Solo was a fun sci-fi flick, and an excellent heist-caper film. Alden Ehrenreich did a great job of portraying young Han, the meeting with Chewbacca explained a lot about their later relationship, and for what I believe might be the first time in his career Woody Harrelson doesn't just play Woody Harrelson. I think the reviews suffer from two problems, both telling us more about the reviewer than about the movie:
1) the fact that nobody in the entire film uses the Force to do anything, because none of them are Jedi; and
2) the rabid "fans" who hate anything new, who used to be stuck in magazine letter columns and the like back when they complained about The Empire Strikes Back but now get their voices amplified far beyond any actual influence they might have by the modern Internet.
And then you have folks like Rattler, who are willing to give the movie a chance but fear spending theater-ticket prices on a movie that might not be good. That cuts severely into the box-office take, while not in fact reflecting anything about the movie's actual quality. Understandable, but still...
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,940Community Moderator
2) the rabid "fans" who hate anything new, who used to be stuck in magazine letter columns and the like back when they complained about The Empire Strikes Back but now get their voices amplified far beyond any actual influence they might have by the modern Internet.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
I haven't seen Discovery, but it seems like every time a Discovery discussion pops up people talk about having the sense that the writers want to take things in their own direction but can't because it would conflict with canon, so they have to do all sorts of poorly-thought-out contortions that bring everything down.
Honestly a lot of the rants that come up seem to be recycled rants from when Enterprise first aired, and again when the Kelvin Timeline movies started. And not every series has a breathtakingly awesome 1st season either. I mean TNG didn't get its footing until season 3. Yet people are content to set fire to Discovery after a single episode because "it doesn't look like TOS".
I'm still a little critical about the look of the Klingons, but I do have hope that they WILL give us an explanation down the road. And now that the Fed-Klingon War is over, and transitioning into the Cold War we see in TOS, we might actually see some more "Trek-like" stories that aren't grounded in a war effort.
You misunderstand me. I'm not complaining about how Trek-like Discovery is or is not. That's a separate issue. I'm addressing a challenge of writing within a rigid framework of events you inherit from other works, because I know it can make a difficult task harder. I'm currently wrestling with the very same problem in my own writing. Whether Discovery looks like TOS is kind of a separate question, and the question doesn't apply at all to JJ-Trek because it's a reboot.
I'm not saying that it's bad to take a new approach to Star Trek. I'm saying that if you're going to do it, setting the work in a time period where there are a lot of things you need to keep track of from other stories in that era puts constraints on what you can do. It can be done, but it's difficult, especially if you feel the need to constantly tie it into existing stories (coughSpock'sLongLostSistercough). I just don't get the sense that the Trek talent pool is deep enough to pull something like that off and create a quality product.
Of course, looking back there are very few Star Trek stories that meet my current quality standards... Inner Light,Devil in the Dark, and I, Borg come to mind. Maybe First Contact?
But I'm also just kind of sick of getting nothing but reboots and prequels from Star Trek. We haven't gone forward in 16 years, is it too much to ask to look into the future?
2) the rabid "fans" who hate anything new, who used to be stuck in magazine letter columns and the like back when they complained about The Empire Strikes Back but now get their voices amplified far beyond any actual influence they might have by the modern Internet.
Sounds familiar.
*cough*discovery*cough*
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,940Community Moderator
2) the rabid "fans" who hate anything new, who used to be stuck in magazine letter columns and the like back when they complained about The Empire Strikes Back but now get their voices amplified far beyond any actual influence they might have by the modern Internet.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
But I'm also just kind of sick of getting nothing but reboots and prequels from Star Trek. We haven't gone forward in 16 years, is it too much to ask to look into the future?
Oh shush. I'm pretty sure you hate JJ-Trek and Discovery more than I do.
I thought EVERYONE hated it more than you?
Well, not everyone. I'm probably... low-to-mid up the ladder of hating JJ-trek. Discovery seems like something I won't like, so I haven't watched it, so I don't know enough about it to actually hate it.
I don't think it was as blatant and rampant as it seems to be in Star Wars these days though. It was more subtle and didn't detract from the actual story. Right now, other than Rogue One, Star Wars is being rather... blatant with the SJW stuff, virtually beating us in the face with it.
