Also, (yes I'm going to say it) more defensive power would help with the "balance" in PvP. Since some people still do it, and apparently a so called "PvP revamp" was mentioned and now there's a new PvP queue on tribble, an engineering defensive ability buff could tie into that "revamp."
Except that now most people speed tank. Last time I was in PvP, I actually got physically sick trying to track a target because it was zooming around at warp speeds. Combine that with all the cheese, for starters it almost crashed my comp, and secondly it almost crashed my brain. They do speed tanking and vapes. It's all fine and dandy if you can heal from dead to full in 3 seconds, but that's not going to do you much good if you get vaped in under a second.
The fact is that if people want the extra defensive abilities that engineering provides (like me), why change it? People who want to do major damage have tactical and science. There may be no need for you to have to soak up additional damage using engineering abilities, but for a lot of people there might be (whether they PvE or PvP). Let's just not turn engineering into a DPS oriented class. Engineering is about defense. Tactical is about offense.
It's not a matter of engi not doing it's job. It does it's job just fine. The problem is that it's job isn't necessary. Don't turn it into a DPS oriented class? Ok fine. But you're in a DPS oriented game. Yes. Tactical is about offensive. But when my tac captain can have almost equivalent durability and tanking capability as my engi (~90%), all without engi captain abilities, and do almost double the DPS from it's massively DPS oriented captain layout, then you know something's wrong, and if not wrong, then something needs to change.
Can you tell Engineering is my life in this game? I honestly don't know what I would do if Engineering was changed away from what it is now. I just don't "synergize" well with Tactical and Science as well as I do Engineering.
EDIT: I'm glad engineering is receiving the attention it is on the forums though, I wouldn't have thought most people cared about Engineering.
My first captain in this game was an engineer. I ran cruisers from lvl 10 to lvl 50, then later to 60. To my friends in game, I was "that guy in the cruiser". My favorite ship has always been the Tac Oddy, then later the Tac Oddy T5U. Yeah, now I fly a Chronos/Presidio, but I will always love my big fat space whale.
Don't get me wrong, I get the love for engi. I've always had a thing for mine. And before S7 came out, it actually had a use. I was the punching bag for the Borg. I did my job well, and I did it with pride. But as the game has evolved (and after much whining from all the tacscorts about being too squishy), sustain became stronger and easier. Passive and active durability has increased exponentially (I wish I was exaggerating but I'm not), regardless of class. Tacs have gained the ability to deal even MORE damage. Scis have even more CC at their disposal. And engis? Well yeah, we can tank more, but the other classes can now tank almost as well.
When the survivability of a class is only 10% greater than the others, and it's damage output is 20-100% less, that's really not a fair trade-off, esp when the stronger survivability isn't a necessity.
Improve an Engineer in space? Demand Cryptic adds a zen store token to change career types. Then purchase one and change to a Tac or even a Sci :-)
That was a useful and totally constructive comment that didn't come off condescending at all...I'm still a proponent of giving then a lot more threat gen not tied to doing damage, so they can fulfill the role their abilities were obviously designed for.
(and now the second response since it seems the forums don't want me to do this all in one)
...It's not a matter of engi not doing it's job. It does it's job just fine. The problem is that it's job isn't necessary...
...My first captain in this game was an engineer. I ran cruisers from lvl 10 to lvl 50, then later to 60. To my friends in game, I was "that guy in the cruiser". My favorite ship has always been the Tac Oddy, then later the Tac Oddy T5U. Yeah, now I fly a Chronos/Presidio, but I will always love my big fat space whale...
...Don't get me wrong, I get the love for engi. I've always had a thing for mine. And before S7 came out, it actually had a use. I was the punching bag for the Borg. I did my job well, and I did it with pride...
...When the survivability of a class is only 10% greater than the others, and it's damage output is 20-100% less, that's really not a fair trade-off, esp when the stronger survivability isn't a necessity.
Seconded...though I can still get well over 100k and almost 10k tps in the t6 sci oddy after all the power creep. This, from remembering the days when a tenth of that was rare for engineers.
