OK...I just remembered what I was going to say....
You can grab anything from any mission can't you....thanks to that skip button? I can test with my Delta Recruit I am running right now.
Edit: Oh those sneaky TRIBBLE....they stuck that Yesterday's War Arc in the middle, everything is gray on that tab. And after you click on that Yesterday's War tab...resets all the previous missions I just skipped to "Hail" and turns the "Skip" button gray on them. Leaving me to go back and play everything to unlock Yesterday's War all over again. LOL!
Well, so, that is not a quick way to get to the upper level missions any more. But you can still do the FEs if above Level 10. And I really did not want to skip the Fek'IhrI anyways.
And my Delta Recruit picked up that Trait from the Renegade's Regret FE...she is at level 15 or something. So any character can collect the newest stuff from the current FE Event if they made it through the tutorial and is Level 10. And upgrades to them are free to Mark 12.
Cryptic could make money selling people STORAGE GARAGES just for gear.
Post edited by where2r1 on
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Hmmm...since they seemed to have locked out skipping missions to access the free gear... how viable would low level PvP BE any more?
You guys don't do that stuff with the "regular" Eng/Tac/Sci consoles and weapons, are you? Without sets from missions at all????
It sounds like the world's most boring PvP ever. Is that even challenging? Where is the problem that one would have to strategicize over? Wouldn't it just be a stale mate only on the other end of the spectrum?
Hmmm....I think I need some people over here who have all these budget sets memorized. LOL! I wonder how the PvP Bootcamp people are going to be handling the more low level PvP?
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Problem:
Every Player has access to every ability.
Every Player has access to every ship.
Every player has access to every trait.
There is no limitation by Captain Career....thanks to Specialization.
No limitation by Faction...thanks to Cross Faction everything.
And every player has access to every Universal Console, now.
Right? The last Dev blog (I think it was the Infinity Lockbox blog) said they are unlocking all universal consoles across ships???
I don't see how there can be any competiton any more. LOL!
It will all be about who can get the best in everything on the list.
And ship builds become a shopping list.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Every player has access to every ability
Every Player has access to every ship
Every player has access to every trait...
IF
you limit the synergies between abilities/traits/items such that no matter what combination EVERY player has access to, no combination allows them to buy their way to godmode. (aka no combination allows a ship that is incredibly fast, while being immune to damage AND delivering one-shot-kills on any non-identical ship or build).
Well, it is neigh near impossible for PLAYERS to do THAT on their own....
and Cryptic is only going to continue ramping everything up through the roof.
So, what can be done?
I really can't see "vanilla" PvP lasting for very long in this environment, either....
People will see the new "hotness" and want to add it.
Because once you learn the tactics...what is left unless there is a new element?
Is there going to have to be multiple levels of "vanilla"???
That is just breaking up the PvP community...if they are not playing together they can not learn. Then, casuals are where??? Asking them to grind, grind, and grind, again, to move up? Which is divisive as what we saw in the DPS leagues.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
meaning that powers and power-creep would be limited, every new power would come with a drawback, and every special power would come with drawbacks, and there would be diminishing returns coded into stacking things like immunities and special equipment so that 'set bonuses' would also come with 'set drawbacks', set up so that there's a general 'maximum score', an 'average score', and a 'minimum score' and maxing out one aspect (say, movement) would require sacrifice somewhere else, give universal consoles a longer cooldown, and no way to shorten it, limit "lobi powers' to a similar restriction so that you can still have specialist builds, and have generalist builds, but the specialists would be significantly more limited and the generalists would require better over-all gameplay.
That's "powers balance", you can get very powerful on a very narrow field that leaves you vulnerable to more generalist builds, or you can be generally 'okay' at most things, but not as powerful as a specialist.
"Faction balance" would be basically putting a stop to handing out faction-specific gear and unit types to everybody via lockboxes. Meaning Klingons get Klingon ship types and Klingon gear, Feds get Fed shiptypes and Federation gear, and Romulans get Romulan ship types and Romulan gear, and they all have different advantages, but those advantages can be countered in different ways. Faction balance is so far gone away that you can't even see it now.
"Scenario balance"-asymmetrical numbers, asymmetrical builds... if you can't balance powers, and you can't balance factions, balance scenarios. one-on-five doesn't make sense until you recognize that at 'endgame' there are builds that can do it simply because the players have a spreadsheet program and are willing to grind forty hours a week to get that kind of power. a 5-on-5 pug only makes sense when everyone's got roughly (within 10%) the same level of gearing, traits, stats, etc. etc. etc. but we've got an in-built imbalance that makes 2 on 8 a viable fight right now, since Cryptic can not or will not fix the power imbalance, the solution is to let the whales display their investing skill by making them fight at a disadvantage in numbers.