Please enlighten us on exactly how Star Wars is blatantly beating us in the face with SJW stuff.
Regarding Star Trek's current bassackwardness, I don't think it's specifically a Star Trek problem but rather a problem with media in general. Sometime in the last decade or two many, many shows and movie prequels have been made, probably because the execs believe that they are more certain cash cows than unexplored territory that they're scared won't be as possible. They've also learned that prequels can safely be ill-researched, canon-stomping dreck if they put enough explosions and lens flares. Meanwhile many franchises have volumes and volumes of discredited novels to flesh out the futures, but they can safely ignore those because book readers are a substantial minority.
And they always have fans that will fall for these policies and defend them fervently.
> @rattler2 said: > jonsills wrote: » > > You do realize, of course, that "diversity and SJW" was what TOS was about. A multiethnic crew? With a woman on the bridge? A black woman?? In 1966??? > > > > > I don't think it was as blatant and rampant as it seems to be in Star Wars these days though. It was more subtle and didn't detract from the actual story. Right now, other than Rogue One, Star Wars is being rather... blatant with the SJW stuff, virtually beating us in the face with it. In contrast, whenever Star Trek ventured into SJW territory... they blended it in with the story so that it didn't detract from the story. It was just an element. Not the focus.
True, very true, it never was allowed to get in the way of the plot. I think partly why that is is because in the federation they are passed all the racist stuff, homobia, sexism and so on, or at least enough that they aren't that concerned, so now they focus on weirder forms of biogry and issues, like AL, aliens, and so on.
Who cares about skin colour when the dude over there has a positronic brain and the lady over their can read your thoughts.
> @mneme0 said: > rattler2 wrote: » > > I don't think it was as blatant and rampant as it seems to be in Star Wars these days though. It was more subtle and didn't detract from the actual story. Right now, other than Rogue One, Star Wars is being rather... blatant with the SJW stuff, virtually beating us in the face with it. > > > > > Please enlighten us on exactly how Star Wars is blatantly beating us in the face with SJW stuff.
You can find that out all over the internet.
Not that I care, I think Star Wars is a huge wasted potential filled with recycled wars and uninteresting characters. I like Yoda, the force, lightsabres, Ewoks, and Princess Leia in the bikini with Jabba the Hut, when that former storm trooper Finn stood up to his female boss, and that is it, I have no use for the rest of the setting, it's over rated.
Just one story that isn't about the same war, recycled, again and again, it's the perfect example of the Cardassian repetitive epic.
> @jonsills said: > Solo was a fun sci-fi flick, and an excellent heist-caper film. Alden Ehrenreich did a great job of portraying young Han, the meeting with Chewbacca explained a lot about their later relationship, and for what I believe might be the first time in his career Woody Harrelson doesn't just play Woody Harrelson. I think the reviews suffer from two problems, both telling us more about the reviewer than about the movie: > > 1) the fact that nobody in the entire film uses the Force to do anything, because none of them are Jedi; and > > 2) the rabid "fans" who hate anything new, who used to be stuck in magazine letter columns and the like back when they complained about The Empire Strikes Back but now get their voices amplified far beyond any actual influence they might have by the modern Internet. > > And then you have folks like Rattler, who are willing to give the movie a chance but fear spending theater-ticket prices on a movie that might not be good. That cuts severely into the box-office take, while not in fact reflecting anything about the movie's actual quality. Understandable, but still...
Now see no one using the force, that sounds different, now you have my interest.
The claim of "SJW takin' over muh Star Wars!!" seems to be based in the idea that a) General Leia Organa-Solo displays her family's Force power when she winds up outside the ship (and still has to be hustled off to Medical, where she spends most of the movie in a coma); b) her replacement, Vice-Admiral Holdo, is also female (not a squid who can't see a trap until it closes, as God and Lucas apparently intended); c) said Vice-Admiral doesn't feel the need to fill in some random fighter pilot (whose recklessness recently managed to destroy one First Order dreadnought, at the cost of almost all of their light fighters and every last one of their bombers) on the details of highly-classified plans (remembering that they believed tracking through hyperspace was impossible, therefore the First Order's ability to do so was likely because somebody was feeding them information); and d), and most unforgivably of all, when said fighter pilot set off on his own in defiance of orders, he was wrong and very nearly got the entire Resistance killed.