Maybe. I've actulaly worked EPS overload into my current DPS build. Still have yet to pick up Nadion Bypass, but mainly because I've picked up a couple of other engineering traits along the way such as Fleet Technician. Still trying to gather together everything I need and make out a plan (was going to stay DPS-traited, but after seeing the K-13 stuff...). I've half a notion the meta is about to change again. I'd also really like to remake a tanking build using at least some of this new stuff just to see how well it actually does.
Don't forget coalition starship tactics, at least for durability...that and a well-boosted fleet technician are some nice tools.
I've actually been eyeballing Coalition Starship Tactics. Might get it (along with all the other traits mentioned) for my new KDF engineer. Instead of shying away from my main's DPS build, decided to go that route and give my Marauder Flight Deck Cruiser some love.
I've actually been eyeballing Coalition Starship Tactics. Might get it (along with all the other traits mentioned) for my new KDF engineer. Instead of shying away from my main's DPS build, decided to go that route and give my Marauder Flight Deck Cruiser some love.
what's in them?
I still wanna find a way to avoid feeling like a skeet pigeon in a PVP, since my life expectancy is roughly 30-40 seconds in a PVP, despite having all Mk14 stuffs. ~large anime sweatdrop~
I still wanna find a way to avoid feeling like a skeet pigeon in a PVP, since my life expectancy is roughly 30-40 seconds in a PVP, despite having all Mk14 stuffs. ~large anime sweatdrop~
Each of the following bonuses may stack up to 5 times. Only Players contribute to these buffs, but you also gain a benefit from your own class while solo.
Per Engineer teammate: +X Shield Regeneration per sec
Per Science teammate: +3% Hull Healing Received
Per Tactical teammate: +3% Flight Speed and Defense
Your engineering expertise allows you to convey additional hull repairs for any teammates that are affected by your Engineering Fleet ability.
Adds a Hull Heal-Over-Time effect to teammates affected by your Engineering Fleet ability.
If you're dying that fast as a tank, you may want to check your build. Granted, everybody you're facing is probably running the [pen] mod and pretty much ruining your day. That's when you go full tank with plenty of self-heals and go full troll as they try to kill you.
I've actually been eyeballing Coalition Starship Tactics. Might get it (along with all the other traits mentioned) for my new KDF engineer. Instead of shying away from my main's DPS build, decided to go that route and give my Marauder Flight Deck Cruiser some love.
what's in them?
I still wanna find a way to avoid feeling like a skeet pigeon in a PVP, since my life expectancy is roughly 30-40 seconds in a PVP, despite having all Mk14 stuffs. ~large anime sweatdrop~
I doubt it's your fault that you're dying so fast. The Temporal Space abilities that just about everyone in PvP flies nowadays are very hard to tank.
There has to some sort of counter to that. Stack up on exotic resists, maybe?
Supposedly stacking things that say +All Damage Resistance and +Physical Damage Resistance will help, but in my tests despite using these things, my resists are almost in the negatives against entropy. Plus they just bypass shields, although shields were already just about worthless anyways in pvp.
Entropy, yeah. Though I thought there was a skill or two in the Temporal skillset that let you wipe entropy off of yourself. Give me a minute to log on and take a look.
Wipes Entropy off of your ship. Of course, the drawback is that you'd need a cruiser with Temporal seating, which problem is further compounded by the fact that there's no DOFFs that will buff this skill.
I've actually been eyeballing Coalition Starship Tactics. Might get it (along with all the other traits mentioned) for my new KDF engineer. Instead of shying away from my main's DPS build, decided to go that route and give my Marauder Flight Deck Cruiser some love.
what's in them?
I still wanna find a way to avoid feeling like a skeet pigeon in a PVP, since my life expectancy is roughly 30-40 seconds in a PVP, despite having all Mk14 stuffs. ~large anime sweatdrop~
don't feel bad, even experienced players wind up in that position against dedicated grinders, and no single thing is going to fix it until you find the combination that fits your own style and instincts.
Well, right now, after each PVP, I feel like this:
You know just thought of something that engineers could use that would make them a bit more desired/appealing to use in a group, which would also not really need to have a change to the game's style of content. What I am thinking is how the power cap works, like that engineers do not have the same power cap of 125 for how high the bonus they gain from a sub-system power-level is. Another idea could be that while in a group with a engineer other non-engineers gain different bonuses from having high sub-system power levels that are based on that specific sub-system's type.
