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secondary deflectors: inhibiting vs deteriorating
telbasta7386
Member Posts: 761 Arc User
in The Academy
Can anyone give me some input on which of the secondary deflectors is best (or preferred) for exotic sci damage builds?
The guides i watched before committing to my sci torp boat build almost all said deteriorating was better for damage, though since it procs from debuffs instead of controls it seems more difficult to keep active. This is what i went with on my sci torp character, and im currently running destabilizing resonance beam and tykens rift to proc it, as it doesnt seem to activate from much else that i would be interested in using.
On the other hand, i have a fleet member who also runs a sci torp build and uses the inhibiting secondary deflector with amazing results. Inhibiting procs off of gravity well and subspace vortex, so he doesnt even need to run DBR or tykens rift like i do, giving him two more boff slots over me to use for heals/buffs.
At the same time, when looking at the stats on the two types of deflectors, it seems like deteriorating does more overall dps. At mk xii, i think the numbers are like:
Inhibiting: 4000 damage after 4 seconds
Deteriorating: 2000 damage per second for 9 seconds
As far as i can tell, the inhibiting deflector's damage only procs once per control ability used, so with those numbers you'd only get 4000 extra damage from a grav well, while deteriorating does 18,000 damage over 9 seconds, and a few seconds later youre already casting another debuff.
Then again, DBR and tykens both have very long cooldowns, and tykens can't be used until 15 seconds after your grav well. I use improved gravity well, so it lasts 40 seconds with a 40 second cooldown, but there's a very small window where i can activate tykens without it interfering with my grav well uptime.
Could really use some clarification on these mechanics, and what the best abilities to use for their procs are
The guides i watched before committing to my sci torp boat build almost all said deteriorating was better for damage, though since it procs from debuffs instead of controls it seems more difficult to keep active. This is what i went with on my sci torp character, and im currently running destabilizing resonance beam and tykens rift to proc it, as it doesnt seem to activate from much else that i would be interested in using.
On the other hand, i have a fleet member who also runs a sci torp build and uses the inhibiting secondary deflector with amazing results. Inhibiting procs off of gravity well and subspace vortex, so he doesnt even need to run DBR or tykens rift like i do, giving him two more boff slots over me to use for heals/buffs.
At the same time, when looking at the stats on the two types of deflectors, it seems like deteriorating does more overall dps. At mk xii, i think the numbers are like:
Inhibiting: 4000 damage after 4 seconds
Deteriorating: 2000 damage per second for 9 seconds
As far as i can tell, the inhibiting deflector's damage only procs once per control ability used, so with those numbers you'd only get 4000 extra damage from a grav well, while deteriorating does 18,000 damage over 9 seconds, and a few seconds later youre already casting another debuff.
Then again, DBR and tykens both have very long cooldowns, and tykens can't be used until 15 seconds after your grav well. I use improved gravity well, so it lasts 40 seconds with a 40 second cooldown, but there's a very small window where i can activate tykens without it interfering with my grav well uptime.
Could really use some clarification on these mechanics, and what the best abilities to use for their procs are
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Comments
the only mobs that in my experience that lives long enough is boss mobs in ques.
Gravity Well
Photonic Shock Wave
Jam Sensors
Scramble Sensors
Tractor Beam
Tractor Beam Repulsors
only Sci ships can use a secondary deflector so they have enough sci ability slots... but how often/many sci boff debuff abilities do you use?
Charged Particle Burst
Destabilizing Resonance Beam
Energy Siphon
Structural Analysis
Tachyon Beam
Tyken's Rift
Viral Matrix
Subspace Vortex does not Proc the Inhibiting deflector.
Looking at An 80k parse I did with my self and another player (Both in sci ships)
His Inhibiting defector was only doing about 6k dps/10% of his damage..
My Deteriorating Deflector was doing 29kdps/36% of my damage.
The Inhibiting is a delayed radiation strike like the Neutronic Torpedos Neutronic Radiation..
The Deteriorating does "18,000" PER TICK not over 9 seconds.
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
In my Case...
Destabilizing Resonance Beam, Structural Analysis
Tachyon Beam,Tyken's Rift (Additional when I have space.)
But I also use TBR and GW3..
Parsing I know my Deteriorating deflector has worked very well and adds additional damage when Im using Tachyon and DRB..I belive it only refreshes the duration of the deflector damage.