Apparently it's an "SJW" insult to testosterone for males to be required to obey the orders of females just because the females outrank them, and for said males to ever find they were mistaken to have disobeyed said orders in the first place. (Had Leia's and Holdo's plan gone off without Poe's interference, the most probable outcome would have been that the First Order, not knowing about the cloaked transports or the concealed old Rebellion base, would have eventually destroyed the by-then-abandoned capital ships, believed the Resistance done for, and gone home for a congratulatory round of blue milk.)
Oh, yes, and Rey has the temerity to be almost as strong in the Force as a Skywalker, without in fact being related to them in any way. It seems that this entire sprawling saga is "supposed" to be about the inbred infighting among a single family, destroying lives across the stars as they figure out which side of the Force is better.
> @jonsills said: > The claim of "SJW takin' over muh Star Wars!!" seems to be based in the idea that a) General Leia Organa-Solo displays her family's Force power when she winds up outside the ship (and still has to be hustled off to Medical, where she spends most of the movie in a coma); b) her replacement, Vice-Admiral Holdo, is also female (not a squid who can't see a trap until it closes, as God and Lucas apparently intended); c) said Vice-Admiral doesn't feel the need to fill in some random fighter pilot (whose recklessness recently managed to destroy one First Order dreadnought, at the cost of almost all of their light fighters and every last one of their bombers) on the details of highly-classified plans (remembering that they believed tracking through hyperspace was impossible, therefore the First Order's ability to do so was likely because somebody was feeding them information); and d), and most unforgivably of all, when said fighter pilot set off on his own in defiance of orders, he was wrong and very nearly got the entire Resistance killed. > > Apparently it's an "SJW" insult to testosterone for males to be required to obey the orders of females just because the females outrank them, and for said males to ever find they were mistaken to have disobeyed said orders in the first place. (Had Leia's and Holdo's plan gone off without Poe's interference, the most probable outcome would have been that the First Order, not knowing about the cloaked transports or the concealed old Rebellion base, would have eventually destroyed the by-then-abandoned capital ships, believed the Resistance done for, and gone home for a congratulatory round of blue milk.) > > Oh, yes, and Rey has the temerity to be almost as strong in the Force as a Skywalker, without in fact being related to them in any way. It seems that this entire sprawling saga is "supposed" to be about the inbred infighting among a single family, destroying lives across the stars as they figure out which side of the Force is better.
I don't think that anyone suggested that it was an insult to follow a female boss' orders.
Honestly I haven't seen the movie, but from what I've heard is that males are written to be universally useless morons and the females are Mary Sues, but I can't verify that as I haven't watched most of them and don't intend to because I'm not a Star Wars fan aside from Yoda and Princess Leia.
This also talks about the deal involving creating new series with new possible details, like a Star Trek Academy spin off (perhaps this would be the project they are referring to, with Patrick Stewart as a Professor of gifted young students, so with telepathic abilities far beyond a normal humans...wait this sounds familiar... Oh TRIBBLE they are going to merge his Professor X and Captain Picard roles into a single character ;p), the Khan Miniseries might still be on, and who knows what else.
If they are doing new series, it'd be neat to do Captain Shon and the Enterprise F as well and a series focused on a none federation ship, like an Orion Pirate ship forced to save the universe, and a series about sending ships to explore the bruise where scientists believe an alternate universe hit ours leaving a cold bruise, and maybe give Q his own series, The Immortal Adventures of Q, and Little House on Ferenginar, a show called 7th Stov'kor about a Klingon Cleric and his family. Maybe they should just change the name of CBS all access to The Star Trek Channel.
Starfleet Academy (not a new idea, but it's reamerged).
Another miniseries, unknown plotline
Animated Series
And I was kind of joking about a Star Trek Channel, but they are going to hire an Executive dedicated to over seeing Star Trek, can you imagine being Vice President at CBS for Star Trek.
If CBS and Paramount do merge, that is just going to magnify things, because they have so many Star Trek projects between them, including two separate movies at Paramount.
