I hope that if we get more cross-faction 3-packs, Cryptic uses the opportunity to bring in some more Bird of Preys. If they make a few Escorts perhaps, this would seem to fit just fine. Science Vessels might work, too, but I think people would be alienated again if there is a Fed Science vessel and the 3-pack doen't include a KDF Science Vessel.
But for packs including Cruisers I fear we'll always be stuck with more KDF Cruisers.
You forget the Kolasi. Now that was a nice surprise. And bundled in with cruisers, no less.
Some of the fairly recent releases had mixed ship types. To add to the Kosali, Kor you guys mentioned is the Mogai, a Cmdr TAC Warbird released alongside the Cmdr ENG T6 Avenger & Mogh.
if it's bigger than a B'rel than it should be a raptor.
pro: one more aft weapon, stronger hull
con: no battlecloak, not as many universal stations
so a bit like a Qa'tel without the Hangar.
essentially there are already KDF ships that either have 5-2 weapons (ie piloting raptors and Mat'ha) and the 4-3 Qa'Tel.
Now there is no need for another BOP unless it has Intel seating or a raptor with command seating. But Klingon force has more Need of a science vessel.
18 characters
KDF: 2 tacs, 2 engs, 3 scis
KDF Roms: 3 tacs, 1 eng, 1 scis
FED: 2 tacs, 1 eng, 2 scis
TOS: 1 tac
all on T5 rep (up to temporal)
all have mastered Intel tree (and some more specs Points)
highest DPS: 60.982
if it's bigger than a B'rel than it should be a raptor.
pro: one more aft weapon, stronger hull
con: no battlecloak, not as many universal stations
so a bit like a Qa'tel without the Hangar.
essentially there are already KDF ships that either have 5-2 weapons (ie piloting raptors and Mat'ha) and the 4-3 Qa'Tel.
Now there is no need for another BOP unless it has Intel seating or a raptor with command seating. But Klingon force has more Need of a science vessel.
The KDF right now is absolutely LOADED with good Escorts/Raptors. An addition to this line of the KDF doesn't flesh out the faction's lineup. Where is the faction is deficient in? That's Science Vessels (2 with none at T6), Carriers (2 with none at T6), and BOPs/Raiders (several at T5, 1 at T6).
In contrast, within T6 alone the KDF has 5 Cmdr TAC Escorts ("Escort" being the big umbrella Raptors, Destroyers are under). This includes the Game Winning Pilot Escorts topping anything Cmdr TAC related, and the 5 Battlecruisers.
Another mere Raptor/Destroyer is not doing anything special for the faction, not when there's already good choices there, not when there's something completely OP as the Pilot Escorts. In addition, becoming a Raptor/Destroyer means forsaking the Full Universal BOFF Setup as well as Battle Cloak combination of a Bird of Prey.
Aside from relative size, the T5/6 B'rel basically *is* a K'vort.
Personally I'd love to see the "Heavy Bird of Prey" concept revisited - the T5 Hegh'ta was a great ship in its day and good looking. Heck, Cryptic could go back and *properly* adapt John Eaves' unused design from Way of the Warrior. They used the ST: Into Darkness concepts for the Pilot raptors, so why not?
I watched the episode last night with the alternate timeline when the Enterprise C slips through the rift and alters history. Three K'Vort class cruisers!
Plus they're referred to in DS9 - albeit not seen on screen - so we know there's *something* called a K'vort in the prime universe. Given the big BoPs that dominated the first few seasons of TNG it seems a fair bet that the prime universe K'vort is the same as its Yesterday's Enterprise counterpart.
However - I'm still not convinced that a simple upscale would be a good idea in game. It would be great if Cryptic made some minor amendments to show the size of the thing while keeping the overall profile; things like extra windows, secondary weapons. Heck, there's still a modest gameplay niche to be had by trading off the Enhanced Battle Cloak for more Tac-heavy consoles and hull.
The K'vort could certainly be a destroyer or possibly even a raptor as some of you suggest. The fact that it is a larger B'rel is irrelevant. It's a canon ship and deserves a spot on the kdf line-up like any other ST series ship. If you want to give it a distinctive feel, you could give it a unique skin that reflects a more modern 2409 aesthetic. Make it so Cryptic plox!
Just remember, if it goes down the Raptor route, it already has competition with the long-reigning, best Escorts in the game: Pilot Ships.
Going down the Bird of Prey route, it has a chance to be unique, different, and bring strength and variety to the one place the KDF has an advantage over the Roms and Feds: Birds of Prey with Raider Flanking, Full Universal BOFF Seats, Battle Cloaks. Anything else, even within the KDF, even the powerful Pilot Ships, do not have that combo. Not even the Romulan T'Varo, Faeht, and the now Battle Cloak capable T6 Defiant has that combo. Not even the Raiders that are not KDF ships has that combo of capability.
Aside from relative size, the T5/6 B'rel basically *is* a K'vort.
Personally I'd love to see the "Heavy Bird of Prey" concept revisited - the T5 Hegh'ta was a great ship in its day and good looking. Heck, Cryptic could go back and *properly* adapt John Eaves' unused design from Way of the Warrior. They used the ST: Into Darkness concepts for the Pilot raptors, so why not?
Something I was thinking - the Federation has Intel ships for Cruiser, Science Vessels and Escorts. Romulans have a "Tactical Warbird" and the Klingons have a Battlecruiser.
How about an Intel Bird of Prey? Commander Universal|Intel, Lt.Cmdr Universal, Lt.Universal|Intel, Lt.Universal. Ideally as Hegh't variant.
And then we could add the Vo'Quv as Command Carrier. I think Science/Command/Carrier has some interesting options that the game currently doesn't cover at all. And it fits the role.
Admittedly, so far no "Full Spec" ships have been Retrofits. But why not break the mold... It's not like Cryptic will be making as many KDF ships as they will make Fed ships, better really hit all the interesting spots to optimize sales.
Mustrum "I should go to bed, I am already dreaming" Ridcully
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
Just remember, if it goes down the Raptor route, it already has competition with the long-reigning, best Escorts in the game: Pilot Ships.
Going down the Bird of Prey route, it has a chance to be unique, different, and bring strength and variety to the one place the KDF has an advantage over the Roms and Feds: Birds of Prey with Raider Flanking, Full Universal BOFF Seats, Battle Cloaks. Anything else, even within the KDF, even the powerful Pilot Ships, do not have that combo. Not even the Romulan T'Varo, Faeht, and the now Battle Cloak capable T6 Defiant has that combo. Not even the Raiders that are not KDF ships has that combo of capability.
Ok, so maybe a bird of prey with a turn-rate of 16, 17? It would be hard to justify such a large ship having the same turn-rate as a smaller, more nimble bop.
Intel BOP sounds interessting - decloak, hit Intel Team, strafe and recloak.
Also decloaking, override safety, surgical strikes and flanking could be devestating - ah wait - that'S pretty much my Intel warbird build again...
18 characters
KDF: 2 tacs, 2 engs, 3 scis
KDF Roms: 3 tacs, 1 eng, 1 scis
FED: 2 tacs, 1 eng, 2 scis
TOS: 1 tac
all on T5 rep (up to temporal)
all have mastered Intel tree (and some more specs Points)
highest DPS: 60.982
I was just thinking that maybe Cryptic could introduce a k'vort with a fleet raider console that would temporarily grant a flanking damage bonus to team mates. Can I haz?
Another cool idea would be that if you're in a team of fIve and 2 bops are within 5 km of your ship, you get a small flanking damage bonus.
Alternatively, bops that are within 5 km of one another could give each other a small flanking damage bonus.
Comments
You forget the Kolasi. Now that was a nice surprise. And bundled in with cruisers, no less.
It's a viable method of bringing in new BoPs.
pro: one more aft weapon, stronger hull
con: no battlecloak, not as many universal stations
so a bit like a Qa'tel without the Hangar.
essentially there are already KDF ships that either have 5-2 weapons (ie piloting raptors and Mat'ha) and the 4-3 Qa'Tel.
Now there is no need for another BOP unless it has Intel seating or a raptor with command seating. But Klingon force has more Need of a science vessel.