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
I recommend DBR and Structural Analysis. BOTH trigger the deflector and Both reduce enemies resistances (multiple enemies)
Tachyon 1 If you have room. I usually only have 6 total sci boff seats (@ Sci Bridge officer Cmdr and lt Sci)..
Some times I run ships that are with 3 Sci Boffs (then Ill add Tykens1 to cycle between GW3)
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
I was thinking I'd set it up like this:
Commander science:
Gravity well 3
Subspace vortex 3
Tykens rift 1
Hazard emitters 1
Lt commander science/temporal:
Chronometric inversion field 2
Destabilizing resonance beam 1
Hazard emitters 1
Lt commander tactical:
Fire at will 3
Fire at will 2
Kemocite laced weapons 1
Ensign tactical:
Tactical team 1
Lieutenant engineering:
Emergency power to shields 2
Emergency power to shields 1
How does this setup look?
I tried structural analysis for a bit on another sci character but because it needs a single living target to keep functioning, and everything other than bosses dies too fast, i didn't feel it was very useful.
Im using layered shielding, hence the doubled up epts, but i might make one of those an aux 2 sif 1. Im wanting a lot of low cooldown heals, since the mastery trait from the dranuur does an aoe radiation damage every time i use a heal.
Heres mine. I just transferred a build I was using on my Wells...Went back to the Wells..Yes its not your cup o tea because it uses torps..Oh well.
Thats alot of duplication for a science ship.I get your reasoning..I just wouldn't do it..If your wanting to proc the proto spill aux2sif will proc it quite often (Mines up every 10 seconds.). Aux2Sif will also get you to max 5 stacks exotic damage buffs with the fleet Restorative consoles very quickly...Additionally there is a Doff that placates when your getting a little too much aggros..(Its kinda a useful ability).Theres also an trait (Tricks of the trade) that I believe grants weapon power cost decrease when using aux2sif.
Id switch out one of your EmpS for EmpE to get ya close enough to make proto spill worth it (Basically a weak photonic shockwave that not shield penetrating)...Thats because this is not an exotic from of radiation (so its similar to Kemocite or the radiation from the Neutronic Torpedo).
I have layered shielding but dont ever use it as I rely heavily on Hull heals (and rely more on shield overload for more resists)
I really think your missing out on Structural Analysis.I run at least level 1. More debuffing is not bad. (Are you playing on advanced or elite?) but to each their own. Have fun!
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
So far, so good, though
> Sensor Analysis is an ability that all science ships have, it's not a BOFF ability.
Sorry, meant structural analysis,easy to confuse the two
Ah, that makes more sense. Never tried that one.
Yea its a single target debuff (science boff ability) that reduces damage resistance, and then spreads to nearby enemies every couple of seconds. He was suggesting to use that as a way to proc the deteriorating deflector radiation damage.
No..Its a Contiguous Debuff. It will both Proc your deflector AND (use with Gravity Well) Debuff anywhere from 4 - 8 other targets (depending on level)
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
But only if the primary target survives that long. Thats the issue i have with it - it has to remain active on the primary target to keep spreading to other targets and when even tougher enemies tend to die within seconds it just doesnt seem that useful.
I can get more damage out of tykens rift or even charged particle burst, still proc the secondary deflector on every target hit, and just use sensor scan for the dr debuff
So..What is your ISA Dps? Im doing around 120k and It still takes more than 2 seconds to destroy my primary target..2 seconds is all that debuff needs to move to other targets.
Sensor Scan is an every 90 seconds affair..Structural Analysis is available faster than everything (debuff related) other than Tachyon beam.Just between those abilities..Your secondary defector is never down.
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
I see nothing in the ability description that says that (i.e. Main target dies the ability stops).
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
To me, the way that reads says "you cast this on one ship, and it will occasionally debuff the resistances of other nearby ships". If you stop analyzing the target ship, why would it continue spreading?
In other MMO's this would be a single-target ability that occasionally debuffs nearby enemies, but if the single target dies, the debuffing stops as well (it will run its course on currently effected targets, but not keep spreading).
Now, if it were more like a pestilence-style ability, where it jumps from the main target to another, and then to another, and then to another, spreading exponentially, I can see how it would be much more useful, but unfortunately there's not a really good way to test this and cryptic is incredibly bad at writing useful tooltips or providing players with information on how things actually work.
