Star Fleet Battles has the ISC (Inter Stellar Concordium), which is basically like the Federation, but from a a different part of the galaxy. They invade because they want to keep the various empires from fighting
I think it might work best as a previously-undiscovered alliance in a distant part of the Delta Quad. (Remember that each quadrant is one-quarter of an entire galaxy that's over a hundred thousand lightyears across - there's a lot of room out there for previously-unknown interstellar governments.)
Borrowing heavily from the above, this Alliance consisted originally of worlds that had survived Borg attacks, and banded together for mutual defense. They would consider it one of their primary missions to discover worlds with developed sapient species, usually with some variety of advanced technology, and invite them to join the Alliance before the Borg attacked them too. They're not "warlike" as such, not in the sense of the Klingon Empire or the old Cardassian Union, but they're more than ready to defend themselves when attacked, with technology roughly equal to that of the Federation or the Empire. They'd be more like the Federation than unlike - except that they believe it would be foolish to leave sapient beings to "develop on their own", in a universe that includes the Borg. Rather than Starfleet's hands-off General Order One, they would operate by the principle that interference is required so that other sophonts have a chance to live.
In encounters with the Federation, given the differences in the basic situation in Alpha/Beta and Delta quads, it would be (on both sides) a case of, "Wait a minute, this guy's got a point there..." They almost certainly wouldn't wind up firing at one another, unless of course your particular ship is protecting, say, a Borg Coalition ship that's wandered out of its usual territory, and the Alliance ship wants to destroy the lousy Borg before they can start assimilating everything in sight. (In that way, it would be similar to some of the Benthan encounters we experience in the current DQ missions, except without the fascist overtones in our opponents.)
Yes, the Octanti. Sorry, been a while since I ran Delta patrols, and I was confusing that with a Benthan mission where they're not exactly on the up-and-up (for a change).
Borrowing heavily from the above, this Alliance consisted originally of worlds that had survived Borg attacks, and banded together for mutual defense. They would consider it one of their primary missions to discover worlds with developed sapient species, usually with some variety of advanced technology, and invite them to join the Alliance before the Borg attacked them too. They're not "warlike" as such, not in the sense of the Klingon Empire or the old Cardassian Union, but they're more than ready to defend themselves when attacked, with technology roughly equal to that of the Federation or the Empire. They'd be more like the Federation than unlike - except that they believe it would be foolish to leave sapient beings to "develop on their own", in a universe that includes the Borg. Rather than Starfleet's hands-off General Order One, they would operate by the principle that interference is required so that other sophonts have a chance to live.
I'd enjoy that. Probably too much, as I'd end up agitating for them to be a playable faction.
I think it might work best as a previously-undiscovered alliance in a distant part of the Delta Quad. (Remember that each quadrant is one-quarter of an entire galaxy that's over a hundred thousand lightyears across - there's a lot of room out there for previously-unknown interstellar governments.)
Borrowing heavily from the above, this Alliance consisted originally of worlds that had survived Borg attacks, and banded together for mutual defense. They would consider it one of their primary missions to discover worlds with developed sapient species, usually with some variety of advanced technology, and invite them to join the Alliance before the Borg attacked them too. They're not "warlike" as such, not in the sense of the Klingon Empire or the old Cardassian Union, but they're more than ready to defend themselves when attacked, with technology roughly equal to that of the Federation or the Empire. They'd be more like the Federation than unlike - except that they believe it would be foolish to leave sapient beings to "develop on their own", in a universe that includes the Borg. Rather than Starfleet's hands-off General Order One, they would operate by the principle that interference is required so that other sophonts have a chance to live.
In encounters with the Federation, given the differences in the basic situation in Alpha/Beta and Delta quads, it would be (on both sides) a case of, "Wait a minute, this guy's got a point there..." They almost certainly wouldn't wind up firing at one another, unless of course your particular ship is protecting, say, a Borg Coalition ship that's wandered out of its usual territory, and the Alliance ship wants to destroy the lousy Borg before they can start assimilating everything in sight. (In that way, it would be similar to some of the Benthan encounters we experience in the current DQ missions, except without the fascist overtones in our opponents.)
So Team America, against the Film Actors Guild...
My only issue with that concept, is that principle of interference being required is a presumption that such help is going to be welcome by the recipients...
For example:
Alliance Commander: You don't want to be assimilated into the Collective, do you?
Planetary Leader: No, nor do we want you telling us what to do...
Alliance Commander: But we can help you in the future...
Planetary Leader: And how soon does 'but we helped you with the Borg', become the whip you use to guilt us into compliance??
The well-intentioned Alliance may not have considered that their help is not invited and not wanted, so may be seen as just as intrusive and damaging, just in different ways...
@marcusdkane Why is that a problem? That's the whole point, surely, that the Alliance aren't always clearly in the right (and neither are the Federation). In fact I'd been thinking that the only problem was that I couldn't see how to make the disagreement ever be more pointed than, as Jonsills said, a mild mannered "This guy's got a point here", and you've thought of a way.
Hey, it'd be exactly like "Errand of Mercy". And like "Errand of Mercy", the Alliance faction would take some saying "no" to if for some reason it was important to them that the Borg should NOT get that particular planet. They might decide to take extreme measures, sending telepaths to manipulate the planetary leaders or whatever, to get this planet to agree to their offer - "for their own good". And in that case, the player captain might have to get involved directly to try and stop them.
An equivalent on the Federation's side, where they're arguably in the wrong, is something like the incident described in part 2 of the "Uprising" Foundry series, where a species called the Alabantrians - who weren't yet warp-capable, but getting close, and had found out about the existence of aliens - asked the Federation to defend them against the Borg, but the Federation refused claiming the Prime Directive forbade them to interfere. Of course, there were accusations that it had had nothing to do with the Prime Directive and everything to do with not wanting to get in a fight with the Borg. That's another thing that could come into it - neither side might be acting quite as purely from high principles as they say they are.
@marcusdkaneWhy is that a problem? That's the whole point, surely, that the Alliance aren't always clearly in the right (and neither are the Federation). In fact I'd been thinking that the only problem was that I couldn't see how to make the disagreement ever be more pointed than, as Jonsills said, a mild mannered "This guy's got a point here", and you've thought of a way.
Hey, it'd be exactly like "Errand of Mercy". And like "Errand of Mercy", the Alliance faction would take some saying "no" to if for some reason it was important to them that the Borg should NOT get that particular planet. They might decide to take extreme measures, sending telepaths to manipulate the planetary leaders or whatever, to get this planet to agree to their offer - "for their own good". And in that case, the player captain might have to get involved directly to try and stop them.
An equivalent on the Federation's side, where they're arguably in the wrong, is something like the incident described in part 2 of the "Uprising" Foundry series, where a species called the Alabantrians - who weren't yet warp-capable, but getting close, and had found out about the existence of aliens - asked the Federation to defend them against the Borg, but the Federation refused claiming the Prime Directive forbade them to interfere. Of course, there were accusations that it had had nothing to do with the Prime Directive and everything to do with not wanting to get in a fight with the Borg. That's another thing that could come into it - neither side might be acting quite as purely from high principles as they say they are.
It's not a 'problem', but an observation on the mindset. I don't really want to drag RL politics into things, but will say again, that one of the themes behind Team America: World Police, was specifically the opinion that America has the presumption that it has the responsibility/right to police the world, ie going into regions and imposing Western Democracy. And thst said intervention can actually be unwelcome, and in some instances harmful. And that would be 'the problem' which the Federation would take with the Alliance, and would come at it from that political viewpoint, as even benevelent 'we can be of help to you in the future', has the potential to be used as emotional blackmail later down the road...
I think it might work best as a previously-undiscovered alliance in a distant part of the Delta Quad. (Remember that each quadrant is one-quarter of an entire galaxy that's over a hundred thousand lightyears across - there's a lot of room out there for previously-unknown interstellar governments.)
Borrowing heavily from the above, this Alliance consisted originally of worlds that had survived Borg attacks, and banded together for mutual defense. They would consider it one of their primary missions to discover worlds with developed sapient species, usually with some variety of advanced technology, and invite them to join the Alliance before the Borg attacked them too. They're not "warlike" as such, not in the sense of the Klingon Empire or the old Cardassian Union, but they're more than ready to defend themselves when attacked, with technology roughly equal to that of the Federation or the Empire. They'd be more like the Federation than unlike - except that they believe it would be foolish to leave sapient beings to "develop on their own", in a universe that includes the Borg. Rather than Starfleet's hands-off General Order One, they would operate by the principle that interference is required so that other sophonts have a chance to live.
In encounters with the Federation, given the differences in the basic situation in Alpha/Beta and Delta quads, it would be (on both sides) a case of, "Wait a minute, this guy's got a point there..." They almost certainly wouldn't wind up firing at one another, unless of course your particular ship is protecting, say, a Borg Coalition ship that's wandered out of its usual territory, and the Alliance ship wants to destroy the lousy Borg before they can start assimilating everything in sight. (In that way, it would be similar to some of the Benthan encounters we experience in the current DQ missions, except without the fascist overtones in our opponents.)
So Team America, against the Film Actors Guild...
My only issue with that concept, is that principle of interference being required is a presumption that such help is going to be welcome by the recipients...
For example:
Alliance Commander: You don't want to be assimilated into the Collective, do you?
Planetary Leader: No, nor do we want you telling us what to do...
Alliance Commander: But we can help you in the future...
Planetary Leader: And how soon does 'but we helped you with the Borg', become the whip you use to guilt us into compliance??
The well-intentioned Alliance may not have considered that their help is not invited and not wanted, so may be seen as just as intrusive and damaging, just in different ways...
And ethically speaking, that's (in my opinion, anyway) certainly no worse than Picard's willingness to let an entire planetary population die of a preventable disaster in service of (his interpretation of) the Prime Directive*. "That other guy's kind of got a point there..."
I think it might work best as a previously-undiscovered alliance in a distant part of the Delta Quad. (Remember that each quadrant is one-quarter of an entire galaxy that's over a hundred thousand lightyears across - there's a lot of room out there for previously-unknown interstellar governments.)
Borrowing heavily from the above, this Alliance consisted originally of worlds that had survived Borg attacks, and banded together for mutual defense. They would consider it one of their primary missions to discover worlds with developed sapient species, usually with some variety of advanced technology, and invite them to join the Alliance before the Borg attacked them too. They're not "warlike" as such, not in the sense of the Klingon Empire or the old Cardassian Union, but they're more than ready to defend themselves when attacked, with technology roughly equal to that of the Federation or the Empire. They'd be more like the Federation than unlike - except that they believe it would be foolish to leave sapient beings to "develop on their own", in a universe that includes the Borg. Rather than Starfleet's hands-off General Order One, they would operate by the principle that interference is required so that other sophonts have a chance to live.
In encounters with the Federation, given the differences in the basic situation in Alpha/Beta and Delta quads, it would be (on both sides) a case of, "Wait a minute, this guy's got a point there..." They almost certainly wouldn't wind up firing at one another, unless of course your particular ship is protecting, say, a Borg Coalition ship that's wandered out of its usual territory, and the Alliance ship wants to destroy the lousy Borg before they can start assimilating everything in sight. (In that way, it would be similar to some of the Benthan encounters we experience in the current DQ missions, except without the fascist overtones in our opponents.)
So Team America, against the Film Actors Guild...
My only issue with that concept, is that principle of interference being required is a presumption that such help is going to be welcome by the recipients...
For example:
Alliance Commander: You don't want to be assimilated into the Collective, do you?
Planetary Leader: No, nor do we want you telling us what to do...
Alliance Commander: But we can help you in the future...
Planetary Leader: And how soon does 'but we helped you with the Borg', become the whip you use to guilt us into compliance??
The well-intentioned Alliance may not have considered that their help is not invited and not wanted, so may be seen as just as intrusive and damaging, just in different ways...
And ethically speaking, that's (in my opinion, anyway) certainly no worse than Picard's willingness to let an entire planetary population die of a preventable disaster in service of (his interpretation of) the Prime Directive*. "That other guy's kind of got a point there..."
*ST:TNG season 2, ep 15, "Pen Pals"
Absolutely so... It's very easy to pontificate on the subtleties of morality, but the underlying fact remains that these are officers given orders, who have a sworn obligation to follow said orders, and the Prime Directive is not supposed to be broken.
The precurser chat with Obisek before the Coliseum mission, for example: T'nae grants The Captain the leeway to 'investigate' the matter, but not to directly interfere in what is viewed as an internal struggle. Going 'by the book', The Captain should outright refuse Obisek's request, just as Picard refused Gowron's...
The issue with the Alliance, is that although they believe they are operating from a point of assistance, benevolence and whatnot, not everyone would necessarily agree with that... It was only reading an article the other day about Alec Peters where that kind of emotional blackmailing was mentioned, which made me think of it in this instance...
I still personally believe that Picard ordered Data to terminate comms so that the girl would plea for his help and give Picard an excuse to intervene. Remember 'The Drumhead'; despite Picard's supposedly dogmatic devotion to the Prime Directive, he'd violated it dozens of times in the space of 3-4 years.
I still personally believe that Picard ordered Data to terminate comms so that the girl would plea for his help and give Picard an excuse to intervene. Remember 'The Drumhead'; despite Picard's supposedly dogmatic devotion to the Prime Directive, he'd violated it dozens of times in the space of 3-4 years.