Holy Jumda Sticks on a cracker, now it's possibly multiple animated series, with Patrick Stewart not only acting in one of the Live Action series, but acting as a voice actor in animated star trek series!
If this is true it's really is time to just call CBS all access the Star Trek Network for real. That is a lot of Star Trek.
The claim of "SJW takin' over muh Star Wars!!" seems to be based in the idea that a) General Leia Organa-Solo displays her family's Force power when she winds up outside the ship (and still has to be hustled off to Medical, where she spends most of the movie in a coma); b) her replacement, Vice-Admiral Holdo, is also female (not a squid who can't see a trap until it closes, as God and Lucas apparently intended); c) said Vice-Admiral doesn't feel the need to fill in some random fighter pilot (whose recklessness recently managed to destroy one First Order dreadnought, at the cost of almost all of their light fighters and every last one of their bombers) on the details of highly-classified plans (remembering that they believed tracking through hyperspace was impossible, therefore the First Order's ability to do so was likely because somebody was feeding them information); and d), and most unforgivably of all, when said fighter pilot set off on his own in defiance of orders, he was wrong and very nearly got the entire Resistance killed.
Apparently it's an "SJW" insult to testosterone for males to be required to obey the orders of females just because the females outrank them, and for said males to ever find they were mistaken to have disobeyed said orders in the first place. (Had Leia's and Holdo's plan gone off without Poe's interference, the most probable outcome would have been that the First Order, not knowing about the cloaked transports or the concealed old Rebellion base, would have eventually destroyed the by-then-abandoned capital ships, believed the Resistance done for, and gone home for a congratulatory round of blue milk.)
To be fair, Holdo is pretty easy to hate. Her plan was decent, but she went about it in the worst way possible. It's one thing to shut out an underling from your plans, but Holdo manages to actively breed distrust. Remember it wasn't just what's-his-name who went off the rails, it was a full-blown mutiny because she failed to gain the trust of a large portion of the crew by not just shutting them out, but doing it in a snide, passive-aggressive way that makes it seem like she's doing it more out of spite than out of strategy. She also failed to include any other officers who had a reputation for being trustworthy, who could have diffused the situation. Assuming there were any, the only She might be a decent tactician (though her tactics are pretty basic), but she's a bad leader.
Remember when this thread about about Star Trek, I mean we are getting a bunch of new Star Trek series, 2 movies, a second season of Discovery (actually I think 5 more seasons at least now thanks to that deal), a DS9 Documentary and a ton of future material for STO to use, and you guys are Star Wars still in a Star Trek thread. Star Trek rules, Star Wars drools, there I had to say.
Now back to the new series, I don't' think any of the new series involve the enterprise, because no other TNG actors have come forward saying they are in talks to reprise their role. Still maybe I'm wrong, and they want to make sure Picard is a lock before approaching other actors.
Still I think he'll be a professor at the Academy along side I hope Avery Brooke's who idea for Starfleet Academy series was originally his I think.
Also I hope and pray they cooderinate with Cryptic better then Discovery's first season did, although Crptic made the best of it with the Discovery Lockbox.
And maybe the unknown miniseries is about the Enterprise E to boost the Synergy with STO.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,940Community Moderator
To be fair, Holdo is pretty easy to hate. Her plan was decent, but she went about it in the worst way possible. It's one thing to shut out an underling from your plans, but Holdo manages to actively breed distrust. Remember it wasn't just what's-his-name who went off the rails, it was a full-blown mutiny because she failed to gain the trust of a large portion of the crew by not just shutting them out, but doing it in a snide, passive-aggressive way that makes it seem like she's doing it more out of spite than out of strategy. She also failed to include any other officers who had a reputation for being trustworthy, who could have diffused the situation. Assuming there were any, the only She might be a decent tactician (though her tactics are pretty basic), but she's a bad leader.
It was rather odd to NOT let anyone know they were trying to get to an old Rebel base. Made it look like her only plan was just to run at sublight. Not fight, not try and do anything. Just run.
But lets face it, The Last Jedi was pretty much a fiasco. It honestly makes Star Trek: The Motion(less) Picture look good.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
I remind you again: To the best of the Resistance's knowledge, tracking ships through hyperspace was impossible. (Nobody thought to ask the tech who was working as a janitor down on some sub-level near the escape pods.) Therefore, as far as Leia and Holdo knew, the most probable explanation was that someone in the Resistance was informing the First Order of all of their moves. When you believe there's an intelligence leak in your organization, the last thing you're going to do is tell everyone where you're going.