Hmmmm...
"Powers Balancing"...too much stuff out there for that. The nightmare would be real....worse than untangling spaghetti wiring (or spaghetti code).
"Faction Balance".... long gone.
And if you look on Tribble patch notes...they are unlocking Faction specific T-5 ships (and a few T-6s ???) to Romulans. I do not see anything about them unlocking Romulan ships going the other way, though.
"Scenario Balance"....maybe that is what they are planning with this Onslaught thing?
June and ViL is taking entirely too long to get here to stave off my curiosity.
Did anyone make a video of that 2 on 6 (?) you were talking about, way, way earlier? You said your Armada did it?
And the "2", they have access to that Walker immunity bubble, yet, did they? And that Temporal Backstep/Mannheim Device (???)...the immunity bubble that freezes everyone in place for 7 seconds. LOL!
OH and I forgot...you have to kill everyone twice thanks to "Invincible".
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
I think I am done here, Patrickngo..... I can only think of flippant remarks to this, any more.
Totally drained of thinking of PvP and the dire situation it has become. Sorry.
Down the road...will I ever be interested in bashing you over the head with a Harg'pengh Torpedo? ::::grins:::: LOL! No, probably not. I will just imagine you as a pink cloud in my mind's eye.
Post edited by where2r1 on
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
What the heck sort of PvP were they expecting from Level 11 characters???
I think my Delta Recruits have ships with 4 weapons, 4 BOFF abilities (if I happen to have the right career BOFFs, otherwise they only have 3), 4 regular trait slots, same for console slots.
I am already getting PvP mission prompts.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Hmm... and this really does show: PvP is so far ingrained in this program. I mean, all the way down into the first level up! There is no way they can remove it, unless they start from a clean slate.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
So, people with conflicting ideas of what should be in the game is still in there....
Somewhere...at some level. It shows in what actions actually takes place.
And what we ultimately see as we play the game.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Considering at peak evening time EU there are literally 4 players (including me) in Ker'rat, and 0 in the queues, pretty much ANYthing that changes PvP cant be worse than what it is now.
Sorry, @marctraiderz ... I think most people are on Tribble right now.
Are you not "testing" your "builds" with the new Captains and powers and Mark 15 stuff over there?
I do not remember having so much revealed before other "expansions".
The spoilers are getting quite annoying, really.
As far as all that PvP stuff...try getting hold of those PvP Bootcamp folks on Discord.
I think they may be able to point you to where they all hang out....instance, location, meetings, etc...
I really think most people are on Tribble. Not Holodeck.
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Considering at peak evening time EU there are literally 4 players (including me) in Ker'rat, and 0 in the queues, pretty much ANYthing that changes PvP cant be worse than what it is now.
I don't do PvP (not saying never) ... it's just not my preferred style of play. I love reading and understanding different elements (hence why I am reading this post).
I have read the first 2 pages and skimmed the last 2 pages and want to say a massive thank you!
Your updates/posts are amazing and I have had my mind blown, with the complexities of dealing with PvP; I can see exactly where you are coming from and why you make those choices.
(This is just a thank you post ... just amazed at the detail and quality of this discussion around PvP)
Well....I couldn't sleep. (What else is new???)
So, I downloaded and patched Neverwinter....because it was driving me nuts I could not remember the names for my characters.
I wandered around for an hour and was clicking around the UI....and I come across this...hmmmm...
Never seen this before...it has been added since I quit playing, I think.
I assume it works over there. They only have ground combat.
I can not for the life of me remember HOW to walk on that game. LOL!
But I know my character's names now:
Falkrunn Torgarsaxe is a Dwarf/Guardian Fighter. (She gets an Axe and a Shield)
Breella is a Half-Orc Great Weapons Fighter. (She has a sword taller than her)
"Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Comments
You can grab anything from any mission can't you....thanks to that skip button? I can test with my Delta Recruit I am running right now.
Edit: Oh those sneaky TRIBBLE....they stuck that Yesterday's War Arc in the middle, everything is gray on that tab. And after you click on that Yesterday's War tab...resets all the previous missions I just skipped to "Hail" and turns the "Skip" button gray on them. Leaving me to go back and play everything to unlock Yesterday's War all over again. LOL!
Well, so, that is not a quick way to get to the upper level missions any more. But you can still do the FEs if above Level 10. And I really did not want to skip the Fek'IhrI anyways.
And my Delta Recruit picked up that Trait from the Renegade's Regret FE...she is at level 15 or something. So any character can collect the newest stuff from the current FE Event if they made it through the tutorial and is Level 10. And upgrades to them are free to Mark 12.
Cryptic could make money selling people STORAGE GARAGES just for gear.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
You guys don't do that stuff with the "regular" Eng/Tac/Sci consoles and weapons, are you? Without sets from missions at all????