Data put the comm on specifically so Picard had to hear her, and thus forcing him to then relent to taking action. Plot means we're meant to accept that as 'the right thing to do', but make no mistake about it, what Data did, was guilting his superior officer into breaking orders via emotional blackmail... The only possible excuse I could present for this, is that to Data, his ethical subroutines would take a higher precedent to any 'man-made regulation', which is why he was so compelled to assist, and to force Picard's hand...
Without the specific citations of the instances when Picard breached it, I can't comment on them... The writers played as loose with Prime Directive adherence as they did with Mad Kathy's behaviour
Narratively the PRIMARY function of the Prime Directive is to give the protagonist something arbitrarily stupid and dogmatic to rail against. Its a tool to showcase how noble they are even in the service of an organization that's manifestly a bunch of jerks.
Actually going along with it to the fatal detriment of others is the exception, not the rule.
Narratively the PRIMARY function of the Prime Directive is to give the protagonist something arbitrarily stupid and dogmatic to rail against. Its a tool to showcase how noble they are even in the service of an organization that's manifestly a bunch of jerks.
Actually going along with it to the fatal detriment of others is the exception, not the rule.
The original purpose of the Prime Directive, as conceived by Gene L. Coon, was to prevent the corruption of developing societies by premature interstellar contact (as with the many philosophers of science who believe that humanity's reaction to alien visitation would be a profound feeling of inferiority). An example of how benign interference could go wrong was given in "Patterns of Force", when a former history professor at the Academy decided to help the poor, backward natives of Ekos by teaching them the efficiencies of fascism. Its original formulation, as discussed in "The Return of the Archons", was to forbid interference in the "normal" development of a "viable" pre-spaceflight society; this left some wiggle room for interpretation in the field, and of course once a culture achieved spaceflight in the Star Trek universe they could expect to find aliens.
In TNG, Gene Roddenberry expanded it to the point that Starfleet officers couldn't "interfere" in any society, no matter how stupid such a concept might become (cf "Justice", in which a Federation civilian was to be executed for violating an arbitrary rule even though the locals had regular contact with aliens, or the aforementioned "Pen Pals"). Our hypothetical Alliance might have an opportunity to point out the ridiculousness of having such a hard-and-fast rule, especially when a starship captain might expect to be out of contact with any higher authorities for some time; meanwhile, a Starfleet captain might well be able to point to a world contacted by the Alliance which, for one reason or another, wound up considerably worse off than they might have been (perhaps a race with a history similar to Vulcan's, but in which their version of the Reformation of Surak was cut short by the arrival of an Alliance craft, resulting in the world becoming both highly advanced and highly paranoid about outsiders).
Narratively the PRIMARY function of the Prime Directive is to give the protagonist something arbitrarily stupid and dogmatic to rail against. Its a tool to showcase how noble they are even in the service of an organization that's manifestly a bunch of jerks.
Actually going along with it to the fatal detriment of others is the exception, not the rule.
The original purpose of the Prime Directive, as conceived by Gene L. Coon, was to prevent the corruption of developing societies by premature interstellar contact (as with the many philosophers of science who believe that humanity's reaction to alien visitation would be a profound feeling of inferiority). An example of how benign interference could go wrong was given in "Patterns of Force", when a former history professor at the Academy decided to help the poor, backward natives of Ekos by teaching them the efficiencies of fascism. Its original formulation, as discussed in "The Return of the Archons", was to forbid interference in the "normal" development of a "viable" pre-spaceflight society; this left some wiggle room for interpretation in the field, and of course once a culture achieved spaceflight in the Star Trek universe they could expect to find aliens.
In TNG, Gene Roddenberry expanded it to the point that Starfleet officers couldn't "interfere" in any society, no matter how stupid such a concept might become (cf "Justice", in which a Federation civilian was to be executed for violating an arbitrary rule even though the locals had regular contact with aliens, or the aforementioned "Pen Pals"). Our hypothetical Alliance might have an opportunity to point out the ridiculousness of having such a hard-and-fast rule, especially when a starship captain might expect to be out of contact with any higher authorities for some time; meanwhile, a Starfleet captain might well be able to point to a world contacted by the Alliance which, for one reason or another, wound up considerably worse off than they might have been (perhaps a race with a history similar to Vulcan's, but in which their version of the Reformation of Surak was cut short by the arrival of an Alliance craft, resulting in the world becoming both highly advanced and highly paranoid about outsiders).
Don't forget though, Wesley did break their laws... Even here on Earth, if someone from America or the UK was to visit Thailand and break their laws, they will be punished as per Thai law, and ignorance of the law has never been a valid defence... So that's what should have happened to Wesley, but Plot dictated that Picard disrespect their laws and break the rules just to save him...
Although I don't like to use personal work as an example, in this instance, I will just mention that that kind of Plot Armor was something I wanted to deliberately override with Chanos' court-martial, and rather than a 'TV Happy' slap-on-the-wrist-don't-do-it-again rebuke, he took the full punishments as equivalent in the UCMJ, and wound up dismissed from Starfleet, and sentenced to twenty two years, possibility of parole in twelve...
Don't forget though, Wesley did break their laws... Even here on Earth, if someone from America or the UK was to visit Thailand and break their laws, they will be punished as per Thai law, and ignorance of the law has never been a valid defence... So that's what should have happened to Wesley, but Plot dictated that Picard disrespect their laws and break the rules just to save him...
Although I don't like to use personal work as an example, in this instance, I will just mention that that kind of Plot Armor was something I wanted to deliberately override with Chanos' court-martial, and rather than a 'TV Happy' slap-on-the-wrist-don't-do-it-again rebuke, he took the full punishments as equivalent in the UCMJ, and wound up dismissed from Starfleet, and sentenced to twenty two years, possibility of parole in twelve...
There is generally a bit of reluctance to honor such things when the death penalty is involved though. A lot of countries don't support that level of punishment, so asking them to just go along with it tends to be unpopular with their own populace. A lot of these instances are judged on a case by case basis, especially if the laws and penalties in question are blatantly barbaric.
I've always felt that their was a lot of apathy involved with the TNG interpretation of the Prime Directive. They always tried to dress it up as this grand noble idea, that they were actually protecting other people by ignoring their pleas for help. I wish I could agree that it was simply a straw man rule for the cast to rail against, but the times those stories happened tended to be pretty poorly constructed, making the cast simply look heartless as they debated helping people.
Of course this tended to be coupled with a somewhat arrogant belief that the pre-warp cultures were simply to primitive to survive exposure to space faring folk. There were several episodes where they strongly imply or outright show that simply knowing of aliens would be enough to cause their tiny primitive brains to go insane. The whole thing always reeked of elitist arrogance. Honestly if aliens suddenly showed up today our society would probably yawn, our own science fiction has done more than enough to prepare ourselves to the concept of alien life, the idea that our society would instantly implode with riots and mass suicides is pretty ridiculous.