You need to be fair, though. Back in 2012 when I started enjoying STO, the PvP community had its fair share of self-important loudmouths without manners who would go around and yell that they believed the developers were oh so bad at their job... nobody likes to be accused of that, and so, defensive comments like Geko's are a natural outcome.
Yeah. Except Geko is a professional; head-professional, no less, so he needs to act the part. As the lead developer you just can't engage in the kind of Publikumsbeschimpfung, the way he did: they're your customers; if you don't like what they say about PvP, just ignore them.
It was the same for PvE, btw. Geko always seemed to take it personal, like 'Geko vs. the top of the DPS League.' Which resulted in some mssions needing to be seriously toned down, shortly after DR, when he realized not everyone does top DPS.
You know just thought of something that engineers could use that would make them a bit more desired/appealing to use in a group, which would also not really need to have a change to the game's style of content. What I am thinking is how the power cap works, like that engineers do not have the same power cap of 125 for how high the bonus they gain from a sub-system power-level is. Another idea could be that while in a group with a engineer other non-engineers gain different bonuses from having high sub-system power levels that are based on that specific sub-system's type.
Another interesting idea, making them team support/team dependent, since that's what they seem to have been designed to do (theoretically).
I've actually been eyeballing Coalition Starship Tactics. Might get it (along with all the other traits mentioned) for my new KDF engineer. Instead of shying away from my main's DPS build, decided to go that route and give my Marauder Flight Deck Cruiser some love.
Imo, provided you're an engi or can get multiple on your team, one of the more underrated genetic resequencers. My main's shield regenerates at ~1250/6s and the trait adds 210/s at current skils, thus doubling my passive regen.
I've actually been eyeballing Coalition Starship Tactics. Might get it (along with all the other traits mentioned) for my new KDF engineer. Instead of shying away from my main's DPS build, decided to go that route and give my Marauder Flight Deck Cruiser some love.
Imo, provided you're an engi or can get multiple on your team, one of the more underrated genetic resequencers. My main's shield regenerates at ~1250/6s and the trait adds 210/s at current skils, thus doubling my passive regen.
Yeah, the shield regeneration buff from that trait is really nice.
You know just thought of something that engineers could use that would make them a bit more desired/appealing to use in a group, which would also not really need to have a change to the game's style of content. What I am thinking is how the power cap works, like that engineers do not have the same power cap of 125 for how high the bonus they gain from a sub-system power-level is. Another idea could be that while in a group with a engineer other non-engineers gain different bonuses from having high sub-system power levels that are based on that specific sub-system's type.
Another interesting idea, making them team support/team dependent, since that's what they seem to have been designed to do (theoretically).
Yeah kinda trying to figure what career abilities to link with the idea, though I am thinking making it that engineers base-line have a higher sub-system power level cap than other careers (like maybe raising it to 150 maybe). I would rather see EPS Power Transfer have the idea of during it's duration it raises the buff cap of the other non-engineer players in the group by maybe 10-20 points. While engineering fleet I could see that ability giving party-members a different set of buffs from their power levels in their sub-systems that are affected by it. It might be interesting to make rotate shield frequency have that during the duration it would either reduce the shield bypass, or completely negate shield bypassing effect damage of incoming attacks. All of these would fit the style of a engineering character as it would be like you telling your teammates how to get the most out of their ship, which could even also be a continuous bonus that while in a group the engineer gives out a different bonus effect based on the team-member's ship type.
I have also been wondering what could be done with the cruiser command auras, so that all of them are more appealing to use, or atleast that when you have several cruisers in a group you have more than just the Weapon System Efficiency command aura. Could be maybe have some function that when getting into a group the cruiser switches thru the command auras till it finds one not being used (except the attract fire command aura.).
Just because they didn't fire him, doesn't mean companies, in general, are happy with employees calling their customers names. It was a faux pas. And the fact that we're still talking about it, to date, proves the fact.
Comments
wow, this was perfectly said.
That was a useful and totally constructive comment that didn't come off condescending at all...I'm still a proponent of giving then a lot more threat gen not tied to doing damage, so they can fulfill the role their abilities were obviously designed for.