It sounds like the world's most boring PvP ever. Is that even challenging? Where is the problem that one would have to strategicize over? Wouldn't it just be a stale mate only on the other end of the spectrum?
Hmmm....I think I need some people over here who have all these budget sets memorized. LOL! I wonder how the PvP Bootcamp people are going to be handling the more low level PvP?
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Every Player has access to every ability.
Every Player has access to every ship.
Every player has access to every trait.
There is no limitation by Captain Career....thanks to Specialization.
No limitation by Faction...thanks to Cross Faction everything.
And every player has access to every Universal Console, now.
Right? The last Dev blog (I think it was the Infinity Lockbox blog) said they are unlocking all universal consoles across ships???
I don't see how there can be any competiton any more. LOL!
It will all be about who can get the best in everything on the list.
And ship builds become a shopping list.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Well, it is neigh near impossible for PLAYERS to do THAT on their own....
and Cryptic is only going to continue ramping everything up through the roof.
So, what can be done?
I really can't see "vanilla" PvP lasting for very long in this environment, either....
People will see the new "hotness" and want to add it.
Because once you learn the tactics...what is left unless there is a new element?
Is there going to have to be multiple levels of "vanilla"???
That is just breaking up the PvP community...if they are not playing together they can not learn. Then, casuals are where??? Asking them to grind, grind, and grind, again, to move up? Which is divisive as what we saw in the DPS leagues.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Hmmmm...
"Powers Balancing"...too much stuff out there for that. The nightmare would be real....worse than untangling spaghetti wiring (or spaghetti code).
"Faction Balance".... long gone.
And if you look on Tribble patch notes...they are unlocking Faction specific T-5 ships (and a few T-6s ???) to Romulans. I do not see anything about them unlocking Romulan ships going the other way, though.
"Scenario Balance"....maybe that is what they are planning with this Onslaught thing?
June and ViL is taking entirely too long to get here to stave off my curiosity.
Did anyone make a video of that 2 on 6 (?) you were talking about, way, way earlier? You said your Armada did it?
And the "2", they have access to that Walker immunity bubble, yet, did they? And that Temporal Backstep/Mannheim Device (???)...the immunity bubble that freezes everyone in place for 7 seconds. LOL!
OH and I forgot...you have to kill everyone twice thanks to "Invincible".
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Totally drained of thinking of PvP and the dire situation it has become. Sorry.
Down the road...will I ever be interested in bashing you over the head with a Harg'pengh Torpedo? ::::grins:::: LOL! No, probably not. I will just imagine you as a pink cloud in my mind's eye.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Hmmmm... I just made a Fed Klingon..... :::::evil grin::::
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
I think my Delta Recruits have ships with 4 weapons, 4 BOFF abilities (if I happen to have the right career BOFFs, otherwise they only have 3), 4 regular trait slots, same for console slots.
I am already getting PvP mission prompts.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
As players, we can only see the odd result.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
So, people with conflicting ideas of what should be in the game is still in there....
Somewhere...at some level. It shows in what actions actually takes place.
And what we ultimately see as we play the game.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
DED.
Are you not "testing" your "builds" with the new Captains and powers and Mark 15 stuff over there?
I do not remember having so much revealed before other "expansions".
The spoilers are getting quite annoying, really.
As far as all that PvP stuff...try getting hold of those PvP Bootcamp folks on Discord.
I think they may be able to point you to where they all hang out....instance, location, meetings, etc...
I really think most people are on Tribble. Not Holodeck.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
Besides the one I saw a month ago about this PvP Bootcamp thing? It looks like they did one tournament and dissipated.
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
@marctraiderz @cesitar257 at what level are you doing PvP at, anyways?
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
I don't do PvP (not saying never) ... it's just not my preferred style of play. I love reading and understanding different elements (hence why I am reading this post).
I have read the first 2 pages and skimmed the last 2 pages and want to say a massive thank you!
Your updates/posts are amazing and I have had my mind blown, with the complexities of dealing with PvP; I can see exactly where you are coming from and why you make those choices.
(This is just a thank you post ... just amazed at the detail and quality of this discussion around PvP)
So, I downloaded and patched Neverwinter....because it was driving me nuts I could not remember the names for my characters.
I wandered around for an hour and was clicking around the UI....and I come across this...hmmmm...
Never seen this before...it has been added since I quit playing, I think.
I assume it works over there. They only have ground combat.
I can not for the life of me remember HOW to walk on that game. LOL!
But I know my character's names now:
Falkrunn Torgarsaxe is a Dwarf/Guardian Fighter. (She gets an Axe and a Shield)
Breella is a Half-Orc Great Weapons Fighter. (She has a sword taller than her)
“Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin