will be serious and that wont be good for him, nor for cryptic, so hopefully he is hard at work to create something that backs his words
I agree on the yogurt. It's mainly the fat and cream contents. In many places people think yogurt has to be low fat, which takes everything from it. Greek has at least 10% which gives it a full taste, although it still varies depending on the origin. But that wasn't my point I added the comparison to make clear that a greek yogurt is still in fact a yogurt and not "more" than that. Different, better, but still yogurt.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
It's funny that you omitted the significant part of the quote to make a point 😁
The quote says "Next years story arc, it's going to be more than a story arc, it's going to change the face of the game". The object of the announcenent has always been the story arc.
Saying 'Thing X is more than X' is just empty banter. 'This Yogurt is more than a Yogurt! It's greek!'
Look, I get that some people enjoy mocking other people for being wrong. But saying it was "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story" is demonstrably false when Geko specifically said it was MORE than just a story arc.
Yes, people took that and ran with it and made assumptions and that is their own fault. But your "crystal clear" statement is still wrong.
(...) But your "crystal clear" statement is still wrong.
I don't see how, but you are of course entitled to an opinion. I'm not mocking anyone, I simply couldn't understand why they ran wild and give Geko/Cryptic flak for it.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
(...) But your "crystal clear" statement is still wrong.
I don't see how, but you are of course entitled to an opinion.
Here, I'll break it down for you:
1) he said it's MORE than just a story arc.
There. Explained.
Again, I agree people read too much into what he said. No argument there. But his statement was in no way "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story". That is demonstrably false.
I don't see how, but you are of course entitled to an opinion. I'm not mocking anyone, I simply couldn't understand why they ran wild and give Geko/Cryptic flak for it.
Because we live in an era were gross over-exaggeration, and needing to be victimized, have run rampant.
Same reason we frequently see people say that the developers lied to them about not doing X or Y when, if you go back to the devs original statements, they use wording like "thinking of doing", "considering", "maybe", all of which clearly show it may or may not happen. But OFC people ignore that so they can turn around and say the devs lied to them because portraying any and all game developers as being pure evil is the hip thing to do, and has been for some time.
Which is part of the reason developers rarely, if ever, talk to their fanbases anymore.
There are 2 groups of bad actors in this discussion, and they are BOTH guilty of claiming Geko said something he didn't.
Group A claims Geko said that some kind of mechanic changes were happening. He didn't.
Group B claims Geko clearly said that ONLY the story was being updated. He didn't.
Both of those groups are making false claims to try to support their position, and neither has any moral highground on the other.
As far as the devs talking, they actually do it quite a bit; just not on the official forums. For whatever reason they have nearly abandoned the official forums for reddit.
Again, I agree people read too much into what he said. No argument there. But his statement was in no way "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story". That is demonstrably false.
I'm sorry, but I don't see it. I disagree.
"Next year's story arc, it's (=the story arc) going to be more than a story arc, it will change the face of the game." He didn't say "there will be more than a story arc" (as in there will be something else) but "the story arc will be 'more' than a story arc" (this story arc will trump your expectations, because it is so awesome). This is marketing speak, see the yogurt example I gave. It is common for companies to call their product "more than a product" not because there is something else in it, but because they say it's so super.
I hope that makes sense, I'm not trying to be annoying. But the way I understand the wording I never had any doubts, but if anything you show me that the statement could have been interpreted differently.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Disagree with me if you want. I am long past caring. (...)
I'm not doing any of this, you are free to have an opinion. I was merely talking about the original statement. I personally am also not happy with the development of STO and where it went, but it's not going to change. For example, I personally do not want more story arcs with expensive voice acting, I'd like open-ended continuous game play with semi-procedual content generation. I don't want more single player story lines, because as a story based single player RPG/Adventure game STO is not all that good. As a open-ended, MMO dungeon crawler / hack&slay game it could be great. But that is also just my opinion.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
As a open-ended, MMO dungeon crawler / hack&slay game it could be great. But that is also just my opinion.
How would a dungeon crawler work in STO's setting?