(Remember, Leia didn't tell anyone outside the General Staff either, but I guess she gets a pass because she's what, one of the guys?)
Seriously, am I the only one here who grasps the concept of OPSEC? If you don't have the clearance for the information, you don't get the information, no matter how badly you want it.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,940Community Moderator
Seriously, am I the only one here who grasps the concept of OPSEC? If you don't have the clearance for the information, you don't get the information, no matter how badly you want it.
No. You're not. Its how Holdo went about it. Even if he got in trouble above their last base for losing the bomber wing while taking out the Dreadnaught, Poe Dameron was still acting as the Raddis' Wing Commander. Honestly he would have been one of the people who should have been in on the plan as when it comes to defending the ships from fighter attack, Poe would have been leading the defense (granted he got his wing clipped when the hanger got hit in a surprise fighter attack). Not only that, he could have helped keep things from escalating the way they did. Instead, he got told NOTHING at all. Not even that the plan was classified. As far as he knew, there was no plan whatsoever. Just told to be a good boy and sit on your hands. So as a result he was the one LEADING the mutiny.
If he had known there was something besides running, he might not have been so aggressive in pushing for mutiny. But the way it was handled... it seemed that literally only two people on the entire ship knew the plan: Holdo and Leia. Hell... Poe wasn't even clued in when he saw the shuttles being fueled up.
"Tactical genius" or not, Holdo did kinda drop the ball on trust, as that whole mutiny was avoidable if she hadn't been so aloof.
I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
In fact, if there had been a spy, Poe was a prime suspect. He disobeyed orders and lost the Resistance all of their bombers, and most of their fighters (not just a wing, all of them) in order to take out one enemy craft. That's how you lose wars, and if I were in command and eyeing possible spies and saboteurs, that trick would have put him right at the top of my list - did he do it on purpose?
And again, General Organa-Solo went about it the same way, but the only thing about her that upsets people was when she saved her own life by displaying her Skywalker heritage.
I remind you again: To the best of the Resistance's knowledge, tracking ships through hyperspace was impossible. (Nobody thought to ask the tech who was working as a janitor down on some sub-level near the escape pods.) Therefore, as far as Leia and Holdo knew, the most probable explanation was that someone in the Resistance was informing the First Order of all of their moves. When you believe there's an intelligence leak in your organization, the last thing you're going to do is tell everyone where you're going.
(Remember, Leia didn't tell anyone outside the General Staff either, but I guess she gets a pass because she's what, one of the guys?)
Seriously, am I the only one here who grasps the concept of OPSEC? If you don't have the clearance for the information, you don't get the information, no matter how badly you want it.
Yes, I understand the idea of not sharing sensitive information with someone you don't trust (Poe), but Holdo didn't even hint that she had a good reason for holding things back. Keeping Poe out of the loop makes sense, but there must have been somebody on the senior staff that the crew trusted who she could bring in and reassure everybody that "yes, we have a plan, we just can't tell you about it."
And yes, Leia gets a pass. She was one of the figures of the original Rebellion, and they know they can trust her. When Leia keeps you in the dark, you trust her to have a plan. When Holdo not only keeps you in the dark, but does it in a seemingly spiteful, passive-aggressive way, you have no reason to trust that she knows what she's doing.
So you're right that what Holdo did was pretty normal for a military operation, but she managed to TRIBBLE it up so badly that it led to a mutiny. She's a failure as a commander.
Edit: Thanks, censor, you made my post look a lot more profane than it actually is.
Comments
1) the fact that nobody in the entire film uses the Force to do anything, because none of them are Jedi; and
2) the rabid "fans" who hate anything new, who used to be stuck in magazine letter columns and the like back when they complained about The Empire Strikes Back but now get their voices amplified far beyond any actual influence they might have by the modern Internet.
And then you have folks like Rattler, who are willing to give the movie a chance but fear spending theater-ticket prices on a movie that might not be good. That cuts severely into the box-office take, while not in fact reflecting anything about the movie's actual quality. Understandable, but still...