I always though the primary basis for the Prime Directive was based in our fears during the Cold War. The technology we have now allows us mutually assured destruction. If we gave this to a "primitive" culture, wouldn't it lead to that culture destroying itself - if we can barely avoid this destruction, how could they*? Of course there is also a sense of elitism in that.
And we also know that so called "primitive" cultures don't tend to take contact with other cultures so well - the culture tend to be severely harmed or destroyed. Now, this might just be because the "advanced" culture is doing its best to marginalize to outright murder these other people so it can claim their land, and the Federation wouldn't be like that. But it might also be that the culture simply can't survive since if the other really has "wonders" they don't have themselves, many members of that culture will want to the other (since they can't just take thnigs away from them.) And they can't always deal well with that.
*) My own theory lately is - the consequences of M.A.D are easily seen and generally, we don't like to destroy our own society. So we avoid it. That is completely independent of technological or societal advancement, it's a fundamental aspect of us as beings that evolved to maintain complex social structures for our own survival. The difficult stuff is really the things we can't so easily predict - like long-term pollution or climate changing effects.
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
What the Alliance and Federation relationship might look like.
The Alliance believes that bringing more worlds/cultures into their group provides a more diverse pool of people and with that new ideas on how to fight the Borg. Basically they are saying " Hey they might think of something we haven't.
The Federation might point out that many of the groups they are bringing in would not have been targets of the Borg if they had not been given a technology upgrade. So the Federation would not be happy with this group putting worlds at risk that otherwise might not have been.
The Alliance of Planets might counter by saying that the Borg changed tactics based on the loses they have suffered at the hands of the Federation. The Borg suffered much higher loses then they ever have when Voyager blew up the Transwarp Hub. The Borg are now targeting any and all species they come across in order to replenish their ranks.
It pretty much boils down to The Federation not liking that the Alliance is bringing in worlds that it feels are not ready and that they should not interfere with the natural evolution of those worlds but the Alliance is saying that the Federation has in fact played a big part in interfering with those worlds because they caused the Borg to need to go to those worlds in order to quickly resupply itself with drones.
I feel this might be a great way of moving things into a bit more of a grey area for the Federation as well as act as the source of the drama in the complicated relationship the Alliance might have with the Federation. On one hand the Alliance needs all the help it can get and they love that the Federation has handed the Borg some big defeats. However it is those worlds closer to Borg territory (Delta Quadrant) who are now suffering the consequences of those actions. The Borg are trying to rebuild and they can't get back to the Alpha Quadrant quickly with the lose of the Transwarp Hub so they are swarming the Delta Quadrant at an increased rate. The Alliance was made aware of the Federation by some of the Delta Quadrant races that encountered Voyager and are now seeking help from the group they believe is at least partially responsible for their current troubles so they have come looking for the Federation. They still like the Federation but believe the Federation is obligated to help .
Dr. Miranda Jones: I understand, Mr. Spock. The glory of creation is in its infinite diversity.
Mr. Spock: And the ways our differences combine, to create meaning and beauty.
Don't forget though, Wesley did break their laws... Even here on Earth, if someone from America or the UK was to visit Thailand and break their laws, they will be punished as per Thai law, and ignorance of the law has never been a valid defence... So that's what should have happened to Wesley, but Plot dictated that Picard disrespect their laws and break the rules just to save him...
Although I don't like to use personal work as an example, in this instance, I will just mention that that kind of Plot Armor was something I wanted to deliberately override with Chanos' court-martial, and rather than a 'TV Happy' slap-on-the-wrist-don't-do-it-again rebuke, he took the full punishments as equivalent in the UCMJ, and wound up dismissed from Starfleet, and sentenced to twenty two years, possibility of parole in twelve...
There is generally a bit of reluctance to honor such things when the death penalty is involved though. A lot of countries don't support that level of punishment, so asking them to just go along with it tends to be unpopular with their own populace. A lot of these instances are judged on a case by case basis, especially if the laws and penalties in question are blatantly barbaric.
I've always felt that their was a lot of apathy involved with the TNG interpretation of the Prime Directive. They always tried to dress it up as this grand noble idea, that they were actually protecting other people by ignoring their pleas for help. I wish I could agree that it was simply a straw man rule for the cast to rail against, but the times those stories happened tended to be pretty poorly constructed, making the cast simply look heartless as they debated helping people.
Of course this tended to be coupled with a somewhat arrogant belief that the pre-warp cultures were simply to primitive to survive exposure to space faring folk. There were several episodes where they strongly imply or outright show that simply knowing of aliens would be enough to cause their tiny primitive brains to go insane. The whole thing always reeked of elitist arrogance.
Maybe so, but foreign nationals are still subject to the laws of the land they visit, and are held accountable if they break them.
Recall the American teenager who was caned in Singapore back in the 90s...
I should note, that the Edo seemed perfectly accepting of the death penalty, and saw it as neither cruel nor unusual...
What kind of message is 'we respect other cultures and obey their laws - accept for the ones we don't agree with...' ?
Because that's what Picard's behaviour toward the Edo said. The manner with which he forced the Edo girl to 'face her God', to try and prove his point, was quite frankly barbaric in its arrogance...
Now had the story been written with Doctor Crusher revealing that Wesley was really Picard's son, I would have considered that a much better motivating factor for him to disregard the Edo's laws, and to petition on Wesley's behalf...
Honestly if aliens suddenly showed up today our society would probably yawn, our own science fiction has done more than enough to prepare ourselves to the concept of alien life, the idea that our society would instantly implode with riots and mass suicides is pretty ridiculous.
Is it? A black gang member getting shot by a white cop is excuse enough for folks to go on a riot... And not just once, it happens a fair bit... Or the frequent riots in France... You seriously think humanity would take the news of alien contact well?? You clearly have more faith in people than I do...
Exactly. Two things this would be a good opportunity to show up.
It would be really cool to see a season-long sort of discussion on this. See both sides in action, their failing, and strengths. Especially as the question of how do you weigh the short-term benefits (improvements in quality of life with better tech) with longer-term (possible cultural destruction or dependence on the higher-tech culture)
Star Fleet Battles has the ISC (Inter Stellar Concordium), which is basically like the Federation, but from a a different part of the galaxy. They invade because they want to keep the various empires from fighting
I actually mentioned the ISC earlier on, although my experience with the ISC is in the form of the Starfleet Command games.
It would be interesting - the ISC in SFB is a little different than the SFC version.