It could be a large, procedually created Nebula that you dive into deeper and deeper, find planets in which could harbour friendly "towns" where you can trade and rest or they could be hostile. The way I imagine it, it could have a little bit of a roguelike feeling, however you could invite other players to explore your personal progression cooperatively and vice versa. Milestones could be by building outposts and the like. And of course worthwhile and unique loot that can only be get via this game mode, but in order to fuel the treasure hunt it'd require random weapon drops for instance to have randomized effects (not just a [dmg] mod, but +x% damage against (enemy), +x% chance for additional elemental damage (radiation, electricity, agony etc.)) so the random loot you find could potentially be really good, especially in special circumstances when you face random enemies that happen to be resistant to your go-to weapons.
To me, this is more entertaining than playing a single story arc and be done with it, because there is little replayability.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
The one time I can think STO did something similar was with the Dyson weapons bypassing Voth shields, but thats bypassing shields, not doing extra damage because you created a bioweapon made to target them specifically.
Well... there is the Bio-molecular weapons that are specifically designed to combat the Undine...
Ok, but what would be the goal of said system? How would it tie into the rest of the game's systems? How does progression in such a system work? What is to stop people from just hitting full throttle and reaching the other end of the map in no time?(since the max map size in STO is equal to an 8x8 sector map space, and that's pushing it, 7x7 is more likely)
What you described sounds like Minecraft, or No Many's Sky: STO edition, where you just fly to a planet to mine resources to power your ships so you can fly to another planet to mine resources ad infinitum.
Yes, it is an open system. The story really doesn't matter, there has to be little more than "we explore this Nebula, make contact with the natives and report back after your five-year mission". And then, like I said, a roguelike experience. It doesn't have to tie into anything, it's a game mode you can play endlessly but which offers surprises through randomized factors.
A. That's pretty much the whole purpose behind the different energy types to begin with, as enemies have higher resistances against some types of energy, and lower resistances against others.
B. I doubt CBS would approve of the Federation using bioweapons to destroy targets like you suggest with the "+x% damage against (enemy)". The one time I can think STO did something similar was with the Dyson weapons bypassing Voth shields, but thats bypassing shields, not doing extra damage because you created a bioweapon made to target them specifically.
C. Going the Borderlands route of "50 billion gun combinations" just results in most loot drops being even more worthless then they are already.
The combinations is exactly what makes loot worthwhile. Of course most of it is vendor trash, but some can be a really lucky find. Right now there is literally no loot in the game that is desirable. And I don't get what you are at with the bio weapons. You are grasping at straws to have a counter argument just based on how I phrased the sentence and you argue from a lore perspective that isn't really important to begin with. Instead of bio weapons just say nanites r special frequency that works against their ships, it really doesn't matter.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
Again, I agree people read too much into what he said. No argument there. But his statement was in no way "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story". That is demonstrably false.
I'm sorry, but I don't see it. I disagree.
I completely understand that you disagree, and the "crystal clear" comment is still wrong. But as long as it wasn't intentional with the purpose of trying to make those who misunderstood his statement look foolish, it's ok.
You forgot about Group C, of which I subscribe to. That is, we are wasting our time speculating and arguing about some trolling comments made by Geko. See what he says at STLV, if anything, otherwise wait for more definite information.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I agree with @angrytarg 's take on Geko's comments. It was clear to me that when he said the story is "more than a story arc," he was saying it's not just another story arc being tacked on to continue the STO storyline, but that the story will "change the face of the game." His later comments that intimated there would be no gameplay changes solidified that for me.
I realize that others didn't come away with the same interpretation from that interview. And that's fine. But there have been subsequent statements made, possibly due to those other interpretations, to clarify that it was always meant to be about story.
Now, we can all go round and round about what each of us thinks he meant when he said what he said when he said it. But only Geko actually knows what he meant when he said it. And he's actually come out since then to clarify what he meant. So, continuing this argument about lack of clarity is pointless since clarification has been given.