Sounds familiar.
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
You misunderstand me. I'm not complaining about how Trek-like Discovery is or is not. That's a separate issue. I'm addressing a challenge of writing within a rigid framework of events you inherit from other works, because I know it can make a difficult task harder. I'm currently wrestling with the very same problem in my own writing. Whether Discovery looks like TOS is kind of a separate question, and the question doesn't apply at all to JJ-Trek because it's a reboot.
I'm not saying that it's bad to take a new approach to Star Trek. I'm saying that if you're going to do it, setting the work in a time period where there are a lot of things you need to keep track of from other stories in that era puts constraints on what you can do. It can be done, but it's difficult, especially if you feel the need to constantly tie it into existing stories (coughSpock'sLongLostSistercough). I just don't get the sense that the Trek talent pool is deep enough to pull something like that off and create a quality product.
Of course, looking back there are very few Star Trek stories that meet my current quality standards... Inner Light, Devil in the Dark, and I, Borg come to mind. Maybe First Contact?
But I'm also just kind of sick of getting nothing but reboots and prequels from Star Trek. We haven't gone forward in 16 years, is it too much to ask to look into the future?
*cough*discovery*cough*
Discovery... Kelvin Timeline movies... Enterprise...
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
Oh shush. I'm pretty sure you hate JJ-Trek and Discovery more than I do.
My character Tsin'xing
Please enlighten us on exactly how Star Wars is blatantly beating us in the face with SJW stuff.
And they always have fans that will fall for these policies and defend them fervently.
> jonsills wrote: »
>
> You do realize, of course, that "diversity and SJW" was what TOS was about. A multiethnic crew? With a woman on the bridge? A black woman?? In 1966???
>
>
>
>
> I don't think it was as blatant and rampant as it seems to be in Star Wars these days though. It was more subtle and didn't detract from the actual story. Right now, other than Rogue One, Star Wars is being rather... blatant with the SJW stuff, virtually beating us in the face with it. In contrast, whenever Star Trek ventured into SJW territory... they blended it in with the story so that it didn't detract from the story. It was just an element. Not the focus.
True, very true, it never was allowed to get in the way of the plot. I think partly why that is is because in the federation they are passed all the racist stuff, homobia, sexism and so on, or at least enough that they aren't that concerned, so now they focus on weirder forms of biogry and issues, like AL, aliens, and so on.
Who cares about skin colour when the dude over there has a positronic brain and the lady over their can read your thoughts.
> rattler2 wrote: »
>
> I don't think it was as blatant and rampant as it seems to be in Star Wars these days though. It was more subtle and didn't detract from the actual story. Right now, other than Rogue One, Star Wars is being rather... blatant with the SJW stuff, virtually beating us in the face with it.
>
>
>
>
> Please enlighten us on exactly how Star Wars is blatantly beating us in the face with SJW stuff.
You can find that out all over the internet.
Not that I care, I think Star Wars is a huge wasted potential filled with recycled wars and uninteresting characters. I like Yoda, the force, lightsabres, Ewoks, and Princess Leia in the bikini with Jabba the Hut, when that former storm trooper Finn stood up to his female boss, and that is it, I have no use for the rest of the setting, it's over rated.
Just one story that isn't about the same war, recycled, again and again, it's the perfect example of the Cardassian repetitive epic.
> Solo was a fun sci-fi flick, and an excellent heist-caper film. Alden Ehrenreich did a great job of portraying young Han, the meeting with Chewbacca explained a lot about their later relationship, and for what I believe might be the first time in his career Woody Harrelson doesn't just play Woody Harrelson. I think the reviews suffer from two problems, both telling us more about the reviewer than about the movie:
>
> 1) the fact that nobody in the entire film uses the Force to do anything, because none of them are Jedi; and
>
> 2) the rabid "fans" who hate anything new, who used to be stuck in magazine letter columns and the like back when they complained about The Empire Strikes Back but now get their voices amplified far beyond any actual influence they might have by the modern Internet.
>
> And then you have folks like Rattler, who are willing to give the movie a chance but fear spending theater-ticket prices on a movie that might not be good. That cuts severely into the box-office take, while not in fact reflecting anything about the movie's actual quality. Understandable, but still...