So as far as secondary deteriorating deflector's debuff goes, this is how I see it working:
Scenario: big group of enemies (lets say 10 enemies), no major bosses or anything. You're obviously going to be casting gravity well and subspace vortex right off the bat, so everything will be nice and clustered together in a 1 Km katamari ball.
At that point:
Casting structural analysis on one target debuffs its damage resistance by 25ish. Every 2 seconds afterwards, it jumps to another target and debuffs that target's resistance by the same amount. To spread to 10 enemies, this would take 20 seconds (and the ability doesnt even last that long).
Casting tyken's rift (15 seconds after gravity well, due to linked cooldown) would instantly apply additional kinetic damage over time, proc deteriorating deflector, and debuff enemy power levels for all 10 enemies instantly on cast. I'm not sure if power levels effect NPC enemies (I assume they do), but tyken's rift should be dropping both damage and resistance by draining weapon/aux/engine/shield power from all effected targets.
Casting destabilizing resonance beam will instantly deal damage, debuff resistance, and apply deteriorating deflector to every target in the area, and will continue casting (usually) for several seconds after the main target dies, so if your target goes down quick you dont lose out so much of the cast.
Charged particle burst will instantly debuff/drain shields of everything in the area, and apply deteriorating.
So unless there's some hidden mechanic where structural analysis will continue spreading from secondary targets to tertiary and so on, the only thing it has going for it is cooldown.
Okay..some clarification..
Structural analysis will absolutely "infect" another ship and not go away just because the "primary" ship dies for the duration of the ability or the ship (which ever ends first). So as you say..It is a "pestilence-style ability" but not exponentially as the ability description says "every 2 seconds" so that means per ability level that is at most 4 to 6 ships for the duration.
So per the basic description..It does what it says(Thankyou CrypticSpartan)..The mouse over (Tooltip) is even More specific.."Spreads to 1 additional Target with in 4km every 2 seconds for 8 seconds" <-This is the level 1 ability (@-20 all). So Up to 4 targets on this one.The Highest level would equal 6 ship in 12 seconds. (Very useful on those Darn Tzenkethi no?)
So as long as you have something alive..It has the potential to be debuffed by that ability while it is active.
Hrmm Well im interested in a side by side so lets do this:
Pros (LT Seat)
Structural Anaylsis2
-28 on up to 5 targets within 4km for 10 sec
Procs the Defector
20 second cooldown @ 35% Sci CD
Tykens1
1536 Kinetic damage per sec to everything within 3km for 10 sec
Procs the Deflector
38 second cooldown @ 35% Sci CD
Im actually only really advocating for the Ensign seat. (Who need 2 hazards?)
For the the Lt Seat..If you dont have a Doffed TBR..Tykens1 would be the way to go. But..If your a control build your not going to have high drain so Id ignore the subsystem drain..Everything will be dead long before it does anything of use. Even on my "Example" @ 313 DrainX and 100 Aux im only doing -30 all subsystems per sec for 10 sec (CBP at this seat is 7.9k on that ship)..So If the NPC has no drain resistances..That should be 3 seconds for the higher power levels to go "bye bye"..But Quite a few Npcs are flat out immune to drain effects..
However..I have another idea...If Structural Analysis aint your thing.. Why not Photonic Officer 1 for that LT seat..No it wont trigger your deflector..BUT...The up date to this ability is really nice..It works on all abilities,it doesn't rely on a % chance to activate, its already at global, and the level 1 ability is equal to a 40% reduction in cooldowns on its own..If you got the Improved Photonic Officer Starship trait that level 1 ability is now a 60% cooldown...Whacha think?
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.
It is infact exponential.
Hitting the first target, then after 2 seconds, spreads tothe second target,then after 2 seconds, the first and second targets both spread the debuff to another target each.
One thing somebody could clarify for me here.does tykens doff proc also trigger secondary deflector?
https://sto.gamepedia.com/Ability:_Charged_Particle_Burst
(damn' already listed
The doffs that spawn new rifts? That is a good question I can't answer.
I only have that one on my carrier captain which has no secondary deflector. I'm going to guess not, in the same way I'm fairly sure that red gravity wells from the Glenn trait with the doff to spawn more grav wells do not spawn red ones, and I'm pretty sure Overwhelming force doesn't proc the inhibiting deflector either with its mini charged particle bursts.
I think typically things that proc on Boff powers only proc on the actual Boff power not Doff or trait spawned effects.
Tykens Rifts Triggers the Deteriorating deflector. The Secondary doff does not
Rouge Sto Wiki Editor.