Star Trek Online Volunteer Community Moderator and Resident She-Wolf
Community Moderators are Unpaid Volunteers and NOT Employees of Gearbox/Cryptic
Views and Opinions May Not Reflect the Views and Opinions of Gearbox/Cryptic
If there is one thing that I have learned over these many years as an STO player? It's that Al - as passionate a Trekkie as he may be - isn't the teams best spokesperson for interviews. IMO, the best spokesperson should be the teams EP. Whoever that happens to be at the time.
For good or bad, Al does get folks talking about STO. I just feel that might be best when in context of group panels. Balanced by EP presence.
(/\) Exploring Star Trek Online Since July 2008 (/\)
Again, I agree people read too much into what he said. No argument there. But his statement was in no way "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story". That is demonstrably false.
I'm sorry, but I don't see it. I disagree.
I completely understand that you disagree, and the "crystal clear" comment is still wrong. But as long as it wasn't intentional with the purpose of trying to make those who misunderstood his statement look foolish, it's ok.
No. What Gecko said was crystal clear. People assumed alot and read into what he said to see what they wanted to. They took it more literal than common sense should have told them to. The reality is his statement was clearly intended to state that something big story wise was going to happen that would change the face of the game in terms of what happened in games storyline - in exactly the same way that one could say that the iconian war changed the face of the game, which it did. Said war was more than just some random storyline like colonizing a planet or exploring a new part of space, it was a massive galaxy wide war that changed everything
Again, I agree people read too much into what he said. No argument there. But his statement was in no way "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story". That is demonstrably false.
I'm sorry, but I don't see it. I disagree.
I completely understand that you disagree, and the "crystal clear" comment is still wrong. But as long as it wasn't intentional with the purpose of trying to make those who misunderstood his statement look foolish, it's ok.
Now, we can all go round and round about what each of us thinks he meant when he said what he said when he said it. But only Geko actually knows what he meant when he said it. And he's actually come out since then to clarify what he meant. So, continuing this argument about lack of clarity is pointless since clarification has been given.
As a open-ended, MMO dungeon crawler / hack&slay game it could be great. But that is also just my opinion.
How would a dungeon crawler work in STO's setting?
It could be a large, procedually created Nebula that you dive into deeper and deeper, find planets in which could harbour friendly "towns" where you can trade and rest or they could be hostile. The way I imagine it, it could have a little bit of a roguelike feeling, however you could invite other players to explore your personal progression cooperatively and vice versa. Milestones could be by building outposts and the like. And of course worthwhile and unique loot that can only be get via this game mode, but in order to fuel the treasure hunt it'd require random weapon drops for instance to have randomized effects (not just a [dmg] mod, but +x% damage against (enemy), +x% chance for additional elemental damage (radiation, electricity, agony etc.)) so the random loot you find could potentially be really good, especially in special circumstances when you face random enemies that happen to be resistant to your go-to weapons.
To me, this is more entertaining than playing a single story arc and be done with it, because there is little replayability.
the problem with that is this. the manchilds who live in mom's basement and game 18 hours a day (and you know who you are) would be able to squeeze out any hope of the casual player to do anything in said environment. indeed it woud be a lot like the jerks who sit on the edge of the safe areas in EVE and wait for ne players to set out.. and gank them
the problem with that is this. the manchilds who live in mom's basement and game 18 hours a day (and you know who you are) would be able to squeeze out any hope of the casual player to do anything in said environment. indeed it woud be a lot like the jerks who sit on the edge of the safe areas in EVE and wait for ne players to set out.. and gank them
I don't think there has to be any open PvP in these areas. Everything in STO is instances of 1-5 players. Nothing would be different here, in theory. I don't have to hear how that is impossible with the engine and blah, I don't care, that wasn't my point, I just said what I personally would have wished for happening. And that would be for your personal progress to be saved clientside and your personal Nebula be generated every time you enter the area on the galaxy map. I'd also imagine you could reset your progress if your random enemies become too strong or annoying.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
As a open-ended, MMO dungeon crawler / hack&slay game it could be great. But that is also just my opinion.
How would a dungeon crawler work in STO's setting?