Now see no one using the force, that sounds different, now you have my interest.
Apparently it's an "SJW" insult to testosterone for males to be required to obey the orders of females just because the females outrank them, and for said males to ever find they were mistaken to have disobeyed said orders in the first place. (Had Leia's and Holdo's plan gone off without Poe's interference, the most probable outcome would have been that the First Order, not knowing about the cloaked transports or the concealed old Rebellion base, would have eventually destroyed the by-then-abandoned capital ships, believed the Resistance done for, and gone home for a congratulatory round of blue milk.)
Oh, yes, and Rey has the temerity to be almost as strong in the Force as a Skywalker, without in fact being related to them in any way. It seems that this entire sprawling saga is "supposed" to be about the inbred infighting among a single family, destroying lives across the stars as they figure out which side of the Force is better.
> The claim of "SJW takin' over muh Star Wars!!" seems to be based in the idea that a) General Leia Organa-Solo displays her family's Force power when she winds up outside the ship (and still has to be hustled off to Medical, where she spends most of the movie in a coma); b) her replacement, Vice-Admiral Holdo, is also female (not a squid who can't see a trap until it closes, as God and Lucas apparently intended); c) said Vice-Admiral doesn't feel the need to fill in some random fighter pilot (whose recklessness recently managed to destroy one First Order dreadnought, at the cost of almost all of their light fighters and every last one of their bombers) on the details of highly-classified plans (remembering that they believed tracking through hyperspace was impossible, therefore the First Order's ability to do so was likely because somebody was feeding them information); and d), and most unforgivably of all, when said fighter pilot set off on his own in defiance of orders, he was wrong and very nearly got the entire Resistance killed.
>
> Apparently it's an "SJW" insult to testosterone for males to be required to obey the orders of females just because the females outrank them, and for said males to ever find they were mistaken to have disobeyed said orders in the first place. (Had Leia's and Holdo's plan gone off without Poe's interference, the most probable outcome would have been that the First Order, not knowing about the cloaked transports or the concealed old Rebellion base, would have eventually destroyed the by-then-abandoned capital ships, believed the Resistance done for, and gone home for a congratulatory round of blue milk.)
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> Oh, yes, and Rey has the temerity to be almost as strong in the Force as a Skywalker, without in fact being related to them in any way. It seems that this entire sprawling saga is "supposed" to be about the inbred infighting among a single family, destroying lives across the stars as they figure out which side of the Force is better.
I don't think that anyone suggested that it was an insult to follow a female boss' orders.
Honestly I haven't seen the movie, but from what I've heard is that males are written to be universally useless morons and the females are Mary Sues, but I can't verify that as I haven't watched most of them and don't intend to because I'm not a Star Wars fan aside from Yoda and Princess Leia.
This also talks about the deal involving creating new series with new possible details, like a Star Trek Academy spin off (perhaps this would be the project they are referring to, with Patrick Stewart as a Professor of gifted young students, so with telepathic abilities far beyond a normal humans...wait this sounds familiar... Oh TRIBBLE they are going to merge his Professor X and Captain Picard roles into a single character ;p), the Khan Miniseries might still be on, and who knows what else.
If they are doing new series, it'd be neat to do Captain Shon and the Enterprise F as well and a series focused on a none federation ship, like an Orion Pirate ship forced to save the universe, and a series about sending ships to explore the bruise where scientists believe an alternate universe hit ours leaving a cold bruise, and maybe give Q his own series, The Immortal Adventures of Q, and Little House on Ferenginar, a show called 7th Stov'kor about a Klingon Cleric and his family. Maybe they should just change the name of CBS all access to The Star Trek Channel.
More details.
Possible shows:
Khan, that has been rumoured for awhile.
Starfleet Academy (not a new idea, but it's reamerged).
Another miniseries, unknown plotline
Animated Series
And I was kind of joking about a Star Trek Channel, but they are going to hire an Executive dedicated to over seeing Star Trek, can you imagine being Vice President at CBS for Star Trek.
If CBS and Paramount do merge, that is just going to magnify things, because they have so many Star Trek projects between them, including two separate movies at Paramount.
This is an exciting year to be a Trekkie.