The ISC is definitely nastier in the Starfleet Command version, and more directly a Federation inverse. In SFB, the IFC took it upon themselves to 'cordon' all the warring empires from each other at the end of an absolutely huge General War. The Pacification was still a Federation inverse, in the sense of launching a preemptive peacekeeping effort, but not the point of an anti-Federation. The empires didn't protest too heavily as they were exhausted and, when it became clear the ISC wasn't launching a general invasion, welcomed the chance to rebuild their fleets and economies with secure borders.
The Culture, on the other hand, definitely takes it upon itself (defines itself) by its willingness to technologically and culturally manipulate species less advanced technologically. While the Culture's really nice, the realities of interference raise a similar set of questions to the Federation's non-interference on whether it is justified.
Fate - protects fools, small children, and ships named Enterprise Will Riker
Member Access Denied Armada!
My forum single-issue of rage: Make the Proton Experimental Weapon go for subsystem targetting!
Maybe so, but foreign nationals are still subject to the laws of the land they visit, and are held accountable if they break them.
Recall the American teenager who was caned in Singapore back in the 90s...
I should note, that the Edo seemed perfectly accepting of the death penalty, and saw it as neither cruel nor unusual...
What kind of message is 'we respect other cultures and obey their laws - accept for the ones we don't agree with...' ?
Because that's what Picard's behaviour toward the Edo said. The manner with which he forced the Edo girl to 'face her God', to try and prove his point, was quite frankly barbaric in its arrogance...
Now had the story been written with Doctor Crusher revealing that Wesley was really Picard's son, I would have considered that a much better motivating factor for him to disregard the Edo's laws, and to petition on Wesley's behalf...
Honestly if aliens suddenly showed up today our society would probably yawn, our own science fiction has done more than enough to prepare ourselves to the concept of alien life, the idea that our society would instantly implode with riots and mass suicides is pretty ridiculous.
Is it? A black gang member getting shot by a white cop is excuse enough for folks to go on a riot... And not just once, it happens a fair bit... Or the frequent riots in France... You seriously think humanity would take the news of alien contact well?? You clearly have more faith in people than I do...
There is a difference between being respectful and being submissive. As I mentioned with the issue of foreign laws, they tend to be viewed on a case by case basis. In a lot of cases countries will cooperate with foreign governments in this regard, but there are also many times when they don't cooperate. If two nations are hostile to each other the cooperation generally doesn't happen, if the circumstances behind the case are considered to be dubious then the parent nation will sometimes refuse to cooperate as well.
This is pretty much the situation with the Edo episode, where Picard viewed the punishment to be completely disproportionate to the offense. As much as he had an obligation to be respectful to the foreign government of that world, he also had a duty to protect his crew from unreasonable persecution. The fact that Picard chose his crewman over a politeness isn't a sign of arrogance but rather of display of priorities. The ability to look at a situation and say that the rigid enforcement of dogma is inappropriate is a sign of Picard's values.
It isn't much different than how many of us would react to somebody being sentenced to being stoned to death. We as a society have come to the conclusion that it is a horrible action, and choosing not to object would be a silent endorsement of the act.
As for the self destructive impulses of society... they are largely overblown for sensationalized entertainment media. Most people don't go off the deep end during a crisis or nasty event. It is only a fringe minority of the population that engages in such activities, but the squeaky wheel gets more attention than the wheels that are running smoothly. For all the talk about the world teetering on the edge of oblivion, it hasn't happened yet and I don't think it will happen anytime soon. All the doom and gloom on the TV screen is a poor representation of reality, most people in real life are decent, honest, and willing to help when needed.
First contacts typically end poorly when one side has ulterior motives. If the more powerful party isn't out for conquest or subjugation things can go pretty well. If the Federation doesn't want to dominate a world then it is up to them to choose that path. Temptation will always exist, but it is a mark of character to reject it. If the Federation is as noble as they claim then they have nothing to fear from contact with others.
Don't forget though, Wesley did break their laws... Even here on Earth, if someone from America or the UK was to visit Thailand and break their laws, they will be punished as per Thai law, and ignorance of the law has never been a valid defence... So that's what should have happened to Wesley, but Plot dictated that Picard disrespect their laws and break the rules just to save him...
The mystery to me is how Picard managed to keep his butt from being chewed to the point of losing his command, regardless of the resolution. "Wait, you allowed your civilians -- including a minor -- to beam down without so much as a briefing or even a pamphlet on the capital offenses of the folks you'd be frolicking amongst...?"
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,564Community Moderator
Honestly if aliens suddenly showed up today our society would probably yawn, our own science fiction has done more than enough to prepare ourselves to the concept of alien life, the idea that our society would instantly implode with riots and mass suicides is pretty ridiculous.
C'mon rattler2, Hollywood is hardly the best source for how life actually works. Their world view is tinted by their own self segregation from normal society, and scenes like that are more a reflection of their disdain for their audience's intelligence.
Maybe so, but foreign nationals are still subject to the laws of the land they visit, and are held accountable if they break them.
Recall the American teenager who was caned in Singapore back in the 90s...
I should note, that the Edo seemed perfectly accepting of the death penalty, and saw it as neither cruel nor unusual...
What kind of message is 'we respect other cultures and obey their laws - accept for the ones we don't agree with...' ?
Because that's what Picard's behaviour toward the Edo said. The manner with which he forced the Edo girl to 'face her God', to try and prove his point, was quite frankly barbaric in its arrogance...
Now had the story been written with Doctor Crusher revealing that Wesley was really Picard's son, I would have considered that a much better motivating factor for him to disregard the Edo's laws, and to petition on Wesley's behalf...
Honestly if aliens suddenly showed up today our society would probably yawn, our own science fiction has done more than enough to prepare ourselves to the concept of alien life, the idea that our society would instantly implode with riots and mass suicides is pretty ridiculous.
Is it? A black gang member getting shot by a white cop is excuse enough for folks to go on a riot... And not just once, it happens a fair bit... Or the frequent riots in France... You seriously think humanity would take the news of alien contact well?? You clearly have more faith in people than I do...
There is a difference between being respectful and being submissive.
That is true, but also irrelevant, as a traveller is bound by the laws of both their home nation and their host nation...
This is pretty much the situation with the Edo episode, where Picard viewed the punishment to be completely disproportionate to the offense. As much as he had an obligation to be respectful to the foreign government of that world, he also had a duty to protect his crew from unreasonable persecution. The fact that Picard chose his crewman over a politeness isn't a sign of arrogance but rather of display of priorities. The ability to look at a situation and say that the rigid enforcement of dogma is inappropriate is a sign of Picard's values.
What Picard viewed is irrelevant... It's not his planet, not his ship, not his place to make or challenge policy... He had an obligation to respect their government, period. Don't use hyperbole, Wesley wasn't 'being persecuted', he was being punished. He committed a crime, and was being punished, as per the local law. That we or Picard may see it as unreasonable, is again, irrelevant, because that was the Edo law. Riker was quite willing to 'enjoy the hospitality' of the locals, and that has to go both ways... Absolutely it is a sign of Picard's values -- a sign that he is only prepared to respect alien cultures and their values when it suits him, and high-handedly destroy belief systems to suit his needs. We can agree to disagree on this, but as far as I'm concerned, Picard's behaviour in this instance was wrong, and his treatment of the Edo girl, callous, and barbaric in its high-handedness. Had the situation been different, such as the Klingon Civil War, Picard would quite happily have invoked the Prime Directive and refused to get involved, stating that it would be interference with the planet's culture...
It isn't much different than how many of us would react to somebody being sentenced to being stoned to death. We as a society have come to the conclusion that it is a horrible action, and choosing not to object would be a silent endorsement of the act.
Guilting... I endorse any nation's right to set and impose their own laws as they see fit... I might not like a particular law, but I understand that it's not my place to try and insist they do otherwise, and I also understand that in a foreign country, I am subject to those laws, wether I agree with them or not, and to claim otherwise is simply entitlement...
As for the self destructive impulses of society... they are largely overblown for sensationalized entertainment media. Most people don't go off the deep end during a crisis or nasty event. It is only a fringe minority of the population that engages in such activities, but the squeaky wheel gets more attention than the wheels that are running smoothly.
It may only be a minority of people who behave thusly, but it is still an undeniable Human behaviour, and one which can have massive costs attached...
All the doom and gloom on the TV screen is a poor representation of reality, most people in real life are decent, honest, and willing to help when needed.
For sure, but again, that doesn't ease the costs of repairing the damage done by looting and rioting...
First contacts typically end poorly when one side has ulterior motives. If the more powerful party isn't out for conquest or subjugation things can go pretty well. If the Federation doesn't want to dominate a world then it is up to them to choose that path. Temptation will always exist, but it is a mark of character to reject it. If the Federation is as noble as they claim then they have nothing to fear from contact with others.
And what if the other side's motives aren't as noble? Look what happened when Bajor made contact with Cardassia...
Don't forget though, Wesley did break their laws... Even here on Earth, if someone from America or the UK was to visit Thailand and break their laws, they will be punished as per Thai law, and ignorance of the law has never been a valid defence... So that's what should have happened to Wesley, but Plot dictated that Picard disrespect their laws and break the rules just to save him...
The mystery to me is how Picard managed to keep his butt from being chewed to the point of losing his command, regardless of the resolution. "Wait, you allowed your civilians -- including a minor -- to beam down without so much as a briefing or even a pamphlet on the capital offenses of the folks you'd be frolicking amongst...?"
I wonder if word about incidents like that spread at command, and that's why Admiral Nechayev always treated Picard with such contempt
C'mon rattler2, Hollywood is hardly the best source for how life actually works. Their world view is tinted by their own self segregation from normal society, and scenes like that are more a reflection of their disdain for their audience's intelligence.
Correct, but in this instance they get it right. It's well-known that when people get in big groups, they tend to behave more stupidly and sometimes are more prone to violence. It's why mobs are so dangerous. There's a whole branch of psychology devoted to crowd behaviors because they're so distinct from how people behave alone or in small groups.
That said, don't underestimate the ability of the human population as a whole to adapt to shocking developments like first contact (as long as you don't have them all in one place). I'd bet that the majority Americans and Europeans would be excited to meet aliens, if apprehensive at first. It's something that our species has put a lot of thought into, so we won't exactly be running around like headless chickens. I know that scientists have devised ways to handle first contact, and I'm betting there are military and diplomatic plans as well.
It isn't much different than how many of us would react to somebody being sentenced to being stoned to death. We as a society have come to the conclusion that it is a horrible action, and choosing not to object would be a silent endorsement of the act.
Guilting... I endorse any nation's right to set and impose their own laws as they see fit... I might not like a particular law, but I understand that it's not my place to try and insist they do otherwise, and I also understand that in a foreign country, I am subject to those laws, wether I agree with them or not, and to claim otherwise is simply entitlement...
First contacts typically end poorly when one side has ulterior motives. If the more powerful party isn't out for conquest or subjugation things can go pretty well. If the Federation doesn't want to dominate a world then it is up to them to choose that path. Temptation will always exist, but it is a mark of character to reject it. If the Federation is as noble as they claim then they have nothing to fear from contact with others.
And what if the other side's motives aren't as noble? Look what happened when Bajor made contact with Cardassia...
It is only guilting because you understand it is wrong. I realize this is going to run counter to the modern self-esteem generations views, but respect is something that has to be earned. If a society, culture, or person engages in horrible acts then it is perfectly acceptable to not respect them. Not all ideas hold equal value and moral relativism is just a cowards excuse for apathy.
As for the Bajor-Cardassia example, I really don't think that is applicable to the Federation's policies. What a facist police state like Cardassia does is obviously going to be different how the Federation behaves. If the Federation has no intention of dominating a world then it simply needs to follow through and not dominate that world, simple as that. Temptation to do wrong isn't a guarantee that wrong will be done.
Comments
I actually mentioned the ISC earlier on, although my experience with the ISC is in the form of the Starfleet Command games.
Borrowing heavily from the above, this Alliance consisted originally of worlds that had survived Borg attacks, and banded together for mutual defense. They would consider it one of their primary missions to discover worlds with developed sapient species, usually with some variety of advanced technology, and invite them to join the Alliance before the Borg attacked them too. They're not "warlike" as such, not in the sense of the Klingon Empire or the old Cardassian Union, but they're more than ready to defend themselves when attacked, with technology roughly equal to that of the Federation or the Empire. They'd be more like the Federation than unlike - except that they believe it would be foolish to leave sapient beings to "develop on their own", in a universe that includes the Borg. Rather than Starfleet's hands-off General Order One, they would operate by the principle that interference is required so that other sophonts have a chance to live.
In encounters with the Federation, given the differences in the basic situation in Alpha/Beta and Delta quads, it would be (on both sides) a case of, "Wait a minute, this guy's got a point there..." They almost certainly wouldn't wind up firing at one another, unless of course your particular ship is protecting, say, a Borg Coalition ship that's wandered out of its usual territory, and the Alliance ship wants to destroy the lousy Borg before they can start assimilating everything in sight. (In that way, it would be similar to some of the Benthan encounters we experience in the current DQ missions, except without the fascist overtones in our opponents.)
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
I'd enjoy that. Probably too much, as I'd end up agitating for them to be a playable faction.
My only issue with that concept, is that principle of interference being required is a presumption that such help is going to be welcome by the recipients...
For example:
Alliance Commander: You don't want to be assimilated into the Collective, do you?
Planetary Leader: No, nor do we want you telling us what to do...
Alliance Commander: But we can help you in the future...
Planetary Leader: And how soon does 'but we helped you with the Borg', become the whip you use to guilt us into compliance??