It could be a large, procedually created Nebula that you dive into deeper and deeper, find planets in which could harbour friendly "towns" where you can trade and rest or they could be hostile. The way I imagine it, it could have a little bit of a roguelike feeling, however you could invite other players to explore your personal progression cooperatively and vice versa. Milestones could be by building outposts and the like. And of course worthwhile and unique loot that can only be get via this game mode, but in order to fuel the treasure hunt it'd require random weapon drops for instance to have randomized effects (not just a [dmg] mod, but +x% damage against (enemy), +x% chance for additional elemental damage (radiation, electricity, agony etc.)) so the random loot you find could potentially be really good, especially in special circumstances when you face random enemies that happen to be resistant to your go-to weapons.
To me, this is more entertaining than playing a single story arc and be done with it, because there is little replayability.
the problem with that is this. the manchilds who live in mom's basement and game 18 hours a day (and you know who you are) would be able to squeeze out any hope of the casual player to do anything in said environment. indeed it woud be a lot like the jerks who sit on the edge of the safe areas in EVE and wait for ne players to set out.. and gank them
Having played EVE since 2011 the new players got way too many warnings on an area being unsafe and actually the game doesnt let them activate the gate even as it asks them to confirm they want to go to the unsafe area. If someone chooses to risk, which isnt mandatory - its an option, means he/she can stomach the consequences. But its generally hard to compare with STO because EVE is a sandbox you pretty much craft everything and everything can be destroyed whereas STO if you lose your ship for example you dont have to replace it, it will just respawn
As a open-ended, MMO dungeon crawler / hack&slay game it could be great. But that is also just my opinion.
How would a dungeon crawler work in STO's setting?
It could be a large, procedually created Nebula that you dive into deeper and deeper, find planets in which could harbour friendly "towns" where you can trade and rest or they could be hostile. The way I imagine it, it could have a little bit of a roguelike feeling, however you could invite other players to explore your personal progression cooperatively and vice versa. Milestones could be by building outposts and the like. And of course worthwhile and unique loot that can only be get via this game mode, but in order to fuel the treasure hunt it'd require random weapon drops for instance to have randomized effects (not just a [dmg] mod, but +x% damage against (enemy), +x% chance for additional elemental damage (radiation, electricity, agony etc.)) so the random loot you find could potentially be really good, especially in special circumstances when you face random enemies that happen to be resistant to your go-to weapons.
To me, this is more entertaining than playing a single story arc and be done with it, because there is little replayability.
the problem with that is this. the manchilds who live in mom's basement and game 18 hours a day (and you know who you are) would be able to squeeze out any hope of the casual player to do anything in said environment. indeed it woud be a lot like the jerks who sit on the edge of the safe areas in EVE and wait for ne players to set out.. and gank them
Comments
"Next year's story arc, it's more than just a story arc, it's going to change the face of the game.... I'm not going to play 100 questions with you on what is going to change, but we are changing something significant as a result of the arc we are telling and how it will..."
My reading: He is not talking about just the story arc - there will be one anyway, so the very fact of its existence wouldn't be news. But it is an advertisement and when you hear "more than just a car" it in all likelihood is still a car. So I wouldn't call expecting all-story, no-mechanics changes as wrong. "something significant" may just be ad hyperbole, or, as some have speculated, some change of the status quo of the galaxy, but story wise. The undestruction of Romulus would be an example, though I personally consider it far fetched, I guess that's the category of stuff we're talking about. "As a result of the arc ...", unfortunately omitted sometimes in the quote, means at least story relation and makes mechanical changes unlikely - though not out of the question.
"I mean its not like hey we are on Nintendo now kind of changing the game kind of thing or now you have bridge commander gameplay, but there is a significant change to the game, and I think we are hoping to make a group of players that have been unhappy, happy"
I understand these as examples of what kind of changes not to expect. Neither expanding to a new platform nor a complete overhaul of gameplay. It doesn't rule out mechanics, but if taken pars pro toto it can easily mean that. If we're talking mechanics though, it needs to be something comparatively minor. T7 would be an example. I personally wouldn't call that "change the face" but again, it's an ad.