KDF: 2 tacs, 2 engs, 3 scis
KDF Roms: 3 tacs, 1 eng, 1 scis
FED: 2 tacs, 1 eng, 2 scis
TOS: 1 tac
all on T5 rep (up to temporal)
all have mastered Intel tree (and some more specs Points)
highest DPS: 60.982
The KDF right now is absolutely LOADED with good Escorts/Raptors. An addition to this line of the KDF doesn't flesh out the faction's lineup. Where is the faction is deficient in? That's Science Vessels (2 with none at T6), Carriers (2 with none at T6), and BOPs/Raiders (several at T5, 1 at T6).
In contrast, within T6 alone the KDF has 5 Cmdr TAC Escorts ("Escort" being the big umbrella Raptors, Destroyers are under). This includes the Game Winning Pilot Escorts topping anything Cmdr TAC related, and the 5 Battlecruisers.
Another mere Raptor/Destroyer is not doing anything special for the faction, not when there's already good choices there, not when there's something completely OP as the Pilot Escorts. In addition, becoming a Raptor/Destroyer means forsaking the Full Universal BOFF Setup as well as Battle Cloak combination of a Bird of Prey.
Personally I'd love to see the "Heavy Bird of Prey" concept revisited - the T5 Hegh'ta was a great ship in its day and good looking. Heck, Cryptic could go back and *properly* adapt John Eaves' unused design from Way of the Warrior. They used the ST: Into Darkness concepts for the Pilot raptors, so why not?
And that's fine.
Because NONE of those other Raiders are:
Battle Cloak / Enhanced Battle Cloak-capable
Full Universal BOFF setup.
Much less both on one ship.
Even within the "Raider" subset of this game, Klingon Birds of Prey are still, 100% unique that nobody else has replicated.
However - I'm still not convinced that a simple upscale would be a good idea in game. It would be great if Cryptic made some minor amendments to show the size of the thing while keeping the overall profile; things like extra windows, secondary weapons. Heck, there's still a modest gameplay niche to be had by trading off the Enhanced Battle Cloak for more Tac-heavy consoles and hull.
KDF: 2 tacs, 2 engs, 3 scis
KDF Roms: 3 tacs, 1 eng, 1 scis
FED: 2 tacs, 1 eng, 2 scis
TOS: 1 tac
all on T5 rep (up to temporal)
all have mastered Intel tree (and some more specs Points)
highest DPS: 60.982
except for being butt ugly and borked
You have my support OP.
Going down the Bird of Prey route, it has a chance to be unique, different, and bring strength and variety to the one place the KDF has an advantage over the Roms and Feds: Birds of Prey with Raider Flanking, Full Universal BOFF Seats, Battle Cloaks. Anything else, even within the KDF, even the powerful Pilot Ships, do not have that combo. Not even the Romulan T'Varo, Faeht, and the now Battle Cloak capable T6 Defiant has that combo. Not even the Raiders that are not KDF ships has that combo of capability.
How about an Intel Bird of Prey? Commander Universal|Intel, Lt.Cmdr Universal, Lt.Universal|Intel, Lt.Universal. Ideally as Hegh't variant.
And then we could add the Vo'Quv as Command Carrier. I think Science/Command/Carrier has some interesting options that the game currently doesn't cover at all. And it fits the role.
Admittedly, so far no "Full Spec" ships have been Retrofits. But why not break the mold... It's not like Cryptic will be making as many KDF ships as they will make Fed ships, better really hit all the interesting spots to optimize sales.
Mustrum "I should go to bed, I am already dreaming" Ridcully
Ok, so maybe a bird of prey with a turn-rate of 16, 17? It would be hard to justify such a large ship having the same turn-rate as a smaller, more nimble bop.
Also decloaking, override safety, surgical strikes and flanking could be devestating - ah wait - that'S pretty much my Intel warbird build again...
KDF: 2 tacs, 2 engs, 3 scis
KDF Roms: 3 tacs, 1 eng, 1 scis
FED: 2 tacs, 1 eng, 2 scis
TOS: 1 tac
all on T5 rep (up to temporal)
all have mastered Intel tree (and some more specs Points)
highest DPS: 60.982
I was just thinking that maybe Cryptic could introduce a k'vort with a fleet raider console that would temporarily grant a flanking damage bonus to team mates. Can I haz?
Another cool idea would be that if you're in a team of fIve and 2 bops are within 5 km of your ship, you get a small flanking damage
bonus.
Alternatively, bops that are within 5 km of one another could give each other a small flanking damage bonus.