The well-intentioned Alliance may not have considered that their help is not invited and not wanted, so may be seen as just as intrusive and damaging, just in different ways...
What?
Hey, it'd be exactly like "Errand of Mercy". And like "Errand of Mercy", the Alliance faction would take some saying "no" to if for some reason it was important to them that the Borg should NOT get that particular planet. They might decide to take extreme measures, sending telepaths to manipulate the planetary leaders or whatever, to get this planet to agree to their offer - "for their own good". And in that case, the player captain might have to get involved directly to try and stop them.
An equivalent on the Federation's side, where they're arguably in the wrong, is something like the incident described in part 2 of the "Uprising" Foundry series, where a species called the Alabantrians - who weren't yet warp-capable, but getting close, and had found out about the existence of aliens - asked the Federation to defend them against the Borg, but the Federation refused claiming the Prime Directive forbade them to interfere. Of course, there were accusations that it had had nothing to do with the Prime Directive and everything to do with not wanting to get in a fight with the Borg. That's another thing that could come into it - neither side might be acting quite as purely from high principles as they say they are.
*ST:TNG season 2, ep 15, "Pen Pals"
The precurser chat with Obisek before the Coliseum mission, for example: T'nae grants The Captain the leeway to 'investigate' the matter, but not to directly interfere in what is viewed as an internal struggle. Going 'by the book', The Captain should outright refuse Obisek's request, just as Picard refused Gowron's...
The issue with the Alliance, is that although they believe they are operating from a point of assistance, benevolence and whatnot, not everyone would necessarily agree with that... It was only reading an article the other day about Alec Peters where that kind of emotional blackmailing was mentioned, which made me think of it in this instance...
Trials of Blood and Fire
Moving On Parts 1-3 - Part 4
In Cold Blood
Without the specific citations of the instances when Picard breached it, I can't comment on them... The writers played as loose with Prime Directive adherence as they did with Mad Kathy's behaviour
Actually going along with it to the fatal detriment of others is the exception, not the rule.
In TNG, Gene Roddenberry expanded it to the point that Starfleet officers couldn't "interfere" in any society, no matter how stupid such a concept might become (cf "Justice", in which a Federation civilian was to be executed for violating an arbitrary rule even though the locals had regular contact with aliens, or the aforementioned "Pen Pals"). Our hypothetical Alliance might have an opportunity to point out the ridiculousness of having such a hard-and-fast rule, especially when a starship captain might expect to be out of contact with any higher authorities for some time; meanwhile, a Starfleet captain might well be able to point to a world contacted by the Alliance which, for one reason or another, wound up considerably worse off than they might have been (perhaps a race with a history similar to Vulcan's, but in which their version of the Reformation of Surak was cut short by the arrival of an Alliance craft, resulting in the world becoming both highly advanced and highly paranoid about outsiders).
Although I don't like to use personal work as an example, in this instance, I will just mention that that kind of Plot Armor was something I wanted to deliberately override with Chanos' court-martial, and rather than a 'TV Happy' slap-on-the-wrist-don't-do-it-again rebuke, he took the full punishments as equivalent in the UCMJ, and wound up dismissed from Starfleet, and sentenced to twenty two years, possibility of parole in twelve...
There is generally a bit of reluctance to honor such things when the death penalty is involved though. A lot of countries don't support that level of punishment, so asking them to just go along with it tends to be unpopular with their own populace. A lot of these instances are judged on a case by case basis, especially if the laws and penalties in question are blatantly barbaric.
I've always felt that their was a lot of apathy involved with the TNG interpretation of the Prime Directive. They always tried to dress it up as this grand noble idea, that they were actually protecting other people by ignoring their pleas for help. I wish I could agree that it was simply a straw man rule for the cast to rail against, but the times those stories happened tended to be pretty poorly constructed, making the cast simply look heartless as they debated helping people.
Of course this tended to be coupled with a somewhat arrogant belief that the pre-warp cultures were simply to primitive to survive exposure to space faring folk. There were several episodes where they strongly imply or outright show that simply knowing of aliens would be enough to cause their tiny primitive brains to go insane. The whole thing always reeked of elitist arrogance. Honestly if aliens suddenly showed up today our society would probably yawn, our own science fiction has done more than enough to prepare ourselves to the concept of alien life, the idea that our society would instantly implode with riots and mass suicides is pretty ridiculous.
And we also know that so called "primitive" cultures don't tend to take contact with other cultures so well - the culture tend to be severely harmed or destroyed. Now, this might just be because the "advanced" culture is doing its best to marginalize to outright murder these other people so it can claim their land, and the Federation wouldn't be like that. But it might also be that the culture simply can't survive since if the other really has "wonders" they don't have themselves, many members of that culture will want to the other (since they can't just take thnigs away from them.) And they can't always deal well with that.
*) My own theory lately is - the consequences of M.A.D are easily seen and generally, we don't like to destroy our own society. So we avoid it. That is completely independent of technological or societal advancement, it's a fundamental aspect of us as beings that evolved to maintain complex social structures for our own survival. The difficult stuff is really the things we can't so easily predict - like long-term pollution or climate changing effects.
The Alliance believes that bringing more worlds/cultures into their group provides a more diverse pool of people and with that new ideas on how to fight the Borg. Basically they are saying " Hey they might think of something we haven't.
The Federation might point out that many of the groups they are bringing in would not have been targets of the Borg if they had not been given a technology upgrade. So the Federation would not be happy with this group putting worlds at risk that otherwise might not have been.
The Alliance of Planets might counter by saying that the Borg changed tactics based on the loses they have suffered at the hands of the Federation. The Borg suffered much higher loses then they ever have when Voyager blew up the Transwarp Hub. The Borg are now targeting any and all species they come across in order to replenish their ranks.
It pretty much boils down to The Federation not liking that the Alliance is bringing in worlds that it feels are not ready and that they should not interfere with the natural evolution of those worlds but the Alliance is saying that the Federation has in fact played a big part in interfering with those worlds because they caused the Borg to need to go to those worlds in order to quickly resupply itself with drones.
I feel this might be a great way of moving things into a bit more of a grey area for the Federation as well as act as the source of the drama in the complicated relationship the Alliance might have with the Federation. On one hand the Alliance needs all the help it can get and they love that the Federation has handed the Borg some big defeats. However it is those worlds closer to Borg territory (Delta Quadrant) who are now suffering the consequences of those actions. The Borg are trying to rebuild and they can't get back to the Alpha Quadrant quickly with the lose of the Transwarp Hub so they are swarming the Delta Quadrant at an increased rate. The Alliance was made aware of the Federation by some of the Delta Quadrant races that encountered Voyager and are now seeking help from the group they believe is at least partially responsible for their current troubles so they have come looking for the Federation. They still like the Federation but believe the Federation is obligated to help .