In the end I personally expect some stuff which will indeed not affect the core of gameplay at all. The more formal founding of the alliance, blowing up of First City (to explain a redesign), stuff along those lines.
>
> I agree people often speculate and it turns out wrong. However your statement is also wrong. The quote in question says:
>
> "it is more than just a story arc" and "there is a significant change to the game"
>
> Those are direct quotes, and neither of those quotes are "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story", like you said.
>
> Now, I honestly don't care and therefore haven't been let down/disappointed by any of this. But don't say things that aren't true just to try to make people look silly about being wrong.
It's funny that you omitted the significant part of the quote to make a point 😁
The quote says "Next years story arc, it's going to be more than a story arc, it's going to change the face of the game". The object of the announcenent has always been the story arc.
Saying 'Thing X is more than X' is just empty banter. 'This Yogurt is more than a Yogurt! It's greek!'
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Being a greek myself and loving yogurt - its something I eat too often, I got negatively surprised when I bought yogurt during a travel abroad. I practicaIly ended sending it to trash bin and going for a plan B meal. I am not sure why they dont nail it abroad - it may have to do with maturation procedure that does take a bit of time but it shouldnt had been that hard. That said, as an example, I dont think it fits on this thread either as example since your example compares places of origin mainly and Al Rivera was promoting (early) an arc without comparisons being made. He just said it will be changing something too.
But yes it did sound like he wanted to show/advertise their work on that arc - or at least create hype, but if he/they want to be taken seriously in the future he does need to show a significant arc that changes something important in 2020. Else its a given he will never be taken seriously again by the fanbase even if times he will be serious and that wont be good for him, nor for cryptic, so hopefully he is hard at work to create something that backs his words
I agree on the yogurt. It's mainly the fat and cream contents. In many places people think yogurt has to be low fat, which takes everything from it. Greek has at least 10% which gives it a full taste, although it still varies depending on the origin. But that wasn't my point
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Look, I get that some people enjoy mocking other people for being wrong. But saying it was "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story" is demonstrably false when Geko specifically said it was MORE than just a story arc.
Yes, people took that and ran with it and made assumptions and that is their own fault. But your "crystal clear" statement is still wrong.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I don't see how, but you are of course entitled to an opinion. I'm not mocking anyone, I simply couldn't understand why they ran wild and give Geko/Cryptic flak for it.
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Here, I'll break it down for you:
1) he said it's MORE than just a story arc.
There. Explained.
Again, I agree people read too much into what he said. No argument there. But his statement was in no way "crystal clear from the beginning the line only concerned the story". That is demonstrably false.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
There are 2 groups of bad actors in this discussion, and they are BOTH guilty of claiming Geko said something he didn't.
Group A claims Geko said that some kind of mechanic changes were happening. He didn't.
Group B claims Geko clearly said that ONLY the story was being updated. He didn't.
Both of those groups are making false claims to try to support their position, and neither has any moral highground on the other.
As far as the devs talking, they actually do it quite a bit; just not on the official forums. For whatever reason they have nearly abandoned the official forums for reddit.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
I'm sorry, but I don't see it. I disagree.
"Next year's story arc, it's (=the story arc) going to be more than a story arc, it will change the face of the game." He didn't say "there will be more than a story arc" (as in there will be something else) but "the story arc will be 'more' than a story arc" (this story arc will trump your expectations, because it is so awesome). This is marketing speak, see the yogurt example I gave. It is common for companies to call their product "more than a product" not because there is something else in it, but because they say it's so super.
I hope that makes sense, I'm not trying to be annoying. But the way I understand the wording I never had any doubts, but if anything you show me that the statement could have been interpreted differently.
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I'm not doing any of this, you are free to have an opinion. I was merely talking about the original statement. I personally am also not happy with the development of STO and where it went, but it's not going to change. For example, I personally do not want more story arcs with expensive voice acting, I'd like open-ended continuous game play with semi-procedual content generation. I don't want more single player story lines, because as a story based single player RPG/Adventure game STO is not all that good. As a open-ended, MMO dungeon crawler / hack&slay game it could be great. But that is also just my opinion.