Holy Jumda Sticks on a cracker, now it's possibly multiple animated series, with Patrick Stewart not only acting in one of the Live Action series, but acting as a voice actor in animated star trek series!
If this is true it's really is time to just call CBS all access the Star Trek Network for real. That is a lot of Star Trek.
To be fair, Holdo is pretty easy to hate. Her plan was decent, but she went about it in the worst way possible. It's one thing to shut out an underling from your plans, but Holdo manages to actively breed distrust. Remember it wasn't just what's-his-name who went off the rails, it was a full-blown mutiny because she failed to gain the trust of a large portion of the crew by not just shutting them out, but doing it in a snide, passive-aggressive way that makes it seem like she's doing it more out of spite than out of strategy. She also failed to include any other officers who had a reputation for being trustworthy, who could have diffused the situation. Assuming there were any, the only She might be a decent tactician (though her tactics are pretty basic), but she's a bad leader.
Now back to the new series, I don't' think any of the new series involve the enterprise, because no other TNG actors have come forward saying they are in talks to reprise their role. Still maybe I'm wrong, and they want to make sure Picard is a lock before approaching other actors.
Still I think he'll be a professor at the Academy along side I hope Avery Brooke's who idea for Starfleet Academy series was originally his I think.
Also I hope and pray they cooderinate with Cryptic better then Discovery's first season did, although Crptic made the best of it with the Discovery Lockbox.
And maybe the unknown miniseries is about the Enterprise E to boost the Synergy with STO.
It was rather odd to NOT let anyone know they were trying to get to an old Rebel base. Made it look like her only plan was just to run at sublight. Not fight, not try and do anything. Just run.
But lets face it, The Last Jedi was pretty much a fiasco. It honestly makes Star Trek: The Motion(less) Picture look good.
Speak for yourself man. I happen to like Star Trek AND Star Wars. And Wing Commander, Stargate, Babylon 5, Battletech/Mechwarrior...
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(Remember, Leia didn't tell anyone outside the General Staff either, but I guess she gets a pass because she's what, one of the guys?)
Seriously, am I the only one here who grasps the concept of OPSEC? If you don't have the clearance for the information, you don't get the information, no matter how badly you want it.
No. You're not. Its how Holdo went about it. Even if he got in trouble above their last base for losing the bomber wing while taking out the Dreadnaught, Poe Dameron was still acting as the Raddis' Wing Commander. Honestly he would have been one of the people who should have been in on the plan as when it comes to defending the ships from fighter attack, Poe would have been leading the defense (granted he got his wing clipped when the hanger got hit in a surprise fighter attack). Not only that, he could have helped keep things from escalating the way they did. Instead, he got told NOTHING at all. Not even that the plan was classified. As far as he knew, there was no plan whatsoever. Just told to be a good boy and sit on your hands. So as a result he was the one LEADING the mutiny.
If he had known there was something besides running, he might not have been so aggressive in pushing for mutiny. But the way it was handled... it seemed that literally only two people on the entire ship knew the plan: Holdo and Leia. Hell... Poe wasn't even clued in when he saw the shuttles being fueled up.
"Tactical genius" or not, Holdo did kinda drop the ball on trust, as that whole mutiny was avoidable if she hadn't been so aloof.
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And again, General Organa-Solo went about it the same way, but the only thing about her that upsets people was when she saved her own life by displaying her Skywalker heritage.
Yes, I understand the idea of not sharing sensitive information with someone you don't trust (Poe), but Holdo didn't even hint that she had a good reason for holding things back. Keeping Poe out of the loop makes sense, but there must have been somebody on the senior staff that the crew trusted who she could bring in and reassure everybody that "yes, we have a plan, we just can't tell you about it."
And yes, Leia gets a pass. She was one of the figures of the original Rebellion, and they know they can trust her. When Leia keeps you in the dark, you trust her to have a plan. When Holdo not only keeps you in the dark, but does it in a seemingly spiteful, passive-aggressive way, you have no reason to trust that she knows what she's doing.
So you're right that what Holdo did was pretty normal for a military operation, but she managed to TRIBBLE it up so badly that it led to a mutiny. She's a failure as a commander.
Edit: Thanks, censor, you made my post look a lot more profane than it actually is.