Mr. Spock: And the ways our differences combine, to create meaning and beauty.
-Star Trek: Is There in Truth No Beauty? (1968)
Recall the American teenager who was caned in Singapore back in the 90s...
I should note, that the Edo seemed perfectly accepting of the death penalty, and saw it as neither cruel nor unusual...
What kind of message is 'we respect other cultures and obey their laws - accept for the ones we don't agree with...' ?
Because that's what Picard's behaviour toward the Edo said. The manner with which he forced the Edo girl to 'face her God', to try and prove his point, was quite frankly barbaric in its arrogance...
Now had the story been written with Doctor Crusher revealing that Wesley was really Picard's son, I would have considered that a much better motivating factor for him to disregard the Edo's laws, and to petition on Wesley's behalf...
Is it? A black gang member getting shot by a white cop is excuse enough for folks to go on a riot... And not just once, it happens a fair bit... Or the frequent riots in France... You seriously think humanity would take the news of alien contact well?? You clearly have more faith in people than I do...
It would be really cool to see a season-long sort of discussion on this. See both sides in action, their failing, and strengths. Especially as the question of how do you weigh the short-term benefits (improvements in quality of life with better tech) with longer-term (possible cultural destruction or dependence on the higher-tech culture)
It would be interesting - the ISC in SFB is a little different than the SFC version.
The ISC is definitely nastier in the Starfleet Command version, and more directly a Federation inverse. In SFB, the IFC took it upon themselves to 'cordon' all the warring empires from each other at the end of an absolutely huge General War. The Pacification was still a Federation inverse, in the sense of launching a preemptive peacekeeping effort, but not the point of an anti-Federation. The empires didn't protest too heavily as they were exhausted and, when it became clear the ISC wasn't launching a general invasion, welcomed the chance to rebuild their fleets and economies with secure borders.
The Culture, on the other hand, definitely takes it upon itself (defines itself) by its willingness to technologically and culturally manipulate species less advanced technologically. While the Culture's really nice, the realities of interference raise a similar set of questions to the Federation's non-interference on whether it is justified.
Member Access Denied Armada!
My forum single-issue of rage: Make the Proton Experimental Weapon go for subsystem targetting!
There is a difference between being respectful and being submissive. As I mentioned with the issue of foreign laws, they tend to be viewed on a case by case basis. In a lot of cases countries will cooperate with foreign governments in this regard, but there are also many times when they don't cooperate. If two nations are hostile to each other the cooperation generally doesn't happen, if the circumstances behind the case are considered to be dubious then the parent nation will sometimes refuse to cooperate as well.
This is pretty much the situation with the Edo episode, where Picard viewed the punishment to be completely disproportionate to the offense. As much as he had an obligation to be respectful to the foreign government of that world, he also had a duty to protect his crew from unreasonable persecution. The fact that Picard chose his crewman over a politeness isn't a sign of arrogance but rather of display of priorities. The ability to look at a situation and say that the rigid enforcement of dogma is inappropriate is a sign of Picard's values.
It isn't much different than how many of us would react to somebody being sentenced to being stoned to death. We as a society have come to the conclusion that it is a horrible action, and choosing not to object would be a silent endorsement of the act.
As for the self destructive impulses of society... they are largely overblown for sensationalized entertainment media. Most people don't go off the deep end during a crisis or nasty event. It is only a fringe minority of the population that engages in such activities, but the squeaky wheel gets more attention than the wheels that are running smoothly. For all the talk about the world teetering on the edge of oblivion, it hasn't happened yet and I don't think it will happen anytime soon. All the doom and gloom on the TV screen is a poor representation of reality, most people in real life are decent, honest, and willing to help when needed.
First contacts typically end poorly when one side has ulterior motives. If the more powerful party isn't out for conquest or subjugation things can go pretty well. If the Federation doesn't want to dominate a world then it is up to them to choose that path. Temptation will always exist, but it is a mark of character to reject it. If the Federation is as noble as they claim then they have nothing to fear from contact with others.
The mystery to me is how Picard managed to keep his butt from being chewed to the point of losing his command, regardless of the resolution. "Wait, you allowed your civilians -- including a minor -- to beam down without so much as a briefing or even a pamphlet on the capital offenses of the folks you'd be frolicking amongst...?"
What Picard viewed is irrelevant... It's not his planet, not his ship, not his place to make or challenge policy... He had an obligation to respect their government, period. Don't use hyperbole, Wesley wasn't 'being persecuted', he was being punished. He committed a crime, and was being punished, as per the local law. That we or Picard may see it as unreasonable, is again, irrelevant, because that was the Edo law. Riker was quite willing to 'enjoy the hospitality' of the locals, and that has to go both ways... Absolutely it is a sign of Picard's values -- a sign that he is only prepared to respect alien cultures and their values when it suits him, and high-handedly destroy belief systems to suit his needs. We can agree to disagree on this, but as far as I'm concerned, Picard's behaviour in this instance was wrong, and his treatment of the Edo girl, callous, and barbaric in its high-handedness. Had the situation been different, such as the Klingon Civil War, Picard would quite happily have invoked the Prime Directive and refused to get involved, stating that it would be interference with the planet's culture...
Guilting... I endorse any nation's right to set and impose their own laws as they see fit... I might not like a particular law, but I understand that it's not my place to try and insist they do otherwise, and I also understand that in a foreign country, I am subject to those laws, wether I agree with them or not, and to claim otherwise is simply entitlement...
It may only be a minority of people who behave thusly, but it is still an undeniable Human behaviour, and one which can have massive costs attached...
For sure, but again, that doesn't ease the costs of repairing the damage done by looting and rioting...
And what if the other side's motives aren't as noble? Look what happened when Bajor made contact with Cardassia...
That said, don't underestimate the ability of the human population as a whole to adapt to shocking developments like first contact (as long as you don't have them all in one place). I'd bet that the majority Americans and Europeans would be excited to meet aliens, if apprehensive at first. It's something that our species has put a lot of thought into, so we won't exactly be running around like headless chickens. I know that scientists have devised ways to handle first contact, and I'm betting there are military and diplomatic plans as well.
It is only guilting because you understand it is wrong. I realize this is going to run counter to the modern self-esteem generations views, but respect is something that has to be earned. If a society, culture, or person engages in horrible acts then it is perfectly acceptable to not respect them. Not all ideas hold equal value and moral relativism is just a cowards excuse for apathy.
As for the Bajor-Cardassia example, I really don't think that is applicable to the Federation's policies. What a facist police state like Cardassia does is obviously going to be different how the Federation behaves. If the Federation has no intention of dominating a world then it simply needs to follow through and not dominate that world, simple as that. Temptation to do wrong isn't a guarantee that wrong will be done.