Seconded...though I can still get well over 100k and almost 10k tps in the t6 sci oddy after all the power creep. This, from remembering the days when a tenth of that was rare for engineers.
Don't forget coalition starship tactics, at least for durability...that and a well-boosted fleet technician are some nice tools.
what's in them?
I still wanna find a way to avoid feeling like a skeet pigeon in a PVP, since my life expectancy is roughly 30-40 seconds in a PVP, despite having all Mk14 stuffs. ~large anime sweatdrop~
Coalition Starship Tactics: http://sto.gamepedia.com/Trait:_Coalition_Starship_Tactics
Each of the following bonuses may stack up to 5 times. Only Players contribute to these buffs, but you also gain a benefit from your own class while solo.
Per Engineer teammate: +X Shield Regeneration per sec
Per Science teammate: +3% Hull Healing Received
Per Tactical teammate: +3% Flight Speed and Defense
Fleet Technician: http://sto.gamepedia.com/Trait:_Fleet_Technician
Your engineering expertise allows you to convey additional hull repairs for any teammates that are affected by your Engineering Fleet ability.
Adds a Hull Heal-Over-Time effect to teammates affected by your Engineering Fleet ability.
If you're dying that fast as a tank, you may want to check your build. Granted, everybody you're facing is probably running the [pen] mod and pretty much ruining your day. That's when you go full tank with plenty of self-heals and go full troll as they try to kill you.
Yeah, I'd rather leave the game than do that. Great idea you have there. *sarcasm*
I doubt it's your fault that you're dying so fast. The Temporal Space abilities that just about everyone in PvP flies nowadays are very hard to tank.
Supposedly stacking things that say +All Damage Resistance and +Physical Damage Resistance will help, but in my tests despite using these things, my resists are almost in the negatives against entropy. Plus they just bypass shields, although shields were already just about worthless anyways in pvp.
Wipes Entropy off of your ship. Of course, the drawback is that you'd need a cruiser with Temporal seating, which problem is further compounded by the fact that there's no DOFFs that will buff this skill.
Well, right now, after each PVP, I feel like this:
Yeah. Except Geko is a professional; head-professional, no less, so he needs to act the part. As the lead developer you just can't engage in the kind of Publikumsbeschimpfung, the way he did: they're your customers; if you don't like what they say about PvP, just ignore them.
It was the same for PvE, btw. Geko always seemed to take it personal, like 'Geko vs. the top of the DPS League.' Which resulted in some mssions needing to be seriously toned down, shortly after DR, when he realized not everyone does top DPS.
How do we know this?!
Another interesting idea, making them team support/team dependent, since that's what they seem to have been designed to do (theoretically).
Imo, provided you're an engi or can get multiple on your team, one of the more underrated genetic resequencers. My main's shield regenerates at ~1250/6s and the trait adds 210/s at current skils, thus doubling my passive regen.
Yeah, the shield regeneration buff from that trait is really nice.
Yeah kinda trying to figure what career abilities to link with the idea, though I am thinking making it that engineers base-line have a higher sub-system power level cap than other careers (like maybe raising it to 150 maybe). I would rather see EPS Power Transfer have the idea of during it's duration it raises the buff cap of the other non-engineer players in the group by maybe 10-20 points. While engineering fleet I could see that ability giving party-members a different set of buffs from their power levels in their sub-systems that are affected by it. It might be interesting to make rotate shield frequency have that during the duration it would either reduce the shield bypass, or completely negate shield bypassing effect damage of incoming attacks. All of these would fit the style of a engineering character as it would be like you telling your teammates how to get the most out of their ship, which could even also be a continuous bonus that while in a group the engineer gives out a different bonus effect based on the team-member's ship type.
I have also been wondering what could be done with the cruiser command auras, so that all of them are more appealing to use, or atleast that when you have several cruisers in a group you have more than just the Weapon System Efficiency command aura. Could be maybe have some function that when getting into a group the cruiser switches thru the command auras till it finds one not being used (except the attract fire command aura.).
He might just be smooching the overlords' backsides.
Suits LOVE yesmen.
Just because they didn't fire him, doesn't mean companies, in general, are happy with employees calling their customers names. It was a faux pas. And the fact that we're still talking about it, to date, proves the fact.
But let's talk about Engineers again.