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It could be a large, procedually created Nebula that you dive into deeper and deeper, find planets in which could harbour friendly "towns" where you can trade and rest or they could be hostile. The way I imagine it, it could have a little bit of a roguelike feeling, however you could invite other players to explore your personal progression cooperatively and vice versa. Milestones could be by building outposts and the like. And of course worthwhile and unique loot that can only be get via this game mode, but in order to fuel the treasure hunt it'd require random weapon drops for instance to have randomized effects (not just a [dmg] mod, but +x% damage against (enemy), +x% chance for additional elemental damage (radiation, electricity, agony etc.)) so the random loot you find could potentially be really good, especially in special circumstances when you face random enemies that happen to be resistant to your go-to weapons.
To me, this is more entertaining than playing a single story arc and be done with it, because there is little replayability.
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Well... there is the Bio-molecular weapons that are specifically designed to combat the Undine...
Yes, it is an open system. The story really doesn't matter, there has to be little more than "we explore this Nebula, make contact with the natives and report back after your five-year mission". And then, like I said, a roguelike experience. It doesn't have to tie into anything, it's a game mode you can play endlessly but which offers surprises through randomized factors.
The combinations is exactly what makes loot worthwhile. Of course most of it is vendor trash, but some can be a really lucky find. Right now there is literally no loot in the game that is desirable. And I don't get what you are at with the bio weapons. You are grasping at straws to have a counter argument just based on how I phrased the sentence and you argue from a lore perspective that isn't really important to begin with. Instead of bio weapons just say nanites r special frequency that works against their ships, it really doesn't matter.
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I completely understand that you disagree, and the "crystal clear" comment is still wrong. But as long as it wasn't intentional with the purpose of trying to make those who misunderstood his statement look foolish, it's ok.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
- The Klingon Empire finally joins the Federation.
*drops mic*
I realize that others didn't come away with the same interpretation from that interview. And that's fine. But there have been subsequent statements made, possibly due to those other interpretations, to clarify that it was always meant to be about story.
Now, we can all go round and round about what each of us thinks he meant when he said what he said when he said it. But only Geko actually knows what he meant when he said it. And he's actually come out since then to clarify what he meant. So, continuing this argument about lack of clarity is pointless since clarification has been given.
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Link please? I'd like to add those comments to the OP. Thanks.
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
For good or bad, Al does get folks talking about STO. I just feel that might be best when in context of group panels. Balanced by EP presence.
No. What Gecko said was crystal clear. People assumed alot and read into what he said to see what they wanted to. They took it more literal than common sense should have told them to. The reality is his statement was clearly intended to state that something big story wise was going to happen that would change the face of the game in terms of what happened in games storyline - in exactly the same way that one could say that the iconian war changed the face of the game, which it did. Said war was more than just some random storyline like colonizing a planet or exploring a new part of space, it was a massive galaxy wide war that changed everything
Like BMZ said:
The-Grand-Nagus
Join Date: Sep 2008
the problem with that is this. the manchilds who live in mom's basement and game 18 hours a day (and you know who you are) would be able to squeeze out any hope of the casual player to do anything in said environment. indeed it woud be a lot like the jerks who sit on the edge of the safe areas in EVE and wait for ne players to set out.. and gank them
I don't think there has to be any open PvP in these areas. Everything in STO is instances of 1-5 players. Nothing would be different here, in theory. I don't have to hear how that is impossible with the engine and blah, I don't care, that wasn't my point, I just said what I personally would have wished for happening. And that would be for your personal progress to be saved clientside and your personal Nebula be generated every time you enter the area on the galaxy map. I'd also imagine you could reset your progress if your random enemies become too strong or annoying.
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Having played EVE since 2011 the new players got way too many warnings on an area being unsafe and actually the game doesnt let them activate the gate even as it asks them to confirm they want to go to the unsafe area. If someone chooses to risk, which isnt mandatory - its an option, means he/she can stomach the consequences. But its generally hard to compare with STO because EVE is a sandbox you pretty much craft everything and everything can be destroyed whereas STO if you lose your ship for example you dont have to replace it, it will just respawn